Video: Get off of Jonah Goldberg’s lawn, you darned kids

posted at 5:46 pm on May 12, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

I love a curmudgeonly rant, and so this interview of National Review’s Jonah Goldberg is right up my alley. This excerpt of a longer interview with the Daily Caller’s Ginni Thomas focuses on Jonah’s issues with the “youth culture,” the obsession with the worldview of the least experienced of our citizenry. Goldberg notes that “we’re all born idiots,” and that some people are a lot closer to that point in time than most of the rest of us:

“It is a simple fact of science that nothing correlates more with ignorance and stupidity more than youth,” the National Review Online editor said in an interview. “We’re all born idiots, and we only get over that condition as we get less young.”

So why all the focus on the youth vote and “millennials” in politics? Goldberg says young people having so much influence in a society is unhealthy.

“My view is, they’re going to run the country some day, so we should really explain why they’re so frickin’ stupid about so many things,” he said.

Goldberg says in the interview that he would prefer a much higher voting age than 18, and while I agree that these voters tend to be the least sophisticated and informed voters in any election, I still disagree with Goldberg on this point. The law treats 18-year-olds as fully responsible for their actions. The purpose of elections is to form a representative government that binds all citizens and holds them accountable. That includes 18-year-old citizens, which means that they should have the right to participate in the formation of legislatures and executive branches that create and enforce those laws.

That doesn’t mean that politicians should pander to them, or at least at the expense of both older voters and common sense. They may be running the country someday, it is true, but it is equally true that they may be performing brain surgery someday too. That doesn’t mean I want them practicing on my head when they’re 18 and haven’t learned anything about it yet.

In fact, I’d say that a sure sign of political desperation is when a politician has to focus on the least-sophisticated and least-experienced voters to gain any traction. That’s a giveaway that their policies are probably too simplistic and unrealistic to sell elsewhere. One case in point: ObamaCare. Obama got a great deal of support from young voters on this policy — and now they will be forced to needlessly buy comprehensive health insurance at great expense when a simple catastrophic policy would suit their needs much more economically, in order to subsidize the health-care costs of middle-aged and senior voters. Suckers!

Perhaps that experience will have taught the youth culture an important lesson. If so, Jonah will try not to bark at them when their radios are too loud or order them off his darned lawn. Jonah also has a new book out, The Tyranny of Cliches: How Liberals Cheat in the War of Ideas — be sure to check it out.


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Poor monetary policy coupled with immature fiscal policy is the culprit. I think you would agree.

Saltysam on May 12, 2012 at 7:47 PM

I agree in a sense. The cause is that our government is so corrupt that they blatantly flout the will of the American people, or try to, in such notable instances as Shamnesty and Obamacare. They are so deep in the pockets of their corporate and labor other special interest cronies that our government is now a form of immoral generational tyranny.

It is time for the tree of liberty to be refreshed, but unfortunately America is an aging, immoral country and the boomers don’t want to boat to be rocked, they just want to preserve their own comfort, to hell with the future of the nation and all of us younger people who will be left holding the bag. Even while Ron Paul tries to stop this and correct it, he is smeared and cheated and maligned by the people trying to preserve the immoral status quo.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:55 PM

“+$16 Trillion dollar in debt and rising…”

“What’s that mean…?” - 18 year old

Seven Percent Solution on May 12, 2012 at 7:55 PM

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 7:46 PM

The point was about the right to vote for those taking ss etc right?

I like how you changed the subject. Yeh I noticed.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 7:56 PM

The only way you are entitled to money you pay into something is if you don’t withdraw it, or allow crony-politicians to withdraw it, and spend it on candy and bailouts instead.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:42 PM

I notice the dimwitted seem to run from the entire point about connecting such thinking to the right to vote.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

But, Goldberg’s point is rational. The “youth” vote is, in monolithic terms, an idiot.

Saltysam on May 12, 2012 at 7:37 PM

I was 18 when I voted for Reagan. But I also had a job. The kids these days? Not so much. Not that they don’t WANT jobs. They just can’t seem to compete with the 45 year olds for McDonald’s jobs.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

Awesome idea. Let’s couple that with subsidized student loans, aid to families with dependent children, collectiong a government paycheck, living on your parents insurance (like julia), living in your parent’s home (because them might be getting social security), collecting government contraception, food stamps, and the whole host of other programs that have been designed to buy your votes. Which RELIABLY go to the democrats.

You get what you pay for. Sometimes not even that.

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 7:45 PM

I am against all of those things anyway. I don’t know if you were intending to be sarcastic but I don’t want the big government leviathan in any form, much less for any of the programs that you mentioned above.

Again, I don’t want to take away anyone’s right to vote, including those that receive benefits, but I do believe that it would be less wrong to take away someone’s right to vote based upon receipt of government bennies than it would based on something arbitrary like age. I was in the Army and voted all GOP when I was 18. Why would you want to take away my right to vote? (Not saying that you would, but Mr. Goldberg is arguing for this).

Are there a lot of idiot 18 year olds? You betcha. Trouble is, there are plenty of older generation adults who will vote for the person that they think will best protect their benefits, regardless of party affiliation. Maybe a better way to say that is that older voters, including GOP voters, will vote against anyone that they feel will legitimately threaten their benefits. SS, Medicare and Medicaid are known as the “third rail” of politics for that very reason. It isn’t the youth vote that politicians are afraid of losing when it comes to entitlement reform. It’s the older generation. In that sense, it strikes me as extremely unfair to blame our current situation on the “youth.”

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

Where I come from the age for drinking and getting a drivers license is 18.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 6:49 PM

I got my driver’s license at age 15, though I started driving cars, motorcycles and boats at age 12, which was when I could reach the peddles and see over the dashboard at the same time.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 7:58 PM

I wish the schools would once again teach American History, and a semester of civics in the senior year. Then require each 18 year old pass a civics test in order to register to vote.

Posey on May 12, 2012 at 7:58 PM

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:55 PM

At least that’s what it seems like.

In reality, I don’t think most of the immoral generational thieves that are destroying America even realize what they’re doing because the corporate media is nothing more than a propaganda arm of the establishment that is comprised of immoral generational thieves and cronies. They are the real culprits that are most to blame.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:59 PM

Just wait until everyone is thrown off the unemployment dole. Things are going to get very ugly for Obama.

And best of all, he deserves it.

You can’t socialize the USA, you pansy.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 7:59 PM

Rebar on May 12, 2012 at 5:56 PM

both my son-18. graduates from high school a week from tomorrow-and my second nephew-turns 18 and graduates from high school in early June-are both proud patriots who will be casting their first votes accordingly. I turned 18 less than two weeks prior to the 1988 general election. My first vote was for GHWB. My husband was 21 in 1980. Guess who his first vote was for.
My point is that not all young people are brain-dead lefties looking for a government-teat to suck on.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:01 PM

Awesome idea. If you receive SS, Medicare or Medicaid, you lose the right to vote. That makes a lot more sense than doing it by age.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 6:38 PM

Alrighty…now tell us how you feel about death panels.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:01 PM

The point was about the right to vote for those taking ss etc right?

I like how you changed the subject. Yeh I noticed.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 7:56 PM

You keep on wishing on that star.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:01 PM

I am against all of those things anyway. I don’t know if you were intending to be sarcastic but I don’t want the big government leviathan in any form, much less for any of the programs that you mentioned above.

Again, I don’t want to take away anyone’s right to vote, including those that receive benefits, but I do believe that it would be less wrong to take away someone’s right to vote based upon receipt of government bennies than it would based on something arbitrary like age. I was in the Army and voted all GOP when I was 18. Why would you want to take away my right to vote? (Not saying that you would, but Mr. Goldberg is arguing for this).

Are there a lot of idiot 18 year olds? You betcha. Trouble is, there are plenty of older generation adults who will vote for the person that they think will best protect their benefits, regardless of party affiliation. Maybe a better way to say that is that older voters, including GOP voters, will vote against anyone that they feel will legitimately threaten their benefits. SS, Medicare and Medicaid are known as the “third rail” of politics for that very reason. It isn’t the youth vote that politicians are afraid of losing when it comes to entitlement reform. It’s the older generation. In that sense, it strikes me as extremely unfair to blame our current situation on the “youth.”

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

Sarcastic???? Only sort of. I am willing to make that trade. Betcha the dems aren’t. And you started the negotiations. Really wanna stop generational theft?????

Go with the lesser of two evils.

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:02 PM

We can still afford a safety net for the boomers, but they’d have to cut down on all of their Marxist and Fascist statist policies that are so expensive, like the nation-building and the war on drugs and some of the bureaucratic arms of the government. But they won’t have it. They want their cake to to eat it to. They want the safety net and the police-state and the nation-building that is bankrupting America and instead of being responsible, moral people, they are being irresponsible, immoral people.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:23 PM

Without law enforcement on drugs and our military presence overseas insuring trade, you wont have half of the GDP we have now. De-funding either won’t save anyone any money.

Count to 10 on May 12, 2012 at 8:02 PM

I was 18 when I voted for Reagan. But I also had a job. The kids these days? Not so much. Not that they don’t WANT jobs. They just can’t seem to compete with the 45 year olds for McDonald’s jobs.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

My oldest son registered to vote at 17 and was disappointed to find out that he could not vote in the primaries but could vote for some of the candidates and issues. He will vote in November after he turns 18 and is decidedly libertarian in his views. He is not looking for a handout and is likely more intelligent than 98% of those his age and no doubt more intelligent than the vast majority of those his senior.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 8:02 PM

In reality, I don’t think most of the immoral generational thieves that are destroying America even realize what they’re doing because the corporate media is nothing more than a propaganda arm of the establishment that is comprised of immoral generational thieves and cronies. They are the real culprits that are most to blame.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:59 PM

The enemy is welfare and its recipients who believe they are entitled to womb to tomb “benefits”. Cuz, you know… They just are. They don’t know why, that’s just what they momma say.

/Mine did, but I got off that train in 1980.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:03 PM

which party wanted to penalize SS recipients for making to much earned income???

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:03 PM

Alrighty…now tell us how you feel about death panels.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:01 PM

“Death panels” are the immoral consequence of an immoral and bankrupt entitlement system.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:04 PM

CW on May 12, 2012 at 7:56 PM

You keep on wishing on that star.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:01 PM

What star dimwit? The one where I expect you and others to address my point rather than twisting it into something else. To tie the right to vote to the absence of taking your earned SS is asinine and wrong.

Play on dummy.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 8:04 PM

which party made it illegal for patients on medicare to pay out of pocket for any other medical services?? (Dr. could lose license)

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:06 PM

I got my driver’s license at age 15, though I started driving cars, motorcycles and boats at age 12, which was when I could reach the peddles and see over the dashboard at the same time.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 7:58 PM

I got my drivers license when I was 18 because I was offered a job as a driver for the U.S. Embassy in my home country. But driving isn’t such of a big deal in most of Eastern Europe or Europe for that matter because it’s too expensive i.e gas, insurance and there is no place to park the darn things on those tiny, narrow streets.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 8:07 PM

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:02 PM

Ughh. I am not voting democrat, nor will I ever, but encouraging me to vote for the LOTE just made me throw up a little bit. I guess that’s the best we can do. Ughh.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:07 PM

The reason old white Republicans are complaining about young people, I think, is because Ron Paul supporters, who are trying to stop the tyranny of the majority and the generational theft, and the old white people don’t like it.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 6:27 PM

First, Ron Paul took $31 Billion in pork, which your generation will be paying for – with interest, in perpetuity, so right there you’re proving Mr. Goldberg right in that “youth” are idiots.

Second, your non-white people are exact the ones whom are voting en mass for the democrat party – and no solution is going to be found there.

Last, by stripping away the benefits that people have paid into their entire working lives, aren’t YOU all the ones who are, in fact, “generational thieves”?

Rebar on May 12, 2012 at 8:08 PM

“Death panels” are the immoral consequence of an immoral and bankrupt entitlement system.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:04 PM

We agree that death panels are immoral. However, what makes you think any of us oldsters want to participate in any entitlement system? I never did. In fact, we’ve been living for the last over 30 years as though SS and medicare won’t be there for us so, should it go away overnight, it’s of no consequence to us, though it is to others. We were forced to pay into it, though.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:09 PM

Besides, you don’t have to worry about generational theft. No matter where the dem/socialists have had their way (50 years plus in most places) your generation is disappearing.

Thats why Bernanke needs to inflate the older generations assetts out of existence.

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:10 PM

To tie the right to vote to the absence of taking your earned SS is asinine and wrong.

Play on dummy.

CW on May 12, 2012 at 8:04 PM

I have said above that it is wrong. But it is less wrong than taking away someone’s right to vote that is of age to fight in the military and is considered an adult for every other conceivable purpose because they are 18. You obviously disagree. That doesn’t mean I didn’t address it.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:10 PM

Sew… the other day I went out on my lunch hour to go buy a coffee maker, so I went to a Wal Mart near the office. Got there around 1:00 or so. So, here are all the Welfare Queens with fancy fingernails and designer bags and beautiful weaves and fine shoes. Sitting in the Wal Mart cafe munching on pizza, checking their I-phones and in general, conducting their business.

There were just as many able bodied men walking around, wandering through electronics, playing x-box and play station demo’s.

It truly was bizzarro world. When I grew up on welfare we didn’t parade around. We were ashamed. Which is why I left that plantation.

Obama. Destroyer of Dreams

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:10 PM

But driving isn’t such of a big deal in most of Eastern Europe or Europe for that matter because it’s too expensive i.e gas, insurance and there is no place to park the darn things on those tiny, narrow streets.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 8:07 PM

Those streets may be tiny and narrow, but so are the cars. ;o)

I can certainly see why, as a youngster, getting your license wasn’t as exciting to you as it was to us. To us, it represented freedom and we took full advantage of it.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:12 PM

I wish the schools would once again teach American History, and a semester of civics in the senior year. Then require each 18 year old pass a civics test in order to register to vote.

Posey on May 12, 2012 at 7:58 PM

…need to start here with the trolls who don’t know how government works.

KOOLAID2 on May 12, 2012 at 8:13 PM

which party made it illegal for patients on medicare to pay out of pocket for any other medical services?? (Dr. could lose license)

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:06 PM

My parents’ primary doctor is moving away from Medicare into a flat rate monthly system for all patients. He is genuinely concerned for the health of his patients and won’t go into the auto=storage of all personal/private info of all patients to be disclosed to the HHS.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:14 PM

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:10 PM

I’m jealous……….you have WalMarts.

Obama. Destroyer of Dreams

That is it in a nutshell.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:15 PM

I do not care about the age of the prospective voter.

I care, as did the founders, about the responsibiliy of the voter.

That is why they restricted voting to property owners, business owners or journeyman tradespeople. It was the only way to ensure that the parasites did not gain control.

Well, we have allowed those parasites to gain control and vote themselves largesse from the ever-fewer of us who actually work.

Explain to me why the opinion of a welfare queen who has contributed nothing except 5 or 6 hungry mouths who are destined only for prison or an early grave after being raised on my damn dime, should have the same right to vote that I, who have worked for more than 40 years, paying taxes each of those years, do.

While we cannot easily go back to those restrictions on the franchise so carefully embodied in the Constitution, we can most assuredly restrict it to taxpayers.

By that light, a young genius who creates a business at 12 or 14 would have the vote, while a 70 year-old who lives completely from the government dole (no matter how well-earned) would not.

I will be 60 years old next month, and I could live with that.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:18 PM

We agree that death panels are immoral. However, what makes you think any of us oldsters want to participate in any entitlement system? I never did. In fact, we’ve been living for the last over 30 years as though SS and medicare won’t be there for us so, should it go away overnight, it’s of no consequence to us, though it is to others. We were forced to pay into it, though.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:09 PM

“Wanting” to participate really creates an easy ethical out for those that are the current beneficiaries of the system. I am not coming down on you personally, because I don’t know or care what you have “contributed” or what you have done to abolish the current entitlement system. Since Mr. Goldberg was taking a broad swipe at a group based entirely on their age, I am just pointing out that the current 18-21 age group has no culpability for the mess we are in. That is on the shoulders of the older generations.

The youth will have to pay for benefits to the older generations that they will never receive. Are you ok with that? As long as you “get yours” because you paid into the system, are you ok with perpetuating a system that has bankrupted this country and saddled the youth with a crushing debt and will never see the same benefits that you are enjoying? I don’t know where you come down on that, I just think it is a perverse metric for Mr. Goldberg to use to decide who should and should not vote.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:20 PM

I can certainly see why, as a youngster, getting your license wasn’t as exciting to you as it was to us. To us, it represented freedom and we took full advantage of it.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:12 PM

My freedom came on November 29, 1989, the day we threw the Commies out.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 8:22 PM

The drinking age was raised to 21 because horrific accidents happened when the drinking age was 18? Well I would have to say horrific accidents have happened when 18 year olds vote.

mabelee on May 12, 2012 at 8:26 PM

My freedom came on November 29, 1989, the day we threw the Commies out.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 8:22 PM

Applause.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:26 PM

In fact the only people today that are fighting the immoral majority of generational thieves are Ron Paul and his supporters

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:48 PM

This is not true, FR. It is a fact that there are others, that do not support Ron Paul, that are fighting against the devaluation of our currency.

Saltysam on May 12, 2012 at 8:27 PM

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:20 PM

So when guys like Paul Ryan step up and propose reform of the system; i.e., allowing 18 year olds to pay into their own system vs. the gubmint system that supports all those geezers vs. a self-directed investment plan designed to protect the individaul investor (the 18 year old), do you still see Paul Ryan pushing your grandma over the cliff? With (LMAO) Obama standing in the valley waiting to catch your grandma like John Kerry catches this baby?

I’m curiouser.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:30 PM

This is not true, FR. It is a fact that there are others, that do not support Ron Paul, that are fighting against the devaluation of our currency.

Saltysam on May 12, 2012 at 8:27 PM

If they’re supporting a candidate like Obama or Romney then they are fighting on the wrong side. If they don’t like Ron Paul they should vote Gary Johnson or find somebody else to run 3rd party.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:30 PM

I was 18 when I voted for Reagan. But I also had a job. The kids these days? Not so much. Not that they don’t WANT jobs. They just can’t seem to compete with the 45 year olds for McDonald’s jobs.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 7:57 PM

I was 19 when I voted for Reagan in the Texas ’76 primary and also was a Young Republican in college who knocked on doors and made phone calls on his behalf. Old school style, no internet.

My nephew turned 18 this year and his first vote will be cast against Obama. But he comes from a long line of hard working conservatives.

TxAnn56 on May 12, 2012 at 8:33 PM

18 year olds being able to vote stems from the Vietnam War and the draft, both of which were over decades ago, so it should be returned to 21. If “kids” can be on their parents health care plan until 26, then 26.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:34 PM

This is not true, FR. It is a fact that there are others, that do not support Ron Paul, that are fighting against the devaluation of our currency.

Saltysam on May 12, 2012 at 8:27 PM

Who? I mean, I am sure that there are voters out there that fit that descriptions, but what politicians are fighting that besides Paul?

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:38 PM

My nephew turned 18 this year and his first vote will be cast against Obama. But he comes from a long line of hard working conservatives.

TxAnn56 on May 12, 2012 at 8:33 PM

Your statement is very telling. Your nephew’s vote will be “against Obama”, meaning it’s a vote against socialism/statism/marxism.

I wish Obama would stop spending so much DNC money visiting someone’s driveway in Nevada

Folks? How do you magnify the term landslide? Mudslide? Avalanche?

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:38 PM

I understand the argument “if you are old enough to be sent off to fight for your country, then you should be old enough to cast a vote (oddly though, you aren’t old enough to drink).” I get it. I really, really, really do, but is it too much for me to ask that those allowed to vote also understand that the toy in the Happy Meal isn’t actually free?

Resist We Much on May 12, 2012 at 8:38 PM

I am just pointing out that the current 18-21 age group has no culpability for the mess we are in. That is on the shoulders of the older generations.

The youth will have to pay for benefits to the older generations that they will never receive. Are you ok with that? As long as you “get yours” because you paid into the system, are you ok with perpetuating a system that has bankrupted this country and saddled the youth with a crushing debt and will never see the same benefits that you are enjoying? I don’t know where you come down on that, I just think it is a perverse metric for Mr. Goldberg to use to decide who should and should not vote.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:20 PM

In all seriousness, we shall see what the voting trends of the current 18-21 year olds will be soon enough.

Regarding that last paragraph, do you really, HONESTLY, believe that your generation wasn’t handed something better than say every other 18-21 year old group in the rest of the world? Think that one through carefully.

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 8:39 PM

Oh, and to anyone that I might have offended by my posts on I think it was Thursday night, I’m sorry. I was a wino.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:41 PM

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:34 PM

My son has until he’s 22. Ditto with car insurance. He’s joining ROTC as well. I was a USMC DEP @ 18-even though in the end I washed out-and SPAWN will be joining ROTC.
You were saying…

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:41 PM

That is on the shoulders of the older generations.

Correction…that is on the shoulders of older democrat generations, and on current democrats.

The youth will have to pay for benefits to the older generations that they will never receive.

The way things stand now, he’s absolutely correct.

Are you ok with that? As long as you “get yours” because you paid into the system, are you ok with perpetuating a system that has bankrupted this country and saddled the youth with a crushing debt and will never see the same benefits that you are enjoying?

No, I am not okay with that. I’m not a “get mine” kind of person. As I said earlier, it would be no skin off our noses if those entitlements disappeared over night. However, there are those who have worked all of their lives, forced to pay into the system, and will need that money when they are no longer working. Had they not had to pay into the system, most would have been better off investing in their retirement and health care themselves.

I am all for entitlement reform, and am sorry it’s worked out so badly for young people. But, this generational war must cease. We aren’t your enemy…the system is, and it’s broken. The democrats use this issue as a political tool to scare old people, and to tick off young people. I wish young people were able to focus their scorn and anger in the right direction.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:42 PM

Because we older Americans are stealing their futures and spending it on ourselves instead, sticking them with the bill for our own intransigence. We are selling America’s youth down the river, burying them in a hole under a mountain of debt and back-filling with inflation.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 6:14 PM

And by voting overwhelmingly for Obama in 2008, the “youth” are leading this very charge against themselves. That’s not exactly the definition of competent.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:42 PM

That is why they restricted voting to property owners, business owners or journeyman tradespeople. It was the only way to ensure that the parasites did not gain control.

Well, we have allowed those parasites to gain control and vote themselves largesse from the ever-fewer of us who actually work.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:18 PM

Ah, but here’s the ironic part: it’s the businesses like the corrupt banks, insurance and healthcare companies that are the parasites now. They keep all of the ill gotten gains from crony-economics, like the housing/debt bubble, for themselves and then when the ponzy scheme falls apart they stick the taxpayers with the bill and get off Scott free.

Also, it’s the “land owners” that took out second and third mortgages to buy a bunch of junk and keep up with the jones’ and support bailing out house prices that are the parasites now.

Not the young people; they’re mostly just the victims.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:43 PM

My son has until he’s 22. Ditto with car insurance. He’s joining ROTC as well. I was a USMC DEP @ 18-even though in the end I washed out-and SPAWN will be joining ROTC.
You were saying…

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:41 PM

I have no idea what you are getting at. 22 is over 18 and ROTC is mostly a joke.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:44 PM

My freedom came on November 29, 1989, the day we threw the Commies out.

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 8:22 PM

What a day that must have been for you and your fellow countrymen!

Believe me when I say, we were watching the iron curtain fall in amazing wonderment. I must say, too, when watching the news, even I caught myself welling up with tears. I never thought it would happen, much less happen so fast. What an amazing time to be alive!

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:45 PM

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:43 PM

young people that support Herr Doktor may well be victims-but my son and my nephew will never be ANYONE’S ‘victim’.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:45 PM

They keep all of the ill gotten gains from crony-economics, like the housing/debt bubble, for themselves and then when the ponzy scheme falls apart they stick the taxpayers with the bill and get off Scott free.

To correct myself, it’s not the taxpayers that are really picking up the tab, it’s the victims in the future that will have to try to pay back all of that debt through taxation and inflation.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:47 PM

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:44 PM

My son’s a patriot. I’m glad that he will be voting this year.
I’m also glad that he wants to serve his country long-term.
You sound like a very bitter person. That’s not the fault of young conservatives like my son.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:48 PM

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:43 PM

young people that support Herr Doktor may well be victims-but my son and my nephew will never be ANYONE’S ‘victim’.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:45 PM

“Herr Doktor”? Some call that “Goodwin’s Law”.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:49 PM

So when guys like Paul Ryan step up and propose reform of the system; i.e., allowing 18 year olds to pay into their own system vs. the gubmint system that supports all those geezers vs. a self-directed investment plan designed to protect the individaul investor (the 18 year old), do you still see Paul Ryan pushing your grandma over the cliff? With (LMAO) Obama standing in the valley waiting to catch your grandma like John Kerry catches this baby?

I’m curiouser.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:30 PM

“Guys like Paul Ryan” that gave an impassioned speech in support of TARP? But I digress.

The fact that Paul Ryan is called “courageous” for suggesting such milquetoast entitlement reforms that will really do very little, if anything, says FAR more about politicians fear of the older generations punishing them at the ballot box for taking away their benefits. The pushing grandma off the cliff commercials were not created for the purpose of scaring 18-21 year olds. They were created to enflame the current recipients of those programs.

The desire to do the reforms that are actually necessary to “save” these entitlements for future generations is nonexistent on BOTH sides of the aisle. I have little faith that Paul Ryan’s extremely modest reforms will ever pass, even with the GOP controlling both houses and the presidency.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 8:49 PM

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:44 PM

My son’s a patriot. I’m glad that he will be voting this year.
I’m also glad that he wants to serve his country long-term.
You sound like a very bitter person. That’s not the fault of young conservatives like my son.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:48 PM

Bitter because I said that 22 is over 18 (simple math) or that ROTC is a joke (it largely is)?

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:51 PM

ROTC is mostly a joke.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:44 PM

Well, except that those who join the ROTC are actually accepting some damn responsibility to defend their nation, instead of whining that their basket-weaving ‘doctorates’ have left them hundreds of thousands in debt whilr offering no equivalently remunerative jobs.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:52 PM

Youth are only as dumb and ill-informed as their parents allow them to be.

It’s no secret that the left has been doing everything in it’s power to diminish the role of the family.

It doesn’t matter anyway, the vast majority of young people of voting age who don’t have a clue are too lazy to bother voting.

reaganaut on May 12, 2012 at 8:53 PM

‘Whilr’ = while.

Preview is my eternal, sworn enemy.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:53 PM

To correct myself, it’s not the taxpayers that are really picking up the tab, it’s the victims in the future that will have to try to pay back all of that debt through taxation and inflation.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 8:47 PM

And yet most of them voted for Obama, a self indictment.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:54 PM

FAR more about politicians fear of the older generations punishing them at the ballot box for taking away their benefits.

If Republicans would spend more time and money educating those already receiving benefits that entitlement reform won’t affect them, I think it’s very possible to have meaningful entitlement reform. However, their voices are drowned out by outraged democrats and the LSM, so they need to shout louder.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:55 PM

Well, except that those who join the ROTC are actually accepting some damn responsibility to defend their nation, instead of whining that their basket-weaving ‘doctorates’ have left them hundreds of thousands in debt whilr offering no equivalently remunerative jobs.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:52 PM

I believe that is called damning by faint praise, or a close relation.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:57 PM

Goldberg says in the interview that he would prefer a much higher voting age than 18, and while I agree that these voters tend to be the least sophisticated and informed voters in any election, I still disagree with Goldberg on this point. The law treats 18-year-olds as fully responsible for their actions. The purpose of elections is to form a representative government that binds all citizens and holds them accountable. That includes 18-year-old citizens, which means that they should have the right to participate in the formation of legislatures and executive branches that create and enforce those laws.

Then the answer is to eradicate 18 as the arbitrary ‘age of adulthood’; make it 25 or something.

Your argument is akin to “pull down the wealthy” rather than “raise the poor”. If ‘young’ people (barely 18) are stupid – and they largely are, in terms of realities of life/politics/etc – then the answer is not to maintain that status quo for the sake of “well, the law treats them as responsible for their actions at that age”.

Look, at ELEVEN we have to pay ‘adult’ prices for food, movies, etc – that doesn’t make him an ‘adult’.

Midas on May 12, 2012 at 8:57 PM

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:52 PM

He’s majoring in history. He’s also a grease-monkey-so he has back-up skills. He really wants to serve his country.

annoyinglittletwerp on May 12, 2012 at 8:58 PM

And yet most of them voted for Obama, a self indictment.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 8:54 PM

Voting for Romney is also an indictment, so then everybody is indicted.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 9:00 PM

Well, except that those who join the ROTC are actually accepting some damn responsibility to defend their nation, instead of whining that their basket-weaving ‘doctorates’ have left them hundreds of thousands in debt whilr offering no equivalently remunerative jobs.

Siddhartha Vicious on May 12, 2012 at 8:52 PM

That doesn’t apply to all young people. The fact is that after the boomers got to the top of the ladder they outsourced large pieces of the ladder overseas where young Americans no longer have access to it.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 9:03 PM

Voting for Romney is also an indictment, so then everybody is indicted.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 9:00 PM

There are indictments for misdemeanors and then there are indictments for capital crimes.

VorDaj on May 12, 2012 at 9:03 PM

One case in point: ObamaCare. Obama got a great deal of support from young voters on this policy — and now they will be forced to needlessly buy comprehensive health insurance at great expense when a simple catastrophic policy would suit their needs much more economically, in order to subsidize the health-care costs of middle-aged and senior voters. Suckers!

But it wont.

The endgame of Obamacare is not for these people to have to buy insurance they don’t want. Most of them will never realize what has happened.

The endgame is for the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT to be the insurance provider, paid for out of payroll taxes – period.

We’ve already seen that the American public – virtually all of it – is too stupid and ignorant to even understand how much they pay in taxes because of the miracle of ‘withholding’. Once the true goal is achieved – single payer, funded with income taxes/withholding – these nimrods (and not just them – most everyone) will not even realize they’re paying for it and bringing even less home in their paychecks.

Midas on May 12, 2012 at 9:03 PM

Midas on May 12, 2012 at 9:03 PM

They will realize they are paying for it the way the rest of the socialist societies are paying for it. By not having children (hey, let’s face it, the younger generation is a paragon of delayed gratification, and yes, that is a generalization, but true none-the-less) which would erode their lifestyle, and allowing a huge influx of cheap labor. The latter, eventually rising up out of the ground to eat a few of them every night.

WryTrvllr on May 12, 2012 at 9:10 PM

If Republicans would spend more time and money educating those already receiving benefits that entitlement reform won’t affect them, I think it’s very possible to have meaningful entitlement reform. However, their voices are drowned out by outraged democrats and the LSM, so they need to shout louder.

kakypat on May 12, 2012 at 8:55 PM

Perhaps. That’s a start. It is still a bitter pill for the younger generations to swallow the reality that they will have “paid into the system” just like you did for your entire life but they will not receive the same benefits that you are currently entitled to, whether you need them or not.

Personally, I think that our currency will completely collapse before I will become eligible for benefits. Unfortunately, that is probably the only way that any reform will be achieved.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 9:11 PM

Am I stoked I made Jonah’s acknowldgement page in Tyranny of Cliches?

Yes. Yes I am. D.GOOCH

DGOOCH on May 12, 2012 at 9:15 PM

With all the “arrested development,” and laws like Obamacare saying “children” can stay on a parent’s insurance until 26-27,living w/ parents/parental support through their 20s, legal drinking age of 21, then maybe what we accepted in the past as an adult, is no longer the case. The mindset has changed so much in the last few decades.

di butler on May 12, 2012 at 9:28 PM

The law treats 18-year-olds as fully responsible for their actions.

But the government treats them as if they are infants, from congress down to their freshman high school English teacher.

Jaibones on May 12, 2012 at 9:36 PM

Maybe we shouldn’t let anybody vote who benefits from government enforced generational theft regardless of age. That way young people with too much debt won’t be able to use the government to steal from old people, and old Republican voters won’t be able to steal the future of young people and spend it on themselves and their cronies.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 6:34 PM

Those “old Republican voters” who are about to benefit from generational theft were, once upon a time, the victims of it. Any solution must take that fact into account. You can’t eliminate Social Security completely when it has sucked the wealth out of one generation and given it to another. But how to fix it?

Romney’s solution (or, rather, Ryan’s) would fix that problem by gradually shifting us from a social security program (where the succeeding generation pays the bills for the preceding generation) to a pay-as-you-go program, where individuals save for their own retirements.

Given that our birthrate is falling rapidly, such a solution is urgent — or else, as time goes on, we may have one worker working to support one retiree (we’re down to 2.8 workers/retiree [2010], down from 16 workers/retiree in 1950, 42 workers/retiree in 1940) and no possibility of making the change without destroying the retirements of a whole generation.

Does anyone remember George Bush’s 2005 State of The Union Address, in which he said:

Our society has changed in ways the founders of Social Security could not have foreseen. In today’s world, people are living longer and, therefore, drawing benefits longer. And those benefits are scheduled to rise dramatically over the next few decades.

Does anyone remember what the Democrats of Congress did when he spoke those words? [And they expect respect....]

unclesmrgol on May 12, 2012 at 9:41 PM

That doesn’t apply to all young people. The fact is that after the boomers got to the top of the ladder they outsourced large pieces of the ladder overseas where young Americans no longer have access to it.

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 9:03 PM

Huh? Ever been to Home Depot — the Home Depot of “we’re not going to advertise on Rush Limbaugh”?

They do have American tools, and tools made overseas (mostly in china). I love my Estwing hammers — they are a joy to use, but I could have had an equivalent hammer Made in China for half the price. Now, is my Estwing worth two Chinese made hammers? I don’t know, but I’ve watched you Generation X’ers come down the aisle and pick up — the Chinese hammer. Very few of you will pick the Estwing because it’s so costly. I’d say you are the problem, not the solution — you guys don’t want to pay for American Union Labor, and that’s the issue right there. By the way, even Estwing sees the light for some things — my Monster Estwing prybar is Made in Japan — not the cheapest place to do labor, but apparently far better than the USA. It’s equal in quality to all the other products they sell. It’s very nice steel too — I can put a new edge on it in a minute without worrying about screwing it up.

So I’d say that, if there was anything that my generation did to screw up things, it would be in trusting people like Mr. Trumka, who believed in milking “the bosses” for every last dime they could get. They succeeded, but it was a Pyrrhic victory.

unclesmrgol on May 12, 2012 at 9:53 PM

Goldberg says in the interview that he would prefer a much higher voting age than 18, and while I agree that these voters tend to be the least sophisticated and informed voters in any election, I still disagree with Goldberg on this point.

I agree with the sentiment by Goldberg, but it presumes that wisdom comes with age. Experience comes with age, but not necessarily wisdom. Some get wiser, but others do not.

ted c on May 12, 2012 at 10:39 PM

I love this, and verrrry spot on:

TheMightyMonarch on May 12, 2012 at 10:49 PM

Whoops…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKUZ42T9diU

TheMightyMonarch on May 12, 2012 at 10:50 PM

Case in point for the “follies” of youth:

Bryce Harper [19-year-old phenom for Washington Nationals] hits his own face with a bat, gets 10 stitches in return/

A metaphor for the youth voting for Obama.

Christian Conservative on May 12, 2012 at 11:10 PM

For the record, states can set the minimum voting age at 14 if they wish. All the Constitutional amendment means is that 18 year olds can’t be denied voting privileges.

Dante on May 12, 2012 at 11:18 PM

Oh, and to anyone that I might have offended by my posts on I think it was Thursday night, I’m sorry. I was a wino.

Key West Reader on May 12, 2012 at 8:41 PM

…well then keep drinking!…you’re more coherent than me when I’m sober!

KOOLAID2 on May 12, 2012 at 11:25 PM

How about we go the “full Heinlein” and restrict full citizenship, including the right to vote, to those that have served in the military?

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 5:56 PM

There is no right to vote. It doesn’t exist.

If that were true, why not allow 18 year old’s the right to drink?

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 5:56 PM

The drinking age is determined by each individual state.

Dante on May 12, 2012 at 11:30 PM

In fact the only people today that are fighting the immoral majority of generational thieves are Ron Paul and his supporters

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:48 PM

Are you saying that you are the ones you’ve been waiting for?

NukeRidingCowboy on May 12, 2012 at 11:35 PM

The law treats 18-year-olds as fully responsible for their actions.

If that were true, why not allow 18 year old’s the right to drink?

JPeterman on May 12, 2012 at 5:56 PM

Those who are allowed to serve and die for their land at 18, s/b allowed everything else (within laws). Yes, I know it’s state by state.

They should not be treated like children at 18 and in school, s/b taught a lot and how to be responsible.

The 30+ moron on Hannity who thought all things are “free” and that no one pays for them was symbolic of society’s failures, beg. at home and in school.

——-
Jonah Goldberg is still great.

Schadenfreude on May 12, 2012 at 11:38 PM

Dante on May 12, 2012 at 11:30 PM

Not advocating that. Just a somewhat sarcastic response to Mr. Goldberg since I know he’s not a veteran.

iwasbornwithit on May 12, 2012 at 11:55 PM

I know you weren’t, but there is no right to vote.

Dante on May 13, 2012 at 12:02 AM

Drinking age should be 18. Rather than raise the voting age, I’d like to see a competency test on basic political information. If you can’t answer basic questions about politics, you shouldn’t be voting. I know that’s controversial given the historical fact of using “literacy” tests and other qualification tests to exclude minorities…but just because they’ve been misused in the past doesn’t mean they aren’t a good idea…properly implemented. D.GOOCH

DGOOCH on May 13, 2012 at 12:17 AM

The drinking age is determined by each individual state.

Dante on May 12, 2012 at 11:30 PM

And the federal government threatening to withold highway funds if the states don’t raise the drinking age to twentyone has absolutely nothing to do with it.

Right.

I’ll bet you believe that.

Solaratov on May 13, 2012 at 12:26 AM

n fact the only people today that are fighting the immoral majority of generational thieves are Ron Paul and his supporters

FloatingRock on May 12, 2012 at 7:48 PM

Are you saying that you are the ones you’ve been waiting for?

NukeRidingCowboy on May 12, 2012 at 11:35 PM

Hmmm. Sounds oddly familiar, doesn’t it?

Solaratov on May 13, 2012 at 12:28 AM

Drinking age should be 18. Rather than raise the voting age, I’d like to see a competency test on basic political information. If you can’t answer basic questions about politics, you shouldn’t be voting. I know that’s controversial given the historical fact of using “literacy” tests and other qualification tests to exclude minorities…but just because they’ve been misused in the past doesn’t mean they aren’t a good idea…properly implemented. D.GOOCH

DGOOCH on May 13, 2012 at 12:17 AM

It’s a great idea, and would work well at both ends of the age spectrum. It’ll pass about the same time as nationwide voter ID laws do.

WryTrvllr on May 13, 2012 at 12:29 AM

Love Jonah and generally agree with his sentiments.

However, youthful idealism is a necessity, not an option.

Societies calcify and die without it. Balance is everything, but I’d prefer to live in a world with more idealism than not.

Just as political decisions sometimes make the best military decisions, sometimes “wing and a prayer” idealism trumps crusty wisdom.

rickyricardo on May 13, 2012 at 12:45 AM

My “kids” are 19, 20, and 25. They all have full-time jobs and my youngest is currently at Air Force basic training, he’s been in the Air National Guard for about 9 months now. We’ve made sure that their education included politics, government and history and educated them on how to counter incorrect information in their high school classes. They are all very aware of the stupidity on the left and are true fiscally conservative, limited government Americans.

With helicopter parents and the nanny government, society has been trying to keep people children as long as possible. 30 is the new 18. If we were talking about the 18-year-olds of a generation or two ago, I would agree that 18 is a good age to vote. However, that is no longer the case. Most 18-year-olds today can barely take responsibility for themselves, let alone be sophisticated enough to keep up with politics. Heck, there are a good number of so-called adults who don’t have a clue either.

Common Sense on May 13, 2012 at 12:52 AM

Very funny! There are many problems with our youth, ie, parents that don’t want to parent, education programs that teach them little of anything useful and tell them they are wonderful the way they are simply because they exist. I agree with Goldberg that they do need to be told how ignorant they are and also need to be told they can learn if they do the work to learn.

Charm on May 13, 2012 at 1:37 AM

Perhaps that experience will have taught the youth culture an important lesson.

By the time experience has taught youth anything, they are no longer youth.

Johnny 100 Pesos on May 13, 2012 at 1:49 AM

Just spent an evening on the lower East side of Manhattan.

You want to see stupid young people, and I’m talking stupid on steroids, try it sometime.
It’s downright disheartening what our culture has done to these poor souls.

Cleombrotus on May 13, 2012 at 2:12 AM

Just spent an evening on the lower East side of Manhattan.

You want to see stupid young people, and I’m talking stupid on steroids, try it sometime.
It’s downright disheartening what our culture has done to these poor souls.

Cleombrotus on May 13, 2012 at 2:12 AM

The East Village is a freak show. Its a shame because that’s where some of the best food and shops are.

The West Village is sane by comparison.

rickyricardo on May 13, 2012 at 4:51 AM

In fact, I’d say that a sure sign of political desperation is when a politician has to focus on the least-sophisticated and least-experienced voters to gain any traction. That’s a giveaway that their policies are probably too simplistic and unrealistic to sell elsewhere. One case in point: ObamaCare. Obama got a great deal of support from young voters on this policy — and now they will be forced to needlessly buy comprehensive health insurance at great expense when a simple catastrophic policy would suit their needs much more economically, in order to subsidize the health-care costs of middle-aged and senior voters. Suckers!

Suckers is right…they expected free health care..just like they expect free college and free housing..the youth culture could just as easily be described as the gimme culture.

And yet look at what these kids are dealing with…high unemployment and high cost of living. No wonder they move back home.

Terrye on May 13, 2012 at 6:12 AM

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