Texas dad “remorseful” after catching man molesting his daughter and beating him to death

posted at 9:00 pm on June 12, 2012 by Allahpundit

The case is headed to a grand jury but this guy’s more likely to land on Barbara Walters’s couch than in prison. I’d be surprised if there’s a GJ in America that would indict him; if there is, lord knows it’s not in Texas. Here’s the relevant statute in the state’s penal code. Not a close call:

(a) A person is justified in using deadly force against another:

(1) if the actor would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.31; and

(2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:

(A) to protect the actor against the other’s use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or

(B) to prevent the other’s imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery…

(c) A person who has a right to be present at the location where the deadly force is used, who has not provoked the person against whom the deadly force is used, and who is not engaged in criminal activity at the time the deadly force is used is not required to retreat before using deadly force as described by this section.

That provision covers the use of deadly force when you’re the one being attacked; the next section in the code extends the use of deadly force to defending someone else so long as the same conditions as the above are met. In other words, if a woman (or little girl, in this case) is entitled to defend herself by killing the man who’s trying to rape her, a third person who’s coming to her aid is entitled to do so too. In theory, a father might not be entitled to use force if he stumbled upon the molestation and the molester stopped and begged for mercy; deadly force is protected legally as a means of ending an attack (or preventing one that’s imminent), not punishing an attacker for something he just did. But c’mon — is there a man or woman alive who’d vote to convict on a murder charge with a fact pattern like that? Morally, this will be treated as justifiable homicide whether or not it’s technically self-defense by proxy — which, to be clear, I think it is here — and any jury would strain mightily to find that it qualified under the definition for the latter. Exit quotation: “He got what he well deserved.”




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I know other Texans have commented here about this case. I will say that Shiner is a lovely little town full of wonderful hard working folks.
Sounds like the family of this little girl were just that sort of hard working people.
I feel for them because of the memories this day will hold for them. I hope that the dad and especially the little girl will find peace.
I don’t believe the Grand Jury will take much time in no-billing this dad. Every person serving on that Grand Jury will be thinking “What if that were my kid?” They will make quick work of this case.
This dad saved the state some serious bucks, so good for him. The perp will have to answer to the ultimate judge who, I believe, will punish him for eternity.

armygirl on June 12, 2012 at 10:56 PM

I can not even imagine the rage he felt. I understand his remorse.
And, as a Dad, I understand his actions.

kingsjester on June 12, 2012 at 10:57 PM

Well said and I’m pretty sure that’s what the other folks were trying to say too.

hawkdriver on June 12, 2012 at 10:47 PM

I’m pretty sure most of the folks were taking the ignorant macho route.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 PM

Probably, not to say that those people are wrong for not being sympathetic to the dead child molester, because quite frankly, he doesn’t deserve any sympathy, but the father does deserve it because taking a human life isn’t an easy thing to do for a normal healthy human being.

I 100 percent wholeheartedly applaud him for protecting his daughter, it was and always be the right thing for a father to do. At the same time he has my sympathy and compassion for the fact that in protecting his beloved child, he took the life of another human being.

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 10:59 PM

Holder will probably get involved and sue him..

reshas1 on June 12, 2012 at 11:00 PM

What a horrible thing to happen to father and daughter. I’m sure he is remorseful.. it’s an awful thing to take a life even if circumstances warrant the action.

lexhamfox on June 12, 2012 at 11:00 PM

I think killing the pedo caught red handed is completely legitimate, however, we have to be VERY careful that cold-blooded murders cannot abuse this allowance with false claims of molestation. Unless you have video tape evidence it is very hard to know what really happened.

kaltes on June 12, 2012 at 10:22 PM

I completely agree. Someone in the headlines thread said it was a moral failing that we were even considering charging this man, but I think it would be a moral failing if we didn’t. A man is dead now. Let’s not take that lightly.

Which isn’t to say I’d vote to convict.

Esthier on June 12, 2012 at 11:02 PM

You should all notice how the most balanced/honest perspective comes from people who have actually had to kill in either self or national-defense. The rest of you tough guys are cute though.

Capitalist Hog on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 PM

Glass houses and all that. You pretentious jerk.

CW on June 12, 2012 at 11:02 PM

I have always known that if I ever take a life, even if by total accident, I will not handle it well. This man will need as much support as possible.

CW on June 12, 2012 at 11:03 PM

I can not even imagine the rage he felt. I understand his remorse.
And, as a Dad, I understand his actions.

kingsjester on June 12, 2012 at 10:57 PM

Quite honestly I seriously doubt he felt any rage at all, more likely it was an extremely intense sensation of fear and panic combined with a profound need to protect his daughter. The adrenalin surge most likely was the fight or flight reflex.

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 11:04 PM

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 11:04 PM

You might be right. So might KJ. I can’t imagine how I would feel or what I would do in such a situation. My daughters are 18 and 21 but when they were small we were quite paranoid about keeping them safe.

gh on June 12, 2012 at 11:08 PM

…but the father does deserve it because taking a human life isn’t an easy thing to do for a normal healthy human being.

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 10:59 PM

More than most people will ever know. Thankfully.

When people come up to him and shake his hand, or pat him on the back, or say things like “thanks for doing the public a service”, he will most likely nod and move on. Maybe even smile if he knows the person.

But, that is most likely not what he wants to be doing.

Its a really tough thing to explain. And most people never catch on.

It changes a person. Externally, maybe forever, or maybe just a little while. Inside though, I don’t know how long, yet.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 11:08 PM

Look at the bright side. Just think of all the little girls WHO WON’T BE MOLESTED IN THE FUTURE.

GarandFan on June 12, 2012 at 11:09 PM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Capitalist Hog on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 PM

Glass houses and all that. You pretentious jerk.

CW on June 12, 2012 at 11:02 PM

That got a laugh, thanks things were starting to get melancholy.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Anybody know people on the losing end of self-defense?

Capitalist Hog on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 PM

Yes. Over the years – many. Most of them are women and children. There have been far too many. No one knew much about them, no one cared much, and nothing was done.

That’s why I’m glad this father did what he had to do. I’m not glad that it happened. The child and her father are the victims. Fortunately, they are the survivors.

Cody1991 on June 12, 2012 at 11:11 PM

It changes a person. Externally, maybe forever, or maybe just a little while. Inside though, I don’t know how long, yet.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 11:08 PM

I’ve never taken another human life (thank god for that), but I did have someone die in my arms, there was nothing I could do to save him. It’s an experience that never really leaves you.

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 11:12 PM

Fortunately, they are the survivors.

Cody1991 on June 12, 2012 at 11:11 PM

And in one of the strangest twists of human nature, sometimes that can be utterly devastating to cope with.

SWalker on June 12, 2012 at 11:14 PM

He’ll get no billed in no time.

Fortunately this did not happen in Libtard Travis County, home of Austin, the San Fran Sicko of Texas. He’d be indicted already by a liberal DA and it would cost him a lot to get a not guilty verdict.

Robert Jensen on June 12, 2012 at 11:16 PM

He’ll get no billed in no time.

Fortunately this did not happen in Libtard Travis County, home of Austin, the San Fran Sicko of Texas. He’d be indicted already by a liberal DA and it would cost him a lot to get a not guilty verdict.

Robert Jensen on June 12, 2012 at 11:16 PM

Amen brother. Thank goodness it happened in Shiner. There will be little sympathy for the perp if the story in the media holds up. From the way the sheriff talked, I assume that they will.

I with the father and the little girl well and hope they find peace.

armygirl on June 12, 2012 at 11:23 PM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

He wouldn’t have attempted to molest a little girl.

itsspideyman on June 12, 2012 at 11:23 PM

Well, I shouldn’t post comments after 10 apparently!

I should have said:
From the way the sheriff talked, I assume that story the media has presented will hold up.

I WISH the father and the little girl well and hope they find peace.

armygirl on June 12, 2012 at 11:26 PM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Seriously?

armygirl on June 12, 2012 at 11:27 PM

That’s why I’m glad this father did what he had to do. I’m not glad that it happened. The child and her father are the victims. Fortunately, they are the survivors.

Cody1991 on June 12, 2012 at 11:11 PM

No! They were those left standing.

We can’t know what this incident did to this family in a very small community.

Happy Nomad on June 12, 2012 at 11:29 PM

“Remorseful” for what?

Schadenfreude on June 12, 2012 at 11:31 PM

1 perp dead.
1 little girl rescued by her daddy.
What’s the f%#@&ing problem???

garnkikaloid on June 12, 2012 at 11:34 PM

Glass houses and all that. You pretentious jerk.

CW on June 12, 2012 at 11:02 PM

I’m not The Brave One. You must be talking to Jodie and the Pussycats.

Yes. Over the years – many. Most of them are women and children. There have been far too many. No one knew much about them, no one cared much, and nothing was done.

That’s why I’m glad this father did what he had to do. I’m not glad that it happened. The child and her father are the victims. Fortunately, they are the survivors.

Cody1991 on June 12, 2012 at 11:11 PM

Too true. Thanks for the reminder.

I still find it amusing that there are so many champions and nobody on the mat in comment threads.

This question is not meant for military, law-enforcement, bouncers or Walmart-greeters. They have it rough everyday. :)

Capitalist Hog on June 12, 2012 at 11:39 PM

If I were the dad, I’m not sure I would feel much remorse.

There’s an old West Texas saying that applies to the molester…
“He needed killin’”
Nope, I don’t have much sympathy for that low life.

fabrexe on June 12, 2012 at 11:47 PM

It definitely needs to go to trial. People are innocent until proven guilty. The alleged abuser is still innocent, as a jury has not convicted him of sexual assault. Let’s keep that in mind, please.

Assuming he did, in fact, molest the girl, and I see no evidence that he did not, then it’s both morally and legally open and shut. The father is a hero.

That said, let’s please not act like the Left with the Trayvon Martin incident, please.

mboyle1988 on June 12, 2012 at 11:55 PM

Anybody hurts my kids/family is a dead dog! Guarantee it.

StevC on June 12, 2012 at 11:55 PM

Self-defense by proxy, indeed. The child had little means to defend herself thus her father rescued her from imminent danger and who knows what might have followed.

Very understandable to those except the fanatical “Hell’s Angela” Corleys of the world only able to excuse the criminal purely for political gain. Hopefully the father will avoid political hacks like Barbara Walters more likely wishing to undermine those defending ourselves (the Leftist canonization of Saint Travon and harassment of the Zimmermanns continues) than otherwise.

viking01 on June 12, 2012 at 11:57 PM

We can’t know what this incident did to this family in a very small community.

Happy Nomad on June 12, 2012 at 11:29 PM

I live in a small community. Southern.

Here’s what will happen. The community comes together. The wagons circle, and, once again, we take care of our own.

That’s how it works. No one is outcast or forgotten. It may work differently where you live, but despite what people say about the South, we don’t work that way. I can’t believe that a small Texas town will be any different.

Cody1991 on June 13, 2012 at 12:03 AM

It definitely needs to go to trial.

mboyle1988 on June 12, 2012 at 11:55 PM

No it doesn’t. A grand jury will decide. As it should.

A grand jury is stressful enough for an innocent man. Even an innocent person would be stupid to fore go legal representation at this point. That’s going to cost money up front. Most lawyers will not let their accused client appear before a grand jury. You have to shop to find one if you are adamant about telling your side of the story before trial. A grand jury has a whole other set of rules than regular juries. Rules that favor indictment.

If the grand jury hands up a true bill, things change significantly. An innocent person can lose their lively hood, home, family and health. If things go bad, even their freedom. All for doing the right thing.

cozmo on June 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones. KJV

That answer your question?

Sterling Holobyte on June 13, 2012 at 12:14 AM

Too bad you can only kill this man once.

CherryBombsBigBrownBeaver on June 13, 2012 at 12:24 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

What did Jesus do when he found the money changers cheating people out of their money? And that was just a cheater. Add that to what Sterling Holobyte said about the millstone and I think that paints a pretty clear picture.

Luke 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones. KJV

stevelockridge on June 13, 2012 at 12:27 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Pray.

Spliff Menendez on June 13, 2012 at 12:40 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM
————————————————————–

Go view Michelangelo’s painting of the Last Judgement if you want the complete answer.

PackerBronco on June 13, 2012 at 12:49 AM

Like we say round here:

“He needed killin’.”

heywaitaminute on June 13, 2012 at 12:50 AM

Okay Libtards logic time:

The statute states:

(B) to prevent the other’s imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery…

Thus when you commit any of the above acts you run the risk of having a third party use force, up to and including deadly force, to stop you in the commission of the act. From the video the sherif stated that the father struck the pervert several times in an attempt to get him to stop.

Luckily, from the point of view of the Texas taxpayers, one or more of the blows was deadly.
Sadly, the young girl was molested and watched her father kill the guy.
Sadly, the father took a life. The fact that he is remorseful means he is human. He must also be thinking it is his fault that all this occurred as he left his daughter alone with this person whom he apparently trusted. Both the father and the little girl will need counseling, which should be paid for as much as possible by the pervert’s assets and family. As he probably an illegal and his family is in Mexico that more than likely ain’t gonna happen. Still, sell what he’s got and fork it over.

Any AG that even thinks about sending this to a grand jury should be fired or recalled.

Bubba Redneck on June 13, 2012 at 12:54 AM

The obligatory:

Don’t mess with Texas.

AP is right. This is Lavaca county, not Travis county. The grand jury might indict the DA for bringing the case. Prosecutorial misconduct?? (OK, so that’s a stretch.)

I grew up one county to the south (Victoria). A prosecution wouldn’t go over well there, either.

David Block on June 13, 2012 at 1:10 AM

Like we say round here:

“He needed killin’.”

heywaitaminute on June 13, 2012 at 12:50 AM

It’s a pity the grand jury can only decide not to prosecute. They ought to be able to thank this father for doing a public service by removing this dirt bag from the face of the earth.

If I was on the grand jury, I’d also vote to prosecute the prosecutor for adding to the stress on this family, even if that was not an option. There is no question of the facts that a competent prosecutor needs a grand jury to resolve. The prosecutor should be sanctioned for this serious lack of judgment.

WhatNot on June 13, 2012 at 1:27 AM

First of all… sending this case to a Grand Jury is an excellent way to shut off any further law suits or prosecutions. It doesn’t sit well, but it can be the best way out of this for the dad. If this were Travis County (which is that shame of Texas that contains Austin) I’d be worried, but it isn’t. It’s Shiner, Texas in Lavaca County. If you’ve never had a Shiner Bock, get one or six. Good stuff.

As for the bleeding hearts that are saying a man has been killed… Save your tears for the next aborted baby or this molested little girl.

I feel for the dad. As a dad, I know I’ve been given children, and that I am expected to provide for and protect them. To fail that, would be unbearable to me. I don’t know what libtards are thinking with their sympathy for this criminal, but hurt one of my kids, and I’ll cut you three ways. Long, Deep and Continuous. Why? Because, my children are my reason for living.

WestTexasBirdDog on June 13, 2012 at 2:15 AM

It sucks to kill somebody. It really does. Regardless of the situation.

notropis on June 13, 2012 at 2:38 AM

I completely agree. Someone in the headlines thread said it was a moral failing that we were even considering charging this man, but I think it would be a moral failing if we didn’t. A man is dead now. Let’s not take that lightly.

Which isn’t to say I’d vote to convict.

Esthier on June 12, 2012 at 11:02 PM

Depending on the corresponding medical evidence and the child’s testimony; they may not be able to charge the father. The statute clearly states that deadly force may be used to stop a sexual assault. If the testimony and medical evidence bears that out then legally why should be charged?

melle1228 on June 13, 2012 at 3:12 AM

There appears NO BASIS TO PROVE OR ESTABLISH that deadly force (by the child’s father) was NOT “necessary to stop the assault.”

In other words, on a common-sense level alone (which is important to jurists as it is to most people in other situations), the father’s “force” applied “to stop the assault” (and to the attacker) was what it was: force adequate to stop the assualt, to protect the life and person of his child, if not himself in the process of stopping the attack.

To ANYone who’s ever come to the aid of others in an emergency — big or small emergency — there is always the risk inherent in the situation of being harmed yourself. So the father almost certainly applied whatever “force” was necessary to protect his child and then himself.

I can’t imagine, like most people, emotionally withholding empathy from the father’s actions.

The molester, to the contrary, put himself in a gruesome situation intentionally (he has to have acted intentionally by the sheer fact of what he was doing to the child) and the father’s application of “what” force he applied just can’t be questioned, especially since the father said his intent was to protect his daughter, to stop the assault, not to “exact revenge” on the attacker.

So, yes, the attacker, the molester, “got what he deserved”.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 4:05 AM

I understand that the girl’s father acted in the heat of the moment and I understand that he did not intend to kill the perp. But the situation is not his fault. So I don’t get the remorse. Regret perhaps but remorse implies guilt.

gh on June 12, 2012 at 9:33 PM

On first take, it reveals to me that the father has a conscience. His “remorse” is about having taken a life, which means he didn’t act with motive “to take revenge” on the molester but with intent to stop the molester’s attack on the father’s child.

It just shows the father as being a decent person, that he’d feel “remorse” at the UNDESIRED CONSEQUENCES, that another man died, in other words.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 4:24 AM

I think what the jury is going to have to consider is when did he cross over the line from “I am so angry with you because of what you did, I’m gonna pound on you for a while, to “OK, that’s over with – now I’m gonna kill you.”

Frank_D on June 13, 2012 at 5:21 AM

I think what the jury is going to have to consider is when did he cross over the line from “I am so angry with you because of what you did, I’m gonna pound on you for a while, to “OK, that’s over with – now I’m gonna kill you.”

Frank_D on June 13, 2012 at 5:21 AM

I don’t see any logical bridge to assume there was that move you describe (or suggest) from one state of min d to another.

Fictional example: a shark is biting you (or someone else), you defend yourself by whopping the thing in the head and stabbing at it’s eyes with the fishing pole in your hand; the shark continues to try to bite but is reacting to your defense while you then continue to apply your defense after seeing the shark’s reaction (your defense is weakening the shark’s biting on you/someone else.

Meaning, the father’s “state of mind” in attacking the molester may not or did not NECESSARILY “move” from one intent on defense by offense (of his child) (and in that process, of himself, to self-preserve, an innate aspect of being on his defense by offense) to one of “now I’m gonna k… you” as you suggest such move occured or may have.

The father’s “state of mind” as he’s declared it was to defend his daughter, to stop the molestation or in other words, “to stop the shark from biting him/someone else”. His remorse afterward likely as anything reveals that his intent was not as to the ultimate outcome, which was that the molester (the “shark” doing the “biting”) perished.

One keeps on with the “defense by offense” until the molester (or, “shark”) stops it’s efforts to continue to attack.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 5:44 AM

I have a niece approaching that age and so help me, if I found someone molesting that little girl I’m not sure what I would do, but it wouldn’t be pretty. There isn’t a circle of hell low enough for child molesters. And anyone that could be capable of such an act is almost by definition in my mind irredeemably sick. A four year old? Thats putting down a rabid animal, and I just hope his conscience – which is what makes him human as opposed to the subhuman that would attack a four year old girl – adjusts to what he had to do.

Four year old. Sick.

Arssanguinus on June 13, 2012 at 6:37 AM

Remorse is entirely understandable, even when you do the right thing. Most of us who venture out armed pray we never have to use those arms because the weight of that decision will hang heavy on us for a long time. Assuming the story is true, the father did the right thing and the molester brought about his own end.

Extrafishy on June 13, 2012 at 7:00 AM

I think what the jury is going to have to consider is when did he cross over the line from “I am so angry with you because of what you did, I’m gonna pound on you for a while, to “OK, that’s over with – now I’m gonna kill you.”

Frank_D on June 13, 2012 at 5:21 AM

I’m not entirely sure that is how Texans think. Nor do I believe that is necessarily a bad thing. Keep in mind this was a 40-year-old molesting a four-year-old. Is jail really the best solution for such vermin?

Happy Nomad on June 13, 2012 at 7:09 AM

There’s a lesson here for how the criminal justice system should deal with all pedophiles.

locomotivebreath1901 on June 13, 2012 at 7:09 AM

Thoughts and prayers to the man and his daughter… I hope the Grand Jury sets a record for the “No bill” they SHOULD produce and I hope the time spent collecting the vote is in nanoseconds…

Khun Joe on June 13, 2012 at 7:09 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

1. Kill the molester with his version of a framing hammer.

2. I’m not *exactly* sure on this, but if it were my daughter, and if I had his powers…I would light him on fire with my mind, watch him burn to death, and then bring him back to life and heal him like new…and do that repeatedly for about an hour or so. And then blow his head up, like in that ‘Scanners’ movie.

I didn’t know Jesus personally, but I bet he’d roll on the #1 option pretty good.

a5minmajor on June 13, 2012 at 7:20 AM

“Your Honor, he needed killin’”

rayra on June 13, 2012 at 7:21 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Oooo! OR… He could turn the molester into a big pile of shit, like they did to Chet in ‘Weird Science’, only instead of turning him back after a while..just leave him the big pile of shit that he is!
.
.
.
…And then blow him up.

a5minmajor on June 13, 2012 at 7:23 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

Approve of a father protecting his child from a vile and wicked human being.

mankai on June 13, 2012 at 7:44 AM

On first take, it reveals to me that the father has a conscience. His “remorse” is about having taken a life, which means he didn’t act with motive “to take revenge” on the molester but with intent to stop the molester’s attack on the father’s child.

It just shows the father as being a decent person, that he’d feel “remorse” at the UNDESIRED CONSEQUENCES, that another man died, in other words.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 4:24 AM

I have no argument with this. I would feel more “remorse” that I had left my daughter in a situation where she could be attacked. I would feel “regret” that I had to deal with the situation that arose. The molester is not blameless.

I really don’t know what I would have done. When my daughters were small we went out of our way to ensure that things like this could not happen. But they still might have. I am thankful that they did not.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 7:44 AM

If you don’t feel some sort of remorse or sadness after taking another man’s life, regardless of his misdeeds, you’re a sociopath.

That isn’t to say that what the father did is wrong or wasn’t justified, but it’s a long step to take for any moral person to even unwittingly take a life in self-defense or in defense of the defenseless.

I pray for the father that he finds solace and resolution for what he did.

wv619 on June 12, 2012 at 9:43 PM

That’s a ridiculous, emotionally overwrought statement – it reminds me of a discussion I heard some Buddhists having on the radio some years back, in which one of them said that even justifiably killing someone in self-defense adds to your negative karma. That kind of no-win thinking is nutty.

If I had a gun, and I saw someone raping a woman who refused stop after being ordered to, I’d only feel bad if I did not pull the trigger. I say that someone who’d tell me that there’d be something wrong with me for not having remorse after I’d killed the rapist is the person who’d be the one in need therapy, not me… :)

Bizarro No. 1 on June 13, 2012 at 7:49 AM

The message is you rape a 4yr old in front of parent you get your head caved in. That’s message we could use more of.It also saves alot of taxpayer cash. Added bonus.

rik on June 13, 2012 at 7:53 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.

gwelf on June 13, 2012 at 7:55 AM

On first take, it reveals to me that the father has a conscience. His “remorse” is about having taken a life, which means he didn’t act with motive “to take revenge” on the molester but with intent to stop the molester’s attack on the father’s child.

It just shows the father as being a decent person, that he’d feel “remorse” at the UNDESIRED CONSEQUENCES, that another man died, in other words.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 4:24 AM

I have no argument with this. I would feel more “remorse” that I had left my daughter in a situation where she could be attacked. I would feel “regret” that I had to deal with the situation that arose. The molester is not blameless.

I really don’t know what I would have done. When my daughters were small we went out of our way to ensure that things like this could not happen. But they still might have. I am thankful that they did not.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 7:44 AM

Emotionally, psychologically, even on a civic-minded basis, MOST of us understand that this molester lost his life and that it is/was “just” in these contexts.

Legally and ethically, in the context of a justice-evaluation or “judgement” about the father’s actions (and culpability and for what), we can see from his own statements that HIS INTENT was not to “kill” (not to “take revenge”) but to stop the molestation of his child by this depraved individual caught in the act.

So it seems in the latter that the guy (the father of the child, the man who defended his daughter) exercised force to defend his child and not to “kill” the man — his motive was the defense of his daughter, to literally stop the violence being done to her.

So unless I read otherwise, more information about the father and what his motives were there (or more facts that reveal falsehoods or whatever, but for this discussion it seems most of us are discussing the death of the molester and whether or not the father of the molested child is somehow criminally liable for that), anyway, unless I read otherwise (more facts, etc.), then it appears to me that the molester died as a result of the molester’s actions and not at the intent of the father.

Whatever force the father used against the molester — from which the molester died afterward or during — doesn’t appear unacceptable. Like I earlier wrote, when a shark is biting you, you respond with whatever force necessary to stop the attack. Likely as anything, that’s what the father did in response to this molester attacking his child.

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 7:56 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

You’re biblically ignorant, aren’t you?

I take that back. You’re just plain ignorant.

kingsjester on June 13, 2012 at 7:58 AM

It definitely needs to go to trial.

mboyle1988 on June 12, 2012 at 11:55 PM

No it doesn’t. A grand jury will decide. As it should.

A grand jury is stressful enough for an innocent man. Even an innocent person would be stupid to fore go legal representation at this point. That’s going to cost money up front. Most lawyers will not let their accused client appear before a grand jury. You have to shop to find one if you are adamant about telling your side of the story before trial. A grand jury has a whole other set of rules than regular juries. Rules that favor indictment.

If the grand jury hands up a true bill, things change significantly. An innocent person can lose their lively hood, home, family and health. If things go bad, even their freedom. All for doing the right thing.

cozmo on June 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM

Having served on a grand jury here in Bexar County, I agree. The jury had several instances where the attorney handling the case had to bring an indictment only to ask the grand jury to “no bill it”

banzaibob on June 13, 2012 at 8:02 AM

“Your Honor, he needed killin’” rayra on June 13, 2012 at 7:21 AM

Yep…old Southern saying. Fits well here.

Dingbat63 on June 13, 2012 at 8:06 AM

WWJD?

lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

You’re biblically ignorant, aren’t you?

I take that back. You’re just plain ignorant.

kingsjester on June 13, 2012 at 7:58 AM

As a kindred spirit, KJ, given your most recent blog-post, I have to ask if you don’t see just a wee bit of irony here?

Extrafishy on June 13, 2012 at 8:08 AM

Extrafishy on June 13, 2012 at 8:08 AM

Yep.

kingsjester on June 13, 2012 at 8:10 AM

Two observations:

1. I can’t decide if being beaten to death or spending life in prison as a child molester–of a four year old girl, no less–would have been worse. It’s a toss up. Either way, the guy deserved it.

2. I love that the sheriff wears a white, ten gallon cowboy hat.

Grace_is_sufficient on June 13, 2012 at 8:15 AM

Lourdes on June 13, 2012 at 7:56 AM

That is a good summary of what appears to be the facts of the case.

The debate here seems to concern the emotional consequences.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 8:17 AM

WWJD?
lostmotherland on June 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

AS I recall, Jesus said those would corrupt a child should have a millstone tied around their neck then tosses into the sea.

tommyboy on June 13, 2012 at 8:17 AM

Thankfully, this Grand Jury will be presented by a reasonably competent D.A in front of a more-than-likely understanding judge…nothing like the “Bonfire of the Vanities” remake going on in Florida with Zimmerman.

It should go to GJ, and hopefully, they will see the extraordinary circumstances surrounding the case, and find him not guilty.

Yet ANOTHER reason for me to move to Texas…

BlaxPac on June 13, 2012 at 8:25 AM

I have a daughter,.. so I understand what you’d do,.. I can’t guarantee that killing him wouldn’t be my first thought, even though it’s in defense of a loved one. I have a history,.. fighting, service time during the cold war,….. I never had to kill thank God.

But that wasn’t certain a few times.

I hate the adrenaline, coming down from it, the shakes, the nausea.. I can easily see why he would regret killing.

mark81150 on June 13, 2012 at 8:29 AM

Shiner TX is about 130 miles east of Houston and I heard on one of the local talk radio shows this afternoon that the rapist was an illegal. Look for the Houston Barnicle to put out a sob story on the poor misunderstood pedophile.

TxAnn56 on June 12, 2012 at 9:23 PM

Leave that to Univisión; they run sob stories of illegals all the time; that’s why I don’t watch them even though I am from PR. That has NOTHING to do with me.

As for the race deal, I bet that someway, somehow a dark pen will spin this to oblivion without considering the mental trauma both father and daughter are going through. PR is Texas Part Deux, where almost 4 million ppl would agree that he deserves a medal, a free pass, heck I bet Texas would have no problems paying their medical bills and for potential mental/physical issues that may surface later on. He’s remorseful ’cause he’s a good Christian and The Law says “Thou Shall Not Kill.”

I hope that if he goes to church, the church doesn’t turn him away because of this, nor his family.

ProudPalinFan on June 13, 2012 at 8:33 AM

We all know there are too many molesters living among us. The law thinks that if they are on a list, we are protected. Why, oh why, are molesters of any kind once caught, convicted and jailed ever let loose to pray on others? Protecting ourselves and family is a basic instinct. What this guy did needed doin’.

Kissmygrits on June 13, 2012 at 8:34 AM

The grand jury might indict the DA for bringing the case. Prosecutorial misconduct?? (OK, so that’s a stretch.)

David Block on June 13, 2012 at 1:10 AM

I think, these days, that needs to happen more often. Then again, I am not much of a fan of the legal profession. A great many, seem to have a lot in common with the oldest profession.

98ZJUSMC on June 13, 2012 at 8:34 AM

We all know there are too many molesters living among us. The law thinks that if they are on a list, we are protected. Why, oh why, are molesters of any kind once caught, convicted and jailed ever let loose to pray on others? Protecting ourselves and family is a basic instinct. What this guy did needed doin’.

Kissmygrits on June 13, 2012 at 8:34 AM

Question..

We know that their is no cure for pediphilia, that they never stop. We know that given a chance they WILL repeat offend and another child will suffer. So why do we not lock them up for life, no parole?

It seems our only options are, prision or mental hospital for life, or killing them. The only way to protect children, is to do what our legal system is incapable of doing.

mark81150 on June 13, 2012 at 8:39 AM

I hate the adrenaline, coming down from it, the shakes, the nausea.. I can easily see why he would regret killing.

mark81150 on June 13, 2012 at 8:29 AM

Adrenaline is a great drug and a natural gift from God. I get a boost every time I jump out of an airplane. Feels so good. I guess it can have a negative side depending on the situation.

SKYFOX on June 13, 2012 at 8:42 AM

mark81150 on June 13, 2012 at 8:39 AM

The left has been allowed to take over cultural institutions and it’s going to take a sustained effort to remove their control. This issue is just one among many.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 8:45 AM

I don’t see how it is even a discussion. He didn’t use a gun. He used his fists. Unless the pervert lost both of his arms(probably not if he groomed horses) then it was a fair fight.

This is a good argument to use against the liberals. He killed him without a gun!

(I’m sure I’m misquoting this as it is coming from memory, but I have the basic conversation right)
Archie Bunker’s daughter: Dad, look at the statistics, gun deaths have risen every year for the last 20 years. We need to ban guns!
Archie Bunker: Would it make you feel any better had they all been pushed out of windows?

jeffn21 on June 13, 2012 at 8:46 AM

Thank goodness the wannabe rapist wasn’t black.

Labamigo on June 12, 2012 at 9:04 PM

It’s sad that that is even a thought.

98ZJUSMC on June 13, 2012 at 8:49 AM

ProudPalinFan on June 13, 2012 at 8:33 AM

I think he’ll be alright. I can think of very few houses of faith from ANY religion that will shun him for what he did.

Texas or not, even in foam at the mouth liberal states, you will be hard pressed to find a full jury that would convict this man…judges maybe less so, except for those that would want to argue that this could be considered vigilantism and the whole dumbass “Slippery Slope” meme.

We’re still a nation that cherishes our kids (abortions argument notwithstanding)…we may argue with alot of things but protecting the kids has always been one of those American quirks of character.

BlaxPac on June 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM

Here is a link with better information.

Watch the video on the right hand side.

Some other facts from the article/video:

The girls and her father were also Hispanic.

The girl’s brother saw the molester grab the little girl.

The girl was assaulted and required medical treatment, not just an exam.

bitsy on June 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM

It didn’t need fixin’.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Yes, it did.

98ZJUSMC on June 13, 2012 at 8:53 AM

What did Jesus do when he found the money changers cheating people out of their money? And that was just a cheater.

stevelockridge on June 13, 2012 at 12:27 AM

To expand on that a little; Jesus was angry because they were doing that IN the temple, turning it into a “den of thieves.” But I get your point.
Jesus showed righteous anger. He never killed anyone. Could he have? In the blink of an eye.

Sterling Holobyte on June 13, 2012 at 8:56 AM

The big take-away from this is that even among the right, there are a whole lot of people that know more about pop culture than the laws that affect their lives.

They think real violence is like a Chuck Norris movie.

And are either clueless about what effects doing harm to another person has on a decent person. Or they are psychopaths.

God help them if they are ever in a similar situation, because they will certainly be of no help…to themselves.

cozmo on June 13, 2012 at 9:02 AM

It scares the beta-yankees and keeps them out.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 9:29 PM

…and if your fellow travellers would leave and stay out of Illinois, we could fix it. It would make things a lot nicer.

Thanks, in advance.

98ZJUSMC on June 13, 2012 at 9:02 AM

Texas is full of uncivilized neanderthals.

cozmo on June 12, 2012 at 9:07 PM

There is no-one lower on the scale of humanity than a pedophile. Nothing. I once advocated that they be castrated without anaesthetics and then put in a prison full of 250 pound horney tough guys….

I’m a mother. I’d have killed him without hesitation. On purpose. A hit man for the mob is a higher form of humanity and deserves more respect.

Portia46 on June 13, 2012 at 9:03 AM

Given the circumstances, punching the attacker “several times” sounds very reasonable and restrained. It would be very easy to land “several” punches before the attacker was incapacitated without any intent to ‘beat him to death’. I am sure the father was experiencing a surge of adrenaline and likely did not realize his own strength.

People at the SeeBS article who suggested that the father should have beaten him to unconsciousness, but not killed him are just plain ignorant. Their is a very fine line between unconsciousness and death. Punching someone until they are no longer a threat could very easily lead to significant enough brain damage to kill them. Someone engaged in self defense is not an anesthesiologist; they are not obligated to stop at unconsciousness without causing death. That is why you shouldn’t assault little girls.

bitsy on June 13, 2012 at 9:05 AM

They think real violence is like a Chuck Norris movie.

cozmo on June 13, 2012 at 9:02 AM

You truly are an idiot.

98ZJUSMC on June 13, 2012 at 9:07 AM

I’m betting this hero’s lawyer told him to say “remorseful”. What he’s likely really thinking is what the rest of us are: “The pervert had it coming.”

mr.blacksheep on June 13, 2012 at 9:08 AM

bitsy on June 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM

Thanks for the link. It makes the story much clearer.

The brother must also be quite young, since the father is only 23.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 9:09 AM

bitsy on June 13, 2012 at 9:05 AM

Can’t disagree with anything you wrote there.

gh on June 13, 2012 at 9:10 AM

Two observations:

1. I can’t decide if being beaten to death or spending life in prison as a child molester–of a four year old girl, no less–would have been worse. It’s a toss up. Either way, the guy deserved it.

2. I love that the sheriff wears a white, ten gallon cowboy hat.

Grace_is_sufficient on June 13, 2012 at 8:15 AM

1: Yep!

2: I thought that white hat was great, too! :)

Bizarro No. 1 on June 13, 2012 at 9:16 AM

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