Is it possible to ruin “Imagine”?

posted at 1:25 pm on January 2, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

I have never understood the affection for “Imagine,” John Lennon’s least-imaginative pop hit.  The music is dull and dreary, the lyrics a paean to an utterly childish Utopianism, and practically a prescription for surrender.  At least “Power to the People” imagined that people could change the world.  The ballad that many consider to be Lennon’s best work in his career did nothing but dream that all dissent and individual perspective would drain magically from the human race so that we could all live in peace, or perhaps a boredom-induced stupor.  It’s existential nonsense to which it’s not even terribly pleasant to listen, let alone contemplate.

I accept that I’m firmly in the minority on this point, which was driven home when a performer had the gall to adjust one line in the song to fit his own personal childish Utopianism on New Years Eve, and get castigated for a kind of secular heresy:

Cee Lo Green upset John Lennon fans on Saturday night by performing a soulful version of the songwriter’s classic “Imagine” with the lyrics changed from “nothing to kill or die for / and no religion too” to “nothing to kill or die for / and all religion’s true.” According to some fans, Green changed the meaning of the song by switching out the line. “The whole point of that lyric is that religion causes harm,” tweeted someone with the handle @geekysteven. “If ‘all religion’s true’ it would be a pretty bleak place.”

No more so than imagining no heaven, I’d argue.  Frankly, if I liked the original, I’d be more irritated with Cee-Lo’s vocal rendition than with the change of lyrics.  There’s a certain amount of irony, as one atheist wrote, in Cee-Lo’s presentation, too:

Cee-Lo Green claims that he was merely attempting to be tolerant and inclusive, but his alteration is anything but tolerant and inclusive and it is also nonsensical (especially since he sung the part about no Hell below us and above us only sky). But what can we expect from someone who sings, “Imagine no possessions” while wearing a fur coat.

As a matter of fact, all religions believe that they are in possession of “the Truth” and yet none have presented any valid evidence for their claims. Most religions conflict with each other at the core and their value on faith rather than evidence leaves believers with no independent way of judging which religion(s) if any is actually true. The only way to settle the matter is often through violence and a quick history of religion supports this very problem. John Lennon understood that and that was one of the main themes of the song.

Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either; it’s a belief in no God at all.  The only approach based on objective proof would be agnosticism, not atheism.  As for religions causing violence, perhaps the author in this case should familiarize himself with the histories of the explicitly atheist communist nations in the 20th century for a better understanding that violence comes from human nature, not religious belief.

Besides, remakes don’t ruin songs.  Anyone who wants to hear the original recording of “Imagine” can, unfortunately, hear it just about everywhere on the radio, as well as buy a copy for replay at any time.  I’ll just keep changing the channel when it starts playing on my stereo.

What do you think of “Imagine”? Take the poll:

Update: From the comments, what do you get when you cross the instrumental from “Imagine” and the vocals from Van Halen’s “Jump”? A much duller version of “Jump,” really:


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OWSers on display?

Imagine there’s no grav-i-ty…

petefrt on January 2, 2012 at 2:23 PM

I don’t like this song, but I’ve always assumed people like it better if they’re stoned.

Little Boomer on January 2, 2012 at 2:23 PM

It’s funny . . . as our world has progressed in so many ways (even with the downturn of the last five years): technology, healthcare, air travel safety, etc., the arts–music, film, theater–have gone backwards. Musicians, singers, actors, writers, all of them were better 20, 30 years ago than they are now.

Govicide on January 2, 2012 at 2:24 PM

I never understood ppl who get so into a singer or song that they’ll argue with other ppl who don’t like or care about it or them. I like country and have never got how ppl will say it sucks, but they’ve never listened to it. It just a song, get over it.

angrymike on January 2, 2012 at 2:24 PM

The only people I’ve ever met that like “Imagine” still smoke pot in their 30′s, live in their parents basement, and drone on about “social justice” their Sociology professor dupped them into….. So I’m guessing its the song of choice at Media Matters HQ.

bigrichard.small on January 2, 2012 at 2:18 PM

I like the song but only fit under one of those (I’m in my 30s). I’m a home owner, I don’t smoke pot and will not allow it in my house, I roll my eyes most of the time when someone mentions “social justice” and I never took a sociology course.

DethMetalCookieMonst on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

The stupidest Imagine moment ever was when they had Yoko sing it at the winter Olympics opening ceremony. Imagine there’s no countries, right there at the parade of nations.

It’s a profoundly stupid song.

MayBee on January 2, 2012 at 1:38 PM

Yes, that was stupid, but I think the stupidest is the video shows Lennon and Ono running through the woods next to their mansion in England

Imagine no possessions, indeed.

sockpuppetpolitic on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

Hindus generally believe All Paths lead to the Mountaintop.

Dandapani on January 2, 2012 at 1:47 PM

Then how do you get back down the mountain?

Goldenavatar on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

If there’s nothing worth dying for, there’s nothing worth living for, religion or not.

And there’s nothing wrong with nations at their best. The variety of humanity – clothing, customs, food, etc. – is wonderful.

Mommynator on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

I loved it in college in the 70′s but then grew up and got real. This became the unreal part:

“did nothing but dream that all dissent and individual perspective would drain magically from the human race so that we could all live in peace”

The trouble with this is you just can’t trust everyone to do it. Someone WILL break the chain.

Mr_Magoo on January 2, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Then how do you get back down the mountain?

Goldenavatar on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

Walk backwards:-/

DethMetalCookieMonst on January 2, 2012 at 2:27 PM

If “dreck” means “crap”, then no, Captain, you’re not alone in this. Irrational, unthinking, leftist pablum.

Squiggy on January 2, 2012 at 2:27 PM

Del Dolemonte on January 2, 2012 at 2:12 PM

Sorry, I’m not and never have been a Beatles fan. I jumped right from old Blues and Jazz right into heavy rock. Right from John Lee Hooker right into Jimi, Tull and then into Zeppelin…..and again, my opinions are just my opinions

Vntnrse on January 2, 2012 at 2:29 PM

I don’t know who this Green guy is, but I do know that he can’t sing (if that is what he’s trying to do) – - – SO, he changed the lyrics to a sappy old Lennon song – who cares? When a non-singer with as little talent as this guy sings a song, any song – the song is ruined, regardless of whether the lyrics are changed or not.

Pork-Chop on January 2, 2012 at 2:30 PM

All religions cannot be simultaneously true, obviously.
Since the Lord Jesus Christ claimed to be the only way to eternal life & redemption, & he called other paths wrong, then other paths cannot be right, if he is right.
Either Jesus Christ is wrong or others are wrong.

itsnotaboutme on January 2, 2012 at 1:47 PM

In an abstract sense it is possible to see the common purposes that different religions fill. Christ could have been wrong, or quoted wrong, on some points but Christianity still be an important part of a higher purpose. Off course that view would upset the religion business–which would be OK with Lennon and maybe with Cee Lo. Christ, too, battled the professional religious types of his time and elevated love over adherence to a legal system of observance.

OptionsTrader on January 2, 2012 at 2:31 PM

As a matter of fact, all religions believe that they are in possession of “the Truth” and yet none have presented any valid evidence for their claims.

Not exactly. One religious leader claimed not only to “have” the truth, but to “be” the truth:

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

John 14:6

He then went on to prove his claim with his resurrection from the dead. No other religious leader has resurrected from the dead.

ITguy on January 2, 2012 at 2:31 PM

Imagine there no druggies with their bloodshot eyes
No lamestream media to disseminate your insipid lies
Imagine no child-rapists directing movies too.
No Occupy Wall Streeters trampling through their own poo.
Imagine all you losers showed up on time for work…

You may think that I’m a winner but I’m not the only one.
Some day you’ll all join us and the World will live as one.

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 2:31 PM

Thank God they broke up before it became a Beatles song!

Personally, my favorite Lennon ballad is “If I Fell”, a gorgeous, jazzy, Brill Building influenced masterpiece with stunning chord changes. Unfortunately, once he became an acid head, he lost interest in writing in his early style. He still wrote great stuff right up until Abbey Road, but I love the early stuff the best….”No Reply”, “This Boy”, “I Call Your Name”, etc.

The funny thing is that Yoko doesn’t acknowledge that period of his work at all, because he wasn’t a part of her life at that point, and he was also a proud male chauvinist who hadn’t yet been corrupted by pretentious art and Marxist rhetoric.

ardenenoch on January 2, 2012 at 2:36 PM

Vntnrse on January 2, 2012 at 2:29 PM

So this will probably cause you pain then.

heh. sry.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 2:36 PM

The Beatles are the most over-rated band ever. Most of their stuff, and subsequent post-Beatles music, is absolute dreck. They were a bar band who Brian Epstein and George Martin moulded into the “cute” mop-top boys wearing silly suits, and sold to the public as the greatest thing ever. They weren’t. Best British bands of the ’60′s were The Kinks, The Stones, The Who, The Hollies…Beatles weren’t even close to being in the same class musically.

Trafalgar on January 2, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Walk backwards:-/

DethMetalCookieMonst on January 2, 2012 at 2:27 PM

Brilliant :)

PS: Is a death metal cookie monster silver? Or black? I see silver sometimes. Sometimes black.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Imagine there no druggies with their bloodshot eyes
No lamestream media to disseminate your insipid lies
Imagine no child-rapists directing movies too.
No Occupy Wall Streeters trampling through their own poo.
Imagine all you losers showed up on time for work…

You may think that I’m a winner but I’m not the only one.
Some day you’ll all join us and the World will live as one.

Capitalist Hog

That brought a tear to my eye.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 2:40 PM

Then how do you get back down the mountain?

Goldenavatar on January 2, 2012 at 2:25 PM

You take a leap of faith.

BL@KBIRD on January 2, 2012 at 2:41 PM

So this will probably cause you pain then.

heh. sry.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 2:36 PM

Hahaha!!! No, as soon as I saw “Jessica Simpson”, I turned down the volume! Good try though!!! Lol!!! Good try!!! :)

Vntnrse on January 2, 2012 at 2:41 PM

I don’t know who this Green guy is, but I do know that he can’t sing (if that is what he’s trying to do) – – – SO, he changed the lyrics to a sappy old Lennon song – who cares? When a non-singer with as little talent as this guy sings a song, any song – the song is ruined, regardless of whether the lyrics are changed or not.

Pork-Chop on January 2, 2012 at 2:30 PM

You only write the second part of your statement because of the first part.

Cee Lo is pretty amazing.

Abby Adams on January 2, 2012 at 2:42 PM

As far as liking or not liking the Beatles, I liked some of their work, such as their Rubber Soul album and some of the White Album.

In fact, I just downloaded Rubber Soul the other day. Part of it was for nostalgia as I remembered riding around our small Connecticut town as a teenager – in my 65 Mustang playing my 8-track tape – lamenting over lost or unrequited loves. What triggered that was listening to the catchy tunes from the smash single Stars on 45. Hey we all have our weaknesses!

Mr_Magoo on January 2, 2012 at 2:43 PM

Most of you are discussing the religious commentary the song makes, when really that is the least offensive part of the song.

It is not at all a stretch to call it a leftist manifesto. The fact that it is celebrated should be anathema to any conservative.

jjraines on January 2, 2012 at 2:43 PM

I accept that I’m firmly in the minority on this point

Maybe among people from your generation. It’s hard to find anyone under 30 who cares about Lenon or the Beatles. And rightfully so, they’re the most overrated band of all time.

Go RBNY on January 2, 2012 at 2:44 PM

He then went on to prove his claim with his resurrection from the dead. No other religious leader has resurrected from the dead.

ITguy on January 2, 2012 at 2:31 PM

Well the next time I hear the old slave spiritual “Were You There?” I’ll be sure to respond, “well no, but ITguy from Hot Air was!”

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 2:44 PM

Thank God they broke up before it became a Beatles song!
.

ardenenoch on January 2, 2012 at 2:36 PM

There is a school of thought that holds that most post-Beatles music was mediocre at best is that the only person in the worlf whol could tell John Lennon that something sucked was Paul McCartney, and vice versa.

I’d like to think Paul would have told John that imagine didn’t make the cut.

urban elitist on January 2, 2012 at 2:45 PM

Best version of “Imagine” ever.

PatriotGal2257 on January 2, 2012 at 2:47 PM

Beatles weren’t even close to being in the same class musically.

Trafalgar on January 2, 2012 at 2:39 PM

Is this where you got that line?

hoofhearted on January 2, 2012 at 2:50 PM

PS: Is a death metal cookie monster silver? Or black? I see silver sometimes. Sometimes black.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 2:39 PM

It’s blacker then the blackest black x infiniti.

DethMetalCookieMonst on January 2, 2012 at 2:50 PM

Ok, that Jump/Imagine thing was humorous, to be sure.

Midas on January 2, 2012 at 2:51 PM

Green’s take was better. Another distraction for us plebs, so they don’t cover real news we truly need to know.

Mutnodjmet on January 2, 2012 at 2:52 PM

Imagine there’s no farting
What would comedians do?
No children pulling fingers
No smelling like a zoo…

radjah shelduck on January 2, 2012 at 2:52 PM

I liked Imagine when I was young and didn’t know any better.

I heard that Sat. night and do not want to hear it again. Was that a Dean Martin 5 martini song?

He should never sing that again!

TfromV on January 2, 2012 at 2:52 PM

I have never understood the affection for “Imagine,” John Lennon’s least-imaginative pop hit. The music is dull and dreary, the lyrics a paean to an utterly childish Utopianism, and practically a prescription for surrender. At least “Power to the People” imagined that people could change the world. The ballad that many consider to be Lennon’s best work in his career did nothing but dream that all dissent and individual perspective would drain magically from the human race so that we could all live in peace, or perhaps a boredom-induced stupor. It’s existential nonsense to which it’s not even terribly pleasant to listen, let alone contemplate.

Ed,

This is a truly excellent post. “imagine” appealed to me when I was in high school. However, once you grow, you really ought to see these lyrics for the nihilistic tripe that they are. Lennon wants us to imagine a world without love, without anything worth living for, or anything to believe in. No, thank you. It’s hard to figure how grownups can’t see this for the nonsense that it is…

ghostwriter on January 2, 2012 at 2:53 PM

It’s blacker then the blackest black x infiniti.

DethMetalCookieMonst on January 2, 2012 at 2:50 PM

Of course. Duh. :) Overlook me awhile, overlook me. Coolness can regenerate, given time.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 2:56 PM

The song sounds suicidal, lamenting everything that is part of life. The ultimate answer to it is the movie “Serenity” in which we see what a world without struggle would look like.

flataffect on January 2, 2012 at 2:56 PM

Imagine there’s no farting
What would comedians do?
No children pulling fingers
No smelling like a zoo…

radjah shelduck on January 2, 2012 at 2:52 PM

It would also render my HA handle meaningless.

hoofhearted on January 2, 2012 at 2:58 PM

Doesn’t matter if Cee Lo Green ruined the song. It was already ruined.

gyrmnix on January 2, 2012 at 3:01 PM

The song sounds suicidal, lamenting everything that is part of life. The ultimate answer to it is the movie “Serenity” in which we see what a world without struggle would look like.

flataffect on January 2, 2012 at 2:56 PM

I thought of Serenity too.

The ballad that many consider to be Lennon’s best work in his career did nothing but dream that all dissent and individual perspective would drain magically from the human race so that we could all live in peace, or perhaps a boredom-induced stupor.

… reminded me of Mal:

“A year from now, ten, they’ll swing back to the belief that they can make people… better. And I do not hold to that.”

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 3:02 PM

This from a rap thug that uses FU in his songs.
Talent, on loan from Stupid.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:02 PM

Man. Is Ce Lo in for a surprise.

kingsjester on January 2, 2012 at 3:03 PM

Imagine, just how much I don’t care about John Lennon or Cee Lo Green.

Wallythedog on January 2, 2012 at 3:03 PM

I never liked that song. Some of the Beatles songs were great some not so much. Lennons solo stuff I could leave at the curb. I blame Yoko. My musical likes run the gauntlet from country, southern rock, classic rock to heavy metal and on and on. Didn’t I read somewhere later in his life Lennon became a republican?

D-fusit on January 2, 2012 at 3:09 PM

Ok, that Jump/Imagine thing was humorous, to be sure.
Midas on January 2, 2012 at 2:51 PM

I didn’t get it. Waste of time making it and watching it, IMHO.

Mr_Magoo on January 2, 2012 at 3:10 PM

Imagine is one of the worst songs ever written (lyrically) but it’s a catchy tune – like the equally horrible, “I’ve Been Watching You” by the Police.

Ironically (and “depressingly”), I went to a New Year’s Eve party where very, very religious/Christian conservatives performed and I was stunned to see/hear them choose to sing the gawdawful “Imagine” as it’s just so very contradictory to what they very openly profess.

Buy Danish on January 2, 2012 at 3:12 PM

Oh, and BTW Celo Green’s biggest hit is”Forget You” but not forget, but another F word that will bring out the ban hammer. Google it if you dare. 2 different versions.

D-fusit on January 2, 2012 at 3:13 PM

The song sounds suicidal, lamenting everything that is part of life. The ultimate answer to it is the movie “Serenity” in which we see what a world without struggle would look like.

flataffect on January 2, 2012 at 2:56 PM

If a liberal (or other marxist minded individual) creates artificial intelligence we are all doomed. The somewhat brilliant, but socially inept and clueless of human nature liberal will ask his creation to solve all the worlds problems. The inputs from this good intentioned liberal will lead the artificial intelligence to only one possible conclusion: To achieve the nirvanic goals of his creator humanity must be destroyed, for human nature will not allow humanity to exist in a leftists idea of utopia.

AI is probably many decades or centuries away if ever. But God help us is this well meaning liberal gives his creation the tools to “fix” society.

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:14 PM

Never liked the song.

Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either; it’s a belief in no God at all. The only approach based on objective proof would be agnosticism, not atheism.

Actually, that isn’t true.

There are several kinds of atheists but you really mangled the basic definition here Ed. Agnostics can be atheists or believers. You say an atheist is a belief in no God. I think that is wrong. I would say (per the gk. root), atheism is the lack of belief in gods. It is simply the lack of belief. Atheism is not faith based.

lexhamfox on January 2, 2012 at 3:14 PM

This from a rap thug that uses FU in his songs.
Talent, on loan from Stupid.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:02 PM

I don’t consider F*** You rap music at all. I think it was a long overdue anthem and rather catchy. Have you listened to the lyrics? Never felt that way? Just imagine the girl in the song is America and her new beau is OWS. That might help move the metaphor along.

Aside from that, I think large men should not ever, ever, ever, ever wear glitter.

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM

lexhamfox on January 2, 2012 at 3:14 PM

Believing in God has nothing to do with faith in general. Not all religions in our history have or had a god. Atheists have faith in there being no god. Most Atheists do not argue that there is no proof for a god; they actively argue against there being a god.

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM

FU is better than Imagine. It’s decidedly tongue-in-cheek. Imagine is overwrought with meaning. Blechh!

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 3:19 PM

C-Lo singing “Imagine” was just the capstone of a “New Year’s Rockin’ Eve” that managed to p!ss off anyone to the right of Michael Moore.

First Michael Bloomberg’s touted of gay marriage, then Ryan Seacrest’s mentioned the Occupoopers in glowing terms, and then “Imagine” instead of “Auld Lang Syne”.

Sorry, NBC, I can have the hard left push their agenda on me 364 other days a year. I don’t need to start off the New Year with that.

Thanks for the memories, Dick Clark. I won’t be watching your show next year.

ExUrbanKevin on January 2, 2012 at 1:39 PM

Dick Clark and Ryan “Lil’ Buddy” Seacrest were on ABC.

NBC had “Carson’s Countdown” with Carson Daly and Cee Lo, both of whom are a part of “The Voice,” which is heavily hyped along all Comcast-NBC-Universal properties. (I’m actually surprised Christina Agualiria didn’t perform!)

IIRC, BOTH networks were guilty of showing Mike Bloomburg’s midnight embrace of Stefani Germanotta.

Myron Falwell on January 2, 2012 at 3:19 PM

This from a rap thug that uses FU in his songs.
Talent, on loan from Stupid.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:02 PM

Look if you don’t know anything about a particular genre of music its just best not to say anything at all. Cee-Lo Green is by no means a “thug” rapper nor is F*ck You his first song or first mainstream hit. He is also the major force behind Gnarls Barkely the group that gave us Crazy, one of the biggest hits of the last decade. Remember?

But before that Cee-Lo produced two excellent, independent hip hop/funk albums that merged hip hop styles with the best of 70s funk, expand your mind. But then again, this is a thread about people who had a fit over one line change in an overrated former Beatle song so there’s that.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:19 PM

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM

Kini’s response isn’t about the actual song, or Cee Lo’s actual musical production its his about his belief that all black men are thugs.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:22 PM

Oh, and BTW Celo Green’s biggest hit is”Forget You” but not forget, but another F word that will bring out the ban hammer. Google it if you dare. 2 different versions.

D-fusit on January 2, 2012 at 3:13 PM

This is actually Cee Lo’s biggest hit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd2B6SjMh_w&ob=av2e

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:23 PM

Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either; it’s a belief in no God at all. The only approach based on objective proof would be agnosticism, not atheism.

Atheism doesn’t have to prove anything, absence of fact is all the proof one needs. I no more have to PROVE there are no unicorns or dragons in the world either.

So please tell me, are there unicorns? And don’t say “I don’t know”, that would be ridiculous.

Your argument is the classic theist “gotcha” but is childish in its concept.

BierManVA on January 2, 2012 at 3:24 PM

True story.

I saw the raw feed of Cee Lo’s performance on a livestream feed at a NYE party hosted by a good friend of mind. None of us knew who was singing “Imagine” (there were no identifying graphics or L3s on the feed)… I thought it was Ruben Studdard.

None of us cared for the song in the first place, and were more anticipating the countdown to midnight. The lyric change was totally incidental and otherwise ignored.

And we also thought it was Dick Clark who was kissing Lady Gaga… not Bloomburg.

Myron Falwell on January 2, 2012 at 3:25 PM

Is it wrong to feel a warm fuzzy affection for all you strangers who hate that song as much as I do?

Like so many of today’s experiences, Imagine is content-free.

SomeCallMeJohn on January 2, 2012 at 3:26 PM

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM
libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:19 PM

This is not music. It is pornography disguised a music.
Talentless idiots like this boob use such language because they cannot get attention beyond their nursery rhyming vulgarity.

You want kids listening to this cRAP crap? Way to coarsen civility and art, for trash.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:26 PM

Well the next time I hear the old slave spiritual “Were You There?” I’ll be sure to respond, “well no, but ITguy from Hot Air was!”

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 2:44 PM

perfect response.

svs22422 on January 2, 2012 at 3:27 PM

Dreadful song… Hate it

Neomom on January 2, 2012 at 3:29 PM

Atheists have faith in there being no god. Most Atheists do not argue that there is no proof for a god; they actively argue against there being a god.

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM

Do have faith in Santa Clause? Do you think Santa Clause exists? If you think there is no Santa Clause is that based on a kind of faith? Can you prove there is no Santa Clause?

lexhamfox on January 2, 2012 at 3:32 PM

BierManVA on January 2, 2012 at 3:24 PM

Let’s look at your unicorn argument another way. Let’s say someone has a belief that unicorns exist. Let’s say you don’t believe they exist. Do you ignore the possibility because of lack of evidence and give it no further thought? Or do you actively try to convince the person who does believe in unicorns that unicorns do not exist?

Personally I don’t believe in ghosts, but i don’t waste any of my time trying to convince others to see things my way either. However, far too many Atheists feel they have to convince believers of the rightness of their belief. Once someone crosses that line they certainly have a faith and are most likely practicing a religion. Atheists can’t have it both ways and still claim to have no faith.

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:34 PM

Is it possible to ruin “Imagine”?

Is it possible to hysterically over-react to an utterly ephemeral pop culture moment?
Is it possible to feel the need to stamp one’s feet and denounce a silly song because it apparently shakes one’s loudly self-proclaimed rock-solid faith?
Is it possible to paint all non-believers as uniformly monolithic with the same broad, bigoted brush-stroke that the need-to-be-seen-as-a-tortured-yet-virtuous-martyr Christians will protest at the drop of a palm frond?

Why yes, yes it is.

M240H on January 2, 2012 at 3:34 PM

My ears burnt out about the time of (but not because of) the White Album, so it’s all mox nix to me.

CC Senor on January 2, 2012 at 3:34 PM

Do have faith in Santa Clause? Do you think Santa Clause exists? If you think there is no Santa Clause is that based on a kind of faith? Can you prove there is no Santa Clause?

lexhamfox on January 2, 2012 at 3:32 PM

You doubt Santa Claus exists? For shame…

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:35 PM

Atheism doesn’t have to prove anything, absence of fact is all the proof one needs. I no more have to PROVE there are no unicorns or dragons in the world either.

So please tell me, are there unicorns? And don’t say “I don’t know”, that would be ridiculous.

Your argument is the classic theist “gotcha” but is childish in its concept.

BierManVA

Ummmm, it’s been proven there aren’t.
There is no proof either way that God does or does not exist.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 3:36 PM

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 3:36 PM

It has never been proven that there are no unicorns.

NotCoach on January 2, 2012 at 3:37 PM

When I was a young Liberal on booze and drugs I used to idolize John Lennon and Jim Morrison, until I read enough to learn that they were both flaming @ssholes. For the redcord, I can’t stand the song. Anything Cee-Lo added or removed could only improve it.
Still love Jimi Hendrix…

Dork B. on January 2, 2012 at 3:37 PM

It has never been proven that there are no unicorns.

NotCoach

We would have to agree to disagree.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 3:39 PM

A stoner song for sure. I would have to be in a qualuude induced stupor for it to be appreciated.

jake49 on January 2, 2012 at 3:41 PM

Imagine, just how much I don’t care about John Lennon or Cee Lo Green.

Wallythedog on January 2, 2012 at 3:03 PM

FTW! And I AM a Beatles fan. John always annoyed the h*ll out of me. He’s right up there with Bono’s ego too.

lucyvanpelt on January 2, 2012 at 3:41 PM

Nihilism in song form.

AbaddonsReign on January 2, 2012 at 3:42 PM

CC Seno

r on January 2, 2012 at 3:34 PM

Sorry for that, CC Senor.

But you really haven’t missed much, not along these lines anyway.

Axe on January 2, 2012 at 3:43 PM

Update: From the comments, what do you get when you cross the instrumental from “Imagine” and the vocals from Van Halen’s “Jump”? A much duller version of “Jump,” really

Silly Hotgas commenters.

If you are ever going to do something to a Van Halen vocal track the best thing to do is to leave it alone. Mixing Jump and Imagine make Jump duller, leaving the vocal track for “Running with the Devil” by itself makes it hilarious.

LevStrauss on January 2, 2012 at 3:43 PM

Who…?

Seven Percent Solution on January 2, 2012 at 3:43 PM

Way to coarsen civility and art, for trash.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:26 PM

They said the same thing about Stravinsky, Gounod and Mozart in their days. I still say that Entführung aus dem Serail is a great vorspiel with music no matter what those conservative critics say.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:44 PM

It has never been proven that there are no unicorns.

NotCoach

We would have to agree to disagree.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 3:39 PM

Then what do we call Ryan Seacrest?

Myron Falwell on January 2, 2012 at 3:45 PM

Musically, “Imagine” is quite pretty.
The lyrics, though, are pure communist agit-prop.

Count to 10 on January 2, 2012 at 3:49 PM

Worst composition ever by the most overrated ex-Beatle. His work with The Beatles was clever, witty and ground breaking, while his solo catalog was mostly boring and forgettable, of which “Imagine” was the worst example.

holygoat on January 2, 2012 at 3:53 PM

Musically, “Imagine” is quite pretty.

Is it? Its OK, I suppose. But I’d rather listen to the Doors or Pink Floyd whose drug use/experience of close friends going through clinical depression produced music with a lot more substance than Imagine. But I’m also in the camp that is sort of over the Beatles love.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:54 PM

Musically, “Imagine” is quite pretty.
The lyrics, though, are pure communist agit-prop.

Count to 10 on January 2, 2012 at 3:49 PM

Yep, I can’t stand it, but I would be that Toby Keith would rework the lyrics into something you could drink to while poking fun of commie regressive litards. :)

Robert Jensen on January 2, 2012 at 3:57 PM

Kini’s response isn’t about the actual song, or Cee Lo’s actual musical production its his about his belief that all black men are thugs.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:22 PM

That’s a horrible thing to say about someone. I think you’re courageous from behind the keyboard. I doubt you’d make such vicious, insulting remarks in person or without the cloak of anonymity.

You’re pathetic.

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 3:58 PM

Ummmm, it’s been proven there aren’t.
There is no proof either way that God does or does not exist.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 3:36 PM

Oh, really? So how are we able to “prove” there are no unicorns but not prove there is no god? Hmmm? Please explain that to me.

You can’t have it both ways. Either there is a god AND unicorns, or there is no god AND no unicorns. There is the same amount of proof for both (or lack thereof).

No one I know believes in unicorns. Why? I wold assume because they have never seen on. Sure, there are plenty of books written about them. Even paintings, etc to look at. But even children know that there are no such thing as a unicorn.

In science, the lack of a physical observation is enough proof that something is not present. For example, “no reading for helium in my air sample? No helium exists.” Would you tell the scientist he has not “proved” there is no helium? Of course you wouldn’t.

This is what my original discussion point means with regards to “Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either.”

BierManVA on January 2, 2012 at 4:05 PM

When you break the word down, it’s not a(the-ism): “absence of god-belief” but (a-the)ism : “absence of gods, belief about”. If it were semantically grouped as the first, it wouldn’t be the “ism” part that gets changed — as it is to “ist” when speaking of the (a-the)ist: “absence of gods, believer about”.

And one may not believe in unicorns anymore, but at one time “black swan” was a phrase that meant an impossibility, because everyone speaking English KNEW there was no such thing. Then Australia was “discovered”….

The human race is still finding out things about the universe, and those discoveries often overturn the previous conventional science. As long as that happens, the jury’s still out about God, in my opinion.

sistrum on January 2, 2012 at 4:05 PM

Then what do we call Ryan Seacrest?

Myron Falwell

The son of Satan?

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 4:05 PM

They said the same thing about Stravinsky, Gounod and Mozart in their days. I still say that Entführung aus dem Serail is a great vorspiel with music no matter what those conservative critics say.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:44 PM

That’s a stretch of the truth and history.
Where did these artists use vulgarity in their composition’s.

And calling me a bigot for point out vulgarity show remarkable ignorance on your part. I put all cRAP music in the same category, crap. Vulgarity, misogynistic and droning nursery rhymes.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 4:07 PM

That song sucks so bad, it can even make Cee Lo boring.

forest on January 2, 2012 at 4:07 PM

sistrum on January 2, 2012 at 4:05 PM

Black Swan never referred to the impossible. It referred to something rare.

lexhamfox on January 2, 2012 at 4:10 PM

They said the same thing about Stravinsky, Gounod and Mozart in their days. I still say that Entführung aus dem Serail is a great vorspiel with music no matter what those conservative critics say.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:44 PM

Art is always in the “eye of the beholder” isn’t it? Personally, I think modern art and it’s million dollar prices are comical and outrageous. Especially when my tax dollars go to support them.

BTW, thumbs up on Mozart.

BierManVA on January 2, 2012 at 4:10 PM

Oh, really? So how are we able to “prove” there are no unicorns but not prove there is no god? Hmmm? Please explain that to me.

You can’t have it both ways. Either there is a god AND unicorns, or there is no god AND no unicorns. There is the same amount of proof for both (or lack thereof).

No one I know believes in unicorns. Why? I wold assume because they have never seen on. Sure, there are plenty of books written about them. Even paintings, etc to look at. But even children know that there are no such thing as a unicorn.

In science, the lack of a physical observation is enough proof that something is not present. For example, “no reading for helium in my air sample? No helium exists.” Would you tell the scientist he has not “proved” there is no helium? Of course you wouldn’t.

This is what my original discussion point means with regards to “Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either.”

BierManVA on January 2, 2012

It sounds like we are talking past each other then. As an agnostic I am not convinced God does or does not exist.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 4:10 PM

Well, atheism hasn’t proven itself either; it’s a belief in no God at all. The only approach based on objective proof would be agnosticism, not atheism.

Well Ed, the onus isn’t on atheists to prove a negative: it’s like asking someone to prove that invisible unicorns don’t exist or that the tooth fairy doesn’t exist. Indeed, theists are the ones who have something to prove. And agnostics? They are just intellectually lazy. What good does it do to just say that there is no way to truthfully know if unicorns exist or not?

mazer9 on January 2, 2012 at 4:10 PM

You want kids listening to this cRAP crap? Way to coarsen civility and art, for trash.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 3:26 PM

I don’t live my life for your kids. (I’m slightly suspicious of people who can’t seem to think of anything else.)

Adult entertainment is for adults. Do you limit your viewing/listening content to that of the Disney Channel? Lawrence Welk, perhaps? You make the I Love Lucy choco-factory reference all the more relevant.

Your life sounds absurd and just a little boring.

Thanks for your input. You and libtardordie occupy opposite ends of stupid. You’ll meet soon.

Capitalist Hog on January 2, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Kini’s response isn’t about the actual song, or Cee Lo’s actual musical production its his about his belief that all black men are thugs.

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 3:22 PM

What’s the difference between Eminem and this clown?
Nothing, but they both share your lack of education and skills to make anything of your life beyond the fry station.

Capitalist Hog is right, you are pathetic and ignorant.

Kini on January 2, 2012 at 4:11 PM

BTW BierManVA, I take your post to me to mean that there is no Helium in the sample, but it is not proof there is no Helium anywhere in existence.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 4:11 PM

Well the next time I hear the old slave spiritual “Were You There?” I’ll be sure to respond, “well no, but ITguy from Hot Air was!”

libfreeordie on January 2, 2012 at 2:44 PM

No, I wasn’t there. But if you use the same logic and procedures as used in a court of law, the verdict is that yes, Jesus was crucified and rose from the dead.

If you have the intellectual integrity to do so, I challenge you to read The Case for Christ, written by the former legal editor of the Chicago Tribune.

ITguy on January 2, 2012 at 4:12 PM

It sounds like we are talking past each other then. As an agnostic I am not convinced God does or does not exist.

Hard Right on January 2, 2012 at 4:10 PM

I agree with you. But it sounded like you said there is proof of no unicorns. Seems to me you should say “There might be unicorns” as the proof is the same as in a deity.

BierManVA on January 2, 2012 at 4:12 PM

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