Quotes of the day
posted at 9:30 pm on January 14, 2012 by Allahpundit
“Yet the act of desecrating an enemy’s body is as old as war, perhaps most famously described by Homer in ‘The Iliad,’ when Achilles drags Hector’s lifeless body behind his chariot before the eyes of a shocked and despairing Troy. Nancy Sherman, a professor of philosophy at Georgetown University who has written a book about the moral implications of war on troops, ‘The Untold War,’ said dehumanizing the enemy can be a psychological defense mechanism for the troops whose job is to kill that enemy…
“Mr. Exum said black humor is another coping mechanism for young troops trying to act tough beyond their years. ‘I remember being a young officer in Afghanistan in 2002 and standing over the body of this partially decapitated Taliban and cracking jokes,’ he said. ‘Humor is how we cope with pretty horrific stuff. It’s almost dangerous to be too sensitive.’
“Alex Lemons, a Marine scout sniper during the fierce fighting in the Iraqi city of Falluja in 2004, said that on several occasions he encountered American troops who either urinated on insurgent bodies or manipulated them for photographs, like putting them in ridiculous poses. While he called such behavior disgusting, he also said it could be cathartic.
“‘I’ve never spat on a dead body or urinated on one, but I’ve certainly screamed at a dead body because they’ve taken a friend’s life,’ said Mr. Lemons, who left the Marine Corps in 2008.”
“But what possible benefit does desecrating enemy corpses serve? — other than to radicalize other terrorists — and to provide our enemies with talking points and propaganda photos? (Oh yeah, it also fosters the notion that America is no different from the rest of the barbaric world — that we are simply about imposing our power, not liberating oppressed people or defending our citizens.)
“In a perfect world, our warriors would operate clinically. Like professionals, they would follow orders, dispassionately removing cancers, never allowing emotion to creep into their decisions. It is understandable, of course, that men — faced with the horrors of war (our enemies are evil people who do horrible things!) — sometimes fall far short of that high standard.
“But this was dancing in the end zone.”
“There is a final context for this act in which we are all responsible, all guilty. A 19-year-old Marine has a very hard time reconciling the fact that it’s okay to waterboard a live Taliban fighter but not okay to urinate on a dead one.
“When the war on terror started, the Marines in that video were probably 9 or 10 years old. As children they heard adults — and political leaders — talk about our enemies in the most inhuman terms. The Internet and the news media are filled with self-important men and women referring to our enemies as animals that deserve little legal or moral consideration. We have sent enemy fighters to countries like Syria and Libya to be tortured by the very regimes that we have recently condemned for engaging in war crimes and torture. They have been tortured into confessing their crimes and then locked up indefinitely without trial because their confessions — achieved through torture — will not stand up in court.
“For the past 10 years, American children have absorbed these moral contradictions, and now they are fighting our wars. The video doesn’t surprise me, but it makes me incredibly sad — not just for them, but also for us. We may prosecute these men for desecrating the dead while maintaining that it is okay to torture the living.
“I hope someone else knows how to explain that to our soldiers, because I don’t have the faintest idea.”
“Initially there were concerns that outrage over the issue would spiral into a scandal like the one in 2004 over the release of photos showing a group of U.S. military police abusing prisoners at the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq…
“But Afghan officials and others said the quick responses by all sides had helped contain the damage.
“‘As all three sides — the U.S., the Afghan government and the Taliban — have all condemned this act, I’m hopeful that this will not have any effect on the peace process,’ Abdul Hakim Mujahid, a member of the peace council and the Taliban’s former envoy to the United Nations, said Saturday…
“‘Reconciliation is a big change for the people of Afghanistan and it won’t be affected by the actions of individuals like those in the video,’ Taliban spokesman Zabiullah Mujahid told The Associated Press on Friday. ‘We are focused on the bigger picture and for that, we have to avoid small things.’”
“‘It’s insane,’ says an Afghan [Taliban] sub-commander in Helmand province where the urination incident allegedly took place last year. ‘Why are we talking to those who hate us so much that they desecrate our martyrs’ bodies?’ he asks angrily in a phone conversation with The Daily Beast. His anger extends to the Taliban’s negotiators in Qatar. ‘To me those who claim to represent the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan in these talks are dishonoring the rivers of blood we have shed,’ he says. ‘This act is worse than that of animals,’ adds the sub-commander who declines to be named for security reasons. ‘They showed no shame.’
“Jan Mohammad Khan, a Taliban fighter in eastern Afghanistan, says the video affected him more than all the carnage that he’s seen in his 10 years in the jihad. ‘I have never hurt so much as I did when I saw this video,’ he says. ‘These Americans have crossed the borders of civilization and humanity by disrespecting the dead.’…
“The former translator who lives in Kabul with his family says the video has outraged even his normally calm and moderate father. ‘This morning my father was so angry that he ordered me to burn any money I may still have from the Americans as it was a sin to keep it,’ he says. ‘If this action has so angered my father it will certainly anger other common Afghans.’ If so the already difficult fledgling peace process has just become even more complicated.”
Via the Daily Caller.
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I’m surprised its not higher. We should not go into Syria under ANY circumstances…short of the US coming in danger.
nonpartisan on April 30, 2013 at 12:03 PM
64% oppose US intervention in Syria?
Barry, “Its settled then, we’re goin’ in!”
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:04 PM
This decision making stuff is hard. “Valerie? Valerie? Would you come in here, please?”
a capella on April 30, 2013 at 12:05 PM
But they crossed the red line… And Obama promised assistance if they did…
Skywise on April 30, 2013 at 12:06 PM
well it’s a good thing the President doesn’t need congressional approval to wage war then huh?
equanimous on April 30, 2013 at 12:06 PM
ok, hawkeye, we get it…
nonpartisan on April 30, 2013 at 12:07 PM
WTF is with all the repeat posts?
MelonCollie on April 30, 2013 at 12:07 PM
Not his fault — we had a database glitch. Our fault.
Ed Morrissey on April 30, 2013 at 12:09 PM
Hair Trigger.
VegasRick on April 30, 2013 at 12:10 PM
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:04 PM
So are we going in or what?
HumpBot Salvation on April 30, 2013 at 12:11 PM
database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…database gli…
equanimous on April 30, 2013 at 12:12 PM
Ok, better now.
Hey leftists – when do we get antiwar protests? Oh, that’s right, those would be RAAACIST because your boy-king was ‘elected’ to be ‘in charge’.
MelonCollie on April 30, 2013 at 12:12 PM
Phew! And I was wondering how that hiccup happened!
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:13 PM
Stay O.U.T. of Syria, especially with Obama in charge.
No American life is worth expending saving a Muslim one. Let them fight it out until they’re either all dead or exhausted.
If the Islamists win, give them a simple warning. Any attacks on the US results in the nuking of a Muslim city starting with the letter A and working down the alphabet. That way each Muslim country has incentive to protect us from attacks from another.
If Saudis attack us, nuke Aleppo.
If Iranians attack us, nuke Baghdad.
Then Cairo, Damascus, on down until they’re all dead or stop attacking us.
Charlemagne on April 30, 2013 at 12:13 PM
PinballKeyboard Wizzard.antipc on April 30, 2013 at 12:14 PM
Somebody put a nickel on the needle!!
I’m having a hard time picking which side is the “good guys” here. When I see reports of European jihadis going to Syria to fight the good fight, I don’t really see any downside to letting them have at it.
jdpaz on April 30, 2013 at 12:14 PM
We should still call that “pulling a hawkeye,” though … ;-)
Ed Morrissey on April 30, 2013 at 12:14 PM
I’d almost bet money on that. I don’t see how Barry can keep out of it.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:14 PM
“No boots on the ground” time, again?
kingsjester on April 30, 2013 at 12:14 PM
When it comes to the warring factions, there are none, from the perspective of our national interests anyway.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:15 PM
I’m with the 24%. I mean Libya worked out so well: I say we partner with AQ-affiliated Islamists again. What could go wrong?
batter on April 30, 2013 at 12:15 PM
John McCain hardest hit.
bannor on April 30, 2013 at 12:15 PM
I like it! My 15 minutes of fame!! :)
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:15 PM
Ha!
hawkeye54 – under the bus driven by Ed.
…actually it’s worse than that – Ed drives a scooter.
batter on April 30, 2013 at 12:18 PM
Exactly what I was thinking, along with, “They think they still have a say? Looks like I’ll have to show them who’s boss — again!”
Liam on April 30, 2013 at 12:20 PM
We can always send Lindsey Graham and his sweetheart Juan McCain.
celticdefender on April 30, 2013 at 12:20 PM
Does he wear a bow tie too? Somehow scooters and bow ties just seem to go together.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:20 PM
I like the way you think, Charley!
Even they’re smart enough to get that ‘equation’.
MelonCollie on April 30, 2013 at 12:22 PM
I think Barry has some of our military surplus he can sell to the rebels, at very reasonable prices too.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:22 PM
They are a very determined lot….we might have to go on nuking them all the way to Dearborn.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:23 PM
Picture this: Ed. Bow tie. Wearing nothing else. Driving over you.
(no, I will not pay your therapy bills)
batter on April 30, 2013 at 12:25 PM
.
The criteria for “go / don’t go” will be based on whether it helps the ‘One World Government’ movement, or not.
If it helps the cause of One World Government for us to go, then that’s what the decision will be. What the American people think about it be damned.
listens2glenn on April 30, 2013 at 12:25 PM
…and then they can become a regional threat. Just like the Libya/Mali model. Aaah, perfection.
batter on April 30, 2013 at 12:27 PM
If Obama’s recent history is any guide, these are precisely Obama’s objectives.
Fenris on April 30, 2013 at 12:30 PM
For once, I agree with the New York Times–we have no business in Syria.
Various leftists have argued that the 2003 invasion of Iraq was a mistake, but at the time, Saddam was a threat to our allies in the region, notably Kuwait and Saudi Arabia. Obama made a name for himself by his speech at the 2004 DNC decrying the Iraq war, then he brought us into Libya to help oust Khadafi, but bungled the “peace” by enabling hard-line jihadists and the Muslim Brotherhood to come to power.
Assad in Syria is a fellow Baathist like Saddam Hussein, and doesn’t deserve our support, but there are no better alternatives–we don’t really have any friends in Syria, and lots of enemies there. If our enemies are killing each other, we don’t have to fight them.
About the only possible benefit from the Syrian conflict would be that if Assad’s army is preoccupied on its own turf, it could be an opportunity to liberate Lebanon. If we had a smart President and State Department, now would be a good time to depose a UN resolution telling Syria to get out of Lebanon “or else”, and Israel and France would probably do the dirty work.
But with Obama and Kerry at the helm, we’re a rudderless ship…
Steve Z on April 30, 2013 at 12:30 PM
Hey Hagel all ya gotta do is make sure those who go in are all muslims.
jake49 on April 30, 2013 at 12:31 PM
Great idea, but since ‘mulslim’ starts with an ‘m’, I suggest starting with Mecca.
Fenris on April 30, 2013 at 12:31 PM
Hah! I remember watching “Monty Python” with the occasional clip of one of its members playing the piano whilst naked. Can’t possibly be worse than that. :)
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:32 PM
Make a trade with Assad: give him conventional arms in exchange for his WMDs.
Then give more arms to the rebels.
And then make more popcorn.
rbj on April 30, 2013 at 12:34 PM
I see the reverse: The NYT agrees with us. Very rare, but I imagine their people know more about the matter than their precious Obama. If they were as ignorant about the world as is Dear Leader, I’m certain they’d be calling for immediate intervention.
Liam on April 30, 2013 at 12:35 PM
If that doesn’t get ‘em all riled up world wide nothing will. Create a vast target rich environment though with all the outraged muslims rioting in the streets.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:35 PM
It could be that. It could also be that antiwar protesters tend to be motivated by, you know, war, and right now nobody’s talking seriously about going to war in Syria. But I appreciate the strawman.
YYZ on April 30, 2013 at 12:36 PM
Good.
Stay out of that part of the world – too many of our young men and women have perished to try and bring civilization to those effing barbarians.
Defenestratus on April 30, 2013 at 12:37 PM
A Civil War ?
How can that be ?
Muslims dont kill Musl… Oh, never mind. It’s the religion of peace we’re talking about.
Make no mistake. This will become a proxy war between SA and Iran. Or rather Sunni vs. Shia, respectfully. Been fighting for over 1,000 years with only occasional breaks to address the infidels.
Jabberwock on April 30, 2013 at 12:37 PM
Any News if the WMD’s used by Syria have “Made in Iraq” on them?
dirtseller on April 30, 2013 at 12:37 PM
Dear Leader is not just ignorant about the world as he sees it, but misled. His entire life. He’s the perfect Manchurian President.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:38 PM
Syria, ‘Red-Lines,’ and Obama’s Feckless Foreign Policy
Heckava job, Barry!
Resist We Much on April 30, 2013 at 12:38 PM
The USA’s only action should be to cantain these fools within their borders.
As many of these nutjobs that kill each other the better.
Tater Salad on April 30, 2013 at 12:40 PM
Never let a crisis go to waste. I was just afraid that Mecca was so many letters away from Aleppo that the opportunity would be lost.
Fenris on April 30, 2013 at 12:42 PM
Send in the Muslim Brotherhood!!!
albill on April 30, 2013 at 12:44 PM
And we have no compelling reason, as a nation, to get involved in a local squabble far away from us.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 12:44 PM
62% in CBS/NYT poll: Stay out of Syria
It should be 100%.
#neoconfail
#nocaliphate
#democratwarmongering
PappyD61 on April 30, 2013 at 12:57 PM
‘So Long Muslim World, And Thanks For All The Fish!’
M2RB: KoRn
Resist We Much on April 30, 2013 at 12:57 PM
The last thing Obama needs to do is listen to McCain. This guy wants to get involved in every conflict that pops up.
Tasha on April 30, 2013 at 1:01 PM
Good idea. I’d say let’s supply them guns (Oh, yeah, forgot we did that from Libya) and let them duke it out to the last survivor. We should have stayed out of those other localized civil wars (Bosnia, Egypt, Libya) too. As it turns out, helping the Muslims fight these civil wars doesn’t encourage them to like us very much anyway.
TulsAmerican on April 30, 2013 at 1:10 PM
Meh, he’ll only listen to McCain if John parrots what Obama already has in mind, then he can boast of a “bipartisan” effort on any action taken, and have the proverbial person to throw under the bus and blame when things don’t go as planned.
hawkeye54 on April 30, 2013 at 1:11 PM
Hezbollah & Iranian Shia
vs.
Al Qaeda & Sunni Arab Jihadist
For control of Syria??
This is like a wonderful dream that I hope never ends. I hope they fight over that useless piece of land forever.
William Eaton on April 30, 2013 at 1:33 PM
Also the sad thing is Assad and the Iranians actually treat Christians (and even Jews) better than the Sunni Jihadist “Freedom Fighters” John McCain wants to help. That is how bigoted and insane the Syrian opposition to Assad is.
William Eaton on April 30, 2013 at 1:37 PM
Riiiiiight. Look, I know the truth because I watch TV. The next time you update the matrix, get me a blonde in a red dress. I deserve it. I’m value-added.
Axe on April 30, 2013 at 2:34 PM
Wow. Speaking of blondes in red dresses:
That’s a pretty clear sentiment, but this is what makes it special:
http://predicthistunpredictpast.blogspot.com/2012/09/so-long-muslim-world-and-thanks-for-all.html
lol — Some of you guys have a terrible time expressing your feelings. Just let it out. Say what you really think. Stop mincing words. :)
Axe on April 30, 2013 at 2:47 PM
Axe – I refer to this as the ‘Curtis LeMay foreign policy’, of which I’ve more or less been an adherent most of my adult life.
JEM on April 30, 2013 at 3:06 PM
It’s very appealing. :)
Sort of an international laissez-faire attitude with a touch of “I will hit you back, you know.” It’s not isolationist. It just presupposes the business of a national government is primarily that nation’s business, independently.
Kind of like sitting at a picnic table and being much more interested in your own barbequed chicken then what Bob’s eating. Bob’s only an issue when he messes with your plate, or maybe tries to make a run at the smoker. It might be necessary to beat the hell out of Bob from time to time, but that’s not why anyone’s at the lake.
I get it.
. . . and come on, summer.
Axe on April 30, 2013 at 3:34 PM
WE HAVE NO FRIENDS IN SYRIA!
Not. A. One.
mojo on April 30, 2013 at 3:50 PM
There are only 2 viable sides in Syria: Islamists and a corrupt and hostile dictatorship. There is nothing to gain by going in. Americans should concentrate upon restoring responsible government to America.
Basilsbest on April 30, 2013 at 4:44 PM