Q4 GDP: 2.8%

posted at 9:15 am on January 27, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

The good news — the annualized GDP growth rate in the fourth quarter went up a full point from Q3′s final number to 2.8%.  The bad news: the first estimate for Q4 is only three-tenths of a point better than the first estimate for Q3:

Real gross domestic product — the output of goods and services produced by labor and property located in the United States — increased at an annual rate of 2.8 percent in the fourth quarter of 2011 (that is, from the third quarter to the fourth quarter), according to the “advance” estimate released by the Bureau of Economic Analysis.  In the third quarter, real GDP increased 1.8 percent.

The Bureau emphasized that the fourth-quarter advance estimate released today is based on source data that are incomplete or subject to further revision by the source agency (see the box on page 4).  The “second” estimate for the fourth quarter, based on more complete data, will be released on February 29, 2012.

The increase in real GDP in the fourth quarter reflected positive contributions from private inventory investment, personal consumption expenditures (PCE), exports, residential fixed investment, and nonresidential fixed investment that were partly offset by negative contributions from federal government spending and state and local government spending.  Imports, which are a subtraction in the calculation of GDP, increased.

Even assuming this number holds up in further revisions, it’s still basically a holding-pattern number.  We need to see much more growth than this to expand job creation in any significant manner.  That figure should be in the 4s this far out from a recovery, not the 2s or the 1s, and until we see that kind of growth, we won’t see job growth significantly exceeding population growth or an expansion of the work force from its 30-year low in participation rates.

Underneath the mildly positive report are a couple of warning signs.  PCE growth was only 2.0%, below the growth level of the overall economy, which means consumer demand isn’t catching fire.  Services only grew 0.2%, a bad indicator for demand.  Most worrisome is that the real final sales of domestic product, which measures actual sales without inventory growth, only rose 0.8%, after a 3.2% growth in Q3.  That’s a very weak number and may indicate an inventory glut heading into 2012.

Even Reuters doesn’t sound terribly optimistic about this report’s indications for 2012:

The U.S. economy grew at its fastest pace in 1-1/2 years in the fourth quarter, but a strong rebuilding of stocks by businesses and weak spending on capital goods hinted at slower growth in early 2012.

U.S. gross domestic product expanded at a 2.8 percent annual rate, the Commerce Department said on Friday, a sharp acceleration from the 1.8 percent clip of the prior three months and the quickest pace since the second quarter of 2010.

It was, however, a touch below economists’ expectations for a 3.0 percent rate.

They also point out that most of the growth was in inventory expansion:

Inventories increased $56.0 billion, adding 1.94 percentage points to GDP growth. Excluding inventories, the economy grew at a tepid 0.8 percent rate, a sharp step-down from the prior period’s 3.2 percent pace.

The robust stock accumulation suggest the recovery will lose a step in early 2012.

I’d expect this number to fall to 2.2% or 2.3% by the time of the final revision in March.


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So when is the downgrade expected? So it’s not… you know, unexpected.

UnderstandingisPower on January 27, 2012 at 9:17 AM

OMG BEST ECONOMY EVER SUCK IT BUSH!

Good Lt on January 27, 2012 at 9:17 AM

“We are headed in the right direction”
Obama..2010

Baxter Greene on January 27, 2012 at 9:19 AM

Is it actually possible to expect constant, exponential growth without economic bubbles anymore? Has there been spectacular growth in the last 30 years without a resultant bubble and crash? Savings and Loan in the 1980s, dot coms, telecomm, housing etc. When we don’t produce and rely upon financing gimmicks for growth, how can we expect that American capitalism will function the way it did during the golden years?

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:19 AM

Underneath the mildly positive report are a couple of warning signs. PCE growth was only 2.0%, below the growth level of the overall economy, which means consumer demand isn’t catching fire. Services only grew 0.2%, a bad indicator for demand. Most worrisome is that the real final sales of domestic product, which measures actual sales without inventory growth, only rose 0.8%, after a 3.2% growth in Q3. That’s a very weak number and may indicate an inventory glut heading into 2012.

Memo to Mittens. The economy is NOT improving. So stop saying it on nationally broadcast radio programs!!!

Doughboy on January 27, 2012 at 9:21 AM

to be revised down by at least 1pt in 30 days.

james23 on January 27, 2012 at 9:21 AM

Good thing we’ve got one of the top four Presidents in charge right now! [phooey!!!]

The fact of the matter is President Poverty has made it clear that private business and profit are bad things. He is constantly demanding higher taxes and more regulation. It is small wonder that corporations are sitting on their cash, it is not clear that any investment makes sense so long as a socialist is destroying this nation and all it used to stand for.

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 9:22 AM

to be revised down by at least 1pt in 30 days.

james23 on January 27, 2012 at 9:21 AM

Unexpectedly.

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 9:22 AM

They also point out that most of the growth was in inventory expansion

Yep. Ex-inventory, GDP only grew at .8%. This is really really bad news for the U.S. The FED came out this week and basically said that the economy is going to suck until 2014, so they’re keeping rates at 0% to .25% for the next 2 years! That’s an amazingly long length of time for no rate hikes, esp. with the trillions we’ve spent on stimulus and QE’s. With the personal consumption numbers collapsing, who’ll buy all that inventory? Prices will have to be slashed which will mean less profits, which will mean more job losses and bankruptcy. Not good.

Weight of Glory on January 27, 2012 at 9:24 AM

Spin away now cuz you know it’ll be revised

cmsinaz on January 27, 2012 at 9:24 AM

So I got a question for you right wing nuts

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

Drudge has the “1.7% GDP for the year” posted.
Excruciating………
Obama’s policies have been a dismal failure……political payoffs,bailouts,and throwing money at ideological windmills.

….Obama and the liberal sheep that praise his every step will continue to claim how superior they are…how successful they are….and how much any failure is “Bush’s fault” and “could have been a lot worse.”

This is what liberals consider “The best President ever”……
…..even Obama claims himself to be “the forth best President ever”…..

………….not based on facts or results…just because they say so.

Epic fail.

Baxter Greene on January 27, 2012 at 9:27 AM

So without inventory stockpiling the GDP growth would be 0.8%?
Wow. That stimulus package is the gift that keeps on giving.

eyedoc on January 27, 2012 at 9:27 AM

Is it actually possible to expect constant, exponential growth without economic bubbles anymore? Has there been spectacular growth in the last 30 years without a resultant bubble and crash? Savings and Loan in the 1980s, dot coms, telecomm, housing etc. When we don’t produce and rely upon financing gimmicks for growth, how can we expect that American capitalism will function the way it did during the golden years?

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:19 AM

We can’t as long as the current party in power
continues to destroy the engines of wealth creation and chase away investors.

You cannot create finacial growth and jobs in a country where you

1. Reduce the countries ability to generate power
2. Pick winners and loser in the market place instead of allowing the market to compete.
3. Regulate all profit out of any viable business (EPA
4. Push a policy of union growth at every possible opportunity
5. Limit the ability to obtain the natural resources required to create manufacturing and skilled labor based jobs

I could go on but I think the point is made. We will never see any substantial growth under democrats or liberal republicans.

Skwor on January 27, 2012 at 9:27 AM

Wait until the “revisions” are posted…and forgotten.

A command economy a la Soviet Union…increase production and who cares if there is a market for what is produced and the costs of production nor the price it is to be sold. We can always have a red tag sale at the end of the season. Solyndra anyone?

Just got to keep churning out “stuff” so we can sell “stuff” and move “stuff” around.

Can we see Obama’s transcripts now? His understanding of Econ 101 seems a bit lacking, but his grasp of a command economy seems to be right on target…Marxism was always an easy “A” back in the day.

coldwarrior on January 27, 2012 at 9:28 AM

So you’re going to blame PBHO for this?

Yeah, that’s fair, as if this nation has incredible amounts of energy resources to harvest that would create millions upon million of jobs in every sector you can imagine while simultaneously dropping energy prices so low that people wouldn’t have to choose between gasoline and food.

Get your heads out of the sand, wing-dings.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:28 AM

It is small wonder that corporations are sitting on their cash, it is not clear that any investment makes sense so long as a socialist is destroying this nation and all it used to stand for.

Um, if that is the case then why are corporations marketing and selling products at all if they are convinced that the destruction of the nation is a very real possibility. Your insane conspiracy theories surrounding Obama just do not pass the most basic of smell tests. Corporations aren’t hiring, in part, because they are too busy wringing every last bit of productivity out of the workers they have now. As anyone who has a mid-level corporate job will tell you, corporations are adding responsibilities to folks workdays at an accelerated rate. Many large corporations are changing their PT and Vacation day policies, for the worse. Work hours continue to lengthen and pay increases are not matched with increased productivity.

These policies, which are explicitly anti-family values as they keep parents away from children longer, and add stress to families, are not the fault of the Obama Administration’s “destruction of the nation.” They are about the fact that corporations recognize that American workers have given up on unionization and will accept any and all working conditions, no matter how arbitrary or difficult. Tightening employment across the board makes it easier for employers to enact regressive policies against their employees, because jobs are scarce. If you deny that any of the phenomenon I’ve listed is happening in your job than I say:

1. You’re represented by a union
2. You work for the state
3. You’re a liar.

One of those three.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:29 AM

I’m sorry that this isn’t the good news that you REAL Americans were looking for. Perhaps some extra prayer will help the economy decline next quarter.

KeninCT on January 27, 2012 at 9:29 AM

Do not focus on the Q4 number!

GDP for the year declined from 3% in 2010 to 1.7% in 2011

singlemalt 18 on January 27, 2012 at 9:29 AM

It is small wonder that corporations are sitting on their cash, it is not clear that any investment makes sense so long as a socialist is destroying this nation and all it used to stand for.

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 9:22 AM

Rhetorical query: I have 100 million in sitting cash. Why would I risk loaning any of it into a shrinking down economy at less than 1% interest? Re-fi mortgages for the best clients are less than 4% for 30 year loans.

Answer: If I lost enough brain cells to loan in that market, I Wouldn’t have enough left for autonomic functions.

platypus on January 27, 2012 at 9:31 AM

So I got a question for you right wing nuts

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

If you want to be technical yes, 2.8% represents grwoth.

The problem with 2.8% growth is that it is not high enough to spur job growth. Eventually, this demand to grow inventory will stop, and unless there is a demand to buy the inventory, this “growth” will cease.

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 9:31 AM

Inventories increased $56.0 billion…

How much of that involved Volts and Leafs sitting around on dealer lots, taking up space and money?

Sounds like a lot of companies either ramped up their inventory in hope for a good season, or, lots of inventory was left on shelves in the Christmas season.

William Teach on January 27, 2012 at 9:32 AM

So I got a question for you right wing nuts

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

…..Does this look like “success to you” dumba$$?????

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/gdp-growth-rates-list-by-country

…Slovakia..Poland..Sir Lanka….and Kenya are kicking our butt in growth rate.

Go get your shovel and dig a whole so that you can lower the bar even further in your pathetic attempts to praise your boy king dumba$$.

Baxter Greene on January 27, 2012 at 9:34 AM

1. Reduce the countries ability to generate power

Agreed. Too bad that the right insists that we abandon any and all domestic energy solutions that don’t rely on fossil fuels. Thst’s a two way street.

2. Pick winners and loser in the market place instead of allowing the market to compete.

I don’t think I have to remind you which President proposed and instituted the bailouts which began in 2007 of the auto industry, AIG and other financial firms long before Obama came into office. What on earth makes you think electing Mitt Romney who is the only candidate more Wall Street friendly than Obama in this race, would allow for “too big” institutions to actually fail. You’re deluding yourself.

3. Regulate all profit out of any viable business (EPA

Sort of hard to make money if your customers are hacking up a lung because of polluted particulates in the air or are paying for cancer treatments from contaminated water. You watched the 2008 housing bubble burst and you believe that corproate America is going to self regulate its output to prevent harming American life expectancy? And they call liberals naive.

4. Push a policy of union growth at every possible opportunity

Unions are not perfect, especially teacher’s unions, but we are so far from a period of union growth its not funny. Union membership has plummetted in the last 30 years, you can not blame the current economy on them.

5. Limit the ability to obtain the natural resources required to create manufacturing and skilled labor based jobs

Specific examples please? For manufacturing jobs specifically, not for oil production.

Skwor on January 27, 2012 at 9:27 AM

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

The state of the union is strong
-dear leader

cmsinaz on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

Thursday, July 23, 2009 5:59:11 PM

WASHINGTON (AP) – President Barack Obama says he’s gone from praying nightly before going to bed to praying all the time because he has a “lot of stuff” on his plate and needs “guidance all the time.”

Obama made the comments in an interview to air Thursday on ABC’s “Nightline.”

Does anyone else miss Poptech? I do; the current crop of leftists who managed to sneak past the HEPA filter just aren’t up to the job.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

I’d expect this number to fall to 2.2% or 2.3% by the time of the final revision in March.

At which point it will never be reported by Reuters…

hillsoftx on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

If everything’s so rosy, why then is the Bearded Clam proclaiming low interest rates forever? This will be stagnation from now right through election day.

FerdtheMoonCat on January 27, 2012 at 9:38 AM

Does anyone else miss Poptech? I do; the current crop of leftists who managed to sneak past the HEPA filter just aren’t up to the job.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

As if you’ve ever committed anything substantive to a HotAir thread. Even your fellows have universally labelled you a bomb thrower and troll. You’re shtick is tired.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:38 AM

See…making stuff and selling stuff and moving it around works!

BobMbx on January 27, 2012 at 9:39 AM

So I got a question for you right wing nuts

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

Hey SCREW LOOSE!
Maybe the hundreds and thousands of republicans that were elected to office around the country in the last year… have started to make a difference. Maybe, that’s why there are slowly pockets of growth showing.

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 9:42 AM

Agreed. Too bad that the right insists that we abandon any and all domestic energy solutions that don’t rely on fossil fuels. Thst’s a two way street.

ROFL

Produce a solar panel that is cost efficient, robust, and can still generate power on a cloudy day and you will make money, lots of money.

Then ask Ted Kennedy, well ok that would be difficult to do now, but rhetorically ask him why he quashed a plan to put wind turbines off the coast of Hyannisport.

After that, factor in the 5 million electric cars PBHO said he wanted to see on the road and then figure out where the electricity to juice them is going to come from, especially when America is told that no energy source is allowed to be utilized, not even clean nuclear.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:43 AM

Thank you Mr. President.
-crr6

What ever happened to crr6 by the way?

Meat Fighter on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 9:31 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:38 AM

Don’t get mad, little lady, things will turn around for you eventually.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:45 AM

Inventories increased $56.0 billion

WHAT???

This stuff didn’t sell during the Christmas season? This is a time bomb.

faraway on January 27, 2012 at 9:45 AM

Does anyone else miss Poptech? I do; the current crop of leftists who managed to sneak past the HEPA filter just aren’t up to the job.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM
As if you’ve ever committed anything substantive to a HotAir thread. Even your fellows have universally labelled you a bomb thrower and troll. You’re shtick is tired.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:38 AM

WRONG! Dumba$$! His shtick is fun…your’s is SH!T shtick… d!ck!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 9:49 AM

The state of the union is strong
-dear leader

cmsinaz on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

Yeah!!! Economic growth is below forecasts!!!!!

/real American patriots

cjw79 on January 27, 2012 at 9:49 AM

The good news — the annualized GDP growth rate in the fourth quarter went up a full point from Q3′s final number to 2.8%.

Apples and oranges. You need to compare the FIRST Q3 number to the FIRST Q4 number.

And, besides, how do we know the Q3 numbers are “final” yet?

This goes way beyond fudging. I’m not even sure that calling what this administration does “cooking the books” pays it justice. When you take the REAL GDP and adjust it for the REAL inflation rate, America’s economy has been flatlined for three years now. And when you look at the per-capita GDP, it’s dropping like a rock.

logis on January 27, 2012 at 9:49 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

Tax revenues should be flooding in to enable him to starting paying down the national debt, right?

BuckeyeSam on January 27, 2012 at 9:51 AM

For the average voter, GDP is meaningless data as it does not compute in their American Idol brain. Now, un/underemployment, fuel prices, groc store prices, home loan qualifying, etc– those will be the difference makers.

hillsoftx on January 27, 2012 at 9:51 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

The economy will be very strong? Based on what? The 1.7% growth in 2011? That’s terrible. That’s barely treading about recession level.

Doughboy on January 27, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Don’t get mad, little lady, things will turn around for you eventually.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:45 AM

..lib has no choice but to get mad….can’t brag about any success from President down grade.

If libordie is so dam% impressed with Obama’s dismal numbers…

Then Bush’s numbers are through the roof successful….

http://percentgdp.com/

From 2003 to 2007, the U.S. economy grew faster than all but three countries on the Economist’s list of developed countries. Two of the countries ahead of the U.S.–Australia and Sweden–are large commodity exporters and benefited from significant growth through price increases.

Another way to put U.S. growth in context is to compare it to the size of the Chinese economy. Real U.S. growth from 2000 to 2007 was +20% (+48% unadjusted for inflation). The economy of China.was about 18% of the size of the US economy in 2007, in nominal terms. This means the US added more to its economy in seven years than China had created in its entire history with four times as many people. And we are “unhappy” with this?

Of course Bush had to direct the country through the devastating effects of
9/11…..saw much more growth than President downgrade has produced up until the point that the democrats took over the purse strings in the House and Senate.

Can’t have it both ways liberal….
…..if you want to claim Obama’s growth is successful…then Bush gets major credit for the better numbers he produced.

Baxter Greene on January 27, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Obama lied and the economy died.

Rational Thought on January 27, 2012 at 9:55 AM

This stuff didn’t sell during the Christmas season? This is a time bomb.

faraway on January 27, 2012 at 9:45 AM

Have you been in a department store lately? Racks and racks of deeply discounted winter merchandise surrounded by new spring arrivals (even though it’s only January). This despite the fact that they were offering 25 – 40% off BEFORE Christmas.

Naturally Curly on January 27, 2012 at 9:55 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

..yea…
It’s “recovery summer” all over again.

Baxter Greene on January 27, 2012 at 9:56 AM

hillsoftx on January 27, 2012 at 9:51 AM

PBHO’s hidden ace is the media putting a blitz on the GOP controlled house, “In office since 2010 and they haven’t done anything!”

PBHO is already running against his own senate with their approval.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:56 AM

Um, if that is the case then why are corporations marketing and selling products at all if they are convinced that the destruction of the nation is a very real possibility.
libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:29 AM

This is so stupid it is uplifting to read.

GaltBlvnAtty on January 27, 2012 at 9:59 AM

PBHO is already running against his own senate with their approval.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 9:56 AM

Agreed Bish..and which candidate can best expose what should be a self-destructive strategy once the DO NOTHING SENATE facts are revealed of sitting on job bills, no budget, etc..TGIF, excuse to drink.

hillsoftx on January 27, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

Based on what information? As stated in the article, the GDP increase is due mainly from inventory growth, not demand. If demand does not pick up the economy is not going to pick up.

How will the economy be very strong?

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Pretty mediocre, but still a testament to the ingenuity of the American people and their ability to bear the incredible burdens that government has foisted upon them.

Ted Torgerson on January 27, 2012 at 10:03 AM

Based on what information? As stated in the article, the GDP increase is due mainly from inventory growth, not demand. If demand does not pick up the economy is not going to pick up.

How will the economy be very strong?

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:01 AM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

Are you satisfied with the economy? The unemployment rate? The level of national debt?

I’ve grown very weary of you commies jumping on any tick in the economy as proof positive that your jug-eared messiah and his filthy party have made things better in America. The fact of the matter is that too many people are jobless, too many businesses are not profitable, and we’ve squandered our childrens’ futures just so your SOB President could bail out the UAW and his campaign contributors. I really have to wonder about you leftists that you have so little concern for Americans that you prop up failed dogma instead of demanding a fiscally responsible government.

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

hillsoftx on January 27, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Agreed, any excuse to quaff the Islay is a good excuse.

But how do you get past the American Idol brain you mentioned, or the bootlicking MSM firewall?

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 10:06 AM

So I got a question for you right wing nuts

Is the economy growing or not?

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:26 AM

Ok. I see. So, if the population base is expanding say, what 3% (I don’t know the real figure) and we are growing the economy at 2.8%, In just a few years it should be PARTY TIME.

WryTrvllr on January 27, 2012 at 10:06 AM

The solution is simple: slash the corporate income tax rate to competitive levels for a solid 10 years and unleash the private sector and private investment.

Ours is around 40% (amongst the highest in the developed world). The rate in Germany is around 30%.

The effect would be almost immediate. The benefits to the poor and “middle class” would be immense.

visions on January 27, 2012 at 10:08 AM

Obama will win re-election easier. Come November the economy will be very strong..

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM

lobotomy4life will be found in moms basement, in the second week of November…hanging by his Hemorrhoids!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:08 AM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

The economy is only adding enough jobs to keep up with the population that is joining the workforce.

The unemployment rate is also dropping because so many people have been unemployed for so long that they are no longer counted by the BLS.

The percentage of people in the labor force continues to drop.

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:11 AM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

The only really good month in recent memory was December which saw 200,000 new jobs added. That’s a decent, but not great figure. And it was during the holidays. Let’s see if that holds up over the next few months.

As for the unemployment rate, use your head. The only reason it’s dropping so rapidly is that people are dropping out of the workforce and are no longer counted toward the rate. It’s been shown by several reports that if you applied the workforce from January 2009 when Obama came into office to today’s unemployment rate, the number would be around 11%. And remember, it was 7.6% when he was inaugurated. That’s inexcusable.

Doughboy on January 27, 2012 at 10:11 AM

0.8% without inventories? Oh man…

ojfltx on January 27, 2012 at 10:12 AM

Oh yes, let’s look at unemployment numbers which are on the “uptick”.

Well ok, except that the method of compiling the unemployment rate doesn’t account for the thousands of frustrated people who’ve stopped looking for work. Or those who work part time because they can’t find full-time jobs. Or those who can’t get a job and instead head off to school, apply early for Social Security benefits or travel the nation in search of work and therefore get missed by state compilers.

9% unemployment….right, sure.

Bishop on January 27, 2012 at 10:12 AM

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Stats and facts to back up your howlingly hilarious claim.

tom daschle concerned on January 27, 2012 at 10:24 AM

@libfreeordie, 9:35:

Nice fantasy land you’re living in. You can only believe the things you do because:

1) You’re a troll receiving instructions from axelrod
2) You’re an indoctrinated pro-union leftist intent upon ignoring the realities of a failed Detroit, Cleveland, USSR, and so on.
3) You’re just weird.

anyway, to your enlightened jabber:

“Agreed. Too bad that the right insists that we abandon any and all domestic energy solutions that don’t rely on fossil fuels. Thst’s a two way street.”

Please indicate any large scale non-fossil fuel energy solutions that exist outside of massive government subsidy- that is, without the current administration picking winners and losers in the economy. And the right insisting on it don’t make it so- king putt has already sunk and lost billions in “green energy” like solyndra, ener1, etc. So you are doubly mistaken.

“I don’t think I have to remind you which President proposed and instituted the bailouts which began in 2007 of the auto industry, AIG and other financial firms long before Obama came into office.”

And we all remember the junior senator from Illinois making a principled stand against said bailouts..oh, wait, never mind he voted FOR them. Now then- GM, and the complete inversion of investor law- all benefiting the unions, thanks to soetero. Chrysler, the student loan industry, healthcare. XL pipeline nixed so Buffett’s rail benefits. Gulf oil permits nixed so Soros’s petrobras stock bumps. Legislation to induce natural gas truck conversion so soros’s natural gas holdings benefit.

“Sort of hard to make money if your customers are hacking up a lung because of polluted particulates in the air or are paying for cancer treatments from contaminated water”

Right, Carbon Dioxide is a “polluted particulate”. You might want to inform everyy plant living on Earth of this “fact”. And please do explain how and why obama’s epa classified milk as oil.


“You watched the 2008 housing bubble burst and you believe that corproate America is going to self regulate its output to prevent harming American life expectancy?”

Yes, a housing bubble brought into existence by the unintended consequences of the community reinvestment act- brought to us all by carter (2nd worst president ever), expanded by Clinton (impeached rapist), and championed by Soetero (worst president ever). Also involved- Frank (d- male hooker town) and Dodd (d, republic of free mortgages) who blocked any attempts by Republicans to actually introduce regulations preventing said meltdown.

“Specific examples please? For manufacturing jobs specifically, not for oil production.”

First, why do you attempt to exclude oil production from this argument? That’s a bogus frame, and soetero’s war on oil production is causing a massive drag on our economy in ways too many to mention. Also- barry the clown recently banned all uranium mining in the state of Arizona for 20 years. Next?

You’re bad at this.

GrassMudHorsey on January 27, 2012 at 10:25 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Drooling again!
Bib is getting saturated!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:26 AM

Agreed. Too bad that the right insists that we abandon any and all domestic energy solutions that don’t rely on fossil fuels. Thst’s a two way street.

Do you use real green power to torture the electrons used to post your comments. How about a link to the pictures of the solar panels and wind generator that run your house. Otherwise stow it on the green power.

I don’t think I have to remind you which President proposed and instituted the bailouts which began in 2007 of the auto industry, AIG and other financial firms long before Obama came into office. What on earth makes you think electing Mitt Romney who is the only candidate more Wall Street friendly than Obama in this race, would allow for “too big” institutions to actually fail. You’re deluding yourself.

And we took Bush to task for that also.

Sort of hard to make money if your customers are hacking up a lung because of polluted particulates in the air or are paying for cancer treatments from contaminated water. You watched the 2008 housing bubble burst and you believe that corproate America is going to self regulate its output to prevent harming American life expectancy? And they call liberals naive.

The housing bubble wasn’t caused by corporate America it was caused by Government Regulation that pushed the wrong ideas.
No one is saying get rid of every regulation. There comes a point in which the marginal gains from a regulation are far out stripped by the costs.

chemman on January 27, 2012 at 10:27 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

This is simply nonsense. The economy was going through a severe contraction when Obama was elected, but the recession would have ended with or without the stimulus, as all recessions do. Socialists take a part of how a capitalist economy works (a cyclical downturn) and try to make it into a systemic flaw that requires government intervention; i.e.: “Don’t let a good crisis go waste.” Regardless, the purpose of the stimulus among Democrats was not to improve the economy, it was to engorge the government, pay off its core constituencies and accelerate the looming fiscal crisis that would justify enormous increases in taxes on the wealthy and redistribution of the national income. In that respect it has been a huge success.

Ted Torgerson on January 27, 2012 at 10:31 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

And if Hannibal had won we would have world peace too. The only thing we know is that we have had the worst recovery since the depression. Stating that if we hadn’t intervened the economy would have fallen off a cliff is a belief not a fact.

chemman on January 27, 2012 at 10:31 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

You said it yourself though, Bush implemented the bailouts not Obama. So what steps did Obama take? The American Recovery and Reinvestment act? The 740.6 billion dollar bill that we had to have to keep unemployment down?

You know what he should have just done? Give each person the $2468.67 that the bill required. So instead of watching the government blow the money, a family of 4 would have almost $10,000.

dernst2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:32 AM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

LOL! You really believe this crap you post, don’t you?

But you didn’t answer my questions. Are you happy with the economy? The unemployment rate? The amount of debt being foisted on our children by the filthy Dems?

That you would come back essentially blaming GWB for you jug-eared messiah’s failures tells me that you don’t want to admit that your guy has failed and this nation is not where it should be. Nobody is better off now than they were when Obama took office. Millions no longer have jobs thanks to Obama. The national debt is unacceptably high. And Obama is driving businesses overseas. Responsible Americans will evict Obama from the White House and install a real American in his place. I despise the fact that idiots like you want to keep us down this very bad road to ruin.

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 10:36 AM

The local rag had an AP piece this morning about the real estate market. All last year AP was touting how the market was growing and recovering. Today’s article called it ‘the worst year’ for real estate.

Gotta admit, AP keeps trying to talk up Obama’s economy, just like they tried talking down GWB’s beginning around 2003.

HINT TO AP: The economy doesn’t work that way.

GarandFan on January 27, 2012 at 10:41 AM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

C R A C Khead at keyboard!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 10:41 AM

The only figure I could find was 1% population growth in 2010 (USA, annualized). Comparing that to the .8% GDP minus inventories and I’d say WOW. Obama is the MAN…./s

WryTrvllr on January 27, 2012 at 10:43 AM

So far, the market is liking these numbers as much as KeninCT….

WryTrvllr on January 27, 2012 at 10:48 AM

10 trillion in debt by Obama is growing the economy in a libs mind.

wheelgun on January 27, 2012 at 10:52 AM

Specific examples please? For manufacturing jobs specifically, not for oil production.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

I love it when Obama supporters and Barack Obama himself reveal their basic ignorance.

To them, all they know about oil is that it comes out of the ground and they put it in their cars. They don’t think there’s any use for oil other than as transportation fuels.

They are completely unaware of just how much oil is used to manufacture products, from the grease used to lubricate machines to the core hydrocarbons that are the building blocks for plastics and virtually every other synthetic material made.

How is a solar panel going to make industrial grease? How is a wind turbine going to produce cracked hydrocarbons that you can turn into nylon?

And then this gets really funny:

Sort of hard to make money if your customers are hacking up a lung because of polluted particulates in the air or are paying for cancer treatments from contaminated water.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

Guess what the biggest sources of particulates are?

Ship engines and diesel train engines.

Thus, to limit their use, one would suggest that one looks for alternative ways to transport fossil fuels, i.e. pipelines that can use electric motors, and also ways to minimize the distance that such fuels need to be carried, i.e. local production.

But the Obama Party blocks pipelines and demands that oil be imported via particulate-spewing supertankers halfway around the world.

And then Barack Obama leaves clean-energy summits in a 22-car motorcade.

What’s the matter, libbie? You talk a good game, but your Barack Obama’s actions show that you’re just lying. If your Barack Obama cared about reducing carbon footprints, he would tell his liar Michelle to wait a few hours instead of taking a separate jet. But he’s a pathetic liar and a hypocrite, just like you are.

northdallasthirty on January 27, 2012 at 10:54 AM

Happy Nomad on January 27, 2012 at 10:36 AM

Explain to me what Romney would have done differently since he also supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:57 AM

Epic fail does not even begin to describe a 1.7% GDP number for the entire year 2011. How will Obama spin this to make it look like Bushes fault. He’s starting to make Jimmy Carter look real good about now.

MJZZZ on January 27, 2012 at 11:00 AM

Explain to me what Romney would have done differently since he also supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:57 AM

When you come in and drop deuces in a comment thread, you don’t get to ask the questions.

Nothing you have claimed has any founding in reality. You are a glittering jewel of colossal ignorance.

tom daschle concerned on January 27, 2012 at 11:08 AM

Reading your stuff is like drinking concrete.

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Suppose you see a man staggering out of the desert. As he approaches, he looks and acts like any other man desperate for water. You look at him as he stumbles and say, “Well, he is fine he is still on his feet and it looks like he can almost run”.

Corporations are leaving because of regulations, that’s bad. Corps can’t start here because of regulations, bad. Millions of useful men can’t get jobs because of lack of Corps, bad. Corporations can’t even move their operations somewhere else within the USA to be free, Bad. We can’t drill, nuke, dam or mine our own energy, bad. We can’t buy land with even a wet spot on it and enjoy it, bad. A service economy is automatically more unstable than manufacturing because it has no real value of inventory and people can choose to go without. We are living on the producers of 70-20 years ago that are becoming mature technologies, (Boeing or Microsoft) at the same time killing or driving out new startups.

Bad

God you are Stupid….

Bulletchaser on January 27, 2012 at 11:14 AM

Yep. Ex-inventory, GDP only grew at .8%. This is really really bad news for the U.S.

You said it.

Do not focus on the Q4 number!

GDP for the year declined from 3% in 2010 to 1.7% in 2011

singlemalt 18 on January 27, 2012 at 9:29 AM

Yes, we must bring this out.

Zero, his policies and his clown posse are all responsible for this. Many CEOs including democrats saying they absolutely refuse to expand, invest or hire until after the Emperor is out of office.

Corporate CFOs see through the propganda and advise their management team to hunker down or move to a more hospitable environment.

We now have over thirty million unemployed thanks to the Emperor, but foodstamps for all!

http://news.investors.com/Article/598993/201201260805/entitlements-soar-under-president-obama.htm

dogsoldier on January 27, 2012 at 11:19 AM

Just wait until Teh Krugman weighs in and says this is all because of the “austerity” imposed by the Reichwing Tea Partires.

rockmom on January 27, 2012 at 11:21 AM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Actually all thats going down you idjit is the fake number they report. Or haven’t you gotten the memo on that?

Zero has his team arbitrarily reducing the size of the US labor pool among other things to manipulate the values reported by the BLS.

In like actual reality-reality, the US labor pool grows by over 150,000 people a month. The fact that people cant find work doesnt mean they are not part of the labor pool, as several of my family members will tell you.

dogsoldier on January 27, 2012 at 11:23 AM

The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

Some of you made sense of that first sentense?
Ok! Yeah me too!
“I was reading the oil drill,and it fell over into the sky, landing in the grocery store, at the runway by the cloud for the manufacturing plant, and everybody heard what happened!”
Ok!… I’m with you now lobotomy!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 11:24 AM

sentense?

Oh gawd! It’s rubbing off!

KOOLAID2 on January 27, 2012 at 11:27 AM

5. Limit the ability to obtain the natural resources required to create manufacturing and skilled labor based jobs

From LIBFREEORDIE

Specific examples please? For manufacturing jobs specifically, not for oil production.

Have you looked into Gibson Guitars lately. I cannot imagine a more blatant attempt to reduce American manufacturing than to have admin thugs confiscate a company’s raw materials.

LarryinLA on January 27, 2012 at 11:31 AM

People are hammering Zero in the comments over at the article Drudge linked on the front page:

2011 GDP: 1.7%

http://www.businessinsider.com/2011-gdp-2012-1

dogsoldier on January 27, 2012 at 11:33 AM

LarryinLA on January 27, 2012 at 11:31 AM

But not their competitor who uses the same materials, BUT DOES CONTRIBUTE TO ZERO’s campaign.

dogsoldier on January 27, 2012 at 11:35 AM

Sort of hard to make money if your customers are hacking up a lung because of polluted particulates in the air or are paying for cancer treatments from contaminated water.

libfreeordie on January 27, 2012 at 9:35 AM

That’s why cancer death rates continue to drop.
At least until 2014 when Obozo care really kicks in. Then you will learn a true lesson in economics. Diminishing returns. Pay attention now.

Also, by an objective measure air and water quality have continued to improve over at least the last 15 years.

Try looking up “Global Dimming”, a huge concern, from yesteryear.

WryTrvllr on January 27, 2012 at 12:36 PM

The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Only if you look at the numbers, and don’t dig into WHY those numbers are occurring. Fact is, the number which ISN’T widely reported is the workforce participation rate. If you factor in the drop in participation, its pretty evident that the reason unemployment is dropping is because people are starting to roll off the 2 year unemployment and have given up looking for a job. Those people aren’t counted in the unemployment numbers.

My concern is that the participation rate is the worst its been in at least 5 decades… which means even if it does start to recover, it will take YEARS to get back to “normal”. This in turn leads to other problems, such as unemployment (not shown in the government figures, but is reflected in the participation rate) among teens is the highest I’ve heard of in modern times… which means that we have a whole generation of workers who have never cut their teeth on entry level jobs and will be clueless when they finally land a real one.

dominigan on January 27, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Obama was given lemons and he made lemonade out of it. The economy would have fallen off a cliff he did not take the bold states to save it. Even Mitt Romney supported the bailouts

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:20 AM

No proof to this whatsoever. None.

We are still in the weakest post-WW2 recovery ever by a long shot.

Chuck Schick on January 27, 2012 at 2:04 PM

And we’re suppose to believe the numbers coming out of this regime because? Why? Is there any proof that past numbers have held up or have they been consistently revised downwards after all the media hype has played out and moved on to more important topics like oh, Barney’s wedding dress?

chickasaw42 on January 27, 2012 at 2:48 PM

I’d expect this number to fall to 2.2% or 2.3% by the time of the final revision in March.

You are optimistic. After the media have touted the “large scale” growth for a month or two, it will be revised down to 2.0% or less. It is the continuing game that they play with the media in order to make things look better for Obama.

Theophile on January 27, 2012 at 2:54 PM

dominigan on January 27, 2012 at 12:55 PM

I mentioned that earlier in teh thread, but what needs to get said often and with emphasis is this: THE NUMBERS ARE FAKE.

You cannot arbitrarily remove people who havent found work from the actual workforce. Cute accounting gimmicks dont resolve real issues or make them disappear.

We have over thirty million people out of work because of the Emperor Zero.

dogsoldier on January 27, 2012 at 3:47 PM

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs although not as much as I would have liked. The unemployment rate keeps dropping which is also a good thing.

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

Do you really think anyone unemployed or underemployed through no fault of their own gives a rat’s patootie what you would have liked? How much of the President-imposed misery in our country is too much, o bootlicker?

It is headed in the right direction. The economy has been adding jobs

which is the real goal here, right? Team Barry took over a flailing economy–blame Bush or Pelosi, for this post I don’t care–and promptly let all the air out of the tires so the economic growth would be inevitable, slow and gradual right up through the 2012 elections. But the brilliant manipulators of misery didn’t count on the fact that all that air (in the form of capital) cannot re-create itself, especially in a hostile environment; it goes elsewhere.

So, yes, we can blame Team Barry for our current misery, and for our sustained misery as well.

And let’s just take a moment to remember what this President of the Jackass Club considers to be a successful economy:

At his 2004 keynote address to the DNC, a young state-Sen. Obama wowed millions with his “We Are Not Red States and Blue States” speech, but the most outlandish phrase he used was “the failed economic policies of George W Bush.” When he repeated this ridiculous phrase several times–at a time of 96% employment, booming stock markets and highest personal incomes ever–with complete and utter conviction, the DNC Party fathers and Mother Hillary became visibly consternated at his claims.

An economic analyst later explained Obama’s reasoning, that while 96% of Americans were doing great, the 2-8% at the economic bottom were not keeping up with the boom times the rest of the country was enjoying. And he represented those folks.

So to Obama, a successful economy is one where the bottom 2-8% of Americans are keeping up with the most successful Americans.

I ask you: has he achieved it?

Under Obama, total household wealth has dropped over 15K per household. But on a percentage basis, black families’ wealth has dropped incredibly more than their white counterparts.

http://consumerist.com/2011/07/economists-recession-hit-black-households-especially-hard.html

If you truly believe we are headed in the right direction, are you prepared to forgive the misery he has perpetuated for the last 3 years to both black and white? The fact that he was willing to downgrade the economy for everyone to provide equal misery for the poorest? The fact that we must now compromise our ability to defend ourselves and our friends around the world in order to pay for all the boneheaded jackassery of these incompetents who were all so smugly naive?

Forgive me for calling you a bootlicker earlier; I might have elevated you higher than you deserve.

rwenger43 on January 27, 2012 at 4:05 PM

liberal4life on January 27, 2012 at 10:04 AM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43645168/ns/business-eye_on_the_economy/

Don’t read this with an eye to who is responsible for the recession of 2008-2009 because we will always disagree; instead, read it for how good things were in 2004 when Obama first started talking about what a failure the Bush economy was.

We all could wish for failure like GW’s.

Obama’s successes will never equal Bush’s failure.

rwenger43 on January 27, 2012 at 4:14 PM

Disappointing, primarily because expectations were set too high. Still, it is better than 3Q11 (even though it will likely be revised down over the coming months). The slow steady climb out continues as the private sector de-leverages … Job report next Friday will be very interesting as well … Markets handled it well, retrenching a bit before the final assault on 13k … all in all, disappointing – but in context not too bad …

TouchdownBuddha on January 27, 2012 at 9:31 PM