Support for abortion drops to record low

posted at 11:21 am on May 23, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

A new Gallup poll shows that the pro-life position has once again reclaimed — narrowly — the majority among American adults.  Support for abortion dropped to its lowest level in the 18-year polling series, and the pro-life view gained among all partisan groups:

The 41% of Americans who now identify themselves as “pro-choice” is down from 47% last July and is one percentage point below the previous record low in Gallup trends, recorded in May 2009. Fifty percent now call themselves “pro-life,” one point shy of the record high, also from May 2009.

Gallup began asking Americans to define themselves as pro-choice or pro-life on abortion in 1995, and since then, identification with the labels has shifted from a wide lead for the pro-choice position in the mid-1990s, to a generally narrower lead for “pro-choice” — from 1998 through 2008 — to a close division between the two positions since 2009. However, in the last period, Gallup has found the pro-life position significantly ahead on two occasions, once in May 2009 and again today. It remains to be seen whether the pro-life spike found this month proves temporary, as it did in 2009, or is sustained for some period.

Actually, the trending on this has been in motion for several years, as the Gallup chart demonstrates:

This could reverse in the future, but the overall trend is falling support for abortion and rising support for pro-life positions.  The same trend can be seen in the partisan demos.  Republicans have backed the pro-life position all along, but support for abortion ran in the 30s until 2009, and has now declined to a new low of 22%.  The change has been less dramatic among Democrats, but support for abortion dropped to 58% in this poll, a decline of ten points in the last year and the lowest since 2003.  Independents now favor the pro-life position 47/41, a dramatic shift from last years’ 51/41 support for abortion, and the trend lines for independents roughly mirror the trends of the overall population.

We are seeing a societal shift in attitudes in abortion.  While a majority believe that abortion should be legal under certain circumstances, that number has been slowly drifting downward over the series, too, although the “legal in any circumstance” proportion has held steady in the mid-20s.  People seem more willing to identify as pro-life despite an overwhelming media and cultural bias in favor of abortion as a liberty issue.  With the US conducting over a million abortions every year and people gain a clearer understanding of the development of children in utero, the practice cannot help seem more and more barbaric.  We may still see some hiccups and occasional spikes in the wrong direction, but the long-term prospects for abortion support look almost as grim as abortion itself.


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Won’t stop NOW from making those cool signs.

LeftCoastRight on May 23, 2012 at 11:22 AM

Kermit Gosnell has that effect…

Gatsu on May 23, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Who cares about a poll? Planned Parenthood isn’t going away; it has the full support of the U.S. government.

spiritof61 on May 23, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Who’s on the wrong side of history now?

Brian.oco1 on May 23, 2012 at 11:25 AM

Dr. Kermit Gosnell and his practicing of murdering born-alive infants of minority mothers may have something to do with this. Abortion is a heinous, murderous practice. The blood of thousands, hundreds of thousands millions of children are on the hands of those who support, fund, perform and agree to these procedures.

ted c on May 23, 2012 at 11:26 AM

People seem more willing to identify as pro-life despite an overwhelming media and cultural bias in favor of abortion as a liberty issue.

Abortion is a liberty issue. The right to life is the first and most important right. It trumps all other rights.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 11:27 AM

War on women going gangbusters

cmsinaz on May 23, 2012 at 11:28 AM

Discard: “Abortion must be legal because it is the majority will of the people.”

Adopt: “Abortion must be legal to protect the rights of a repressed minority.”

Funny how a polling percentage grants moral authority regardless of what that number is.

The Schaef on May 23, 2012 at 11:29 AM

Abortion is a liberty issue. The right to life is the first and most important right. It trumps precedes all other rights.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 11:27 AM

I agree with you, slight modification.

ted c on May 23, 2012 at 11:29 AM

Has anyone consulted Julia for her opinion? I mean, it’s all about her, right?

VastRightWingConspirator on May 23, 2012 at 11:30 AM

I agree with you, slight modification.

ted c on May 23, 2012 at 11:29 AM

OK, but when rights come into conflict in a legal setting life wins. The loan exception being prenatal murder.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 11:31 AM

Let me see, the pro-abortion crowd eliminates their children. The pro-life crowd gets bigger.

Why yes, eventually, the people who want children will outnumber the ones who don’t want kids. Demographics are brutal.

See Europe. European birthrate is below replacemetn levels, Islamic immigrants are having lots of kids. Guess what?

patch on May 23, 2012 at 11:31 AM

Dr. Kermit Gosnell and his practicing of murdering born-alive infants of minority mothers may have something to do with this. Abortion is a heinous, murderous practice. The blood of thousands, hundreds of thousands millions of children are on the hands of those who support, fund, perform and agree to these procedures.

ted c on May 23, 2012 at 11:26 AM

You are absolutely correct. It is about time that people understand that life begins at conception, and that abortion is murder, regardless of the age of the fetus. Committing murder is a sin, even in this very sinful society we live in.

chai on May 23, 2012 at 11:31 AM

Hmmmm. It might be time for one of our Superpacs to educate the electorate on what the Born Alive Infance Protection Act wass and which IL state Senator thrice voted against it.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:32 AM

*Infant

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:32 AM

I continue to pray to God that more individuals come to their senses and recognize abortion as the heinous, hideous act that it is.

And for all the souls whose lives have been taken from them by this hideous act.

The more of a majority we have as a nation who refuse support for abortion, the more we will have voter support to both defund Planned Parenthood and to bring their monstrously destructive deeds to an end.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

As I said in the Headlines comments, the bolder the pro-abortionists get with their rhetoric(like articles talking about how glad they are that they got abortions because they were just too damned busy to deal with another human being), the more they push those who waver pro-choice to the other side. After a while, even those who want abortion to remain legal are sickened by the depravity of the “pro-choice” crowd.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Who cares about a poll? Planned Parenthood isn’t going away; it has the full support of the U.S. government.

spiritof61 on May 23, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Agreed. Polls are crap.

What was the actual rate of decrease?

deedtrader on May 23, 2012 at 11:34 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Are you being sarcastic, or just incredibly foolish? Next you’re going to say that people just don’t change their minds on gun control…yet support for gun control has been steadily decreasing since the 50s.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:35 AM

As I said in the Headlines comments, the bolder the pro-abortionists get with their rhetoric(like articles talking about how glad they are that they got abortions because they were just too damned busy to deal with another human being), the more they push those who waver pro-choice to the other side. After a while, even those who want abortion to remain legal are sickened by the depravity of the “pro-choice” crowd.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

I would love to see some polling on Sarah Silverman’s latest stunt among those where were on the fence.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Hmmmm. It might be time for one of our Superpacs to educate the electorate on what the Born Alive Infance Protection Act wass and which IL state Senator thrice voted against it.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:32 AM

Yes, agreed. That (former) Illinois State Senator’s name is Barack Obama. He is known as “the most ardent of pro-abortion” legislators and more people need to know this about him. His record, as also his wife’s, is as what I’d call “a fanatical supporter” of abortion. It’s cryptic to what degree his (and his wife’s) support for abortion — AND the “Born Alive” issue regards abortion attempts — is.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:36 AM

It only makes sense, as pro-choice people keep killing their babies they have less to pass their views onto.

tvor03 on May 23, 2012 at 11:36 AM

This old mind remembers some poll that was close to 79% against it when the Supreme Court created the absurd right to kill our offspring from emanations from penumbras (from thin air in non-legal honest discourse) I guess abortion is like drugs -when you’re doing it who cares about right or wrong?

Don L on May 23, 2012 at 11:36 AM

Good news. Pro-life educational efforts through the years are making a difference.

WannabeAnglican on May 23, 2012 at 11:37 AM

I would love to see some polling on Sarah Silverman’s latest stunt among those where were on the fence.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Polling the 10 people who watch Sarah Silverman seems kind of pointless.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 11:38 AM

It’s almost too general a question to ask someone “are you pro-life or pro-choice?”…same with asking about the morality of abortion. There are too many variable to consider…some pro-choicers would be against late-term abortion, and some pro-lifers (like myself) find exemptions in the effects of carrying to term endangering the mother’s life, or in cases of rape. Some pro-lifers see no valid excuse to abort under any circumstance.

In any event, if this poll is accurate…or even close to accurate…it’s a good sign overall.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 11:39 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Bernard Nathanson and Abby Johnson would disagree. No, even people who are invested in an issue can change, and radically.

Bracketing for a moment what can only be described as conversions, the majority of Americans are deeply ambivalent on the issue. All it takes there–on any issue–is time and some nudging.

DRPrice on May 23, 2012 at 11:39 AM

I would love to see some polling on Sarah Silverman’s latest stunt among those where were on the fence.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Sarah who? I heard some of her crap years ago and have ignored her ever since. That c**t makes Rosie O’Donnell seem reasonable.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:40 AM

It only makes sense, as pro-choice people keep killing their babies they have less to pass their views onto.

tvor03 on May 23, 2012 at 11:36 AM

Likely explains a lot of their fever in clinging to public education as vehicle for their message.

I also think that this explains a good amount of the support for “importing replacement populations” — what’s imported is an ever-lowering learning ability and productivity but they sure do provide for increased followers, so to speak: easier to manipulate.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:41 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Norma McCorvey…

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 11:42 AM

It’s almost too general a question to ask someone “are you pro-life or pro-choice?”…same with asking about the morality of abortion. There are too many variable to consider…

No, not at all. One is either pro-life or pro-death.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:42 AM

WHERE DO THE ATHEISTS GO ?????????????????

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:44 AM

No, not at all. One is either pro-life or pro-death.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:42 AM

Wow. As deep as a bottle cap half-full of water.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:44 AM

I realize that I’m in the minority of pro-lifers when it comes to the issue of abortion in cases of rape and incest But if one is opposed to abortion because it’s the heinous taking of an innocent life, it really doesn’t matter how that life came into being…it’s still a human life and that’s what we’re talking about protecting here. Why make exceptions and allow the execution of innocent victims of rape or incest?

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:45 AM

I smell an “I have Sara Palin” retaliation piece coming around 4pm EST.

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:45 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Sonograms.

monalisa on May 23, 2012 at 11:46 AM

“Why make exceptions and allow the execution of innocent victims of rape or incest?”

Why catagorize incest? Is incest rape or not????

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:46 AM

Sarah who? I heard some of her crap years ago and have ignored her ever since. That c**t makes Rosie O’Donnell seem reasonable.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:40 AM

This prize.

As NotCoach points out, her audience is small, but I would imagine those unfamiliar with her would be horrified by her antics.

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:47 AM

No, not at all. One is either pro-life or pro-death.

Lourdes on May 23, 2012 at 11:42 AM

But at what point is one “pro life” or “pro death” if, for example, a mother is told by her doctors that if she carries her baby to full term, there’s a very good chance she will die? Either option will result in a death. Is the mother to be sacrificed, or the baby?

And as for rape, I couldn’t imagine forcing a rape victim to carry her rapists baby to term. An abortion in that case is still evil, and the rape was evil as well. So, the choice is really trying to choose the lesser of two evils, and allowing the rape victim to abort.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 11:48 AM

Why catagorize incest? Is incest rape or not????

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:46 AM

I agree with you. Incest is rape. I used the categorization because many who believe in exceptions use the words “rape and incest”, so I wanted to be sure to address them all.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:49 AM

Congratulations on the trend. May it continue.

Bmore on May 23, 2012 at 11:50 AM

” Incest is rape.”

How do you know?

It can be consensual too. Sick and demented….but consensual

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:51 AM

Yet more evidence that a prog future will not be our future.

NoDonkey on May 23, 2012 at 11:53 AM

Kataklysmic on May 23, 2012 at 11:47 AM

About what I expect from that thing. I swear, she’d videotape herself banging a dog if she thought she could pass it off as a “joke”.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:54 AM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Of course they do.

When I was in my teens and twenties, I wholeheartedly supported abortion.

Now that I have children of my own, I am completely against it.

Real world experience separated from academia, contributed heavily to my conversion.

NoDonkey on May 23, 2012 at 11:55 AM

50 years from now we will look t abortion on demand the way we look at eugenics today

cpaulus on May 23, 2012 at 11:56 AM

It’s too bad that Romney is so wishy-washy on abortion – it would be great to have a staunch pro-life nominee to stand up to obama and his abortionists heading into November. Romney cannot effectively tap into the pro-life trend in America.

Pork-Chop on May 23, 2012 at 11:58 AM

But at what point is one “pro life” or “pro death” if, for example, a mother is told by her doctors that if she carries her baby to full term, there’s a very good chance she will die? Either option will result in a death. Is the mother to be sacrificed, or the baby?

And as for rape, I couldn’t imagine forcing a rape victim to carry her rapists baby to term. An abortion in that case is still evil, and the rape was evil as well. So, the choice is really trying to choose the lesser of two evils, and allowing the rape victim to abort.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 11:48 AM

I understand your points and can only say that, coming to my views on abortion from a Christian perspective, I may have a different viewpoint than you. So bear with me and I hope you can appreciate where I’m coming from.

In the first case, you’re correct, either option may result in a death…the mother’s or the child’s. If one believes in the sanctity of human life from conception to natural death, the answer is quite obvious. It’s not our decision to choose who should be “sacrificed”.

In the second case, I agree with you fully that rape is evil and so is abortion. I don’t understand the concept of compounding one evil (rape) with another (abortion).

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

50 years from now we will look t abortion on demand the way we look at eugenics today

cpaulus on May 23, 2012 at 11:56 AM

I’ve already been looking at them as part of the same movement for years. Planned Parenthood used to be the American Birth Control League, a publicly pro-eugenics outfit founded by eugenics champion Margaret Sanger.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

I just have to add…the signs that read “Keep abortion safe…”

The irony just pours out of that one like an epic flood.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

As others have noted, people can change their minds. Also, the poll no doubt takes into account new people being polled (teens). So, every year or so that the poll is taken, in theory there are a fresh batch of teens to affect the poll.

As Ed notes, there are a couple of factors no doubt playing into why support for abortion is slowly trending downwards. Media and ideologues continually pushing pro-abort view, even to the point of being sickeningly obtuse, science (as compared to Science!) and continued improvements in medicine, and demographics… liberals are just breeding themselves out of existence.

The problem with the abortion view is that it uses the fallacious “logic” of relativism with a sliding scale of value and worth.

Logus on May 23, 2012 at 12:00 PM

Two things I think of, the availability of ultra sound, to see the little baby, and the reduction in the stigma of being a single mother, might be leading to this.

There are surely a lot of things gone wrong in the rise of single motherhood, but life isn’t one of them.

Fleuries on May 23, 2012 at 12:01 PM

” Incest is rape.”

How do you know?

It can be consensual too. Sick and demented….but consensual

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 11:51 AM

Whatever…the point is that human life conceived under any circumstances, is still human life and deserves to live.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 12:01 PM

“50 years from now we will look t abortion on demand the way we look at eugenics today”

No way. I say 10 years from now.

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 12:01 PM

“Whatever…the point is that human life conceived under any circumstances, is still human life and deserves to live.”

AMEN!

Eph on May 23, 2012 at 12:02 PM

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

Nail. Head.

+1000

Logus on May 23, 2012 at 12:03 PM

Who out there thinks that criminalizing abortion would be easier to enforce than, say, criminalizing pot?

wbcoleman on May 23, 2012 at 12:04 PM

50 years from now we will look t abortion on demand the way we look at eugenics today

cpaulus on May 23, 2012 at 11:56 AM

And leftists will relabel themselves conservatives and try to claim us classical liberals were the ones who loved abortion.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:05 PM

this makes sense. first, abortion seems like something out of the dark ages meant for people still living in the dark ages. with so much information available today, for anyone to have an unwanted pregnancy is just unbelievable. those people are just full of bad decisions and i think most people realize this.

when you consider that more and more families are having difficulty in conceiving, it just makes it difficult to support something like abortion.

jetch on May 23, 2012 at 12:06 PM

What I would like to see when a question like this is asked is a better distinction between the legality and morality of abortion.

When someone says they are “pro-life”, does that mean they just think abortion is wrong, or does it mean they think it’s both wrong and should be illegal in nearly all cases?

BradTank on May 23, 2012 at 12:06 PM

odd, I never got that impression that this was the case. I wonder why…

joeindc44 on May 23, 2012 at 12:07 PM

If I asked the questions the opposite would be true.
Polls are dependable as the questions.

lilium479 on May 23, 2012 at 12:07 PM

Who out there thinks that criminalizing abortion would be easier to enforce than, say, criminalizing pot?

wbcoleman on May 23, 2012 at 12:04 PM

Does it matter? We can argue about the legitimacy of keeping pot illegal until the sun implodes, but that is purely a political question. Abortion is a liberty issue just as murder or any other violent crime is. Yet those crimes being illegal does not prevent them, but it does reduce their likelihood. Respect the liberties of the unborn under the law and deal with those on a case by case basis who violate those liberties just like we do with the rest of the criminal code.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:09 PM

Seems safe to say that efforts from new GOP legislatures pushing pro-life bills aren’t backfiring.

theperfecteconomist on May 23, 2012 at 12:11 PM

I understand your points and can only say that, coming to my views on abortion from a Christian perspective, I may have a different viewpoint than you. So bear with me and I hope you can appreciate where I’m coming from.

In the first case, you’re correct, either option may result in a death…the mother’s or the child’s. If one believes in the sanctity of human life from conception to natural death, the answer is quite obvious. It’s not our decision to choose who should be “sacrificed”.

In the second case, I agree with you fully that rape is evil and so is abortion. I don’t understand the concept of compounding one evil (rape) with another (abortion).

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

I’m getting no work accomplished today anyway :/ …so here goes…

As I’m sure you can remember, I’m a Christian as well (Catholic) but my pro-life stance doesn’t so much come from my faith’s core belief on the issue of abortion, but is a result of me believing that the right to life is a human rights issue, and abortion on demand is akin to legalized genocide/infanticide.

Now, it seems to me you’re saying that we let whatever happens happen in the case of saving the mother or the baby, as it’s “God’s will”. Correct me if I’m wrong tho. I do know the Catholic position had for ages been to save the child over the mother, but Vatican II in the 1960′s changed that, saving the mother over the child.

Again, I totally agree that it’s a tough choice either way, and not an easy one for most people on either side to fully grasp.

And with the rape victim, again I totally agree that there are two evils there. The mother, through no fault of her own, is raped and gets pregnant as a result. Just the psychological damage alone on the mother’s part could be immense…and only increased by having her carry to term. She is here already, and deserves to have a life of her own. To make her give birth to her rapists baby…I just cannot and would not wish that on anyone.

True, it’s still taking a life, but again, it depends on which side you see as the worst evil. I’m not arguing with you here, as this is as touchy a subject one can talk about, and no answer is an easily formed one. Bottom line I think we both can agree on…abortion on demand is first degree murder, plain and simple, and it’s to our nation’s shame our government allows it to happen.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:13 PM

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

Mild disagreement on these points:
First, I believe that our lives are gifts from God. God expects us to care for and protect them. I believe this protection can extend to even killing a child in the womb if that child is killing you. Yes, the child is innocent and there is no intent to do harm. This is similar to shooting someone who is so out of their minds they don’t even know they are spraying bullets from an AK in a schoolyard. This doesn’t mean that I believe you are obligated to terminate the baby, just that I don’t think it’s a sin to save your own life.
Second, The baby that is a product of rape is not guilty of anything and in almost all cases, won’t kill the mother if brought to term. The justification to kill this baby is emotion-based, not life-based. A far weaker justification.

SKYFOX on May 23, 2012 at 12:15 PM

Simply not being pro choice doesn’t mean you’re pro life.

I think both positions are probably too extreme. If I had to choose between the two, I’d go pro choice. I believe in freedom… it’s a core belief for me. But I can see some arguments for restricting it under some circumstances. Everyone brings up the horror stories on BOTH sides. And I think we can all agree we don’t want a 12 year old girl that was raped by her uncle to be forced to have the child or for that matter to facilitate some crazy person that wants to have a couple late term abortions every year.

Again, if I had to choose, I’d just say do what you want and let the consequences be upon the heads of those that choose. But there are valid arguments on both sides.

I really think most people are just tired of this issue. Maybe that’s me projecting on it. But I don’t really care about abortion. It’s not an important issue for me. It’s legal now so the people that want it can get it… and the counter arguments are less important then many other national issues. Just chill and lets focus on something more relevant right now. The American nation is on fire… it is burning. Once we’ve put the fire out we can worry about what color we paint the house or whether to change the carpets.

Karmashock on May 23, 2012 at 12:17 PM

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 11:59 AM

Sorry…wanted to add that during my own birth, my mother had lost so much blood the doctors didn’t expect her to make it. She even had a priest come into the delivery room reading her the “last rites”. I was already mostly out, so the choice was clear…my mom would have died giving birth to me.

She made it…and had to get approval from the Vatican to have the “tube tie” operation, as the doctors said if she tried to give birth again she wouldn’t make it. In a way, it was a miracle she survived.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:18 PM

but the long-term prospects for abortion support look almost as grim as abortion itself.

Viewpoints are one thing.

Ask people if they want the government to be in charge of pregnancy and see what happens. Put it on a ballot.

An abortion ban is the gay marriage of the right. A minority is oh-so-convinced that they are the mainstream even though that would lose on any ballot in any state.

There is also the inconvenient fact that the demand for abortion is still there regardless. It isn’t disappearing because you say so. Want to be the one that sends females to some guy somewhere that saw how to do it on the internet? He can take care of that for ya for a few bucks.

Better that females have access to actual doctors and professional conditions. You don’t have to approve. It’s none of your business anyway.

Moesart on May 23, 2012 at 12:27 PM

If abortion was illegal, but the same number of abortions were happening anyway, and they would, social cons would be smugly happy with themselves.

It’s kind of like the religious in Iran. They know that homosexuality will exist whether it is illegal or not, but by making it illegal, they get to punish those caught. So they feel smug about it. Kind of like the drug laws. Making drug use illegal doesn’t stop anybody from using drugs. But it makes the nanny-state busybody conservatives smugly content with themselves knowing that they can throw someone in jail for doing it.

They are delusional. And hypocritical. Delusional because they think that a single young woman is going to have a baby she doesn’t’ want just because a law says she has to. Abortion will remain a practice whether it is legal or illegal. And they are hypocritical for championing the heavy hand of the government, when they spend the rest of their lives ranting about the heavy hand of the government.

As far as I know, there is no abortion law mandating abortion. So social conservatives already have the law on their side. The fact that you are not forced to have abortions, is an example of the freedom of America. So celebrate the law. You can have as many babies as they want. But to tell other people they have to have a baby because YOU want them to, is where you turn in your conservative card, and replace it with a big brother socialist card.

This is why the only true conservative is, today, a libertarian.

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:28 PM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Bernard Nathanson and Abby Johnson would disagree. No, even people who are invested in an issue can change, and radically.

Bracketing for a moment what can only be described as conversions, the majority of Americans are deeply ambivalent on the issue. All it takes there–on any issue–is time and some nudging.

DRPrice on May 23, 2012 at 11:39 AM

I think Norma McCorvey changed her mind too, don’t forget her!

Maddie on May 23, 2012 at 12:29 PM

If abortion was illegal, but the same number of abortions were happening anyway…

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:28 PM

What exactly do you base this on? Your irrational hatred of life?

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:33 PM

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:13 PM

I don’t believe that the Catholic position on saving the life of the mother or the child comes down in favor of one side or the other. The Catholic Church bans direct abortion to save the life of the mother. However the mother’s life may be saved by a surgical procedure that does not directly attack the baby’s life. So that, as long as there is no evil intent to deliberately kill the unborn child, procedures which may unintentionally kill the child are justified to save the mother’s life.

In the case of rape, while I understand your point that the mother “is here already and deserves to have a life of her own”, I just think that,once conceived, the baby is here already too and deserving of a life of its own.

And yes, we agree totally, abortion on demand is not only first degree murder but also an unspeakable and unpardonable sin.

Thank you for sharing the story of your birth, and thank God for the miracle that allowed you and your mother to survive.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 12:33 PM

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:28 PM

I don’t know that it’s easy for anyone else to be “smug” about anything, since you managed to corner the market on the adjective in question.

DRPrice on May 23, 2012 at 12:36 PM

…hey…I’d rather travel to China to adopt a baby…then be able to get one from somewhere in this country to give it loving and a good life.

KOOLAID2 on May 23, 2012 at 12:36 PM

Are you being sarcastic, or just incredibly foolish? Next you’re going to say that people just don’t change their minds on gun control…yet support for gun control has been steadily decreasing since the 50s.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Or gay marriage, slavery…

Plus, there’s no proof that this poll shows people who are changing their minds. It could simply be that the younger generation is more pro-life than the older.

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:40 PM

This poll proves the greater screech theory:

The more you screech about something that most Americans don’t care about at the expense of something most Americans do care about than you are likely to lose Americans support for that political view.

Example:

A vast majority of Americans care most about the economy and the national debt, but Obama and Democrats keep screeching about abortions, and other uniquely hardcore left wing feminist causes at the expense of finding real solutions to fix our economy and the national debt problems. This in turn annoys Americans, who out spite turn against abortion.

William Eaton on May 23, 2012 at 12:40 PM

lester and the rest of the plankton bank will drop by to claim that it doesn’t matter…same claim that it matters totally on gay marriage…go figure.

Schadenfreude on May 23, 2012 at 12:41 PM

What exactly do you base this on?

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:33 PM

Common sense. People who do drugs, don’t ask the government first for permission. People who rob banks, don’t ask the government for permission. And women who have abortions, have never asked the government for permission. So government permission is irrelevant to the practice. Even jaywalking is immune. People who are going to jaywalk, do it anyway. People who don’t jaywalk, refrain because they don’t feel it safe, not because it’s illegal.

But you social cons get bent out of shape based solely on the issue of government permission. Why? Because as it is now, you can’t punish the heretics.

Abortion is actually moot to your people. It happens anyway. But as it is now, you don’t have the satisfaction of punishing the women.

Aye, there’s the rub.

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:42 PM

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:28 PM

Interesting, for sure. But the problem is, you’re not seeing things through the baby’s eyes.

John the Libertarian on May 23, 2012 at 12:43 PM

I don’t know that it’s easy for anyone else to be “smug” about anything, since you managed to corner the market on the adjective in question.

DRPrice on May 23, 2012 at 12:36 PM

To enhance the richness, realize that the person you’re addressing was once a HUGE Ron Paul booster, to the point of saying anyone who didn’t support him wasn’t conservative.

Ron Paul is anti-abortion.

Reconcile dat s**t.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 12:44 PM

Anyone who believes this poll is crazy. People just don’t change their minds on these issues.

aniptofar on May 23, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Saint Paul would give you a very good arguement on this point.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 12:46 PM

If abortion was illegal, but the same number of abortions were happening anyway, and they would, social cons would be smugly happy with themselves.

Right, cause laws NEVER affect behavior. That’s why we shouldn’t actually have ANY laws, cause clearly they don’t do anything. People would even commit murder at the exact same rate now, even if they didn’t have to worry about jail time, cause it’s really about how good they are as people, not whether or not they’ll get caught and punished. There’s no such thing as a deterrent, apparently.

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:47 PM

I don’t believe that the Catholic position on saving the life of the mother or the child comes down in favor of one side or the other. The Catholic Church bans direct abortion to save the life of the mother. However the mother’s life may be saved by a surgical procedure that does not directly attack the baby’s life. So that, as long as there is no evil intent to deliberately kill the unborn child, procedures which may unintentionally kill the child are justified to save the mother’s life.

In the case of rape, while I understand your point that the mother “is here already and deserves to have a life of her own”, I just think that,once conceived, the baby is here already too and deserving of a life of its own.

And yes, we agree totally, abortion on demand is not only first degree murder but also an unspeakable and unpardonable sin.

Thank you for sharing the story of your birth, and thank God for the miracle that allowed you and your mother to survive.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 12:33 PM

I’d really have to look it up, but I’m pretty confident that the Catholic position is to save the mother over the baby, should it come to that. This is post-Vatican II tho, prior to that it was the other way around. At least that’s what I’ve always understood it to be. If I’m wrong on that, please correct me.

I guess we’ll simply disagree on the rape scenario…neither side on that issue is totally correct, or totally incorrect, and both sides can be argued for or against logically. It’s a tough call. Again, I just cannot see telling a raped woman she has to have the baby. It’s cruel, as was the rape, and again…an abortion in that instance is simply the leasser of the two evils…to me, anyway. But to take the other side on that isn’t evil or wrong either…again, it’s a tough call.

Thanks…yeah, I don’t know where I’d be today if not for having a mom to grow up with. We we always pretty close, unlike my relationship with my dad. She died of cancer a few years ago, and I do miss her. I can only hope and pray I’ll see her again in the presence of our Lord in heaven.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

To enhance the richness, realize that the person you’re addressing was once a HUGE Ron Paul booster, to the point of saying anyone who didn’t support him wasn’t conservative.

Ron Paul is anti-abortion.

Reconcile dat s**t.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 12:44 PM

Haha. Long memories can be helpful, I see.

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Truly sad….

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Truly sad….

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Oh, do elaborate. We’re waiting with bated breath for your insight as to why people disliking the killing of children is sad.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 12:52 PM

It’s cruel, as was the rape, and again…an abortion in that instance is simply the leasser of the two evils…to me, anyway. But to take the other side on that isn’t evil or wrong either…again, it’s a tough call.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Jet, I think I agree with your overall point, but I’d rephrase it. I’d argue that allowing a rape victim to have an abortion rather than putting the pressure of law on her to carry her attacker’s child is the lesser of two evils, but I don’t think her actually having the abortion is itself the lesser evil.

Some women do still raise children born of rape, and I am very much in awe of them.

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:52 PM

Common sense.

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:42 PM

*snort*

People who do drugs, don’t ask the government first for permission.

An addiction. Not comparable.

People who rob banks, don’t ask the government for permission.

Are you honestly going to argue that decriminalizing bank robberies would no effect their rate of occurrence?

People who are going to jaywalk, do it anyway. People who don’t jaywalk, refrain because they don’t feel it safe, not because it’s illegal.

Rudy Giuliani would beg to differ.

But you social cons get bent out of shape based solely on the issue of government permission. Why? Because as it is now, you can’t punish the heretics.

Yes, I want to burn people at the stake. You caught me. Nothing to do with respecting life above all else and protecting the liberties of the unborn. Nope. All about public stoning.

Abortion is actually moot to your people. It happens anyway. But as it is now, you don’t have the satisfaction of punishing the women.

Aye, there’s the rub.

I think I see the problem here. You can’t seem to understand the viewpoint of a pro-lifer because you project your own broken thought processes onto others. A conman also has great difficulty processing the fact that there are actually honest people in the world.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:53 PM

Oh, do elaborate. We’re waiting with bated breath for your insight as to why people disliking the killing of children is sad.

MadisonConservative on May 23, 2012 at 12:52 PM

Ahh, good to see MadCon hasn’t lost his snark :)

*waves to Est* Wow, it’s like a reunion or something, I don’t see y’all too often anymore :P

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:53 PM

Whatever…the point is that human life conceived under any circumstances, is still human life and deserves to live.

Trafalgar on May 23, 2012 at 12:01 PM

I think most could agree with that. Some, however, would disagree with the religious definition of what “life” is. To me, it starts with heartbeat.

Archivarix on May 23, 2012 at 12:54 PM

Truly sad….

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Why?

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Also wonder if Ed et al is going to post on the new study which finds Fox viewers are the least informed and NPR listeners the most informed on current events and basic knowledge.

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:55 PM

keep the change on May 23, 2012 at 12:42 PM

So if you’re driving and happen to be speeding, you don’t bother slowing down when you see a cop car? You don’t bother stopping at red lights with cameras when there’s no one else around?

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:56 PM

Also wonder if Ed et al is going to post on the new study which finds Fox viewers are the least informed and NPR listeners the most informed on current events and basic knowledge.

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Link it too us, and then tell us why being against prenatal murder is sad development.

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:57 PM

Jet, I think I agree with your overall point, but I’d rephrase it. I’d argue that allowing a rape victim to have an abortion rather than putting the pressure of law on her to carry her attacker’s child is the lesser of two evils, but I don’t think her actually having the abortion is itself the lesser evil.

Some women do still raise children born of rape, and I am very much in awe of them.

Esthier on May 23, 2012 at 12:52 PM

For sure, it would be up to the woman herself if she wanted the child, or the abortion. She should not be forced to carry to term, nor should she be forced to have an abortion. But if she were forced to carry to term against her will, it makes no sense to me to save a new life as a result of possibly destroying another.

I cannot speak for God…but I’m guessing he wouldn’t approve of that either. Not the God I know, anyway.

JetBoy on May 23, 2012 at 12:57 PM

Why?

NotCoach on May 23, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Because the state is claiming the right to control women’s reproduction and less and less responsibility to aid parents who are financially unable to care for additional children. The whole goal is to encourage that people have less sex. Its about control over private sexual choices and its working.

libfreeordie on May 23, 2012 at 12:58 PM

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