Anti-bullying hero bullies conference of school children

posted at 11:46 am on April 28, 2012 by Jazz Shaw

Barack Obama and Joe Biden may be having second thoughts about assigning Dan Savage as their de facto “Anti-Bullying Czar” this year. According to Fox News, the sex advice columnist – Savage Love – and gay rights activist who founded It Gets Better seems to either have a hard time understanding the definition of bullying or has some serious issues with irony.

Really? So you picked a raunchy sex advice columnist who publishes a column called “Savage Love” as your ambassador to help out at risk children. What could possibly go wrong? Well, here’s what can possibly go wrong.

As many as 100 high school students walked out of a national journalism conference after an anti-bullying speaker began cursing, attacked the Bible and reportedly called those who refused to listen to his rant “pansy asses.” …

Savage was supposed to be delivering a speech about anti-bullying at the National High School Journalism Conference sponsored by the Journalism Education Association and the National Scholastic Press Association. But it turned into an episode of Christian-bashing.

Rick Tuttle, the journalism advisor for Sutter Union High School in California, was among several thousand people in the audience. He said they thought the speech was one thing – but it turned into something else.

“I thought this would be about anti-bullying,” Tuttle told Fox news. “It turned into a pointed attack on Christian beliefs.”

Tuttle said a number of his students were offended by Savage’s remarks – and some decided to leave the auditorium.

“It became hostile,” he said. “It felt hostile as we were sitting in the audience – especially towards Christians who espouse beliefs that he was literally taking on.”

The speaker, in a supposed attempt to encourage young people to behave in a civil fashion toward each other, immediately launches into a diatribe against Christian values. When some of the students – particularly a few of the young ladies – become offended, he berates them and engages in hostile name calling. This is the keystone of the anti-bullying campaign?

For anyone to be shocked by this outcome, you’d either have to be completely ignorant about the author’s history or … well… have a job at the White House, I suppose. For just one brief sample of the aforementioned “Savage Love” wisdom, click here. But before you do, I have to warn you… the language in this column is absolutely not safe for work and not appropriate for children to read. Also, if you are easily offended, don’t read it either. (Or at least don’t say I didn’t warn you.) I will not be reprinting any of the quotables here today.

UPDATE: (Jazz) I won’t embed it here because of the NSFW language, but if you want to watch Savage’s speech (along with all of the Christian students walking out) you can do so here. Link provided via Twitter by Ningrim.

But wait! We have located what is likely the primary source material Dan Savage used in developing this program. Watch the video and be amazed.


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Actually, I was trying to be tongue in cheek, but without tonal inflections I’m guessing that didn’t get through in the printed text.

jaydee_007 on April 28, 2012 at 4:04 PM

Gotcha. ;)

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:04 PM

A child who is bullied is being subject to chronic physical or social threats.

thuja on April 28, 2012 at 3:57 PM

And being labeled a “homophobe” isn’t a social threat? Riiiight.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:06 PM

And for how many years have other countries’ governments recognized same-sex unions as a right, and as a category that can experience discrimination?

Not very long, see the bottom of the post you’re responding to and the entirety of my response to AZ Federalist.

You’re talking as if this concept is well-established in modern civilization. It isn’t.

No. I’m arguing that, in the west, the trend is towards acceptance of homosexuality as an identity and way of life. The polls indicate that trend line. That doesn’t mean that gay rights, in every state, can win ballot measures yet. Ballot measures, as you know, are about turn out and organization. I might also add that even the trendline on ballot measures, in terms of margin, is moving towards acceptance.

But you’re also revealing a shallow understanding of the history of Western civilization. Specifically, you fail to recognize that, until the 20th century, there were *very* few organized social movements around democratization and the expansion of rights for aggrieved minorities. No doubt, being a conservative, you’ll point to the American revolution. Which opposed a particular kind of tyranny enacted upon wealthy colonists…and then created a new government that happily justified the exclusion of all non-white people, all women and all non-propertied white men from the category of citizenship. The U.S. (and the rest of the West) gradually, over the course of the last two centuries got its act together in regards to expanding categories of citizenship and folding social movements which critiqued oppression into the arms of the state. The LGBT rights struggle is in that long genealogy and (as is normally the cast) its taking about two to three generations for it to come to pass. Think about the 100 years between slave emancipation and full citizenship rights for black people. We’re slow but we get around to things…eventually. The same is true for LGBT rights. I don’t really care where *you* individually stand on the issue and thats why I mocked your little “oh I’m the good one” comment. Who cares. Its not about you individually, its about broad societal trends. And the opponents of gay rights are on the wrong side of history.

Congratulations. Once again, you just excerpted a specific data set that supports your hypothesis, and dismissed analysis of anything beyond its borders.

Are you for real? You offered up one CBS report from 1960, used it to make sweeping claims about ALL OF HUMAN HISTORY, and then you accuse me of not offering up enough data points? Jesus H. Christ on a pancake.

My comment about anti-gay sentiments being natural are as a result of looking at the attitudes of societies and cultures throughout the rest of the world, and for the last few thousand years

“Anti-gay sentiment” would suggest that there was such a social category as “gay.” There wasn’t and so it is impossible to talk about “anti-gay sentiment” prior to the 20th century in the West. We can talk about the various systems of sexual categorization that exist and have existed in the West and throughout the globe over time. Including “in the U.S. before 1910″ (even though if you had read my post you would recognize that the period of fluidity I was referring to was before the interwar decades) but I just don’t believe you’ve actually read any of that literature. Would you care to point to evidence of “anti-gay sentiment” throughout human history?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:06 PM

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:04 PM

A mutation that ultimately fails when speaking strictly in biological terms. For any mutation to prevail it must have some sort of beneficial value to the organism. A mutation that stops reproduction kills itself in one generation amongst simpler life forms.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:09 PM

Mutations are natural. I know, you probably just bristled at the use of the word “mutation”, but if it is genetic, it is a mutation. A disinclination to reproduce, for a living organism, is a mutation.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:04 PM

Oh I agree. There’s nothing derisive about the word “mutation,” it just means a change from the original genetic programming. I happen to believe that homosexuality is natures means of population control. Which is often why the youngest son after 2-3 boys is significantly more likely to be gay.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:10 PM

If it is ‘Separation of Church & State’ how come only the angry LGBT man gets to spew hate about the Bible in School?

DANEgerus on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

A mutation that stops reproduction kills itself in one generation amongst simpler life forms.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:09 PM

So why isn’t there one human society on the planet without a segment of the population who experience same-sex desire?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Libfree still no evidence of a bunch of people being upset over the picture of two men kissing. I will take it that you admit you are FOS.

CW on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Well, I will say this much for the libfreeordie entity, at least it does try to put forth discussion points and positions for its viewpoints. They may be historical revisionism, fed from a “queer studies” agenda and syllabus, but at least it’s more than a couple of liberal talking points chosen at random from a response list — kind of like first level technical support scripts. Doesn’t make its points any more cogent or correct, but at least there is some amount of effort going into those posts. More like level 2 technical support.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:12 PM

Would you care to point to evidence of “anti-gay sentiment” throughout human history?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:06 PM

Spoken like someone who really, really doesn’t want to deal honestly with the topic of this thread. A billion meaningless words can’t hide the ridiculous but all-too-common hypocrisy of the Left.

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 4:12 PM

“Anti-gay sentiment” would suggest that there was such a social category as “gay.” There wasn’t and so it is impossible to talk about “anti-gay sentiment” prior to the 20th century in the West.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:06 PM

So homosexuality only began in the 20th century in the West? Homosexual behavior hasn’t occurred for thousands of years, and been addressed by governments? Oookay.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:12 PM

Actually even your first paragraph is revisionism as well. Has that desire manifested itself? Yes Was it embraced by those societies in which it was manifested? Not in those societies that endured.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 3:59 PM

Evidence please.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

Are you in the habit of defending hate speech?

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 4:03 PM

Yes. I believe in the Freedom of Speech as a sacred moral duty for each of us. By the Freedom of Speech, I mean not just the Freedom itself, but the moral insight that is behind it: we should all learn to not let what other people say bother us. I also think we should try to treat each other well, but there is little empirical evidence that we will ever live completely without harsh words to each other.

I also want to repeat that a bullied child is a chronic victim.

thuja on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

So why isn’t there one human society on the planet without a segment of the population who experience same-sex desire?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Because homosexuality probably isn’t genetic. It is most likely a hormonal malfunction during pregnancy in my view.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

For any mutation to prevail it must have some sort of beneficial value to the organism. A mutation that stops reproduction kills itself in one generation amongst simpler life forms.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:09 PM

Not if that mutation leads the creature to behavior that releases dopamine, which will allow it to possibly overcome its limitations and reproduce.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

So homosexuality only began in the 20th century in the West? Homosexual behavior hasn’t occurred for thousands of years, and been addressed by governments? Oookay.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:12 PM

Homosexual behavior and homosexual identity are not the same thing…..

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

A mutation that stops reproduction kills itself in one generation amongst simpler life forms.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:09 PM

So why isn’t there one human society on the planet without a segment of the population who experience same-sex desire?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Your(as you use it) not real bright.

CW on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

Because homosexuality probably isn’t genetic. It is most likely a hormonal malfunction during pregnancy in my view.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

Well our creator deemed that it is a hormonal malfunction that would occur at relatively similar rates throughout all humans. Wonder why he didn’t point that out to folks who penned the Bible. Would’ve saved people a lot of grief.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

Evidence please.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

Funny . You still have not even supported your contention that there was a big uproar about the picture .

Too much you hypocritical bit*h.

CW on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

Evidence please.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

Start with the fall of Greece, then move on to the fall of the Roman empire, fed largely by the debauchery in the capital of Rome itself.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

thats why I mocked your little “oh I’m the good one” comment. Who cares.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:06 PM

Leftists truly are blind to the concept of civility. Get this through your head: you bully people, and then you mock them for not wanting to listen to your bullying. You are IDENTICAL to Savage in this blind spot.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:16 PM

You’d better believe Savage would be calling that person a bully. Fact of the matter is is that Savage is a bigot. Pure and simple.

Zaggs on April 28, 2012 at 4:02 PM

You’ve hit on an important point. Savage NEEDS to be victim to justify his being a bigot and bully. He could have stuck to the “It gets better” theme he was supposed to talk about. But, by making it into an anti-Christian rant, he gets to claim victimhood and gets useless idiots defending the way HE was treated. How dare those students walk out on HIM?

Happy Nomad on April 28, 2012 at 4:16 PM

Savage is trying to defend himself on Twitter. Fail.

Blue Collar Todd on April 28, 2012 at 3:57 PM

Checked those tweets, and he says he later praised the Bible… yada, yada.
The vid links I have only cover 3+ mins, of the verbal assault, and kids walking out.
Anyone know where one can watch the entire thing ?

pambi on April 28, 2012 at 4:17 PM

If it is ‘Separation of Church & State’ how come only the angry LGBT man gets to spew hate about the Bible in School?

DANEgerus on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of Religion, nor limiting the free exercise thereof.

Please note that it says AN establishment of religion.

Not Any establishment
Not The establishment

AN establishment.

That is to say, Congress is not allowed to Pick One! (like say Gaea, the Green Church?)

but it also says Nor Limiting the Free Exercise Thereof.

This is where I always enjoy the Logic Pretzles of the Left trying to explain how Limiting the Free Exercise Thereof is the only way not to Respect an Establishment.

jaydee_007 on April 28, 2012 at 4:17 PM

Homosexual behavior and homosexual identity are not the same thing…..

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

The one does not lead to the other? I’ve yet to meet a homosexual that would claim that.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:18 PM

I also want to repeat that a bullied child is a chronic victim.

thuja on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

You would have a point if we did not make it a crime for that bullied child to make a stand. As it is, if the child stands up for himself, he is the one who is often punished.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:19 PM

They may be historical revisionism, fed from a “queer studies” agenda and syllabus

Calling something “revisionist” or “queer studies” is only descriptive, it doesn’t actually challenge any of the arguments being made. But I accept your backhanded compliment.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:19 PM

AZfederalist, I am glad that you notice that libfreeordie actually discusses these issues. Some people were getting him confused with liberal4life for a bit, but I never understood how. The guy isn’t a troll. He sees things from a left-wing POV, but he doesn’t post and run.

Oh, and he can even be a bit charming at times.

McDuck on April 28, 2012 at 4:21 PM

The one does not lead to the other? I’ve yet to meet a homosexual that would claim that.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:18 PM

All the homosexuals you’ve met were born after the development of gay identity and subjectivity in the West. And (like most people) are profoundly not curious about their history (or history in general). So why would they think critically about these things.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:22 PM

AZfederalist, I am glad that you notice that libfreeordie actually discusses these issues. Some people were getting him confused with liberal4life for a bit, but I never understood how. The guy isn’t a troll. He sees things from a left-wing POV, but he doesn’t post and run.

Oh, and he can even be a bit charming at times.

McDuck on April 28, 2012 at 4:21 PM

At times…but he/she cannot resist defaulting to the elitist mindset of a liberal who believes themselves to be morally superior to their ideological opponents, and therefore justified in utilizing tactics that they normally decry.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:22 PM

Yes. I believe in the Freedom of Speech as a sacred moral duty for each of us. By the Freedom of Speech, I mean not just the Freedom itself, but the moral insight that is behind it: we should all learn to not let what other people say bother us.

Then you really need to be lecturing the side of the spectrum that promotes political correctness. We’re simply pointing out the hypocrisy of somebody like Dan Savage engaging in the kind of hate-filled rhetoric that he himself would condemn if the victims were gay kids. It’s the Left that is constantly screaming about “empathy” and “sensitivity” and “civility.” And yet here is Savage violating all of those things, despite the fact that he’s supposed to be opposed to all forms of bullying. And yes, his behavior qualifies. And I’m waiting for you to say whether or not you would be defending the obnoxious behavior of a heterosexual speaker who was deliberately insulting gay kids. Would you be insisting that the gay kids “toughen up” or whatever.

I also think we should try to treat each other well, but there is little empirical evidence that we will ever live completely without harsh words to each other.

I also want to repeat that a bullied child is a chronic victim.

thuja on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

Again, you need to be lecturing the folks on some Left-wing site. If, in fact, you really feel this way, rather than simply trolling around. Don’t blame us for focusing on the hypocrisy. It’s just too blatant to ignore.

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 4:22 PM

Well our creator deemed that it is a hormonal malfunction that would occur at relatively similar rates throughout all humans. Wonder why he didn’t point that out to folks who penned the Bible. Would’ve saved people a lot of grief.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

And psychotics most, many of which suffer a chemical imbalance in the brain, should be embraced as well because God made it so….

You are not making a logical argument, you are making an anti-theist argument.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:23 PM

Libfree that’s what I thought. You hypocrite.

CW on April 28, 2012 at 4:24 PM

All the homosexuals you’ve met were born after the development of gay identity and subjectivity in the West.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:22 PM

That development has been significantly rapid in the last century, so your implication is flawed. I’ve known people who knew they were gay in the 1940s, when it was still barely discussed.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

The one does not lead to the other? I’ve yet to meet a homosexual that would claim that.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:18 PM

All the homosexuals you’ve met were born after the development of gay identity and subjectivity in the West. And (like most people) are profoundly not curious about their history (or history in general). So why would they think critically about these things.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:22 PM

Scratch that. You may know gay or lesbian people, but I doubt how close you are to any of them. Anyone who really knows a gay or lesbian person knows that every gay or lesbian person has had sex with someone who will, with a straight face, “oh yeah, we did all of that stuff, but I’m straight, I’m not gay.” McDuck, confirmation?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

Thuja also is just another hypocritical tool .

CW on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

The bottom line is that from the perspective of the mainstream media, which is to say the Left, it’s okay to bully young people as long as they are not protected by political correctness. That means heterosexual Christians. That’s why Savage feels completely confident in doing what he did, even though he would be outraged if it were gay kids being needlessly insulted.

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 3:33 PM

.
Wrap it up boys and girls…

… cicerone just nailed it!

Seven Percent Solution on April 28, 2012 at 3:51 PM

.
cicerone “nailed it” alright, but don’t stop now.

We’re having too much fun. : )
.
Nothing quite like intolerant athiests (not to be confused with tolerant athiests) on parade.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

Life imitates entertainment. How many days until Mr. Savage is found jacking it in San Diego?

ray on April 28, 2012 at 4:26 PM

Anyone who really knows a gay or lesbian person knows that every gay or lesbian person has had sex with someone who will, with a straight face, “oh yeah, we did all of that stuff, but I’m straight, I’m not gay.” McDuck, confirmation?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

The DL phenomenon…That’s pretty common in the black community, isn’t it? Confirmation?

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 4:28 PM

You may know gay or lesbian people, but I doubt how close you are to any of them.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:25 PM

So now you’re passing judgment on the level of my relationships with people in my life? Wow. Just wow, pal. I could very easily do the same, but I know that’s about as relevant to the discussion as cotton candy. When you’re getting personal, you’re not winning the discussion, nor furthering your argument.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:28 PM

And psychotics most, many of which suffer a chemical imbalance in the brain, should be embraced as well because God made it so….

You are not making a logical argument, you are making an anti-theist argument.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:23 PM

I don’t like your term “embraced” it feeds into this conservative meme that what gay people really want to forcibly extract from the rest of society is “love and acceptance.” But you’ve got it, per usual Coach dear, switched around. Gay people *feel* rejected because of their second class citizenship status before the law. A second class citizenship that, unlike sociopaths and violent psychotics, doesn’t actually hurt anyone else. Based on your logic, shouldn’t all sociopaths be banned from marriage? Psychotics who aren’t a danger to others should be treated as full citizens.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Dan Savage is apologizing for something on Twitter, but I’m not sure what…

d1carter on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Must see video-
If you want to find out what Dan Savage is all about watch this-

Santorum VS Savage.

redridinghood on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Homosexual behavior and homosexual identity are not the same thing…..

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

And the homosexual lifestyle is yet another.

I’m willing to agree that there are those attracted to those of the same sex and it is innate not learned behavior. I am willing to agree that, as a society, we should be open to the idea that some people identify themselves as homosexuals. That doesn’t mean that society should accept the practice of homosexuality as normal. In fact, since sex is at it’s core about reproduction of the species, homosexuality is NOT normal.

Which, aside from moral or religious reasons, the homosexual lifestyle is anti-social and should not be promoted as normal.

Happy Nomad on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Calling something “revisionist” or “queer studies” is only descriptive, it doesn’t actually challenge any of the arguments being made. But I accept your backhanded compliment.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:19 PM

No, revisionism does have a problem and you demonstrate it in spades. Your silly assertion that homosexuality was not recognized as an “orientation”, as if that is some sort of revelation in itself, until 1910 is absurd on its face. There is significant evidence that those of that orientation viewed it as an orientation, as did society, going all the way back to antiquity. As someone else pointed out, look up the army of Thebes for an example. That does not mean that it was generally condoned. Thus the notion that somehow, before the 1950′s that gay behavior was well accepted is absurd as is the idea that all of this orientation association was only “discovered” in the early 1900′s. Those books you quote were written by people with a specific political and lifestyle agenda. Those books are long on agenda and short on fact.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM

When you’re getting personal, you’re not winning the discussion, nor furthering your argument.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:28 PM

Dude, MadCon typed that with a straight face. *IRONY METER EXPLODES!!*

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM

While Christianity is an immoral belief system and its adherents are, of necessity, apologists for incredibly horrific evil, I suppose Savage shouldn’t have allowed to attack Christianity. Separation of Church and State and all.

Mitchell Heisman on April 28, 2012 at 4:31 PM

In fact, since sex is at it’s core about reproduction of the species, homosexuality is NOT normal.

So Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky didn’t have sex?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:31 PM

Actually even your first paragraph is revisionism as well. Has that desire manifested itself? Yes Was it embraced by those societies in which it was manifested? Not in those societies that endured.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 3:59 PM
.

Evidence please.

libfreeordie
on April 28, 2012 at 4:13 PM

.
Start with the fall of Greece, then move on to the fall of the Roman empire, fed largely by the debauchery in the capital of Rome itself.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

.
How about Sodom and Gomorrah?

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:32 PM

Because homosexuality probably isn’t genetic. It is most likely a hormonal malfunction during pregnancy in my view.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:14 PM

My own theory is that it’s a mental disorder, along the same lines of drug addiction and alcoholism. I also have as much proof as people that claim it’s a genetic trait…other than personal observation, none.

TugboatPhil on April 28, 2012 at 4:32 PM

McDuck, much appreciated. I’ve always had a fondness for your screen name as it makes me think of Duck Tales. And I have always tended to think of Scrooge McDuck as my favorite conservative. :)

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:32 PM

No dumbass. They fornicated.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:33 PM

Dude, MadCon typed that with a straight face. *IRONY METER EXPLODES!!*

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM

Feel free to quote where I’ve ever started questioning people’s personal relationships, or else get off that paper tiger you believe to be a high horse.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:33 PM

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:11 PM

If it is a mutation then it is recessive gene. It would continue to be carried in the population. Whatever its contribution to long term species reproduction it wouldn’t be eliminated.

chemman on April 28, 2012 at 4:35 PM

McDuck, much appreciated. I’ve always had a fondness for your screen name as it makes me think of Duck Tales. And I have always tended to think of Scrooge McDuck as my favorite conservative. :)

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:32 PM

And libby is now completely checked out of the relevant conversation… Any topic is preferable to the one about Left-wing hypocrisy in condoning hate speech because the speaker is of the correct political and sexual persuasion.

cicerone on April 28, 2012 at 4:35 PM

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM

Unfortunately, once again, like a liberal…instead of backing off from tactics they decry, in typical hypocritical fashion, they create a double standard by justifying their use of tactics when their passions are flared over an issue they’re discussing. In all seriousness, it’s sad and frustrating, and especially infuriating when they turn around and accuse us of “lowering the tone”.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:36 PM

Start with the fall of Greece, then move on to the fall of the Roman empire, fed largely by the debauchery in the capital of Rome itself.

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

You mean those societies upon which the ideological foundation of Western civilization was built? And which survived for hundreds and hundreds of years and spread their territory across the fricking globe before collapsing under their own weight? You mean *those* examples of the “destrucrtiveness of homosexuality.” Jeez, homosexuality must *suck* (pun intended) at destroying societies if it didn’t manage to do so until AFTER the Greeks and Romans permanently altered human history. Jeez, homosexuality, you’ve *really* got to get your act together if you’re going to keep this reputation for societal destruction.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:36 PM

In fact, since sex is at it’s core about reproduction of the species, homosexuality is NOT normal.

Happy Nomad on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

.
So Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky didn’t have sex?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:31 PM

.
Foreplay without copulation counts as “having sex”.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:36 PM

Pro-gray = anti-Christian.

This is as obvious as the purportedly right-wing pro-gay GOProud’s resounding silence on the closing of Catholic adoption agencies because they espouse traditional beliefs regarding marriage.

How long have these institutions been in business only to knocked out for unlawful discrimination the day after gay “marriage” gets recognized?

This has happened in every state and every nation where the gay Reich movement takes hold. It is the best leverage for the abolition of faith.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:37 PM

redridinghood on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Thank you for providing that link. I don’t think I ever heard of this putz before but he clearly is quite the darling among gay activists and the idiots who support them.

Happy Nomad on April 28, 2012 at 4:38 PM

The New Secular Inquisition

Music to read by: U2

http://predicthistunpredictpast.blogspot.com/2012/04/new-secular-inquisition.html

Liberals: Out: Cigarettes. In: Exploding Cigars.

Music to read by: Queen

http://predicthistunpredictpast.blogspot.com/2012/04/liberals-out-cigarettes-in-exploding.html

Resist We Much on April 28, 2012 at 4:38 PM

Pro-gray = anti-Christian.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:37 PM

I love earl grey tea. Guess I must be anti-Christian.

I’m also pro-gay. Now go ahead and call me anti-Christian so I can stop spending my time defending Christianity from atheist and liberal d*ckheads who spend their time demeaning and smearing it.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:38 PM

So Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky didn’t have sex?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:31 PM

Apples and oranges. Per the neo-darwinian synthesis the purpose of sex is the spread genes in the gene pool to enhance the long term viability of the species (not the individual).

Of course they stimulated their sexual organs and and apparently got off on it. In a non scientific definition they had sex.

chemman on April 28, 2012 at 4:40 PM

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:29 PM

Homosexuals aren’t banned from marriage. Let’s put this in simpler terms for you though. Any prenatal issue that can be diagnosed and treated (abortion is not a treatment) usually is. If chemical imbalances that lead a psychosis can be treated before birth why not a hormonal imbalance that leads to homosexuality? Procreation is hardwired into our bodies, so what benefit would a parent gain by not treating for such an hormonal imbalance?

While we tend not to discriminate against those who do not demonstrate violent intent we still try to remedy those things we feel are not correct in people even if they don’t lead to violent behavior. Therefore there is no reason to assume God embraces homosexuality when homosexuality has no useful benefit to the human condition. Regardless, people are born with a multitude of afflictions, but most of us do not bemoan the fact that God was not created in our own image. We accept that this mortal life is a challenge built upon free will. If life were perfect there would be no point to free will.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:41 PM

Being politically active homosexual does not make one a cuddly minority. This should be obvious, but lefties do not understand that it is not just syntax and intention but also semantics and consequences.

They do not see reality unless it jibes with their heavily-filtered preconceptions.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:41 PM

How about Sodom and Gomorrah

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:32 PM

Fairy stories don’t count.

Feel free to quote where I’ve ever started questioning people’s personal relationships, or else get off that paper tiger you believe to be a high horse.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:33 PM

The statement that detonated my irony meter into smithereens was “when you’re getting personal, you’re losing the argument.” I lurked around here a while before signing up. Lets just say you have a reputation for going for the jugular. So it is extremely hypocritical for you to *shut it down* when I made the teensiest implication that, whoever the gay and lesbian people in your life are, you appear to not be close in a way that you would not that obvious fact about their relationship or sexual history. Trust me when I say, there are lots of people who engage in homosexual behavior who do not claim a gay or lesbian identity. The two are not the same at all.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:42 PM

Dude, MadCon typed that with a straight face. *IRONY METER EXPLODES!!*

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM

This.

Mitchell Heisman on April 28, 2012 at 4:42 PM

As for the fully automatic weapons in your home.

Class III License?

jaydee_007 on April 28, 2012 at 3:57 PM

No Class III license needed. Only the proper tax stamp for each individual item.

And why would you need to have the hammer down on an empty chamber of a double-action revolver? (Or even a ‘new model’ Ruger single action)

Solaratov on April 28, 2012 at 4:43 PM

I believe that gay pride parades are the worst thing to happen to gay rights and acceptance, and here, as always, it’s gay activists themselves who are their own worst enemy.

And did everybody notice what a horrible ignorance he demonstrates as to how the Bible and Christians played the fundamental role in abolition and civil rights movements in the US, England, etc?

BocaJuniors on April 28, 2012 at 4:43 PM

AZfederalist on April 28, 2012 at 4:15 PM

.
You mean those societies upon which the ideological foundation of Western civilization was built?

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:36 PM

.
That first line “cuts to the chase”.

You could say this whole thread has become the usual argument over what the “ideological foundation of Western civilization was built” realy was/is.

Myself (and others present) say the foundation of Western civilization is, and has always been, the Bible.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:44 PM

And why would you need to have the hammer down on an empty chamber of a double-action revolver? (Or even a ‘new model’ Ruger single action)

Solaratov on April 28, 2012 at 4:43 PM

One of my .357′s has the firing pin on the hammer, so I do so as a matter of habit, so it doesn’t matter which one I’m carrying.

jaydee_007 on April 28, 2012 at 4:45 PM

Foreplay without copulation counts as “having sex”.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:36 PM

Oral sex’s last name is “sex.” See Laura Bush is a Bush, even though there are other Bushes. George, Barbara and the like, they are all Bushes. Oral sex, is sex. It is a particular kind of sex. It even involves penetration no matter what combination of ways you do it. (Please do not make me draw a diagram for you, I fear as a glenn beck listener it may have been *ages* since you’ve engaged in any of these activities). But yes, they all count as sex.

Or are you one of those people who had anal sex as a teenager and claimed to be a “virgin” as some evangelical kids have done to skirt the “saving it for marriage” rules.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:45 PM

I’m also pro-gay. Now go ahead and call me anti-Christian so I can stop spending my time defending Christianity from atheist and liberal d*ckheads who spend their time demeaning and smearing it.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:38 PM

Tell me where this movement has not resulted in Christian oppression and suppression and some could be persuaded.

You ignore the reality at your own peril.

I need a lot more convincing before I publicly commit an act of faithlessness.

This coming from a former ardent supporter of gay rights. I abused my position as minority reporter in my college paper to include the campus homosexual group in a leap of logic I recognize now as having the right intentions but applying a false narrative.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:46 PM

Myself (and others present) say the foundation of Western civilization is, and has always been, the Bible.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:44 PM

And no one with half a wit takes such ahistoricist claims seriously. Here’s a notion, look up the meaning of B.C. check out the timeline of Greek history and then come back to us. Sheesh.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:47 PM

Pro-gray = anti-Christian.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:37 PM

Christians don’t hate old people. :0

As to the rest of your comments I’ll only say this. There is no state in the union where gay marriage came about by the will of the people. There has been no referendum where the plurality of the populace has voted in favor of gay marriage. The few states that recognize these unions do so through the edicts of either the state legislature or the judiciary. California even DID put it to a vote after legalizing gay marriage and it failed. Maryland’s recognition of sodomy (by one vote in the dark of the night when an opponent was so ill that she was in the hospital) is apt to be overturned in November.

Happy Nomad on April 28, 2012 at 4:48 PM

jaydee_007 on April 28, 2012 at 3:57 PM

.
No Class III license needed. Only the proper tax stamp for each individual item.

Solaratov on April 28, 2012 at 4:43 PM

.
No class III needed for a “fully automatic” firearm? ! !

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

Therefore there is no reason to assume God embraces homosexuality when homosexuality has no useful benefit to the human condition.

Not my concern, I care about citizenship categories.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

I lurked around here a while before signing up. Lets just say you have a reputation for going for the jugular.

So do many others. When people are not hostile, and not engaging in trolling tactics, I am civil. That is what I have been doing with you. If you don’t want to be civil, tell me now, because I’ve frankly lost interest in much of the spite-fueled arguments with ideological opposites. I had my fill at the Capitol during the protests against Walker, with people who would just insult me or laugh when I asked them a question regarding a double standard. I’m sick of immature brats that refuse to address their own beliefs, but are content to use them as a verbal cudgel. Are you one of these people or not?

So it is extremely hypocritical for you to *shut it down* when I made the teensiest implication that, whoever the gay and lesbian people in your life are, you appear to not be close in a way that you would not that obvious fact about their relationship or sexual history.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:42 PM

Teensiest? How cute. You outright start passing judgment on my personal relationships in my life, which have nothing to do with the discussion…and now you’re defending them by stating the claim that it was “teensy”?

You are a hypocrite. We’re talking in a thread about bullying, and repeatedly, I have had to point out your own bullying tactics. There’s no point in talking further if you can show no respect whatsoever for someone who disagrees with you. If anything, I’ve made a reputation around here for always looking at both sides of the argument critically and analytically, without the elitist scorn and snide that you’ve demonstrated here. When those on the other side of the argument continually refuse to engage without descending into ridicule, what is the point of dialogue with them? Please, tell me the point.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

libfreeordie, I prefer the Scrooge of the comics the most, but DuckTales was a solid cartoon. Even better were the two DuckTales games for the NES. True classics. Oh, how I wish they would make a DuckTales 3, but the CAPCOM of today isn’t what it used to be, so maybe I should be thankful that licensing issues make such a project unlikely.

McDuck on April 28, 2012 at 4:50 PM

Of course they stimulated their sexual organs and and apparently got off on it. In a non scientific definition they had sex.

chemman on April 28, 2012 at 4:40 PM

And we know how those Christians are so apt to go to science as our standard for law making and cultural norms…

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:51 PM

Tell me where this movement has not resulted in Christian oppression and suppression and some could be persuaded.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 4:46 PM

Um…pretty much the entire world pre-1990? While I am as disturbed as you at the businesses and religious organizations that have had to fight frivolous lawsuits regarding their desire not to do business with people they choose, homosexuals have had no power to oppress or suppress anyone throughout human history.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:51 PM

lol Jazz that South Park vid at the end of the post is the most hilarious comment anyone could make

WeekendAtBernankes on April 28, 2012 at 4:52 PM

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:44 PM

.
And no one with half a wit takes such ahistoricist claims seriously. Here’s a notion, look up the meaning of B.C. check out the timeline of Greek history and then come back to us. Sheesh.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:47 PM

.
“Checking the timeline” has no relevance to my statement that “Western civilization was founded on the Bible”.
.
Sheesh.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 4:54 PM

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

Why are you acting fresh and brand new? Do I occasionally throw in a jibe here or there intermixed with my otherwise sparkling analysis (/partial sarc)? Well yeah. But that’s part of what makes it fun. You’re being intellectually dishonest if you claim that *all* I’ve done this thread is badger, beat up and and bully poor Madison Conservative. Particularly in light of some of the truly nasty things you’ve said to people on this board, even to other conservatives. Its sort of adorbs to see you playing this rolled over puppy thing (but I won’t be scratching your belly, no matter how hard you wag your tail OK little guy?) but I don’t think anyone who’s had any serious interaction with you would ever buy it as for real. If you want to stop the discussion because you’re out of your depth historically and analytically, then fine. But its beneath you to pull this victim card. No one here is buying it.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:55 PM

libfreeordie, I prefer the Scrooge of the comics the most, but DuckTales was a solid cartoon. Even better were the two DuckTales games for the NES. True classics. Oh, how I wish they would make a DuckTales 3, but the CAPCOM of today isn’t what it used to be, so maybe I should be thankful that licensing issues make such a project unlikely.

McDuck on April 28, 2012 at 4:50 PM

Oh wow, you’ve taken it to a whole new level of nerd. I never read Disney comics, being a future radical lefty I was most enamored with all things X-men and Marvel generally. D.C. eventually as well, but Disney, couldn’t hang. As for Duck tales video games, that’s waaay down the nerd rabbit hole. I never could get into platformers that weren’t Mario. I was more the RPG, first person shooter, action/adventure etc. And also SNES was the first console I truly fell in love with. But lets not have too much fun, there are people with their feelings hurt and others who get really upset if anyone expresses joy or happiness on these threads.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:59 PM

Um…pretty much the entire world pre-1990? … homosexuals have had no power to oppress or suppress anyone throughout human history.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 4:51 PM

So, before the gay reich was politically organized, there was no was no religious oppression.

And now there is. We are talking about now, not pre-90′s.

And do not deign to paint an entire group as virtuous and ordained victims simply because you cannot think of any examples. When the stigma against committing homosexual acts was strong, of course there was no systematic oppression.

But if you think there is a single person or group of people who will never be faced with their own failings and hypocrisy, then you have no Christian understanding of the human condition, Christian.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 5:00 PM

Therefore there is no reason to assume God embraces homosexuality when homosexuality has no useful benefit to the human condition.
NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 4:41 PM

.
Not my concern, I care about citizenship categories.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

.
Am I wrong to interpret that as:

“I care about abolishing stigmatization”?

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 5:01 PM

And we know how those Christians are so apt to go to science as our standard for law making and cultural norms…

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:51 PM

The Creator of Gaia: The Science Is Not Settled

But, you “intelligent, wise, and enlightened” people have called for the mass executions of “climate change deniers,” the burning of their homes, the interment of “deniers” in reeducation or concentration camps.

“Surely it’s time for climate-change deniers to have their opinions forcibly tattooed on their bodies. Not necessarily on the forehead; I’m a reasonable man. Just something along their arm or across their chest so their grandchildren could say, ”Really? You were one of the ones who tried to stop the world doing something? And why exactly was that, granddad?”

- Richard Glover, Sydney Morning Herald, 6 June 2011

You guys sound exactly like medieval popes and your scientism has taken on all of the characteristics of the religions that you mock and despise.

Resist We Much on April 28, 2012 at 5:01 PM

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:55 PM

So, basically, you’re confirming that you don’t want to remain civil. That’s fine, but I’m not interested. I’ve been civil to you throughout this discussion. I thought you’d have sufficient awareness to extend the same courtesy, but apparently you’re not interested. I prefer civil conversation. If all you can do is ridicule that, like a bully, then I’m not interested in continuing this conversation.

Maybe you can call me a pansy ass for exiting…you know, like Dan Savage.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 5:02 PM

So, before the gay reich…

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 5:00 PM

*facepalm* Nice talking to you.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 5:03 PM

Savage attacks the Biblical passages for condemning homosexuality. But those same passages, particularly Leviticus, also condemn incest and bestiality, and child sacrifice. I guess Savage wants to normalize these things as well.

Blue Collar Todd on April 28, 2012 at 5:05 PM

The photo at this thread truly sickens me.

onlineanalyst on April 28, 2012 at 5:06 PM

*facepalm* Nice talking to doging you.

MadisonConservative

Fixed.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 5:07 PM

Not my concern, I care about citizenship categories.

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:49 PM

And that is where all of your problems start and end.

NotCoach on April 28, 2012 at 5:07 PM

I don’t much care about the gay rights movement. It doesn’t motivate me to go to the polls. What is a bit troubling is this bizarre offshoot of the gay rights movement that really is nothing more than a militant pervert movement. Savage falls into that group. These are the whack jobs that want to teach 4 year olds how to give b***jobs and middle schoolers to start fisting each other. Yuck. Keep these freaks on the fringe of society.

moonbat monitor on April 28, 2012 at 5:09 PM

libfreeordie on April 28, 2012 at 4:55 PM
I didn’t mean to insinuate earlier that you had been anti-Jew or anti-Mormon. I was just illustrating that there are differing opinions on where the power lies. Many self identified Christians choose to operate from a perceived position of authority as if their particular brand of faith has passed through some form of ultimate validation while others simply have pagan ideas not worthy of recognition. On this particular topic, I have not problem with the kids walking out; I would encourage kids to walk out of an anti-gay tirade. The problem is the delivery of some activists like Dan Savage. They claim to be advocates of tolerance and then use obscenities to smear those who don’t agree with them. If these high school kids are the sway able crowd, the more effective argument would be, “while each is entitled to there own beliefs, religious or otherwise, society must learn to act in more civil ways regardless of individual beliefs”. Not simply, demeaning a book that billions accept as the word of God. And while there are controversial scriptures, generally the bible doesn’t cause violence against gays any more so than
It causes adherents to pluck their eyes out after checking out a hot girl. My point is that pure liberalism is wonderful, accepting others and allowing them their agency, at all times, not just when they are like-minded.

Rusty Allen on April 28, 2012 at 5:09 PM

The photo at this thread truly sickens me.

onlineanalyst on April 28, 2012 at 5:06 PM

.
Yeah, I did a “double-take” on it as well.

listens2glenn on April 28, 2012 at 5:09 PM

Fixed.

StubbleSpark on April 28, 2012 at 5:07 PM

So sorry for dodging your equivocation of 3% of the population that like to have sex with each other to the goddamned Nazi Empire.

MadisonConservative on April 28, 2012 at 5:09 PM

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