US intelligence warns Iran poised to conduct terror attacks in US

posted at 11:00 am on January 31, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

During the debates, Rep. Ron Paul often wonders aloud why the US should fear an Iranian nuclear weapon.  I’d call this a good reason:

U.S. intelligence agencies believe that Iran is prepared to launch terrorist attacks inside the United States in response to perceived threats from America and its allies, the U.S. spy chief said Tuesday.

Director of National Intelligence James Clapper said in prepared testimony that an alleged Iranian plot to assassinate the Saudi ambassador in Washington that was uncovered last year reflects an aggressive new willingness within the upper ranks of the Islamist republic to authorize attacks against the United States.

That plot “shows that some Iranian officials — probably including Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei — have changed their calculus and are now more willing to conduct an attack in the United States in response to real or perceived U.S. actions that threaten the regime,” Clapper said in the testimony, which was submitted to the Senate Intelligence Committee in advance of a threat assessment hearing Tuesday. “We are also concerned about Iranian plotting against U.S. or allied interests overseas.”

The assessment signals a potentially dire new direction in the adversarial relationship between the United States and Iran, at a time when there are indications that a covert campaign is already underway to thwart Iran’s alleged ambition to develop a nuclear weapons.

And now that covert campaign takes on a lot more significance.  If Iran develops a nuke, the presumed primary target of such a weapon would be Israel, which could get devastated by such an attack.  An attack on Washington DC simultaneously would decapitate most of our government and military leadership and make it difficult to organize a defense or a response.  However, it would also make it clear that Iran would have been the culprit, and any opposition to a full-scale war on Tehran after conducting such an attack on American soil would dissipate overnight.

Iran knows this, and if they acted in a rational manner, they would not dare to invite such a devastating war on their country.  The problem for us is that Iran’s policy is neither rational or irrational, but non-rational.  The theocratic clique running the show are true believers in the Twelfth Imam and the need for a conflagration to produce him, and the promised result of Islamic rule throughout the world.  Starting a war with the US won’t bother them as they believe that (a) the Muslim world will find itself in such a conflict anyway, and/or (b) they can hasten the arrival of the mahdi by kicking one off.  If they see their position threatened in Iran, they may even accelerate those plans before they lose the chance to put them into action.

Even without the nuclear aspect to the threat, though, this report should make clear to everyone that Iran’s mullahcracy has been at war with us ever since it took power in 1979.  Sometimes they have been more effective at it than others, but they have conducted a low-level war against the US that Americans are loath to acknowledge.  Fortunately, our intelligence services have taken a more practical look at Iran than they did in 2007, when they produced a thoroughly political and widely discredited NIE that claimed Iran wasn’t working on nuclear weapons at all as a means to curb George Bush from acting against the Iranian threat.  What’s changed since 2007?  Hmmmm …..


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JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:19 PM

Far more honest then pretending that this is an invented threat like most Paultards do. But certainly not shameful on Ed Morrisey’s part to point out a legitimate concern. I personally don’t believe that Iran is a rational player.

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 12:25 PM

Again with the ‘ground invasion’ strawman. When you start with that, I ignore everything that follows. No one credible is suggesting a ground invasion of Iran.

slickwillie2001 on January 31, 2012 at 12:19 PM

I’m not referring to Iran, I’m talking about Iraq/Afghanistan. Why is it so “liberal” to bring the troops home? Every time someone on our side talks about bringing home the troops, Limbaugh takes to the airwaves and accuses that person of supporting “defeat” and “surrender.” I’m curious to find out how much longer conservatives want to stay in the Middle East.

And I’m not opposed to attacking Iran, either, as long as it’s a last-resort measure.

Aizen on January 31, 2012 at 12:26 PM

The “scholarly community” also supposedly confirms that man-made global warming is going to kill us all. I’d say you should be ashamed of yourself for buying into that old canard, but you made it clear you were shameless quite a while ago.

MadisonConservative on January 31, 2012 at 12:23 PM

The anti-intellectualism runs strong through this one. Clearly more fit for South Milwaukee than for Madison.

Just because one group of politically influential scholars goes astray, we are now to write off the entire academy, MadCon?

Even the ones in Israel, who actually have skin in the game, and the alphabet soup after their names?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

I’ve said this in years past on Hot Air:

Long lasting peace is from decisive victories and maritime supremacy.

Our current leadership does not use this time-tested knowledge.

If you are serious about removing the Iranian threat we have the forces to do it, without putting a soldier feet-dry.

We have the technology and weaponry to take down the entire Iranian power grid, without setting off an exo-atmospheric EMP nuke. Isotopic separation requires a lot of electrical energy. So we stop nuclear material gathering. The nuke bomb program stops. Civilian deaths are minimized.
 Sucks to be Iran when they are returned from a 1980’s culture to the 18th century. The loss of all electrical power may lead to regime change also.

From September 2009 on HA.

NaCly dog on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

JohnGalt and MellonCollie are here! NOW its a tinfoil hat party! I love their stories. Tell me the one again about the racist newsletters Paul didnt write, or how writing millions in earmarks then voting against them is in line with conservatism. Those are my favs!

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

I read his post and thought what? Unfortunately they get to vote. He must be studying different WWII material than I have.

arnold ziffel on January 31, 2012 at 12:09 PM

His worldview only makes sense if one believes as he and many hardcore Prison Planet/Stormfront Ron Paul believers believe. According to them (Ron Paul, et al), The Protocols of the Elders of Zion is true and a cabal of evil Zionist international bankers orchestrate all wars everywhere, and have done so since the time of Napoleon. We–the United States–are a pawn of these evil Jews (headed by the Rothschild Family, btw), and they are using us to further their diabolical goals. Ron Paul’s friend and creative collaborator Alex Jones has definite ideas on what these goals are.

Watch it all and know that’s what they truly believe. The ‘Ron Paul movement’s’ whole ideology is premised on antisemitism of the worst, most conspiratorial sort. Nothing they believe can be remotely considered within the mainstream of American political thought or theory. Descended from the Know Nothings and the America Firsters, Ron Paul’s acolytes are certainly not Republicans–affiliation with the GOP is strictly a matter of political expediency–and they’re not even libertarians, as the term is commonly understood. They’re something else entirely.

Eine Reich, eine Volk, eine Paul.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:30 PM

Far more honest then pretending that this is an invented threat like most Paultards do. But certainly not shameful on Ed Morrisey’s part to point out a legitimate concern.

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 12:25 PM

Ed goes way past pointing out a legitimate concern. He takes a small minority opinion, colored by anti-Islamic bigotry on the part of some in this country, and puts it forward as foreign policy fact.

Substitute “climate” for “foreign policy”, and “capitalism” for “Islamic”, and you have yourself an instant recipe for global warming shill.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM

Let us see what Reuven Pedatzur said on the pages of Ha’aretz:

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:19 PM

Ha’Aretz is Israel’s New York Times. I would be triple wary of anything their editorial staff writes…

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

“Thread hijacking”.

Look it up, and get back to us.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM

LOL
When did HA become the Daily Kos with the hair-trigger sensibilities and purity tests? I don’t advocate non-interventionism. America is placing sanctions on Iran that will push Iran to war with us (as other sanctions did in the past with Japan).
I think that the confrontation we are inching towards is probably a good thing, so long as we go in with our eyes open and not our heads up our patoots with all this nonsense about facing a “non-rational” or “irrational” adversary (remember: we are, how to put it, a little short on cash atm; it would be better NOT to have another protracted nation building project).
The Iranian regime is smart and sober. If we imagine them to be otherwise, the charlie foxtrot we had at the beginning of the Iraqi war will seem like a joke by comparison.

daddytype on January 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM

Ha’Aretz is Israel’s New York Times. I would be triple wary of anything their editorial staff writes…

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM

Reuven Pedatzur’s Bona Fides

RP received his Ph.D. in 1992 from the Department of Political Science, Tel Aviv University. He is the Director of the Galili Center for Strategy and National Security. He serves as a fighter pilot in the Israeli Air Force reserves as well as a Defense Analyst for the Ha’aretz daily newspaper.

Something tells me his c.v. is better than yours.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM

JohnGalt and MellonCollie are here! NOW its a tinfoil hat party!

Two dissenters in a room full of neocon nuts…yeah…what a party for us.

Tell me the one again about the racist newsletters Paul didnt write

How about I tell you about all the racist cr@p Obama spouts, the racist church he goes to, the racial un-supremacy gang of thugs he supports, and the racist LEADERS he’s been chums with for decades? You know, Obama, the guy who’s President RIGHT NOW and not just a candidate?

Hey I have an idea – let’s see you justify permanent occupation of half the Middle East when we’re trillions in the hole?

Or how about the one where ‘national defense’ really means ‘offense’?

Oh! Or the story where you’re somehow deterring terrorists while we have a national border like Swiss Cheese?

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM

They’re something else entirely.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:30 PM

For all their misguided foreign policy stances, Paulians’ posts make significantly more sense than yours. That alcohol-induced raving doesn’t help your cause much, buddy; being coherent does.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:39 PM

The Iranian regime is smart and sober. If we imagine them to be otherwise, the charlie foxtrot we had at the beginning of the Iraqi war will seem like a joke by comparison.

daddytype on January 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM

You’re still nuts, I see. Here’s hoping modern medical science comes up with a miracle cure for antisemitic conspiracy delusions before November.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:40 PM

We have the technology and weaponry to take down the entire Iranian power grid, without setting off an exo-atmospheric EMP nuke. Isotopic separation requires a lot of electrical energy. So we stop nuclear material gathering. The nuke bomb program stops. Civilian deaths are minimized.
 Sucks to be Iran when they are returned from a 1980’s culture to the 18th century. The loss of all electrical power may lead to regime change also.

From September 2009 on HA.

NaCly dog on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

An electric-power strike is another option, and we can do it with old-fashioned iron bombs on all of their big dumb and very vulnerable power plants. Ditto an oil strike.

slickwillie2001 on January 31, 2012 at 12:41 PM

Substitute “climate” for “foreign policy”, and “capitalism” for “Islamic”, and you have yourself an instant recipe for global warming shill.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM

This is precisely why I left the left’s ideology (LOL) not too long after getting sick of the right’s. Same. Exact. Nonsense.

Change a name here and a talking point there, and you could repost the exact same scaremongering bunk on an opposing site’s blog or forum. I used to make a sport out of that…

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM

Something tells me his c.v. is better than yours.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM

And Barack Obama is a Magna Cum Laude graduate of Harvard. Does it make him any smarter? I’d play chess against him for money any day.

Also, let the following penetrate: Ha’Aretz owners do not tolerate political dissent. Even the smartest people will write unbalanced, biased editorials not grounded in facts when the pay is good.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM

His worldview only makes sense if one believes as he and many hardcore Prison Planet/Stormfront Ron Paul believers believe. According to them (Ron Paul, et al), The Protocols of the Elders of Zion is true and a cabal of evil Zionist international bankers orchestrate all wars everywhere, and have done so since the time of Napoleon. We–the United States–are a pawn of these evil Jews (headed by the Rothschild Family, btw), and they are using us to further their diabolical goals. Ron Paul’s friend and creative collaborator Alex Jones has definite ideas on what these goals are.

Watch it all and know that’s what they truly believe. The ‘Ron Paul movement’s’ whole ideology is premised on antisemitism of the worst, most conspiratorial sort. Nothing they believe can be remotely considered within the mainstream of American political thought or theory. Descended from the Know Nothings and the America Firsters, Ron Paul’s acolytes are certainly not Republicans–affiliation with the GOP is strictly a matter of political expediency–and they’re not even libertarians, as the term is commonly understood. They’re something else entirely.

Eine Reich, eine Volk, eine Paul.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:30 PM

The other night I had AM radio on and one of those bottom feeding conspiracy shows came on featuring John Galt’s bud Alex Jones. It was a revealing look into the minds of the mad hatters. I learned they hate the military because they’re actually afraid of us. They seriously think the military has gone through special training on how to round up and execute American citizens. You know, after martial law has been declared (that crazy claim they’ve been saying for the last couple decades). These people are seriously fricken crazy.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM

For all their misguided foreign policy stances, Paulians’ posts make significantly more sense than yours. That alcohol-induced raving doesn’t help your cause much, buddy; being coherent does.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:39 PM

I don’t drink, Paulbot drone, and the incoherence you’re talking about arose only when I described your deeply held and highly irrational personal beliefs.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:44 PM

I don’t drink, Paulbot drone, and the incoherence you’re talking about arose only when I described your deeply held and highly irrational personal beliefs.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:44 PM

Then you obviously pop, sniff, or mainline. Calling me a Paulbot drone is idiotic – double idiotic on the very thread where I’m arguing against Paul’s supporters.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:46 PM

And Barack Obama is a Magna Cum Laude graduate of Harvard.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM

You’re giving him too much credit. Ohblama SAYS he’s a Harvard grad, but he has yet to back it up. Probably because his transcripts read like a Sesame Street episode on the letters “D” and “F”.

Also, they don’t have Dumb-firmative Action in Israel. So take that into account as well.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:48 PM

And Barack Obama is a Magna Cum Laude graduate of Harvard. Does it make him any smarter? I’d play chess against him for money any day.

Also, let the following penetrate: Ha’Aretz owners do not tolerate political dissent. Even the smartest people will write unbalanced, biased editorials not grounded in facts when the pay is good.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM

Re: Iranian nuclear ambitions and motivations, this guy’s c.v. is better than Barack Obama’s. It’s better than anyone in the Cabinet. It is, in fact, better than the Director of CIA (who has a mighty impressive c.v.).

And it is a debatable point as to whether the mullahocracy can be counted on to behave in a completely rational manner. But to state, as fact, that we cannot trust them to be rational, as Ed Morrisey has now done, when the bulk of scholars disagree with him, is approaching global warming crusader status.

The globaloneyists at least do us the favor of limiting their discussion to matters capable of wrecking the world economy. This treads over the line into thermonuclear war.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:49 PM

Also, they don’t have Dumb-firmative Action in Israel. So take that into account as well.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:48 PM

You’re telling that to me, an Israeli citizen? Oh yeah, they have. It just favors different groups.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Then you obviously pop, sniff, or mainline. Calling me a Paulbot drone is idiotic – double idiotic on the very thread where I’m arguing against Paul’s supporters.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:46 PM

No, you’re a Paulbot drone who claims to be an Israeli dual citizen whose daughter happens to be a Ron Paul supporter. Sorry, I don’t buy any of it. You’re a phony, a sock. That blog of yours? Established only to buttress your online persona.

Speaking of which, just how many socks are you guys running on here, anyway?

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Re: Iranian nuclear ambitions and motivations, this guy’s c.v. is better than Barack Obama’s. It’s better than anyone in the Cabinet. It is, in fact, better than the Director of CIA (who has a mighty impressive c.v.).

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:49 PM

I do not question the guy’s CV, though this cabinet’s qualifications is a very low bar to clear. I do question his sincerity.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:54 PM

No, you’re a Paulbot drone who claims to be an Israeli dual citizen whose daughter happens to be a Ron Paul supporter. Sorry, I don’t buy any of it. You’re a phony, a sock. That blog of yours? Established only to buttress your online persona.

Speaking of which, just how many socks are you guys running on here, anyway?

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

Sounds a bit like Pitchforker and Dante.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 12:54 PM

You’re telling that to me, an Israeli citizen? Oh yeah, they have. It just favors different groups.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

…I was referring specifically to the race-based A.A. – like the kind that is pervading the United States. I’m sure your nation has its own brands of favoritism; everyone does.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:55 PM

No, you’re a Paulbot drone who claims to be an Israeli dual citizen whose daughter happens to be a Ron Paul supporter. Sorry, I don’t buy any of it. You’re a phony, a sock. That blog of yours? Established only to buttress your online persona.

Speaking of which, just how many socks are you guys running on here, anyway?

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

What can I say? That’s pretty elaborate characters we got here, just to mess with your mind. Can I offer you a gently used tinfoil hat?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:58 PM

What can I say? That’s pretty elaborate characters we got here, just to mess with your mind. Can I offer you a gently used tinfoil hat?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:58 PM

No, Paulbot, but you and yours can disassociate yourselves from the GOP. That would make me happy.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:01 PM

Speaking of which, just how many socks are you guys running on here, anyway?

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM

The only socks are the ones you stuffed in a tin can for discreet glue-sniffing.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:01 PM

I do not question the guy’s CV, though this cabinet’s qualifications is a very low bar to clear. I do question his sincerity.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 12:54 PM

Petreaus has some mighty impressive credentials, even aside from his military training.

As far as Pedatzur’s sincerity, he heads up a pretty well thought of policy tank in Israel, certainly not one known for it’s dove standards. And he has worked with heavy duty programs in this country, like MIT.

I don’t think he’s tossing a career for 30 pieces of silver from Ha’aretz.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:02 PM

…I was referring specifically to the race-based A.A. – like the kind that is pervading the United States. I’m sure your nation has its own brands of favoritism; everyone does.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Got it now. I just used Teh Zero as an example: having a lauded CV, having intelligence and skill, and actually giving a qualified opinion do not always go together.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:03 PM

No, Paulbot, but you and yours can disassociate yourselves from the GOP. That would make me happy.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:01 PM

I haven’t been associated with the GOP in the first place; I don’t want the stench to rub on me.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:05 PM

They were told October is a good time to try something.

Kissmygrits on January 31, 2012 at 1:06 PM

I don’t think he’s tossing a career for 30 pieces of silver from Ha’aretz.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:02 PM

Sigh. Editorializing for Ha’Aretz is a career. Unless you’re a lawyer or an old Palmachnik, it’s the only way to introduce yourself to public before you jump into center-left politics.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:08 PM

I haven’t been associated with the GOP in the first place; I don’t want the stench to rub on me.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:05 PM

The only socks are the ones you stuffed in a tin can for discreet glue-sniffing.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:01 PM

Just a friendly suggestion, but you might want to take your sock puppetry elsewhere. Besides, talking to yourself online isn’t conducive to mental stability. Ask Glenn Greenwald.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:12 PM

How about I tell you about all the racist cr@p Obama spouts, the racist church he goes to, the racial un-supremacy gang of thugs he supports, and the racist LEADERS he’s been chums with for decades? You know, Obama, the guy who’s President RIGHT NOW and not just a candidate?

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM

Obama being a racist makes Paul not a racist? I’m confused, what’s your point? That Bush did it too?

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 1:13 PM

Besides, talking to yourself online isn’t conducive to mental stability.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:12 PM

I’m sure you speak from personal experience. In any case, a sincere offer of a gently used tinfoil hat still stands; you are in obvious need of one.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:18 PM

Sigh. Editorializing for Ha’Aretz is a career.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:08 PM

Perhaps you’d care to tell that to the Poli Sci Dept at Tel Aviv University.

Or are they just another left-wing fifth column for the Persians?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:18 PM

Obama being a racist makes Paul not a racist? I’m confused, what’s your point? That Bush did it too?

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 1:13 PM

When Paul (a potential candidate) is ten cents worth of racist and Obama (the elected POTUS) is ten DOLLARS worth of racist, picking on Paul for ‘racism’ is pretty darn lame.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:21 PM

From September 2009 on HA.

NaCly dog on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

That may not be sufficient to stop these crazies though.

dogsoldier on January 31, 2012 at 1:21 PM

Perhaps you’d care to tell that to the Poli Sci Dept at Tel Aviv University. Or are they just another left-wing fifth column for the Persians?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:18 PM

No, they are the left-wing fifth column for the so-called “Palestinians”, though not so much as Jerusalem University. If you look for Israeli right-wing intelligentsia, that would be Bar-Ilan.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:25 PM

When Paul (a potential candidate) is ten cents worth of racist and Obama (the elected POTUS) is ten DOLLARS worth of racist, picking on Paul for ‘racism’ is pretty darn lame.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:21 PM

Yeah. Dahmer only killed 17 people. Bundy killed far more. We need to build a statue to commemorate Dahmer…

“Ron Paul for president. Only a “little” racist.”

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 1:28 PM

No, they are the left-wing fifth column for the so-called “Palestinians”, though not so much as Jerusalem University. If you look for Israeli right-wing intelligentsia, that would be Bar-Ilan.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:25 PM

Then you should feel free to quote some of their scholars indicating Iran is a non-rational nuclear actor.

If you can find them.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:31 PM

I’m sure you speak from personal experience. In any case, a sincere offer of a gently used tinfoil hat still stands; you are in obvious need of one.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:18 PM

No, you are what you are: a Paulbot who thinks he’s some kind of Internet sock wizard, too clever by half. Pro-tip: all socks can be found out if someone decides to take the time and trouble to find them out. A copy of Tor to generate a different IP does not make one un-findable.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:32 PM

I haven’t the time now to read the whole thread, so please forgive if this is redundant:

I question the timing.

(Somebody had to say it.)

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 1:32 PM

Yeah. Dahmer only killed 17 people. Bundy killed far more. We need to build a statue to commemorate Dahmer…

Go ahead and build one. Make sure to sign your name and address on the statue and post pictures up on Youtube.

“Ron Paul for president. Only a “little” racist.”

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 1:28 PM

Considering the left thinks all of you are racist, and not just a little, you might want to actually come up with a valid point.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:34 PM

No, you are what you are: a Paulbot who thinks he’s some kind of Internet sock wizard, too clever by half. Pro-tip: all socks can be found out if someone decides to take the time and trouble to find them out. A copy of Tor to generate a different IP does not make one un-findable.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:32 PM

And I suppose you’ve actually tried, and found out your accusations of ‘socks’ are utterly worthless, like everything else you post?

I’d be surprised if me and whatsisface are even in the same state.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:39 PM

Then you should feel free to quote some of their scholars indicating Iran is a non-rational nuclear actor.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:31 PM

Who needs scholarly analysis when we have the original source?

http://blog.standforisrael.org/issues/terrorism/iran/iranian-calls-for-israels-destruction

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:39 PM

If Libertarianism is such a great political philosophy, why are the Paultards constantly trying to co-opt the GOP? If Paul is the one and only messiah who can save us from ourselves, then he should have no problem standing on his own two feet on the Libertarian schtik. Instead we have mindless drones trying to tell us we’re not the “true conservatives.”

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 1:40 PM

A copy of Tor to generate a different IP does not make one un-findable.

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 1:32 PM

I see you have significant exposure to the technology. “Project we much”?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:42 PM

This is all part of the Democrat plan to reduce the size of the federal government.

NoDonkey on January 31, 2012 at 1:42 PM

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM

You can’t be serious.

That’s quite the stretch.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 1:44 PM

The Paulians speak with all the wisdom of youth.;)

Ed Morrisey, you should be ashamed.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:19 PM

Ed is spot on, you are the one who should be ashamed at your ignorance. The 12ver thing is the driving force behind Irans leader. It is a bastardized version of Christian Armageddon with the difference being that the Shia don’t have to wait on Allah, they can induce the world chaos required to wake the dude up. They won’t bother to take the time to paint the weapon before they use it.

I’ve often wondered what Sunni majority Syria would have such ties to Shia Iran. Assad is an Amirite Muslim. The Amirites are the ruling class of Syria. Amirites are a splinter Shia group who also are profound believers in the dude in the well. That is the only connection between them but it seams to be strong enough to bond them solidly enough to risk all in sowing the chaos required for prophesy to be fulfilled.

If you do some study on Islam you will find the backstory that drives the current world and see things a little more clearly. Ignorance is not bliss, it is ignorance.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 1:44 PM

If Libertarianism is such a great political philosophy, why are the Paultards constantly trying to co-opt the GOP? If Paul is the one and only messiah who can save us from ourselves, then he should have no problem standing on his own two feet on the Libertarian schtik. Instead we have mindless drones trying to tell us we’re not the “true conservatives.”

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 1:40 PM

My theory on that is that the Libertarian movements, like the first mammals of Jurassic era, have to feed on dead dinosaur carcasses until they evolve. :)

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:45 PM

If Paul is the one and only messiah who can save us from ourselves, then he should have no problem standing on his own two feet on the Libertarian schtik.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 1:40 PM

Why? If people won’t listen to the actual Messiah to save them from hellfire, is it really so surprising that the permawar brigade won’t listen to one of the very few people in the government saying “we can’t afford to do this forever!”

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:45 PM

Who needs scholarly analysis when we have the original source?

http://blog.standforisrael.org/issues/terrorism/iran/iranian-calls-for-israels-destruction

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:39 PM

Please point to me the quote you think we should understand to mean that we must necessarily count on Iran to behave in a non-rational manner re: nuclear weapons.

Or admit that you cannot.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:46 PM

I see you have significant exposure to the technology. “Project we much”?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:42 PM

He’s probably logged on as we speak, diligently searching for “Captain Picard”.

Warning to the curious: do not try this. I found out the hard way that you won’t get results related to Star Trek.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:49 PM

If you do some study on Islam you will find the backstory that drives the current world and see things a little more clearly. Ignorance is not bliss, it is ignorance.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 1:44 PM

Apparently, you missed my source, which disagrees with your analysis

Iran is too rational to attack Israel

Prof. Ofira Seliktar of Gratz College in Pennsylvania examined the vast literature on this subject and found that two-thirds of researchers fall into the “nuclear optimist” category – they believe that a nuclear Iran would behave as a rational state and thus be susceptible to deterrence aimed at stopping it from using nuclear weapons.

Those in a position to know overwhelmingly disagree with you.

Perhaps you can offer some scholarship in your defense?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:51 PM

Which is why I am a gun owner who supports the Second Amendment.

My bet is they won’t put Texas, Arizona or Louisiana high on the possible attack list for that very reason.

Liberal states where legal guns are virtually banned?

Marcus Traianus on January 31, 2012 at 1:52 PM

Please point to me the quote you think we should understand to mean that we must necessarily count on Iran to behave in a non-rational manner re: nuclear weapons.

Or admit that you cannot.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:46 PM

I doubt I’ll find anything good in under a few minutes; this is not a subject on which I keep diligent tracks. The question, however, is whether I’m willing to take a chance of such behavior, and the answer is a resounding no.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:54 PM

You can’t be serious.

That’s quite the stretch.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 1:44 PM

Did he state it as fact?

Are there not many scholars who disagree? In fact, does not a scholar on the ground in Israel say most of the scholarship disagrees with that viewpoint?

Perhaps I was a bit harsh on our host. But dammit, this dogma of a non-rational Iranian leadership, when those who know best at very least acknowledge serious disagreement on the matter… sometimes it p!sses me off.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:54 PM

The question, however, is whether I’m willing to take a chance of such behavior, and the answer is a resounding no.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:54 PM

From my perspective, the question is should this nation, the US, risk war, quite possibly thermonuclear war, over an assumption of non-rationality that simply is not backed up by those who study such things?

And the answer is a resounding no.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:01 PM

But dammit, this dogma of a non-rational Iranian leadership, when those who know best at very least acknowledge serious disagreement on the matter… sometimes it p!sses me off.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:54 PM

Think of it this way. We may have a rational, stable government in Iran today, but who promised you that we will have it tomorrow? It just takes one burst of “Arab spring”, one “democratic” election, and one popular, weasel-crazy Islamic cleric to bang the red button.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:01 PM

This is rich. Tinfoil hatters calling others tinfoil hatters. Talk about projection. Perhaps we need to start dragging out their childish behavior from the other Paul threads. Like JohnGalt telling me to STFU and Pitchforker insinuating the military is full of child molesters.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 2:06 PM

From my perspective, the question is should this nation, the US, risk war, quite possibly thermonuclear war, over an assumption of non-rationality that simply is not backed up by those who study such things?

And the answer is a resounding no.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:01 PM

See where people who studied American economy got us? Now, what makes you think that prized experts in other areas are any better?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:08 PM

Think of it this way. We may have a rational, stable government in Iran today, but who promised you that we will have it tomorrow? It just takes one burst of “Arab spring”, one “democratic” election, and one popular, weasel-crazy Islamic cleric to bang the red button.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:01 PM

You could say the same about Pakistan. You could say a similar thing about the NoKo’s, a state that probably actually comes the closest to a non-rational actor, but we manage to get by treating them rationally. Hell, to some extent, you could say it about the Russians.

But to propose acts of war (which is where all this discussion inevitably ends), based on the possible outcomes of unforeseen revolutions, is lunacy. You talk of isolation? Such a policy would not only bankrupt us, but would inevitably pit us against a good chunk of the world eventually.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:08 PM

This is rich. Tinfoil hatters calling others tinfoil hatters.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 2:06 PM

Bullcrap. We are discussing ideas. You’re frothing at the mouth. See the difference?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:09 PM

I see you have significant exposure to the technology. “Project we much”?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 1:42 PM

A few years ago, some friends and I exposed a pedophile network on YouTube that was using a ‘kids video club’ to groom and gather personal data on children. We publicly exposed and reported those men to the authorities. Each of those men had constructed an elaborate, multi-layered set of defenses around their identities, since exposure meant the possibility of prison time. Their methods were sophisticated but not impenetrable, given time and effort.

Obviously, exposing a Ron Paul sock farmer on a political forum isn’t a big deal. The safety of children is not at stake, as was the case before. The thing that bothers me about it is the dishonesty of your methods. Ron Paul supporters stuff the ballots in straw polls and swarm online polls and create innumerable sock accounts on political forums in order to give the impression Ron Paul enjoys more popular support than is the case.

It isn’t your methods so much (which are a nuisance), it’s the thinking behind it. Does it occur to any of you that what you’re doing is wrong, or are all means and methods permissible if done in service to your cause?

troyriser_gopftw on January 31, 2012 at 2:12 PM

Go ahead and build one. Make sure to sign your name and address on the statue and post pictures up on Youtube.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 1:34 PM

Just like you attach your name to Ron Paul? Logical disconnect much?

Backing the racist Ron Paul automatically calls into question your motives character, just like if I put my name on the hypothetical statue commemorating Dahmer.

Considering the left thinks all of you are racist, and not just a little, you might want to actually come up with a valid point.

What does the unhinged stupidity of the left have to do with anything? They also fail to recognize Obama’s racist tendencies. Independents are what matters. And if they view both candidates as racist they will vote for the racist we know. Personally, I won’t vote for either racist.

NotCoach on January 31, 2012 at 2:12 PM

See where people who studied American economy got us? Now, what makes you think that prized experts in other areas are any better?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:08 PM

I see the only man still on stage for the GOP nomination… the only man in Congress… who told us ahead of time what was going to happen to the housing market, and what it was going to do to the larger economy.

And then I listen to what he is saying about conducting diplomacy with Iran.

Now, Ron Paul is no Iranian scholar. But he knows that there are such people, and that most such people are now telling us we should treat Iran as a rational actor.

Sounded like good advice in 2003, when he warned about the housing bubble. And it sounds like good advice now.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:14 PM

And I think that you know innocent people were killed in those raids. And I think you know that steps were taken to cover those incidents up. Maybe you didn’t witness them. But, much like the veterans I referenced before, I’m sure you heard the stories.

JohnGalt23 on December 14, 2011 at 10:10 AM

On the album of John Gault’s greatest hits, this is my favorite. We military folks apparently killed a bunch of civilians in Iraq and covered it up (or at least “heard the stories”). This fits right in with my earlier comments on Alex Jones, and your frequent comments on the military.

The other night I had AM radio on and one of those bottom feeding conspiracy shows came on featuring John Galt’s bud Alex Jones. It was a revealing look into the minds of the mad hatters. I learned they hate the military because they’re actually afraid of us. They seriously think the military has gone through special training on how to round up and execute American citizens. You know, after martial law has been declared (that crazy claim they’ve been saying for the last couple decades). These people are seriously fricken crazy.

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 2:15 PM

You could say the same about Pakistan. You could say a similar thing about the NoKo’s, a state that probably actually comes the closest to a non-rational actor, but we manage to get by treating them rationally. Hell, to some extent, you could say it about the Russians.

But to propose acts of war (which is where all this discussion inevitably ends), based on the possible outcomes of unforeseen revolutions, is lunacy. You talk of isolation? Such a policy would not only bankrupt us, but would inevitably pit us against a good chunk of the world eventually.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:08 PM

I actually wouldn’t mind melting half Pakistan into radioactive glass, just avoiding the part that India wants back. The world will be definitely better without. NorKo is a part of Korea and will merge in sooner or later; there is no point in wasting nukes on one of our best allies. As for Russians, their regime does not threaten the USA directly or even rhetorically, so why bother?

And honestly, I don’t give a flying rat’s patootie what “good chunk of the world” thinks. They’ll mind their business and we’ll mind ours.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:17 PM

Bullcrap. We are discussing ideas. You’re frothing at the mouth. See the difference?

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:09 PM

Why do you keep thinking I’m talking to you?

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 2:17 PM

The anti-intellectualism runs strong through this one. Clearly more fit for South Milwaukee than for Madison.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM

And you appear more fit for France, you pompous twit.

MadisonConservative on January 31, 2012 at 2:18 PM

America never properly repaid the Iranian regime after the hostage crisis.

The failure to do so in a timely manner is a large part of why we’re where we are today.

Christien on January 31, 2012 at 2:19 PM

Perhaps you can offer some scholarship in your defense?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 1:51 PM

The 12vers are the quintessential irrational actors. Scholars who are rational and operate with a Western mindset can’t help but dismiss such irrationality. But the fact is that the supreme believer in this irrationality is the supreme leader of Iran. He is not encumbered with Western logic, he is to usher in the last days. A nations domestic worries or demise are small potatoes compared to bringing Muslim salvation to the planet isn’t it? And if the Mahdis wake up call consists of Nuking Israel, that’s a twofer.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 2:20 PM

I actually wouldn’t mind melting half Pakistan into radioactive glass, just avoiding the part that India wants back. The world will be definitely better without.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:17 PM

Yeah.

Advising candidates for public office in the US to take such a position… probably not a winning move.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:22 PM

I see the only man still on stage for the GOP nomination… the only man in Congress… who told us ahead of time what was going to happen to the housing market, and what it was going to do to the larger economy.

And then I listen to what he is saying about conducting diplomacy with Iran.

Now, Ron Paul is no Iranian scholar. But he knows that there are such people, and that most such people are now telling us we should treat Iran as a rational actor.

Sounded like good advice in 2003, when he warned about the housing bubble. And it sounds like good advice now.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:14 PM

I would embrace his financial and economic position any day, but he hadn’t been dealing with the Middle Eastern breed of Muslims as much as I had to, for a decade. Even though some of these people may be rational, most of them are not; to ascribe an ability to cooperate, see reason, and keep the word to them, and especially to their leaders, is a gross mistake.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:22 PM

Why do you keep thinking I’m talking to you?

Logboy on January 31, 2012 at 2:17 PM

I know. You’re talking to yourself. No problem, go ahead.

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:23 PM

Prof. Ofira Seliktar of Gratz College

Oh, now I’m convinced.

I googled Prof. Ofira Seliktar and this is the first result:

Academics against Israel : Middle East Forum

Oh, that Ofira Seliktar.

My bad.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:23 PM

The 12vers are the quintessential irrational actors. Scholars who are rational and operate with a Western mindset can’t help but dismiss such irrationality. But the fact is that the supreme believer in this irrationality is the supreme leader of Iran. He is not encumbered with Western logic, he is to usher in the last days. A nations domestic worries or demise are small potatoes compared to bringing Muslim salvation to the planet isn’t it? And if the Mahdis wake up call consists of Nuking Israel, that’s a twofer.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 2:20 PM

I’ll take the noticeable lack of links or bibliographical reference as: “No, I cannot provide such scholarly evidence.”

That’s what I thought.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:24 PM

Advising candidates for public office in the US to take such a position… probably not a winning move.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:22 PM

LOL, it isn’t. I don’t think any candidate is willing to adopt it. But in an imperfect world, I can still support a candidate who rejects it with the least enthusiasm. :)

Archivarix on January 31, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Oh, that Ofira Seliktar.

My bad.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:23 PM

Who is, in fact, being cited by Reuven Pedatzur, Senior Lecturer at Tel Aviv University.

But I suppose he is an anti-Zionist also, hmm?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Advising candidates for public office in the US to take such a position… probably not a winning move.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:22 PM

Don’t be too sure of that. Permawar voters are numerous, the military and arms lobbies are very powerful, and most politicians don’t really give a rat’s arse about ending the occupations. Obama didn’t even bother trying until he needed a cheap bonus card for his reelection.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 2:26 PM

But I suppose he is an anti-Zionist also, hmm?

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:26 PM

What?

God, you’re a shitbird.

I guess all of the scholarly treatises on global warming set your heart aflame as well.

What part of THEY SAID THEY WOULD DO IT don’t you understand?

You don’t think we should be prepared for that scenario and work to avert it if indeed this isn’t some cosmic bluff?

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:33 PM

Oh, now I’m convinced.

I googled Prof. Ofira Seliktar and this is the first result:

Academics against Israel : Middle East Forum

Oh, that Ofira Seliktar.

My bad.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:23 PM

Did you even read that article that came up when you Googled it?

I didn’t think so.

Allow me…

While researching a new book on the failure of the Oslo Accords Seliktar noted the predominance of Israeli academics among Oslo’s promoters, but even more disturbingly, working in conjunction with NGOs and others to discredit Israel. Her article, which will appear in the next issue of the journal Israel Affairs, will generate even more controversy….

As Seliktar’s paper points out, the explicitly political activities of activist scholars are given legitimacy and protected by their positions of authority and safety in universities.

So, in other words, the person you are trying to discredit is in fact, pointing out the failings of the anti-Israel academy.

You have just proven the depths of dumbass that the knuckle-dragging Right will descend into.

Congratulations.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:33 PM

I’ll take the noticeable lack of links or bibliographical reference as: “No, I cannot provide such scholarly evidence.”

That’s what I thought.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:24 PM

You could google 12vers for a start on your road away from ignorance. There is much out there. No need for me to present any, it isn’t esoteric knowledge.Educate yourself.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 2:34 PM

In the year or two after 9/11, a lot was said about “sleeper cells.” Now, I can’t remember the last time I heard a reporter give an update. Remember the news segments about Muslim enclaves in which non-Muslims couldn’t go, including a few camps in the woods? I haven’t heard about them in years.

Tick tock.

KyMouse on January 31, 2012 at 2:37 PM

So, in other words, the person you are trying to discredit is in fact, pointing out the failings of the anti-Israel academy.

You have just proven the depths of dumbass that the knuckle-dragging Right will descend into.

Congratulations.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:33 PM

Yes, I followed the link and read the first several paragraphs, and found it wanting.

See my last post. Your last sentence reinforces my opinion that you are, indeed, a shitbird of the highest order.

Now go chase a rEVOLutionary blimp or something, you Paulian nutter.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:39 PM

No need for me to present any…

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 2:34 PM

…is usually taken as an admission of defeat.

I learned a rule a long time ago… good general rule for discussions, both off and online: It’s bad form to go around questioning other people’s sources, when you fail to provide any of your own.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Yes, I followed the link and read the first several paragraphs, and found it wanting.

See my last post. Your last sentence reinforces my opinion that you are, indeed, a shitbird of the highest order.

Now go chase a rEVOLutionary blimp or something, you Paulian nutter.

I stand corrected.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Fixed, for good manners.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:41 PM

for good manners.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:41 PM

That’s a keeper.

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:42 PM

US intelligence warns Iran poised to conduct terror attacks in US

Substitute Al Qaeda for Iran, and you have the title of a famous presidential daily briefing.

tom on January 31, 2012 at 2:44 PM

You have just proven the depths of dumbass that the knuckle-dragging Right will descend into.

Congratulations.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:33 PM

You have just proven the narcissistic arrogance and elitism that so oft yet wrongly accompany the mindset of paleocons, stuck forever in the belief that World War 2 has not yet occurred.

Pat Buchanan is proud.

MadisonConservative on January 31, 2012 at 2:44 PM

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012

Do you or do you not find the IPCC report on AGW to be credible?

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:47 PM

KyMouse on January 31, 2012 at 2:37 PM

The ‘sleeper cells’ stories have gone the way of WMD’s. After certain people started proclaiming that every last practicing Muslim should be considered an enemy agent, even interned like Japanese during WW2…

Let’s just say the discussion kind of went downhill from there, and the news agencies eventually dropped it.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 2:47 PM

is usually taken as an admission of defeat.

I learned a rule a long time ago… good general rule for discussions, both off and online: It’s bad form to go around questioning other people’s sources, when you fail to provide any of your own.

JohnGalt23 on January 31, 2012 at 2:39 PM

He is the secret my ignorant friend. Type the magic words….hidden imam……into whatever search engine you like. Google has currently 12,700,000 bits of info on the matter. Read a few and make your own decision on the matter rather than rely on what some Jewish Scholars agree on. Jews are clever but not necessarily wise.

BL@KBIRD on January 31, 2012 at 2:47 PM

Do you or do you not find the IPCC report on AGW to be credible?

hillbillyjim on January 31, 2012 at 2:47 PM

Already brought it up, and he responded by calling me anti-intellectual. He’s increasingly become a scummier and scummier troll as time has gone by.

MadisonConservative on January 31, 2012 at 2:49 PM

Substitute Al Qaeda for Iran, and you have the title of a famous presidential daily briefing.

tom on January 31, 2012 at 2:44 PM

And just like then, our internal security is daily breached by illiterate peasants and groping Granny because they’re forbidden to profile…

It looks as though the USA is going to have to learn the hard way that playing “Whack-A-Jihadi” makes a lot of sound and fury but not much security, besides being hopelessly expensive.

MelonCollie on January 31, 2012 at 2:51 PM

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