More financial bombshells for baby boomers: Don’t count on that inheritance

posted at 2:41 pm on June 11, 2012 by Erika Johnsen

Is no age group safe from the fiscal woes of economic near-recession and pending entitlement crises? (Hint: No.) While we often focus on the troubles of young people unable to find employment and just chillin’ on the parents’ couches, and we’re already well aware of the upcoming squeeze on Social Security as baby boomers begin to reach retirement age, here’s a fun and exciting reminder from the Wall Street Journal.

For years now, there’s been a lot of talk about boomers getting tremendous windfalls as their parents pass on. Many boomers, in fact, have been lagging behind in their savings, betting on—hoping for—big bequests, especially since many of them suffered big losses in 2008.

But for a growing number of boomers, things aren’t going according to plan. The postwar generation is living longer—and many are spending their savings along the way. And, of course, many of them also took a hit in 2008.

The result is that, as a group, boomers likely won’t be getting as much of an inheritance as they hoped. Even worse, far from receiving a bequest, a growing number are tapping some of their own savings to help their cash-strapped parents make ends meet. …

“There are way too many adult children I see who are looking at Mom and Dad’s estate as their ticket to a secure retirement,” says M. Holly Isdale, an estate planner in Bryn Mawr, Pa. “But with people living longer, much of the money is likely to be spent.”

How much longer? Thanks to medical gains, a 65-year-old man has a 60% chance of living to age 80 and a 40% chance of reaching 85. For women, the odds are 71% and 53%, respectively. All of this has made the 85-and-over age bracket the fastest-growing segment of the population. In an era of low interest rates, volatile financial markets, and rising costs for health and long-term care, finding money to cover those years isn’t always easy.

This inheritance-news is just one in a long line of financial challenges and demographic nightmares facing the baby boomers (Americans born between 1946 and 1964) as they near retirement. Conversations about death and mortality, finances and inheritances, are already difficult and awkward enough, and the added weight of ongoing lackluster returns, a poor housing market, and escalating healthcare costs (combined with longer lifetimes) are making it all that much harder.

With adult children still living at home adding to baby-boomer parents’ financial strain, perhaps compounded by their own parents now needing financial assistance… this is shaping up to look like a pretty darn painful demographic shift. Yikes. We need to get some wealth creation and growth going in this economy, stat!

Accounting for nearly one-fourth of the U.S. population, their impact on the economy, government policy and culture is expected to be every bit as profound in their golden years as it has been since their birth. …

According to an article published on The American Dream, a website of social commentary, as many as 36 percent of those in the baby boomer generation have not contributed to a retirement program of any kind. Among those who did, many relied on 401(k)s and investment portfolios that have been seriously compromised by collapsing markets. …

Compounding efforts to build security has been a decade of the worst performance in history of financial markets, impacting 401(k)s and other securities-based investments. “They’ve not grown like previous decades. That’s just the reality,” Siebenmorgen said.

The Employment Benefit Research Institute reports 35 percent of those of retirement age are almost totally dependent on Social Security benefits for income. Only about half the remaining 65 percent have retirement savings of $50,000 or more.


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Comment pages: 1 2

Laura, you’re a good one and fogw is the best. It’s not a fight one enjoys to watch. Best to focus the energy against the peski leftists.

Schadenfreude on June 11, 2012 at 4:31 PM

I’m not fighting, I’m discussing. If fogw is taking this really personally, I can’t help that, but to me it’s just a friendly chat among people who are supposed to be on the same team. Why behave as though this is some kind of Rocky Balboa / Apollo Creed throwdown? That’s silly.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:36 PM

Paying attention to what laws are proposed and will be voted on, then phoning, sending letters, and showing up at town hall meetings to pressure your elected officials to do the right thing. In short, making more noise than the left so that elected officials feel like their best bet for retaining power is to please us, rather than liberals. If you don’t call that supervision, what would you call it?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:29 PM

So what are you saying? Gen Xers do this but boomers don’t. How did Obama get elected?

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 4:36 PM

I wonder how much of the Tea Parties are made up of boomers.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 4:40 PM

If you don’t call that supervision, what would you call it?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:29 PM

I would call it being engaged in the process. Supervision connotates oversight of the process, with a means to apply direct corrective measures when things go awry.

But that’s just me.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 4:43 PM

I’m not fighting, I’m discussing. If fogw is taking this really personally, I can’t help that, but to me it’s just a friendly chat among people who are supposed to be on the same team. Why behave as though this is some kind of Rocky Balboa / Apollo Creed throwdown? That’s silly.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:36 PM

You made it personal by lumping all Boomers into a single group, blaming all of us for the woes brought upon us by 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in congress.

Maybe you should choose your words more carefully next time and avoid the hassle. If you can’t take the heat ………….

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 4:49 PM

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 4:43 PM

Fine, you say tomayto, I say tomahto. There IS a means of corrective measures, though extreme: recall. But you agree we mustn’t vote them in and then think our job is done? I’m contending that if enough Boomers, the largest demographic group, had done this for the last 40 years, they would have – in their own self-interest – corrected the situations that led to the entitlement problems we have today.

It’s starting to be GenX’s turn as (forgive me for being blunt) Boomers die off and that generations gradually loses their political power. Twenty years from now, I hope my generation will have stepped up and gotten the job done so that my daughter doesn’t look at me and say that I let her down. At that point, the country will be what GenXers have made of it and we’ll get the blame or credit, however it may be.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:50 PM

Those who have saved for retirement, can’t earn anything on their savings now, so principle is having to be spent. It is terrible on the retired or near retirement folks. We have saved faithfully and lived below our means for years, planning for a comfortable retirement. That is much less likely thanks to these interest rates.

bopbottle on June 11, 2012 at 4:50 PM

You made it personal by lumping all Boomers into a single group, blaming all of us for the woes brought upon us by 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in congress.

Maybe you should choose your words more carefully next time and avoid the hassle. If you can’t take the heat ………….

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 4:49 PM

Really, consider investing in fabric softener stock if you’re that sensitive.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:51 PM

Oh, and fogw, of that 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in Congress, Boomers have been the largest voting demographic group. That’s my point.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:52 PM

Laura and Fog, knock it off. We all know it was the left that created the entitlement mentality, and we on the right know who’s fault it is… Dems from the BB, Gen X, etc., who created the mess. Both of you know what to do moving forward, so stop with the back and forth. Just stop.

As for who voted in Obumbles, Otoolbag, Odipstick, whatever calamity we call our current predicament, I mean adminstration, we know who that was too.

The worst part is you can’t discuss what needs to be done with the left… all you get is “IT’S BUSH’S FAULT!!! RACISTS! SPEND MORE MONEY THAT WE DON’T HAVE!!! HEEEHAAAAAW HEEEEEEHAAAAAWWWW!!!”

So tired of the fighting. My plan is to get a damn boat and go to find a nice deserted island to die on. At least there I won’t have to listen to the braying of jackasses there, no matter what party they belong to. Self-sufficient engineering types welcome.

Symshady on June 11, 2012 at 4:59 PM

GenXers had voting rights starting about twenty years ago, but again, demographically, the Boomers have been in the driver’s seat. There are far fewer Xers than Boomers. So I don’t absolve my generation of all responsibility, but I do blame the Boomers more than the Xers. Just as my daughter’s generation will blame the Xers for not straightening this mess out when we have the most power.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:33 PM


The bullet points I quoted regarding Baby Boomers …

… we were working on those before we could vote (10th grade – founding member of ecology group in my hometown, state assemblyperson for a day), 11th – being the rasp to Linda D’s principles on feminism before most women her age had any clue what she was talking about).

Empowerment is a choice – not a legal voting age requirement.

With regard to today’s problems:

Exactly when did the rampant, unsustainable borrowing begin?

2001?

2006?

If you are over 29 – you ARE part of the problem.

Well, that decision was made in late 2008/ early 2009 and was something few people had ANY say in. I’ve spent thousands of hours since then learning about the problems, who made them, who made the decisions and where the bulk of the corruption is centered. What have YOU been doing since then?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 4:29 PM


Here is something YOU need to internalize.

The world was worse off 50 years ago than it is today. Lots of Baby Boomers have spent their lives making it better that it was when we found it.

We are NOT happy with the way it is today. Any younger generation blaming US is just displaying a PROFOUND lack of character and a compete ABSENCE of any understanding on HOW to fix the problems.

If the BEST you have to offer is to COMPLAIN about the Baby Boomers?

Sit down, shut up and stay out of OUR way. We KNOW how to FIX things. WE have done it BEFORE.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:01 PM

The world was worse off 50 years ago than it is today. Lots of Baby Boomers have spent their lives making it better that it was when we found it.

We are NOT happy with the way it is today. Any younger generation blaming US is just displaying a PROFOUND lack of character and a compete ABSENCE of any understanding on HOW to fix the problems.

If the BEST you have to offer is to COMPLAIN about the Baby Boomers?

Sit down, shut up and stay out of OUR way. We KNOW how to FIX things. WE have done it BEFORE.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:01 PM

lol ya BLAME the younger GENERATION for the AUDACITY of holding ACCOUNTABLE those who have HAD THE POWER for ALL these YEARS

Seriously grandpa, sit down, shut, take yer pills and go to bed.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:06 PM

… we were working on those before we could vote (10th grade – founding member of ecology group in my hometown, state assemblyperson for a day), 11th – being the rasp to Linda D’s principles on feminism before most women her age had any clue what she was talking about).

Wow well you are just an amazing hero time to go back to HuffPo u r 2 gud 4 us hurr

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM

Sit down, shut up and stay out of OUR way. We KNOW how to FIX things. WE have done it BEFORE.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:01 PM

LOL, go to it, then, with my profound thanks. As long as you want to acknowledge that the country is pretty much what Boomers have made of it, good and bad, I’m fine with that. What grates on my nerves is when the group which has enjoyed the most political power complains that they don’t like the results of what they themselves did.

When my generation enjoys that level of power, I’ll gladly take the blame, or the credit, as it may be. If we can’t persuade liberals of the error of their ways or shove them out of power, we’ll get what we deserve, just as Boomers will – and much sooner, too. Our time to control things is coming, but as you point out, Boomers are still in the driver’s seat.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM

Oh, and fogw, of that 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in Congress, Boomers have been the largest voting demographic group.

That’s my point.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:52 PM

You’re point has sucked ever since your first post, yet you continue to spew out the same idiotic drivel.

Boomers have been the largest voting demographic group.

So what?

They didn’t all have the same political ideology. Every Boomer isn’t to blame. Sometimes pilots cause plane crashes, let’s blame pilots for all plane crashes. Sometimes children accidentally cause fires. Let’s blame children for all fires. Sometimes doctors prescribe the wrong medicine, let’s blame all doctors.

When you intially put the blame on all Boomers you already lost the argument but you’re too blind to see.

Really, consider investing in fabric softener stock if you’re that sensitive.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:51 PM

Cute, but hardly addresses the point.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 5:11 PM

If the BEST you have to offer is to COMPLAIN about the Baby Boomers?

Sit down, shut up and stay out of OUR way. We KNOW how to FIX things. WE have done it BEFORE.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:01 PM


Extra Thought Added: When we set out to solve these problems

* Ended segregation and fought for equal rights regardless of race, creed, color or religion

* Stopped the wholescale environmental pollution which was rampant until the 1970′s

* Established the social & economic rights of women (you would have gone insane during the Sixties and the Seventies)

* Brought about the fall of communism and an end to M.A.D. Sword of Damocles we grew up under.

We didn’t start by focusing on which generation we could blame them on. We just went out and fixed them.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:12 PM

lol ya BLAME the younger GENERATION for the AUDACITY of holding ACCOUNTABLE those who have HAD THE POWER for ALL these YEARS

Seriously grandpa, sit down, shut, take yer pills and go to bed.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:06 PM


You think that is AUDACITY?

You’ve just self-defined the worthlessness of YOUR approach to life.

Has anybody ever beaten the crap out of you for your AUDACITY?

Has anybody ever shot and killed someone of your generation for that AUDACITY?

Has anyone ever threatened your parent’s job for your AUDACITY?

You are so inconsequential as a result of your own words that you will never be able to understand how trivial your life is if you think:

AUDACITY of holding ACCOUNTABLE those who have HAD THE POWER for ALL these YEARS

is ANYTHING other than the most pitifully weak argument made by the most pitifully weak people of EVERY generation for the last 10,000 years.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:21 PM

Oh, and fogw, of that 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in Congress, Boomers have been the largest voting demographic group. That’s my point.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:52 PM

You know what? SO WHAT!? What the hell difference does it make now?

Do you have access to a time machine??

The fact is, there is a massive problem with perceived entitlements in this country NOW and, other than the fact that it makes you feel better about yourself to fix blame, at this point, IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE.

Don’t you get it? What’s done is done. It’s time for all generations to come together to do what they can to fix this mess – not argue about who’s to blame.

Acting like a spoiled rotten 12 year-old intent only on fixing blame solves nothing.

Rod on June 11, 2012 at 5:24 PM

Citizens Broke!!.. Citizen’s parents Broke!!.. Kids broke and can’t find a job!! This situation is going to contribute to a landslide defeat of Obama
and his merry little band of Communist Dimocrats!! Remember in November!!

Marco on June 11, 2012 at 5:29 PM

Has anybody ever beaten the crap out of you for your AUDACITY?

Has anybody ever shot and killed someone of your generation for that AUDACITY?

Has anyone ever threatened your parent’s job for your AUDACITY?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:21 PM

Those are some pretty serious threats a**hole.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:30 PM

Wow well you are just an amazing hero time to go back to HuffPo u r 2 gud 4 us hurr

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM

You EGO may exceed your IGNORANCE – though how it can be so is impossible to imagine.

Thank you for driving home my point and illustrating YOU will never be empowered.

I am not aware of ANYONE other than you who is a member of Hot Air who thinks we should:

Go back to the ecological disasters of the Sixties/Seventies
Repress women into the roles defined for them during that same time period
Ignore the field of politics and just HOPE things will get better
.

… and most of ALL, there is/was/never has been conservative involvement in fixing things that were wrong back then.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:30 PM

AUDACITY of holding ACCOUNTABLE those who have HAD THE POWER for ALL these YEARS

is ANYTHING other than the most pitifully weak argument made by the most pitifully weak people of EVERY generation for the last 10,000 years.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:21 PM

Internet tough guy uses threats to make argument. Eff you buddy.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:31 PM

I am not aware of ANYONE other than you who is a member of Hot Air who thinks we should:

Go back to the ecological disasters of the Sixties/Seventies
Repress women into the roles defined for them during that same time period
Ignore the field of politics and just HOPE things will get better.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:30 PM

lolwut?

The 60s were a sh*tty mess, just like you.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:32 PM

Hey you know what, maybe if YOU JUST YELL SOME MORE and make moar DEATH THREATS I’ll BELIEVE IN YOUR ARGUMENTS.

What a guy, what a hero, what a role-model, you.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:33 PM

Boomers have been the largest voting demographic group.

So what?

They didn’t all have the same political ideology. Every Boomer isn’t to blame.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 5:11 PM

Yes, they didn’t all have the same political ideology. And conservative Boomers have (so far) failed to either persuade liberal Boomers of the error of their ways or to shove them out of power by working harder against the liberal takeover of schools and media.

Like the president, no generation starts with a clean slate, and Boomers have had to play the cards they were dealt, just as my generation will. But conservative Boomers have certainly not been helpless against liberal Boomers, and yet, liberal Boomers have prevailed. How do you explain this without taking any responsibility for it?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:12 PM
Are you also going to congratulate yourself on race quotas, the breakdown of the family unit and all the consequent financial woes (yay for doing what “feels good” and no-fault divorce!) and the rise of the democratic socialism?

Oh, and by the way, wrt to the fall of communism: my generation also fought that, albeit on the tail end. The Wall didn’t fall until 1989.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

LOL, go to it, then, with my profound thanks. As long as you want to acknowledge that the country is pretty much what Boomers have made of it, good and bad, I’m fine with that. What grates on my nerves is when the group which has enjoyed the most political power complains that they don’t like the results of what they themselves did.

When my generation enjoys that level of power, I’ll gladly take the blame, or the credit, as it may be. If we can’t persuade liberals of the error of their ways or shove them out of power, we’ll get what we deserve, just as Boomers will – and much sooner, too. Our time to control things is coming, but as you point out, Boomers are still in the driver’s seat.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM


Hmmmmmm

Ignore the multiple posts I have made on this set of topics.

States it is only possible to fix things when YOU have ALL the POWER.

Does not see the logical inconsistency of these two paragraphs or the logical consistency of statements others have made to try to get you to focus beyond YOUR complaint.

I get it!

How you doing, Moby?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:37 PM

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:33 PM

Meh. I clicked on your monicker. Not impressed with you intelligence.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:41 PM

PolAgnostic: Let me be clear, I am not a bitter weepy liberal aghast that no one respects me for having the audacity to plant flowers, burn bras, carry a sign, and do as my masters bid.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:41 PM

Meh. I clicked on your monicker. Not impressed with you intelligence.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:41 PM

Ah well I suppose I shall just go to the shower and cry. Vince is not impressed with you intelligence.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:42 PM

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

It’s your generation’s fault that Obama is President.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:43 PM

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

It’s your generation’s fault that the dems took control of Congress in 2006 and then passed Obamacare.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:44 PM

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:37 PM

I take it you don’t agree that the group that enjoys the most power should also receive the most credit or the most blame? That seems illogical to you?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:45 PM

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:42 PM

Still not impressed.

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:46 PM

Those are some pretty serious threats a**hole.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:30 PM


Seriously there is no limit to your ignorance?

Back in the Sixties and Seventies – having African American friends was audacious enough that bigots would beat the crap out of you … if they could. I had four brothers and we didn’t fight, we maimed so it was not a problem for us.

My brother went to Little Rock High School while stepping around the National Guardsmen sent there to enforce integration. Some of my older brother’s friends fighting racism disappeared during the Sixties. Others had people firing guns through their windows in the evening.

My father’s position on integration and the fact that his sons had African American friends was made an issue by people above him where he worked at the time.

History is not threats, you sissy and AUDACITy is a word you could not live up to if you tried.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:48 PM

Hey you know what, maybe if YOU JUST YELL SOME MORE and make moar DEATH THREATS I’ll BELIEVE IN YOUR ARGUMENTS.

What a guy, what a hero, what a role-model, you.

WeekendAtBernankes on June 11, 2012 at 5:33 PM


R
eading Is Fundamental – reading comprehension, even more so.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 5:52 PM

I take it you don’t agree that the group that enjoys the most power should also receive the most credit or the most blame? That seems illogical to you?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:45 PM

Okay Laura. I’m 62. I hereby take all the blame. It’s all my fault.

Now what?

Rod on June 11, 2012 at 5:53 PM

Vince on June 11, 2012 at 5:44 PM

Vince, those things are certainly partly my generations fault, and partly the fault of my daughter’s generation, but again, Boomers are the largest demographic group, and they get most of the credit for those things.

To whom much is given, much is expected. The Boomers have enjoyed, by their sheer numbers, a whole lot of political power for the last 40 years and the country is not entirely, but is largely, what they’ve made of it.

For my part, I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing until my generation enjoys that power. Namely, continuing to blog, to give to candidates who are truly conservative and not just Republican, to harass or encourage my representation as needed (they know me by voice when I call) and to continually encourage people who are not involved in the process to GET involved because a vote is just the beginning of civic responsibility. It’s only by constant vigilance and involvement that we can take back the schools, the media and the government. I want to be able to look my daughter’s generation in the face.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:53 PM

I take it you don’t agree that the group that enjoys the most power should also receive the most credit or the most blame? That seems illogical to you?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:45 PM


Reading Is Fundamental – reading comprehension, even more so, Moby.

Agree, plenty of blame to go around.

Where was the country 20 years ago financially?

When was Social Security projected to go bankrupt 20 years ago?
Had the dot com bubble even started to form 20 years ago?
What was the unemployment rate 20 years ago?

Heck, Glass-Steagall was not repealed until 14 years ago.

Treat the above questions as rhetorical. Back the clock up 11 years.

Many of the challenges we face have become issues in just that period of time and there are solutions. I’ve posted a number of them here in the last two months. I’ll dig up the one regarding SS and post it.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 4:16 PM


This was before you made it clear you were a Moby and not reading anything beyond your own posts.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 6:01 PM

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 6:01 PM

I guess I’m the only Moby at Hot Air who’s been personally vetted by Michelle Malkin, then.

Listen, you’re perfectly entitled to disagree with me, but insults and namecalling are not persuasive at all. I’ve tried to avoid that. I have read your posts; I just disagree with some of what you say. It’s not particularly time-effective to fisk every line of a comment you disagree with, so I picked out the points that seemed most important to me, and ignored the rest. You also seemed really emotional, and that certainly makes me not want to interact with you. I’ve had days like that, myself. Comment threads here at Hot Air where I just couldn’t let something go. Just because I don’t post often, don’t think I’m new here. In fact, I’ve had some very pleasant conversations with fogw before now, and probably will again. I have been here since the first week Hot Air opened and again, Michelle asked me to write for the Green Room back in the day. I occasionally still do post there. My mother, who is disabled, moved in with us last year and I’ve had a lot on my plate since then, so my blog time has been limited.

I find it kind of baffling that you find what I say so objectionable because it seems incredibly obvious to me, but hey, to each his own, I guess. For whatever it’s worth, no hard feelings on my part and I hope your day gets better.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 6:12 PM

Yes, they didn’t all have the same political ideology. And conservative Boomers have (so far) failed to either persuade liberal Boomers of the error of their ways or to shove them out of power by working harder against the liberal takeover of schools and media.

Like the president, no generation starts with a clean slate, and Boomers have had to play the cards they were dealt, just as my generation will. But conservative Boomers have certainly not been helpless against liberal Boomers, and yet, liberal Boomers have prevailed. How do you explain this without taking any responsibility for it?

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

HaHa. Persuade liberals? Work hard against their takeover of schools and media? And you say you do that by showing up at meetings and protesting. Laughable. Please tell me more about you’re magic wand that can change the mindset of liberals in academia and in the MSM. Too funny. WAKE UP LAURA …….. IT HAPPENS IN THE VOTING BOOTH. Not by pointing fingers or going to political gatherings, pleading and whining for some change. Liberals respond to that tactic by saying “I won”, or “we’ll find out what’s in it when we read it”, or “shut up”. I’m of the opinion you don’t know what you’re dealing with here. A little wet behind the ears. Dreaming of rainbows and unicorns and hoping libs we’ll listen to us if we shout loud enough or shout the right words or convince them our way in the right way is a naive approach.

BTW, did you happen to see the results of the 2010 elections? People voted. Dems got tossed out. But that was probably because of GenXer voters, right? Those old GenXer folks we saw at all of those Tea Party gatherings. Yup.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 6:20 PM

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 6:20 PM

Gee, and here I thought we were building on our previous conversation where I had clearly stated that voting and what I called supervising our elected officials were incredibly important and necessary. I didn’t realize I had to spell out every thought I had in each comment I post in order for it to count… Fogw, I’m starting to think it just might be possible that you’re more interested in “winning” this conversation than actually communicating with me.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 6:42 PM

It is not a nightmare to have your parents live longer… I object to that.

My parents are both gone now, but I was very grateful they lasted past 90.

Some things are more important than money.

petunia on June 11, 2012 at 7:00 PM

Laura,

The day hasn’t come yet where I’ll debate an issue hoping to lose. I like winners. Liberals despise winners and success. What side are you on?

HotAir is all about heated debate, discussions, winners and losers.

Its not HappyAir.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 7:16 PM

And you don’t mind being disingenuous to do so, obviously. That, or you suffer from serious memory problem that prevented you from recalling my comments – and your arguing about them – wrt voting. Straw men tremble at the sound of your moniker. Congrats!

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 7:24 PM

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 6:01 PM

I’m sorry, I try to stay out of the generational BS, but really Pol? Your generation single handedly save this nation? Wow, so your parents generation didn’t build sky scrappers in less than 2 years, Empire State building? Your generation put a man on the moon? Your generation broke the sound barrier? Your generation built the Hoover dam? Your generation didn’t bring ethnic quotes, forcing the government not to hire qualified people? your generation didn’t raise a group of petulant little brats, Millennials who helped vote the worthless one into office? Your generation didn’t change education with social promotion, because God forbid you tell a parent his kid might become a garbage man (don’t get me wrong, important job)? Your generation didn’t invent the sit in, didn’t smoke pot, didn’t drop LSD, and didn’t practice free love? Am I missing something here? Maybe somebody should go back and review their history books… just my two cents.

uncommon sense on June 11, 2012 at 7:26 PM

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 7:24 PM

Really, consider investing in fabric softener stock if you’re that sensitive.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 8:10 PM

I am not at all sensitive about the fact that you exposed yourself as dishonest. I quite enjoyed it.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 8:18 PM

I’m sorry, I try to stay out of the generational BS, but really Pol? Your generation single handedly save this nation? Wow, so your parents generation didn’t build sky scrappers in less than 2 years, Empire State building? Your generation put a man on the moon? Your generation broke the sound barrier? Your generation built the Hoover dam? Your generation didn’t bring ethnic quotes, forcing the government not to hire qualified people? your generation didn’t raise a group of petulant little brats, Millennials who helped vote the worthless one into office? Your generation didn’t change education with social promotion, because God forbid you tell a parent his kid might become a garbage man (don’t get me wrong, important job)? Your generation didn’t invent the sit in, didn’t smoke pot, didn’t drop LSD, and didn’t practice free love? Am I missing something here? Maybe somebody should go back and review their history books… just my two cents.

uncommon sense on June 11, 2012 at 7:26 PM


Well, there you go again …

You operate under the mistaken belief that if you don’t specifically quote someone others, with minds as weak as yours, will take your version as gospel … and can’t just scroll back up the thread to see what someone actually said.

I blame Obama’s ascendancy and the LSM’s permissive acceptance of his lying ways for this becoming so widespread that the poorly educated think it passes for debating skill.

So , now that you’ve lied, let’s see what I actually said.

They country WE live in is one where the Baby Boom generation:

* Ended segregation and fought for equal rights regardless of race, creed, color or religion

* Stopped the wholescale environmental pollution which was rampant until the 1970′s

* Established the social & economic rights of women (you would have gone insane during the Sixties and the Seventies)

* Brought about the fall of communism and an end to M.A.D. Sword of Damocles we grew up under.

Remind me again … what things of comparable scope has the GenX generation done for THEIR country?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 3:37 PM


Hmmmmmmm, not word one other than factual statements and a request that a whining GenX Moby cite anything of comparable scope achieved by the GenX genertion.

I’d parse out the generational nonsense you threw in after that … but leading off with the lie shows you are just not worth the time and effort.

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 8:29 PM

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 6:01 PM

I guess I’m the only Moby at Hot Air who’s been personally vetted by Michelle Malkin, then.

Listen, you’re perfectly entitled to disagree with me, but insults and namecalling are not persuasive at all. I’ve tried to avoid that. I have read your posts; I just disagree with some of what you say. It’s not particularly time-effective to fisk every line of a comment you disagree with, so I picked out the points that seemed most important to me, and ignored the rest. You also seemed really emotional, and that certainly makes me not want to interact with you. I’ve had days like that, myself. Comment threads here at Hot Air where I just couldn’t let something go. Just because I don’t post often, don’t think I’m new here. In fact, I’ve had some very pleasant conversations with fogw before now, and probably will again. I have been here since the first week Hot Air opened and again, Michelle asked me to write for the Green Room back in the day. I occasionally still do post there. My mother, who is disabled, moved in with us last year and I’ve had a lot on my plate since then, so my blog time has been limited.

I find it kind of baffling that you find what I say so objectionable because it seems incredibly obvious to me, but hey, to each his own, I guess. For whatever it’s worth, no hard feelings on my part and I hope your day gets better.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 6:12 PM


By your own words, you impeach your credibility, intellectual honesty and merits.

(Hint: When I bold something in text I am quoting & then bold part of my reply, I am visually tieing the two together so others, including you, can more easily follow what I am saying.)

Michelle Malkin is a businesswoman who derives no small amount of her income from page hits generated on the web sites she owns. The more posts that are made, say by people fruitlessly trying to educate a Moby, more page hits occur and she makes more money.

Do you really think your average Hot Air member is impressed because you’ve “been personally vetted by Michelle Malkin”?

Are you so naive you can not comprehend she may be using you for her own ends?

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 8:45 PM

I am not at all sensitive about the fact that you exposed yourself as dishonest. I quite enjoyed it.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 8:18 PM

So you want to take it to the next level.

Show me where I lied about anything, or STFU.

I’ll be waiting.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 8:47 PM

They country WE live in is one where the Baby Boom generation:

* Ended segregation and fought for equal rights regardless of race, creed, color or religion

Really, hmmm so a lot of you baby boomers had a lot to do with Brown vs. the board of education in 1954, or Morgan vs Virginia in 1946???? didn’t realize that the majority of boomers could vote in back then. Heck, not sure how many boomers could vote in 1964, as a percentage of that generation, when Johnson sign the Civil rights act.

uncommon sense on June 11, 2012 at 8:56 PM

Still waiting.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 9:24 PM

Hmmmmmmm, not word one other than factual statements and a request that a whining GenX Moby cite anything of comparable scope achieved by the GenX genertion.

Oh, did I forget to mention that the GenXer’s helped to put Regan in, and keep him in the White House… my bad.

uncommon sense on June 11, 2012 at 9:36 PM

Calling someone a liar is a serious accusation that I don’t take kindly to.
Prove it.

Still waiting.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 10:07 PM

What a manipulative article and subsequent blog post.

Besides one comment by one estate planner (and who knows what issues she has) , a sociologist with some goop about something and one family tussle over a hair cut cost) the remainder of the children are not depending on or hoping for a windfall.

The people in this article took out mortgages on their own homes to cover a parents medical expenses, lent large amounts of money to parents whose finances went south or believe the parent’s care is “first and foremost”

If anything it shows boomers to be less concerned with inheriting and more concerned with parent’s welfare.

Some of the nasty assumptions in the article don’t jive with the examples in the article.

Additionally, the sidebar of a comparison of boomers and the generation prior and their attitudes toward inheritance shows the generation prior more interested in inheritance, thinks it is more of their business to know what parents will do with assets and want to start a conversation about inheritance. If anything it is that prior generation that should be admonished for being to “concerned” with inheritance if that is what these two writers are going for.

Maybe they should go read King Lear.

DoubleClutchin on June 11, 2012 at 10:07 PM

Oh, did I forget to mention that the GenXer’s helped to put Regan in, and keep him in the White House… my bad.

uncommon sense on June 11, 2012 at 9:36 PM


Interesting delusion …

… a generation born between 1965 and the early 1980′s helped elect Ronald Reagan President before any of them were old enough to vote?

… and re-elect him in 1984 when they were the tiniest sliver of eligible voters with an overwhelming propensity for NOT voting?

This first link has some iconic art regading GenX at the start of it:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/09/weekinreview/09aoscott.html?pagewanted=all

And for those of you interested, a chart of the generations:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_Birth_Rates.svg

PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 10:23 PM

Fogw, I’ve been out gaming. My d20 took precedence over this fascinating conversation. Let’s recap – you and I had an exchange starting about about 4:30 wherein we discussed the fact that voting was just the start of our civic duty. I said we needed to “supervise” our elected officials, you took issue with that and ended up saying you would call that “being engaged in the process” but by 4:43 we’d established that voting and nagging the crap out of our elected officials was something we should all be doing.

At 4:43 I expanded on that, trying – once again – to explain why I don’t have a lot of sympathy for Boomers griping about Social Security, since the country we live in they are largely responsible for, having enjoyed the most , not all, of the political power. So I wrote, “And conservative Boomers have (so far) failed to either persuade liberal Boomers of the error of their ways or to shove them out of power by working harder against the liberal takeover of schools and media.”

By 6:20, you either managed to forget all that went on less than two hours before, or you were being disingenuous when you set up this straw man, set it on fire, and danced around it:

HaHa. Persuade liberals? Work hard against their takeover of schools and media? And you say you do that by showing up at meetings and protesting. Laughable. Please tell me more about you’re magic wand that can change the mindset of liberals in academia and in the MSM. Too funny. WAKE UP LAURA …….. IT HAPPENS IN THE VOTING BOOTH. Not by pointing fingers or going to political gatherings, pleading and whining for some change. Liberals respond to that tactic by saying “I won”, or “we’ll find out what’s in it when we read it”, or “shut up”. I’m of the opinion you don’t know what you’re dealing with here. A little wet behind the ears. Dreaming of rainbows and unicorns and hoping libs we’ll listen to us if we shout loud enough or shout the right words or convince them our way in the right way is a naive approach.

If you have some kind of mental problem that affects your memory about what I wrote about our civic duty, then fine, you weren’t being dishonest there. But lacking some medical diagnosis, I’m calling shenanigans. I made it abundantly clear that voting and spending time keeping our pols in line is critically important. You evidently wanted to “win” this conversation so badly you pretended that I had a view which I obviously did not; that I didn’t care about voting or the political process. Either your mental acuity or your integrity are harmed by your comments. I don’t particularly care which one it is, but the strawman thing is a pathetic tactic and it did not work here.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Do you really think your average Hot Air member is impressed because you’ve “been personally vetted by Michelle Malkin”?
PolAgnostic on June 11, 2012 at 8:45 PM

No, because it doesn’t particularly impress me either; while I admire her it’s not like we’re friends or anything. I was trying to take a shortcut to establish my bona fides when you ridiculously accused me of being a moby. But hey, if the Malkin vote of approval and however many Instalanches and Malkalanches and HotAirlanches I’ve been fortunate enough to receive, if writing for the Washington Examiner and eight years of posting conservative posts at my own blog aren’t enough to get through to you, then it’s not really worth my time to try to convince you that – believe it or not! – it’s possible to disagree with you and yet still be conservative.

But – and I am only saying this because I care – there are a lot of decaffeinated brands on the market today that are just as tasty as the real thing.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:52 AM

BTW, did you happen to see the results of the 2010 elections?
fogw on June 11, 2012 at 6:20 PM

Boomers supported Republican candidates in 2010
Baby boomers split their votes for president votes evenly between Barack Obama and John McCain. The vote was 49 percent to 49 percent.

Gen Y, age 18 to 31, voted two to one for Obama, while Gen X, age 32 to 43, supported him by a smaller, but clear margin.

The Silent Generation, age 63 to 83, voted for McCain, the group of which he is a member.

The boomer vote, went to President Bush by a slim majority in 2004.

lynncgb on June 12, 2012 at 12:54 AM

But – and I am only saying this because I care – there are a lot of decaffeinated brands on the market today that are just as tasty as the real thing.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:52 AM

The only thing true to your nature you have posted on this thread today was:

“It’s not particularly time-effective to fisk every line of a comment you disagree with, so I picked out the points that seemed most important to me, and ignored the rest.”

Every other aspect of your behavior revolves around this telling statement.

By your lights, I was one of the people of my generation in power. I also hired and mentored people of your generation as successors. They all had qualities you have shown no ability or appreciation for:

Attention to detail – when you are living up to the expectations of of your superiors you do not get to “ignore the rest”. You OWN it all. If it is wrong, even a little bit, even if it is the work product of other people in your organization … YOU still passed on something which was not correct.

Listening more than talking – you have had multiple people engage in multiple posts with you on this thread. When they have made points which do not align with your point of view … whoosh, they disappear from your world … and then you ignore them if they are pointed out to you again. In the real world of higher level organizations, this behavior gets you fired.

Empowerment – Wannabees expect to be handed a very clear set of instructions, job description, defined limits of authority, blah, blah, blah. People who LEAD empower themselves and others. They look for opportunities to do things better and DO them.

From your perspective, as stated repeatedly in this thread, you are waiting for your generation to be handed over the keys to the kingdom and then you will be the ones responsible for the mess.

What is dumbfounding is how everything you have said mirrors the “it’s somebody else’s fault” mentality of Obama and his ilk.

You are not a Moby. You are much more deceitful than a liberal pretending to be a conservative.

You are an ‘Obama’ and excellent example of how the same behaviors so many of us despise in the POTUS can live and breathe beneath a conservative mask.

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 1:38 AM

The appeal of the “gotcha” games really baffle me. I outgrew that a long time ago. But to address your concerns about

“It’s not particularly time-effective to fisk every line of a comment you disagree with, so I picked out the points that seemed most important to me, and ignored the rest.”

It seemed obvious to me that I mean it’s not time-effective for me to fisk every word you say that I disagree with, so I’m being selective about what I’m taking the time to answer, because my time is valuable to me and you are only entitled to as much of it as I want to give. So since that was unclear, I apologize. If I interact with you in the future – unlikely, but still – I’ll be sure to parse every word and not rely on the concept that you are able to understand what I’m saying to you.

By the way, if I wanted to play gotcha, I could have: “you do not get to “ignore the rest”. You OWN it all. If it is wrong, even a little bit, even if it is the work product of other people in your organization … YOU still passed on something which was not correct.” MUST mean that you’re agreeing with me that the Boomers are the group most responsible for the financial problems we have today, right? Because YOU own it, if it’s wrong, even a little bit, your generation passed on something which is not correct. But no, of course that’s not what you meant and so I didn’t play gotcha and parse words.

What is dumbfounding is how everything you have said mirrors the “it’s somebody else’s fault” mentality of Obama and his ilk.

Every boomer I know moans about how they’re so shafted by Social Security and Medicare going under and the Big Mean Government is picking on them and I’m heartily tired of it. I’m not championing “it’s somebody else’s fault” so much as I’m championing ownership and personal responsibility. Boomers have enjoyed a lot of political power, and in my view that means you have the most responsibility for current conditions. Not all. Most. If Boomers did take responsibility for what they’ve done, or in this case, not done, they’d quit whining about how victimized by the system they are. I started by saying I have no sympathy for Boomer’s financial woes and you have certainly failed to persuade me I’m wrong about that.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 2:18 AM

The appeal of the “gotcha” games really baffle me. I outgrew that a long time ago.


Seriously? You opened with a gotcha and your complaint.

No sympathy for the Boomers here. They have had about 40 years of being the largest demographic with voting rights, and the country they live in is the one THEY created for themselves. Meanwhile, we GenXers are taking care of our Boomer parents AND our children.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 3:10 PM


and a little farther down

::eyeroll:: right, so you elect them and just go about your business for the next 2, 4 or 6 years, never worrying about what they’re up to. That’s been so effective so far! Good governance abounds.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:11 PM


and a little farther down

Really, consider investing in fabric softener stock if you’re that sensitive.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 4:51 PM


and a little farther down

Are you also going to congratulate yourself on race quotas, the breakdown of the family unit and all the consequent financial woes (yay for doing what “feels good” and no-fault divorce!) and the rise of the democratic socialism?

Oh, and by the way, wrt to the fall of communism: my generation also fought that, albeit on the tail end. The Wall didn’t fall until 1989.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

You are all about YOU.

You are SO about YOU I am certain there is no one on the planet who could walk you through this thread and get you to SEE all the replies provided in good faithby people who thought you were engaged in a dialogue. Our mistake – you are a monologue of self-indulgence.

I’ve taken the time to document your behavior and your lies for the sake of others reading this thread.

Good night, Obamy.

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 3:21 AM

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Wow. And you accused me of being fixated on winning?

But more to the point. I asked you to prove where I had lied about anything in my posts.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 6:40 AM

If you have some kind of mental problem that affects your memory about what I wrote about our civic duty, then fine, you weren’t being dishonest there.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

This convoluted diatribe falls just a wee bit short of proving I had lied about something. Saying I didn’t lie because I had a mental problem is the coward’s way out.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 6:51 AM

But lacking some medical diagnosis, I’m calling shenanigans.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Wordplay. Still haven’t proved I lied about anything.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 6:54 AM

Either your mental acuity or your integrity are harmed by your comments. I don’t particularly care which one it is, but the strawman thing is a pathetic tactic and it did not work here.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Anyone can go back and read this entire thread and judge my mental acuity for themselves. They can also judge my integrity and determine if they think I lied about anything.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 7:06 AM

Are you also going to congratulate yourself on race quotas, the breakdown of the family unit and all the consequent financial woes (yay for doing what “feels good” and no-fault divorce!) and the rise of the democratic socialism?

Oh, and by the way, wrt to the fall of communism: my generation also fought that, albeit on the tail end. The Wall didn’t fall until 1989.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 5:36 PM

You seem to be trying a little too hard to pat yourself on the back while only focusing on the negatives of “the boomers”. No generation is perfect by any stretch. Some things about the boomers you conveniently left out:
- probably the last group of Americans who received a quality education through public schools
- Didn’t need the internet to be the silent majority that elected Nixon twice and swept Carter out of office which implies a keen interest in issues and values of the time
- Fought in Viet Nam and the Gulf Wars

The thing you seem to miss in patting yourself on the back (yes Michelle Malkin sings your praises or something) is that eventually the kids of one generation have to grow up and take ownership for their lives. Spending a person’s life heaping the negatives of society on their parents fills a need for lots of psychiatrists and little else.

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 7:19 AM

I am not at all sensitive about the fact that you exposed yourself as dishonest. I quite enjoyed it.

Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 8:18 PM

Strong words, no proof.

Still waiting.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 7:21 AM

I started by saying I have no sympathy for Boomer’s financial woes and you have certainly failed to persuade me I’m wrong about that.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 2:18 AM

You must not know that many boomers. You definitely seem bent on creating a class warfare in take theirs not mine mentality that Obama is so attached to.
Guess you will tell the boomers to do the right thing and march off into the wilds to let nature take its course when they cannot contribute anymore.

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 7:24 AM

Bradky, I know a lot of boomers, and to a man they’re heartily ticked off about the upcoming crash of SS/Medicare as though this were some strange event nobody could have prevented. I just expressed my wish that they’d stop whining, because boomers are the largest demographic and have had the most political power. The country we live in is the one they are most responsible for created – the good, and the bad.

No long march, no ice floes, no requirement they off themselves at age 60. Just, for the love of God, stop acting surprised and whining about the fact that SS and Medicare are unsustainable when they’ve spent decades re-electing politicians who told them their lunch was going to be free.

Fogw, you either have a serious memory problem or you absolutely were dishonest in your dealings with me.
Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:47 AM

PolAgnostic, you seem confused about the difference between gotcha games (twisting someone’s words so that they seem to say something they obviously didn’t mean) and sarcasm/snark.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:12 AM

boomers are the largest demographic and have had the most political power.

The size of the boomer generation has not guaranteed it’s influence. If we can use the percentages of the votes in the 2008 election as an example (49% went to Obama and 49% went to McCaain), you can see the Boomers did not sweep Obama into office. Boomers effectively cancelled each other out.

lynncgb on June 12, 2012 at 10:24 AM

The thing you seem to miss in patting yourself on the back (yes Michelle Malkin sings your praises or something) is that eventually the kids of one generation have to grow up and take ownership for their lives. Spending a person’s life heaping the negatives of society on their parents fills a need for lots of psychiatrists and little else.

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 7:19 AM

Also, I want to be really clear about this because you have the wrong impression about what I was trying to say. PolAgnostic accused me of being a moby – a liberal who just came here, pretending to be a conservative, to cause mayhem, etc. Now of course you know that’s not so – we’ve chatted many times before, though it was quite a while back. My blogging time has been severely reduced for the last year. But to settle the question of me being a moby for PolAgnostic, I listed the fact that Michelle has linked me before, invited me to post in the Green Room, and I have a pretty long history both here and at my own blog. That was all there was to it.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:38 AM

lynncgb on June 12, 2012 at 10:24 AM
That’s true, and that’s a point fogw made earlier – that while boomers are the largest demographic, conservative boomers are not the largest demographic; as you say, the numbers are about even.

Liberal boomers have prevailed for decades – the Overton window moved left far enough so that the GOP has been pretty comfortable with big government and Bush’s “compassionate conservatism” was approved by a lot of people, including me for a couple of years.

Since liberal ideas are not superior to conservative ideas and the numbers are almost even, why were liberal boomers able to prevail over conservatives?

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 AM

Liberal boomers have prevailed for decades
Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 AM

I don’t believe that’s true. Boomers are a very difficult demographic to pin down as far as voting patterns are concerned. Boomers went right in helping to elect Reagan (2x), but will swing left (2006 as an example) as well. Older Boomers tend to vote more Democrat, while younger Boomers lean more to Republicans. Our generation considers Reagan and Clinton to be the best presidents during our lifetime. See any constant trend? I don’t.
And at this point, Boomers in total represent about 28% of the electorate (I believe it used to be about 40%). So the more liberal Boomers are possibly about half of that. 20% at one time and 14% now. Seems like those kinds of percentages of the electorate would need alot of additional help to prevail at anything.

lynncgb on June 12, 2012 at 11:41 AM

I said that liberal boomers have prevailed based on the fact that liberal ideology is widely accepted and practiced, even by a good portion of the GOP. Bush, who did a lot of good and deserves a lot of credit, still was a big-government guy. McCain. A good chunk of Congress. There are very few small-government advocates, even within the GOP. So when I say liberal boomers have prevailed, that’s what I’m talking about – where we are in society, the media, schools, and government; what’s considered normal and acceptable and what’s considered fringe. The pendulum is starting to swing the other way, especially since 2010, but liberal ideology was the status quo for decades in terms of how we’ve actually lived.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 11:55 AM

Fogw, you either have a serious memory problem or you absolutely were dishonest in your dealings with me.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:12 AM

Come on Laura, you

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 12:10 PM

Fogw, you either have a serious memory problem or you absolutely were dishonest in your dealings with me.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:12 AM

Let me try again, power outage.

Come on Laura, you came on this thread wiith guns ablazing at the Boomers. Initially you didn’t differentiate between liberal and conservative Boomers, you lumped them all together.

You were challenged by a handful of people and you’ve had a hissy fit ever since. Resorting to name calling is classless. I don’t have a memory problem, a mental problem, nor have I been dishonest in any way.

Get over the Boomers, quit placing blame all the time, and get over yourself.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 12:23 PM

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:38 AM

Laura,
Some things you don’t take into consideration with your rather sweeping conclusions are:
a. Until Reagan came along the boomers were taxed quite heavily
b. Not until the 80′s were investment vehicles for retirement widely available

With those things in mind it is a little unreasonable to say some of the things you have said.

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 12:38 PM

Fogw, I have not had “guns blazing.” I started with

No sympathy for the Boomers here. They have had about 40 years of being the largest demographic with voting rights, and the country they live in is the one THEY created for themselves. Meanwhile, we GenXers are taking care of our Boomer parents AND our children.
Laura Curtis on June 11, 2012 at 3:10 PM

If you’re calling that “guns blazing” as opposed to simple frustration, well, we’re just going to have to disagree. But it’s a fact – Boomers have been the largest demographic with voting rights, and during that time liberalism has prevailed to the point that society at large is thoroughly infected with it. Schools, media, and government have pretty steadily moved left. Even the GOP has moved left; look at our Presidential candidates, look at Congress!

I haven’t had a “hissy fit,” I’ve defended myself from a lot of insults and personal attacks. I called you out on a straw man attack where you pretended that I wasn’t interested in voting or the political process, even though you and I had already discussed that less than two hours before.

I’m not interested in “winning” in the sense of smacking down the other person. I’m interested in communicating and persuasion, and in that sense, this whole conversation is a pretty epic fail because we haven’t communicated well at all – but then I believe we’ve had different goals all along. I’m not so much blaming Boomers as expressing frustration for the fact that as I see it, they are not taking ownership of where we are and why we are here. They’re just griping about how they’ve been victimized and it’s aggravating because if they were victimized, it certainly wasn’t by my generation.

You made good decisions about your retirement and I congratulate you but you are not representative of Boomers. Circumstances are what they are, and we all need to move forward from this point and salvage the situation, but the complaining is very tiresome and I’ve got no problem saying so.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:44 PM

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 12:38 PM

That’s a good point about pre-Reagan tax rates, but I think we’re talking past each other to some extent. I’m not trying to make any “sweeping conclusions” other than to say that Boomers should not act surprised or victimized by the state of the country. They’ve had decades to do something about it. To persuade liberal boomers of the error of their ways, to work the political process, to hold politicians accountable, to build stable families and raise their children to be conservatives and steer the country in the direction they wanted it to go.

My generation will be answerable to the next one. Even though we’re still demographically a minority, we’ve had 15-20 years to start to influence the country and lay the groundwork. Have we squandered that time? I think to an extent we have but we’ve got another 20+ years to turn it around, especially since 2010. And during the next twenty years we will gain more and more political power as we start to outnumber the boomers and hold positions of power. If we’re not being mindful of what we’re doing, we’ll leave the next generation worse off and they will rightly blame us for that.

Also, FWIW, people did save for retirement before the 1980s. They just used savings accounts, invested in property, stocks, etc. I mean to say that retirement is not a recent concept, regardless of what happened in the 80s to make it more convenient.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 1:07 PM

I’m not so much blaming Boomers as expressing frustration for the fact that as I see it, they are not taking ownership of where we are and why we are here. They’re just griping about how they’ve been victimized and it’s aggravating because if they were victimized, it certainly wasn’t by my generation.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 12:44 PM

You must socialize with different Boomers than I do. I don’t hear anyone griping or saying they’ve been victimized. I hear my fellow Boomers say we must get out and vote in November to rid ourselves of the socialist in the White House. And they are passionate about it, and active in the process. I don’t see Obama going to retirement homes, but I do see him on Jimmy Fallon acting like a gangsta rapper, I do see him going after the MTV crowd. Those aren’t Boomers, he knows where his bread is buttered.

Something in your past has colored your opinion of Boomers in general. At least that’s my opinion. I don’t know the Boomers you know. I admire and respect all of them. They’ve accomplished great things in their lives in spite of the government’s attempts to put a stranglehold on them.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 1:07 PM

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 1:07 PM

This may be one of those things we will not come to common agreement on.
passbook savings and bonds couldn’t possibly keep up with inflation. With higher taxes arguably there was less to invest with. The life expectancy was lower as well.

My point is that we have reached a point in history where the problems that need correction will require something from everyone. That is NOT an argument for higher taxes by the way.
Higher eligibility ages for Social security with adjustments based on census life expectancy stats is one example but where do you make the cut? 55, 60 or 65 and above that won’t be impacted?
If the desired end state is to make things better for your generation in the long run what type of sacrifices do you envision for your age group until we are firmly away from the cliff of financial collapse?

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 1:24 PM

Since liberal ideas are not superior to conservative ideas and the numbers are almost even, why were liberal boomers able to prevail over conservatives?

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 10:49 AM

Simple. Leftist boomers (they sure are not liberal) have controlled the media and the educational fields for decades. They learned from the Communists that when one controls the message, one is able to control the actions that occur based on the message. It is only with the rise of alternative media and home schooling that we are starting to see cracks in this left-wing narrative.

StoneHeads on June 12, 2012 at 1:38 PM

If the desired end state is to make things better for your generation in the long run what type of sacrifices do you envision for your age group until we are firmly away from the cliff of financial collapse?
Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 1:24 PM

Actually, our (meaning my husband and myself) desired end state is to make things better for my daughter’s generation. We’ve kind of written off our own. Consequently we started to do these things and we encourage others to as well:

Practice austerity on every level: Get out of debt, stay out of debt, and advocate for every level of government to cut spending and do the same.

Practice charity: Give to charities which genuinely help people become and stay independent. (This is a balancing act between my Christian faith and my Randian political bent…)

Have no expectations of government help for ourselves: We’re not planning on any kind of government help with retirement or health care. If we salvage the system and it’s there for us, that’s great, but at this point we have resigned ourselves that every nickel we’ve put in is gone. We fully expect to work longer and have less medical care than Boomers.

Now, none of this is in any way self-pitying. We enjoy our lives. We just feel like this is the reality of what’s going to happen and we’re making the best of it. We’ve chosen inexpensive hobbies like RPG gaming rather than, say, golf or sailing. We watch movies on Netflix rather than go to the theater. We’re not deprived, we’ve just learned to be more patient and to enjoy different things. It’s much more important to us to leave less debt and smaller government to the next generation.

StoneHeads on June 12, 2012 at 1:38 PM
Sure, but how did that happen?

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 1:58 PM

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 1:58 PM

The ironic thing about your explanation is pretty much what we have been doing for 30 years.
I still don’t see a sacrifice mentioned other than taking care of yourself by being self-sufficient which is laudable.
What I’m getting at specifically is for the 60, 65+ members of our society who for whatever reasons will need social security and assistance. Is the younger gen okay with continued rates of ss for a few more years to care for those members of society with a cut line of some date that sees the rates lowered considerably in acknowledgement of the need to provide for one’s own retirement?
I don’t envision a mass charitable effort where the younger generations take in the elderly who cannot survive.
And you are realistic enough to know that simply due to politics somehow they will be taken care of so the choice is about how you are willing to do that.

Bradky on June 12, 2012 at 2:16 PM

What I’m getting at specifically is for the 60, 65+ members of our society who for whatever reasons will need social security and assistance. Is the younger gen okay with continued rates of ss for a few more years to care for those members of society with a cut line of some date that sees the rates lowered considerably in acknowledgement of the need to provide for one’s own retirement?

Okay, I see what you’re asking. No, regardless of what I think about who created the situation they are now suffering under, I am unwilling to throw those people under the bus. That’s my parents. My father is 68, his wife is 64. My mother is 65 (though she has been disabled for about a year which is why she lives with me now.) I think as a society we should find a way to give them the benefits they expected to get, though I AM in favor of means-testing. To my way of thinking, that means cutting all the government fat and then cutting taxpayer funded services for younger people.

Rational economic policy would help a great deal with all of this – unleashing business and getting the economy growing again will make belt-tightening slightly less necessary and much easier to take. But at the end of the day, where cuts are necessarily, let them mostly affect people who are 20-50 years old. We’re better able to take it and recover from it.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 2:29 PM

Something in your past has colored your opinion of Boomers in general. At least that’s my opinion. I don’t know the Boomers you know. I admire and respect all of them. They’ve accomplished great things in their lives in spite of the government’s attempts to put a stranglehold on them.

fogw on June 12, 2012 at 1:07 PM

.
I think her most recent remarks have unwittingly highlighted the accuracy of your statement. This is personal for her. She started off sneering, blaming and complaining about the Baby Boom generation exhibiting behaviors (blaming and complaining, what a coincidence) I have not seen across the political spectrum of Baby Boomers.

She personifies the Obama behaviors of “it’s somebody else’s fault”, “I, me, my” and “I am the adult in the room” to perfection.

How terrible to see the same behaviors embodied in someone calling herself a conservative.

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 3:46 PM

Only in the sense that my opinion is informed by what I have personally experienced and seen, just like anyone’s else’s is. To say nothing of a decades-long narrative that even the GOP has bought into – the “3rd rail” – that anyone who dares to question government benefits for the elderly is pushing Grandma off a cliff.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 3:53 PM

… that anyone who dares to question government benefits for the elderly is pushing Grandma off a cliff.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 3:53 PM

Interesting choice of referencing the visual a LIBERAL ad used against the Ryan budget plan …

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 4:25 PM

Pol, if you are oblivious to the sense of entitlement that Boomers have that led to the “3rd rail” and cliff-pushing becoming part of our political narrative, then there’s really not much that I can say to convince you of anything. You may say that Boomers feel entitled because they ARE entitled; that’s a fair POV. But if you’re suggesting that they actually don’t feel entitled, then, wow.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 4:30 PM

I started reading HotAir when it started because of Michelle Malkin, whose site it used to be. I read, commented and was happy as a lamb…then the threat of Obama came along and I spent my time blogging, posting, commenting about the danger of this Progressive and his cronies. Now that many more know the mess we are in and the why…I come back to read HotAir, but today I spent a few minutes
on the “comments” of this article….WOW!!! What happened? The posts appear to direct themselves at other posters rather than discussing the content. In the old days, the trolls were kept in check to some degree..but today, it looks like you are all fighting each other. We only have about l30 +/- days before the most critical election in the history of the most amazing country on the planet, the like of which may never be seen again. We need to work together and get over the blame game, I am a pre-boomer, my kids are GenX and don’t know yet, what they’ll call my grands…lived through the 50′s, 60′s when I was particularly bleeding heart liberal…then came the 70-80-90-2000′s. When anyone asks why the conservatives have not had more power, consider the question and note that not until Buckley was the conservative movement begun. Since 1880, America has had Progressives with a mentality that hated what “freedoms” America was founded on….they lost the election to Lincoln and went under getting into local, city, county and state offices…in the very early l930′s the “Progressives” merged themselves into the Democratic Party and the rest is the why we are the way we are. Do your own research and don’t depend on Wiki….use the hard books. Most Gen-Xers may be surprised at what you weren’t taught, what you were taught and why.

sharinlite on June 12, 2012 at 4:57 PM

Pol, if you are oblivious to the sense of entitlement that Boomers have that led to the “3rd rail” and cliff-pushing becoming part of our political narrative, then there’s really not much that I can say to convince you of anything. You may say that Boomers feel entitled because they ARE entitled; that’s a fair POV. But if you’re suggesting that they actually don’t feel entitled, then, wow.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 4:30 PM


The sound of one hand clapping …

As I and others have tried to point out “the sense of entitlement that Boomers have” is based entirely on YOUR observations.

Anyone who says anything to dissent from YOUR observations is “oblivious”?

On this thread – you are coming across EXACTLY like Obama – behaviors, tactics, etc

It seems on other thread comments you can be more … normal. You might want to compare your differing approaches and reflect on them.

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 5:05 PM

sharinlite on June 12, 2012 at 4:57 PM

If you start from the beginning and work your way through to here, you can find any number of times where myself and others tried to engage Laura in a discussion of the problems and the solutions.

She has not moved off her opening rant.

Strangely enough, some people have found her behavior to be offensive.

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 5:09 PM

Pol, you’re killing me, brah. This sort of thing doesn’t come out of nowhere or from my imagination: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3yHa8brzNA

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 5:12 PM

Its been said before, but…Each generation must face its own challenges. In the modern era, Americans have faced the Great Depression, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, the Cold War with its threat of nuclear annihilation, energy crises, social upheaval as in the Civil rights movement and so on…After WWII, we were the only major power that was not digging out of the ashes of war. We attained Superpower status during and after WWII in large part because most of the rest of the world was devastated. Now, fast forward to today. Europe and Asia have long since risen from the ashes of WWII to become economic Superpowers in their own right. Whole industries that were once the sole possession of American workers now reside elsewhere. There are literally billions of people around the world who want their piece of the pie. The result is that we face enormous competiton for jobs, income, and lifestlye. This is an economic fact. This is perhaps the greatest challenge facing younger Americans. It is natural to have the expectation of having what your parents had and even more. It’s human nature. The reality is that each generation has to deal with world that is presented to them, because the one their parents faced is long gone. So, to blame boomers for problems of today is a pointless endeavor. The world has moved on…The choices presented to them are now history…It’s time for us to deal with the unfolding history of today and make the most of it for ourselves…Don’t look back isn’t just a song title!

Nozzle on June 12, 2012 at 6:30 PM

The reality is that each generation has to deal with world that is presented to them, because the one their parents faced is long gone. So, to blame boomers for problems of today is a pointless endeavor. The world has moved on…The choices presented to them are now history…It’s time for us to deal with the unfolding history of today and make the most of it for ourselves…Don’t look back isn’t just a song title!

Nozzle on June 12, 2012 at 6:30 PM

This is true, but again, my original comment that a few people find so objectionable was just that the unfolding history we are experiencing now is a result of choices that Boomers, mostly, have made and they should not be surprised about or complain about the results.

Also, now I’ve got Boston playing in my head, so thank you for that. :-) Love that band.

Laura Curtis on June 12, 2012 at 6:42 PM

You made it personal by lumping all Boomers into a single group, blaming all of us for the woes brought upon us by 60+ years of predominately Democrat rule in congress.

fogw on June 11, 2012 at 4:49 PM

Let’s talk about how the GOP promised you they’d cut government for 50 years and never did.

Dims aren’t the only ones to blame – the people you’ve been going to the polls (like a slave) to vote for have been responsible for overspending too.

HondaV65 on June 12, 2012 at 9:17 PM

PolAgnostic on June 12, 2012 at 5:09 PM

Then don’t. The simpler thing to do is avoid the situation. Post your thoughts but don’t fight over Laura’s definitions, predictions, thoughts…don’t.

sharinlite on June 13, 2012 at 12:45 AM

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