The State Dept: Saving the world, one clean cookstove at a time

posted at 10:41 am on May 7, 2012 by Erika Johnsen

Last week, much of the news revolving around Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s diplomatic visit to China was focused on the human-rights concerns surrounding blind Chinese dissident Chen Guangcheng. His developing case overshadowed some of the more ho-hum activities on the State Department’s agenda, such as successfully convincing China to sign on to several new “eco-partnership” projects — for instance, joining the Global Alliance for Clean Cookstoves. Clinton launched the public-private initiative two years ago, and the premise of its mission statement, “to save lives, improve livelihoods, empower women, and combat climate change by creating a thriving global market for clean and efficient household cooking solutions,” may be well-meaning but in practice is patently ridiculous:

“This illustrates once again that the United States and China can and will work together in new ways and through many channels to address our common challenges on energy and the environment, two issues that transcend politics,” Clinton said at a ceremony marking the cookstove agreement. She did not address the Chen situation in her remarks. …

The total U.S. commitment to the cookstove project so far is $105 million. …

“By joining the Global Alliance for Clean Cookstoves, China is taking an important step towards reducing the enormous health, gender, economic and environmental risks associated with inefficient and polluting cookstoves, both in China and in developing markets around the world,” the U.S. State Department said.

China will help establish global performance standards for cookstoves and work with domestic manufacturers to meet these standards. It also will launch an international stoves research center to create high-performing domestic stoves for global markets.

Many environmentalists are quite taken with the whimsical notion that prosperous societies are the world’s most dangerous polluters, and that, if we would all just commit to leading more simple, rustic lives with less technology, the planet would be better off — but they could not be more mistaken. Modern conveniences contribute to a level of efficiency that allow more people to live better lives using fewer resources, and free-market innovations and progress contribute to bettering the planet on a daily basis. People who aren’t worried about scratching out a bare-minimum survival level also have the luxury of choosing alternatives in considering how their actions will affect the planet. Wealthier societies are, in fact, healthier societies!

The World Health Organization estimates that there are more than 540,000 premature deaths in China every year as a result of 80 percent of households relying on ‘solid fuels’ (such as wood and dung) for their energy needs. But these people aren’t burning solid fuels because of a lack of “global performance standards for cookstoves” — they do it because they are veritable peasants living under the inescapable, crushing poverty of a totalitarian communist regime and have to resort to burning refuse to stay alive.

The root of the real problem here is, of course, communism — and perhaps, in the long term, shallow feel-good ties like “eco-partnerships” will eventually help to move China away from its evil communist ways toward a more open, free-market society. That’s why I think Chen Guangcheng’s story is an important one: only good can come from shedding light on the disgusting state of human rights in China and demonstrating to the world that America is a safe haven of freedom. I just hope the State Department isn’t operating under the delusion that promoting worldwide cookstove standards is going to be a penetrating, productive tool in lifting China’s peasant hordes out of poverty and misery.


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Clean-Cookstoves…that’s what these clowns are all about!

KOOLAID2 on May 7, 2012 at 10:45 AM

So who’s the leftist bundler that owns the cook stove company?

Chitcago way and all.

MNHawk on May 7, 2012 at 10:45 AM

Now what the hell does Hillary know about cook stoves?

That China trip was to supplicate themselves (Hillary and Timmy), kow-tow in grand fashion, and beg, truly beg, China to be beneficent and loan us another trillion or so to stabilize things until after November.

coldwarrior on May 7, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Hillary is going to empower women in China?

KOOLAID2 on May 7, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Out: Fiddle

In: “Clean” cooktop

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 10:47 AM

Gender?

Along with cleaner cooking devices, they want more Chinese men to do the cooking?

Good luck with that.

BobMbx on May 7, 2012 at 10:47 AM

This from Hillary “I suppose I could have stayed home and baked cookies” Clinton. Delicious.

Paul-Cincy on May 7, 2012 at 10:47 AM

Clean cookstoves? Another diplomatic triumph for Global Thinker Clinton and her amazing mad diplo skillz.

Scriptor on May 7, 2012 at 10:48 AM

Does dog cook better on a clean cookstove?

acyl72 on May 7, 2012 at 10:48 AM

80 percent of households relying on ‘solid fuels’ (such as wood and dung) for their energy needs.

Now I know why Obama is constantly sabotaging American energy production. He protects his market segment!

Archivarix on May 7, 2012 at 10:49 AM

Why shouldn’t everyone be able to buy the same type of stove Hill uses in Chappaqua?

Ben Hur on May 7, 2012 at 10:50 AM

the premise of its mission statement, “to save lives, improve livelihoods, empower women, and combat climate change by creating a thriving global market for clean and efficient household cooking solutions,”

Man, that is an awful lot to ask of a cookstove.

Happy Nomad on May 7, 2012 at 10:51 AM

China is trying to make capitalism, if you can call it that, work in a communist nation. In order for capitalism to work properly, a nation must have a free-market society. China thinks it can make both work, but, like my grandpa use to say, “It ain’ta gonna happen.” I believe China made the move in desperation in order to survive, and while it lasted, created massive growth in a short period of time. Now the time has come to “pay the piper” and it must face competition on top of totalitarian rule by it’s elitist government.

Think those workers are going to get paid substandard wages forever just to keep Beijing happy? Think again.

Turtle317 on May 7, 2012 at 10:53 AM

So who’s the leftist bundler that owns the cook stove company?

Chitcago way and all.

MNHawk on May 7, 2012 at 10:45 AM

This is the question everyone should be asking.

Follow the money.

tetriskid on May 7, 2012 at 10:53 AM

Hillary gives the little “Chinese woman”
a cookstove???

An yet turns her back on Chen, who was fighting to bring attention to the world of the missing 100,000,000 women that have been aborted or killed in China due to the one child policy in China.

Truly a “War on Women” is going on in China —but Hillary wants to upgrade their cookstoves ?? American can do a lot better than this!!

WHERE IS THE OBAMA STATE DEPARTMENT PRIORITIES IN CHINA ??

HILLARY’S CHINA POLICY IS IN DISARRAY !!

BigSven on May 7, 2012 at 10:54 AM

So will these stoves be burning Obama’s books that the State Department spend $79,000 on?

joekenha on May 7, 2012 at 10:54 AM

So will these stoves be burning Obama’s books that the State Department spend $79,000 on?

joekenha on May 7, 2012 at 10:54 AM

*spent

We need an edit button.

joekenha on May 7, 2012 at 10:56 AM

I’m confused as to why a country with forced abortion policies is suddenly concerned about premature deaths.

More importantly, it looks like Hilary has a slightly shorter do unless I’m mistaken. Maybe she’s realized that at a certain point you’ve grown your hair long enough.

pianomomma on May 7, 2012 at 10:56 AM

Global Alliance for Clean Cookstoves

Is this The Onion or Mark Steyn?

mudskipper on May 7, 2012 at 10:58 AM

May God help us all !
Sigh.

pambi on May 7, 2012 at 10:59 AM

Ed and Allah: I am no Obama fan and never will be. But if you guys think that that’s all State is doing these days, you need to read Walter Russel Mead’s blog. We’re actually in the best position in Asia that we have been in years, if not ever. There’s a lot more going on there than this meathead post implies.

Ed Snyder on May 7, 2012 at 11:00 AM

The total U.S. commitment to the cookstove project so far is $105 million. …

Could someone please tackle Hillary and take her checkbook away… SHE HAS NO MONEY! We have NO MONEY… WE are Trillions… upon Trillions in debt and what does she offer the Chinese … Easy Bake ovens to cook with? INSANE would be an upgraded mental condition.

If the blind Chinese dissident Chen Guangcheng, gets what he is asking for… which is to come to America, New York.. in general, to go to college… WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR HIM AND HIS FAMILY to do this? We have over half a million people being allowed into America each year for any manner of reasons from many nations…. at some point we just have to say… NO. We are in debt, we don’t have jobs for the people we already have here and a great number of people that can’t or wont work even if we magically all of a sudden did have jobs for them.

Send China instructions via internet (free) not $105 million… on how to build a cardboard solar oven and let them figure out how to cook their own food….and save the planet!

ActinUpinTexas on May 7, 2012 at 11:00 AM

Hillary is going to empower women in China?

KOOLAID2 on May 7, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Pretty soon, the fruits of the one-child policy will come to be seen, and China won’t have any women to empower.

Washington Nearsider on May 7, 2012 at 11:01 AM

So who’s the leftist bundler that owns the cook stove company?

Chitcago way and all.

MNHawk on May 7, 2012 at 10:45 AM

Good question, but the last time I looked they were made in the Philippines or China where they are already pretty populate (or so I thought). Still most are kerosene or gas, and the target people have no money or infrastructure for that either.

I priced a kerosene stove at about $50 US, and it would run like 20hrs on a quart of K1 (what about a week or 2 worth of cooking?)

I am surprised they didn’t promulgate the ‘solar oven’ as a solution?!. Lots of websites push these as ‘envrionmentally helpful’ or whatever in India and so on. They are also a lot more than $50 (but don’t use any fuel). The Sun! – it burns.

orbitalair on May 7, 2012 at 11:02 AM

The world laughs at us because of this kind of stuff…

PatriotRider on May 7, 2012 at 11:02 AM

But these people aren’t burning solid fuels because of a lack of “global performance standards for cookstoves” — they do it because they are veritable peasants living under the inescapable, crushing poverty of a totalitarian communist regime and have to resort to burning refuse to stay alive.

Welcome to the Obama Administration! “WE CAN DO IT”

Rovin on May 7, 2012 at 11:04 AM

So exactly what–or rather, who–is being cooked in China?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2140702/South-Korea-customs-officials-thousands-pills-filled-powdered-human-baby-flesh.html

This is macabre & infuriating.

China & South Korea have some sick, evil people.

But what’s worse, eating already dead children, or killing children, as millions in the US have?

itsnotaboutme on May 7, 2012 at 11:06 AM

Pretty soon, the fruits of the one-child policy will come to be seen, and China won’t have any women to empower.

Washington Nearsider on May 7, 2012 at 11:01 AM

The stats show that there are 119 men for every 100 Chinese women. Elderly parents spend the weekends in parks holding pictures of their sons trying to attract young women as future brides. They need their sons to stay in China and maintain a home because there is no social safety net for the elderly.

If the gap between men and women continues to grow, China could become the first gay super power since the Greeks. All joking aside, with that kind of testosterone flowing and the growing internal discord (there are more than 100,000 strikes and riots in China every year — and those are only the ones that the government tells us about), China may need a war to cull the male population.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 11:08 AM

Global Alliance for Clean Cookstoves

Are you f***ing kidding me? This is what foreign policy has become under ObaMao? This, plus ObaMao’s pathological need to appease Islamofascists, is a disgrace.

cicerone on May 7, 2012 at 11:08 AM

So we are paying people to clean cookstoves? Kind of like retrofitting houses with more insulation? So…are these green jobs?

Larr on May 7, 2012 at 11:10 AM

If the gap between men and women continues to grow, China could become the first gay super power since the Greeks. All joking aside, with that kind of testosterone flowing and the growing internal discord (there are more than 100,000 strikes and riots in China every year — and those are only the ones that the government tells us about), China may need a war to cull the male population.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 11:08 AM

Everybody was kung-fu fighting
Those cats were fast as lightning
In fact it was a little bit frightning
But they fought with expert timing

But seriously, that’s a good point. This is where the road to war begins.

cicerone on May 7, 2012 at 11:11 AM

The Obama “administration” are experts on shoveling/burning dung, so we should let them take the lead on this.

NoDonkey on May 7, 2012 at 11:15 AM

The people making the stoves are probably making out like bandits. Another socialist idea that’s bound to fail.

darwin on May 7, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Clean cookstoves? Another diplomatic triumph for Global Thinker Clinton and her amazing mad diplo skillz.

Scriptor on May 7, 2012 at 10:48 AM

And yet we’re supposed to believe that if Obama dumps Biden and convinces Hillary to join the ticket, it’s “game over”.

Smartest Woman in the World, my a$$.

Bitter Clinger on May 7, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Why shouldn’t everyone be able to buy the same type of stove Hill uses in Chappaqua?
Ben Hur on May 7, 2012 at 10:50 AM

Naw. It’s the new front in the war on womyn. Stoves should be free. $105 million should get about one million free stoves placed in homes without gas or electricity.

AH_C on May 7, 2012 at 11:18 AM

Many environmentalists are quite taken with the whimsical notion that prosperous societies are the world’s most dangerous polluters, and that, if we would all just commit to leading more simple, rustic lives with less technology, the planet would be better off

And we all know this by the environmentalists themselves…the ones who texted, tweeted and posted their comments on their Facebook pages.

Kingfisher on May 7, 2012 at 11:19 AM

^^

I should also mentioned that it is VERY highly likely that they posted their comments from their mobile smartphones.

Kingfisher on May 7, 2012 at 11:20 AM

I am surprised they didn’t promulgate the ‘solar oven’ as a solution?!. Lots of websites push these as ‘envrionmentally helpful’ or whatever in India and so on. They are also a lot more than $50 (but don’t use any fuel). The Sun! – it burns.

orbitalair on May 7, 2012 at 11:02 AM

“Sorry kid, its a cloudy day. You’ll have to eat your bugs raw today”

BobMbx on May 7, 2012 at 11:21 AM

$105 million of our greenbacks for a clean cookstove initiative?

O_o

Ya know, I’m thinking of moving to Lexington, Massachusetts so I can be near the action when it all finally boils over again.

Bishop on May 7, 2012 at 11:24 AM

Clean cook stoves? Nay, it’s all about the good stuff: powerful gasoline, a clean windshield, and a shoeshine!

Kraken on May 7, 2012 at 11:25 AM

Hillary Clinton – when Bourbon meets diplomacy – bad things happen

jake-the-goose on May 7, 2012 at 11:30 AM

I just told my wife to become empowered and go clean the kitchen. I’m now living in the garage.

Trafalgar on May 7, 2012 at 11:33 AM

It’s about the carbon stupid. (Sorry, economic spinoff)
Necessary prep for cap and trade. Oh did you think it went away? You can’t sell air until you can bottle it (appropriate sizes -family, single, latte). You can’t charge for carbon without standardization. Not to worry. Just another meter on the side of the house. Chicom’s getting their cut of course.

onomo on May 7, 2012 at 11:35 AM

for $105 million, those cookstoves better play all of Barry’s speeches as well.

TexasDan on May 7, 2012 at 11:40 AM

I just told my wife to become empowered and go clean the kitchen. I’m now living in the garage.

Trafalgar on May 7, 2012 at 11:33 AM

Luxury!

TexasDan on May 7, 2012 at 11:41 AM

Saints preserve us … please?
The ChiComs must be laughing their asses off – and justifiably so.
These are the same people, the Lumpenprolariat (serfs), who have to melt pig-iron in back-of-the-hut pits in order to survive, ferchrisake.
How can one NOT be embarrassed to be an American on the foreign state stage?
~(Ä)~

Karl Magnus on May 7, 2012 at 11:49 AM

Google “Ecozoom” and “Ecolite” stoves. No questions better stoves should be available for the unwashed masses. Less soot, less fuel from these things.

Seems to me that Hillary has got more important things to be doing. Maybe this is the only thing she can actually accomplish? Send some bucks to buy some stoves?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 11:55 AM

I just told my wife to become empowered and go clean the kitchen. I’m now living in the garage.

Trafalgar on May 7, 2012 at 11:33 AM

I’m confused. Did she clean the garage for you after she finished the kitchen?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 12:00 PM

These are the same people, the Lumpenprolariat (serfs), who have to melt pig-iron in back-of-the-hut pits in order to survive, ferchrisake.

~(Ä)~

Karl Magnus on May 7, 2012 at 11:49 AM

Is this a reference to the disastrous Great Leap Forward of half a century ago, or to China’s current position as the world’s largest producer and exporter of iron and steel products? Or something else?

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 12:01 PM

I’m surprised the Chinese could keep a straight face. “They want us to sign WHAT?”

GarandFan on May 7, 2012 at 12:01 PM

Knowing what I know about most of these next generation biomass cook-stoves being manufactured for the most part in China, I’m wondering why the workers paradise can’t spare a few of their own bucks to distribute these things throughout the land.

Hmmm….aren’t we supposed to be emulating their way of doing things? Yet they need our help just to provide basic necessities?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 12:09 PM

My husband just retired and is taking over a great deal of the cooking. He does dishes, but doesn’t wipe down surfaces. I’ve just kept silent and going behind him to silently clean the stove. Should I turn him in to the State Department right away? Or does he get a warning first that he’s destroying the planet first?

Portia46 on May 7, 2012 at 12:09 PM

Mark my words, at some point in the future, a crew cleaning out a UN warehouse is going to find $105M worth of cookstoves still in their original packaging.

Happy Nomad on May 7, 2012 at 12:10 PM

Portia46 on May 7, 2012 at 12:09 PM

Clearly Hillary didn’t mean “The cook-stove needs to be clean”.

Get an outdoor stove and kitchen area for him…

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 12:15 PM

$5 says she couldn’t even name the manufacturer of the stove in her own kitchen…let alone know if its gas or electric.

These are the people hat say they’re smarter than us…it must be true, they keep telling us daily.

BlaxPac on May 7, 2012 at 12:23 PM

Seriously, the clean cookstove initiative can be a high return use of aid. Higher efficiency means less fuel therefore less effort collecting fuel or less money spent. In areas that use wood, it decreases deforestation or stripping every twig within walking distance of the village. Using dung results in high particulates – levels which have a demonstrable and significant impact on health. This is not the BS EPA increase from 99.99% to 99.999% improvement but more like the huge step from 25% to 90%.

deadman on May 7, 2012 at 12:39 PM

cicerone on May 7, 2012 at 11:11 AM

Thanks. Here’s a heads up: Singing “Kung Fu Fighting” in the UK will get you charged with a hate crime.

Not. Kidding. Sadly.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 12:43 PM

It’s always fun to pick on the Commies and how they play with their little useful idiot pets. At the very least, it helps keep our mind off of what these same eco-freaks have done in Africa to protect all the precious mosquitoes. Because if you ever let your mind drift to that, you’ll start screaming and you’ll never stop.

logis on May 7, 2012 at 12:46 PM

$5 says she couldn’t even name the manufacturer of the stove in her own kitchen…let alone know if its gas or electric.

These are the people hat say they’re smarter than us…it must be true, they keep telling us daily.

BlaxPac on May 7, 2012 at 12:23 PM

You raise a good point. I’ll bet pretty little Hillary has not cooked anything since 1980.

arnold ziffel on May 7, 2012 at 12:48 PM

deadman on May 7, 2012 at 12:39 PM

Several of these are available for camping/emergency/recreational use. Ecozoom, Biolite, StoveTec, WoodGas are brands that are available. These are great just in terms of conservation of wood/fuel/forest. The things are kind of neat if you are into outdoor stuff.

You can also “donate” one to “cooks” who need them. Ecozoom will put a stove aside for every one that they sell. They focus most on getting stove to Mexico.

I’m still just kind of curious about how China, India etc. can’t seem to get these low cost devices manufactured and distributed without us having to pour money on them. It doesn’t cost more than 40 or $50 bucks out the factory door to make these…in some cases, even less.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 12:51 PM

You raise a good point. I’ll bet pretty little Hillary has not cooked anything since 1980.

arnold ziffel on May 7, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Au contraire! She has roasted Bubba’s nutz many times since 1980.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Has Chen been given up for a gold star next to Hillary’s name?

oldbearak on May 7, 2012 at 1:00 PM

This is what I don’t get when certain NYT columnists continually promote emulation of China; China is only able grow at the rates they have because they exploit their labor. And yet, certain NYT columnists routinely suggest we should take their lead and operate similarly. Except that we can’t and won’t exploit labor. It’s mind-boggling.

It’s also funny how environmentalists want us to turn back the clock on technology except for transportation. We should all drive electric cars but have no electricity in our homes to recharge our electric cars.

It’s bizzaro world.

BKeyser on May 7, 2012 at 1:09 PM

I guess now they will all have electric cook stoves – powered by a small generator running on wood and/or dung. Progress!

Odysseus on May 7, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Allow me to toss in a bit of monkey wrench here.

Yes, the Hillary-led State Department has been a wretched hive of fail and suckitude.

But.

A clean-burning cookstove is an efficient cookstove, and efficient cookstoves cost less to run, meaning more money to sepnd on other things like, oh, say, food. If clean cookstoves and other “appropriate technology” helps the Third World get more prosperous, faster, what’s the harm?

Seems to me like they’re just benefitting from our knowledge about what works and what doesn’t.

Given a choice between thirty-seven gazillion dollars spent on the major infrastructure developments that turn out to be nothing more than edifices to local greed and corruption or spending a few bucks to make people’s live better right where they live, I’ll take the latter every single day.

Now, in theory, it should be private individuals and charities leading the way on this sort of thing, but until that day arrives, let’s help people help themselves.

ExUrbanKevin on May 7, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Au contraire! She has roasted Bubba’s nutz many times since 1980.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 12:55 PM

True enough but sleeping next to her would cause frostbite. Their relationship is just sick. Then they pretend that everything is “fine”.

arnold ziffel on May 7, 2012 at 1:12 PM

Death by dirty cookstoves? I would think that would compliment the one child program like a glove. What can Barry and Grannie Hillary be up to? Follow the money.

SpiderMike on May 7, 2012 at 1:13 PM

This is what I don’t get when certain NYT columnists continually promote emulation of China; China is only able grow at the rates they have because they exploit their labor. And yet, certain NYT columnists routinely suggest we should take their lead and operate similarly. Except that we can’t and won’t exploit labor. It’s mind-boggling.

It’s bizzaro world.

BKeyser on May 7, 2012 at 1:09 PM

Actually, there is nothing bizarre about it. One of the New York Times most famous journalists, Walter Duranty, wrote a series of articles on the Soviet Union in which he spoke glowingly about the country, its communist marvels, and the wonders of collectivism. Although he knew the truth to be otherwise, he wrote that there was NO systematic famine or food deprivation by Stalin in the Ukraine. For his writings on the USSR, he and the NYT were awarded a Pulitzer Prize.

Years later, even the NYT acknowledged his articles constituted “some of the worst reporting to appear in this newspaper;” however, the “reporting” was not bad enough for the NYT to return the Pulitzer it had won and it has fought every move to force the committee to revoke it.

In its time, the NYT has praised Mussolini, Hitler, Lenin, Stalin, Che and Castro. The real surprise would be if it condemned China. Now, that would be truly bizarre.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 1:17 PM

ExUrbanKevin on May 7, 2012 at 1:10 PM

I’ve always reasoned that China can’t let too much prosperity out of the bag for it’s people. If you keep them running around just to find fuel, water and food, they don’t have time to strike or protest.

What little modernisation they have allowed has brought nothing but trouble for them.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 1:20 PM

Au contraire! She has roasted Bubba’s nutz many times since 1980.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Probably didn’t take that long…not with that face staring at you…

“Those cold dead eyes…like a doll…”

BlaxPac on May 7, 2012 at 1:21 PM

True enough but sleeping next to her would cause frostbite. Their relationship is just sick. Then they pretend that everything is “fine”.

arnold ziffel on May 7, 2012 at 1:12 PM

To paraphrase you, “I’ll bet pretty little Hillary has not shared a bed with Bubba since 1980.”

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 1:23 PM

BlaxPac on May 7, 2012 at 1:21 PM

Ouch.

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 1:28 PM

Resist We Much on May 7, 2012 at 1:28 PM

To be fair, our fair haired SoS isn’t really a bad lookin gal, if she would just loosen up…well a lot!

She just has that “pinched faced” countenance you know?

Put a wimple on her head & a ruler in her hand and you’ll see exactly what i mean.

Of course, those of you that went to Catholic school back in the day when nuns were a force to be feared and reckoned with will get it…lol

BlaxPac on May 7, 2012 at 1:39 PM

I’ve always reasoned that China can’t let too much prosperity out of the bag for it’s people. If you keep them running around just to find fuel, water and food, they don’t have time to strike or protest.

What little modernisation they have allowed has brought nothing but trouble for them.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 1:20 PM

Take a look at my neighborhood in China last Thursday evening. Those are people out for an evening stroll after dinner, not scrounging around for food and water, nor striking or protesting.

At this point China doesn’t have any alternative but to continue letting prosperity continue to increase.

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 1:45 PM

The total U.S. commitment to the cookstove project so far is $105 million. …

Just $105 million? That’s less than the GSA spends on tips!

Richard Blaine on May 7, 2012 at 1:56 PM

Take a look at my neighborhood in China last Thursday evening. Those are people out for an evening stroll after dinner, not scrounging around for food and water, nor striking or protesting.

Photoshop.

Or, those folks are actually hunting moths and other nocturnal creatures to supplement their diet while in the Chinese version of a Potemkin Village.

BobMbx on May 7, 2012 at 1:58 PM

an important step towards reducing the enormous … gender… risks associated with inefficient and polluting cookstoves

So polluting cookstoves can make you lose your gender or something???

Pardon me while I go clean the stove…

taznar on May 7, 2012 at 2:02 PM

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 1:45 PM

What happens when China can’t meet it’s own consumer expectations that will be fostered from that initial prosperity? It’s a pretty picture you present, but one neighbourhood doesn’t indicate what is happening with the other 1.1 Billion people.

And the problem with individual prosperity is that people generally want individual freedom. They go hand in hand. When you make your own prosperous living, you want freedom. Either unsustainable prosperity has to be given in a Chinese war on poverty, or individuals will be free to prosper on their own at all levels. I guess I’m just sceptical that that can happen.

You know much more about China that I do. How much freedom will be allowed with growth of prosperity? How is China’s current path of commercial loan defualts in the 30% level going to be able to be sustained? It kind of indicates an Obama-like interference in commerce.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 2:06 PM

Photoshop.

Or, those folks are actually hunting moths and other nocturnal creatures to supplement their diet while in the Chinese version of a Potemkin Village.

BobMbx on May 7, 2012 at 1:58 PM

Bats mostly I’d guess. There are quite a few little ones flying around there. I guess they already ate the big ones ;)

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:07 PM

From the linked website:

Partners ~

*Founding Partner

National
•Canada
•Denmark
•Finland
•Germany
•Ireland
•Italy
•Malta
•The Netherlands
•Norway*
•Spain
•United Kingdom
United States of America*

Platinum ($5 million and up)
•Dow Corning Corporation
•Shell*
U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (National Institutes of Health and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention)*

Gold ($1 million to $5 million)
•U.S. Department of State / Agency for International Development*
•U.S. Department of Energy*
•U.S. Environmental Protection Agency*

*waving arms*

Hey! I know where we can save some taxpayer money!

Fallon on May 7, 2012 at 2:08 PM

What happens when China can’t meet it’s own consumer expectations that will be fostered from that initial prosperity? It’s a pretty picture you present, but one neighbourhood doesn’t indicate what is happening with the other 1.1 Billion people.

And the problem with individual prosperity is that people generally want individual freedom. They go hand in hand. When you make your own prosperous living, you want freedom. Either unsustainable prosperity has to be given in a Chinese war on poverty, or individuals will be free to prosper on their own at all levels. I guess I’m just sceptical that that can happen.

You know much more about China that I do. How much freedom will be allowed with growth of prosperity? How is China’s current path of commercial loan defualts in the 30% level going to be able to be sustained? It kind of indicates an Obama-like interference in commerce.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 2:06 PM

This one neighborhood didn’t even exist when I first visited the area 22 or so years ago. It was just dark, as was most of the city. It was intended as a counter-point to your statement that ‘China can’t let too much prosperity out of the bag for it’s people. If you keep them running around just to find fuel, water and food, they don’t have time to strike or protest’, as if that was an intentional goal of the government. I don’t think it is.

Having seen a lot of the country over a few decades, it’s certainly true that there are still very many people living in poor conditions, but almost everyone’s conditions have improved substantially during that time, and I think they’ll continue to improve for quite a while longer. It is already a mostly private, market-driven economy now.

Most Chinese are intelligent, have a strong work ethic and a desire to improve their own condition. I think greater freedoms will come gradually, but at least for now most people care first about continuing to improve their economic condition.

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:28 PM

Clinton launched the public-private initiative two years ago, and the premise of its mission statement, “to save lives, improve livelihoods, empower women, and combat climate change by creating a thriving global market for clean and efficient household cooking solutions,”

Because everyone knows a woman’s place is in the kitchen with the stove right?

What was that about a war on women?

weaselyone on May 7, 2012 at 2:32 PM

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:28 PM

Good. But does the Democratic Oops…:), the Communist party want conditions improved? And can they sustain the improvement?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 2:39 PM

For balance, let me also link this picture which is probably more aligned with popular perceptions of China. It’s in the same neighborhood as the first one. Not so pretty, but no shortage of food (it was taken after the morning rush). In fact the first picture is more representative of Shanghai, but this reality exists too.

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:45 PM

So we call China and ask them to spot us 105 million so we can donate stoves to their people?

In a leftist head, that would make us look compassionate.

seven on May 7, 2012 at 2:48 PM

the Communist party want conditions improved? And can they sustain the improvement?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 2:39 PM

I think they do, since at this point their survival depends on it. How much longer the CCP will actually retain it’s current position is an open question. In any case I’m confident China will retake her position as the world’s #1 power within the next 30 ~ 50 years. She’ll certainly have the top spot in terms of total GDP within 10 years.

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:52 PM

the premise of its mission statement, “to save lives, improve livelihoods, empower women, and combat climate change

SEXIST!!!

askwhatif on May 7, 2012 at 3:02 PM

For balance, let me also link this picture…..

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 2:45 PM

Yum, yum, yum….Lotus root, chinese ameranth, choy sum, bok choy, etc. Where are the chickens? Are the chickens a couple alley-ways over from this? No vegetable market noodle vendors?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 3:08 PM

Wait a minute, I think I’ve got this:
Hillary wants to marry a woman to cook for her?
.
.
…and Bill does the happy dance, for several reasons.

askwhatif on May 7, 2012 at 3:09 PM

Yum, yum, yum….Lotus root, chinese ameranth, choy sum, bok choy, etc. Where are the chickens? Are the chickens a couple alley-ways over from this? No vegetable market noodle vendors?

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 3:08 PM

For the live-till-you-buy fresh chickens just turn left at the end of the alley and see this guy.

For fresh hand-cut noodles you’ll have to go out a block to the main road.

DarkCurrent on May 7, 2012 at 3:14 PM

’m still just kind of curious about how China, India etc. can’t seem to get these low cost devices manufactured and distributed without us having to pour money on them. It doesn’t cost more than 40 or $50 bucks out the factory door to make these…in some cases, even less.

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Aaaahh, “Ancient Chinese secret…”

askwhatif on May 7, 2012 at 3:17 PM

You should have added the study done recently (say a few months ago maybe) that proved the cookstoves are dirtier and more ‘polluting’ than the typical way, such as brick or mud ovens. I believe it was done by an Ivy or Cali school, possibly Standford. It was basically done by some organization that would normally be associated with enviro-(insert term).

There may have been an article on WUWT, if you want a refined search, though I’m not sure.

John Kettlewell on May 7, 2012 at 3:22 PM

I notice the noodle vendor isn’t using a third-generation biomass stove. I guess nobody told Hillary that the things just wont keep a large cauldron of noodles boiling, or a family size wok hot enough to finish any more than a single portion at a time. Believe me I’ve tried both with these things. Even with a cheesy western style wok you can’t get it done and have to turn to a large propane unit.

Severe food jealousy is overtaking me at the moment …..must ….calm….down….ack….where is my oyster sauce and my wok….come here my little chicken….

oldroy on May 7, 2012 at 3:23 PM

The State Dept: Saving the world, one clean cookstove at a time

Wow!!! This is even better than a few years ago when Fidel Castro gave everyone in Cuba a new rice cooker!!!

RJL on May 7, 2012 at 4:08 PM

Rocket stoves are good tech regardless of the politics here. Biolite if they ever actually release a product (supposedly next month) and it works, it would be silly to not have a cooking option that can power small lights/recharge batteries. Easier to find biomass/wood than get various liquid/gas fuels.

oryguncon on May 7, 2012 at 8:00 PM