Pew poll: Support for gun rights, gay marriage up since 2004 and 2008 campaigns

posted at 9:12 pm on April 26, 2012 by Allahpundit

I think a similar phenomenon is at work in both cases, as strange as that may sound, but I’m completely open to counterarguments. First the gay marriage numbers:

The most amazing thing to me about those trendlines is how steady they are across nearly every demographic. No matter how you slice the pie, with the important exception of religious groups, opposition drops about eight or nine points every four years; the only outliers are among Republicans, where it’s dropped 10 points total since 2004, and among blacks, where it dropped just four points between 2004 and 2008 and then a whopping 14 points from 2008 until now. While conventional wisdom holds that blacks are overwhelmingly opposed to gay marriage, the margin here between favorable and unfavorable has shrunk to just 10 points and the number who are strongly opposed is on par with whites. In fact, the only group that manages strong opposition above 40 percent is evangelicals, who are at 56 percent. (They’re also the only group that’s grown more strongly opposed over time.) I assume the broader population trend is due mainly to some gay-marriage opponents finding their worst fears of ill social effects unrealized as the practice has become more commonplace. That won’t sway all opponents — if you have a strong moral objection, you don’t need to reach the question of social effects to oppose gay marriage — but it’ll sway some. Note that even among seniors, opposition is creeping down towards 50 percent and strong opposition is already roughly on par with middle-aged adults.

Then there’s guns. Amazing:

That indie number will give you a good idea of why Democrats have stayed far, far away from this subject lately. This too is a policy matter on which black opinion is changing: 35 percent now say it’s more important to protect gun rights to own guns than to control gun ownership, more than double the number (17 percent) who said so in 2007. That puts blacks on par with women, 39 percent of whom say the same. (Really, ladies? Only 39 percent?) As for that astounding jump circa 2007, though, I’m eager to hear your explanations. My theory is that it’s a combination of the Heller litigation, which raised public awareness about the Second Amendment as a core American right, and increasing popular consciousness of the drop in crime rates over the last few decades. One of the key arguments for gun control is that the more freely available guns are, the more chaos there’s bound to be. Instead, empirically we’ve seen the opposite. Here too, then, as with gay marriage, you’ve got doubters who worried about ill social effects getting to see with their own eyes that the libertarian position isn’t nearly as dangerous in practice as they thought. Am I wrong about that? If so, what’s the alternative explanation? Media bias in favor of gay marriage is surely helping to nudge the numbers on that issue but I’m hard pressed to say that’s true for gun rights. Granted, Hollywood glorifies guns, but they’ve glorified guns since day one and only recently have we seen sharp movement in favor of gun rights in the polls.

Update: Ah, here’s an obvious alternative that should have occurred to me sooner: There’s a partisan effect on the gun question. Once you’ve got a liberal in the White House, Republicans and independents start to get nervous about gun-control measures being pushed and respond with a backlash. Not sure how that explains the rise in Democratic support during the first few years of O’s term, though. Maybe that’s rural Dems feeling the same fears?

Two other questions. If this is a partisan effect, why do the lines drop during Clinton’s presidency? And what’s with the jump after 2000? A reaction to 9/11 and terrorism, maybe?


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“Right wing fascist gay militias will be killing coloreds by the hundreds!”

-NYT and angryed

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

If gay marriage is so damn popular then how come it can only be legalized with an end run around the voters….?

NeoKong on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

If teh gheys get married it will destroy civilization so guns will be in high demand in the following chaos.

Pablo Honey on April 26, 2012 at 9:16 PM

Gun ownership was even going up among Democrats between 2007 to 2011.

I wonder why it started dipping again?

The Mexican drug gun violence on the southern border?

Dr Evil on April 26, 2012 at 9:17 PM

I think this simply measures the increasing impact of Glenn Reynolds.

beatcanvas on April 26, 2012 at 9:18 PM

If gay marriage is so damn popular then how come it can only be legalized with an end run around the voters….?

NeoKong on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

This is what I keep thinking. Maybe the people just don’t want to be characterized as bigots by the pollsters? If it’s so GD popular why not let people vote on it?

Living4Him5534 on April 26, 2012 at 9:18 PM

Support for Gay Marriage Shotgun weddings way up!

Where is the dog eating survey?

batterup on April 26, 2012 at 9:18 PM

If gay marriage is so damn popular then how come it can only be legalized with an end run around the voters….?

NeoKong on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

Exactly.

Look at the democrat party – the party homosexuals overwhelmingly favor. They won’t push gay marriage: why is that?

Because despite all these push polls, the fact is it’s simply not accepted by the American people. 31 States had a vote on the issue, and all of them rejected it.

It’s simply a wedge, to split off social conservatives from the GOP, to the profit of the democrat party.

People who want to force the GOP to advocate for homosexual marriage, do not have the party’s best interests in mind.

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 9:19 PM

And don’t forget that 09 JUN 2012 is National Take Your Daughter To The Range Day!

Remember the importance of teaching the basics of this vital human right.

ajacksonian on April 26, 2012 at 9:19 PM

Granted, Hollywood glorifies guns, but they’ve glorified guns since day one and only recently have we seen sharp movement in favor of gun rights in the polls.

Not to the same extent as now. Look at what’s on TV. You have shows like Top Shot, Sons of Guns, American Guns, etc. Then you have shows like The Walking Dead, etc. People see ordinary people in culture using weapons for defense or sport and anti-gun positions soften.

amerpundit on April 26, 2012 at 9:22 PM

Pew-pew.

chimney sweep on April 26, 2012 at 9:22 PM

This too is a policy matter on which black opinion is changing: 35 percent now say it’s more important to protect gun rights to own guns than to control gun ownership, more than double the number (17 percent) who said so in 2007.

Of course. The black community has finally stopped listening to anti-gun media and leaders and started paying attention to the high rates of violent crimes in their neighborhoods. They realize that the Second Amendment applies to them, as well. Well…I guess they don’t realize that in New York, Chicago, or LA, where the laws either totally or effectively prevent them from defending themselves.

MadisonConservative on April 26, 2012 at 9:23 PM

People like guns and generally don’t care what adults do in their bedrooms (or living rooms, etc).

SouthernGent on April 26, 2012 at 9:23 PM

Support for gun rights is only indirectly related to Obama and whatever he may do on the gun control front. But they are directly related to Obama and whatever he may not do on the economic/fiscal policy front. If you think “It’s The End Of The World As We Know It,” you’re gonna buy a gun to project life and property from the scavs.

Scopper on April 26, 2012 at 9:28 PM

I believe that two persons of the same sex should be able to engage in marital relations, BY THE LIGHT OF A 100 WATT INCANDESCENT LIGHT BULB, in the privacy of their own bedroom. Democrats disagree.

grgeil on April 26, 2012 at 9:29 PM

This is sort of OT:

Obama ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:31 PM

If you think “It’s The End Of The World As We Know It,” you’re gonna buy a gun to project life and property from the scavs.

Scopper on April 26, 2012 at 9:28 PM

This.

Gun ownership and firearms purchases have skyrocketed under the 0bama regime – for exactly this reason. And blue states have seen the biggest increases of all.

Americans instinctively feel that something is fundamentally wrong with what the progressives have done and are doing to the country, and are preparing for the worst, even if they cannot put it into words what it will be.

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 9:32 PM

Two other questions. If this is a partisan effect, why do the lines drop during Clinton’s presidency?

In 1994 we passed the Assault Weapons Ban, primarily in reaction to the crack epidemic scare of the late 80s/early 90s, and also in part due to rising media nuttery about violent video games. That entire atmosphere had people running from firearms in fear. The Oklahoma City bombing, as well as other “militiaman” incidents like the Montana Freemen also cast firearms(and by extension, promotion of firearms rights) in a poor light.

And what’s with the jump after 2000? A reaction to 9/11 and terrorism, maybe?

Partly that, and partly an elastic reaction to the media blitz over school shootings.

MadisonConservative on April 26, 2012 at 9:32 PM

If gay marriage is so damn popular then how come it can only be legalized with an end run around the voters….?

NeoKong on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

Agree! This has always puzzled me too! Gay marriage bans always win with the voters, but then some judge comes along and overturns it. But we’re suppose to believe it’s popular.

Well, also, some things can be popular when there’s a fear to speak the truth. Homosexual activists, like unions thugs, know a thing or two about how to intimidate.

JellyToast on April 26, 2012 at 9:35 PM

Once OBlah BLah and his Presstitutes unleash his racist panthers, his OWS stinkers and SEIU wanna be tough guys you will have your answer as to why gun ownership is up!
Its gonna be a long hot summer and I’m packin my heat.

ConcealedKerry on April 26, 2012 at 9:35 PM

Gay marriage will still fail every time it is put on a ballot.

The Notorious G.O.P on April 26, 2012 at 9:35 PM

On the gay issue…wanna blow your mind? Watch this segment from a 1967 CBS report on homosexuality, presented by the recently lost Mike Wallace. Fascinating to look nearly 50 years back in time and find people being so frank about the issue. What I find really odd? At one point, Wallace says that 1 in 10 people said they “hated” homosexuality. I think that number has actually increased over the years.

Honestly, what I think is even more mind-blowing than the overwhelming consensus of those interviewed is how…objective the report is. It sounds like nothing I’ve heard on television in 20 years. There’s barely a hint of bias or loaded words.

MadisonConservative on April 26, 2012 at 9:36 PM

Obama ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:31 PM

It was a gay dog, so it’s on topic.

John the Libertarian on April 26, 2012 at 9:39 PM

Libertarian Nation?

No, no! Karl “the douche architect” Rove says we are all socialists now. Plus, Orin Hatch will have to punch us all in the mouth.

Mr Galt on April 26, 2012 at 9:40 PM

Obama is great for gun ownership!

He is named the Gun Salesman of the Year… AGAIN!

You would think that with that industry making money hand over fist that the Democrats would at least try to subsidize part of it… write of ammo on your taxes or something…

ajacksonian on April 26, 2012 at 9:47 PM

The gay marriage support not translating into the voting booth I believe can be explained by Evangelicals outnumbering gays. A majority may support marriage equality, but many of those couldn’t be bothered to vote, which is what matters in a democracy. The people passionate about gay marriage are the very religious and the gays. It’s obvious who has the numbers.

Client Number Nine on April 26, 2012 at 9:48 PM

This won’t be a libertarian nation until the big government idiots people who frequent HotAir support are defeated.

Also, watch out, I hear you can catch teh ghey from reading a post online about it. Better get to your churches post-haste and pray it away.

Aquateen Hungerforce on April 26, 2012 at 9:49 PM

This won’t be a libertarian nation until the big government idiots people who frequent HotAir support are defeated.

Aquateen Hungerforce on April 26, 2012 at 9:49 PM

Then I guess this isn’t the site for you, is it?

MadisonConservative on April 26, 2012 at 9:51 PM

This is sort of OT:

Obama ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:31 PM

No problem..the dog was probably gay.

HumpBot Salvation on April 26, 2012 at 9:53 PM

People like guns and generally don’t care what adults do in their bedrooms (or living rooms, etc).

SouthernGent on April 26, 2012 at 9:23 PM

I don’t care what people do in their bedrooms.

When I tell someone to get off my lawn, I mean it.

ajacksonian on April 26, 2012 at 9:54 PM

OT but the Labor Dept folded on the Farm Kids bill…http://www.dol.gov/whd/media/press/whdpressVB3.asp?pressdoc=national%2F20120426.xml

lovingmyUSA on April 26, 2012 at 9:54 PM

Client Number Nine on April 26, 2012 at 9:48 PM

Homosexuals are around 2% of the population, Evangelicals are around 25%, same with Catholics.

It’s also an inconvenient fact, that many gays are not for homosexual marriage.

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 9:54 PM

Wait… shouldn’t that be “Pew pew pew poll”?

corncat on April 26, 2012 at 9:58 PM

To be honest, I think that groups like the American Family Association, Focus On The Family, Americans For Truth About Homosexuality, and other vehemently anti-gay political groups are so extreme and out of touch, that they are actually driving moderates away from the anti-gay marriage movement.

These groups don’t simply stop at being against gay marriage, and disagreeing with homosexuality on a religious level, they go to the very extreme. They claim that anti-gay bullying programs at public schools are a mastermind plan to turn children gay, they claim that homosexuality is a mental disease, they claim that most homosexuals are pedophiles, they claim that gays can be turned straight by Christian “therapy”, so on and so forth.

So even if there are people out there who simply disagree with gay marriage and don’t hate homosexuals, whenever they hear these organizations spouting all of this other nonsense besides being against gay marriage, they get turned off to the movement, and either reconsider their position on gay marriage, or don’t vote at all.

theoddmanout on April 26, 2012 at 9:59 PM

I believe that two persons of the same sex should be able to engage in marital relations, BY THE LIGHT OF A 100 WATT INCANDESCENT LIGHT BULB, in the privacy of their own bedroom. Democrats disagree.

grgeil on April 26, 2012 at 9:29 PM

Snort. Where are you getting the bulbs?

katy the mean old lady on April 26, 2012 at 10:01 PM

This won’t be a libertarian nation until the big government idiots people who frequent HotAir support are defeated.

Also, watch out, I hear you can catch teh ghey from reading a post online about it. Better get to your churches post-haste and pray it away.

Aquateen Hungerforce on April 26, 2012 at 9:49 PM

I’m thinking you must have caught something yourself because that first sentence was a doozy.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 10:01 PM

To be honest, I think that groups like the American Family Association, Focus On The Family, Americans For Truth About Homosexuality, and other vehemently anti-gay political groups are so extreme and out of touch, that they are actually driving moderates away from the anti-gay marriage movement.

theoddmanout on April 26, 2012 at 9:59 PM

The flip side of that, is a lot of people are furious at the public schools with their captive audience of children, proselytizing for the homosexual agenda. At taxpayer expense even.

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 10:05 PM

PBHO sold guns to Mexican drug lords.

He also ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 10:06 PM

We are doomed to become a nation of Gay, Vigilante, Polygamists! Horrors!

ronsfi on April 26, 2012 at 10:10 PM

This is sort of OT:

Obama ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:31 PM

The hell you say!

When did this happen?

/

Solaratov on April 26, 2012 at 10:16 PM

Ever notice how all the rainbow boyz posts are put up by the resident beta male? Wazzup wid dat, allah?

platypus on April 26, 2012 at 10:16 PM

The hell you say!

When did this happen?

/

Solaratov on April 26, 2012 at 10:16 PM

It didn’t, I’m just being a rumor-monger.

PBHO is a stand up guy who only eats free range lobster.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 10:27 PM

PBHO is a stand up guy who only eats free range lobster.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 10:27 PM

That’s good to know.

And he can afford it, too…with his profits from selling guns to Mexican drug cartels.

Solaratov on April 26, 2012 at 10:31 PM

It is always good to see reason and liberty winning the day. The anti-gun and anti-gay lobbies are losing as people see their arguments for what they are. Awesome.

McDuck on April 26, 2012 at 10:50 PM

If gay marriage is so damn popular then how come it can only be legalized with an end run around the voters….?

NeoKong on April 26, 2012 at 9:15 PM

How are elected officials voting an end run around voters? Isn’t that the whole point of a constitutional republic?

It's Vintage, Duh on April 26, 2012 at 10:55 PM

If you think “It’s The End Of The World As We Know It,” you’re gonna buy a gun to project life and property from the scavs.

Scopper on April 26, 2012 at 9:28 PM

This.

Gun ownership and firearms purchases have skyrocketed under the 0bama regime – for exactly this reason. And blue states have seen the biggest increases of all.

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 9:32 PM

I maintain that there is a sixth sense: an internal ‘something bad is coming’ alarm that goes off only when a far-reaching disaster is imminent. And I think people are answering theirs en masse.

MelonCollie on April 26, 2012 at 10:56 PM

How are elected officials voting an end run around voters? Isn’t that the whole point of a constitutional republic?

It’s Vintage, Duh on April 26, 2012 at 10:55 PM

One day, a single unelected judge waved her hand, and just like that – homosexual marriage was legal in Massachusetts.

Is that how a constitutional republic is supposed to work?

Rebar on April 26, 2012 at 11:08 PM

Not a libertarian. But, if the libertarian strain has a momentum regarding firearms and homosexuals that is equal, hard to see, but okay. I like any streak where gun owners are on the rise. Each and every man and woman has a natural need and right to defend themselves and their family. So your family is another man (or woman) who with you engage in non-reproductive activities? I still think you need the right to defend your activities and so on.

Okay. All good for the most part. Not talking church here, just reality of life….

JoeinTX on April 26, 2012 at 11:27 PM

Obama ate dog.

Bishop on April 26, 2012 at 9:31 PM

It was a gay dog, so it’s on topic.

John the Libertarian on April 26, 2012 at 9:39 PM

..er ah… what?…did he dry-hump the dog…before he ate it?

KOOLAID2 on April 26, 2012 at 11:28 PM

As Senator Goldwater said “..as long as they can shoot straight…”.

IlikedAUH2O on April 26, 2012 at 11:30 PM

The right to bear arms is outlined in the bill of rights. The “right” to redefine social norms to your own convenience is not.

Mr. Prodigy on April 26, 2012 at 11:31 PM

Gays with guns! YEAAAAAAAAAH! :P

thebrokenrattle on April 26, 2012 at 11:42 PM

http://i.imgur.com/cy16k.jpg

lester on April 27, 2012 at 12:14 AM

I think on the gay marriage issue the feedback would be different… less support… if the question was asked–”Are you for redefining marriage?”

Mike from SoCal on April 27, 2012 at 1:27 AM

As Senator Goldwater said “..as long as they can shoot straight…”.

IlikedAUH2O on April 26, 2012 at 11:30 PM

Now that’s funny! I don’t care who you are. That’s funny!

JeffVader on April 27, 2012 at 3:25 AM

It’s a trap. There is only a small percentage that are pro on both of these issues. If they wanted to combine two issues to show coherence, they could show that the homosexual marriage advocates are the exact same group that is most opposed to allowing private citizens the right to allow smoking in their privately owned establishment ( isn’t that another issue that has been trending similar to these two? ).

Once you establish that fact, then you know it’s not about liberty, it’s about shoving it down our throats. It would be easy enough for them to do polls in this “those who believe x also believe y” fashion, but they choose not to. They would rather you come to false conclusions.

Buddahpundit on April 27, 2012 at 6:32 AM

http://i.imgur.com/cy16k.jpg

lester on April 27, 2012 at 12:14 AM

Yep, impossible to debate gay marriage without attacking hetrosexual marriage. Destroy one to promote the other. Makes your cartoon a bit ironic, no?

hawkdriver on April 27, 2012 at 7:15 AM

I think on the gay marriage issue the feedback would be different… less support… if the question was asked–”Are you for redefining marriage?”

Mike from SoCal on April 27, 2012 at 1:27 AM

As long as same-sex couples can have completely & fully equal “civil unions” (and the federal gov’t has to accommodate them just like marriages), that would be fine with me.

TMOverbeck on April 27, 2012 at 8:07 AM

What I’ve seen is that people I’ve known for years who are anti-gun beginning to ask me questions about the process for obtaining one.

Why?

Because, in the words of a close friend, “the world is rapidly turning into a crazy place where I can’t trust there isn’t someone who has already rationalized why it’s OK to take what’s not theirs.”

I agree.

goflyers on April 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Yep, impossible to debate gay marriage without attacking hetrosexual marriage. Destroy one to promote the other. Makes your cartoon a bit ironic, no?

hawkdriver on April 27, 2012 at 7:15 AM

I think the point they’re making is there are many more issues that are actively destroying marriages than some hollow threat of the republic crumbling because we’re gonna let two men marry each other.

I say we institute the civil unions for now and yes, we can continue to debate over changing the legal definition of marriage.

I personally have no qualms about it. There’s signs all over the streets and highways stating “no trucks”. Does that mean that I can’t drive my Ford Ranger pickup in that area? No, because where the roadways are concerned, the legal definition of a “truck” is a huge vehicle with more than four wheels, and may or may not include a trailer. A legal definition CAN differ from what the general populace perceives something to be.

As for marriage, what is it in the legal sense? A binding contract between two people to share a living arrangement and be faithful and monogamous. Who can legally enter into a contract in the U.S.? Only human beings that are of legal age. For any of this slippery-slope nonsense to happen, we’d have to change basic contract law (which I think will be much harder and open up more cans of worms). So there’s your traction. No one’s gonna be legally marrying houseplants.

TMOverbeck on April 27, 2012 at 10:22 AM

What I’ve seen is that people I’ve known for years who are anti-gun beginning to ask me questions about the process for obtaining one.

Why?

Because, in the words of a close friend, “the world is rapidly turning into a crazy place where I can’t trust there isn’t someone who has already rationalized why it’s OK to take what’s not theirs.”

I agree. – goflyers on April 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Yes, people can use guns kill other people. But taking away guns is not going to stop people from committing murder. And. dialing 911 does not magically put a weapon in your hand when you may really need it.

SC.Charlie on April 27, 2012 at 10:43 AM

To be honest, I think that groups like the American Family Association, Focus On The Family, Americans For Truth About Homosexuality, and other vehemently anti-gay political groups are so extreme and out of touch, that they are actually driving moderates away from the anti-gay marriage movement.

These groups don’t simply stop at being against gay marriage, and disagreeing with homosexuality on a religious level, they go to the very extreme. They claim that anti-gay bullying programs at public schools are a mastermind plan to turn children gay, they claim that homosexuality is a mental disease, they claim that most homosexuals are pedophiles, they claim that gays can be turned straight by Christian “therapy”, so on and so forth.

So even if there are people out there who simply disagree with gay marriage and don’t hate homosexuals, whenever they hear these organizations spouting all of this other nonsense besides being against gay marriage, they get turned off to the movement, and either reconsider their position on gay marriage, or don’t vote at all.

theoddmanout

Thats a fair assessment. I used to be opposed to gay marriage, but ridiculous insane arguments by social cons made me sympathetic towards gays. One one hand, gays are just asking to able to marriage and have the same rights as non gays. And on social con argument, they insist that gays marriage will lead to beastiality, plural marriages, and the destruction of the institution of marriage.

Its just odd that social cons have never explained how a relatively small number of people (who biologically can not reproduce) will destroy marraige and have a worse impact, than the massive amount of divorce and resultant broken homes.

firepilot on April 27, 2012 at 11:07 AM

I also think this is a generational issue more than political. Republicans under 40 are less opposed to gay marriage, than Democrats over 60.

firepilot on April 27, 2012 at 11:08 AM

I don’t care what people do in their bedrooms.

When I tell someone to get off my lawn, I mean it.

ajacksonian on April 26, 2012 at 9:54 PM

Exactly right. I consider myself very conservative but if gay folks want to suffer the abuse and benefits of marriage, so be it. As I read recently marriage is a religeous thing and civil unions are a legal thing.

So whatever works to allow inheritance, hospital vists, etc. Fine. Why would I care? I REALLY don’t want to know what ANYONE does in their (pick your room here).

landowner on April 27, 2012 at 11:37 AM

People like guns and generally don’t care what adults do in their bedrooms (or living rooms, etc).

SouthernGent on April 26, 2012 at 9:23 PM

Gay marriage isn’t about what people do in their bedrooms, it’s about redefining marriage.

swinia sutki on April 27, 2012 at 12:44 PM

As the Bible is clear that homosexuality is a sin, I will personally never approve of homosexuality, which is, I believe, really one of the main reasons why the push for legalization of homosexual marriage exists-

I suspect that militant homosexual groups and their heterosexual supporters think by legalizing homosexual marriage that people such as myself are forced in some manner to recognize it as healthy, acceptable, or equally valid to heterosexual relationships, or they are trying to come up with ways to outlaw people from speaking publicly against homosexuality.

Gay marriage isn’t about what people do in their bedrooms, it’s about redefining marriage.

swinia sutki on April 27, 2012 at 12:44 PM

I agree.

There is more going on than what the militant homosexuals, and even some of the moderate ones, claim (they claim they see it as being an “equal rights” issue and so on).

They really do want people’s full approval for and acceptance of their homosexual behavior. I had a guy on another blog scoff at me for saying that a few years ago, but it’s true.

They don’t want just mere tolerance of their sexuality, which I (and people like me) already grant them.

They want to force acceptance of it on to all, have it depicted as normal and acceptable in society at large (in public school curriculum, in popular culture), and silence those who want to speak out and say it’s sinful.

For a long time, I did not have strong views about the topic and still would not, if not for how it’s being used and abused, and will be in the future, if it’s permitted all over the nation.

TigerPaw on April 27, 2012 at 1:37 PM

Gay marriage isn’t about what people do in their bedrooms, it’s about redefining marriage. – swinia sutki on April 27, 2012 at 12:44 PM

We already have gay marriage in some states and other countries. What is your point?

SC.Charlie on April 27, 2012 at 1:39 PM

So even if there are people out there who simply disagree with gay marriage and don’t hate homosexuals, whenever they hear these organizations spouting all of this other nonsense besides being against gay marriage, they get turned off to the movement, and either reconsider their position on gay marriage, or don’t vote at all.

theoddmanout on April 26, 2012 at 9:59 PM

Some of the points you cited as being “extreme” might actually be true.

If those groups publish studies showing there is a higher incidence of pedophilia/ hebephilia among homos more so than heteros, that is not necessarily “hate;” it could be seen as just pointing out the facts and educating the public.

TigerPaw on April 27, 2012 at 1:47 PM

We already have gay marriage in some states and other countries. What is your point?

SC.Charlie on April 27, 2012 at 1:39 PM

It’s about forcing homosexuality on to people who don’t approve of it. See my April 27, 2012 at 1:37 PM post right above yours.

TigerPaw on April 27, 2012 at 1:47 PM

It’s about forcing homosexuality on to people who don’t approve of it. See my April 27, 2012 at 1:37 PM post right above yours. – TigerPaw on April 27, 2012 at 1:47 PM

My guess is you also don’t accept the fact that people don’t choose their sexuality, whether it is heterosexual or homosexual. From what you have written I am sure you will never approve of homosexuality as not being a sin in the eyes of your God or of homosexual marriage. I am not going to get into a religious argument with you over the issue. Everyone has different religious beliefs.

SC.Charlie on April 27, 2012 at 2:10 PM

It appears that to those who want gay marriage to be accepted, the very idea of “slippery slope” just doesn’t exist. Or else they just don’t care where it leads because it won’t be their problem. No, it’ll be ours.

swinia sutki on April 27, 2012 at 3:28 PM

It appears that to those who want gay marriage to be accepted, the very idea of “slippery slope” just doesn’t exist. Or else they just don’t care where it leads because it won’t be their problem. No, it’ll be ours. – swinia sutki on April 27, 2012 at 3:28 PM

Ah, the slippery slope argument. You got me on that one. The next thing you know we will have Muslims in this country who believe they have the right to practice female genitalia mutilation because it is an accepted rite of their religion. Certainly they can practice their religion under the first amendment.

SC.Charlie on April 27, 2012 at 4:20 PM