Video: AZ abortion clinics arrange sex-selective abortions
posted at 12:01 pm on June 6, 2012 by Ed Morrissey
Why is the location important? Arizona is one of only four states that bars sex-selective abortions. These two Arizona abortion clinics keep telling this Live Action undercover reporter that sex-selective abortion is illegal in Arizona. And yet, neither of the clinics stop her from pursuing the abortion based on the baby being a girl, but just tell her not to talk about it:
LifeNews also comments on the video:
A third video in a series devoted to exposing how the abortion industry is willing to arrange sex-selection abortions for women who seek them shows two National Abortion Federation-affiliated clinics in Arizona agreeing to break state law and perform an illegal sex-selective abortion.
Live Action has released the third video in the series after two other videos exposed how staff at Planned Parenthood abortion centers agreed to facilitate sex-selection abortions.
The new footage shows two NAF members, Camelback Family Planning in Phoenix and the Tucson Women’s Center in Tucson, promising to ignore the law and perform a sex-selective abortion and coaching a woman to lie on official paperwork to conceal the illegal abortion. …
Not only have the videos implicated Planned Parenthood, the nation’s largest abortion business, they now have show how NAF-affiliated clinics are willing to break the law and arrange sex-selection abortions as well. NAF is the professional trade group for hundreds of abortion clinics not affiliated with Planned Parenthood that operate in the U.S. and Canada. Many NAF board members are current or former Planned Parenthood officials, and Planned Parenthood representatives frequently play a prominent role at NAF annual meetings.
The first video detailed a planned Parenthood staffer at an Austin,Texas facility urging a sex-selection abortion and a second video shows staff at Planned Parenthood’s Margaret Sanger clinic in New York City helping arrange one.
So much for compliance with the law, a trait not often found in abortion clinics when Live Action goes undercover.
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That’s disappointing. I was hoping that youth and inexperience might account for some of the ‘words’ you’ve used here today.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:27 PM
What if, say, a woman (with a boy’s name) were to go to one of these abortion factories and tell them she wanted to have an abortion because the boy she was caring had a black father from Kenya?
Just askin?
TXUS on June 6, 2012 at 1:28 PM
Teresa: Well, um, ‘decahedron’ means (among other things) a 10-sided polyhedron, and ‘icosahedron’ means a 20-sided polyhedron, so perhaps ‘icosimation’?
When you think about the term ‘decimation’ and its true meaning, though, it shows that yes, our culture is at war with its own next generation.
Scott H on June 6, 2012 at 1:28 PM
Depends. I’m not likely to endanger my life, the lives of passengers in my car, or the lives of other drivers/passengers, but if I could do something, I would.
Again, what does this have to do with the price of tea in China/
Are you equating human life with the lives of animals?
What’s your point here?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:28 PM
Which words in particular?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:29 PM
Quinquemation?
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 1:30 PM
In every war, there are words – which seem to be your choice of tactic – and there are actions. This war has gone on for entirely too long, and it’s been fought from the pro-life side by employing words almost entirely. You might classify these videos as guerilla tactics, but they are effective for the good. They rip the scab off the wound, and that’s most likely what you don’t like.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 1:31 PM
The point is that many people would willingly endanger their own safety in order to rescuse an animal in traffic, yet you object to people asking questions of abortion providers in order to draw attention to their illegal activities. Even while you maintain that you are pro-life. How very odd. I guess you are against abortion for those who also agree to being against abortion. Everyone else ought to find their own way to that conclusion, I guess.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:31 PM
What I don’t like is the deceitfulness. I don’t like the lack of Christ in the practice.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:34 PM
Again, I’m not sure how these two situations are related.
I’d risk my life to save a single human being. I don’t think Lila Rose has risked anything here to save anyone. She’s posturing and grandstanding and making a name for herself, but she hasn’t stopped a single abortion.
There are many prolifers who’ve dropped out of the debate because of the bullying tactics of a very loud, brutish sort of prolifer who likes to fling around all kinds of extreme rhetoric and applaud extreme grandstanding, and who likes to trample over anyone who doesn’t march in lockstep with them.
That’s a huge loss, in the long run, to the prolife movement.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:37 PM
So we shouldn’t expose the hypocrisy of the abortion supporters because we can’t do it in a way you approve of? OK then.
GeorgieGirl9 on June 6, 2012 at 1:38 PM
You’ve have stated in a number of ways that you find the Lila Rose campaign to be both pointless and ‘attention-whoring.’ Yet history has shown it to be both effective and invaluable in terms of drawing attention to PP’s outrageous activities and policies. It is only a matter of time before Congress completely defunds them. Groups such as Komen are under scrutiny for their connections to PP and that would likely not have happened without these undercover videos. You must also find it distasteful when law enforcement goes undercover as young children in order to catch pedophiles online like this one:
I mean, how shameless of those police officers to ‘trick’ that man in that way. Surely this will only inflame the rhetoric of the pedophilia debate. Just ask NAMBLA.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:39 PM
Oh please! Christ used artifice and used words to lay traps for the Pharisees and Sadducees in almost every encounter He had with them. Christ made a whip and drove the money changers out of the temple – violently. He overturned tables and drove them out.
You don’t like these tactics because they expose something that you want to ignore. If you don;t have to think about it, maybe it will go away. There’s your discomfort.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 1:40 PM
You can do what you like, and Lila Rose can do what she likes, but what you cannot do is insist that I am not a “real” woman because I disagree with those tactics.
When you deny my humanity, you do what abortionists do — deny the humanity of unborn children. You have become the thing you claim you hate.
I disagree with this tactic, and I think it does more harm than good overall, and I highly doubt the tactic prevents a single abortion.
That does not make me not “real”. Yet you insist it does, just like an abortionist insists an unborn child is not a “real” human life.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:41 PM
Then I guess they weren’t really all that committed, were they? Because I find abortion to be horrifying, repugnant and a crime against both humanity and nature and because I genuinely value the sanctity of human life, I will happily and enthusiastically support any measures short of anything illegal or violent that are designed to lead to its eradication.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:42 PM
It is odd that someone so ostensibly pro-life as yourself would object to a perfectly legal means of showing the world how unscrupulous and illegal these clinics are. Very odd.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:43 PM
So we shouldn’t expose the hypocrisy of the abortion supporters because we can’t do it in a way you approve of? OK then.
You didn’t answer my assertion. And I’ll answer yours – People are not human if they can sit around and watch other people be killed because they exist. In other words, I stand by my statements.
GeorgieGirl9 on June 6, 2012 at 1:45 PM
Yes, I agree — actually, I stated that up front — this sort of tactic is very good at getting attention. But attention is a tricky thing, eh?
My point is who and what does this attention-seeking tactic serve in the long run?
You’re comparing apples and oranges with your law enforcement analogy.
Lila Rose hasn’t stopped anything at all. She hasn’t prevented anything. At all. That’s what you don’t seem to understand.
No one was truly attempting to seek an abortion based on sex selection. That was a lie she made up and acted out. And then filmed the “gotcha” moment. She hasn’t proven a thing, stopped a thing, prevented an abortion, changed any pro-choicer’s position.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:46 PM
The concern sure is getting thick in here.
Leave the heavy lifting of superlative concern to olde Tommy O’Daschle.
tom daschle concerned on June 6, 2012 at 1:47 PM
Nope. Wrong again.
I don’t want to ignore abortion at all.
I tend to ignore the Lila Roses of the world, however, but I’m not at all uncomfortable in doing so (obviously, lol!).
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:48 PM
You’re kidding, right?
Over the past four years, Live Action has released undercover videos revealing Planned Parenthood clinics across the country covering up the sexual abuse of children and violating mandatory reporting laws for statutory rape. In February, Live Action released new undercover footage showing 7 Planned Parenthood clinics in 4 states willing to aid and abet the commercial sex trafficking of underage girls. The videos prompted the House of Representatives to vote twice to defund Planned Parenthood of all federal taxpayer subsidies.“North Carolina joins Indiana, Kansas, and New Jersey in standing up for the rule of law, human rights, and responsible government,” says Rose. “While we wait for Congress to defund Planned Parenthood at the federal level, responsible state governments should do their part to protect women and unborn children and end local public subsidies of this lawless abortion chain.”
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:49 PM
Finally. I was wondering when you were going to get here!
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:50 PM
That may be the root of her problem, right there.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 1:52 PM
The only assertion you’ve made (and continue to make) is that I’m not a “real” woman.
I replied to your comment, but once again I refused to capitulate (the real issue here, methinks), so you continue to assert I’m not “real”.
Where have I “sat around and watched other people be killed because they exist”?
Please state your evidence for your assertion that I sit around and watch people be killed (based on any reason, actually).
BTW, I stand my my statement — once you deny the humanity of those you do not agree with, you have become the same as the abortionist because you define humanity by what is acceptable to you and you alone. There’s no difference between someone who denies the humanity of a child based on his or her sex and someone who denies the humanity of another based on his or her position on an issue.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:53 PM
Yes…next question?
right2bright on June 6, 2012 at 1:55 PM
Yes, and as soon as they did, private entities stepped up and donated large sums to PP.
All this kind of stuff only fuels the fire, feeds the ugliness.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:55 PM
You genuinely think that there is no difference between someone who kills an innocent unborn child in its mother’s womb and someone who questions your ‘womanhood?’ Really? Why don’t you give up this pretense that you are “pro-life” and just admit that you are pro-abortion? No one really believes your assertions anyway.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:56 PM
Specifics, please?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 1:57 PM
If PP could rely on private ‘donations’ (earmarked for abortions? Please provide that link because I can’t find it.) they wouldn’t be fighting so desperately to hold onto their subsidies. And like I said earlier: nothing, NOTHING is uglier than abortion.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 1:58 PM
Even if that’s true, that source of funding will dry up much faster than if they exist off of taxpayer funding.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 2:00 PM
Folks, this person is not worth your time. She is arguing for civility yet calling names such as “attention whores” and now invoking Christ as a club against Live Action due to their “tactics” against *abortionists*.
Pathetic and sad. I wonder which would concern Christ more – guerrilla journalism or abortion? SMH.
kim roy on June 6, 2012 at 2:00 PM
Philosophically? No, I don’t think there’s a difference, and that you do only confirms my belief that the kinds of rhetoric and tactics you support do more harm than good.
If my “realness” is denied merely because I disagree with a type of tactic, then why are you so surprised that an unborn child’s realness is denied for any number of reasons?
When you speak like this, pro-choicers see hypocrites. You confirm all the negative stereotypes.
Now your’e claiming I’m lying when I say I’m prolife because I won’t agree with you.
Is this your witness? Really? You think that’s effective? Are you serious? Are you willing to answer for your claims to God Himself? You can justify more deceit and dishonesty and tell Him how your calling me a liar and insisting I’m not a real human being is how you showed the world how respectful of life you are?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:03 PM
You are right and I was just thinking the same thing.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 2:03 PM
No funds to PP are “earmarked for abortions”, taxpayer funded or otherwise.
No, nothing is uglier than abortion. But that’s not an excuse to do ANYTHING in the name of fighting abortion.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:05 PM
Got ourselves a concern troll. Just a more literate one, but still a concern troll.
kim roy on June 6, 2012 at 2:07 PM
I think you are a liar and it would be dishonest of me to pretend otherwise. Jesus told the people this:
“You hypocrites! You know how to analyze the appearance of the earth and the sky, but why do you not analyze this present time? And why do you not even on your own initiative judge what is right?” (Luke 12:56-57)
You are apparently concerned about the semantics of what Lila Rose is doing at the expense of the purpose of her group’s action, just as Jesus railed against in the above quotation.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 2:10 PM
Translation: Its too hard to get them to stop, so I dont even want to try. Please don’t make a fuss, they might get angry at us for slowing down the murder.
(pls note that I believe carolina may not actually call it murder but I am taking her words at face value on that one)
airmonkey on June 6, 2012 at 2:10 PM
You’re misapplying the scripture. I’m not analyzing the “appearance” of Rose’s actions (although you are). I’m analyzing the fruits of Rose’s actions.
You just claimed I’m a liar and that I’m not prolife.
Justify that statement — on what do you base your assertion that I am not prolife? And if your answer is that I don’t agree with Lila Rose’s tactics, then explain how you’re not the guilty party Christ is addressing in that scripture?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:14 PM
You’re wrong. Short of violence or breaking the law, the pro-life movement will continue to do whatever it takes until abortion is again illegal in this country. Just wait until November when the Republicans re-take the White House and Senate. All we need is one more Supreme Court seat (and possibly not even that) and Roe v. Wade will be consigned to the dustbin of history alongside the works of Mengele. And on that glorious day, God indeed will smile upon this nation.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 2:15 PM
I agree. It gives me grave concern that these clinics can be so deceitful in the way they conduct their practice, encouraging women to perjure themselves for the sake of legal protection, and hiding behind a flimsy excuse for the truth. And the lack of Christ in the way they end human life for profit, even to the point of trying to plead ignorance to circumvent the law, is nothing short of appalling.
Thank you for pointing this out.
The Schaef on June 6, 2012 at 2:16 PM
So…you just said I’m wrong when I said we cannot justify any and every tactic when it comes to fighting abortion just because abortion is so evil, and then you said that there were certain things we can’t do…
So which is it — can we justify ANYTHING or are there some things we cannot justify? Seems like you yourself set some parameters when it comes to fighting abortion, yet you have done nothing but rail against me doing the same thing.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:18 PM
Do you have proof that it hasn’t?
Guess all we currently have for proof is the growing % of Americans that are pro-life and all of the state and national bills/votes being performed to reign in money and access to abortions. But I’m sure videos like this have in no way influenced that…
nextgen_repub on June 6, 2012 at 2:22 PM
You have had nothing to say about the fact that these abortion workers are happily engaged in helping this woman break the law in order to kill her baby for the crime of being female. All you do is squawk about the ‘tactics’ involved in presumably recording their words and about how you are being perceived. That is exactly what Jesus was talking about when he admonished the crowds to stop wasting time ‘analyzing’ things that do not matter and focus on acknowledging right from wrong.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 2:23 PM
I think it was adequately explained to you. The sound of your handwringing is becoming a little too obvious now.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 2:23 PM
Again you are merely deflecting from the issue. There is a huge difference between advocating violence and advocating undercover ‘stings’ in order to catch out illegal activities. Or are you trying to make a case for the undercover camera recordings being ‘violent or illegal?’ Those are not “parameters” that I pulled out of a hat.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 2:27 PM
Yes, dear, but I asked you to prove that I’m lying about being prolife.
That I don’t agree with Lila Rose’s tactics is not proof that I’m not prolife.
Again, prove that I’m not prolife. You’re making a pretty hateful claim about me, and I’m asking you pretty darned nicely to at least justify that claim.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:27 PM
Two groups I can always count on to use the Reductio ad Hitlerum tactic: animal rights activists and pro-life activists.
theoddmanout on June 6, 2012 at 2:29 PM
My parameters aren’t parameters I “pulled out of a hat”, either.
My point is that you do allow for diversity when it comes to opinions on what are and are not appropriate and/or effective tactics when it comes to being a prolifer…except when that “diversity” doesn’t jibe with your personal opinion.
Also, you’ve called me a liar, and I’ve asked you to prove this pretty hateful and ugly claim.
Your response, please?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:31 PM
Carolina21 –
You continue to harp on how much you dislike the tactics , and yet even though you’ve been asked repeatedly what would you do , you have avoided the question. Consistantly deflecting and changing the subject. So simply , if you so dislike the “gotcha journalism” , what is the answer? What would YOU do to root out the evil being committed by these “murder mills”?
TXChas on June 6, 2012 at 2:33 PM
kim roy is right. Concern troll and going nowhere.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 2:35 PM
Well, I haven’t been “asked repeatedly” what I would do, nor have I been asked what I’d do without also being told I wasn’t a real woman, or a real human being, or called a liar, or a “concern troll”, etc.
I don’t believe in fighting this battle in the political arena. Roe v. Wade is here to stay, legalized abortion is not going away, and PP is here to stay, as well.
We can reach young women, however, by not dragging them into political fights in lieu of witnessing to them Christ’s message for the whole person — not just their reproductive organs, and not just when they’re dealing with a crisis pregnancy.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:39 PM
Murder is murder is murder is murder is murder … whether the murder is committed based mainly on the gender of the victim (usually female), or, simply as a result of the selfish desires and lack of morals of some Godless, liberal tramp, it is still murder. It is time to outlaw abortion and shut down the liberals’ murder-for-profit industry.
Pork-Chop on June 6, 2012 at 2:42 PM
The mask slips.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 2:48 PM
That’s fine, but we’re talking about young women and girls who are at this moment sitting in a Planned Parenthood clinic, being lied to and being counseled to break the law.
Your tactic is commendable and I believe in it. Teaching anyone about God’s love is the right thing to do. Stick with it, but stop whining about the folks who are called to confront evil head on.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 2:49 PM
Spiritof61, how many young women who chose NOT to abort are you supporting right now? And how many am I supporting right now?
Facts, please.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:50 PM
Wait, so where’s the part of the video where Lila Rose saves all these young girls who were sitting in the waiting room while she was there? How come I don’t see that on the video?
Lila Rose isn’t “confronting evil head on”. What has she genuinely, truly, materially done to prevent one single, actual about-to-happen abortion? What? Who is she supporting? To whom is she writing checks? How many babies did she care for without pay so their mothers could continue school?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 2:54 PM
WOW , it must be nice to live in a world where all you have to do is talk to people and BOOM everything changes. If we don’t not fight this politically nothing will ever change. We CAN do away with Roe v. Wade and PP , but it has to be done politically.
I would hate to know what your methods to get rid of terrorists is , let me guess , if we “hold them , and squeeze them , and pet them and call them George” they won’t try to kill us.
TXChas on June 6, 2012 at 2:54 PM
Again, you chatter in circles without saying anything. I pray for the people you claim to be helping.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 2:57 PM
Carolina21, you are either 1) a fool, 2) a troll, or 3) a well-meaning but somewhat deluded person. I’m leaning toward a mixture of 1) and 2), but my policy is not to engage in direct debate with any of these personas.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 3:00 PM
It would be nice to live in that world, but I never claimed we did.
What do politics have to do with a single human heart, a single human soul?
Roe v. Wade has been challenged and still stands, it’s not likely to go away. Shutting down PP doesn’t end abortion.
Showing young women to value themselves based on who they are in the eyes of God rather than the eyes of some salacious boys and men does more in the long run to turn the tide in the abortion debate than “gotcha” videos and political posturing.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:01 PM
You still haven’t answered the question I (along with several others) asked more than 2 hours ago.
GeorgieGirl9 on June 6, 2012 at 3:01 PM
I think this person is a liberal “Catholic” who is trying to justify her beliefs. I also think she lies a lot.
Vince on June 6, 2012 at 3:03 PM
No, actually, as your behavior here proves, you are more than happy to “engage” when you’re just gleefully calling names and criticizing.
You only stop “engaging” when your target asks you to put your money where your loud, jeering mouth is.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:04 PM
Corrupt, perpetually drunk, crazy pelosi: “My Catholic religion requires me to support murdering unborn fetuses if the parents don’t like it’s gender, don’t like it’s hair color, don’t like it’s eye color, are afraid it might grow up to be a Republican or worse: a job-creating capitalist, etc, etc, etc… This is a “women’s health” issue, and therefore is not open to further discussion !”
TeaPartyNation on June 6, 2012 at 3:05 PM
…. and a feminazee also.
Vince on June 6, 2012 at 3:05 PM
I’m neither liberal nor Catholic.
Can you please substantiate your assertion that I am either of those things? Is it the quote you highlighted?
I’m liberal and/or Catholic because I don’t think it’s okay to do ANYTHING in the name of the prolife movement? What’s particularly liberal or Catholic about that statement?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:06 PM
I’ll ask you point-blank: Do you believe that abortions should be safe and legal?
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:08 PM
The further along this goes, the more I think we’re talking to the Planned Parenthood woman pictured on the main page, starting this thread.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 3:08 PM
What’s “feminazee” about thinking young women shouldn’t value themselves based on how a man or boy views their body?
Are you promoting the objectification of the human person, women in particular — very young women, actually, in particular?
What does that make you?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:09 PM
@GeorgieGal
Yes, I have answered that question, just not to you.
You don’t even think I’m a real human being, so why are you asking me to answer questions?
Also, until you justify your statement that I am not a real person because I don’t agree with you, why should I answer anything you ask?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:11 PM
Oh dear…Oh deary…
tom daschle concerned on June 6, 2012 at 3:11 PM
.
The hardcore gay activists have been claiming for years that homosexuality is something you are “born with” or otherwise predisposed to live as. In other words it’s genetic; can’t be helped.
I think that’s a crock of (expletive), BUT . . . . . . just for the sake of argument let’s say (hypothetically) that homosexuality is something genetic.
We’ve already mapped the human genome, so by their theory we should be able to successfully perform a test on fetal tissue to predetermine the developing babies “sexual preference”. And if the test comes up “positive” for homosexual predisposition, the mother then could decide to abort (kill) the baby in her womb just on that basis alone.
You’re onto something there, redzap.
They would go totally BESERK !
DISCLAIMER: I personally don’t believe that homosexuality is a genetic predisposition, nor am I pro-
choicedeath . This is just a hypothetical “what if”.listens2glenn on June 6, 2012 at 3:12 PM
Again, another hateful, libelous claim about me.
Facts, please. Substantiate your assertion that I am _that_ woman in the video.
Proof, please. That’s a deliberately slanderous statement, and you really are going to have to provide proof that I am indeed that woman.
Go ahead. Prove it.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:13 PM
I’ll ask you point-blank: Do you believe that abortion should be safe and legal?
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:14 PM
Yep. Definitely a concern troll, but she’s getting too excited now. The personalization, the endless strings of deflective questions are tells. She was doing fairly well for an hour back there but then came 2:39 p.m.
Reminds me of some liberal Catholic nuns I know.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 3:17 PM
No.
But that horse has left the barn.
Abortion IS safe and legal, and is likely to remain so for a very long time, if not forever.
So now what? Do we just allow the abortion mindset to be the norm for generation after generation all while we beat away at a dead horse trying to get Roe v. Wade overturned?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:18 PM
So you don’t think that abortion should be safe and legal? Not even in cases of rape and incest?
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:19 PM
That’s just one of the time bombs hidden in the “seamless garment” liberals wear. Paradox? You bet. Once the “gay gene” is identified (it won’t be, because there isn’t one) you would then be able to select it out via Planned Parenthood’s Favorite Women’s Health Service.
Sounds like a job for protective legislation.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 3:22 PM
You are certainly a big one for making sweeping, unsubstantiated statements. Read this from TPM, the Leftist of the Lefts:
That’s from Talking Points Memo, not a pro-life site.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:24 PM
Nope, although I find the rape/incest cases heartbreaking and I’m not sure what the answer is in those situations. I suspect they should be handled privately and with a great deal of prayer.
I do not believe abortion-on-demand should be legal (asking if I think it should be “safe” is a bizarre question, IMO — regardless of my beliefs, I certainly don’t wish physical harm to a girl who gets an abortion), however.
But, as I said, that horse left the barn a long time ago, and that’s not the primary fight we have on our hands, nor do I think it’s one we can win.
And that’s the place I’m working from, because that’s where we are and what we have to deal with.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:25 PM
So what?
If you believe Roe v. Wade can be overturned, outline your case, based on constitutional law, against it and see if it holds up — so far the challenges haven’t held up, and they haven’t held up with the conservative judges already on the bench.
If you think you can mount a viable challenge to Roe v. Wade in the Supreme Court, more power to you. Go for it.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:28 PM
Many researchers believe that homosexuality results from excessive androgen exposure in utero. This is something that could be measured and determined in an individual prior to birth. If that is the case, certainly there are those who would not wish to have a gay child if given the “choice.”
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:28 PM
You can’t be the woman in the video. Nobody in their right mind would make babies with that thing.
The Rogue Tomato on June 6, 2012 at 3:28 PM
Wow. You sound like you’re really involved in the movement to educate women and girls about abortion. What kinds of groups are you involved with? I donate to pro-life groups (of course), but I’d love to do more, too.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:30 PM
Yeah, the dividing may have already been done, but the best debaters understand that you don’t play the hand others want you to play just because that desire exists.
It’s engaging in emotionalism/political gamemanship to indulge an argument about how some abortions done for completely selfish reasons might somehow be more offensive than others, which hurts the purity of the anti-abortion movement, just like failing to distinguish between abortions which are done completely for selfish reasons from those which are done when non-consensual sex caused the pregnancy and when the health of the potential mother is a legitimate issue does…
Bizarro No. 1 on June 6, 2012 at 3:30 PM
So she’s a “thing”, but you want people to respect life, to see the humanity in a baby they can barely see?
Do you see why Satan dances with delight when people make comments like that?
Do you want your daughters to be judged based on the same criteria — things to be used for sex?
You can’t pick and choose who gets to be human enough for you. Once you do, you’re the same as an abortion provider, and you’re contributing to the same mindset that considers some people less worthy of life than others.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:32 PM
You say
yet you display a lack of knowledge of the character and actions of Christ (you made an assertion about Him but had no response to my rebuttal). You started in the thread by name calling and making slanderous claims against me and others, and now you feign offense.
Like I said before, I pray for the people you claim to help. You’ve demonstrated that you’re either naive or just dense.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 3:35 PM
Well, as a matter of fact I did write what I felt was a fairly strong critique of Roe v. Wade for ConLaw back when I was in law school. But to be honest, it relied heavily on this. Read through that and you’ll certainly understand where we’re coming from.
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:36 PM
Aw, cut her some slack. There’s a cute little heart on her white coat for every fetus she’s stuffed into the biohazard bag.
spiritof61 on June 6, 2012 at 3:37 PM
Locally, I work with a group home for young women who’ve chosen not to abort, I personally pay tuition for several young women who’ve chosen not to abort, I work with a group that helps young ladies in these situations to find good-paying jobs, line up daycare, etc. I’ve cared for the babies of a few girls until they’ve been able to stabilize their situations, and I support similar services across the country financially.
I also support programs (both locally and nationally — and I just contributed to a group in Haiti that my niece volunteers with) — that work with at-risk groups of young women, getting them into private schools, providing them with positive after-school activities, and so on, in order to give the most at-risk girls options other than early sexual activity.
There are plenty of ways to reach young women and to give them better options before they have sex, and even after they’ve become pregnant.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:39 PM
I disagree. This puts a face on the child, while simultaneously exposing the lie that it’s about “women’s health”. The argument unto itself might seem self-defeating, until one realizes that nearly ALL abortions take place for “selfish reasons”, when defined as “non-life-threatening”.
The conversation has been at a stalemate for the better part of two decades now; we need some kind of catalyst to get people to stop and take a genuine look at how abortion affects real humans, including the survivors.
The Schaef on June 6, 2012 at 3:39 PM
Welp, have fun embarking on your crusade to change the way people post comments on an Internet forum, while at the same time criticizing Ms. Rose for engaging in a practice that tries to change the discussion but does not directly intervene on anyone’s behalf.
The Schaef on June 6, 2012 at 3:41 PM
Take a look at your first response to me and tell me exactly what kind of response it deserved.
We’re talking about abortion and Lila Rose’s video, and out of the blue, you barrel in and make all kinds of loony comments about something about Palin and McCain, or something, which had nothing to do with anything. What did you expect?
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:43 PM
Truly commendable. What part of Carolina are you in?
cynccook on June 6, 2012 at 3:43 PM
Guys, please dont feed the concern-trolls!
Valkyriepundit on June 6, 2012 at 3:43 PM
I’m not crusading to change the ways people in comboxes respond. I am criticizing you personally for behaving a certain way.
I am also criticizing a behavior made by a person who is seeking publicity via that same behavior.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:46 PM
I’m not in either of the Carolinas.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:47 PM
An answer. The truth. You to have the self-respect to drop out because all you have is whine and you know it.
AubieJon on June 6, 2012 at 3:47 PM
The value of “this particular journalistic tactic” is that it proves that abortionists and their employees are liars and criminals who will say and do anything to make a buck from the suffering of mothers and babies.
The Lila Rose stings have proven that these death chambers disobey the law whenever they please, for example, by refusing to notify law enforcement about suspected sexual abuse of minors — and now, by not refusing to abort babies for sex-selection purposes.
Such revelations are a valuable public service. If abortion mills cared about young women, they would report cases of sexual exploitation. And if they cared about babies…
If this were 1850 and Matthew Brady had taken clandestine photos of slaves being killed by their masters, would Carolina2 have scorned his findings?
KyMouse on June 6, 2012 at 3:48 PM
An answer? To your first comment to me? Um, like I said, that coment got the response it deserved. If you don’t like it, feel free to ignore it, me, all my comments, whatever.
Carolina21 on June 6, 2012 at 3:49 PM
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