Government to mandate “black boxes” on passenger vehicles?

posted at 11:06 am on April 19, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Bruce McQuain at QandO picks up on an effort in the Senate to make cars even more expensive than ever.  The MAP-21 bill is already notorious for giving the IRS the power to confiscate passports on suspicion of tax evasion without getting a judge involved or a suspect a chance to defend himself, and its presence as part of the transportation bill makes it a little easier to pass unnoticed through the House.  Another section of MAP-21 would impose a mandate, starting in 2015, to equip every passenger vehicle sold in the US with a “black box” event data recording system:

SEC. 31406. VEHICLE EVENT DATA RECORDERS.

(a) Mandatory Event Data Recorders-

(1) IN GENERAL- Not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this Act, the Secretary shall revise part 563 of title 49, Code of Federal Regulations, to require, beginning with model year 2015, that new passenger motor vehicles sold in the United States be equipped with an event data recorder that meets the requirements under that part.

(2) PENALTY- The violation of any provision under part 563 of title 49, Code of Federal Regulations–

(A) shall be deemed to be a violation of section 30112 of title 49, United States Code;

(B) shall be subject to civil penalties under section 30165(a) of that title; and

(C) shall not subject a manufacturer (as defined in section 30102(a)(5) of that title) to the requirements under section 30120 of that title.

Title 49, section 563 relates the requirements for ground-transportation EDRs if added to a vehicle by a manufacturer.  It doesn’t require vehicles to include one — or it doesn’t at the moment.  S.1813 would change that to make it a requirement.

In other words, this will be similar to the black-box requirements for airplanes, used to reconstruct events after a crash or other incidents.  There are a lot of auto accidents in the US, but unlike with commercial aircraft, they don’t usually fall 30,000 feet.  The federal government mandated black boxes on aircraft because so little evidence otherwise survives a catastrophic crash, an outcome that’s rare among traffic accidents involving cars.

Besides that, the federal government has jurisdiction over aviation; they don’t over normal traffic.  If states saw a need for this requirement, they could impose it themselves.  California, for instance, has specific and unique requirements for emission systems in vehicles sold in the state, and automakers adapted by selling California-specific versions of their models.

The next question is who gets access to the data, and that’s a little murky.  The proposal states that the owner of the vehicle owns the data as well, but with some exceptions:

(b) Limitations on Information Retrieval-

(1) OWNERSHIP OF DATA- Any data in an event data recorder required under part 563 of title 49, Code of Federal Regulations, regardless of when the passenger motor vehicle in which it is installed was manufactured, is the property of the owner, or in the case of a leased vehicle, the lessee of the passenger motor vehicle in which the data recorder is installed.

(2) PRIVACY- Data recorded or transmitted by such a data recorder may not be retrieved by a person other than the owner or lessee of the motor vehicle in which the recorder is installed unless–

(A) a court authorizes retrieval of the information in furtherance of a legal proceeding;

(B) the owner or lessee consents to the retrieval of the information for any purpose, including the purpose of diagnosing, servicing, or repairing the motor vehicle;

(C) the information is retrieved pursuant to an investigation or inspection authorized under section 1131(a) or 30166 of title 49, United States Code, and the personally identifiable information of the owner, lessee, or driver of the vehicle and the vehicle identification number is not disclosed in connection with the retrieved information; or

(D) the information is retrieved for the purpose of determining the need for, or facilitating, emergency medical response in response to a motor vehicle crash.

In other words, the vehicle owner retains the data, until (a) a court or (c) and (d) government decides he doesn’t.  Speaking of which, what exactly does (d) mean?  I suppose this is based on the OnStar system, which relays GPS coordinates to a call center when airbags deploy, but that is a private transaction between the owner and the service.  This is supposedly a mandate for event-data recorders, not for transmitters and ongoing two-way communications.  What would a black box have to do with emergency response if all they do is record?  How much surveillance would these EDRs allow, anyway?

I suspect that this is an effort by the Senate to plow the road for a mileage tax.  With gasoline tax revenues expected to drop with the advent of electric and hybrid vehicles (a large assumption, by the way), Democrats have been looking for ways to recoup the lost revenue.  They have repeatedly discussed and occasionally proposed instituting a mileage tax, which would either force drivers to keep extensive records of their travel or to add a device that calculates mileage and transmits it to the government.  Forcing manufacturers to include EDRs would give future Congresses the device necessary for this step; all it would take would be a future modification to Title 49, part 563 to require mileage collection.  There doesn’t appear to be any other pressing reason to add EDRs to the family car.

Addendum: Some cars already include EDRs or their rough equivalents (and have to comply with the existing Title 49 part 563 when they do).  No one is arguing that manufacturers should be barred from adding them, but this should be a choice for manufacturers and buyers, not a mandate.


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Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 11:45 AM

Cindy Munford on April 19, 2012 at 11:45 AM

…please let it start posting…just to itself!…they get nucking futs quicker and spin out of control.
This one is worse than the wreck in the picture!

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

He’s going personal to try to bait a response from you. Don’t fall for it.

Bitter Clinger on April 19, 2012 at 11:47 AM

of course it is. Jealousy runs deep in this one.

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

ROAD SALT!!!!

WryTrvllr on April 19, 2012 at 11:50 AM

Heh. Makes me want to dress up like an Indian and drive a Chevy Volt into Boston Harbor.

bitsy on April 19, 2012 at 11:50 AM

========================================================

Your car is just the beginning.

.

Everyone also need to get a black box inplanted under Obama Care so the doctors (and government) can better see what you where doing , eating before the heart attack. It’s all about prevention, you know.

.

Did I mention the devices in shoes, sorry about the looks but we need to know where exactly you tripped.

================================================================

huntingmoose on April 19, 2012 at 11:51 AM

A few well-placed wires……Oh,it quit working,how did that happen?

Frantic Freddie on April 19, 2012 at 11:51 AM

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:46 AM

See thats my point. I didn’t say me going to diesel had paid off. I initially thought it might because you can get a diesel to run on crap, i.e. food industry oil. They will always go with built in obsolescence. Failing that they will retro fit a solution to making things obsolete.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

Health freaks who burn 2X the calories while staying super fit should pay more as well.

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

??

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

if a troll comments and no one responds….does the troll go away?

search4truth on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

Chalk me up as someone who supports mandatory mileage taxes on all electric cars. Or are the owners of these cars not supposed to pay anything for the roads they’re driving on?

strictnein on April 19, 2012 at 11:40 AM

Then they should put them on the electric cars and leave me the hell alone. This isn’t just for tax purposes and we all know it.

txhsmom on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

of course it is. Jealousy runs deep in this one.

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

I’m jealous of a rube who lives in Alaska and owns 6 pickup trucks. OK, sure why not.

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

Failing that they will retro fit a solution to making things obsolete.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

always my dear Bmore, always.

And I am off.. have a great day. :)

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

There is simply too much government. The GSA is a classic case and so it this.

SC.Charlie on April 19, 2012 at 11:54 AM

A few well-placed wires……Oh,it quit working,how did that happen?

Frantic Freddie on April 19, 2012 at 11:51 AM

Wouldn’t they notice it wasn’t working. What if its tied into the starting ability of the vehicle?

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 11:54 AM

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

Have a lovely day. ; )

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 11:54 AM

There’s been something like this on many vehicles for quite a while now, they just haven’t recorded your every move for the life of the car.

How bout a ticket or insurance hike by black box report via satellite?

Speakup on April 19, 2012 at 11:55 AM

This MAP-21 bill, disguised as a highway bill, has lots of big-government intrusiveness issues buried in it as Trojan Horses. Barbara Boxer (Call me Senator, not Ma’am) is the sponsor of this atrocity, supposedly addressing issues on the environment. The acronym MAP also tells you all that you need to know. The “P” stands for Progress.

onlineanalyst on April 19, 2012 at 11:55 AM

1984 is not science fiction it seems but reality.

unseen on April 19, 2012 at 11:57 AM

of course it is. Jealousy runs deep in this one.

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

Yep. “Angry” that you built a life which allowed you to afford multiple vehicles while he drives some old clunker gifted to him by an uncle.

Bishop on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

Now, now if we stop letting people who call others names comment, HotAir will soon dry up. If he doesn’t have an outlet can you imagine his blood pressure?

Cindy Munford on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

Ralph Nader just had an orgasm.

MadisonConservative on April 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM

Oh, so it’s Nader, who is responsible for increased seismic activity. And here the environuts are blaming it on fracking.

onlineanalyst on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

I think it’s time we use the 1/2 of 1/3 of the government we control and block this bill. And the gop better not even think about saying they don’t have enough power to block it. They have a filibuster in the senate and a majority in the house. This is worse then the lightbulb crap. Get the hell out of our lives.

unseen on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Public-safety-surveillance-apf-340327295.html

The paranoia runs deep at RomneyAir. Seems like every single advancement in technology scares you people.

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:35 AM

yeah. some do

WryTrvllr on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

It says they have to be installed, doesn’t say they actually have to work -IYKWIMAITYD.

Besides, I also drive a ’73 MGB and that thing frequently sets fire to its own electrical components with no assistance from me!

Trafalgar on April 19, 2012 at 12:00 PM

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

Nobody works this hard to insult for nothing.

Cindy Munford on April 19, 2012 at 12:01 PM

Which senator will be getting under-the-table kickbacks for this? And where’s the fuse to the box so I can disable it?

sadatoni on April 19, 2012 at 12:01 PM

??

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

You suggested that a car owner should pay an extra tax for using something he has already bought and paid a tax on. Simply because he used it more than someone else.

Why not the same thing for ostentatious use of food.

The point is the foolishness of such a use tax on gas.

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 12:02 PM

Bishop on April 19, 2012 at 11:59 AM

I don’t understand why you haven’t walked his arse to the door out sooner. Worthless that one. He is going to make a mistake . He came very close yesterday. He is a coward.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:03 PM

tetriskid on April 19, 2012 at 11:37 AM

…you’re talking to a dog that just wags it’s tail…why bother?

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:04 PM

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 12:02 PM

…what did you just accomplish?…why bother?

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:03 PM

It’s not my site, and while I enjoy a good spat with a few people here, ed has become simply a petty ahole.

Bishop on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

He came very close yesterday. He is a coward.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:03 PM

And that’s the point of not responding to it. The more it’s left alone, the louder it will screech for attention, and then…BOOM!

Trafalgar on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

http://inhabitat.com/the-warming-dead-uk-crematorium-to-sell-energy-to-national-grid/

1984 is not science fiction it seems but reality.

unseen on April 19, 2012 at 11:57 AM

Oops, sorry, that was “Brave New World” wasn’t it.

WryTrvllr on April 19, 2012 at 12:06 PM

They’ve had that in Texas for many years. Most of the retrieved data was uneventful. However, among pick-up truck owners, there was a common theme. Just before a wreck, a voice was always heard saying “Hold my beer and watch this!”

Odysseus on April 19, 2012 at 12:08 PM

if a troll comments and no one responds….does the troll go away?

search4truth on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

….yes!…if everybody plays the game.
Imagine someone posting 40-50 comments with noone taking the bait.
After a while they start sticking the hooks in their own mouth!

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:08 PM

Cars have data recorders in them today. You go into the shop and the technician plugs you into their data recorder. I have a manual transmission. They can tell me how man times I have screwed up shifting and stalled out. Someone has already stated that insurance companies are probably going to require all cars to have such devices. I am afraid that he is correct. I just don’t like the idea of government requiring them.

SC.Charlie on April 19, 2012 at 12:09 PM

Hmm… before I’d start yelling about ‘stupid repubs’ selling us out, I’d prefer to know who the author of the changes is… and WHO is the sponsor, and who the co-sponsors are.

I wanna know if there’s somebody that shouldn’t be coming back after 2012.

Getting ‘UN-elected’ for agreeing with this seems like a good way to ‘send a message’ to these clowns.

CPT. Charles on April 19, 2012 at 12:10 PM

My uncle has a country place that no one knows about
He says used to be a farm before the motor law
Now on Sundays I elude the Eye and hop the turbine freight
To far outside the wire where my white haired uncle waits…

Red Barchetta, RUSH

Black box huh? Knowing how stupid 99.8% of people are with electronics, it sounds like a perfect way to INJECT A VIRUS into government computers.

To quote another great:

“You have to UNDERSTAND HOW things work on a starship.”
Scotty

orbitalair on April 19, 2012 at 12:10 PM

Bishop on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Yep.

Trafalgar on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Yep.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:11 PM

Call your reps of you oppose this.

http://www.house.gov/representatives/

jawkneemusic on April 19, 2012 at 12:13 PM

…what did you just accomplish?…why bother?

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Understand your point.
Would rather scare it away than have it disappear from atrophy.
Need a stone to keep knife sharp.

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 12:14 PM

Standard Republicans should rise up and show some Paulish outrage on this.

With embedded GPS they (who’s they? who knows) always know where you’ve been, when, and where you are. Plus they’ll probably mandate auto car-disablers so “they” can disable your car anytime, from anywhere… Imagine also cell phones are mandated as buggers and trackers too. No more mandates!

Add we become more like England with more and more cameras everywhere. It’s not American. Add we got flying drones up the yyang everywhere. Where does it end?

Crazy 1984 world, and add Orwellian double speak of future leaders like “freedom of choice is what you got, freedom from choice is what you need.” “Be seen to be hidden.” Or for fun, off topic… “an ‘all of the above’ energy policy to mean a none of the above policy” [He said: “We’ve got to continue the hard, sustained work on {the energy} issue…” NO, the mouse eared dog eater is worker hard to CUT energy production, as called for by climate change proponents.]

Here’s a comment of mine from the skeptic & anti-O blog Real Science:

lol with The Terminator robot graphic, as they are talking about employing flying pilotless drones in border patrol. Aviation assets… Who could argue with that? Of course, soon police forces everywhere, to save $, will scrap their own helicopters etc and turn to drones. Cheap as they are, they’ll be buzzing all over the place, above us.

Also, with the growing sophistication and low cost of mobile ground robots like the [Boston] Dynamics ‘Big Dog,’ police forces may opt for extensive use of these automatons. Real life Robo-cops. Next thing you know… it’s The Terminator for real! Call the governor! Oh right, it’s the ex-governor.

anotherJoe on April 19, 2012 at 12:14 PM

Of course a whole new government agency will be needed to monitor the black boxes and ensure compliance.

RebeccaH on April 19, 2012 at 12:14 PM

upinak on April 19, 2012 at 11:44 AM

…when they’re nucking futs…what are you accomplishing again?

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:17 PM

….yes!…if everybody plays the game.
Imagine someone posting 40-50 comments with noone taking the bait.
After a while they start sticking the hooks in their own mouth!
KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:08 PM

Calls to mind a simple, non-violent way to stop all this Congressional overreach.

This being tax week and all. Maybe it’s time we stop playing the game…en masse.

Cleombrotus on April 19, 2012 at 12:18 PM

Follow the money. What company gets the contract to make the components and the boxes?

Wigglesworth on April 19, 2012 at 12:18 PM

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:17 PM

Be nice to her. I like her. Please.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:19 PM

The federal government mandated black boxes on aircraft because so little evidence otherwise survives a catastrophic crash, an outcome that’s rare among traffic accidents involving cars.

A black box on a plane is only good if you can find the plane after it crashed.

Here in northern New Hampshire we had a mystery crash in December of 1996, when a charter Learjet flying from CT to Lebanon NH (just south of Dartmouth College) disappeared while making a go-around after a missed IFR Approach to the airport in bad weather.

The wreckage was not found until 3 years later, when a forester on private land about 15 miles northeast of the airport found the debris field on the side of a mountain while doing a timber cruise. They did find the CVR, but that was about all.

Since then, all business jets have been required to have ELTs besides their CVRs. Until then, the Emergency Locator devices were only an optional item.

Cause of the crash was Pilot Error. They flew into the side of the mountain.

BTW earlier this week in NH about 15 miles from where that Learjet crashed, a Saab with 3 out-of-staters flew off the side of the road late at night, became airborne, and landed in the top of a utility pole, blacking out the whole region and killing all 3 occupants.

But they’ll never know exactly what happened because it was late at night and no one saw the crash.

Del Dolemonte on April 19, 2012 at 12:19 PM

All of this outrage indicates you have not been paying attention. There is nothing new here. The trucking industry has been subjected to this for years, with most mandates resulting from regulation rather than laws. Mileage taxes have long been imposed by the states, requiring extensive record keeping of mileage and fuel consumed and purchased in each state. Now the USDOT is considering “paperless” logs, i.e. black boxes for all interstate traffic. The only hang-up is how to by-pass the Fourth Amendment to access them at road side inspections. DOT inspectors do not need to have probable cause to stop a truck, simply random choice. The DOT by regulation has made it illegal to use a hand held cell phone while driving, with severe penalties being administered.
The nation’s antipollution standards have been set by the non-elected California Air Resources Board, with the EPA then adopting them for everyone else. This is why a combine sitting in a barn in South Dakota ten months out of the year is considered a major source of pollution. The Tuesday after 9/11, the EPA took the opportunity to quietly announce the the widely-derided limits on lawn mowers and leaf blowers would apply nation-wide.
The frogs have been quietly boiling away, and now its time to add new ones.

FirelandsO3 on April 19, 2012 at 12:20 PM

No one is arguing that manufacturers should be barred from adding them, but this should be a choice for manufacturers and buyers, not a mandate.

I remember when this was a free country. I remember when I thought this country would never be as it is today.

petefrt on April 19, 2012 at 12:20 PM

Would rather scare it away than have it disappear from atrophy.
Need a stone to keep knife sharp.

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 12:14 PM

…this ones been filleted to the bone…and only has one purpose and as you can see…succeeds!

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:20 PM

Back OnTopic: Disconnect/disable the hardware ? No way.
The ‘features’ will be added right into the onboard computer that already controls the engine, transmission, brakes, radio, and dome-lights.
Remember those OnStar ads featuring a stolen vehicle? Ask your friends that get email reminders about oil-changes and tire pressure!

Traffic cops will suck your speed data out via bluetooth .. Resistance is futile.

/.

CaveatEmpty on April 19, 2012 at 12:20 PM

Next step: Automatic traffic tickets from the government.
Government decides it takes “X” amount of time to go from any point A to point B. You go from A to B faster than government time schedule and a ticket is automatically sent to you for speeding.

You park too long or in a no parking zone? The government is tracking you and sending you tickets for every parking violation.

Did not pay your taxes…or pay child support? The government has a kill switch on every device to disable your car.

albill on April 19, 2012 at 12:21 PM

Time to start making the government get used to the word NO.

NO, government, you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY to do this.

Or, NO, government, it’s not enumerated in the Constitution, so you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY until you create it via Amendment and get it ratified.

wildcat72 on April 19, 2012 at 12:23 PM

If you attach them to motorcycles they will be fairly easy to find.

Road grit, rocks, debris…that sort of thing can screw up motorcycles from time to time, maybe even knocking out a small bit of electronics.

Bishop on April 19, 2012 at 12:24 PM

Be nice to her. I like her. Please.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:19 PM

…he11! upinak is one of the ones I have a crush on!…that’s why I can’t understand why she even bothers with this one…because she’s been here long enough and knows what’s happening.

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:25 PM

All you need to know is the NAME of the Legislation MAP21 is an acronym…the important part is “for Progress”

John Kettlewell on April 19, 2012 at 12:26 PM

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:25 PM

Yes, good, but she was gone for far too long. ; ) She’ll get it.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 12:27 PM

Big Brother gets bigger and bigger.

SouthernGent on April 19, 2012 at 12:28 PM

Next step: Automatic traffic tickets from the government.
Government decides it takes “X” amount of time to go from any point A to point B. You go from A to B faster than government time schedule and a ticket is automatically sent to you for speeding.

You park too long or in a no parking zone? The government is tracking you and sending you tickets for every parking violation.

Did not pay your taxes…or pay child support? The government has a kill switch on every device to disable your car.

albill on April 19, 2012 at 12:21 PM

They will have this in California before moonbeam is out of office.

wildcat72 on April 19, 2012 at 12:30 PM

Jabberwock on April 19, 2012 at 11:45 AM

Cindy Munford on April 19, 2012 at 11:45 AM

…please let it start posting…just to itself!…they get nucking futs quicker and spin out of control.
This one is worse than the wreck in the picture!

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM

SECOND THE MOTION.

landlines on April 19, 2012 at 12:30 PM

Time to start making the government get used to the word NO.
NO, government, you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY to do this.
Or, NO, government, it’s not enumerated in the Constitution, so you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY until you create it via Amendment and get it ratified.
wildcat72 on April 19, 2012 at 12:23 PM

What might that look like exactly?

Cleombrotus on April 19, 2012 at 12:30 PM

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 11:48 AM landlines on April 19, 2012 at 12:30 PM

Okay, you have convinced me.

Cindy Munford on April 19, 2012 at 12:32 PM

Is that a melted dog kennel on top of the car in the cover photo?
#romneywarondogs

Scrappy on April 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

Calls to mind a simple, non-violent way to stop all this Congressional overreach.

This being tax week and all. Maybe it’s time we stop playing the game…en masse.

Cleombrotus on April 19, 2012 at 12:18 PM

…I’ve always thought like that. None of us should pay any civil fines to any courts until all illegals are concidered…oh…illegals!…The excuse is always that they can’t enforce the law because of the numbers…So, lets all not pay our taxes or fines! What then?

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

The price of used cars is going to skyrocket.

faol on April 19, 2012 at 12:36 PM

How long before the feds require video monitoring of our bedrooms?

Axion on April 19, 2012 at 12:37 PM

Ok so in theory I can get stopped in a roadside “safety check” and the officer plugs into my car and writes me a ticket for EVERY time I was speeding????? No thanks

Dannyp8262 on April 19, 2012 at 12:38 PM

“Everyone also need to get a black box implanted under Obama Care so the doctors (and government) can better see what you where doing”

Great idea.By inserting a microchip and just punching up your ID # on a computer the government can not only find out your BP,pulse, blood sugar levels, weight etc-but can also overhear your current conversation and know your current location.

You can simultaneously :

1 Have the U.S. Government Insurance Company cancel you Health Insurance because of high blood pressure.
2 Be fined by the EPA (consuming too much green energy food and excessive carbon emissions)for being overweight.
3 Be jailed for insurrection by calling Obama an “a–hole.”

MaiDee on April 19, 2012 at 12:40 PM

Several auto insurance companies already offer a discount if you install their version of a black-box on your auto to monitor your driving habits.

Also, in the fine print in some life insurance policies is a clause stating that if you are killed in an auto accident and not wearing a seatbelt, they won’t pay.

In some cases, there is also a clause saying they won’t pay if you’re killed during an illegal act. Speeding would qualify for this.

The black-box monitors your speed and whether a seatbelt is engaged or not, and an insurance company can get that info through supeona.

BacaDog on April 19, 2012 at 12:40 PM

Another great idea from the feckless rumps in DC.

scalleywag on April 19, 2012 at 12:44 PM

Mandate microchips for all dogs in America. That way, Obama can use Yelp to find where to grab a quick bite wherever he stops along the campaign trail.

Like he says, gotta eat before his events and keep the blood sugar up.

Christien on April 19, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Simply subtract last year’s number from this year’s and you have your data for tax computation.

xkaydet65 on April 19, 2012 at 11:37 AM

Something beyond the ability of the modern, public-school ‘educated’ person.
Or is subtraction only in the managerial job description?

Solaratov on April 19, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Then next…
Road tax for every mile you drive….

albill on April 19, 2012 at 12:49 PM

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

Seriously. Perhaps it’s time to start agitating along these lines. It should be painfully obvious by now that the usual legitimate channels for effecting substantive change are either corrupted or overloaded and it’s foolhardy to think along violent lines.

Cleombrotus on April 19, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Is that a melted dog kennel on top of the car in the cover photo?
#romneywarondogs

Scrappy on April 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

Silly! It’s a dog barbecue.

Trafalgar on April 19, 2012 at 12:51 PM

The MAP-21 bill

Interesting that they put the number “21″ after it. Hmmm … wonder what gave them the idea to use that particular number? Perhaps from Agenda 21, the whole enviro-sustainability-wildlands melange, that Ken Salazar and his minions in the Dept. of Interior are desperately trying to sneak through any way they can?

Forgive me for the maybe-almost tinfoil hat musings, but if there’s one thing (among many) I learned from this site, it is that there are no coincidences in politics.

PatriotGal2257 on April 19, 2012 at 12:52 PM

I feel like the government adopted me, even though I wasn’t an orphan. I appreciate the gesture Daddy Gubbmint, but I’m already over 18 … Oh … really? Damn…

preallocated on April 19, 2012 at 11:21 AM

If the government not only is managing you “for your own good,” but also laying a claim to everything you make and own….

… isn’t the relationship more like slave owner than parent?

tom on April 19, 2012 at 12:53 PM

“Everyone also need to get a black box implanted under Obama Care so the doctors (and government) can better see what you where doing”

Great idea.By inserting a microchip and just punching up your ID # on a computer the government can not only find out your BP,pulse, blood sugar levels, weight etc-but can also overhear your current conversation and know your current location.

One of our kids is in a voluntary health insurance program at work that requires a health evaluation and to join a health club or participate in sports, all paid by their employer. In addition, they wear a pedometer and try to walk 10,000 steps per day. The incentive is great as premiums are much lower, however, it concerns me greatly that an employer and insurance company now has even more knowledge and control over my kid. I’m not sure what the penalties are should someone fail to achieve their goals, but I can see that something like this could possibly be mandated for everyone under Obamacare. It’s just as scary as the black boxes for cars.

GrannySunni on April 19, 2012 at 12:55 PM

if a troll comments and no one responds….does the troll go away?

search4truth on April 19, 2012 at 11:52 AM

Impossible to say. It hasn’t ever happened yet.

I’d like to think it’s more likely that they escalate in trollishness to bait other commenters, continuing to be more and more offensive in the hopes of getting a response until they accidentally go too far and get the banhammer.

But that’s just a little fantasy of mine.

DrAllecon on April 19, 2012 at 12:57 PM

Car owners who drive 15K miles a year pay more tax than those who drive 10K miles a year. What’s so tyrannical about this?

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:44 AM

So, you’re saying that a gas tax is sufficient. And that an added mileage tax would be an unfair imposition.

Solaratov on April 19, 2012 at 12:57 PM

Tax politicians by word syllable character. Oh, wait, it’s supposed to generate revenue. Nevermind.

Christien on April 19, 2012 at 12:58 PM

Time to start making the government get used to the word NO.
NO, government, you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY to do this.
Or, NO, government, it’s not enumerated in the Constitution, so you DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY until you create it via Amendment and get it ratified.
wildcat72 on April 19, 2012 at 12:23 PM

Nice thought, although you’re a lunatic if you think you can make this happen.

Mitchell Heisman on April 19, 2012 at 1:03 PM

I’m jealous of a rube who lives in Alaska and owns 6 pickup trucks. OK, sure why not.

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:53 AM

Leftists never disappoint! They just can’t help themselves.

Solaratov on April 19, 2012 at 1:04 PM

Calls to mind a simple, non-violent way to stop all this Congressional overreach.
This being tax week and all. Maybe it’s time we stop playing the game…en masse.
Cleombrotus on April 19, 2012 at 12:18 PM
…I’ve always thought like that. None of us should pay any civil fines to any courts until all illegals are concidered…oh…illegals!…The excuse is always that they can’t enforce the law because of the numbers…So, lets all not pay our taxes or fines! What then?
KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 12:35 PM

You are a bona fide lunatic.

Mitchell Heisman on April 19, 2012 at 1:05 PM

Time to start buying up all the older pre-blackbox cars and trucks. It will be all mad max style cars driving around to avoid the box in the newer vehicles.

multiuseless on April 19, 2012 at 1:08 PM

If the government not only is managing you “for your own good,” but also laying a claim to everything you make and own….

… isn’t the relationship more like slave owner …?

tom on April 19, 2012 at 12:53 PM

It’s exactly that way. But I refuse to play the game.

Mitchell Heisman on April 19, 2012 at 1:09 PM

The paranoia runs deep at RomneyAir. Seems like every single advancement in technology scares you people.

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Wow. You like being a slave, eh?

BillH on April 19, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Mandate a Black Box for vehicles (except for trucks from Mexico)? Democrats in Congress can do that!

Mandate that a picture ID is required to vote in any election in the United States? Crickets.

BlaxPac on April 19, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Given that so many crimes occur in homes, shouldn’t the Congress mandate Telescreen monitoring of all rooms in houses? Of course the data would only be retrieved in the case of genuine government need, and the individual citizen would always have the right to object before his or her transport to reeducation camps, but the need for this kind of home safety device is obvious.

MTF on April 19, 2012 at 1:14 PM

The paranoia runs deep at RomneyAir. Seems like every single advancement in technology scares you people.

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Sorry you are too naive to recognize the new high-tech chains.

Axion on April 19, 2012 at 1:22 PM

Funny coming from you Random.

Bmore on April 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Republican =! Conservative

That is what lost us Congress in 2006 when Republicans proved to be just as willing to expand the size and intrusiveness of government as democrats.

wildcat72

And yet most people here will go out and vote them back into office like the good little lemmings that our government educational system has made them into.

Benaiah on April 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM

Nice thought, although you’re a lunatic if you think you can make this happen.

Mitchell Heisman on April 19, 2012 at 1:03 PM

If (when) they push things to the point of collapse, do you think the federal government will be able to do anything if 50 million people flip them the bird? I can tell you right now I won’t tolerate such a device in my car, and if there is one in it the first thing I will do is get rid of it.

Hell, they are already down to only a minority of the population even PAYING any taxes. What will happen if an ever shrinking minority gets so sick of ever increasing, onerous demands of the fruits of their labor they simply STOP?

wildcat72 on April 19, 2012 at 1:29 PM

Little by little. Inch by inch. Tiny bit by tiny bit. Not too hasty lest the masses rise up in literal violent revolution. Soon our bodies will be chipped at or just after birth. Chipped just like a dog. But at least 0bama won’t eat us — will he?

FlatFoot on April 19, 2012 at 1:31 PM

BillH on April 19, 2012 at 1:10 PM

Axion on April 19, 2012 at 1:22 PM

Appreciate your comments, but if you’d like to join in we’re conducting an experiment to find out what happens when nobody responds to the moby. Will it disappear? Implode? Get whacked with the ban hammer? Exciting times!

Trafalgar on April 19, 2012 at 1:31 PM

Fortunately, my ’98 Tacoma shall run forever.

Otherwise, roads will be like the new stadium I paid for but can’t afford a ticket to enter.

tomg51 on April 19, 2012 at 1:32 PM

angryed on April 19, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Still sucking on the teat of big energy/oil I see. When are you going stop adding to the air, water and ground pollution you think so highly about. Hypocrite.

chemman on April 19, 2012 at 1:32 PM

You are a bona fide lunatic.

Mitchell Heisman on April 19, 2012 at 1:05 PM

…I hope so!

KOOLAID2 on April 19, 2012 at 1:33 PM

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