F&F: Issa and Holder to meet today ahead of contempt vote

posted at 10:41 am on June 19, 2012 by Erika Johnsen

The imminent threat of actually being found in contempt of Congress has finally spurred Attorney General Eric Holder to some sort of definite action in the continuing investigation over his level of involvement in the deadly, not-botched gunwalking operation known as Fast and Furious.

Given that the Oversight Committee is composed of 22 Republicans and 16 Democrats, and that Holder “invented a privilege that doesn’t exist” in willfully neglecting to comply with last October’s Congressional subpoena of over 140,000 F&F-related documents, the Holder contempt-vote going forward is a very real possibility.  Looking to postpone that pending calamity to his career, Holder last week offered to meet with Oversight Chairman Darrell Issa and cough up a certain selection of the Fast and Furious-related documents that Congress subpoenaed last October. The potentially fateful meeting is currently supposed to take place at 5 p.m. this afternoon:

Holder, in a letter to Issa delivered Monday, said the Justice Department “has offered a serious, good faith proposal to bring this matter to an amicable resolution in the form of a briefing based on documents that the committee could retain.”

Until now, Issa, the chairman of House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, has demanded to see a trove of documents on the controversial Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives operation — and to know who prepared a now-retracted letter from Feb. 4, 2011, in which the Justice Department claimed the U.S. did not knowingly help smuggle guns to Mexico, including those later found at the murder scene of border agent Brian Terry

Congressional Republicans familiar with the investigation say Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls. …

However, late Monday, Issa wrote Holder back with a strategy of his own. Not only must Holder deliver the roughly 1,300 documents pertaining to the Feb. 4 letter, but he must also produce a description of all the documents he will not produce. Issa says that document log is “essential for the committee to determine whether the department has substantially met its obligations.”

I’d guess that Issa is probably chomping at the bit to vote to bring a contempt citation to the House floor, but is reluctantly agreeing to try to work with Holder in order to placate the GOP leadership — and it might actually be worse if a contempt vote does reach the House floor and fails to get through, or if Boehner won’t allow the vote at all. Perhaps Issa really does have some hope that these 1,300 documents will bear fruit, but I can’t help feeling like Holder is just stalling here. Honestly, what are you working so hard to hide?

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.


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Perhaps Issa really does have some hope that these 1,300 documents will bear fruit, but I can’t help feeling like Holder is just stalling here.

Yeah, that seems like a fairly strong possibility.

Red Cloud on June 19, 2012 at 10:44 AM

Holder, in a letter to Issa delivered Monday, said the Justice Department “has offered a serious, good faith proposal to bring this matter to an amicable resolution

as opposed to his previously unserious, bad faith and utter bullsh!t proposals….?

ted c on June 19, 2012 at 10:45 AM

Ddon’t cave Issa!

VegasRick on June 19, 2012 at 10:45 AM

I fear a cave coming on

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

Hey, good luck with that.

mankai on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Absoluetely, this is just another delaying tactic. It’s all he’s got left and he knows it. Holder will be thrown under the bus soon, I predict.

contrarian on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Congressional Republicans familiar with the investigation say Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls. …

Boehner being a spineless crapweasel? Who’d a thunk it?

OhioCoastie on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Holder is following Iran’s Nuke negotiation strategy.

Holder for Secretary of State!

weaselyone on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

I’ve said before that Holder has to just keep the music playing for longer and longer as he continues his tap dance. Nothing can happen to stop the music because, the game will stop. Of course he offers some bullsh!t proposal. I won’t be surprised if the vote is rescheduled or if Issa has a change of hear.

Mr. Issa, if you or your staff read this, DON’T FALL FOR IT. It’s a trap.
/akbar

ted c on June 19, 2012 at 10:47 AM

However, late Monday, Issa wrote Holder back with a strategy of his own. Not only must Holder deliver the roughly 1,300 documents pertaining to the Feb. 4 letter, but he must also produce a description of all the documents he will not produce. Issa says that document log is “essential for the committee to determine whether the department has substantially met its obligations.”

Good, make it harder for them not to hand over a document.

WisRich on June 19, 2012 at 10:47 AM

If we had a media that did their damn job this would have already played out cuz they would have brought pressure. In their world Democrats are not part of scandals even when lives are lost and national security at stake. Absolutely infuriating.

gsherin on June 19, 2012 at 10:47 AM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

…they better follow through. IMO Holder will provide a small portion of documents and try to get away with it some more.

TX-96 on June 19, 2012 at 10:47 AM

By bringing these documents, isn’t that equivalent to admitting that he has been stonewalling this whole time?

weaselyone on June 19, 2012 at 10:48 AM

contrarian on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

My suspicion is that Axelrod has already told The Won that Holder is a liability. Holder may be trying to save his skin here.

nobar on June 19, 2012 at 10:49 AM

The election is important…but justice comes first.

The American public can handle both issues, and seeing as the MSM isn’t spending any time reporting on Fast and Furious, I don’t see how it will take away from the election.

Boehner is wrong on this,the family of Terry and American, needs resolution, before Boehner needs his strategy implemented…and since congress is so “brilliant”, I challenge him to say he can’t handle both.

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 10:49 AM

Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls. …

Boehner continues to disappoint. He needs to lose the gavel…or whatever he supposedly wields.

AubieJon on June 19, 2012 at 10:51 AM

Holder: “Nice family you have there Mr Issa, I hope nothing happens to them.”

Dasher on June 19, 2012 at 10:52 AM

So if Holder does turn over more documents, surely they will have been scrubbed first or the most damning eliminated altogether? What am I missing?

Uncledave on June 19, 2012 at 10:52 AM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

I don’t give a damn how much the Democrats scream “WITCH HUNT!”. Holder has been stonewalling for over a year.

TWO US agents are DEAD; scores of Mexican nationals are DEAD.

Throw that into the faces of the Democrats.

GarandFan on June 19, 2012 at 10:53 AM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

Holder is clearly in contempt. I doubt that a meeting where Holder suggests that the DoJ brief the committee on the documents they refuse to provide is absurd. It’s like Sandy Berger’s crime. It’s more than just the outcome, how much context would Holder ignore to save his hide and that of his inner circle. The real question is if Issa has the votes to pass contempt charges out of committee.

Happy Nomad on June 19, 2012 at 10:53 AM

He will bring part of the docs, say the others are coming…and many redacted so as to be unreadable.
He will request a special panel to review any “sensitive” docs, and of course the panel will consist of equal dems and Republicans.
When Issa refuses, it will be played out as saying it’s proof that it’s a witch hunt…and the MSM would carry the water.

“You can’t possibly expect all the documents to be exposed publicly, it puts America at great risk”

Just one scenario that could be played out…there are literally dozens of others like that.

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 10:53 AM

Having litigated document production disputes for over 40 years I say:
Issa should not compromise at all.

GaltBlvnAtty on June 19, 2012 at 10:54 AM

I fear a cave coming on

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM

I can smell it, cmsinaz.

PopsRacer on June 19, 2012 at 10:55 AM

The Chicago Way.

Hening on June 19, 2012 at 10:57 AM

Thank heaven for Darrell Issa.

Holder: “Nice family you have there Mr Issa, I hope nothing happens to them.”

Dasher on June 19, 2012 at 10:52 AM

Yup, that sums it up pretty well.

petefrt on June 19, 2012 at 10:58 AM

I dont trust either of those idiots.

Dragoro on June 19, 2012 at 10:58 AM

By bringing these documents, isn’t that equivalent to admitting that he has been stonewalling this whole time?

weaselyone on June 19, 2012 at 10:48 AM

I don’t note anything that would suggest that Holder is suddenly willing to comply with the full scope of the subpeona. His people have clearly scrubbed and heavily redacted another batch of documents and are going to try to pawn them off as definitive proof that Holder wasn’t knowledgeable about F&F from the beginning.

Keep in mind, it wasn’t about gun smuggling it was about attacking the Second Amendment in order to curb all those illegal guns in Mexico. This, along with the deliberate leaking of highly classified information to the NYT for political purposes makes Nixon look like a rookie.

Happy Nomad on June 19, 2012 at 10:58 AM

Strange similarity between the behavior of Holder and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. I wonder if Holder considers the Iranian midget one of ‘his people’.

Wine_N_Dine on June 19, 2012 at 10:58 AM

say Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls

Well sure. What’s the life of a border patrolman and the basic Constitutional freedoms of America against Boehner keeping his majority seat; nothing, absolutely nothing. We must all sacrifice to make sure that lifer pols continue to get their perks of office.

The GOP will betray you. Me, I’m getting ready.

Bishop on June 19, 2012 at 11:03 AM

Issa already knows what is in the documents. Holder knows it too. Boehner is on the same page as Issa. Holder has perjured himself and its all a matter of timing now. Let’s calm down and enjoy the coming meltdown because he has to cover for Obama at all costs.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 11:06 AM

If Issa caves due to Boehner, I’m going to start losing all hope for the USA.

The Rogue Tomato on June 19, 2012 at 11:07 AM

Keep in mind, it wasn’t about gun smuggling it was about attacking the Second Amendment in order to curb all those illegal guns in Mexico. This, along with the deliberate leaking of highly classified information to the NYT for political purposes makes Nixon look like a rookie.

Happy Nomad on June 19, 2012 at 10:58 AM

This. This is where Obama is standing nekkid. And they did the same thing moving guns into Chicago from Milwaukee.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 11:09 AM

…I can’t help feeling like Holder is just stalling here…

Wow, ya think? Only since like forever.

Knott Buyinit on June 19, 2012 at 11:09 AM

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 11:06 AM

I hope it’s that. It would be great for Issa to slide a stack of incriminating documents across the table to Holder, telling him that he’s effed and the only way to escape Leavenworth is to start blabbing.

Bishop on June 19, 2012 at 11:09 AM

Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls. …

Boehner doesn’t have a pair of “stones” in his body. He’ll cave and then cry on the House floor when he has to hand the gavel back to Nancy. I think I’ll donate to his opponent in the their next election, we need to get rid of him.

TulsAmerican on June 19, 2012 at 11:14 AM

What negotiation is there to do?

The Regime hasn’t even CLAIMED executive privilege over these, and if they did, they’d have no right to.

Which means Congress, which has the Constitutional duty to oversee the Justice Department issues subpoenas for those records and the DoJ then MUST PROVIDE THEM.

Holder has as much legal authority to withhold them as we do to not pay any taxes.

Issa shouldn’t be meeting with this crook at all except to say, “ok, Eric, if you don’t want contempt charges and JAIL, have all those documents in my office by tomorrow morning”. And that’s THE ONLY DEAL he should offer.

wildcat72 on June 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Great point made by the whistle-blower yesterday. In 4 weeks, we knew all about the Secret Service foul-up, and people were fired. With F&F, we still don’t know anything after 18 months of ‘investigation.’

Issa needs to go forward. Enough lies and stonewalling.

Schwalbe Me-262 on June 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Issa to Holder with a picture of Agent Terry on his desk…

“… my people!”

Seven Percent Solution on June 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Yepper popsracer

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

If the GOP had been on top of its “messaging” from the start and had it been hammering home the questions of the legality of the operation and the purpose of this poorly executed plan, there would be no need for worry. This is not a partisan issue at all.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:17 AM

GOP members of Congress should wear buttons with Brian Terry’s picture on it.

Tough for the media to ignore the story then.

BuckeyeSam on June 19, 2012 at 11:17 AM

if Boehner won’t allow the vote at all

Fact: Holder has been blocking the investigation of F&F.

What politics? Right is right and wrong is wrong! If Boehner does prevent the vote, then we need to primary him out of a job!

The problem is that Boehner probably is playing politics because he has in other aspects. I look at it simply… Do what is RIGHT… PERIOD

If Boehner or any others will refuse to stand up for freedom and what is right, then they need to find another job.

jeffn21 on June 19, 2012 at 11:17 AM

After Friday’s complete usurping of Congress and the Constitution, it is time to play hardball with this thug….fully insert the heated cattle prod Mr.Issa, our hands anxiously await clapping…

hillsoftx on June 19, 2012 at 11:17 AM

Holder, in a letter to Issa delivered Monday, said the Justice Department “has offered a serious, good faith proposal to bring this matter to an amicable resolution
as opposed to his previously unserious, bad faith and utter bullsh!t proposals….?

ted c on June 19, 2012 at 10:45 AM

Yep, Holder has included all of the poll-tested buzz words that will keep the stenographers in the media happy.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:19 AM

If EVER there was a time to stay strong and not cave into politics, this is it. If for no other reason than justice for a fallen CBP officer. But there is certainly more at stake here.
To allow a JUSTICE department official, let alone the AG himself, to simply thumb his nose at congressional oversight, is to fundamentally give up the balance of power so critical to the United States constitution. I’m saying a prayer that Issa will stand his ground.
To hell with politics Rep. Issa, do the right thing.

JusDreamin on June 19, 2012 at 11:19 AM

Boehner doesn’t have a pair of “stones” in his body. He’ll cave and then cry on the House floor when he has to hand the gavel back to Nancy. I think I’ll donate to his opponent in the their next election, we need to get rid of him.

TulsAmerican on June 19, 2012 at 11:14 AM

I couldn’t agree with you more. I think Boehner is doing more damage to America by sitting on his hands than we realize. Now is the time to fight these commie bast*rds. Boehner is curled up in a fetal position afraid that the New York Slimes crowd may say mean things about him.

Wine_N_Dine on June 19, 2012 at 11:20 AM

The GOP should hold a press conference and ask Americans why Obama is violating the Constitution to recognize younger illegal immigrants at the same time his administration is sending guns to Mexico to arm drug cartels and to kill Mexican citizens.

BuckeyeSam on June 19, 2012 at 11:21 AM

Great point made by the whistle-blower yesterday. In 4 weeks, we knew all about the Secret Service foul-up, and people were fired. With F&F, we still don’t know anything after 18 months of ‘investigation.’

Issa needs to go forward. Enough lies and stonewalling.

Schwalbe Me-262 on June 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Actually it’s worse…we know the whistle blower was put on leave of absence for lying, or at least being accused of lying.
The irony is that what he said has been proven to be correct and accurate, but he is still on leave.
The reason? The politically snaky term: He is on leave because he was accused of providing false information.

Even if it was found to be accurate and honest, he can still be place on leave because of the accusation…disgusting perverted bureaucrats.

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 11:21 AM

to simply thumb his nose at congressional oversight, is to fundamentally give up the balance of power so critical to the United States constitution.
JusDreamin on June 19, 2012 at 11:19 AM

The balance of power took a sabbatical in Jan ’09…expected return date Jan ’13.

hillsoftx on June 19, 2012 at 11:22 AM

I’m sure Holder is right now thinking of all the ways Boehner and the boys have held the Obama admins feet to the fire in the past and saying…..”bwwaaaa haa haa, screw you Issa”.

Spider79 on June 19, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Erika, the phrase is “champing at the bit” not “chomping at the bit”.

PleaseFlyOver on June 19, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Issa already knows what is in the documents. Holder knows it too. Boehner is on the same page as Issa. Holder has perjured himself and its all a matter of timing now. Let’s calm down and enjoy the coming meltdown because he has to cover for Obama at all costs.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 11:06 AM

Yep. Holder hands over all of the requested documents today, or tomorrow he’s held in contempt.

I think it’s a safe bet he’s not going to hand over all of the documents today, so, I’m very much looking forward to tomorrow! :)

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 11:24 AM

The man who as clinton’s deputy AG forcefully pushed for commutations and clemency for domestic terrorists and murderers FALN/ los macheteros( 130 bombings, numerous armed robberies and 6 murders)… and assorted Weather Underground serial bomber girl moppets… And still got confirmed as AG with republican votes on his side.

like holder has ever cared about the death on innocents when they are murdered in the pursuit of social justice and communism. dead people- that’s called ‘collateral damage’ in the war against america, her citizens and her constitution. Dead people. Ignored laws. Selective prosecution of crimes dependent on skin tone.

the senate voted to confirm him-they are in part responsible for enabling his criminality. The house needs to stop pussy footing around like they’re the ladies who lunch while our rule of law is being destroyed.

mittens on June 19, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Why are we taking an anonymous source’s word that Boehner wants to cave? I would say that the reporter of this story is trying to push the partisan angle in order to protect Holder and Obama.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:25 AM

a serious, good faith proposal to bring this matter to an amicable resolution

Finally we will get to the bottom of this.
/

Kenosha Kid on June 19, 2012 at 11:27 AM

Issa needs to go forward. Enough lies and stonewalling.

Schwalbe Me-262

Fully agree.

Now where are you so I can shoot you down?

:D

8thAirForce on June 19, 2012 at 11:31 AM

Are we calling it a witch hunt because of the racist implications? Because Holder has quite a history of “questionable” decisions going for him. I’m not sure there were any Dem’s or media folk that called the Scooter Libby investigation a witch hunt; and that actually WAS a witch hunt.

BettyRuth on June 19, 2012 at 11:34 AM

I hope Holder is ready to come clean but I doubt it.

Speakup on June 19, 2012 at 11:34 AM

Redacting is only for documents made available to the public.

A very small amount can be done on sources and methods.

To Congress you increase the security level and hand them over as Congress is the source of power in the security system, which is administered by the President: Congress has the power to look into anything it wishes.

By redacting the documents and not offering them clean but with a higher classification level, Holder is in contempt of Congress which has the power to see it all. That is the final stop against a rogue agency: Congress and its power to get ahold of everything. Even if it is with fewer members of the committee designated for such material, it cannot be withheld.

When you see any agency redacting documents for Congress, start to suspect something is up. When they are stone-walled, you have a positive indicator of the power of Congress being defied. If Congress cannot trust the IG of an agency to do this work, then Congress must do it. The contempt started with the first redaction and not just upping classification to indicate sensitive documents. It isn’t a political question, but one of the necessary checks and balances in the entire Constitution that is at stake.

It is time to remind your Congresscritters that they are being ignored and their power defied on multiple counts and that they have a basic job to do without regard to party or ideology. Yes that message is difficult to get through the constant party and ideological finger-pointing, that is why the final arbiters, the ones who grant these powers, comes from the people. All final accountability starts with you, not Congress, not an IG, not a bureaucratic system… you are necessary as a final check and balance as well.

ajacksonian on June 19, 2012 at 11:41 AM

“Never mind this…

… did you hear Romney say “Wawa”?” – Andrea Mitchell, NBC News

Seven Percent Solution on June 19, 2012 at 11:43 AM

Why are we taking an anonymous source’s word that Boehner wants to cave? I would say that the reporter of this story is trying to push the partisan angle in order to protect Holder and Obama.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:25 AM

Excellent question.

That so-far unfounded rumor has been swirling around for months, along with the one that says Grassley and Issa have not been working together very well on the F&F prosecution. What I find interesting is that those rumors have been being propagated by people on the Right…

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 11:44 AM

Congressional Republicans familiar with the investigation say Issa is under pressure from House Speaker John Boehner to drop the Fast and Furious investigation because Boehner sees it as an election-year distraction that could hurt Republicans at the polls. …

I think as long as Issa keeps the focus on Holder and Justice and doesn’t make it look like a witch hunt on the White House this will not be a political liability to any significant extent. I am sure Holder knows there are potential whistleblowers within Justice who would be habby to rat out Holder if the situation presented itself.

And I have to add that Boehner is a pu$$y. Pelosi may be insane but she has bigger balls than Boehner that is for sure.

DaveDief on June 19, 2012 at 11:45 AM

I absolutely Detest Republican Leadership. Smarmy little political-pacifist douchebag losers, lacking in both backbone and principles.

F U Boner and Company….hope you all contract rectal cancer.

Tim_CA on June 19, 2012 at 11:47 AM

F U Boner and Company….hope you all contract rectal cancer.

Tim_CA on June 19, 2012 at 11:47 AM

karma can be a b!tch – be careful what you wish for…

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

libs touting the elijah cumming lie that this all started under the bush administration….

PUHLEEZE

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

Why are we taking an anonymous source’s word that Boehner wants to cave? I would say that the reporter of this story is trying to push the partisan angle in order to protect Holder and Obama.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:25 AM

In what reality could Boehner see this as a net negative for Republicans? Does he think us incapable of looking at the economy and Democrat malfeasance at the same time? The Democrats own every thread of this stinking garment and anyone who pays attention knows this. Those who still aren’t paying attention probably wouldn’t care either way. They can still read unemployment statistics. They still have to pay much more for gas and groceries and they still know how much less their homes are worth. What distraction?

Extrafishy on June 19, 2012 at 11:56 AM

I already hold Eric Holdout in contempt.

iurockhead on June 19, 2012 at 11:57 AM

I won’t be happy unless Issa walks out of the meeting with Holders head on a platter…

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

I absolutely Detest Republican Leadership. Smarmy little political-pacifist douchebag losers, lacking in both backbone and principles.

F U Boner and Company….hope you all contract rectal cancer.

Tim_CA on June 19, 2012 at 11:47 AM

Did any of your hamburgers burn while you posted your outrage? Or where you outside sweeping the front of the McDonalds…

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 12:01 PM

Erika, the phrase is “champing at the bit” not “chomping at the bit”.

PleaseFlyOver on June 19, 2012 at 11:24 AM

At least if you are going to be foolish and try to correct someone…be right.
Either one is correct…you didn’t know what she meant? Really?

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 12:04 PM

I won’t be happy unless Issa walks out of the meeting with Holders head on a platter…

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

You are speaking for the vast majority of us here!

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 12:04 PM

For the Republicans who voted for the partisan hack, probable criminal Holder, shame (if you are capable of that emotion).

This F & F is a big deal.

trl on June 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Has anybody ever said what this meeting is supposed to be ABOUT?

When there’s a discovery order you either obey it, file an objection, or disobey it. Those are the only three options.

If this “meeting” is just some formalized way of physically handing over the documents, then that’s fine. Otherwise, it’s a little hard to see what there could possibly be to chat about.

logis on June 19, 2012 at 12:06 PM

This isn’t a mysterious stain on a blue dress. People are dead. In what universe does this hurt Republicans? It’s time to play hard ball with this, and accuse the Obama administration of not caring about dead Mexicans and border patrol agents as long as it furthers the progressive agenda. No blood for socialism!

bitsy on June 19, 2012 at 12:08 PM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.
POSTED AT 10:41 AM ON JUNE 19, 2012 BY ERIKA JOHNSEN

May be a bit late to worry about that.
This is already seen as a politically motivated witch hunt by much of the electorate. And as far as those who don’t see it that way, they’ve been wound up to believe there’s some case to made here that will put Holder in jail. So I think in the end, Issa & co will be pleasing none of the people none of the time.
Perhaps Boehner will empathize.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:15 PM

One thing’s for sure. We got to smoke out some new trolls today and confirm the others. Good job Erika.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 12:23 PM

One thing’s for sure. We got to smoke out some new trolls today and confirm the others. Good job Erika.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 12:23 PM

Yes…a worthy endeavor for a thinking lot.
Ha.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:28 PM

Threatening all kinds of scary stuff if Issa proceeds…who blinks first????

aposematic on June 19, 2012 at 12:29 PM

This is already seen as a politically motivated witch hunt by much of the electorate.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:15 PM

If that’s true, then the media is not doing its job.

It is a crime to lie to congress. Holder lied to congress at least twice.

It is contemptible to withhold 130,000+ subpoenaed documents, so Holder deserves to be charged with contempt of congress.

It is obvious to anyone with an IQ over 1 digit that Holder is hiding things, things that should be exposed, things the American public has a right to know.

These issues have nothing to do with politics.

The Rogue Tomato on June 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

These issues have nothing to do with politics.

The Rogue Tomato on June 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

I don’t see it that way –
but if you do, ok.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:38 PM

I fear a cave coming on

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 10:46 AM
I can smell it, cmsinaz.

PopsRacer on June 19, 2012 at 10:55 AM

…Issa looks mad enough to me…I’m waiting for him to punch him!…He’s no Mitch the b!tch or crybaby Bonehead that just make sounds.

KOOLAID2 on June 19, 2012 at 12:40 PM

I don’t give a damn how much the Democrats scream “WITCH HUNT!”. Holder has been stonewalling for over a year.

TWO US agents are DEAD; scores of Mexican nationals are DEAD.

Throw that into the faces of the Democrats.

GarandFan on June 19, 2012 at 10:53 AM

Amen Brother! Didn’t these spineless Repubes learn ANYTHING from Wisconsin? Stand up for the Right Thing and let events play out. These results may surprise. Doing nothing will surely disappoint.

rotorjoe on June 19, 2012 at 12:46 PM

This is already seen as a politically motivated witch hunt by much of the electorate.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:15 PM

Yes – by that section of the electorate who are too stupid to tie their own shoes, or too blinded by leftist ideology to think (sorry about the redundancy). We should not worry about trying to pander to that segment of the electorate.

Those of us who have the capacity to think on our own, however, realize that a bungled “law enforcement operation” that resulted in the deaths of two American law enforcement agents and 200 to 400 Mexican nationals needs to be investigated – not covered up.

SubmarineDoc on June 19, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Has anybody ever said what this meeting is supposed to be ABOUT?

Actually, yeah!

When there’s a discovery order you either obey it, file an objection, or disobey it. Those are the only three options.

If this “meeting” is just some formalized way of physically handing over the documents, then that’s fine. Otherwise, it’s a little hard to see what there could possibly be to chat about.

logis on June 19, 2012 at 12:06 PM

Everything you are saying is true.

Issa and others have said they are expecting full compliance from Holder today, and nothing less than that, if Holder wants to forestall the contempt vote.

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 12:54 PM

Issa had to agree to this meeting; he can’t be seen as refusing a meeting, -as being the stubborn one. If we are to get a significant vote against Holder in the House our side has to demonstrate that we have given Holder every opportunity to meet his obligation of transparency.

I expect this meeting will be a formality, and Holder will still be FAR from full compliance with the committee, and the contempt vote will move ahead.

slickwillie2001 on June 19, 2012 at 12:57 PM

Why are we taking an anonymous source’s word that Boehner wants to cave? I would say that the reporter of this story is trying to push the partisan angle in order to protect Holder and Obama.

onlineanalyst on June 19, 2012 at 11:25 AM

Excellent question.

That so-far unfounded rumor has been swirling around for months, along with the one that says Grassley and Issa have not been working together very well on the F&F prosecution. What I find interesting is that those rumors have been being propagated by people on the Right…

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 11:44 AM


On the one hand …

… onlineanalyst gets to the meat of the issue – the LSM has been trying to kill/spin this story from Day One including trying to split the Republicans in any manner they can but …

… on the other hand …

You are willing to accept the likely misinformation that “rumors” are being propagated by people ion the Right?

I forget who to credit this line to but it somes up ALL aspects of F&F:

“Liars, lies and the lying liars who report the lies.”

So far no one seems to have noticed the meeting is timed for 5:00 PM EDT to keep anything said in the meeting out of the evening news cycle.

Hmmmmm, that’s curious. Almost like certain people don’t trust any of the Democratic participants or the LSM.

PolAgnostic on June 19, 2012 at 1:02 PM

Did any of your hamburgers burn while you posted your outrage? Or where you outside sweeping the front of the McDonalds…

right2bright on June 19, 2012 at 12:01 PM

Ah yes….another elitest RNC stooge. I’d proudly flip burgers for a career if it meant doing away with all of the morons like you, skippy.

oh and btw…. F U too.

Tim_CA on June 19, 2012 at 1:16 PM

These issues have nothing to do with politics.

The Rogue Tomato on June 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

I don’t see it that way –
but if you do, ok.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:38 PM

Verbulace is on record as stating that he believes executive agencies are allowed to a) lie to congress and b) ignore congressional subpeonas if they don’t agree with the investigation.

There is no need to further discuss anything with her as she clearly believes only in will-to-power. Rule of law and separation of powers means nothing to her. Everything she believes is filtered 100% through ideology – she does not care about law, or rules, or anything else except partisan advantage.

Therefore, to her, it is perfectly acceptable for DOJ to refuse to comply with any congressional subpoena because it fits her ideological view of the world.

I certainly hope she remembers that in the future when there is a republican president and his agencies don’t want to comply with a democratic congress’s subpoena or investigation. Of course, Verbulace, like most unprincipled and dishonest leftists, will suddenly start spouting off about rule of law, etc. b/c all of a sudden, congressional subpoenas will mean something.

Verbulace likely was a war protestor and against everything Idiot O does before he was elected, but now finds it all just peachy keen.

No principals, no intellect, no ethics, no honesty, no problem.

Monkeytoe on June 19, 2012 at 1:21 PM

I realize the GOP is worried about how an ostensible “witch hunt” might look to the electorate, but I am sincerely hoping they won’t sacrifice accountability for the sake of politics.

With all due respect Erika, please wake up. This fix has been in on this for months. Please notice that this is dated Feb. 7th 2012.

http://thewildernessofmirrors.wordpress.com/2012/02/07/speaker-john-boehnor-and-congressman-darryl-issa-conspire-to-betray-america/

SWalker on June 19, 2012 at 1:22 PM

This is already seen as a politically motivated witch hunt by much of the electorate.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:15 PM

BS! Much of the electorate still don’t know a damn thing about Fast and Furious thanks to a complicit media working to protect the boy king and his administration.

Flora Duh on June 19, 2012 at 1:22 PM

… on the other hand …

You are willing to accept the likely misinformation that “rumors” are being propagated by people ion the Right?

PolAgnostic on June 19, 2012 at 1:02 PM

No, that’s a misundertanding of what I meant – I meant that those on the Right propagating the rumors have been doing so because they’ve been giving into their pessimism/preconceived notions about “inevitable” GOP capitulance, which I find to be somewhat hysterical, and unwise…

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Lsm proclaiming issa doing this political reasons only and yet defend dear leader as NOT playing politics with his edict

IDIOTS

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM

With all due respect Erika, please wake up. This fix has been in on this for months. Please notice that this is dated Feb. 7th 2012.

http://thewildernessofmirrors.wordpress.com/2012/02/07/speaker-john-boehnor-and-congressman-darryl-issa-conspire-to-betray-america/

SWalker on June 19, 2012 at 1:22 PM

That’s the kind of cynical, so-far unsubstantiated rumor I mean.

SWalker, if that ends up being a myth, will you volunteer yourself to go into the dunk tank as punishment for your participation in spreading that kind of BS?

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 1:29 PM

…Issa looks mad enough to me…I’m waiting for him to punch him!…He’s no Mitch the b!tch or crybaby Bonehead that just make sounds.

KOOLAID2 on June 19, 2012 at 12:40 PM

Daryl Issa used to be my congressman, he is not a towering image of virtue by any stretch of the imagination. I have had personal business dealing with him, he stiffed my company for over $4000.00 dollars. Daryl Issa doesn’t do anything that doesn’t personally profit Daryl Issa.

That cliche that Dire loves to quote, “The GOP will betray you” goes triple for Issa.

SWalker on June 19, 2012 at 1:30 PM

I don’t see it that way –
but if you do, ok.

verbaluce on June 19, 2012 at 12:38 PM

You don’t see it that way not because you are being honest, but because you are a partisan hack who’s not interested in getting to the bottom of why guns were allowed to walk while they officially were forbidden to be tracked – what possible good explanation could be offered up to explain such insane behavior?

This should be a simple exercise – Congress has the Constitutional authority/right to ask for the documents it has, and unless 0bamessiah wants to formally declare executive privilege, which He has not done, Holder must legally hand them over. Failure to do so is why the Oversight Committee’s contempt threats are completely justified

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 1:52 PM

That’s the kind of cynical, so-far unsubstantiated rumor I mean.

SWalker, if that ends up being a myth, will you volunteer yourself to go into the dunk tank as punishment for your participation in spreading that kind of BS?

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 1:29 PM

Myths are things that are not real. You do understand that don’t you? The near total public information black-out with regard to “Fast and Furious” of a Department of Justice operation that violated multiple US Federal Laws, that basically constituted an act of war against a sovereign nation, that resulted in the deaths of hundreds if not thousands of people including at least two American Law Enforcement members, isn’t a myth.

The degree that both Issa and Boehner have dragged their feet on this investigation and been complicent in the media black-out isnt a myth. Compare how this has been addressed by members of congress to how the Iran-Contra affair was.

Watergate, the Iran-Contra scandal, Whitewate and Plamegate have, or at least should have if you were paying attention, taught us that regarding as major scandal, it isn’t the Media that dictates the amount of or degree of media coverage a scandal gets. Especially when that scandal involves criminal actions taken by high level government officials.

No, what dictates the amount and degree of media coverage a scandal of this nature receives, are the actions of the members of the majority party in congress.

SWalker on June 19, 2012 at 1:59 PM

Lsm proclaiming issa doing this political reasons only and yet defend dear leader as NOT playing politics with his edict

IDIOTS

cmsinaz on June 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Democrats/Leftists are never partisan, unfair, or hypocritical, are they?

We shouldn’t expect the blind, thoughtless, excuse-making IDIOTS to not stick together, should we? :)

Bizarro No. 1 on June 19, 2012 at 2:04 PM

Holder is trying to save his neck.
This is not about producing documents but it is about saving his neck. He wants protection or to stall and buy time.

Nothing in this meeting today on Holders part will be abiut producing documents.

seven on June 19, 2012 at 2:10 PM

SWalker, there was a total black out of the ACORN deal as well. Hell there was a total blackout of any detremental information on Obama and it still holds. Look at your four named scandals and note that every one of them was used as a club against repubs. I’ll give you a few minutes to try to come up with an instance of the media doing so against any dem. Try to say Whitewater was harmful to dems and I say how? No one remembers anything about it except Ken Starr went salacious by prosecuting Clenis for sex between consenting adults.

Not having media coverage is not the problem we have. Getting people killed to make anti-constitutional policy without having to answer for it is. The truth will win out or the nation is done. Sorry to hear Issa got to you and I do agree politicians are typically scummy but look down the road in this case. Holder is going down and it will be a very good thing for Obama to lose his most reliable wingman. Let the repubs run the clock.

DanMan on June 19, 2012 at 2:19 PM

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