WaPo wonders: What will hundreds of thousands of job permits do to the economy?

posted at 11:01 am on June 16, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

I asked the same question in an update to Erika’s post on Barack Obama’s unilateral move to accommodate young illegal immigrants by refusing to deport them and issue them temporary work permits instead.  With potentially as many as 800,000 new workers flooding into the system, what happens to the millions of Americans who can’t find work now?  The Washington Post wonders the same thing, and more:

President Obama has just opened a floodgate of opportunity for young illegal immigrants in the United States, but could it squeeze the aspirations of legal Americans in the process? …

Under the new policy, as many as 1.4 million undocumented immigrants under age 30 will be able to apply for the amnesty, allowing them to work and attend college legally. To be eligible, they must have been in the United States for five years, have no criminal record, and attend high school or college or be a military veteran.

The policy does not provide permanent legal residency, but it protects those who qualify from being deported and gives them a chance to renew their new status every two years. It also does not grant any public benefits, such as Medicare and Medicaid. Federal law already grants all undocumented immigrants the right to a public-school education and emergency hospital care.

The new policy could entail additional costs for administration and enforcement, however, and put pressure on state systems of higher education to meet growing demand for slots.

A move like this might have made sense in 2005-6, when the civilian participation rate in the workforce was near its all-time high (around 66.2% at that time), with unemployment in the 5% range, and labor so tight that hourly wages on entry level positions were constantly rising. American businesses would have welcomed a larger pool of legal workers and the competition wouldn’t have put others out of work or forced them to work for significantly less money.  People would have opposed it for other reasons, but economically speaking, it wouldn’t have had a tremendously negative impact, at least not in the short term.

But now?  We’re not creating enough jobs to keep up with population growth as it is.  With this new policy in place, Obama will introduce hundreds of thousands of suddenly-eligible workers into an economy with an 8.2% nominal unemployment rate, a 14.8% U-6 un/underemployed rate, with a civilian participation rate that has plummeted from 65.7% at the start of the Obama recovery in June 2009 (the same as it was when he took office, too) to 63.8%, lower than it was when Reagan faced his first midterm election.  Those who are already struggling to find jobs are not only going to face more competition for those slots, the glut of labor will depress entry-level wages even further.

Don’t make the mistake of dismissing the short-term benefits of this move for Barack Obama.  When a chief executive “takes the bull by the horns” and acts in a strong manner, he will usually get rewarded with a bump upward in approval and support.  Americans like to see leaders lead, which is the reason incumbent Presidents have such an advantage in re-election efforts.  It’s also no secret that the Latino community had grown angry with the increased rate of deportations in the Obama administration, and this will heal a breach that Obama can’t afford in November.  But this has a large potential for backfire — and if jobs reports this summer continue the downward trend we’ve been seeing this year, those 23 million Americans who already feel locked out of the economy will be asking the same question the Post does this morning.


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How many people are using that User Account, “joana”?

Lourdes on June 16, 2012 at 7:55 PM

It’s just two of us, dear: the Muslim illegal immigrant and the Mexican illegal immigrant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:50 AM

A chilling article:
http://nationaljournal.com/columns/political-connections/just-like-the-gipper-20120614

Romney needs to win by Reagan margins with whites to have a chance of winning the election. Considering Obama’s advantage with college educated women, he needs to over-perform Reagan with the rest of the whites.

Gingrich and Perry were right on this: sooner or later, probably sooner rather than later, the GOP needs to start getting a larger share of the minority vote. There are too many left-leaning whites to win national elections based on the strength amongst them.

joana on June 16, 2012 at 6:29 PM

Within a generation (if not sooner) we will see the GOP lose the ability to ever compete again in a national election.

God help us.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 9:49 AM

Oh no, Bad News from the Media!
Even Worse, an opinion saying that the Conservative Cause has lost before it even gets started.
So, Okay, let’s all just do the RINO thing and capitulate before we even put up a fight, because we all know that the MSM speaks for everyone.

When Obama won in 2008 and all the Establishment types were vaunting the new attitude of Capitulate and Kowtow, a few of us, the one’s that didn’t get the memo that it was over for America, formed the Tea Party.

Of course, 2010 was just a fluke and it’s still over and the MSM speaks for everyone and the GOP is finished regardless of what Reality May Bring!

Hey, I’ve got a new memo for you, The Tea Party Ain’t Done!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 10:51 AM

EVERYONE who cares, ask whomever this next time you’re called a “racist” for not supporting amnesty for illegal aliens:

WHAT IS IT ABOUT ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION THAT ASSOCIATES WITH ‘RACE’?

Lourdes on June 16, 2012 at 8:29 PM

Considering your theories on how Hispanics have a tendency to break “our laws”, how you believe that the reason there are more Hispanic illegal immigrants than Chinese illegal immigrants is that “they have that tendency” and not geography and how you say Rubio’s bill is “ethnic-supremacist” and “Marxist” and how you believe people who support Rubio do it “for ethnic ties”, you’re more qualified than anyone to answer that, dear.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:53 AM

WaPo wonders….

What will hundreds of thousands of job permits do to the economy?

Too bad WaPo never wondered…

What will electing a leftist with no experience and no track record of doing anything except skating by on the affirmative action card do to the country?

Once again the institutions many used to look to for leadership demonstrate that they lag far behind the wisdom of much of the citizenry.

drunyan8315 on June 17, 2012 at 11:19 AM

With potentially as many as 800,000 new workers flooding into the system, what happens to the millions of Americans who can’t find work now?

800,000 new workers paying taxes as opposed to working under the table..

triple on June 17, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Hey, I’ve got a new memo for you, The Tea Party Ain’t Done!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 10:51 AM

This has everything to do with demographics, not ideology, you twit.

Unless the GOP is able to make significant inroads unto the coming Latino majority, we are quickly coming to the day when no Republican (moderate or conservative), will stand a chance in a national election.

However, if you wish to stand there with your fingers in your ears and still pretend that it’s 1980, please feel free to do so.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 11:42 AM

There’s something I don’t understand: the same people saying that illegal immigrants take jobs from Americans and legal immigrants and defending the implementation of E-Verify and harsher penalties for employers of aliens, then turn around and say that legalizing a few of them – and actually the ones with higher employment rates – will add a legion of unemployed.

Don’t you see this is nonsensical?

Here’s a secret for you: there’s a very low unemployment rate among illegals. In fact, long-term unemployed illegals are basically non-existent.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:57 AM

With potentially as many as 800,000 new workers flooding into the system, what happens to the millions of Americans who can’t find work now?

 
800,000 new workers paying taxes as opposed to working under the table..
 
triple on June 17, 2012 at 11:35 AM

 
Bless your heart.
 
If there are 800,000 jobs available and there are 800,000 suddenly-legal new workers, there will still only be 800,000 jobs.
 
Meaning there will still be 800,000 people not paying taxes while 1.6M (800K previously illegal + 800K legal) now-qualified people compete for those 800,000 jobs.

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 11:57 AM

What will hundreds of thousands of job permits do to the economy?

Better yet, what do hundreds of thousands of illegal workers do to an already weak jobs market?

Akzed on June 17, 2012 at 12:07 PM

Hey, I’ve got a new memo for you, The Tea Party Ain’t Done!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 10:51 AM

This has everything to do with demographics, not ideology, you twit.

Unless the GOP is able to make significant inroads unto the coming Latino majority, we are quickly coming to the day when no Republican (moderate or conservative), will stand a chance in a national election.

However, if you wish to stand there with your fingers in your ears and still pretend that it’s 1980, please feel free to do so.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 11:42 AM

The only TWIT her is you!

Liberals aren’t having babys either, while conservatives are.
Since Children vote as their parents did in the 90 percntile your Demographics Aren’t as Clear Cut as you would beleive.

But then Doom and Gloom RINOs cannot be convinced even when an overwhelming landslide occurs right in front of their faces.

I’m done argung with you now ID 10 T!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 12:15 PM

The only TWIT her is you!

Liberals aren’t having babys either, while conservatives are.
Since Children vote as their parents did in the 90 percntile your Demographics Aren’t as Clear Cut as you would beleive.

But then Doom and Gloom RINOs cannot be convinced even when an overwhelming landslide occurs right in front of their faces.

I’m done argung with you now ID 10 T!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 12:15 PM

1 – Voting age 18-29:
66% – Obama
32% – McCain

2 – Check the Census and voting registration numbers for the last 3 decades or so.

Again, there are just too many liberal whites – latte liberals, art bums, welfare independents, union fanatics, far-left loonies, limousine liberals, over-educated unemployed, government workers, etc. It’s impossible to keep winning by running up the margins with whites forever.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 12:20 PM

800,000 new workers paying taxes as opposed to working under the table..

triple on June 17, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Taking our jobs. Black and teenage unemployment will necessarily skyrocket. They’ll turn to crime.

jan3 on June 17, 2012 at 12:21 PM

Anyone else see a shiny new “green” tortilla factory in our immediate future? Perhaps a modest *investment* by El Imperialismo Barky of a couple billion of our tax $$$ to help the illegal DREAMERS get a huarache in the door? Nice market for that Mexican-grown GMO corn, too, huh Señor Gates?

Want to bet it declares bankruptcy about eight minutes after they get the dough? All the DREAMERS can then get on the dole . . . right after they vote for Barky.

TheClearRiver on June 17, 2012 at 12:24 PM

It’s impossible to keep winning by running up the margins with whites forever.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 12:20 PM

Fortunatly I’m looking at Conservative vs. Liberal Not RACE as a determinor in ideology.

Racists like you see people Tied by their Race to thier voting block.

I (and The Tea Party in General) see people Tied by thier Ideas to their voting block.

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 12:29 PM

Major backfire. Patience.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 12:30 PM

When supply is greater than demand and you add to supply what happens? DUH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MaiDee on June 17, 2012 at 12:34 PM

or be a military veteran.

Are those not already entitled to citizenship anyhow (except for the dishonorable discarded veterans)?

Why not also mention that the program will also cover anyone who will invest a million in the US (or donates $3 to the obama campaign)

huntingmoose on June 17, 2012 at 12:34 PM

Fortunatly I’m looking at Conservative vs. Liberal Not RACE as a determinor in ideology.

Racists like you see people Tied by their Race to thier voting block.

I (and The Tea Party in General) see people Tied by thier Ideas to their voting block.

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 12:29 PM

That’s it. Horse-racing analysis based on racial voting patterns? Must be racist.

See it this way then: we’ll need more Latino (and/or African-American) conservatives to stay competitive. Or at least willing to vote for conservatives.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 12:40 PM

By the way, we’re already getting to see a 180 on the (D)’s “shut up because illegals do so pay taxes” argument that was popularized over the last few years.
 
Now it’s “thanks to Obama, now they’ll be paying taxes”.

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 12:44 PM

See it this way then: we’ll need more Latino (and/or African-American) conservatives to stay competitive. Or at least willing to vote for conservatives.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 12:40 PM

You make a sensible point, finally.

In other words, if we can’t get some of the minority members to walk off the Democrat welfare plantation, we’re eventually going to be outvoted at every turn.

MelonCollie on June 17, 2012 at 12:50 PM

I’m done argung with you now ID 10 T!

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 12:15 PM

Oh how clever you are.

People like you are why I left the Tea Party.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 12:53 PM

800,000 new workers paying taxes as opposed to working under the table..

triple on June 17, 2012 at 11:35 AM

God you’re simplistic.

CW on June 17, 2012 at 12:53 PM

God you’re simplistic.

CW on June 17, 2012 at 12:53 PM

What else would you expect from a simpleton?

This is on the level of believing that if we legalize drugs, people are suddenly going to report the income they get from selling them on their tax forms.

MelonCollie on June 17, 2012 at 12:57 PM

You make a sensible point, finally.
In other words, if we can’t get some of the minority members to walk off the Democrat welfare plantation, we’re eventually going to be outvoted at every turn.

The implication is that somehow conservatives are stopping them. Of course, they aren’t. The statement presumes entrenched right-wing racism, which is why anyone who makes it is really a progressive who would be much more at home in the Democratic Party.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 1:00 PM

You make a sensible point, finally.
MelonCollie on June 17, 2012 at 12:50 PM

Still hoping I can say the same about you some day.

In other words, if we can’t get some of the minority members to walk off the Democrat welfare plantation, we’re eventually going to be outvoted at every turn.

MelonCollie on June 17, 2012 at 12:50 PM

Yeps. See my first comment on this upthread in which I link a very interesting National Journal article on the issue.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 1:06 PM

How many people are using that User Account, “joana”?

Lourdes on June 16, 2012 at 7:55 PM

It’s just two of us, dear: the Muslim illegal immigrant and the Mexican illegal immigrant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:50 AM

So, daffy, what happened to the lesbian, Geraldo and David Plouffle?

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:07 PM

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:50 AM

And you wrote here days ago that you weren’t “going to comment to (me) again” because of “people like (me)” so what happened?

You need to better coordinate your views and statements from one personality using your account to the other.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:09 PM

The implication is that somehow conservatives are stopping them. Of course, they aren’t. The statement presumes entrenched right-wing racism, which is why anyone who makes it is really a progressive who would be much more at home in the Democratic Party.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 1:00 PM

You just need to read HotAir comments on, say, immigration, to understand that even if there isn’t entrenched racism, there’s a very high lack of tact on how to present one’s policy positions from many on the right. That matters to. Like it or not, most Hispanic see Republicans as hostile, even if not as racists. It’s about emphasis, tone and the right policy proposals.

Matt Lewis nailed it with these two sentences:

A lesson in life: If people think you don’t like them, nothing else matters. They won’t vote for you — even if that means going against their own self interest

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/06/12/jeb-bush-is-right-about-the-gops-immigration-problem/#ixzz1y4UNUrrO

joana on June 17, 2012 at 1:10 PM

It’s just two of us, dear: the Muslim illegal immigrant and the Mexican illegal immigrant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:50 AM

So, daffy, what happened to the lesbian, Geraldo and David Plouffle?

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:07 PM

That’s just our assistant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 1:11 PM

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:53 AM

THIS “joana” needs to coordinate with the other “joana”/s because one of the other “joana”s said he or she wasn’t going to comment “to (me) again”.

I’m offended that you’ve broken your waving resolution.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:12 PM

It’s just two of us, dear: the Muslim illegal immigrant and the Mexican illegal immigrant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:50 AM

So, daffy, what happened to the lesbian, Geraldo and David Plouffle?

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:07 PM

That’s just our assistant.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 1:11 PM

Even your “assistant” has multiple personalities?

/not shocked.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:13 PM

I said it back in 2007, this man wants a nation of “lawn care specialists.” Although, I don’t know who will be able to afford them, except Barky and his ilk or maybe our Mooslim overlords.

rgranger on June 17, 2012 at 1:16 PM

“Our Founders designed a system that makes it more difficult to bring about change than I would like sometimes.”

Therefore, EO’s, fiat, caprice can trump the old white guys’ outdated, overly burdensome document in the interest of political expediency to ensure proper pandering progressive progressivism.

So, screw it.

texacalirose on June 17, 2012 at 1:21 PM

Lourdes on June 16, 2012 at 8:29 PM

Considering your theories on how Hispanics have a tendency to break “our laws”, how you believe that the reason there are more Hispanic illegal immigrants than Chinese illegal immigrants is that “they have that tendency” and not geography and how you say Rubio’s bill is “ethnic-supremacist” and “Marxist” and how you believe people who support Rubio do it “for ethnic ties”, you’re more qualified than anyone to answer that, dear.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 10:53 AM

Long ago, in a reality far, far away from “joana,” it was written at great length that the majority of illegal aliens afflicting the U.S. today originate in Hispanic/Latino majority nations, seconded only by those from Asia.

And, it was patiently explained there, long, long ago on a reality comment far, far away from “joana”‘s ability to honestly refer to — thus, they at the “joana” community hall continue to lie about what was written there — that from among that majority of illegal alien population can be found a cultural presumption that is negative about U.S. sovereignity and our laws.

Illegal immigration IS crime but it’s lost as crime on people who rationalize the crime and benefit from it (either emotionally or financially or whatever, “benefit” means they benefit from it). Additionally, there exists a cultural aspect to and about illegal immigration: that it’s what-to-do, that it’s therefore acceptable, that entire industries exist to make it possible and to make it continue, that the “wrongness” of it is itself wrong.

Thus, there is a cultural aspect to those who engage in illegal immigration. They are exercising something they’ve acquired from their own culture that does not associate violating U.S. laws with anything wrongful or unacceptable.

SINCE the majority of illegal immigration originates in and from “Hispanic/Latino” cultures, then, the obvious point is made there: there is a CULTURAL aspect dominating illegal immigration by those who currently represent the majority of those involved in it.

“joana” has all the crooked, deceitful need to distort and misrepresent what is written here because she/he/they are part of the problem of intentional misrepresentation of information that is necessary for crime to continue and proliferate.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:22 PM

Oh how clever you are.

People like you are why I left the Tea Party.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 12:53 PM

One observation here. A quick search of your prior comments reveals some telling truths about your assertions. Smart money says you have never been a TP activist or anything of the sort. You would appear to be an Rmoney™ fellow from the get go. The TP is glad to be rid of you, for you never were.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 1:23 PM

And, notice that the account “joana” continues to refer to “others” as “whites” while that account hails Rubio and Rubio’s amnesty by any other name, and wrongly alleges that all of us “whites” here commenting are “crazies” and “lunatic deranged fringe” who are “members of (here she/he/they type out various racially defining organizations by name).”

“joana,” you’re the racist here.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:25 PM

Moby.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 1:26 PM

Like it or not, most Hispanic see Republicans as hostile, even if not as racists. It’s about emphasis, tone and the right policy proposals.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 1:10 PM

So you’re “Hispanic” while also a “lesbian” and various other persons and behaviors, yadda, yadda, yadda…

“joana,” I’d say you’ve won the Most Repulsive User Account Ever on this site over the last three days and no one DOES like you. That feeling you have isn’t unreal, it’s real: you’ve offended just about everyone here.

Contrary to your propaganda, people who are “Hispanic” are not disliked by Republicans. ACTIONS by some people who are or are not “Hispanic” are deemed unacceptable and contrary to beliefs held by many Republicans.

Surprise for you: the world is not a “Hispanic” one. There are other people of other ethnicities living on the planet and in this nation and we are not all voting in bitterness over racial or ethnicity issues as you, all of you at that account, are.

“joana” is a multiple user account. Or else it’s a multiple personality user.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:30 PM

Unless the GOP is able to make significant inroads unto the coming Latino majority, we are quickly coming to the day when no Republican (moderate or conservative), will stand a chance in a national election.

However, if you wish to stand there with your fingers in your ears and still pretend that it’s 1980, please feel free to do so.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 11:42 AM

The GOP should be pursing “inroads” into issues, not as a party of ethnic supremacy or racial supremacy, as you wrongly suggest there.

One’s ethnicity does not grant anyone special privilege or voting preferences nor never should.

“Coming (ethnic) majority” sounds terribly like “heil, Hitler” to me except with a different skin color.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:34 PM

Apparently Mitt isn’t scared of the rise of technology, like Obama decries with the increase of ATM’s….

But Romney said his visit there had been “instructive” because it personified the difference between innovation in the private sector and the ability of the government to do its job.

What inspired him: A computer at Wawa that allows customers to type in what they want on a sandwich, as opposed to ordering it through a human cashier. It was a technology, he said, that had been fostered by competition—competition he said the federal government lacks in delivering its services to Americans. He said the government’s lack of competition and bureaucracy was hurting the United States in keeping jobs that are moving to other countries.

But more than anything, Romney seemed blown away by the Wawa computers, which he raved about.

“You press a little touchtone key pad… You touch this, touch this, touch this, go pay the cashier, and there’s your sandwich,” Romney said. “It’s amazing!”

Go Mitt!!!

PappyD61 on June 17, 2012 at 1:36 PM

Don’t you see this is nonsensical?

Here’s a secret for you: there’s a very low unemployment rate among illegals. In fact, long-term unemployed illegals are basically non-existent.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:57 AM

Earth to “joana”s: illegal aliens are involved in cash economies. They aren’t being held accountable for their use and abuse of national infrastructure, resources or anything else. Taxpayers in non-cash economies are carrying their financial liabilities.

Thus, one can “work” as an illegal alien for cash, not report any of it, go home in that new truck purchased by one’s “work” and enjoy rental assistance and food stamps and educational helps and loans and grants and everything else imaginable because of the child or children at home, all of whom the U.S. taxpayers make possible through the 30% or more of their wages taken from them by government.

Conclusion: the cash-economy illegal alien comes out ahead, proving that crime pays.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:38 PM

So “tact” is this problem? No, outrage is a totally justifiable response. And now that Romney has apparently totally blown it on his TV appearances this morning, it sounds like it’s time to start ramping it up again.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 1:39 PM

triple on June 17, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Bless your heart.

If there are 800,000 jobs available and there are 800,000 suddenly-legal new workers, there will still only be 800,000 jobs.

Meaning there will still be 800,000 people not paying taxes while 1.6M (800K previously illegal + 800K legal) now-qualified people compete for those 800,000 jobs.

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 11:57 AM

Actually, there’ll be five million more “suddenly-legal new workers” here because they’ll all (somehow) come up with the “documents” that “prove” they qualify to Obama as “children”.

Reagan’s disasterous amnesty proved that to be the result of creating any form of amnesty by that name or any other process as Obama (and Rubio, unfortunately) is (are) trying to do.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:41 PM

Progressive Utopia on June 17, 2012 at 12:40 PM

You make a sensible point, finally.

In other words, if we can’t get some of the minority members to walk off the Democrat welfare plantation, we’re eventually going to be outvoted at every turn.

MelonCollie on June 17, 2012 at 12:50 PM

The implication is that somehow conservatives are stopping them. Of course, they aren’t. The statement presumes entrenched right-wing racism, which is why anyone who makes it is really a progressive who would be much more at home in the Democratic Party.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 1:00 PM

HB3 has successfully identified “joana”.

Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:49 PM

One observation here. A quick search of your prior comments reveals some telling truths about your assertions. Smart money says you have never been a TP activist or anything of the sort. You would appear to be an Rmoney™ fellow from the get go. The TP is glad to be rid of you, for you never were.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Thank You.

People like him are why I Joined The Tea Party.

(I was there with Keli Carender, and had been a longtime and loyal Kirby Wilber listener to KVI from when he had his 9 to Midnight show. I was also a BIG fan of Seattle Times columnist Michell Malkin, 1996 to 1999, before she moved east and became famous aoround the whole country.)

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 1:49 PM

Reagan’s disasterous amnesty proved that to be the result of creating any form of amnesty by that name or any other process as Obama (and Rubio, unfortunately) is (are) trying to do.
 
Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:41 PM

 
One last thing. Folks are arguing perceived positives of tax status, unemployment characteristics of illegals, etc., but this does nothing to change the motivation of the employers.
 
Suppose Gustav (illegal from Germany) works as a day laborer plumbing houses. He’s now fully cleared to work above-board and, since he speaks fluent Austrian, he is offered a job at Home Depot since his experience and language will be helpful communicating with other Germans who are flooding the construction job market.
 
Home Depot hired Gustav instead of Anthony (from Florence, SC). Anthony, who is the same age and with identical years plumbing houses, had applied for the job after taking two years of Austrian in the evenings at his local community.
 
Sorry Anthony.
 
Now back to the employer. He volunteers to drop Gustav off for his first day at Home Depot because he needs to pick up one of the nameless, faceless Germans waiting in the parking lot because he still needs (and can hire with few worries or repercussions) cheap, invisible, cash-only day laborers. He doesn’t care about their legal status.
 
End result? Fewer legal jobs available to qualified applicants all around, and the exact same number of illegal aliens still working in the U.S.
 
Why is this so hard?

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

they’re already working…now you can tax them

tlynch001 on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

C’mon, 500 posts or bust!

Del Dolemonte on June 17, 2012 at 2:11 PM

End result? Fewer legal jobs available to qualified applicants all around, and the exact same number of illegal aliens still working in the U.S.
 
Why is this so hard?

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

Probably because of the “cheap labor” lobby of the GOP.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 2:12 PM

C’mon, 500 posts or bust!

Del Dolemonte on June 17, 2012 at 2:11 PM

Always willing to help out a friend on that front. 450

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 3:01 PM

I got into this tread late, hope I don’t repeat other comments, but I had two immediate questions when prez announced the program: 1. Will any of this be operational before election? 2. What will be the application fee? Knowing that taxpayers cannot be held responsible to pay the cost of operation, there has to be a fee, and it will probably be substantial.

okiefred on June 17, 2012 at 3:05 PM

“joana,” I’d say you’ve won the Most Repulsive User Account Ever on this site over the last three days and no one DOES like you.
Lourdes on June 17, 2012 at 1:30 PM

OMG! Is that true! On no!11!!! What do I do now? What?

Seriously, I’m not going to read that wall of creepy posts about me, but you seem to be seriously deranged. Get your act together already.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 3:21 PM

One observation here. A quick search of your prior comments reveals some telling truths about your assertions. Smart money says you have never been a TP activist or anything of the sort. You would appear to be an Rmoney™ fellow from the get go. The TP is glad to be rid of you, for you never were.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 1:23 PM

The idea that one could not be a member of the Tea Party unless one strictly towed the TruCon line is precisely why I left. Your final intolerant remark only goes to further serve my point.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 4:10 PM

You want Syria in the US?

Keep encouraging illegal immigration and you may not get it, but your grandchildren will.

Stepan on June 17, 2012 at 4:24 PM

The idea that one could not be a member of the Tea Party unless one strictly towed the TruCon line is precisely why I left. Your final intolerant remark only goes to further serve my point.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 4:10 PM

I’m not sure what your TruCon line means to you. I’ve been told and have it on pretty good authority its is a slur used by Rmoney™ drone supporters against anyone who doesn’t tow the line for Rmoney™, So there’s that. Good point.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 5:22 PM

Oh but JFS61 , you keep right on fluffin by all means.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 5:23 PM

I truly think that Obama doesn’t care in the least what his psuedo-amnesty plan does to the economy as long as it gets him the Hispanic votes. He knows thefull negative effects will probably not occur until after the election. Besides, it was another way to show that HE can do whatever he wants to do without going through Congress and, for a narcissist, power like that is difficult to pass up.

lukjuj on June 17, 2012 at 5:49 PM

End result? Fewer legal jobs available to qualified applicants all around, and the exact same number of illegal aliens still working in the U.S.

Why is this so hard?

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

Probably because of the “cheap labor” lobby of the GOP.

HB3 on June 17, 2012 at 2:12 PM

Exactly, as a consequence we have the gutless surrender to La Raza’s philosophies as evinced by the open borders advocates on this thread and elsewhere

ebrown2 on June 17, 2012 at 5:59 PM

Major backfire. Patience.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 12:30 PM

Watch the polls over the next few days, then over the next few weeks. If there’s not even a bump for Obama, there won’t be a single work permit issued under this directive. Won’t be any issued before November anyway. Vote O first, then you might get your permit.

And if he slides further in the polls, this directive never happened.

de rigueur on June 17, 2012 at 7:09 PM

I’m not sure what your TruCon line means to you. I’ve been told and have it on pretty good authority its is a slur used by Rmoney™ drone supporters against anyone who doesn’t tow the line for Rmoney™, So there’s that. Good point.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 5:22 PM

What it means is Electing Republicans for the purpose of accomplishing something rather than for the purpose of Electing Republicans

It means Accepting Half a Loaf after fighting for your position rather than Just Giving Up on any loaf and going along to get along.

It means haveing Values and Beleifs that mean something other than a filler for sound bites.

That’s what RINOs mean when they say TruCon.

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 7:10 PM

Oh but JFS61, you keep right on fluffin by all means.

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 5:23 PM

Don’t worry, I will.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 7:15 PM

Don’t worry, I will.

JFS61 on June 17, 2012 at 7:15 PM

Yeah, I could pretty much figure that out, the more I read up on you. Rmoney™

Bmore on June 17, 2012 at 7:26 PM

What will hundreds of thousands of job permits do to the economy?

It will give Dear Liar the ability to say, “ignore that monthly uptick in the unemployed that is just do to my super duper fantastic immigration legalization NOT actual unemployment, actually we have created 45 million jobs during my term”!

ConcealedKerry on June 17, 2012 at 8:30 PM

Here’s a secret for you: there’s a very low unemployment rate among illegals. In fact, long-term unemployed illegals are basically non-existent.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:57 AM

Here’s a secret for you. There is no employment data for illegals because deary they’re illegal. They don’t pay taxes and they don’t apply for unemployment. You rebut what you claim is nonsensical with the absurd.

jdkchem on June 17, 2012 at 9:16 PM

Why is this so hard?

rogerb on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

It requires an ability to reason.

jdkchem on June 17, 2012 at 9:19 PM

Here’s a secret for you. There is no employment data for illegals because deary they’re illegal. They don’t pay taxes and they don’t apply for unemployment. You rebut what you claim is nonsensical with the absurd.

jdkchem on June 17, 2012 at 9:16 PM
HotAir

So? Do you think that if we stop collecting employment data, the unemployment will go away? I guess that’s what you’re trying to say. What’s the relevance there are no official employment data for illegals?

Again, why do you think there are so few illegals in poor countries? Why do you think the numbers of illegals have been lowering since the start of the recession?

Because they have a very high elasticity, responsiveness rate, to employment opportunities. Take those away, and illegals will go away too.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 9:39 PM

Here’s a secret for you. There is no employment data for illegals because deary they’re illegal. They don’t pay taxes and they don’t apply for unemployment. You rebut what you claim is nonsensical with the absurd.

jdkchem on June 17, 2012 at 9:16 PM

HotAir

So? Do you think that if we stop collecting employment data, the unemployment will go away? I guess that’s what you’re trying to say. What’s the relevance there are no official employment data for illegals?

Again, why do you think there are so few illegals in poor countries? Why do you think the numbers of illegals have been lowering since the start of the recession?

Because they have a very high elasticity, responsiveness rate, to employment opportunities. Take those away, and illegals will go away too.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 9:39 PM

Are you really this dense or are you playing a part?

Now I understand that when you ask the question, “Do you think that if we stop collecting employment data, the unemployment will go away?” that you are in some way recounting an Obama Administration Wish List Item, but really?

When he said, “There’s no Illegal Immigrant Unemployment because it’s not measured, he was saying when YOU Announce there is no Unemployment among Illegal Imigrants you are either Dead Wrong in the fact that some of them are quite certainly without jobs, or you are simply stating a Falsehood due to the Lack of Evidence because the required information is just not corolated.

Nice Try though.

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 9:59 PM

Late to the game again, so if someone’s already said it – sorry. It’s all about the economy: you know most of these guys are already doing something like landscaping, housekeeping, whatever. Get them on thebooks and that’s 800K+ jobs created/saved. Get the numbers big enough and the unemployment rate will take a hit. If you get the Illegal vote as well, that’s a bonus…

affenhauer on June 17, 2012 at 10:10 PM

Are you really this dense or are you playing a part?

Now I understand that when you ask the question, “Do you think that if we stop collecting employment data, the unemployment will go away?” that you are in some way recounting an Obama Administration Wish List Item, but really?

When he said, “There’s no Illegal Immigrant Unemployment because it’s not measured, he was saying when YOU Announce there is no Unemployment among Illegal Imigrants you are either Dead Wrong in the fact that some of them are quite certainly without jobs, or you are simply stating a Falsehood due to the Lack of Evidence because the required information is just not corolated.

Nice Try though.

jaydee_007 on June 17, 2012 at 9:59 PM

So, if we stop collecting employment data tomorrow, it’ll be correct to say “there’s no unemployment” due to the Lack of Evidence because the required information is just not corolated [sic]?

That doesn’t make a lot of sense, does it?

Plus:

he was saying when YOU Announce there is no Unemployment among Illegal Imigrants you are either Dead Wrong in the fact that some of them are quite certainly without jobs,

When exactly did I announce that “there is no unemployment among illegal immigrants”? As you claim I did? It should be easy for you to produce a direct quotation or a link, no?

Let’s see what I wrote:

Here’s a secret for you: there’s a very low unemployment rate among illegals.

Wait. That does seem a quite different claim, doesn’t it?

Again, what you claim I said:

YOU Announce there is no Unemployment among Illegal Imigrants you are either Dead Wrong in the fact that some of them are quite certainly without jobs,

What I actually said:

Here’s a secret for you: there’s a very low unemployment rate among illegals.

What we have here is a critical theorist. He deconstructed my text to liberate his critique from the constraints imposed by what I wrote.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:02 PM

Keep a clean nose
Watch the plain clothes
You don’t need a weather man
To know which way the wind blows.

J_Crater on June 18, 2012 at 12:06 AM

What we have here is a critical theorist. He deconstructed my text to liberate his critique from the constraints imposed by what I wrote.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:02 PM

Actually, what you specifically said, and if it misquoted it or not, is irrelevant to what I wrote.

Weather you said it’s low or non existent matters not, the truth is the level of unemployment among illegals is wholly and totally unknown because the data is NOT gathered!

So your minutia matters not.

jaydee_007 on June 18, 2012 at 12:11 AM

they’re already working…now you can tax them

tlynch001 on June 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM

Only if you completely ignore economics.

Most illegals are working BELOW minimum wage. Employers are not going to hire them legally because they would now be too expensive since they would have to adhere to minimum wage.

Thus, these jobs will NOT switch to being handled legally and will NOT be taxed.

Obama’s move was political only and will not change any tax revenue.

dominigan on June 18, 2012 at 9:33 AM

Well considering that there are jobs out there, that people of this country do NOT want to do, probably not too much of anything too bad will happen.

Most of these illegals will be able to pay taxes under their own Tax ID rather than a fake or stolen SS to continue working legally instead.

Despite the talking points, illegals do pay taxes, sales taxes and taxes on SS numbers they should not be using.

damian1967 on June 18, 2012 at 11:07 AM

Despite the talking points, illegals do pay taxes, sales taxes and taxes on SS numbers they should not be using.
 
damian1967 on June 18, 2012 at 11:07 AM

 
I don’t think I’ve ever seen “Yay fraud” spelled with so many letters.
 
Well done.

rogerb on June 18, 2012 at 11:41 AM

He deconstructed my text to liberate his critique from the constraints imposed by what I wrote.

joana on June 17, 2012 at 11:02 PM

Psychobabble and nothing more.

zoyclem on June 18, 2012 at 11:45 AM

So, an illegal immigrant parent brought their 25 year old “child” across the border 4 years ago…

And all the “child” knows is he is, and has always been an American, ever since he was a 25 year old “child”.

And I’m the crazy one…

Fartnokker on June 18, 2012 at 12:33 PM

So, an illegal immigrant parent brought their 25 year old “child” across the border 4 years ago…

Correction…let’s say 6 years ago… :)

Fartnokker on June 18, 2012 at 12:35 PM

Correction…let’s say 6 years ago… :)

Ok..my math sucks.
But does my point make sense?

Fartnokker on June 18, 2012 at 12:38 PM

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