What if Catholic bishops aren’t bluffing?

posted at 8:40 am on March 1, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Earlier this week, Francis Cardinal George of the archdiocese of Chicago sent a message to parishioners in Barack Obama’s home town that imposition of the HHS mandate to fund and facilitate contraception, abortifacients, and sterilization would force the Catholic Church to close its hospitals, clinics, schools, and all other organizations that would otherwise have to comply.  “Two Lents from now,” Cardinal George warned, “unless something changes, the page [listing Catholic organizations] will be blank.”  At the time, some commenters wrote that this has been Obama’s plan all along — to force religious charities out of business to make people more dependent on government.  Others, including myself, figure that Obama just thinks the bishops are bluffing, and wants to engage in a high-stakes bout of brinksmanship to force them to kneel to secular authority over doctrine.

But how high are those stakes?  In my column for The Fiscal Times today, I did a little research just on Catholic hospitals and their significance in American health care.  As it turns out, this bet involved nearly $100 billion in annual costs and about one-seventh of all hospital beds in the US — and that’s not all:

The Catholic Church has perhaps the most extensive private health-care delivery system in the nation. It operates 12.6 percent of hospitals in the U.S., according to the Catholic Health Association of the U.S., accounting for 15.6 percent of all admissions and 14.5 percent of all hospital expenses, a total for Catholic hospitals in 2010 of $98.6 billion. Whom do these hospitals serve? Catholic hospitals handle more than their share of Medicare (16.6 percent) and Medicaid (13.65) discharges, meaning that more than one in six seniors and disabled patients get attention from these hospitals, and more than one in every eight low-income patients as well. Almost a third (32 percent) of these hospitals are located in rural areas, where patients usually have few other options for care.

Compared to their competition, Catholic hospitals take a leading role in providing less-profitable services to patients. They lead the sector in breast cancer screenings, nutrition programs, trauma, geriatric services, and social work. In most of these areas, other non-profits come close, but hospitals run by state and local governments fall significantly off the pace. Where patients have trouble paying for care, Catholic hospitals cover more of the costs. For instance, Catholic Health Services in Florida provides free care to families below 200 percent of federal poverty line, accepting Medicaid reimbursements as payment in full, and caps costs at 20 percent of household income for families that fall between 200 percent and 400 percent of the federal poverty line.

Imagine the impact if these hospitals shut down, discounting the other 400-plus health centers and 1,500 specialized homes that the Catholic Church operates as part of its mission that would also disappear. Thanks to the economic models of these hospitals, no one will rush to buy them. One in six patients in the current system would have to vie for service in the remaining system, which would have to absorb almost $100 billion in costs each year to treat them. Over 120,000 beds would disappear from an already-stressed system.

The poor and working class families that get assistance from Catholic benefactors would end up having to pay more for their care than they do under the current system. Rural patients would have to travel farther for medical care, and services like social work and breast-cancer screenings would fall to the less-efficient government-run institutions. That would not only impact the poor and working class patients, but would create much longer wait times for everyone else in the system. Finally, over a half-million people employed by Catholic hospitals now would lose their jobs almost overnight, which would have a big impact on the economy as well as on health care.

Of course, it’s not just hospitals.  The Catholic Church runs over 7500 primary and secondary education schools in the US (where over a third of students are non-Catholics), educating more than 2.5 million students.  Thanks to a near-blanket moratorium on vouchers, taxpayer money doesn’t get used in teaching these students in a system that has a 99% graduation rate and a 97% success rate at placing students in college.  Based on an average student cost of $8000 in public schools, Catholic schools save taxpayers about $20 billion dollars a year.

Perhaps with schools, though, the notion that Obama wants to crowd out private enterprise in favor of the public sector makes more sense. How about charities?  Catholic Charities would also have to close its doors if the bishops refuse to comply with the HHS mandate.  In 2003, the latest data available, they provided emergency food services to 6.5 million people, temporary shelter to over 200,000 people, and a range of other assistance to another 1.5 million people, including assistance in clothing, finances, utilities, and even medication.  Those efforts would disappear overnight, along with schools and hospitals.

Surely, some will think, the bishops are just bluffing, and won’t purposefully create such a social disaster.  Perhaps, but consider the teachings of St. Ignatius of Loyola, the founder of the Jesuit order and a deeply influential figure in Catholic thinking:

Some may doubt that the bishops would create this kind of havoc and disruption, and perhaps President Obama believes Cardinal George and the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops to be bluffing. However, Obama may want to read St. Ignatius of Loyola, the founder of the Jesuits, and his Principle and Foundation of faith, which informs Catholics on the priority of salvation. The first task of mankind, according to St. Ignatius, is to serve God and “save his soul,” and “other things on the face of the earth” should be used only as long as they serve that purpose. When they become a hindrance to salvation, St. Ignatius warns to “rid himself of them.”

If the HHS mandate forces the Catholic Church to fund and facilitate access to products and services they believe imperil souls, they will apply Ignatius’ principle and stick with salvation — which is the entire raison d’être of any religious organization.  The implications for public-sector spending and services is massive, and Obama may be pushing all in with only a pair of jacks.  Don’t count on the bishops to blink first.


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This is why I laugh at the lefties who say “tax the Churches”.

The Catholic Church “gives back” far more than it receives from its tax ememptions, it’s not even close.

Democrats are so inane that they cannot even recognize when something is successful.

NoDonkey on March 1, 2012 at 8:44 AM

If the HHS mandate forces the Catholic Church to fund and facilitate access to products and services they believe imperil souls, they will apply Ignatius’ principle and stick with salvation — which is the entire raison d’être of any religious organization. The implications for public-sector spending and services is massive, and Obama may be pushing all in with only a pair of jacks. Don’t count on the bishops to blink first.

I come out the other way. I think the Bishops will blink first and accept some political “compromise”.

Monkeytoe on March 1, 2012 at 8:44 AM

On this issue, hold fast – or be forever condemned as hypocrites!

OldEnglish on March 1, 2012 at 8:46 AM

The double down president

cmsinaz on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

HOPE & CHANGE…Change everything!

KOOLAID2 on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

Earlier this week, Francis Cardinal George of the archdiocese of Chicago sent a message to parishioners in Barack Obama’s home town that imposition of the HHS mandate to fund and facilitate contraception, abortifacients, and sterilization would force the Catholic Church to close its hospitals, clinics, schools, and all other organizations that would otherwise have to comply. “Two Lents from now,” Cardinal George warned, “unless something changes, the page [listing Catholic organizations] will be blank.” At the time, some commenters wrote that this has been Obama’s plan all along — to force religious charities out of business to make people more dependent on government. Others, including myself, figure that Obama just thinks the bishops are bluffing, and wants to engage in a high-stakes bout of brinksmanship to force them to kneel to secular authority over doctrine.
============

Ed,for some reason,Obama has an “AXE” to grind with the Old World,
back in the “Empire Days”,and Hopey has some kind of warped brain
washing type of mentality concerning all of this,and I think,for
now,Religion is any easy,er,”Soft Tatrget”.And that target is the
“Catholics and Christains”!!

Man,he does have a disstain for the ‘Past’!!!

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

Government – like most institutions – dislikes competition. Liberals particularly dislike real charity because it discouraged dependency on the state.

gwelf on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

I think removing Catholic influence is more important to the left than any of the multitude of services they provide to the people the left supposedly cares about.

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

“We make too many compromises already, too many retreats. They invade our space, and we fall back. They assimilate entire worlds, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far, and no farther!”

redmama on March 1, 2012 at 8:51 AM

Man,he does have a disstain for the ‘Past’!!!

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

And disdain for the present. ; )

Bmore on March 1, 2012 at 8:53 AM

Monkeytoe on March 1, 2012 at 8:44 AM

Why would they? You can’t compromise your soul. Obama has no authority to push this mandate anyway. It violates the first amendment, his own executive order that secured Ben Nelson’s vote for Obamacare and federal law as well.

Mord on March 1, 2012 at 8:53 AM

Don’t count on the bishops to blink first.

Don’t count on them to defend the faith either. After all, they were fine with Obamacare. But then HHS came out after them.

Happy Nomad on March 1, 2012 at 8:54 AM

At the time, some commenters wrote that this has been Obama’s plan all along — to force religious charities out of business to make people more dependent on government.

I have zero doubt it’s true in the case of schools and charities. The hospitals may be too disruptive for him, but only in the short run. It’s a long term goal to have the State control all of that too.

forest on March 1, 2012 at 8:54 AM

They are complying with several similar state laws on contraception insurance. RCC doctrine doesn’t depend on a state/federal question. The issue for the bishops with ObamaCare may be how high-profile the government contraception endorsement is now.

OptionsTrader on March 1, 2012 at 8:55 AM

Democrats are so inane that they cannot even recognize when something is successful.

NoDonkey on March 1, 2012 at 8:44 AM

Oh, they recognize the success alright, but their church (the state) does not need the competition. It’s kind of like how churches and synagogues are allowed to exist in Muslim countries, but they are not allowed to advertise their services nor even repair the buildings.

Odysseus on March 1, 2012 at 8:55 AM

“We make too many compromises already, too many retreats. They invade our space, and we fall back. They assimilate entire worlds, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far, and no farther!”

redmama on March 1, 2012 at 8:51 AM

One of my favorite quotes.

fossten on March 1, 2012 at 8:55 AM

You go redmama

cmsinaz on March 1, 2012 at 8:55 AM

Do it Obama. The press will blame the Church, but people will understand the truth.

itsspideyman on March 1, 2012 at 8:56 AM

The Church has stood for more than 2000 years. The Obama administration has barely survived 4. And some people think the Church will blink first?

votermom on March 1, 2012 at 8:57 AM

Religion starts with an ‘R’ that’s rightwing enough for Obama to oppose it. But I think the real goal is single payer. His wife will head up the Obama Hospital Trust that will buy up these closed Catholic Hospitals for pennies on the dollar.

meci on March 1, 2012 at 8:58 AM

I’m sure the Obozo administration is fully aware of the scope and impact of the Catholic church’s involvement in the American health care system. That is why he wants to destroy it! It’s all about control of our lives.

GFW on March 1, 2012 at 8:58 AM

The Catholic Church wasn’t bluffing when it closed down adoption agencies over same-sex couple mandates. And is not bluffing here either. The worst part of all this…the people will have that much less aid in caring for the sick.

Something tells me that hidden in all this govt. red tape is a loophole that would allow for Catholic Hospitals and charities to sidestep that mandate.

JetBoy on March 1, 2012 at 8:58 AM

Muslims are exempt from ObamaCare altogether. They are protected from any type of challenge to their religous principles. I am not Catholic, but I admire the amount of charitable services they provide, and not just to Catholics. I hope they are not bluffing. This showdown needs to happen and I don’t think Obama really has a leg to stand on with this.

I also believe this is an attempt to further the single payer thing.

Night Owl on March 1, 2012 at 8:58 AM

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

I think Obama’s motives are pretty clear. He does not think of himself as an American but as a world citizen. He has been indoctrinated in international socialism to believe that this nation and all her institutions are inherently evil and it is only until America is defeated and humiliated will things change. In times past people like Obama would be marginilized by society and he would have spent his life in some slum trying to organize low-income workers into some sort of a political bloc. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, Obama became a darling of the left and even now his supporters fail to see just how evil this man is.

Happy Nomad on March 1, 2012 at 8:59 AM

Oops….so,Obama is trying to bring Kenya to America,

February 12, 2012

‘Obama’s Africa’
****************

As the nations of Africa slowly emerge from poverty, burdened by a crushing debt from the West and massive political corruption, there is another consideration to take into account when assessing this continent. It has long been a target of the sponsors of eugenics. The inhabitants here, like poorer people throughout history, are deemed, by and large, as undesirable.

This is seen most clearly by the policies of the Obama administration, which continues to tie financial aid to a country’s willingness to approve of abortion, sterilization and contraception.

And if those three killers aren’t enough, the White House is now deploying a full-court press to twist the arms of African nations to become approving of militant homosexuality.

Not content with limiting his efforts to redefine the culture of the United States with his rabid support for child-killing and sodomy, Obama wants to extend his legacy to Africa.

In fact, he has already scored some major success here.

Last year, he sent his Catholic vice president, Joe Biden, to Kenya to press for passage of a pro-abortion national constitution. The carrot, if Kenya passed it, foreign dollars would flow in. If not, no money. Kenya passed it, and it was cheers and high fives all around at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.
==============================================================

http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/abbott/120212

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 9:00 AM

The Church has stood for more than 2000 years. The Obama administration has barely survived 4. And some people think the Church will blink first?

votermom on March 1, 2012 at 8:57 AM

Pretty much says it all right there.

JetBoy on March 1, 2012 at 9:00 AM

The mandate will disappear after the election, and the Bishops will reaffirm their support for Obamacare. Why is this so difficult to figure out?

Mr. Arkadin on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

Remember too, this Pope is a doctrinal purist and his former job as a Cardinal was to enforce Church dogma. He won’t back down – nosir.

tommyboy on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

Keep flogging this one Ed.

How does the Church pay for all of this?

Investments and donations?

Yea right.

Tax dollars.

You think they should get the money no strings attached, then turn around and put whatever strings they want to attach before doling it out.

Conservatism 2012.

freshface on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

The Catholic Church has granted Obama a stellar chance to apply his beloved Cloward Piven theory on unheard-of scale. Imagine the overload on healthcare and social services if the bishops hold true to their threat. Urban bloodbath and martial law that follows it will be the lightest of possible consequences.

Archivarix on March 1, 2012 at 9:02 AM

Don’t count on the bishops to blink first.
Don’t count on them to defend the faith either. After all, they were fine with Obamacare. But then HHS came out after them.

Happy Nomad on March 1, 2012 at 8:54 AM

Exactly. Several prominent Catholics have already gleefully accepted Obama’s phony “compromise” — which still forces Catholic institutions to pay for contraception and abortion services while pretending that the insurance companies are providing it for “free” out of the goodness of their hearts — so I have little faith in the willingness of the Catholic hierarchy to stand firm.

And didn’t a majority of Catholic voters choose Obama in 2008, despite his strong support for late-term abortion and infanticide?

AZCoyote on March 1, 2012 at 9:02 AM

If our lawmakers cannot pass an exemption for Catholic and religious institutions, isn’t there some other legal loophole that they can use to give the appearance of compliance, but without actually doling put the medications and services they are opposed to?

cmsciulli on March 1, 2012 at 9:03 AM

The Catholics brought this fight upon themselves. The Bishops support for ObamaCare was the decisive factor in getting it passed, and now they have to pay the piper just like all the rest of us. Politically, they can’t be excluded because it is too overly-broad an exclusion. Contraception is just the beginning: what happens when the church wants to provide geriatric care beyond “guidelines”, or won’t permit abortion, or rejects the eventual introduction government board mandated rules of care?

What happens is that this little skirmish will be fought again and again, and the battles will only get larger. This is a fight between liberty and tyranny, and (while the Catholic hierarchy is welcome to the battle) they should have been fighting earlier.

Do not make a deal now, Bishops. It will only get harder. You’ve now seen the future–and you should fight!

MTF on March 1, 2012 at 9:03 AM

Tax dollars.

You think they should get the money no strings attached, then turn around and put whatever strings they want to attach before doling it out.

Conservatism 2012.

freshface on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

So you think the Church should turn away Medicare and Medicaid paitients?

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM

The Church has stood for more than 2000 years. The Obama administration has barely survived 4. And some people think the Church will blink first?

votermom on March 1, 2012 at 8:57 AM

votermom:Very nice,1600 Pennslyvannian Ave.,will blink first!

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM

Your savings of 20 Billion seems to ignore the additional cost of closing the primary and secoundary institutions. Tuition of 4000 per student that are currently being borne by those who send their children to parochial schools would be added to the incremental cost by the public sector once they take over the education of our kids. Additional the analysis seems to ingnore the inherently poor performance that the public sector exhibits in teaching kids.The failure would then have 2.5 million more kids to promote and more kids at risk for failure because of poor teachers and ciriculium. If there is one thing that this administration has succeded at its showing the rest of America that the law of uninteded consequences is not a theortcial doctrine but clearly visible when this bozo start his socialist secular policies.

nicknack60 on March 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM

I think removing Catholic influence is more important to the left than any of the multitude of services they provide to the people the left supposedly cares about.

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

Nailed it.

herm2416 on March 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM

One wonders why Obama attacks Christian entities, and is openly hostile to Isralies, but puckers up and gets smoochy with the Islamics.

/yes, that was rhetorical.

44Magnum on March 1, 2012 at 9:05 AM

As a Jew, I’m hoping the Bishops will stand fast. It’s not about Catholicism but religious freedom for all. What’s next? Banning circumcision? Kosher slaughter?

Oops, the first has already been tried in SF and the latter has been enacted in a few countries.

Gotta stop this.

Grantman on March 1, 2012 at 9:05 AM

The Church won’t say it but I will. **** Obama.

MikeinPRCA on March 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

If the HHS mandate forces the Catholic Church to fund and facilitate access to products and services they believe imperil souls, they will apply Ignatius’ principle and stick with salvation — which is the entire raison d’être of any religious organization. The implications for public-sector spending and services is massive, and Obama may be pushing all in with only a pair of jacks. Don’t count on the bishops to blink first.

they will blink.The jesuits and loyola are but a faction in the church. and by the way, loyola was a bit of a fanatic:

Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556):
We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides

literally blind obedience to the hierarchy of the church is what we need according to the fanatic Loyola. and as we know the church never makes mistakes/

and by the way, if the church has so much power now and blackmail the government into their bidding, what stops them from doing it again in the future? say, they can have another encyclical next hear forbidding catholics from helping certain other religions and sects. what then?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

Spot on spidey, the lsm will blame the church big time

cmsinaz on March 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

Hearing rumors that Andrew Breitbart has died. Can anyone confirm this??

esr1951 on March 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

They may get out of the hospital business, but it doesn’t mean the hospitals will close. They will be sold.

Blake on March 1, 2012 at 9:07 AM

As a Jew, I’m hoping the Bishops will stand fast. It’s not about Catholicism but religious freedom for all. What’s next? Banning circumcision? Kosher slaughter?

Oops, the first has already been tried in SF and the latter has been enacted in a few countries.

Gotta stop this.

Grantman on March 1, 2012 at 9:05 AM

banning heretics and jews from catholic hospitals?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:08 AM

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM
And disdain for the present. ; )

Bmore on March 1, 2012 at 8:53 AM

Bmore:True Dat,ya know,to hate,er dis-like past and present,at the
same time,is burning up alot of mental fuel!!:)

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 9:08 AM

We have several large Catholic hospitals in Cincinnati. There are several Mercy hospitals, and Good Samaritan, and then Christ Hospital which isn’t Catholic per se but they do have a lot of involvement with the Catholic church. Also, there’s a spirit of volunteering there, not only by the nuns and the church, but by members of the Catholic church. It seems like utter insanity to ignore their concerns to the point they’d get out of the hospital “care” business. Liberals. When they think they’re right, then everyone has to believe like they do, or they find a way to force you to fall in line.

Paul-Cincy on March 1, 2012 at 9:08 AM

I’ll believe the bishop on the day that the Catholic Church EXCOMMUNICATES all Democrat politicians for supporting Abortion. Until that day, the Catholic Church remains a den of hypocrites.

My apologies to devout Catholics. I just think that if you are going to have rules, you really ought to follow them.

wearyman on March 1, 2012 at 9:09 AM

You think they should get the money no strings attached, then turn around and put whatever strings they want to attach before doling it out.

freshface on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

You think that big government knows best and can trump what is a key tenet of faith with eternal life or death implications. Yet for all that you demand the church commit a sin in the name of political correctness and a specific voting bloc.

Liberalism 2012- Hey Catholics, STFU and start killing those babies.

Happy Nomad on March 1, 2012 at 9:09 AM

Obama is probably planning that Muslim hospitals and schools will pick up the slack…

Related: Mosques in America nearly double since 9/11

albill on March 1, 2012 at 9:09 AM

“The Pope! How many divisions has he got?”
- Joseph Stalin

This is exactly what Obama wants. If he can’t tax them out of operation, he’ll regulate until they can’t – or won’t – comply anymore.

And if you think they’re only trying to destroy Catholic institutions, you don’t know ANYTHING about the fanatic cult that now calls itself “liberalism.”

logis on March 1, 2012 at 9:11 AM

Odysseus on March 1, 2012 at 8:55 AM

I like to think the best about people, so I think Democrat politicians are simply corrupt, ignorant and incompetent, rather than just evil.

NoDonkey on March 1, 2012 at 9:11 AM

I think removing Catholic influence is more important to the left than any of the multitude of services they provide to the people the left supposedly cares about.

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

yes, the devil dont want the catholic church messing it his turf!

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:12 AM

As long as they ruin the economy under baracks watch. I hope they don’t wait until Romney is president to cause this chaos. Then again, Romney had better hit the undo button on the last four years.

DuctTapeMyBrain on March 1, 2012 at 9:12 AM

Just checked the Big Government site:

They’re announcing Breitbart passed away, died from natural causes?

Has the site been hacked? Or is this for real?

http://biggovernment.com/

mountainaires on March 1, 2012 at 9:13 AM

Hearing rumors that Andrew Breitbart has died. Can anyone confirm this??

esr1951 on March 1, 2012 at 9:06 AM

There’s a story at Big Hollywood. AWFUL!!!!!!

In Memoriam: Andrew Breitbart (1969-2012)

flyfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:13 AM

They are reporting that Breitbart died. This is horrible if true.

Blake on March 1, 2012 at 9:13 AM

Not Breitbart! Just horrible.

Someone needs to lockdown his Obama videos.

Stayright on March 1, 2012 at 9:14 AM

They are the only ones reporting it. They said he died of natural causes shortly after midnight. He was still tweeting up to that time. He wasn’t sick. Heart attack? I wouldn’t call that natural causes. And I don’t think they would release a statement saying it was so quickly.

Blake on March 1, 2012 at 9:14 AM

I was homeschooled in a time when homeschooling as a movement was just getting started, and the tactics the Obama Administration is using against the Catholic and other charities here are exactly the tactics that they used repeatedly to try to put homeschoolers under their thumb. First the carrot, then the stick. Thankfully so far, homeschoolers en masse have resisted the carrots. Unfortunately, the Catholic church was not so wise.

I remember once when the government wanted to offer a special tax break to homeschoolers because “they’re already paying taxes for the schools in their area.” But if it was such a good idea, why was it kept so secret? The bill sailed through committee, through both houses of the legislature, and was headed to the Governor of Wisconsin before anyone heard about it. With eleven hours to spare, we LIT UP the Capitol switchboard. And in a stunning reversal, the Democratic then-governor Doyle vetoed the bill he had promised to sign. Why?

Because we knew that any special “tax break” would not be free of strings. We would rather not have special tax breaks, thank you very much, if it means government control of our education. Unfortunately, the Catholic Church in this arena wanted to promote what they viewed as a good thing (healthcare for all) and ignored at their peril the dangerous slope toward loss of freedom.

Nothing the government does is free.

JoseQuinones on March 1, 2012 at 9:15 AM

Religion starts with an ‘R’ that’s rightwing enough for Obama to oppose it. But I think the real goal is single payer. His wife will head up the Obama Hospital Trust that will buy up these closed Catholic Hospitals for pennies on the dollar.

meci on March 1, 2012 at 8:58 AM

And give payola to the United Auto Workers in the process. He’ll find a way.

Paul-Cincy on March 1, 2012 at 9:15 AM

I’ll believe the bishop on the day that the Catholic Church EXCOMMUNICATES all Democrat politicians for supporting Abortion. Until that day, the Catholic Church remains a den of hypocrites.

My apologies to devout Catholics. I just think that if you are going to have rules, you really ought to follow them.

wearyman on March 1, 2012 at 9:09 AM

why dont protestant denominations do the same?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:15 AM

I think removing Catholic influence is more important to the left than any of the multitude of services they provide to the people the left supposedly cares about.

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 8:47 AM

darwin is right. The left would embrace the pain and suffering as some kind of “sacrifice” to their own God of Entitlement, principles and morals be damned.

Rovin on March 1, 2012 at 9:15 AM

The Church has stood for more than 2000 years. The Obama administration has barely survived 4. And some people think the Church will blink first?

votermom on March 1, 2012 at 8:57 AM

It seems to me, a Protestant, that only recently has the Catholic Church in the United States discovered that the Democratic Party isn’t the traditional Democratic Party anymore, and only now realizes ‘social justice’ doesn’t mean what they thought it meant. Democratic Party leadership and the leaders of the various coalitions and interest groups binding it together are Marxist ideologues. The New Left may be wrapped in slicker packaging than their old-school totalitarian predecessors, but their universal contempt for organized religion remains constant.

That realization came a little late in the game, if you ask me, but better late than never.

troyriser_gopftw on March 1, 2012 at 9:16 AM

Someone needs to lockdown his Obama videos.

Stayright on March 1, 2012 at 9:14 AM

That ‘s right!I forgot about those. My inner conspiracy theorist is wondering of this really was natural causes.

esr1951 on March 1, 2012 at 9:16 AM

Oh Gawd,I can’t believe it……Brietbart has passed!!

n Memoriam: Andrew Breitbart (1969-2012)March 1, 2012 at 6:06 am –
Dateline:
With a terrible feeling of pain and loss we announce the passing of Andrew Breitbart.

Andrew passed away unexpectedly from natural causes shortly after midnight this morning in Los Angeles.

We have lost a husband, a father, a son, a brother, a dear friend, a patriot and a happy warrior.
===================================

http://www.breitbart.tv/

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 9:18 AM

It seems to me, a Protestant, that only recently has the Catholic Church in the United States discovered that the Democratic Party isn’t the traditional Democratic Party anymore, and only now realizes ‘social justice’ doesn’t mean what they thought it meant. Democratic Party leadership and the leaders of the various coalitions and interest groups binding it together are Marxist ideologues. The New Left may be wrapped in slicker packaging than their old-school totalitarian predecessors, but their universal contempt for organized religion remains constant.

That realization came a little late in the game, if you ask me, but better late than never.

troyriser_gopftw on March 1, 2012 at 9:16 AM

and you guys live under the illusion that the catholic church is democratic or something. they are also totalitarian. why should the american state bend to the diktats of the vatican?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:20 AM

darwin is right. The left would embrace the pain and suffering as some kind of “sacrifice” to their own God of Entitlement, principles and morals be damned.

Rovin on March 1, 2012 at 9:15 AM

since when is contraception immoral? since when the vatican become the definer of what is moral and immoral in america?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:22 AM

Can someone tell me why we should care what the Catholic Church wants? would you guys have the same reaction if those expressing outrage were imams and muftis? I have the feeling that your reaction would probably be “They must comply with the law!! OMG those muslims once again want to have it their way!!!” This is just so ridiculous, if I started a religion where the first and only Commandment was “Thou shall pay no tax”, would you guys be supporting my right to enjoy my “religious freedom”?

1215 on March 1, 2012 at 9:23 AM

If the Church shuts down schools and hospitals Obama will simply declare some sort of state of emergency. He will by executive order appropriate all Church properties in question, hire back all the recently displaced staff and will come out looking like a hero to the masses who could give a rip about the Church sticking to its principles, religious freedom or the Constitution.

It’s disgusting, but it’s a win for him.

Niere on March 1, 2012 at 9:25 AM

The Catholic Church “gives back” far more than it receives from its tax ememptions, it’s not even close.

Democrats are so inane that they cannot even recognize when something is successful.

NoDonkey on March 1, 2012 at 8:44 AM

This is by design. Obama and the left has never been interested in helping the poor. They’re only interested either in “free stuff” for themselves (e.g. “free” healthcare) or power.

The Church helps the poor far better than the left and yet, the left never stops complaining about the Church.

Kingfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:27 AM

By whatever means necessary, Obama will impose total government control over health care, among other things, and all of our lives.

For Obama, it is “Catholics be damned.” [After all, in Obama's feeble mind, they are mere obstructionists in the struggle for world socialism....and anti-colonialism.]

Putz.

coldwarrior on March 1, 2012 at 9:29 AM

If the Church shuts down schools and hospitals Obama will simply declare some sort of state of emergency. He will by executive order appropriate all Church properties in question, hire back all the recently displaced staff and will come out looking like a hero to the masses who could give a rip about the Church sticking to its principles, religious freedom or the Constitution.

It’s disgusting, but it’s a win for him.

Niere on March 1, 2012 at 9:25 AM

No, it won’t be a win. Sure, Obama can appropriate all Church property but he would need assistance from the Church in order to do so peacefully.

Since the Church will not permit Obama to use its property to sin against God, Obama will have to take everything by force. While the left will be fine with that concept, Obama will lose out in the end.

Kingfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:30 AM

The Church has stood for more than 2000 years. The Obama administration has barely survived 4. And some people think the Church will blink first?

votermom on March 1, 2012 at 8:57 AM

votermom:Very nice,1600 Pennslyvannian Ave.,will blink first!

canopfor on March 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM

The Church didn’t blink when JPII faced down the Communists in Poland, and Obama thinks he has a chance. Go for it champ.

txmomof6 on March 1, 2012 at 9:30 AM

For Obama, it is “Catholics be damned.

“Catholics be damned.”

– Obama

“Obama be damned.”

– God

Kingfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:31 AM

We thought the major issue in this election would be about the economy and jobs, but it appears that it will be about the unborn. For too long the state has sanctioned and paid for the killing of children in the womb. St. Ignatius had it right.

Kissmygrits on March 1, 2012 at 9:31 AM

and you guys live under the illusion that the catholic church is democratic or something. they are also totalitarian. why should the american state bend to the diktats of the vatican?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:20 AM

Why should teh Vatican bend to the dictates of the state … especially when it’s protected by the 1st Amendment?

darwin on March 1, 2012 at 9:32 AM

The Catholic Church will sell its assets and they will still be utilized. It won’t be terrible. Still, a government that respected freedom of contract wouldn’t have mandates and thus there would be no issue here.

thuja on March 1, 2012 at 9:33 AM

If the Church shuts down schools and hospitals Obama will simply declare some sort of state of emergency. He will by executive order appropriate all Church properties in question, hire back all the recently displaced staff and will come out looking like a hero to the masses who could give a rip about the Church sticking to its principles, religious freedom or the Constitution.

It’s disgusting, but it’s a win for him.

Niere on March 1, 2012 at 9:25 AM

If he is re-elected. This mandate does not take effect until next year.

dukecitygirl on March 1, 2012 at 9:34 AM

Religion starts with an ‘R’ that’s rightwing enough for Obama to oppose it. But I think the real goal is single payer. His wife will head up the Obama Hospital Trust that will buy up these closed Catholic Hospitals for pennies on the dollar.

not if the church doesn’t sell them … they will sit there mocking the Iwon president ….

conservative tarheel on March 1, 2012 at 9:34 AM

Can someone tell me why we should care what the Catholic Church wants? would you guys have the same reaction if those expressing outrage were imams and muftis?

1215 on March 1, 2012 at 9:23 AM

I was beginning to wonder when the completely stupid would respond.

Sure, name the Muslim-run hospitals and I’ll defend their right to run their hospitals according to their principles. Silly me, Muslims have no hospitals.

I guess that means you want the sick to die.

This is just so ridiculous, if I started a religion where the first and only Commandment was “Thou shall pay no tax”, would you guys be supporting my right to enjoy my “religious freedom”?

One exists already, it’s called “liberalism.” This is the religion where you want everybody else to pay your taxes.

Kingfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:35 AM

I hope people come to the realization that the Catholic Church is indispensable.
Re: Healthcare – The best care I ever had was in a Catholic Hospital. Even though it wasn’t on the “approved list of providers” by a for-profit Blue Cross/Blue Shield, I chose St. John’s even though it cost me $4k out of pocket. I would do it all over again.

As a product of 6 years in a Catholic school (and more than regular Mass attendance), I was easily 2 years ahead of my classmates when I was forced to attend public school due to the ‘rent’s financial situation. If all of us could no longer attend, none of we five chilluns would.

The Bishops need to stand fast.
I disagree that Jesuits are the best example to feature.
(see: “Lavender Mafia” that led to rampant homosexual abuses)
Catholic Social Services has been a literal God-send for many dispossessed peoples.
In any event, I hope that the Church doesn’t prostrate themselves before the Supplicant-in Chief. For ChicagØbama, The Catholic Church isn’t even a blip on his faulty Leftist-hued radar.
~(Ä)~

Karl Magnus on March 1, 2012 at 9:35 AM

If Churches get out of the health care business, Obama will gladly fill the vacuum with even more government care. The resulting stress on the health care system will make the individual mandate even more likely, and by eliminating a major alternative, the government will have even more control over your treatment options.

hawksruleva on March 1, 2012 at 9:36 AM

I disagree that Jesuits are the best example to feature.
(see: “Lavender Mafia” that led to rampant homosexual abuses)
Catholic Social Services has been a literal God-send for many dispossessed peoples.
In any event, I hope that the Church doesn’t prostrate themselves before the Supplicant-in Chief. For ChicagØbama, The Catholic Church isn’t even a blip on his faulty Leftist-hued radar.
~(Ä)~

Karl Magnus on March 1, 2012 at 9:35 AM

You’re referring to the current crop of Jesuits in the US. Loyola was the founder and a devout son of the Church. He was fanatic, but his fanaticism is what the martyrs and saints are made of.

dukecitygirl on March 1, 2012 at 9:37 AM

and you guys live under the illusion that the catholic church is democratic or something. they are also totalitarian. why should the american state bend to the diktats of the vatican?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:20 AM

Why should Americans bend to the “diktats” of the Obama administration, especially when we have the First Amendment to protect us against this unlawful act?

Funny, you libs always seem to favor secular dictators.

Kingfisher on March 1, 2012 at 9:37 AM

Can someone tell me why we should care what the Catholic Church wants? would you guys have the same reaction if those expressing outrage were imams and muftis?

1215 on March 1, 2012 at 9:23 AM

Umm, because the Catholic church provides health care, much of it free or at reduced cost, to thousands of Americans.

If McDonald’s ran dozens of hospitals, we’d care what they thought, too. But in addition to affecting the health care of a lot of people, it’s a religious liberty question. America was founded on the idea that government shouldn’t force people to choose between obeying the law and obeying God.

hawksruleva on March 1, 2012 at 9:39 AM

Hope they go ahead with it … for a week or so. Just to show the impact. Might remind not only Obama, but everyone of the good works done by Catholic and other Christian organizations all over the Country and the world.

Christian Conservative on March 1, 2012 at 9:39 AM

How about this:

IGNORE OBAMA. Ignore his mandate.

He ignores DOMA which is law. If the president can do it, so can the church.

HopeHeFails on March 1, 2012 at 9:42 AM

Close the hospitals, sanctify the ground, then let’s see if Obama will play henry VIII, part deux.

OldEnglish on March 1, 2012 at 9:42 AM

wearyman on March 1, 2012 at 9:09 AM

Excommunication is not always a big ceremony, so it’s not true that Catholics who are enthusiastic supporters of abortion, haven’t excommunicated themselves:

“Any Catholic who obstinately denies that abortion is always gravely immoral commits the sin of heresy. The sin of heresy also incurs a latae sententiae excommunication.

Unfortunately, some Catholics obstinately deny that abortion is always immoral, and some Catholics claim that abortion can, at times, be a morally-acceptable choice, and some Catholics claim that a person can, in good conscience, choose abortion. Under the Code of Canon Law of the Roman Catholic Church, canons 751 and 1364, all such Catholics are automatically excommunicated for the sin of heresy.

This sentence of latae sententiae excommunication applies to any Catholic who denies that abortion is gravely immoral, regardless of whether they keep this denial hidden or publicly reveal it.”
http://www.catholicplanet.com/articles/article78.htm

NoDonkey on March 1, 2012 at 9:44 AM

since when is contraception immoral? since when the vatican become the definer of what is moral and immoral in america?

nathor on March 1, 2012 at 9:22 AM

Righteous indignation much nathor? Check Obama’s mandate again moron—he’s the one who’s demanding the moral changes over 2000 years of Catholic doctrine—not the Vatican. I have my own opinion about contraception, but where does it say in the Constitution that it is the responsibility of the government to demand free, (at the taxpayer’s expense), contraception to the masses? What’s next nathor? Federal government intervention into everyone’s daily lives is running amok with this administration. If you want to understand who’s defining morality by executive fiat, look no further than this current President.

Rovin on March 1, 2012 at 9:44 AM

How does the Church pay for all of this?

Investments and donations?

Yea right.

Tax dollars.

Conservatism 2012.

freshface on March 1, 2012 at 9:01 AM

If you are referring to tax deductions for charitable contributions, not every donation gets reflected on taxes. I have never had enough deductions to have it make sense to file anything other than a 1040A–so no deductions for any of my contributions. I’ll bet that most filers are the same.

The Catholic Church is not the only one harmed by the Administration’s edict. Other denominations and religions are also affected, as are individuals.

Kevin K. on March 1, 2012 at 9:46 AM

Don’t count on them to defend the faith either. After all, they were fine with Obamacare. But then HHS came out after them.

Happy Nomad on March 1, 2012 at 8:54 AM

As much as I hate to agree I won’t be surprised if the Bishops allow themselves to be sucked in by another Obama compromise – partially because they really do see helping the sick as part of their mission and they know they’ll end up getting scr*wed out of the physical facilities by the govt and then the parishoners will be po’d.

not if the church doesn’t sell them … they will sit there mocking the Iwon president ….

conservative tarheel on March 1, 2012 at 9:34 AM

If the Church actually ends up closing them the govt will direct a hostile take-over of the facilities and have them operate under the guise of “piblic emergency.” Can’t you see the spin BO & his guttersnipes would preach on that? Look at how mean & unChristian the RCC is – they abandoned the poor & the sick – I had no choice but to reopen the hospitals under govt control. .

katiejane on March 1, 2012 at 9:47 AM

Sure, name the Muslim-run hospitals and I’ll defend their right to run their hospitals according to their principles.

Oh yeah? you would support their right to impose the Sharia in the confines of their premises? Don’t try to fool anyone here, you know you would not.

One exists already, it’s called “liberalism.” This is the religion where you want everybody else to pay your taxes.

So according to your backwards “logic”, you support liberals who refuse to pay their taxes? me thinks you are just arguing for the sake of arguing (I heard they call that “trolling”)

1215 on March 1, 2012 at 9:47 AM

Ed remember the famous Stalin quote “How many divisions does the Pope of Rome have?” Stalin asked, suddenly interrupting Churchill’s line of reasoning.

The secular progressive left aka Marxist wannabees, need to get the biggest roadblock out of their way to succeed in turning this country into a socialist democracy -religion. If the contraceptive mandate goes into effect quite a few of the Pope’s divisions disappear in the United States, they abdicate large swathes of the population. In turn those people will only have the STATE to turn to (kind of like what they are doing to active duty, and retired military folks health insurance premiums – it’s the state trying to monopolize American’s health care. Hmmmm Hmmmm Hmmmm that Liberation Theology – Marxist claptrap, ain’t so Liberating is it? Media: RC Rick Santorum is a religious zealot LOL!

Has anyone checked the savings to raising the Military’s premiums it’s not a lot of money, but watch when it’s voted on the republicans will vote for it as well as the democrats. When that happens, perhaps people will finally figure out that it’s all a D.C. kabuki dance to keep the herd from being spooked and stampeding. The entire exercise is to get us to “Single Payer” you know for our own good/

Why is there no mention that the contraceptive mandate is unconstitutional?

Dr Evil on March 1, 2012 at 9:50 AM

America was founded on the idea that government shouldn’t force people to choose between obeying the law and obeying God.

hawksruleva on March 1, 2012 at 9:39 AM

And you would say the same about Islam, right? or is it that America was founded on the idea that government shouldn’t force people to choose between obeying the law and obeying the Catholic Church.

1215 on March 1, 2012 at 9:51 AM

If Obama can mandate that the Church pay for contraceptives, who’s to say he can’t mandate that their hospitals stay open?

In other words, if the Commerce Clause now means you can force someone to buy a product, doesn’t it also mean that you can force someone to provide a service?

PackerBronco on March 1, 2012 at 9:54 AM

I’m not Catholic but never in my life have I had a stronger desire to stand with them than now.

roy_batty on March 1, 2012 at 9:57 AM

Catholics have been in bed with the Democrats for the past 40 years. They have turned a blind eye towards the Democrat agenda of family values, abortion and gay marriage. Just look at Piglosi, Kerry, Biden, and the Kennedy’s. Total hypocrites when it comes to the Catholic Church. You can’t be Catholic and support abortion!

vietvet68 on March 1, 2012 at 9:58 AM

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