Open thread: The “I can’t believe they’re having another debate” debate

posted at 8:34 pm on January 16, 2012 by Allahpundit

9 p.m. ET on Fox News. If you’ve been reading the site today, you already know what to expect. Santorum will attack Romney for being an Obama clone, Gingrich will attack both of them for being unelectable, and Romney, I suppose, will attack Newt for his Bain criticism — all of which will be punctuated by grumbling about how unfair the other guy’s Super PAC is. Then Ron Paul will say something about the Fed and Perry will say something self-deprecating, and we’ll rinse and repeat. For two hours.

Philip Klein dares to think a terrible, terrible thought. I’m entitling this blockquote, “What if the tea party never existed?”

Is there anything stopping [Romney] from sweeping all 50 states?

Think about it. Romney has a commanding lead in Florida, and will simply obliterate the field if he enters the Sunshine State after having won South Carolina. And if he does win South Carolina and Florida, what will become of the rest of the field? Rick Perry, who came in fifth in Iowa and bailed on New Hamphshire, already has very little justification for continuing. A distant finish in South Carolina would give him even less reason. It’s true that there are states in which Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich can theoretically beat Romney, but if they can’t beat him in South Carolina, where will they go from there? Even now, Romney has a 23-point lead nationally, according to Gallup.

Sure, perhaps Rep. Ron Paul’s fervent supporters can out-hustle Romney’s organization in a caucus here or there. But it’s also possible that Romney will run the table. Remember, as the field gets narrowed, it’ll get a lot harder for Paul to outright win a state, because he’ll have to start getting into the 40-50-plus point range.

Skim this LA Times piece for a reminder of what makes Klein’s scenario plausible. It’s not just that Romney’s national organization is so solid; it’s that, apart from Ron Paul, he’s the only candidate who even has a national organization. And since I’m beating a dead horse by making that point again, let me beat another one by reminding you that even a Romney loss in South Carolina is unlikely to put Florida in play. PPP’s new poll tonight shows Mitt leading Gingrich there 41/26, and by an even wider margin among voters who say they’ve made up their minds. His favorables are 68/24 generally — better than in Iowa, New Hampshire, or South Carolina — and 70/18 on the narrower issue of his business record. So much for the Bain attacks. In fact, I’m curious to see whether Gingrich brings up Bain tonight or whether Romney himself does. That’ll be the best evidence yet of what the campaigns’ internal polling shows on this issue. Do note that Newt conspicuously passed on a golden opportunity to hit Romney on it yesterday.

Here’s the Hot Air/Townhall livetweet widget. Fox is going to solicit Twitter feedback tonight during the debate to track whether viewers think a candidate is answering a question or dodging it, so there’s one way to kinda sorta amuse yourself as debate fatigue sets in circa 9:05. Exit question: Is it racist to give money to someone in need? It is on MSNBC, apparently.



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ExpressoBold on January 17, 2012 at 12:37 AM

Racoons are bad medicine for any dog that isn’t bred and trained to deal with them. (And already inoculated against rabies, as all dogs should be.) If they are cornered, they will fight anything, and they are mean, tough animals.

novaculus on January 17, 2012 at 12:44 AM

It’s curious how Romney fans like Igor try to demonize anybody who criticizes Romney. It’s a primary, for god’s sake. It’s supposed to be a coronation of your preferred candidate.

I don’t think anybody hates Romney, they just don’t want him to be the nominee. That’s a distinction with a difference.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:45 AM

So, when he uses his position to tank an entire country’s currency, that is a moral good that cannot be challenged as immoral by anyone? When he uses his position to crush peoples investments so he can make money on the shorts, that is a moral good and cannot be challenged as immoral by anyone? Doing these activities, and because he does them far better than Romney did, if he just was similar to Romney in ideology you would support him over Romney in the primary? Because those kinds of activities have no bearing on who the person is and how they will lead the nation?

astonerii on January 17, 2012 at 12:29 AM

I completely support his british pound short. Some of his latest activities relied on his connections to the government, and those I don’t support. His financial support of various causes has always been indefensible. I wouldn’t pick the best investor/businessman as the best candidate based on those characteristics alone. There is nothing shameful in shorting stocks or currencies as long as you don’t apply hidden methods to speed up their demise.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Romney Fans to Republican voters:

You don’t want Mitt to be the nominee = You want Mitt To Get Cancer and Die

It’s that black and white for the ROmney SuperFans.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:48 AM

Right now he’s winning b/c of a divided conservative vote. You do understand that, right?

That isn’t really true. Many of the people voting for the other candidates list Romney as their 2nd choice. Don’t assume a Gingrich supporter would automatically go to Santorum or the other way around. Mitt is the nominee and the next president. That is a good thing.

echosyst on January 17, 2012 at 12:49 AM

Thanks for the link. What kind of superpac is this? Who organized it and comprises its membership and driving forces? That would be important to know regarding “birther” issues.
.
I’m sure that there are those who would like for the issue not to be murky and inconsistent but really, the “natural born citizen” issue is interpretive dance, especially when one considers McCain’s birth in the Canal Zone to American parents and “anchor babies” born to legal and illegal residents of the US.
.
Speeches on the House or Senate floor, BTW, are not law. They are barely even guidance since, frequently, an opposing view can be cited from the same debate. I think the last unanimous vote in the Senate was to reject Ø’s last presented budget. Something more recent happened in the House, can’t remember what it was.

ExpressoBold on January 17, 2012 at 12:30 AM

I really don’t know anything about it, it was a reference from some article I had read.

I can’t disagree with anything you have stated.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:49 AM

canopfor on January 17, 2012 at 12:28 AM
Thank you, sir.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 12:30 AM

Cindy Munford:Anytime:)

canopfor on January 17, 2012 at 12:49 AM

This ongoing blog debate is pretty much purely academic now, no? We all know who the nominee will be.

andy85719 on January 16, 2012 at 11:58 PM

Well, we know it will one that is running for President on the Republican ticket; that we know. But what is important to consider, is that the objective? The objective is to elect the best R Candidate that can win against B.O. We overlook that objective many times.

Winning the Republican Nomination alone doesn’t guarantee the General Election win. One of the many reasons that it is said that Romney should be the R Nominee is that he is the best one to beat B.O.

Sorry, I’m not convinced at all.

bluefox on January 17, 2012 at 12:49 AM

No, the point is conservatives could “live” with Romney if could win a majority of Republican voters in a 2-man race.

Right now he’s winning b/c of a divided conservative vote. You do understand that, right?

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:33 AM

I do understand it, it’s just a “funny” way to pick who one supports. Not THAT funny, but still.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:50 AM

That isn’t really true. Many of the people voting for the other candidates list Romney as their 2nd choice. Don’t assume a Gingrich supporter would automatically go to Santorum or the other way around. Mitt is the nominee and the next president. That is a good thing.

echosyst on January 17, 2012 at 12:49 AM

Ok, that’s fine, why not have a primary run-off and we’ll test your theory against mine? To me, it’s better to have a nominee that a majority of Republican voters have casted a vote for, rather than won that wins a plurality in a crowded field.

THe idea is to nominate the canadidate most Republicans want. A primary run-off does that.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:52 AM

I’m warming up to a Romney/Perry ticket.

We do need Newt in the national discussion somewhere to blow up the leftist media memes and explain policy to the folks in a way they can understand.

Never had that much problem with Romney, but I hate that it seems like he’s being forced on us.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 12:52 AM

I do understand it, it’s just a “funny” way to pick who one supports. Not THAT funny, but still.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:50 AM

I’m missign your point here, but you seem a little weird and I’m not going to pursue it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:53 AM

I can’t see ROmney selecting Perry. Perry gets under his skin more than anybody else in the race.

I wouldn’t doubt if Jeb Bush is the VP selection.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:55 AM

I’m missign your point here, but you seem a little weird and I’m not going to pursue it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:53 AM

Well, you seem A LOT weird, so congratulation on winning the contest!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:55 AM

Well, you seem A LOT weird, so congratulation on winning the contest!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:55 AM

Alrighty then. Go back to brownnosing Romney and calling his criticis “haters”. Love that insight. Keep serving it up.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:57 AM

How is suggesting we have a primary run-off weird? I don’t get Romney fans at all.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:58 AM

ExpressoBold on January 17, 2012 at 12:37 AM

Racoons are bad medicine for any dog that isn’t bred and trained to deal with them. (And already inoculated against rabies, as all dogs should be.) If they are cornered, they will fight anything, and they are mean, tough animals.
novaculus on January 17, 2012 at 12:44 AM

Right on.

Enraged racoons can be likened to a miniature enraged grizzly bear, or perhaps wolverine.

listens2glenn on January 17, 2012 at 12:58 AM

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:55 AM

I was thinking about Reagan/Bush when I wrote that.
Politics sometimes makes strange Bedfellows.

Not likely, I know, but could be good unity ticket.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 12:59 AM

Believing Joseph Smith was a prophet of God is weird.

Beliving we should have a primary run-off, not so much.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:59 AM

Alrighty then. Go back to brownnosing Romney and calling his criticis “haters”. Love that insight. Keep serving it up.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 12:57 AM

Since I have never used the word “hater” in my entire life (well now I have, but I mean up to now) I must attribute your knowledge to the voices in your head.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:00 AM

was thinking about Reagan/Bush when I wrote that.
Politics sometimes makes strange Bedfellows.

Not likely, I know, but could be good unity ticket.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 12:59 AM

Eh, Jeb’s too moderate for me but he probably locks up FLorida for Romney against Obama. He really needs to put more of a conservative ideologue as his VP but I don’t see that happening.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:00 AM

I don’t think Mitt is any kind of movement conservative but the hatred that many “conservatives” display towards him and their preference of Gingrich is strange in the face of Gingrich’s anti-capitalist rhetoric.

Igor R. on January 16, 2012 at 11:50 PM

You accused conservatives of hating Romney. No voices in my head. I don’t take people out of context.

What was capitalist about RomneyCare? Do explain the free market mechanisms of RomneyCare since you are teaching class on capitalism tonight.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:04 AM

Jeb probably a good choice, but I fear the country might still have Bush fatigue.

When this I will support the nominee, whoever it is, for no other reason than to keep Obama from swinging the balance of the Supreme Court to the left.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:06 AM

Right on.

Enraged racoons can be likened to a miniature enraged grizzly bear, or perhaps wolverine.

listens2glenn on January 17, 2012 at 12:58 AM

And they wear masks too….furry little criminals.

Tim_CA on January 17, 2012 at 1:06 AM

When this is over

need sleepy

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:07 AM

You accused conservatives of hating Romney. No voices in my head. I don’t take people out of context.

What was capitalist about RomneyCare? Do explain the free market mechanisms of RomneyCare since you are teaching class on capitalism tonight.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:04 AM

I don’t like the word “hater” because it has a particular liberal connotation, that’s something they call someone who criticizes a liberal.

There is nothing capitalist about RomneyCare. I don’t even like Romney, I just think Gingrich is worse.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:07 AM

Ronney picked a lot of liberal Democrat judges in Mass over qualified Republican judges.

I don’t know why anybody would trust him on judges. Yeah I know, Bork his advisor. He’s always got cover from somebody on something.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:08 AM

don’t like the word “hater” because it has a particular liberal connotation, that’s something they call someone who criticizes a liberal.

There is nothing capitalist about RomneyCare. I don’t even like Romney, I just think Gingrich is worse.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:07 AM

Gingrich does have a record of conservative accomplishments, welfare reform, balanced budgets, defeat of HillaryCare.

Romney has none.

You said conservatives hate Romney. Isn’t that the same as calling them haters?

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:10 AM

All those activities, as well as slave trading were perfectly legal at the time. As for ethics, yours and mine differ. Like I will drive 5 miles to return a quarter if I find that a cashier gave me too much change. If a cashier misses an item and puts it in my bag I tell them immediately. it is not all about my bottom line, but giving value for value in my business dealings. You must think there is only one moral, increasing your wealth is the only moral. I disagree. I believe in working for your wealth.

astonerii on January 17, 2012 at 12:14 AM

If everyone was that honest, our Country would not be in the condition it’s in.

Any law that is passed that is not moral, is immoral. A Congress that passes a law that is immoral are themselves immoral.

If a Capitalist uses a law that he knows is immoral, is he himself immoral? Or does he try to justify himself by saying, well it’s legal?

bluefox on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

What was capitalist about RomneyCare? Do explain the free market mechanisms of RomneyCare since you are teaching class on capitalism tonight.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:04 AM

With his idea of capitalism, we would still have slavery in the south, as slavery was an aspect of capitalism of the time, and thus unassailable. As such, slavery must have been 100% perfectly moral as well, as being a part of capitalism of the time.

astonerii on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

I’m saying I’ll vote for Romney in the general, although he may appoint more liberal/moderate judges.

But protest votes/third parties/staying at home will help Obama who will appoint leftist activist judges.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

I’m kind of hoping it turns out Romney did some unethical stuff with Bain so all the Romney fans up on their high horse about Newt’s Bain ads and his attacks on “free enterprise” have to eat crow.

I feel a little sick when people are making the ROmneyCare guy out as some kind of F.A Hayek free markets guy. That doesn’t jive with ROmneyCare.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:15 AM

But protest votes/third parties/staying at home will help Obama who will appoint leftist activist judges.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

Well, big picture wise, a Romney lost may send a message to the GOP. I don’t think it’s asking too much for a consistent conservative Republican candidate who doesn’t have to spend a lot of time defending all his flip flops on every issue except the one that hurts him the most and takes Obamacare off the table.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:17 AM

If everyone was that honest, our Country would not be in the condition it’s in.

Any law that is passed that is not moral, is immoral. A Congress that passes a law that is immoral are themselves immoral.

If a Capitalist uses a law that he knows is immoral, is he himself immoral? Or does he try to justify himself by saying, well it’s legal?

bluefox on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

Well, the reason to return the money to any cashier is that I have seen how cashiers are treated if their till has too much money or not enough money in it. I have never been a cashier myself, but I have relatives that were.

astonerii on January 17, 2012 at 1:17 AM

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:15 AM

One could hope.

But what really got me was the establishment telling conservatives to once again compromise their values so the electable Romney could win, but got all self righteous when conservatives compromised their values to go after Romney on Bain.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:18 AM

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:15 AM

One could hope.

But what really got me was the establishment telling conservatives to once again compromise their values so the electable Romney could win, but got all self righteous when conservatives compromised their values to go after Romney on Bain.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:18 AM

Gingrich’s Bain ads are nothing compared to what Obama is giong to do. To me, he’s doing Romney a service for what’s to come if he’s the nominee. This is an issue Romney’s going to have to talk about in a way that is easy to understand for people who are not in the business world.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:20 AM

Gingrich does have a record of conservative accomplishments, welfare reform, balanced budgets, defeat of HillaryCare.

Romney has none.

You said conservatives hate Romney. Isn’t that the same as calling them haters?

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:10 AM

Gingrich has a lot of accomplishments, but he is imperious and given to wild ideas that he then declares to be “the truth”. I worry about him being the President and running with one of his new great ideas. Romney was a successful businessman and not in the Freddie Mac historian sense. It’s just a gut feel, but I expect him to not go completely crazy as President as I would expect Gingrich to do.

And by analogy, saying that someone “f*cked his girlfriend” is not the same as calling them a “f*cker”. Both may be highly inappropriate, but the meaning is different. And it was meant to apply only to those who don’t seem to criticize Newt’s anti-capitalist rhetoric.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:22 AM

I thought Romney’s defense of his Bain experience by comparing it to what Obama did by taking over GM was far more egregious than the Bain capital ads by Gingrich.

It seems like Rush Limbaugh was about the only one to even talk about that aspect of it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:23 AM

After all the ups and downs of this primary i have finally found the candidate I am going to throw my support behind. I am a strong conservative and do not like Mitt Romney, actually I don’t know how any true conservative can even think about voting for him…unless its against Obama of course. I am in the anybody but mitt category. As of this point I have liked every candidate (excluding Huntsman) and then not liked them (like most of you probably have). I was getting the feeling that this country will never get fixed and there was no true conservative option. I never even looked at Ron Paul because I thought his foreign policy was completely out of whack, and to be blunt…I thought he was a bit of a nut. But when I became completely disgusted and had nowhere else to go, I began to look at him. And I am extremely glad I did. The best thing about him is that you know what you are getting with him. He doesn’t bulls**t you, He shoots straight! He will not change his beliefs like the wind. You cannot say that about ANY of the other candidates. He is extremely conservative and follows every word of the constitution. I mean, if this isn’t what we’ve been looking for I don’t know what is. I still don’t agree completely with his foreign policy but he does have some valid points about blowback, nation building and spreading out military too thin. I believe his foreign policy is more misunderstood than it is dangerous…that of course is his fault for not clarifying…Anyway, that being said…I consider myself part of the tea party, I am extremely conservative, I am a military veteran and after a lot of thought i believe Ron Paul is the only person who can fix this country’s fiscal mess. All the others will just delay the inevitable. It’s crazy that what I’ve been looking for has been right there the whole time….I just had to open my eyes…and my mind! If you have not given him a good look, do it. If you don’t like him, you lose nothing. I never thought I’d say this before but…I’m voting for Ron Paul!

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:25 AM

Igor,

Saying somebody hates Romney is the same as calling them a ROmney hater. You can’t split that hair.

It’s not a big deal, either way.

I think if Gingrich wins the election as the “conservative” alternative to Romney, he’s going to stay true to us. The fact that he has a big ego is a good thing in that he will want to reward his voters for recognizing his greatness. :)

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:26 AM

I was uncomfortable with how Newt/Perry went after Romney on Bain.
They should have framed it more in terms of how the Democrats will handle the Bain issue rather than a direct attack.

Having said that, they did expose Romney’s major liability in the general: that he’ll be framed as a rich white guy who laid off folks to enrich himself. It’s BS, I know, but they will get away with it, becuase the ‘optics’ are bad and the media is biased.

Bain will be the new Haliburton when this is done.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:31 AM

gor,

Saying somebody hates Romney is the same as calling them a ROmney hater. You can’t split that hair.

It’s not a big deal, either way.

I think if Gingrich wins the election as the “conservative” alternative to Romney, he’s going to stay true to us. The fact that he has a big ego is a good thing in that he will want to reward his voters for recognizing his greatness. :)

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:26 AM

I’ve explained the reasons why I don’t like that word, and after that it became splitting hair. There is no purpose to this argument other than to prove or disprove some clearly unimportant point of whether I have used the word “hater” before.

I disagree on Gingrich, but like all opinions about complicated future developments, this can’t really be proven or disproven. That’s why we have elections.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:32 AM

I am a military veteran and after a lot of thought i believe Ron Paul is the only person who can fix this country’s fiscal mess. All the others will just delay the inevitable. It’s crazy that what I’ve been looking for has been right there the whole time….I just had to open my eyes…and my mind! If you have not given him a good look, do it. If you don’t like him, you lose nothing. I never thought I’d say this before but…I’m voting for Ron Paul!

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:25 AM

I got a feeling you been on the Ron paul bandwagon since the very beginning. Your little story seems too contrived.

Since you have your eyes open now, you may want to take a peek at Ron Paul’s newsletters with racist and other controversial statements in there, and tell us how that helps beat a black man in Obama.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:33 AM

I’ve explained the reasons why I don’t like that word, and after that it became splitting hair. There is no purpose to this argument other than to prove or disprove some clearly unimportant point of whether I have used the word “hater” before.

I disagree on Gingrich, but like all opinions about complicated future developments, this can’t really be proven or disproven. That’s why we have elections.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:32 AM

Ok, I accept your point of view.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:34 AM

Bain will be the new Haliburton when this is done.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:31 AM

The message will be blunted over time. People will be bored with this line of attack by the time of the general election as there is little to sex it up. I expect this to be a more generic contest and think Obama is going to speak the name of the one whose name has barely been uttered in all these debates… Bush.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 1:35 AM

Put Ron Paul in charge of the Fed or Treasury or something, but keep him away from our foreign policy please.

Everlasting_Knowitall on January 17, 2012 at 1:36 AM

I expect this to be a more generic contest and think Obama is going to speak the name of the one whose name has barely been uttered in all these debates… Bush.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 1:35 AM

You think Obama going to run against Bush again? The Bush years seem like the Golden Age compared to the Obama years. Who the hell wouldn’t take Bush back over Obama outside of Obama’s committed but grim supporters?

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:37 AM

Ok, I accept your point of view.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:34 AM

Excellent! And I accept that dom here has expressed admiration for the illustrious Dr. Paul once or twice before.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:37 AM

I think people will take Bush’s 5.5% unemployment over Obama’s 9% plus unemployment. He can’t blame Bush for that or all the debt and spending he’s racked up on his own. Or Obamacare.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:38 AM

I got a feeling you been on the Ron paul bandwagon since the very beginning. Your little story seems too contrived.

Since you have your eyes open now, you may want to take a peek at Ron Paul’s newsletters with racist and other controversial statements in there, and tell us how that helps beat a black man in Obama.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:33 AM

I am a Sarah Palin supporter but she did not enter the race which left me searching…I started with Cain, then Newt, then Santorum… I have settled on Paul….This is the difference….you can “think” if Gingrich wins the election as the “conservative” alternative to Romney, he’s going to stay true to us…but I “know” if Paul wins he WILL stay true to us….Is this something you want to gamble on…I’ll go with the money bet…about the newsletters…he said he didn’t write them…he didn’t write them. I have no reason not to believe him…he shoots straight

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:39 AM

am a Sarah Palin supporter but she did not enter the race which left me searching…I started with Cain, then Newt, then Santorum… I have settled on Paul….This is the difference….you can “think” if Gingrich wins the election as the “conservative” alternative to Romney, he’s going to stay true to us…but I “know” if Paul wins he WILL stay true to us….Is this something you want to gamble on…I’ll go with the money bet…about the newsletters…he said he didn’t write them…he didn’t write them. I have no reason not to believe him…he shoots straight

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:39 AM

I don’t believe he never read his own newsletters that went out under his name. That doesn’t jive with his personality at all. Anyhbody who believes his lies on that is gullible as hell.

He’s a liberterian…he needs to run under that banner. He’s a distraction in Republican primaries.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:42 AM

Is there anything stopping [Romney] from sweeping all 50 states?

Funniest quote of this election – it will become historic, but not in the way it was written.

Schadenfreude on January 17, 2012 at 1:42 AM

You think Obama going to run against Bush again? The Bush years seem like the Golden Age compared to the Obama years. Who the hell wouldn’t take Bush back over Obama outside of Obama’s committed but grim supporters?

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:37 AM

He’ll run against Bush and Congress. Paint Romney as a hybrid of both. That’s my bet but we’ll know for sure soon enough.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 1:42 AM

Romney was in the middle of the stage again, and got the most questions again, and speaking time again. The FOX controlled debate went perfectly for their candidate again. The American people lose again.

apocalypse on January 17, 2012 at 1:43 AM

Is there anything stopping [Romney] from sweeping all 50 states?

Funniest quote of this election – it will become historic, but not in the way it was written.

Schadenfreude on January 17, 2012 at 1:42 AM

None of us know the future THIS precisely.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:44 AM

Obama’s going to play the race card on whoever our nominee is, so it would be stupid to give him Ron Paul where that accusation can stick.

I don’t want to lose this election b/c Obama makes it about Ron Paul being a racist. He’s not worth it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:44 AM

I’m voting for Ron Paul!

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:25 AM

Congratulations.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 1:45 AM

I think they tend to put the frontrunners in the middle of the stage. Perry use to be in the middle and then he got shuffled off to the side and less talking time as his poll numbers plummeted.

If you want to be in the middle, you better be more prepared for the debates and run a more energetic campaign.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:46 AM

Romney was in the middle of the stage again, and got the most questions again, and speaking time again. The FOX controlled debate went perfectly for their candidate again. The American people lose again.

apocalypse on January 17, 2012 at 1:43 AM

Well you know what happens when Rove, Murdoch, and both Bushes get together and start brainstorming. “So Karl do you think we should move Mitt to the left side or the right side?” “Look, I like him right there in the center where he belongs.”.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:47 AM

White punks on dope.
Ron Paul’s our pope.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:47 AM

Fox News does prefer Romney, no question about that. Most of their people do vote Democrat, they just know how to play devil’s advocate on Fox…they know lively debate brings in the ratings.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:48 AM

Shepard just prefers Romney because, you know.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:49 AM

Then go vote for Newt, the guy who sat on a couch with Nancy Pelosi. I just hope you don’t think he will pursue any of your “right wing social engineering” ideas. Not he mention, his favorite president is FDR…the father of the progressive era! HE BLOWS LIKE THE WIND!

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:50 AM

Congratulations.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 1:45 AM

It’s like winning Publisher’s Clearinghouse sweepstakes every day of your life, that’s how this honest man of the people makes you feel when you finally accept him as your earthly savior.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:50 AM

Shepherd is a big lib. Not that anybody cares about him one way or another.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:51 AM

White punks on dope.
Ron Paul’s our pope.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:47 AM

Tubes? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFltXDMQsQQ

Bmore on January 17, 2012 at 1:52 AM

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:50 AM

I’d rather just take the money.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 1:52 AM

Shepherd is a big lib. Not that anybody cares about him one way or another.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:51 AM

I almost never get to watch him. I just know that he has multiple reasons to like handsome Mitt. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:53 AM

Then go vote for Newt, the guy who sat on a couch with Nancy Pelosi. I just hope you don’t think he will pursue any of your “right wing social engineering” ideas. Not he mention, his favorite president is FDR…the father of the progressive era! HE BLOWS LIKE THE WIND!

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:50 AM

This may surprise you but I’m not planning on voting b/c I’m not registered to vote b/c I have not registered my car in my new state of residence b/c I don’t want to pay the DMV’s Welcome Tax. :)

I’m a Santorum supporter. I know, I hate gays. Let’s not explore that.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:53 AM

I almost never get to watch him. I just know that he has multiple reasons to like handsome Mitt. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:53 AM

Is he gay? I always thought he may be.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:54 AM

Tubes? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFltXDMQsQQ

Bmore on January 17, 2012 at 1:52 AM

Tubes!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:55 AM

Is he gay? I always thought he may be.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:54 AM

A raging queen!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:57 AM

Tubes!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:55 AM

Rare for anyone to know of them.

Bmore on January 17, 2012 at 1:57 AM

I’d rather just take the money.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 1:52 AM

How materialistic of you!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:58 AM

A raging queen!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:57 AM

I’ve always said if you are going to be gay you need to be flaming gay. Don’t halfass it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:58 AM

Rare for anyone to know of them.

Bmore on January 17, 2012 at 1:57 AM

Dr. Paul knows his way around the tubes.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:59 AM

Well I hope everybody had a Merry Martin Luther King Day.

I need to get my beauty sleep b/c 3.45 am comes early and I have a 1 hour commute to work.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 2:00 AM

I’ve always said if you are going to be gay you need to be flaming gay. Don’t halfass it.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:58 AM

Gays don’t do anything halfass.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 2:01 AM

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 2:00 AM

Good night!

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 2:02 AM

dom89031 on January 17, 2012 at 1:25 AM

It sounds like you’ve made a thoughtful decision after considering the issues and the Candidates. There is a lot that Ron Paul stands for that is admirable. He pretty much sticks with what he believes and you’re right, he doesn’t change back and forth. Some of his foreign policy beliefs are good, but others aren’t. I think that’s the problem many people have. With you being a Veteran, you may have a different view and or understanding of his positions better.

Perhaps if there had not been so many debates, the Candidates could have spent more time visiting the States and talking to the people.

Since it’s Primary season, then we each will have a choice on whom to vote for. Depending on who is still in the race when each State’s Primary is held will have something to do with it too:-) Glad you were able to make your decision, many are still undecided.

bluefox on January 17, 2012 at 2:03 AM

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:58 AM

Now, now, you don’t know what I would do with the money.

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 2:06 AM

With his idea of capitalism, we would still have slavery in the south, as slavery was an aspect of capitalism of the time, and thus unassailable. As such, slavery must have been 100% perfectly moral as well, as being a part of capitalism of the time.

astonerii on January 17, 2012 at 1:12 AM

Morality is not absolute, it changes with time. In the Old Testament slavery is normal. Even the New Testament doesn’t question slavery once. You wouldn’t call the Bible immoral, I guess.

Dividing capitalism into good and bad capitalism is a slippery slope, anyway, because it is utterly subjective. Soon you’ll tell us that Romney should not become President because having a lot of money is immoral.

Gelsomina on January 17, 2012 at 2:17 AM

Romney will be the nominee…all this fuss on this thread is another example of another lame debate will not change the inevitable

I have seen how you folks are like serial daters….support Bachmann, then Perry, then Herman Stain, then Gingrich, and now Santorum

Mitt is laughing his way to the nomination

nparga23 on January 17, 2012 at 2:21 AM

New Romney supporter talking points have went out, “Great debate. I’m comfortable with all the candidates”.

Translation: We have won and now want you to forget how. Oh, and forget what we called you and your candidate too.

FEAR OBAMA

tonotisto on January 17, 2012 at 2:27 AM

good night

nparga23 on January 17, 2012 at 2:29 AM

He’ll run against Bush and Congress. Paint Romney as a hybrid of both. That’s my bet but we’ll know for sure soon enough.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 1:42 AM

If unemployment is near 8% Obama will run on the economy.

Obama will say that he staved off depression and we are about to reap the rewards of his policies. The promises of the ONE will soon come true.

If unemployment is is over 9% then Obama loses unless
Romney’s dog incident was taped and Obama owns it.

BoxHead1 on January 17, 2012 at 2:42 AM

Facebook Gives Politico Deep Access to Users’ Political Sentiments
January 12, 2012 at 11:02 am PT
inShare.Share

http://allthingsd.com/20120112/facebook-gives-politico-deep-access-to-users-political-sentiments/

bluefox on January 17, 2012 at 2:44 AM

This may surprise you but I’m not planning on voting b/c I’m not registered to vote b/c I have not registered my car in my new state of residence b/c I don’t want to pay the DMV’s Welcome Tax. :)

I’m a Santorum supporter. I know, I hate gays. Let’s not explore that.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:53 AM

I almost never get to watch him. I just know that he has multiple reasons to like handsome Mitt. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 1:53 AM

Is he gay? I always thought he may be.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:54 AM

Oh! He really is signing off, unlike yesterday.
I saw this, before he said that, and thought….ohhhh noooo…here we go again!

KOOLAID2 on January 17, 2012 at 3:04 AM

This is a complicated issue because “natural born citizen” is never defined in the constitution. There arguments based on foreign writings at the time of its creation, “the law of nations”, etc. It’s just not a clear area.

Igor R. on January 17, 2012 at 12:12 AM

It means natural born. Not that complicated. Born essentially.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 3:13 AM

How I saw it –

1. Newt
2. Perry
3. Romney
4. Santorum
5. Paul

But Mitt really won because he didn’t have any major screwups. As long as he doesn’t mess up he’s going to win on Saturday.

independentvoice on January 17, 2012 at 12:05 AM

I’m scrolling through the thread a couple hours later, but

I’m switching your 3 & 4.

KOOLAID2 on January 17, 2012 at 3:14 AM

I thought Romney’s defense of his Bain experience by comparing it to what Obama did by taking over GM was far more egregious than the Bain capital ads by Gingrich.

It seems like Rush Limbaugh was about the only one to even talk about that aspect of it.

Dr. Tesla

Still making things up I see. Yet another example of why you’re an idiot that no one should take seriously.

xblade on January 17, 2012 at 3:20 AM

According to polls of ordinary (rank and file, not Establishment) Republicans. The latest Gallup Tracking poll (1/11-1/15) has Romney with more nationwide support among Republicans (37%) than Gingrich, Santorum and Perry, combined (33%). The latest Fox News poll (1/12-1/14) has Romney with more nationwide support among Republicans (40%) than Gingrich, Santorum and Perry, combined (35%). This is as close to a groundswell of rank-and-file support as is to be had this time around. “Romney Denialists” = deadenders, deadending at a deadend.

VorDaj on January 17, 2012 at 3:28 AM

It means natural born. Not that complicated. Born essentially.

lexhamfox on January 17, 2012 at 3:13 AM

The Founding Fathers all read Vatel’s “Law of Nations”. Jefferson even had his own personal copy. I think it fair to say they likely went more by his definition of “Natural Born” than yours.

VorDaj on January 17, 2012 at 3:31 AM

So, what did I miss?

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 12:15 AM

I’m scrolling through much later…and see this ^ …not to worry…canopfor will catch her up in no time!

canopfor on January 17, 2012 at 12:19 AM
—————————————–

That’s been what is missing in this election. Kaos!!!

Cindy Munford on January 17, 2012 at 12:25 AM

Cindy Munford:Yup,and,I’m posting the Debate highlights:)

canopfor on January 17, 2012 at 12:28 AM

Yep! Scroll down a little more…and our good buddy is already hooking her up!
For the new people that were ‘sent in here’ and never read Hot Air much before…he is loved for more than his wit and wisdom.

KOOLAID2 on January 17, 2012 at 3:32 AM

Dom98234987 went from couldnt decide from one to the other all life is la la. To ok its Ron paul as my choice. Then its fire drops on all that is Newt. Dom you are the one of the biggest phoneys around. Behind Chudi and Basil and those boys. Basically, they are the Romney Posse. They will dispute you at all angles. Comparable to ATTACKWATCH!

Dont like Romneys, Romneycare when he was governer? Its what the libs wanted.

Dont like his religion even though Blacks were the seed of Cain and American Indians were the disgraced tribe of Isreal?

When I go to Disneyland I get more pumped from seeing the Lincoln annimatron than I do Romney. I would vote for Newt/Rick/Perry over any Romney Pau; any day. Both are Cancer and neither will get my vote.

Gedge on January 17, 2012 at 3:35 AM

Michelle Malkin not getting her facts straight on twitter:

Perry promises border will be “locked down and secure” within 1 yr of him taking office. How about signing TX sanctuary city ban 1st?

And promptly being schooled by Texas Perry supporter, @StaceinTexas

yes, he did! @michellemalkin – #Perry tried twice last Session to ban Sanctuary Cities. Our Legislature blocked the bill both times. #sc

In the tank much, Malkin?

Fox got their facts wrong, too, about standing ovations. They claimed in the post-debate wrap-up that Newt got the first ever SO tonight. Nope. Perry got a SO at the debate in Sept. at the Reagan Library when he defended the death penalty. How could Fox have forgotten the MSM storm that got kicked up after that? Remember, the MSM said that Republicans showed how blood-thristy they are.

I’m sick of the “Right”-stream media getting their facts wrong.

Aslans Girl on January 17, 2012 at 3:37 AM

Link it then. since you’re so sick.

Gedge on January 17, 2012 at 3:40 AM

Gedge on January 17, 2012 at 3:40 AM

Did you mean the twitter links? I thought if I gave the names, they’d be easy to find. Malkin’s @michellemalkin:

http://twitter.com/#!/michellemalkin

Or did you meant that Perry tried to ban sancuary cities? That’s common knowledge, but ok:

http://www.themonitor.com/articles/cities-51442-perry-sanctuary.html

Or did you mean that Perry got the SO before Newt? Again, common knowledge for anyone who watched the debate and the MSM firestorm afterward. It was the Sept. 7, 2011 debate:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocKFSLsZnUo

Does that answer your question?

Aslans Girl on January 17, 2012 at 3:51 AM

What do you think Mitt Romney pays in Taxes. My guess is less than 15% or we would have seen the returns.Offshore Accounts and Trusts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VddqzmpfJSU

CoolChange80 on January 17, 2012 at 4:17 AM

Since you have your eyes open now, you may want to take a peek at Ron Paul’s newsletters with racist and other controversial statements in there, and tell us how that helps beat a black man in Obama.

Dr. Tesla on January 17, 2012 at 1:33 AM

TMOT covered that issue fairly well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1uc7x4a8SM&feature=list_related&playnext=1&list=SP040F743A1D9E0AD9

cavalier973 on January 17, 2012 at 4:27 AM

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