Muslim Brotherhood spokesman: What say we put that peace treaty with Israel to a popular vote?

posted at 8:59 pm on January 2, 2012 by Allahpundit

Given that the two Islamist parties have won 70 percent of the vote in parliamentary elections, how do you suppose a referendum on the Camp David accords would shake out?

Al-Bayoumi emphasized that the Islamist movement would respect all of the international agreements to which Egypt is signatory, adding, however, that each side had the right to review the peace deal, and that the Egyptian people have yet to speak their mind.

“We weren’t party to the peace treaty, it was signed away from the Egyptian people and thus the people must have its say,” the Muslim Brotherhood official said.

Referring to the issue of recognizing Israel, al-Bayoumi said that the Muslim Brotherhood was not required to recognize Egypt’s neighbor to the north, saying that Israel was an “occupying entity and we will not allow anyone of our members to meet with an Israeli.”

“I won’t allow myself to meet with a criminal and there’s no chance that we’ll cooperate with Israel,” the Egyptian official said.

In case you’re inclined to think this is pandering aimed at outflanking the Salafists among hardcore Islamist voters before the final round of the elections, go back and re-read this Time mag piece dated February 7, 2011. That was four days before Mubarak was finally sent packing — and even then, the Ikhwan was talking about putting the treaty to vote:

On the subject of whether a new Egyptian government should cancel the Camp David Accords, they demurred. “We are not going to cancel any agreement previously made by the government,” says Zakaria. “But if there is a referendum about this or any other agreement, then we obey the people’s will.”

The dirty little not-so-secret about this is that it’s not just the Islamists who are prepared to dump the treaty. Even Ayman Nour, who challenged Mubarak for the presidency on a platform of democracy and human rights and ended up as a political prisoner, told a Lebanese TV network early last year that “the Camp David accords have come to an end.” The U.S. has allegedly been holding secret talks with the Egyptian military on how to preserve the treaty, but if the Brotherhood decided to make an issue of holding a referendum, I don’t know how the army could get away with refusing unless they’re prepared to rule indefinitely in Mubarak fashion themselves. Preventing the referendum or rejecting the results would be dangerous enough for them as a retreat from democracy to autocracy; to do it in the name of preserving relations with Israel would risk whatever popular prestige they have left. The answer in the near term, I take it, will be for the Brotherhood to threaten a referendum but never quite get around to conducting it so long as western aid flows freely and relations between Israel and the Palestinians remain kinda sorta stable. Which of course would be a lot easier to do if they didn’t have to worry about the suddenly popular Salafist party using it against them if/when the next elections are held in a few years.

Speaking of which, in other Egypt news, the Salafists might want to cover the pyramids with wax or something because the idolatry is an affront to Islam. Yeah.


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Comment pages: 1 2

Anybody know the Vegas line on this one? *first?*

predator on January 2, 2012 at 9:04 PM

Well, waddaya know.

predator on January 2, 2012 at 9:04 PM

Islamic hatred for the Jewish people is the root cause of all the misery in the Middle East.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

Muslim Brotherhood spokesman: What say we put that peace treaty with Israel to a popular vote?

I think thats a great idea. The peace treaty will get rejected by the popular vote of the Egyptian people and hopefully the Israeli’s and westerners in general will experience a wake up call. It will show them what Islam is and stop them prattling on about how a democratic middle east will solve everything.

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

What say we take back the Sinai, nuke Cairo and put Lebanon to the torch. Lets take a vote. All in favor…?

Kuffar on January 2, 2012 at 9:07 PM

Christians have a Biblical obligation to defend Israel. Never forget that.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:08 PM

Ya know,on a side note,the Democrats are the same,as the Muslim
speakers,in that,they both use their hands,in a Mesmerizing Hand
Puppet Show!!
(sarc)

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:08 PM

I have prayed for (a)llahpundit before…

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:12 PM

I think thats a great idea. The peace treaty will get rejected by the popular vote of the Egyptian people and hopefully the Israeli’s and westerners in general will experience a wake up call. It will show them what Islam is and stop them prattling on about how a democratic middle east will solve everything.

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

Exactly. Go for it!

Maybe it will clear a little deliberately-fogged air.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 9:12 PM

Never saw this one coming….

LawnGnomeFanFirst on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

All this must be totally unexpected by the Obama Administration.

SlaveDog on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Me thinks this was the plan from day 1,
over-throw the Dictators,who kept the Islamic
Jihady NutJobs at bay!

And,now,an Islamic free-for-all,on the way to
a greater Persian,er Iranian Caliphate Sphere!

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel. Arab anger over the Palestinian question limits the strength and depth of U.S. partnerships with governments and peoples in the region and weakens the legitimacy of moderate regimes in the Arab world. Meanwhile, al-Qaeda and other militant groups exploit that anger to mobilize support. The conflict also gives Iran influence in the Arab world through its clients, Lebanese Hizballah and Hamas.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

The answer in the near term, I take it, will be for the Brotherhood to threaten a referendum but never quite get around to conducting it

Actually the answer is Islam. Does no one listen to them?

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:15 PM

The western nations hope the Israelis don’t nuke the Arabs and the Arabs hope they do, forcing the western world to not only cut ties with Israel but join the Arabs in attacking Israel with nukes. Easy, see?

LizardLips on January 2, 2012 at 9:16 PM

This is building up to be a very interesting year. Israel, man the parapets!

OldEnglish on January 2, 2012 at 9:16 PM

Muslim Brotherhood spokesman: What say we put that peace treaty with Israel to a popular vote?

I think thats a great idea. The peace treaty will get rejected by the popular vote of the Egyptian people and hopefully the Israeli’s and westerners in general will experience a wake up call. It will show them what Islam is and stop them prattling on about how a democratic middle east will solve everything.

i think you underestimate the nature of egyptians…they do want sharia law and the pretty much hate Israel…remember when they went after the Israeli embassy?

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/egyptians-back-sharia-law-end-of-israel-treaty-poll-shows-396178.html

sadsushi on January 2, 2012 at 9:17 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

liberal4life:This might help!!
===============================

The Muslim Brotherhood
**********************

History
*******

The Muslim Brotherhood began as a social and religious organization in Egypt whose members regarded Islam as a way of life. Many Syrian supporters founded their own branches in Syria, one of which was the Aleppo branch, founded in 1935. The Aleppo branch eventually became the Syrian headquarters of the Brotherhood. The Brotherhood expanded its political involvement as the Party of the Muslim Brotherhood, Hizb al-Ikhwan al-Muslimun.
(More…)

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Terrorism/muslimbrotherhood.html

canopfor on December 24, 2011 at 6:18 AM

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:18 PM

This isn’t going to be a wake up call for anyone. Leftists simply don’t care. I think they want Israel to be a human sacrifice, and will be totally ok if the Israelis (and Jews in general) are wiped off the face of the earth.

They are hoping the Islamists kill them last. Good luck with that.

dragonhawk on January 2, 2012 at 9:18 PM

What about a vote to make the Middle East into a parking lot?
Can I get an Hallah Hakbar?

HornetSting on January 2, 2012 at 9:18 PM

iberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

I agree – back right off, then nuke ‘em from space. It’s the only way to be sure.

OldEnglish on January 2, 2012 at 9:19 PM

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

ahh disregard my comment to you..i didn’t read your comment right

sadsushi on January 2, 2012 at 9:21 PM

liberal4life,

Your Dear Leader Obama was glad to sit idly by and do nothing. That was the U.S. position and still is. So enlighten us dumbkoff, back off from what?

fogw on January 2, 2012 at 9:23 PM

Bomb the Muslim Brotherhood in their conclaves. Let’s just get this jihad sham over with. 60yrs of this pan-arab nationalism / Caliphate horsepucky is quite enough.

rayra on January 2, 2012 at 9:24 PM

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

And the reason for Muslim hate of Nigerian Christians?
The reason for Muslim Egyptian attacks on Coptic Christians?
The reason for Muslim attacks on Sudanese Animists?
The reasons for Afghan Muslims blowing up Buddhist temples?
The reason for Indonesian Muslims killing Christians?
The reason for Muslim attacks in India?

I can almost sense a strange pattern emerging?

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:25 PM

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

The Arabs hate the idea of Israel’s very existence, while, at the same time, being scared stiff that they might have to take in the Palestinian trash. They want Israel gone, so that the trash can move in, relieving the Arabs from having to put up with them.

OldEnglish on January 2, 2012 at 9:26 PM

O/T,re:LA Arson FireS!
Breaking!
=======================

Suspect in LA-area arson spree identified as Harry Burkhart, 24, of Hollywood – latimesStory metadata:
Submitted 7 mins ago from latimesblogs.latimes.com by editor

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Submitted 6 hours ago by editor

http://www.breakingnews.com/

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:26 PM

ahh disregard my comment to you..i didn’t read your comment right

sadsushi on January 2, 2012 at 9:21 PM

No problem.

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:27 PM

So, a country of racists has decided to hold a democratic “vote,” have they? Mmmmmmm! How enlightened of them! And, in a stone-age pantomime of Western process, they will “duly” agree to wipe Israel off the map. (By 90-95%!) And we will “duly” recognize this as an act “by consent of the governed.”

I agree with the “nuke ‘em from space” option. Only, I would send a Tomahawk down the Mahdi’s well. It’s in Qom. The CIA has the necessary coordinates.

Herald of Woe on January 2, 2012 at 9:28 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Methinks you don’t understand the meaning of the word you use.

Specifically dictatorship.

They exchanged a relatively benign secular strongman for a theocratic totalitarian tyranny.

They- and you- are now about to discover what the word dictatorship really means.

And another word as well:

Suckers.

profitsbeard on January 2, 2012 at 9:28 PM

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

And the reason for Muslim hate of Nigerian Christians?
The reason for Muslim Egyptian attacks on Coptic Christians?
The reason for Muslim attacks on Sudanese Animists?
The reasons for Afghan Muslims blowing up Buddhist temples?
The reason for Indonesian Muslims killing Christians?
The reason for Muslim attacks in India?

I can almost sense a strange pattern emerging?

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:25 PM

Pardon me. I “forgot” to say who said that, so I can see why you thought it was me. It was a quote from some well know person. No, not Louis Farrakhan.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

What about a vote to make the Middle East into a parking lot?
Can I get an Hallah Hakbar?

HornetSting on January 2, 2012 at 9:18 PM

HornetSting:Aye..Aye:)

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

shaddup, you damned idiot Libtroll.

rayra on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

I can almost sense a strange pattern emerging?

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:25 PM

Paranoia – it’s only a coincidence./Holder.

OldEnglish on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

No, now they will just have sharia law.
Good gravy you’re ignorant, I mean, liberal.

HornetSting on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

This is just more of the super genius that is the 0bama regime. 2012 will let the smartest man in the history of the universe demonstrate more ten dimensional strategy moves like the Egypt brilliance.

jukin3 on January 2, 2012 at 9:30 PM

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel.

It is not a perception, it is a fact.

Arab anger over the Palestinian question limits the strength and depth of U.S. partnerships with governments and peoples in the region and weakens the legitimacy of moderate regimes in the Arab world.

What “moderate” legitimate regimes are we looking at here? Saudi? Snort!

Meanwhile, al-Qaeda and other militant groups exploit that anger to mobilize support. The conflict also gives Iran influence in the Arab world through its clients, Lebanese Hizballah and Hamas.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:14 PM

So you would abandon Israel and hope it will please Islam? Pretty pathetic botboy.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

……And to think the Liberals bought into the

“Democracy Angle”!!

Oh,I’m not surprised,they voted in Hope and Change!

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

The CIA has the necessary coordinates.

Herald of Woe on January 2, 2012 at 9:28 PM

It may now be the coordinates to Tel Aviv though.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

So you would abandon Israel and hope it will please Islam? Pretty pathetic botboy.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

Another fly has walked into my “trap”. And you of all people. I didn’t think I would catch you.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:33 PM

Pardon me. I “forgot” to say who said that, so I can see why you thought it was me. It was a quote from some well know person. No, not Louis Farrakhan.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:29 PM

Petraeus. I should have known.

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:33 PM

So you would abandon Israel and hope it will please Islam? Pretty pathetic botboy.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

So he got you too?

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:35 PM

“With sword in hand,your head in my other hand,

Were the Ones we’ve been waiting for,er,you have
been terrified of”!
(snark)

canopfor on January 2, 2012 at 9:35 PM

Petraeus. I should have known.

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:33 PM

BINGO! It was actually from his 56 page staff report to congress, but if it’s in his staff report, it’s his. You can be sure of that.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:36 PM

This is what happens when amateurs play geopolitics. For an administration so bent against war they are about to enter us into a big one.

Ellis on January 2, 2012 at 9:36 PM

Ever listen to the old Art Bell show? It looks like the grey goo is upon us, only instead of nanobots, it’s going to be radical Islamists.

These guys really aren’t all that different from our liberals: They have an idea to turn the world into a paradise that no one but them would ever want to live in.

arik1969 on January 2, 2012 at 9:40 PM

Christians have a Biblical obligation to defend Israel. Never forget that.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:08 PM

Oh what a disgrace if such a despised and base race, which worships a misogynist pedophile demon, should be allowed to massacre a people which has the faith of omnipotent God! With what reproaches will the Lord overwhelm us if we do not promptly and fully aid those who are being brutalized and murdered because they profess the Jewish or Christian religion! Let those who have been accustomed unjustly to wage private warfare against other of the faithful now all unite and go against the Mohammedans in a Holy Crusade and end with total victory this war against monstrous evil which should have been begun and completed long ago.

Let those who for too long a time have been dhimma, now again become knights. Let those who have been fighting in service of Mohammedans against their own Christian brothers and sisters and their own Jewish cousins now fight in a proper way against all the followers of the misogynist pedophile demon. Let those who have been wearing themselves out in both body and soul in vain attempt to win the dark hearts of the Mohammedans now labor for glorious honor against them. Behold! On the one side will be the completely destroyed Mohammedans, on the other the fierce and righteous protectors of humanity. On the one side will be the destroyed enemies of the Lord, on the other, his friends who will shout at all the Mohammednas as they destroy them, “It is the will of God! It is the will of God!”

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on January 2, 2012 at 9:41 PM

So you would abandon Israel and hope it will please Islam? Pretty pathetic botboy.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM

Another fly has walked into my “trap”. And you of all people. I didn’t think I would catch you.

VorDaj on January 2, 2012 at 9:33 PM

Not much of a trap. I’ve always thought Petraeus was a Muslim ball licker with none of his own and a Jew hating Jackal to boot. If you stuck his name on the post I would have said the same thing.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:42 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

‘Voting’ brought hamas into power against Israel…’Voting’ in Tunisia brought Islamic leaders into power.. ‘Voting’ in brought the muslim brotherhood in power and the salafists…’Voting’ in Libya will bring the muslim brotherhood into to power…

do you see a pattern here? voting in islamic nations always bring islamic leaders into power..dictators can be bad, but they push down the brotherhood and al qaeda…mubarak was our ally for a good long time and obama threw him and with him, Israel under the bus..gaddafi wasn’t a good guy but he wasn’t a threat to us anymore..who replaces him will be

so my point is, dictatorships > islamic rule

sadsushi on January 2, 2012 at 9:43 PM

Not much of a trap. I’ve always thought Petraeus was a Muslim ball licker with none of his own and a Jew hating Jackal to boot. If you stuck his name on the post I would have said the same thing.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:42 PM

iOTW- What do you think of General Petreus and his assertion that inciting Islam puts our soldiers in harm’s way?
Ann Barnhardt – I have an offer for General Petreus. I’ll GIVE him one of my balls. Then I’d still have two, and he would have one. He is a politicking coward who cares only about his pension and cashing in on his rank after he retires. The suicidal, defeatist Rules of Engagement he oversees are the unequivocal proof of that. He should resign in disgrace – yesterday, and then present himself to each and every family of our war dead and BEG their forgiveness for failing in his duty as their son or daughter’s commanding officer.

RasThavas on January 2, 2012 at 9:47 PM

Islamic hatred for the Jewish people, as well as anybody who doesn’t fit the Islamists’ definition of a “good Muslim”, is the root cause of all the misery in the Middle East.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

FIFY.

The Egyptian people are about to find out what it’s like to be defined as “insufficiently Islamist”. Rather like the Afghani did under the Taliban.

Everybody keep in mind that when the “students” (which is what “taliban” actually means) took over after the Soviet withdrawal, they were also heralded as “secular reformers”. Right up the the time that they pulled down those statues, banned schooling for girls, and began stoning women to death just for failing to wear the hijab correctly, never mind what they did to those who didn’t wear it.

Islamists (i.e., hard-core “true believers”) statistically have killed more Muslims throughout Islam’s history than any non-Muslim entity has ever done. And they continue to do so today.

Egypt is likely to be another case in point.

clear ether

eon

eon on January 2, 2012 at 9:48 PM

could this be far behind in Egypt? ho ho oh noooooo

Santa killed by Muslim fanatics for being ‘infidel’ in Tajikistan
http://news.am/eng/news/88071.html

sadsushi on January 2, 2012 at 9:49 PM

Mohammedan morals consist in prostrate like bowing 5 times a day in the general direction of some black stone in Mecca that is suppose to have fallen down from their moon-god, Allah, and attending mosque regularly at the appointed weekly time, and in breaking the ten commandments all the balance of the week. It comes natural to them to lie and cheat and kill and enslave in the first place, and then they go on and improve on that nature until they arrive at perfection. I never did dislike anyone as much as those Muslims and especially the Arabs, and, when Israel is pushed to war with them again, I hope America and England and France will not find it good breeding nor good judgment to interfere.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on January 2, 2012 at 9:51 PM

RasThavas on January 2, 2012 at 9:47 PM

Anns lily needs no gilding.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 9:54 PM

Wow, some really great comments..

As an agnostic friend occasionally opines “Boy when I read the news, it really sounds like the back of that book.”

It looks like its getting close to being a binary choice again.

I’ll vote for reducing the population in the Middle East.

CrazyGene on January 2, 2012 at 9:57 PM

It will lose.

As we’ve seen in Gaza, and followed up elsewhere, when given elections, muslims will vote for jihad.

wildcat72 on January 2, 2012 at 10:01 PM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

They traded dictatorship for slavery, poverty, famine, war, and death. Evidently all good things in your book.

The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him

~Sahih Muslim, Book 41, Number 6985

Rebar on January 2, 2012 at 10:02 PM

I wonder if it will be realized in Egypt that the Camp David Accords meant Israel withdrawing from the Sinai and Egypt regaining sovereignty over the Sinai, and renouncing the Camp David Accords would mean, well, the opposite.

J.S.K. on January 2, 2012 at 10:05 PM

I’ll vote for reducing the population in the Middle East.

CrazyGene on January 2, 2012 at 9:57 PM

Indeed – reducing them all the way back to the slime they came from!

OldEnglish on January 2, 2012 at 10:09 PM

Can I get an Hallah Hakbar?

HornetSting

Hallah !

BoxHead1 on January 2, 2012 at 10:14 PM

Christians have a Biblical obligation to defend Israel. Never forget that.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:08 PM

You first, Brave Christian Warrior.

nice_poltergeist on January 2, 2012 at 9:35 PM

Let’s roll

Our government doesn’t endorse any nutty religious position, and has absolutely no obligation to defend Israel for purposes other than foreign policy maneuvering.

God judges the world and does things in the world based upon what is happening with His people. That’s one thing that we see over and over again in history.

Take up thy arms and hop on the first Value Jet flight out to the motherland.

Rocky Balboa vs Tommy Gunn style… lets go

God Bless!

“For Zion’s sake will I not hold my peace, and for Jerusalem’s sake I will not rest.” Isaiah 62:1

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 10:19 PM

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on January 2, 2012 at 9:41 PM

I didn’t understand a word of what you said. Are you Arab?

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 10:22 PM

FIFY

eon on January 2, 2012 at 9:48 PM

You didn’t really fix my post, but besides hating Jews, I appreciate you recognizing Muslims cannot even live in peace with their fellow Muslims anywhere in the world.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 10:28 PM

I wonder if it will be realized in Egypt that the Camp David Accords meant Israel withdrawing from the Sinai and Egypt regaining sovereignty over the Sinai, and renouncing the Camp David Accords would mean, well, the opposite.
J.S.K. on January 2, 2012 at 10:05 PM

No, they most definitely do NOT realize that. Why should they? Everything they’re talking about is perfectly in keeping with Muslim “law.”

When they say they want to invalidate the treaty, of course what they mean is they want to invalidate all the restrictions that apply to Muslims. The infidel pigdogs will still be held to every letter – plus any new requirements their Muslim overlords decide to impose from one day to the next.

This same thing has been going on for hundreds of years. Once again, when Muslims find out that Jews don’t read contracts quite the same way they do, there will be violence. And the possibility that the code of behavior specifically mandated by the Koran might be “wrong” will never occur to them.

logis on January 2, 2012 at 10:29 PM

Islamic hatred for the Jewish people is the root cause of all the misery in the Middle East.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

I disagree. If the Jews were to all disappear, some new enemy would need to be found. Hatred needs a target to focus on, and they would find a new one, it’s their nature.

iurockhead on January 2, 2012 at 10:39 PM

Voting on the Israeli treaty sounds like a good idea to me – and while they are deciding on a new peace treaty, Israel should get back the Sinai peninsula which it won during the war. Then in 15 years or so the Egyptians might just forget about the whole thing and be glad to have a thriving area across the Suez Canal that they can supply labor to.

KenInIL on January 2, 2012 at 10:42 PM

…They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood…

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Yeah, and the bonus is now they won’t have to bother with any more of those pesky election thingies… or “democratic right” thingies either.

Marcola on January 2, 2012 at 11:17 PM

…They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood…

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

^ This is why trying to install democracy in the Middle East is so frakking hopeless. They’ve no idea what to do with it besides ‘vote’ right back into what they had before.

MelonCollie on January 2, 2012 at 11:21 PM

No, they most definitely do NOT realize that. Why should they? Everything they’re talking about is perfectly in keeping with Muslim “law.”

When they say they want to invalidate the treaty, of course what they mean is they want to invalidate all the restrictions that apply to Muslims.

logis on January 2, 2012 at 10:29 PM

No doubt that’s what they’re thinking. But I wonder if the Israeli government would be able to spread the message to the Egyptian people, “We hope you vote to retain the treaty. But if you don’t, we’ll be coming back to Sinai.”

J.S.K. on January 2, 2012 at 11:35 PM

I can almost sense a strange pattern emerging?

sharrukin on January 2, 2012 at 9:25 PM

American military bases!

(do I really need the tag? :)

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 11:41 PM

Islam and democracy are incompatible. One is a doctrine that forbids the other.

That’s not my opinion; that’s the opinion of the mullahs, imams, terrorists and militiamen. And they’re absolutely right.

The only way a majority-Muslim country can interact with the world is under the boot heel of a strongman. We chased the strongmen out, for “democracy,” whatever that means.

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

Actually, it’s time for nuclear war. That’s what happens in the real world, where the US is an actual nation and not a postmodern symbol.

Egypt has a crazy, genocidal leadership. The fact that its “leadership” is now composed of tens of millions instead of one person doesn’t change the political or ethical calculus at all. At a stroke, Egypt has become worse than North Korea. Other “free” Muslim nations will follow.

HitNRun on January 2, 2012 at 11:47 PM

Holding a balloting is not “democracy”.
Democracy is entrenched institutions, a culture, real recourse to abuses by officials, rule of LAW, as opposed to rule of the jungle, and no out-of-control security services.

To all these Islamist parties, democracy is a means to an end, whereas it should be the end in itself.

To go from dictatorship to a ballot right away and to “democracy” is not going to happen. If Obama is naive enough to support the balloting in Egypt right now, what he’ll get is the same results that Bush got with the “democracy” in Gaza, which is an utterly undemocratic situation.

AlexB on January 2, 2012 at 11:49 PM

I’d add also that there is a way for an Islamic nation to become a democracy: the societal rejection of doctrinal Islam.

Tell me liberal4life, what do you think of the enslavement of 40 million women and pogroms against Jews and gays? Is that part of “democracy,” forgivable because it’s “a different culture?”

Aren’t Rick Santorum’s and Michelle Bachmann’s (relatively mild, compared to the most extreme televangelists and such) visions for America just as legitimate – a culture expressing itself through democratic institutions?

Or would you personally shed, or at least make empty noises about shedding, every drop of blood for your rights as they were taken away by “democracy?”

When the Founding Fathers wrote down their vision for “a republic, if you can keep it” – what we encapsulate as democracy – they did it in a certain societal climate. That ideal could not have been formed during the Crusades, let alone among the Muslims during the Crusades.

HitNRun on January 2, 2012 at 11:59 PM

No doubt that’s what they’re thinking. But I wonder if the Israeli government would be able to spread the message to the Egyptian people, “We hope you vote to retain the treaty. But if you don’t, we’ll be coming back to Sinai.”

J.S.K. on January 2, 2012 at 11:35 PM

if you think the shrieking, and gnashing of the teeth by the muslim world, europe, russia etc is bad now everytime Israel so much as denies a building permit to random arab squatters, imagine the frenzy that will erupt among them if Israel decides to take back the Sinai after the cancellation of the treaty, it will be an international bloodbath, “evil zionists oppress innocent children at the red sea” will be updated hourly by the BBC, guardian, the whole coast of Egypt will turn into one big gaza firing rockets daily, the only realistic solution then would be total deportation of gaza residents and sinai bedouins, and a military buffer zone in egypt run by Israel. And never give back the territory, turn it into another golan heights. But who knows, i doubt that will happen

golembythehudson on January 3, 2012 at 12:01 AM

Islamic and Islamists hatred for the Jewish people is are the root cause of all the misery in the Middle East.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

FIFY

novaculus on January 3, 2012 at 12:03 AM

I disagree. If the Jews were to all disappear, some new enemy would need to be found. Hatred needs a target to focus on, and they would find a new one, it’s their nature.

iurockhead on January 2, 2012 at 10:39 PM

You know, narrowly speaking, I’m not sure about this. I think there is something special about Jews. If you aren’t a religious type, it might have some non-spiritual basis, but it seems to exist regardless of cause. Every once in a while, throughout written history, clouds seem to gather together for a good, solid, Jew annihilating storm. It doesn’t even seem to be geographical; diaspora will do. And it’s not one Jew, or a community; it’s The Jews.

And I’ve noticed that all I have to do when I suspect a bigot is wait; no matter where they start, they invariably get there. If the man hates Leprechauns, give him a minute … he’ll get to Jews.

Axe on January 3, 2012 at 12:47 AM

And I’ve noticed that all I have to do when I suspect a bigot is wait; no matter where they start, they invariably get there. If the man hates Leprechauns, give him a minute … he’ll get to Jews.

Axe on January 3, 2012 at 12:47 AM

Ron Paul does interview with Iranian state TV, bashes Israel, defends Hamas

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1t4O9CcZQ0

Ron Paul and his viewpoint on the ” Jewish question”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O285w-9Qr0s&feature=related

golembythehudson on January 3, 2012 at 12:56 AM

Great idea. Vote down the peace treaty in a plebiscite. Then when Egypt starts another war with Israel, and Israel turns the Egyptian deserts into glass, there won’t have been any innocent civilians killed, they’ll have all declared themselves enemies of Israel and partners in war by their own free will.

Socratease on January 3, 2012 at 1:00 AM

*”irrespective” for “regardless”

Ron Paul and his viewpoint on the “Jewish question”

golembythehudson on January 3, 2012 at 12:56 AM

wow. & fify

Axe on January 3, 2012 at 1:17 AM

The people didn’t want to live under a dictatorship. They exercised their democratic right and elected Muslim brotherhood. Time for the U.S. to back OFF

liberal4life on January 2, 2012 at 9:13 PM

Let’a see!
There’s…dumb.
Then, there’s…dummer.
Then, there’s…dumbest.
Then, there’s…liberal4life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KOOLAID2 on January 3, 2012 at 1:22 AM

No, I did not spell that second one wrong….I was trying to connect to liberal4life.

KOOLAID2 on January 3, 2012 at 1:25 AM

No, I did not spell that second one wrong….I was trying to connect to liberal4life.

KOOLAID2 on January 3, 2012 at 1:25 AM

For that, you’ll need a 1200 baud modem.

OldEnglish on January 3, 2012 at 1:37 AM

OldEnglish on January 3, 2012 at 1:37 AM

RS-232 :)

Wait, no: a camp fire and a deer skin.

Axe on January 3, 2012 at 1:50 AM

Wait, no: a camp fire and a deer skin.

Axe on January 3, 2012 at 1:50 AM

Haha! But, has he mastered the art of fire?

OldEnglish on January 3, 2012 at 1:59 AM

I have something longer that I’ll try to post tomorrow, but for tonight I’ll just suffice with agreeing to most of the above and saying that no one, ever, should make up imaginary “boundaries” for radical, Brotherhood-esque Islam. It doesn’t, and never has, stopped at any particular border. If it is allowed (or encouraged, thanks Barack!) to spread, it will do so. Endlessly. It needs to be turned back at every corner and in every fight. I don’t even see how a crusade (yeah, that went well for the Jews…) gets organized at this point, with every inner-city in Europe, including Vienna, a semi-fortified Muslim stronghold. I lived in Paris recently, and yes, it’s that bad. Somebody here want to organize an Inquisition and burn all the non-Catholics? I sure don’t. So what do we do, realistically, to keep a horribly violent philosophy from taking over our future?

In purely political terms, I’m not really sure where we go from here. I’m certain that Heaven will help us if we are kind and faithful to each other. I’m also sure that giving the Brotherhood (and those more fundamentalist than them) an inch in any one of these blossoming, springtime Arab “democracies” is a great way to push along their goal of a Caliphate.

ChicagoJewishGuy on January 3, 2012 at 2:22 AM

So, I wonder if the Obamas will be now change their vacation venue from Hawaii to Egypt so they can spend it with close family?

Art on January 3, 2012 at 8:28 AM

Evidently, those Coptic Christians in Egypt have some kind of backwards, Islamophobic, religion-based prejudice against having their heads cut off. Honestly, they’re worse than those skeptical Jews. Why can’t they just support the Arab Spring? And who are they to condemn Muslim cultural activities like beheading unbelievers and smashing stuff?

morganfrost on January 3, 2012 at 8:47 AM

This is a good thing. Once people like Paul and others in this country see that the issue is that a majority of the Muslims don’t want peace, they want the Jews and Christians wiped out, we can all agree on a first step. Right now, both sides cannot even agree on what the problem is.

jeffn21 on January 3, 2012 at 9:09 AM

Says the guy to the pack of thugs about to beat him up: “Can we vote on this?”

TerryW on January 3, 2012 at 10:22 AM

Only slightly off-track:

Gaza – Libya – Syria.

Read it and weep, folks. We’re supporting the worst of the worst with tax dollars and NATO flights.

Libyan Rebel Commander Was Flotilla Terrorist
A senior anti-Qaddafi rebel commander says he was among the IHH-terrorists on the Mavi Marmara who attacked IDF navy commandos… A Spanish ABC reporter said he found Al Harati and two other rebel fighters in Syria, where they said they were helping their “Syrian revolutionary brothers.”

ChicagoJewishGuy on January 3, 2012 at 11:11 AM

Good riddance, I say. The slobbering moron “Dhimmi” Carter rammed the Camp David accords down Israel’s throat, thus not only depraving Israel of the control of the strategic buffer zone in Sinai but also committing cool five billion a year in military aid to Israel and Egypt. Take that money away ASAP! Israel will survive – in fact, some say that considering all the strings attached, Israel is much better off without – but Egypt will crash like a party hooker who accidentally washed her last snort down the toilet. And for God’s sake, stop sending them any form of humanitarian aid. The word “humanitarian” comes from “human”, and there are precious few of those in Egypt.

Archivarix on January 3, 2012 at 11:41 AM

Christians have a Biblical obligation to defend Israel. Never forget that.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012

Oh?
So, we should allow Bible-thumping to trump human rights?
Ø
What did Jews do the defend Jesus Christ? Or their lands that the Crusaders were forced to keep open?
Ø
Israel has enough will and ordnance to defend themselves.
That’s a fact, jack.

~(Ä)~

Karl Magnus on January 3, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Christians have a Biblical obligation to defend Israel. Never forget that. apocalypse on January 2, 2012

Israel has a right to exist, should be defended, Jewish homeland is good etc, but there is no biblical justification for what you said. None.

Galatians 6:15-16, “For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.”

The apostle says that circumcision is meaningless this side of the resurrection. It is rebirth that matters. (See Ro. 2:28-29.) And those who agree with this are the blessed Israel of God: the Church.

If circumcision is a moot issue to the apostle, and no one (male) can be considered a Jew without it, what obligation are you talking about?

There are humanitarian and political reasons to defend the modern nation of Israel, but there is nothing in Holy Scripture that makes it an obligation of Christians.

Israel has enough will and ordnance to defend themselves.
That’s a fact, jack. Karl Magnus on January 3, 2012 at 12:05 PM

Indeed.

Akzed on January 3, 2012 at 1:42 PM

I was shocked when I found out that America was giving foreign aid to Israel’s enemies (including Egypt.) In effect, underwriting their armies in exchange for their promise to stop trying to obliterate Israel.

Has Obama even HINTED that the blood money might stop being paid if the treaty is cancelled? Somehow I doubt it.

logis on January 3, 2012 at 2:18 PM

Islamic hatred for the Jewish people is the root cause of all the misery in the Middle East.

apocalypse on January 2, 2012 at 9:06 PM

FIFY

Muslims suicide bomb each other, too. It is a religion of hate. They hate Jews, Christians, and other Muslims. If Israel did not exist, there still wouldn’t be peace in the middle east. If, on the other hand, there were no Muslims, I think there could be peace in the middle east.

This is not to say that all Muslims are evil. Unfortunately, there appears to exist a sufficient minority of violent, hate-filled Muslims that they have corrupted the entire region (and religion).

talkingpoints on January 3, 2012 at 2:35 PM

“The Israeli-Palestinian conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel.”

Why then is the US the Great Satan and Israel only the little Satan? Maybe they hate Israel because Israel supports the US.

davod on January 3, 2012 at 7:26 PM

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