Obama: “If you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax”

posted at 2:31 pm on July 14, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Is the individual mandate in ObamaCare a tax?  No, said Nancy Pelosi.  No, said DNC chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz, even if the IRS is the only agency that can enforce it.  No, said Jay Carney, or at least, “it is not a broad-based tax.”

Of course, Mitt Romney called it a tax — eventually.  Yesterday, his opponent in the election weighed in on the issue, and … have we reached a consensus?

“By the way, if you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax,” President Obama said. “The only thing that’s happening to you is that you now have more security because insurance companies can’t drop you when you get sick.”

That sounds so sweet, you’d never guess that the CBO estimates that the government will raise $54 billion in revenue from this tax in its eight years after the mandate takes effect, almost all of it from the middle class.  (Remember, that’s exactly what the CBO projected we would save through federal tort reform in malpractice cases over a decade, which Democrats rejected as too extreme.) Revenues increase rather than decrease during that eight-year run, too.  Why?  Many employers will stop offering health-care coverage, throwing employees into the individual policy market.  Businesses will pay less in fines than they do in insurance premiums, which means that many middle-class earners will face the same choice of paying for expensive individual plans or paying a fine tax instead.

So not only will some middle-class families get dropped by insurance companies, thanks to an opt-out by employers, they’ll be paying a tax on top of it, thanks to ObamaCare.  Glad to see President Obama has made that clear.


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He lies.

ted c on July 14, 2012 at 2:34 PM

“By the way, if you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax,” President Obama said. “The only thing that’s happening to you is that you now have more security because insurance companies can’t drop you when you get sick.”

You lie! If you have a “Cadillac Plan” you get taxed at 40%.

CC: unions in swing states

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:34 PM

If this is allowed to stand it will be interesting to see how long the federal government continues to offer private insurance before it throws into the “pool” like it did when it went from pension to Social Security.

Cindy Munford on July 14, 2012 at 2:36 PM

You lie! If you have a “Cadillac Plan” you get taxed at 40%.

CC: unions in swing states

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:34 PM

Except for the unions who received exemptions from this ObamaTax altogether.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:39 PM

And when my employer drops my health plan benefit? Where do I go? Oh, yeah, the fracking TAX. Obama is an SOB and a liar.

john1schn on July 14, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Obama: “If you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax”

He’s right……it’s going to be simply a matter of getting hit with higher premiums and co-pays, so relax. Those aren’t taxes, right?

hawkeye54 on July 14, 2012 at 2:40 PM

What a tool.

Weight of Glory on July 14, 2012 at 2:41 PM

Wait I thought Obama said it was a penalty?

The problem is Mr. Obama – you will make health insurance
unaffordable. Your goal is to put the health insurance industry
out of business. Then all Americans will be forced into
government run healthcare. The same government
who has trouble keeping it’s costs down on just sending mail…..

God help us.

redguy on July 14, 2012 at 2:42 PM

Just got back from CVS…

Four prescriptions that used to be about $5 each or so now cost me $90.

The employer and the insurance company, trying to stay in business by shifting costs, has shifted what was once a part of coverage to me.

Of course, I didn’t get a raise to cover these costs.

Who can blame them (not that I like it)? Government is knee deep in the regulation of health care already, and will soon be moving to destroy the private health care industry all together to make way for single payer, just as Barney Frank said.

This ****ing traitorous b****** is sending this country straight to h*** in a handbasket.

(And if Romney doesn’t become president, I will have to get a new computer due to the **** key being worn out)

turfmann on July 14, 2012 at 2:42 PM

And I can keep my current health plan…and I can keep my doctor(s)…and I can be less free

Gohawgs on July 14, 2012 at 2:43 PM

I don’t know how anyone can believe anything this POS says. He is lying so much that even the lapdog media is being forced to own up to it to a certain extent. Is he telling people that the cost of his program is now triple what he said it would be? No.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:44 PM

Maaybe Team Romney should remind everyone that Obowma and the Dems exempted themselves from Obowmacare…

Seven Percent Solution on July 14, 2012 at 2:44 PM

Its time to resurrect this

BobMbx on July 14, 2012 at 2:45 PM

Except for the unions who received exemptions from this ObamaTax altogether.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:39 PM

I believe those are temporary waivers.

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:45 PM

Finally…

… He’s running on his record!

/

Seven Percent Solution on July 14, 2012 at 2:45 PM

“You’re not being taxed if you have insurance. I’m just forcing insurance companies to raise their rates on you/your employer, to cover my mandate requirements. I’m not taxing you, I’m bankrupting you. There’s a difference, you racist”

- Pres. Obama

Weight of Glory on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

(And if Romney doesn’t become president, I will have to get a new computer due to the **** key being worn out)

turfmann on July 14, 2012 at 2:42 PM

how do you become president by sitting on your ass while the other guy trashes your record every second of the day?!?

GhoulAid on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

Lips moving = LYING.

RealMc on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

This tax on bhocare is just one tiny bit of ALL the new taxes and regulations coming from this bill! People need to not just look at bhocare, but all the other things in the bill that will take years to come out and sebelius is adding new ones by the minute!
L

letget on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

This law MUST be repealed in full. States are not going to expand medicare and create the “public option” that Democrats were planning on. Employers will save boatloads of cash by dropping coverage for employees but the state exchanges won’t be there to allow citizens to get insurance in order to comply with the law.

So now your employer will drop you and your only options are to sign up with your state government-run health insurance(if you live in a state that has the means to set one up, most don’t), buy a federally-mandated insurance policy which will be vastly more expensive because they require all kinds of superfluous coverage that most people don’t need (especially anyone under 50!), or go without insurance and pay the vastly cheaper Tax.

It’s almost like this law was designed to destroy the current system we have in order to create cries for the Government to “do something!”.

Mord on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

A few of the patient “rights” under the lunatic-left d-cRAT socialist healthcare nationalization, rationing, taxation and abortion atrocity:

1. you have a “right” to be taxed to death if you don’t pay for government-run obozocare
2. you have a “right” to be put into prison if you don’t pay the IRS penalty for not getting obozocare
3. you have a “right” to go without medical care when ALL doctors refuse to take any new patients under obozocare.
4. you have a “right” to pay for your obozocare out of your own pocket when your employer cancels your healthcare.
5. you have a “right” to die when the obozocare death panel refuses your treatment

Be afraid – be very afraid – of d-cRAT socialist healthcare.

The OBOZOCARE atrocity IS THE BIGGEST TAX INCREASE ON THE MIDDLE CLASS IN AMERICAN HISTORY…

Note: 30 June 2012, Stephen Moore, Senior Economics Writer with the Wall Street Journal: 75% OF OBAMACARE COSTS WILL FALL ON BACKS OF THOSE MAKING LESS THAN $120K A YEAR – “It’s a big punch in the stomach to middle class families. In 2016, an estimated 4 MILLION Americans will have to pay the mandate OBOZOTAX.” Moore’s analysis has been confirmed by the Congressional Budget Office, which NOW projects that OBOZOCARE will cost $2.6 TRILLION over its first decade, thus adding huge amounts to the US deficit and national debt.

TeaPartyNation on July 14, 2012 at 2:49 PM

He’s really in agitator mode in that clip. Preacher rhythms in full force.

aquaviva on July 14, 2012 at 2:50 PM

this man is a fool

ted c on July 14, 2012 at 2:50 PM

Funny how liars eventually and ALWAYS get bit in the a$$ by their own lies.

LOL!!

katy on July 14, 2012 at 2:50 PM

YOU LIE! Either you are so profoundly ignorant of what is going to happen to those of us who get health insurance from employers (esp. those who work for small and medium companies, you are lying about ACA, or both.

I am fairly confident it is both. These liars need to go ASAP.

Mitt, did you hear this? Please tell Americans what is about to happen to them, especially Medicare Advantage customers.

Philly on July 14, 2012 at 2:52 PM

I believe those are temporary waivers.

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:45 PM

I know. I’m thinking of all the other things that are temporary in DC, like the Doc fix, the telephone tax to fund the war of 1812 or whatever…. There is no reason to believe the unions will ever let their “temporary” waiver expire.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:54 PM

In the clip he agitates that the purpose of Obamatax was so that “they” wouldn’t “mess around with you” if “you’re paying your policy”.

aquaviva on July 14, 2012 at 2:54 PM

Attn. “independents”:

Remember, the Dems guaranteed that if you like your plan you can keep your plan, and if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor.

When the feces hit the windmill and when/if ObamaCare is fully implemented many people will lose both. And the Dems will, without a doubt, blame the evil, greedy insurance companies. Their answer will, without a doubt, be more regulation and more control.

Pay attention and stay tuned.

visions on July 14, 2012 at 2:54 PM

Medical device tax applies whether you have ins or not.

matthew8787 on July 14, 2012 at 2:55 PM

I’m guessing the deductables on these new policies are going to be so high that the coverage will be nearly worthless.I will be mostly out of pocket.

docflash on July 14, 2012 at 2:55 PM

The mandate penalty is still not a tax in any way, shape, or form. It’s un-Constitutional and un-American is what it is and it is nothing less than a Soviet-style coercion to buy the recommended products at the recommended prices or give your money to the government to spend on whatever it wants.

It is truly amazing – the depths that America has been dragged to, not just by the Indonesian Dog-Eating Imbecile and the useless idiots dems but by Bendict Roberts on a solitary and insane decision that should make his name “sh!t” for all eternity.

America has truly been Fundamentally Deformed already.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on July 14, 2012 at 2:56 PM

Isn’t there also a real estate transfer tax of what…2.8% or something? That will be interesting when so many people already owe more than their house is worth. Yet another thing to work out with lenders to get them to accept a “short sale”. The government will be sure to get their part first.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:59 PM

There are apparently 21 different taxes in Obamacare, he is only talking about one of them. If you sell a house next year and do too well on the capital gain, you will be paying another Obamatax.

slickwillie2001 on July 14, 2012 at 3:00 PM

This simple mind wonders why the GOP congress just doesn’t fund a gazillion IRS agents snooping into your privacy with your doctor? Go for it-it’s a win-win to put Obama and the left in a bag with such an offensive concept. Just ask out loud in a million ads if the IRS isn’t his private army?

Don L on July 14, 2012 at 3:04 PM

My premiums will double, my OOP expenses will increase, I will pay more federal and state taxes and I will get less healthcare services. Call it anything you like but it’s just the government taking more of my money and giving me nothing in return.

Blake on July 14, 2012 at 3:05 PM

If you have an IRA and fail to make withdrawals after a certain age then you are hit with a penalty tax. You are penalized for doing nothing. Of course opening an IRA is completely optional and you agree to the tax terms when you open one so there is still a big difference between that and the Obamacare tax penalty.

Wigglesworth on July 14, 2012 at 3:06 PM

Mord on July 14, 2012 at 2:46 PM

That’s been the goal all along. You knew that, right?

PatriotGal2257 on July 14, 2012 at 3:09 PM

“By the way, if you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax,” President Obama said.

So, since I have health insurance, I won’t be hit — directly or indirectly — by any of the other taxes in Obamacare either, right, Chump?

1. A 156% increase in the federal excise tax on tobacco

2. Obamacare Employer Mandate Tax

3. Obamacare Surtax on Investment Income

4. Obamacare Excise Tax on Comprehensive Health Insurance Plans

5. Obamacare Hike in Medicare Payroll Tax

6. Obamacare Medicine Cabinet Tax

7. Obamacare HSA Withdrawal Tax Hike

8. Obamacare Flexible Spending Account Cap – aka “Special Needs Kids Tax”

9. Obamacare Tax on Medical Device Manufacturers

10. Obamacare “Haircut” for Medical Itemized Deduction from 7.5% to 10% of AGI

11. Obamacare Tax on Indoor Tanning Services

12. Obamacare elimination of tax deduction for employer-provided retirement Rx drug coverage in coordination with Medicare Part D

13. Obamacare Blue Cross/Blue Shield Tax Hike

14. Obamacare Excise Tax on Charitable Hospitals

15. Obamacare Tax on Innovator Drug Companies

16. Obamacare Tax on Health Insurers

17. Obamacare $500,000 Annual Executive Compensation Limit for Health Insurance Executives

18. Obamacare Employer Reporting of Insurance on W-2

19. Obamacare “Black liquor” tax hike

20. Obamacare Codification of the “economic substance doctrine”

Resist We Much on July 14, 2012 at 3:13 PM

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 2:59 PM

That tax only applies to capital gains earnings above the excluded 500K on houses sold. Not sure how many that will affect anymore.

chemman on July 14, 2012 at 3:15 PM

No you’re still getting hit by the Tax, Mr President. You’re just paying it to a corporation instead of the government in that case.

and WHO is the party of big business now?

WolvenOne on July 14, 2012 at 3:16 PM

The mandate penalty is still not a tax in any way, shape, or form. It’s un-Constitutional and un-American is what it is and it is nothing less than a Soviet-style coercion to buy the recommended products at the recommended prices or give your money to the government to spend on whatever it wants.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on July 14, 2012 at 2:56 PM

Thank you sir, for getting the argument right. I know you catch a lot of crap for your overheated rhetoric, but you usually get it in a way that a lot of more “measured” folks, including Ed, Allah, and Jazz, do not.

Of course, Mitt Romney called it a tax — eventually.

That eventually is very telling, because Romney’s original approach, before he caved to a bunch of superficial, short-sighted criticism from the Republican pundit class was the correct one. I’ve read the entire SCOTUS decision, including the dissent, which is devastating. There is no way one can call the mandate penalty a tax, period. The mandate penalty is a penalty, and the entire Affordable Care Act is unconstitutional. When Ginsburg, in her dissent, does a better job arguing for the constitutionality of Obamacare under the Commerce clause than Roberts did upholding it under the tax power, something is very wrong. The dissent by the four conservative judges, of course, blows Ginsburg and Roberts out of the water.

Now, thanks to a bunch of idiots, we are stuck arguing that the mandate is a tax. Big deal. Obama is right, at least in the short term, which is all that matters for his reelection. Most of the country is insured. The penalty/tax will not affect them. The parts of Obamacare that are popular, like the preexisting conditions provision, are in effect now. And people with insurance will like the idea of freeloaders being forced to carry their end of the log.

Obamacare was designed so that the more onerous provisions don’t come on line until after the election. The Democrats are swine, but they are not stupid.

The Republicans, on the other hand, got all excited over this tax thing and missed the forest for the trees. Stupid is as stupid does.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:18 PM

Obama is lying though his teeth again. The typical catastrophic policy isn’t going to qualify. So no, “people who have insurance” aren’t going to be excused from his tax. Those people will either pay it or go get the government-mandated plan set down by HHS. Either way, they’re paying more.

“If you like your health insurance, you can keep it.” What a crock.

Murf76 on July 14, 2012 at 3:19 PM

Its time to resurrect this

BobMbx on July 14, 2012 at 2:45 PM

Yeah…that’s a good one (A lot of them have disappeared)

workingclass artist on July 14, 2012 at 3:19 PM

That tax only applies to capital gains earnings above the excluded 500K on houses sold. Not sure how many that will affect anymore.

chemman on July 14, 2012 at 3:15 PM

Well, okay. You are right, it won’t affect many. It still sucks.

Night Owl on July 14, 2012 at 3:21 PM

What about all the Waivers that were being issued right and left after TAXCare went into effect?

USMCmom on July 14, 2012 at 3:22 PM

“If you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax”

Outstanding! So let’s get this straight:

It’s only a tax if your are too poor to buy health insurance or too healthy to need it.

Got it.

EconomicNeocon on July 14, 2012 at 3:22 PM

Obama is telling the truth for once. But only on the detail of how he defines a tax. It’s very narrow, about hair-thin.

What he’s not telling is that certain medical-devices manufacturers are paying a higher tax to Washington on the products they produce (like prosthetics).

Also, insurance rates are going up fast, because an insurer is more tightly limited on what can be kept for the company as opposed to what must be held in a pool as a reserve to make payments in case of a major run of claims. Also, the insurance companies are collecting a tax for Obama (like a sales tax, the amount of which must be sent to states’ capitols every quarter or so), which is sent to Washington.

Basically, even if you have insurance, you’re still part of the tax scheme Oblowtheheckaway and the rest of the Democrats imposed on us.

You know, I take back what I said earlier that Obiteme partially told the truth.

The dipsh*t is a total liar.

Liam on July 14, 2012 at 3:24 PM

I got into an argument with a Lib acquaintance over this law. I told him that his employer could decide to pay the fine rather than carry insurance for him. But, since he makes too much he wouldn’t qualify for the government healthcare, which is just an expansion of Medicaid, he’ll be stuck. He’ll have to buy inurance at a hugely higher cost than he paid when his employer paid part. Or he can go without and pay the penalty/tax. He didn’t believe me. A couple of weeks later I saw him again and he told me had checked and I was right. Now he’s worried, and probably rightly so. Dummy voted for Obama. LOL

Deanna on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

The Republicans are selling this country’s freedom down the river for a sound bite. The mandate is not a tax, it is a penalty. Obamacare is unconstitutional, and an affront to the liberty that is our natural right. That is the only argument I want to hear.

Furthermore, re the Catholic Church, which was for Obamacare before they were against it: Obamacare is not an affront to religious liberty, it is an affront to liberty, period. I won’t accept your being O.K. with the mandate as long as you get your abortion and contraception exemptions. You either dump your social justice pretentions and get on board the freedom bus with the rest of us, or reap what you sew.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

i never thought i’d be capable of more contempt for this tool- but the big old sloppy quisling wet kiss Court Jester/Lap Poodle Roberts gave him and the subsequent DemonRat campaign of swanning about lying about It’s Great Triumph Unconscionable Usurpation of Power is forcing me to find It more and more loathsome …

mittens on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

I won’t accept your being O.K. with the mandate as long as you get your abortion and contraception exemptions. You either dump your social justice pretentions and get on board the freedom bus with the rest of us, or reap what you sew.

Mr. Arkadin

here here! this!

mittens on July 14, 2012 at 3:27 PM

If you have an IRA and fail to make withdrawals after a certain age then you are hit with a penalty tax. You are penalized for doing nothing. Of course opening an IRA is completely optional and you agree to the tax terms when you open one so there is still a big difference between that and the Obamacare tax penalty.

Wigglesworth on July 14, 2012 at 3:06 PM

You really have two things there. The first is the contributory tradtional IRA to which people make contributiions subject to annual limits on contributions. The second, and usually far larger, is the rollover IRA to which retiring employees move their balance in one or more of their employer’s profit-sharing plan, 401(k) plan, or other defined contribution plan. In either case, Congress has made the policy decision that in return for the tax-free accumulation over (usually) a long period of time at some point the IRA owner should be required to pull the move out over his or her life expectancy. Congress wants to see IRAs used as a retirement-income vehicle and not so much as an estate-planning vehicle. That said, for most people, by the time they hit the minimum distribution age (70 and 1/2), they’re pulling out more than the required minimum distribution.

Funny, for about 8 or 10 years (1986 or 1988 to 1997, maybe earlier), the Code used to have a tax on “excess distributions.” I’ll never forget trying to explain to a client that the IRS required him to take $X out of his IRA to avoid the tax on “excess accumulations,” but because he took out $X, he would have to pay a tax on “excess distributions” for having taken out such a large distribution. That 70-year-old and his 40-year-old son were furious. I felt as if I were explaining the mission-flying procedures to Yossarian in Catch-22.

Beyond that, how is this race even close? Are Americans really stupid enough to elect Obama again?

BuckeyeSam on July 14, 2012 at 3:31 PM

And, the codicle on page 2,397 states that, from now on, we must refer to the Federal Government as “the Politboro”.

kingsjester on July 14, 2012 at 3:32 PM

It’s only a tax if your are too poor to buy health insurance or too healthy to need it.

Got it.

EconomicNeocon on July 14, 2012 at 3:22 PM

Actually, the lowest strata of the poor are exempt from the mandate; they will be covered by the expanded Medicaid provision. Those who don’t fit the Medicaid criteria can purchase heavily subsidized policies through the new government exchanges.

The real poison pill in Obamacare is the employer mandate. The penalty is set so low that businesses will likely dump their insurance plans and pay the penalty, and save millions.

Worse, healthy young people may forgo insurance, pay the relatively benign penalty, then sign up for insurance when they get sick, and not pay onerous premiums due to the pre existing conditions provision.

Obamacare is a monstrosity, designed to bankrupt the insurance companies, destroy the employer based insurance business, and lead to single-payer. That is the huge difference between Obamacare, and Romneycare.

The entire bill needs to go, now.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:35 PM

Wrong again! If you have health Ins., you are getting hit by an even bigger “tax” in increased premiums. Already Health Insurers have increased their premiums and the sky is not even the limit with Obumbonocare. Plus now everyone will be forced to pay for abortions, contraception, and the euthanasia (death panels) of the sick and elderly. All promoted under the guise of “the general welfare” of the all powerful State.

aposematic on July 14, 2012 at 3:37 PM

If you buy what your dictator says to buy and behave as your dictator says to behave you won’t be taxed. Fundamentally transforming America one dictate at a time.

bgibbs1000 on July 14, 2012 at 3:38 PM

Attn. “independents”:

Yes?

Remember, the Dems guaranteed that if you like your plan you can keep your plan, and if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor.

Yes.

When the feces hit the windmill and when/if ObamaCare is fully implemented many people will lose both. And the Dems will, without a doubt, blame the evil, greedy insurance companies. Their answer will, without a doubt, be more regulation and more control.

I can believe it.

Pay attention and stay tuned.

OK!

visions on July 14, 2012 at 2:54 PM

Axe on July 14, 2012 at 3:39 PM

we have to cut him some slack…he didn’t know what was in the bill nor did Pelosi/Reid…

ever get buyer’s remorse? it’s pretty common…in fact that may explain Robert’s twisted thinking…slam my court repeatedly, you win a battle or two. but you lose the war…

teejk on July 14, 2012 at 3:40 PM

Jerk: you don’t even know what’s in your own bill. You lie all the time anyway, so why pay attention to you.

chai on July 14, 2012 at 3:41 PM

sew.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

*sow — unless I missed a metaphor?

Axe on July 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM

Deanna on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

You nailed it, Deanna, great job. This is what people don’t understand about Obamacare. They just think they are getting “free” healthcare, or that the freeloaders are going to get what is coming to them. They don’t realize that their employer may just dump their insurance program. Some folks will qualify for the Medicare expansion, and some for subsidized policies through the exchanges, but most will have to enter the private insurance market. Right now there is no tax deduction for private insurance (which Romney advocates), and I doubt folks will get a raise when they lose insurance, so costs will go up for the average person/family.

The mandate is not the issue. Obamacare is. The American public needs to know why this bill is a nightmare as a whole, and the Republicans, with this trite tax sound bite argument, are not doing it.

Idiots.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM

Obama: “If you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax”

He’s right……it’s going to be simply a matter of getting hit with higher premiums and co-pays, so relax. Those aren’t taxes, right?

hawkeye54 on July 14, 2012 at 2:40 PM

…notice that the phrase “cost of living” has disappeared from the media (like homeless people)…your food doesn’t cost more, gas doesn’t cost more, etc… 3 or 4 or more hundred dollars a month to pay in premiums for the same coverage…none of it is a tax! …and the LSM keeps giving him the air time he needs to drum his lies into the head of the unaware. They have to keep JugEars near 50%…so he has a shot at the election.

KOOLAID2 on July 14, 2012 at 3:43 PM

Axe on July 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM

Thank, yes, I’m a little agitated today and posted too quickly.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:43 PM

See you in the streets. ; )

Bmore on July 14, 2012 at 3:46 PM

You nailed it, Deanna, great job. This is what people don’t understand about Obamacare. They just think they are getting “free” healthcare, or that the freeloaders are going to get what is coming to them. They don’t realize that their employer may just dump their insurance program. Some folks will qualify for the Medicare expansion, and some for subsidized policies through the exchanges, but most will have to enter the private insurance market. Right now there is no tax deduction for private insurance (which Romney advocates), and I doubt folks will get a raise when they lose insurance, so costs will go up for the average person/family.

The mandate is not the issue. Obamacare is. The American public needs to know why this bill is a nightmare as a whole, and the Republicans, with this trite tax sound bite argument, are not doing it.
Idiots.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM

And the republicans are not going to do it either because they are the good cop, or bad cop depending on which side you fall polically, in this good cop, bad cop political scam being played on the American people with soft tyranny as the ultimate goal of both parties in DC. The sooner enough people wake up and start to put a stop to it the sooner we can get our country fixed.

bgibbs1000 on July 14, 2012 at 3:50 PM

that’s what they have been telling people about medicare, they collected the ‘tax’ for sixty or seventy years and now they are telling the baby boomers they don’t have the money to pay for their medical care.

RonK on July 14, 2012 at 3:52 PM

Thank, yes, I’m a little agitated today and posted too quickly.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:43 PM

Wasn’t even really a correction. You were on a tear, and I genuinely didn’t want anything to go over my head. :) Carry on.

Axe on July 14, 2012 at 3:52 PM

My employer doesn’t offor insurance.
I have my own plan through my self-employment business.
High deductible which means I pay for anything I need out-of-pocket.
Total cost of care including premiums is around $8,500/year.

But the lowest cost Bronze plan via Otax is around $12,500/year.

Obviously my current plan isn’t going to meet the Otax criteria so I will be fined by the IRS for the difference.
That is…if Blue Cross continues with my current policy…
If not…
Then it is the Bronze plan at a $4,000/year increase over what I have today.

I guess my cost isn’t going to go up….

Electrongod on July 14, 2012 at 3:53 PM

LOL. Teh Won can only win applause at high schools.

How the ‘mighty’ have fallen.

Key West Reader on July 14, 2012 at 3:56 PM

Most of the country is insured.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:18 PM

That was your money line and always the issue with this boondoggle….what was there, 9% or so…and then a % of those qualified for Medicaid, a few % were insurable and could afford, just decided to risk it and then the balance…so we have a One Size Fits All for 330 million folks for what 10 million were the issue..

Brilliant.

hillsoftx on July 14, 2012 at 3:57 PM

actually people won’t be paying the tax. There is little the IRS can do to collect the tax…basically docking your refund.

Refund?…so just lower the amt of w/holding and presto…no refund…no tax. Free HealthCare.

Nanzi is sooooo proud.

the leftist press won’t share with us the utter absurdity of this. barty.care subsidizes almost everyone. Medicaid to the state, Exchange plans up to 400 percent of fpl….of course employers can deduct the cost of insurance.

Everyone gets a freebie in barry.world. Even pharma got a few billion dollars…hospitals love it because they get $$$$$$$$$.

barry must be Brilliant!!! he’s come up with a system where every gets a subsidy

and, of course, all this is way too deep and boring for the celebrity/left press to care about…they are happy to be in Historic Times

r keller on July 14, 2012 at 3:57 PM

Where do we look to find out if we pay the Cadillac plan tax??? And is HHS writing all plans to look like Cadillac plans? or will they only cost that much?

Why doesn’t anyone know???

Fleuries on July 14, 2012 at 3:58 PM

The Achilles heel of O-tax is that the states do not have to set up the exchanges. the Feds might have to step in there and, when the costs exceed the budget (which is inevitable) taxes across the borad will have to rise.

My sister is Canadian. Some years ago, the people there with their ‘free’ health care had to also start paying out of pocket when they made a visit.

In Britain, with its ‘free’ healthcare, rural hospitals had to be closed down to cut costs. Then there’s that little mention of how many older people die each year in Merry Ol’ England because it costs too much to take care of them. Heck! The Brits can’t seem to even give those people a ‘dignified’ death when they let them die.

O-Tax isn’t about health care. The way it is written, and the way it will be ‘tweaked’ over time if it’s allowed to remain, is going to be totally Darwinian: Survival of the Fittest.

Didn’t Germany do something like this way back when?

Liam on July 14, 2012 at 3:59 PM

My employer doesn’t offor insurance.
I have my own plan through my self-employment business.
High deductible which means I pay for anything I need out-of-pocket.

Ya know, I really believe employers should not be held accountable for providing employees with health care insurance, any more than they provide home owners or automobile insurance. All personal needs such as these should be the sole responsibility of the individual.

hawkeye54 on July 14, 2012 at 3:59 PM

Electrongod on July 14, 2012 at 3:53 PM

Sorry to tell you, but Kathleen Sebelius will now dictate what is and what is not an acceptable health care plan.

And your plan, is not acceptable.

We need to ensure that we widen the gap by making certain that Bon Qui Qui can still get a first class ride to the emergency room if she gets the cramps or the sniffles. Your existing health care plan doesn’t cement Bon Qui Qui’s coverage so, you get a taxpenalty.

Key West Reader on July 14, 2012 at 3:59 PM

The simple fact is, he is wrong about that and I dare say he knows it. Which means… he’s lying.

ObamaCare already removed the tax exempt status of flexible spending accounts, so I am already paying higher taxes on health care related spending as a direct result of ObamaCare.

Additionally, there are taxes on medical device makers that will absolutely be passed on to consumers like me.

The idea that the only tax involved in ObamaCare is the penalty for not carrying insurance is BS.

deadrody on July 14, 2012 at 4:00 PM

Resist We Much on July 14, 2012 at 3:13 PM

(insert ever increasing number here) The taxing effect of having to listen to Zero’s endless lies.

we have to cut him some slack…

teejk on July 14, 2012 at 3:40 PM

No we don’t; he’s slack enough already.

ghostwalker1 on July 14, 2012 at 4:01 PM

In my case I have already started to save money on a prescription drug. I have had a urologist for about twenty years. I have medicare and a good retirement plan from my former employer. My copays have been quite low. My urologist has at best been breaking even on medicare patients. His expenses will increase under Obamacare. He is dropping me. Since I won’t have a prescription, I won’t get the medicine and I won’t have the small copay. So, everyone comes out ahead.

burt on July 14, 2012 at 4:01 PM

so, you get a taxpenalty.

Key West Reader on July 14, 2012 at 3:59 PM

That’s what I was afraid of..:(
Obama Lied!

Electrongod on July 14, 2012 at 4:03 PM

Thanks, John Roberts.

Cleombrotus on July 14, 2012 at 4:09 PM

barry.care will probably collapse sooner than we think. my wife got a note from her primary care that she’s going into ‘concierge’ practice (i.e. no insurance accepted, fixed annual price)

and when the sheeple find out that the silver plan, which the exchanges will be required to offer…they will have to pay 30 percent out of pocket…that will be interesting.

then too, the whole thing about the irs figuring out who has what insurance from who will be interesting….as will the filling of the ‘household’ form for figuring out household income…and eligibility for subsidies

r keller on July 14, 2012 at 4:10 PM

I no longer allow friends to try to defend this terror for what it claims to do with sad stories about hardships suffered at the hospitals. This thing transforms the government into a dictatorship, bankrupts the nation, and eviscerates the health care industry.

Shut up about your stupid inhalers fools, they come at a cost you have not begun to fathom.

StubbleSpark on July 14, 2012 at 4:15 PM

Furthermore, re the Catholic Church, which was for Obamacare before they were against it: Obamacare is not an affront to religious liberty, it is an affront to liberty, period. I won’t accept your being O.K. with the mandate as long as you get your abortion and contraception exemptions. You either dump your social justice pretentions and get on board the freedom bus with the rest of us, or reap what you sew.

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

Just so you know…there are conservative catholics who were quite vocal in disagreement with the Bishops who originally supported healthcare reform.

And what you call social justice pretensions are old doctrines of charity that have been hijacked and distorted by liberals within and outside the church.

1 in 6 hospital beds in this country is in a catholic charity hospital and catholics bear most of the costs not covered by medicare/medicaid by contributing to catholic charities. These hospitals and related social services will close because they fall under the jurisdiction of the Bishops.

The debate has been muddled to confuse people which is just how liberals want it.

workingclass artist on July 14, 2012 at 4:15 PM

Resist We Much on July 14, 2012 at 3:13 PM

Mitt needs to have this list memorized for the first debate. It would be killer because Obama would have no answer.

gophergirl on July 14, 2012 at 4:20 PM

You lie! If you have a “Cadillac Plan” you get taxed at 40%.

CC: unions in swing states

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:34 PM

Yet we know that won’t actually happen because of waivers/exemptions for progressive allies, right?

Midas on July 14, 2012 at 4:20 PM

Reading these true life stories from commenters is beyond depressing. Anyone who’s on facebook should pose a question to their friends (especially those nearing or on Medicare): Ask your doctor if he/she will continue to accept you as a patient next year. If not, will he drop you and keep non Medicare/Medicaid insured, or just decide to retire and drop their whole damned career as a doctor?

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 4:24 PM

Tax or whatnot, he apparently truly doesn’t understand what’s wrong with punishing Americans merely for being alive. It’s consistent with his belief that the birth of a child is a punishment. Elect him again and look forward to four more years of acute punishment. Allow his people to choose the next 2-3 SCOTUS justices and look forward to 50-100 years of capital punishment, the execution of America by slow strangulation, a penalty merely for being America. This is not a drill.

curved space on July 14, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Furthermore, re the Catholic Church, which was for Obamacare before they were against it: Obamacare is not an affront to religious liberty it is an affront to liberty, period…Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:25 PM

Obamacare is an affront on liberty. I agree with you but the issues are broader than this bill.

The constitutional case for the Catholic Bishops is that Obama and the Democrats have decided the Federal Government has the power to define Catholic Worship and Doctrine.

Obama has decided that Catholic Worship and doctrine are confined to Mass inside a Catholic Church, when Catholic Charities,Social Services,Hospitals and Parochial Schools are an integral part of Catholic Worship and have been since before the establishment of the earliest monastaries and convents and this practice grew when Constantine ended Official Roman Sanction of Christians in 300 AD.

These are inseparable for the Church and the US Constitution prevents the State from dictating the doctrine of a religion.

This power grab by Obama and the Democrats affects all Catholic Institutions if Obama is allowed to define religious doctrine.

workingclass artist on July 14, 2012 at 4:34 PM

Mr. Arkadin on July 14, 2012 at 3:18 PM

Thanks, Mr. Arkadin. I don’t mind the guff I take for some of my rhetoric. Those who understand the true nature of the situation we face understand why I say it the way I do. Those who don’t understand what we face are essentially useless and I couldn’t care less what they think about me, though I’m sure my rhetoric makes them think twice, anyway, since I always back up my assertions and am happy to give detailed responses to any questions people might have.

Back in the 2008 campaign I used to get into arguments with lots of folks about Barky’s alleged intelligence – which it was easy to see was a bad joke from the beginning. I tried to impress on people how important it was to understand what an idiot he was and to not shy away from saying that out loud. I even had a little heated argument with allah about it. I used to take guff from a lot of folks even at ace’s about what I was saying … until a couple of years passed and ace finally saw the light and started with his SCOAMF stuff (which is still too timid, but a step in the right direction).

Too many people think that all of this damage is easily repairable and that they have the time and luxury to pretend that it’s all just temporary, to be wiped away with one election. They are in for a very rude surprise.

ThePrimordialOrderedPair on July 14, 2012 at 4:37 PM

He did not stutter or pause, that “tax” line was in TOTUS so it was not off script.

tjexcite on July 14, 2012 at 4:38 PM

You lie! If you have a “Cadillac Plan” you get taxed at 40%.

CC: unions in swing states

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 2:34 PM

Anyone covered by a union contract, government or private, that covers their health insurance at work or in retirement, is exempted from the Obamacare Cadillac tax. That’s a part of the original Obamacare bill.

slickwillie2001 on July 14, 2012 at 4:39 PM

Vote for Obama in 2012.

Because, y

Key West Reader on July 14, 2012 at 4:51 PM

Anyone covered by a union contract, government or private, that covers their health insurance at work or in retirement, is exempted from the Obamacare Cadillac tax. That’s a part of the original Obamacare bill.

slickwillie2001 on July 14, 2012 at 4:39 PM

The public sector unions are about to crash.

Key West Reader on July 14, 2012 at 4:52 PM

Also what many are forgetting and definitely Obama’s crowd I KNOW did NOT even plan for this was they assumed ALL doctors would continue their practices as normal. We all know here on HA how that is going to turn out if this monstrosity is NOT REPEALED. Doctors will leave in droves and those of us that understand supply and demand what is that going to do to the cost of healthcare?

This is why it is so amazing to me every time we have an election i seriously think back to the times at our Founding that unless you have some form of home ownership or something more concrete to show you are invested in what goes on in this country you should not be allowed to vote. I am tired of my thought out and researched vote being cancelled out because someone who watches Jersey Shore (I think that is what that show is called) or who gets their political information from Jon Stewart votes for someone like Obama because “he’s cool and is going to give me Obama bucks!” IDIOTS!

Seriously, watch doctors leave in droves and then that broken arm that needs to be fixed right away…well we can get you in say…3 weeks…can you hold out that long? I’m sorry your 82 y/o Grandma needs a hip replacement well, policy has changed and you need to be 60 and younger to qualify for that…

These changes are coming unless we REPEAL this beast!

g2825m on July 14, 2012 at 4:58 PM

I’m sorry your 82 y/o Grandma needs a hip replacement well, policy has changed and you need to be 60 and younger to qualify for that…
g2825m on July 14, 2012 at 4:58 PM

Herr Doktor Obama has already responded to this. Take a pain pill. So there you have it!

Buy Danish on July 14, 2012 at 5:05 PM

Gotta PASS the bill to see whats in it!

TX-96 on July 14, 2012 at 5:12 PM

g2825m on July 14, 2012 at 4:58 PM

In many countries that implement socialist healthcare, doctors have had to be forced to stay inside the government system by various means. That’s the way we are headed if the manure pile that is Obamacare survives.

slickwillie2001 on July 14, 2012 at 5:13 PM

Obama: “If you’ve got health insurance, you’re not getting hit by a tax”

So today it is a tax and not a penalty?

Can afford to self insure? You get penalized/taxed if you try.

Need only catastrophic coverage and want to self insure everything else? Too bad.

Don’t really want or need one of the two or three health care plan choices Big Brother Obamacare restricts you to, would prefer more choices and a plan more in line with your age, health, wealth, and income, too bad. Big Brother Obamacare knows better. You will be penalized/taxed unless you buy one of the two or three plans Big Brother Obamacare says you must buy, for your own good.

I know of no another instance where the government massively restricts and dictates the choices of a contract it dictates you must enter into or be penalized/taxed.

Entering into a health insurance contract is not like buying a tie. Chief Justice Roberts is a fool. There has never been a “tax” anything like this.

farsighted on July 14, 2012 at 5:14 PM

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