Karl Rove: The House GOP should cave on the payroll-tax holiday

posted at 8:40 pm on December 21, 2011 by Allahpundit

Via TPM, in case the prospect of caving wasn’t already unpalatable to Boehner, knowing that the base will scream at him in the aftermath that he’s done Rove’s bidding should do the trick. I think they’re going to end up taking his advice, though — sticking on principle for another week, then grudgingly passing the Senate bill and holding an all-hands-on-deck presser to unload on Obama and Reid for preferring crappy stopgap tax measures to long-term solutions. If nothing else, that presser would give Boehner et al. the chance to tout themselves as the saviors of the payroll-tax holiday at a moment when there’ll be nothing else going on in the news. It’s not an ideal ending, but the Democrats really have no incentive to compromise: If the stalemate persists and the payroll tax reverts to the higher rate, they’ll simply point to Republican support in the Senate for Reid’s bill as proof that this is all the House GOP’s fault. That’s a nifty narrative to have while stories like this are rolling off the presses.

Exit question: Why don’t they take Deroy Murdock’s advice instead? Is it simply because passing anything right now except the Senate bill as is would still leave them vulnerable to that Democratic narrative?


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Karl Rove is irrelevant.

they lie on December 21, 2011 at 8:43 PM

Fox is the network of old Pub. establishment has beens. No one with a lick of political sense gives these turkeys the time of day. Most are losers who have never won an election or are so inside the beltway, they are out of touch.

they lie on December 21, 2011 at 8:45 PM

Just last year, this tool was a substitute host for Rush.

Valiant on December 21, 2011 at 8:48 PM

I am weary of the Republican establishment. No fight except against conservative Republicans. Let’s just go with what they say and who they tell us to nominate, then we’ll all get along, even with the democrats.

GaltBlvnAtty on December 21, 2011 at 8:49 PM

Rove is an establishment douche nozzle – it’s all about the sizzle without the steak.

Time to STFU Karl – go back into your closet on the Death Star.

Mr Galt on December 21, 2011 at 8:50 PM

ok karl, break out that chalk board so I can understand how you are trying to manipulate me

RAGIN CAJUN on December 21, 2011 at 8:52 PM

Bush’s Brain Hemorrhage.

fogw on December 21, 2011 at 8:52 PM

SNAFU-CLUSTERFARK!!
(sarc)

canopfor on December 21, 2011 at 8:54 PM

To quote a distinguished elder statesman, a senior senator :

“This war is lost.”

The GOP might just as well go home, and not come back. You have lost the battle, lost the war, lost the country. Just go home and stay there, losers. Let the democrats run the country..

Say, did anyone read Victor David Hansen over on NRO?

Skandia Recluse on December 21, 2011 at 8:57 PM

That’s a nifty narrative to have while stories like this are rolling off the presses.

Please, if the stories on Yahoo News had any importance, there’d be no Republican House to begin with.

I do like how they buried the info that the end of this tax cut would fall mostly on high-income earners.

Higher-income Americans receive the biggest share of tax breaks, so the end of the tax cut would reduce their pay most.

Apologetic California on December 21, 2011 at 8:58 PM

Exit question: Why don’t they take Deroy Murdock’s advice instead? Is it simply because passing anything right now except the Senate bill as is would still leave them vulnerable to that Democratic narrative?

Yep. Boehner got Gingriched, and the sad thing is it was by his “Republican” counterpart in the Senate.

Steve Eggleston on December 21, 2011 at 9:00 PM

As someone to the right of Attilla the Hun, even I must say that Boehner thoroughly screwed the pooch on this one and he just needs to pass the Senate bill by unanimous consent and get out of dodge. He’s been getting played all year because 1) they won’t pass bills for individual departments well before deadlines (which would allow them to attach riders and generally make Reid’s life miserable) and 2) they won’t use that subsequent leverage to shut down departments if need be. They are scared to death of Obama, the media and of losing their jobs. And in this case they’ve picked the wrong fight. They are in a complete no-win situation. What are they gonna do when Jan. 1 rolls around and Schumer is still giving them the finger? Cry some more? Idiots.

DocinPA on December 21, 2011 at 9:00 PM

How about pounding the Senate for not passing the House version instead of the other way around- they went first you know.

Way to help the message Karl.

Good God I despise the “Establishment” wienies.

Neomom on December 21, 2011 at 9:01 PM

Rove is just another insider who is so out of touch he’s still invested in playing the old game and doesn’t realize the country is imploding.

He a bastard, long missing his magnificence.

katy on December 21, 2011 at 9:02 PM

Via,Drudge!
———–

TAX FIGHT TURNS UGLY…
OBAMA PHONES IT IN…
Then goes Christmas shopping…

Yup,Serious Liberals,er,Socialists in action!!

canopfor on December 21, 2011 at 9:02 PM

Say, did anyone read Victor David Hansen over on NRO?

Skandia Recluse on December 21, 2011 at 8:57 PM

Until you mentioned it, no.

I highly recommend it, as it will be coming to a town near you.

Steve Eggleston on December 21, 2011 at 9:02 PM

Isn’t this the same guy who told Bush not to respond to attacks while he was president. That worked out well. So why is anyone still listening to him?

dirtseller on December 21, 2011 at 9:03 PM

I’m starting to think Rove is on the DNC payroll.

Fallon on December 21, 2011 at 9:04 PM

Why is Karl Rove still relevant? Does anyone care what he has to say?

Lord on December 21, 2011 at 9:08 PM

Is Rove still on Alexrod’s secret payroll? He is tainting the prudent option by being Rove and talking at the same time.

kunegetikos on December 21, 2011 at 9:08 PM

House GOP passed a year long extension. It’s the Senate Democrats who refused to consider that. Stupid party needs to push that.

rbj on December 21, 2011 at 9:08 PM

if anyone thinks that this “narrative” they are so scared of is relevent, or has legs, they need their heads examined. this is nuts. the establishment GOP is melting down. totally. they are pissed about their ever-increasing irrelevancy. i thought the death of the dem party that BHO is ushering in would be ugly. sheesh.

t8stlikchkn on December 21, 2011 at 9:10 PM

Screw em. A year from now so much crap will have hit the fan that the payroll tax will be off the radar and mostly forgotten.

Deano1952 on December 21, 2011 at 9:12 PM

VDH article is very good.

In this take, I am not so much interested in chronicling the flotsam and jetsam as in fathoming whether there is some ideology that drives it.

Hot Airs F&J is famous as quoted in VDH article.

FLconservative on December 21, 2011 at 9:13 PM

The whole 9 yards,PayRoll Timeline Breaking News!
=================================================

US payroll tax extension
*************************

http://www.breakingnews.com/topic/us-payroll-tax-extension

canopfor on December 21, 2011 at 9:17 PM

Say, did anyone read Victor David Hansen over on NRO?

Skandia Recluse on December 21, 2011 at 8:57 PM
Until you mentioned it, no.

I highly recommend it, as it will be coming to a town near you.

Steve Eggleston on December 21, 2011 at 9:02 PM

EMBARF was part of the day because of suspected copper theft

RickB on December 21, 2011 at 9:17 PM

i agree that the Rs were rolled by the leftists…but that’s because the Rs always assume that the left is dealing in good faith…which is Never true. And the left has the press PR machine behind them broadcasting their talking points.

Rs will cave, not because they are wrong, but because Mitch/John didn’t wargame the scenario correctly, that is, they assumed that what the left says in private negotiations is what they’ll do publicly….punked again.

So they’ve lost the battle…but lets not forget Nov. Everyone needs to stick together for Nov…else the country will lose big time

r keller on December 21, 2011 at 9:18 PM

Karl Rove should go get lost in a cave somewhere.

PatriotGal2257 on December 21, 2011 at 9:18 PM

Karl Rove again? Quick Ma, where’s the duct tape!

tmac on December 21, 2011 at 9:20 PM

Say, did anyone read Victor David Hansen over on NRO?

Skandia Recluse on December 21, 2011 at 8:57 PM

Good read. Reminds me of “Surviving in Argentina” and its companion book:

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/

This is your future America – as Nero fiddles.

Mr Galt on December 21, 2011 at 9:22 PM

Does anyone really care what Rover has to say? If he is not up in arms about Republicans not taking a stand or showing they have a backbone, he his up in arm became they are. Rover is among the old dogs, and like the saying goes “it is hard to teach an old dog a new trick” As for fox news well they have their hands full cheerleading for Romney’s flip folps?

RiCkY.D. on December 21, 2011 at 9:22 PM

and BTW, there’s lessons here for everyone. 1. the President is very powerful 2. Reid is very crafty and sneaky.

We tend to abstract the Executive and legislative branches as co-equal. That’s true…But a powerful Executive and a Senate leader acting in bad faith can run the table.

So we need to take the Senate

r keller on December 21, 2011 at 9:23 PM

folps = flops :)

RiCkY.D. on December 21, 2011 at 9:23 PM

If Karl is against what the house done, then they must be on the right track. What conservative has he said or done ever. Ruined O’Donnell’s chances in her senate bid, helped to beat Angel, and now he wants to let Obama win. Screw you Rove go to==== and take McCain with you.

jainphx on December 21, 2011 at 9:26 PM

Screw em. A year from now so much crap will have hit the fan that the payroll tax will be off the radar and mostly forgotten.

Deano1952 on December 21, 2011 at 9:12 PM

I was looking for the scene from Legends of the Fall and came up with an interesting article for the Huff Po.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/16/hillary-clinton-on-workin_n_97017.htm

During the past week, Sen. Hillary Clinton has presented herself as a working class populist, the politician in touch with small town sentiments, compared to the elitism of her opponent, Sen. Barack Obama.

But a telling anecdote from her husband’s administration shows Hillary Clinton’s attitudes about the “lunch-bucket Democrats” are not exactly pristine.

In January 1995, as the Clintons were licking their wounds from the 1994 congressional elections, a debate emerged at a retreat at Camp David. Should the administration make overtures to working class white southerners who had all but forsaken the Democratic Party? The then-first lady took a less than inclusive approach.

“Screw ‘em,” she told her husband. “You don’t owe them a thing, Bill. They’re doing nothing for you; you don’t have to do anything for them.”

FLconservative on December 21, 2011 at 9:36 PM

First McCain, and now Rove?!?

The Nerve on December 21, 2011 at 9:36 PM

We don’t want your boy, Romney, Karl.

Get it through your bulbous head!

CurtZHP on December 21, 2011 at 9:41 PM

Rove is the RINO wing of this party.

Intrepid767 on December 21, 2011 at 9:43 PM

btw, I STILL think (cant prove) that Rove is still harboring ‘sour grapes’ over the whole Delware/ODonnell thing. I would NOT put that past him.

Intrepid767 on December 21, 2011 at 9:45 PM

I wouldn’t have expected anything else from Rove. A jellyfish has more backbone then Rove and the establishment Republicans will ever grow.

savage24 on December 21, 2011 at 9:46 PM

Why is Rove on FOX acting as a political consultant? Bush and Rove are the reason we ended up with Obama.

apocalypse on December 21, 2011 at 9:46 PM

Karl Rove > EVERYONE

apocalypse on December 21, 2011 at 9:49 PM

Rove…..establishment….irrelevant..yawns. Rove should get together with Coulter and join in her Christie/Romney love fest !

Sandybourne on December 21, 2011 at 9:52 PM

Karl Rove should have retired when Bush did. Who even cares what he things any more?

RasThavas on December 21, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Pulling a Boehner for Xmas.

profitsbeard on December 21, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Rove who?

Conservchik on December 21, 2011 at 10:00 PM

The evolution of Rove’s face from mildly upsetting looking to downright repulsive is pure visual horror. It’s fattening and sagging right before our very eyes. All the lies and shilling are obviously weighing very heavily upon him.

Spirit Crusher on December 21, 2011 at 10:06 PM

I hate Rove.

He is responsible for the destruction of the Republican brand.

He should be shunned.

mankai on December 21, 2011 at 10:21 PM

Sure because everybody knows that losing a legislature battle never comes back in campaign ads.

Speakup on December 21, 2011 at 10:32 PM

Rove missed the point. The opposition to this cluster-f makes sense, but the messaging was beyond incompetent.

And sadly messaging counts more than ever.

CorporatePiggy on December 21, 2011 at 10:36 PM

Rove is just despicable.

And that’s being generous for the Holidays.

PappyD61 on December 21, 2011 at 11:18 PM

Rove has pretty much lost all credibility. As far as I am concerned, hes in the bag for Obummer. His talk of backing down and caving can only be described as treasonous.

MooCowBang on December 22, 2011 at 12:15 AM

Karl Rove should have retired when Bush did. Who even cares what he things any more?

RasThavas on December 21, 2011 at 9:55 PM

================

Well, I, for one, care about his opinion. Say what you will about the man, but he knows what it takes to win in politics. He is providing a dispassionate analysis from a sympathetic observer. And it sounds like he is giving the Republicans good advice.

No casual observer understands what is going on in Washington with this issue. What are the Republicans standing for here? It looks like they are so against Obama that they are now opposing tax cuts of all things!! This is unbelievable. I don’t understand how this whole mess came about, but the Republicans the Republicans need to get out of this mess before they do any more damage to themselves. They’re getting completely outmaneuvered, and if this keeps up in 2012, they are going to wind up getting Obama reelected, and they are going to lose the House.

ghostwriter on December 22, 2011 at 12:47 AM

Rove is officially an elitist and out of touch with all of us. He strikes out often these days.

ultracon on December 22, 2011 at 12:48 AM

It isn’t “caving”, I think the Republicans have a damned good deal here if they take it.

Their current behavior is adolescent, immature, childish.

crosspatch on December 22, 2011 at 3:32 AM

The house republicans have absolutely nothing to gain here. The Senate is NOT going to cave and Obama (and the media) are going to portray the resulting disruption (particularly on small businesses that must jerk around their withholding) on the Republicans (and they’ll be right).

The Democrats have nothing to lose here and no reason to cave. If the House Republicans dig in their heels, they will lose. The Senate is not going to cave on this issue.

crosspatch on December 22, 2011 at 3:37 AM

Karl (Tokyo) Rove is wrong.

A two month extension is totally irresponsible.

The House, Harry Reid, and the Payroll Tax
http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/286357/house-harry-reid-and-payroll-tax-editors

Newt slams Harry Reid for leaving DC amid Payroll fight
http://www.therightscoop.com/newt-slams-harry-reid-for-leaving-dc-amid-payroll-fight/

john.frank on December 22, 2011 at 4:23 AM

It isn’t “caving”, I think the Republicans have a damned good deal here if they take it.

Their current behavior is adolescent, immature, childish.

crosspatch on December 22, 2011 at 3:32 AM

It seems to me that adolescent, immature and childish is exactly what a lot of these people these days want Congress to be.

If they can ultimately get the deal they want..then holding out is not a bad tactic..however, if it blows up in their faces the media will beat the Republicans over the head with this..in fact they already are.

Terrye on December 22, 2011 at 7:15 AM

Rove is officially an elitist and out of touch with all of us. He strikes out often these days.

ultracon on December 22, 2011 at 12:48 AM

All of us? Who is all of us? You don’t speak for me..and I doubt very much if you speak for a majority of Reublicans much less Americans..the truth is most people just want them to get this done and go on to something else. If they blow this then it will be the Republicans in Congress that people will think are out of touch with all of us.

Terrye on December 22, 2011 at 7:18 AM

Forget the fact that the House is the only part of our present Government controlled by Republicans and get in line behind and follow the dictates of the Democrat controlled Senate. Can there be any doubt as to the Republican establishments seemingly constant nullification of the will of the people in the 2010 election in favor of more of the same that has America teetering on the brink of destruction?

aposematic on December 22, 2011 at 7:21 AM

I’m going to be more generous than many of the commentators and suggest that Rove is taking a strategic viewpoint and is reacting to the idea that the GOP is giving the jug-eared idiot the ability to play the defender of the middle class.

I disagree with Rove, there is a principled reason why the House GOP isn’t “going along to get along” with the deal brokered in the Senate. But I will say that the House has done a poor job of getting the message out.

Happy Nomad on December 22, 2011 at 7:26 AM

Have there been any comments from McConnell or other Senators who supported the Reid bill as to why they stabbed their House colleagues in the back?

Nomas on December 22, 2011 at 7:43 AM

All of us are those of us who have ever been responsible for running a payroll, who know how unworkable a monthly cut of an annual premium/tax is.

All of us are those of us (very few in fact) who know that taxing and spending bills originate in the House, and it’s up to the Senate to reconcile to the House, not the other way around.

All of us doesn’t include Karl Rove.

MNHawk on December 22, 2011 at 8:24 AM

For the life of me I don’t understand why the republicans didn’t show the payroll tax cut for what it is: A SOCIAL SECURITY AND MEDICARE CUT! How can the dems get by with a cut in Social Security and Medicare funding? Both programs are already broke and the solution is to cut the payroll tax? The repubs should have taken a stand on the fiscal irresponsiblity of this reelection tactic and offered an income tax cut of equal value to offset the return to precut levels. Rove is part of the establishment irrelevancy determined to undermine real reform.

essequam on December 22, 2011 at 8:33 AM

Rino Rove remains a petulant puppy who pouts when he can’t get a presser or his way.
What is missing from the NARRATIVE is the truth!
My guess is all this tax cut nonsense is nothing more than
Cloward Piven rearing its ugly head one more time.
If zero destroys the SS fund by cutting it over 30% with his 2% tax cut for everyone” is this not just another move,incrementally,to cave/destroy the welfare systems?
SS has become just another budget item since the “fund” really does not exist. Politicians have successfully raided it constantly. Viewing it that way why is this no more just the far left trying to destroy the country by collapsing it from within with too much welfare payments and too little income?Its Cloward Piven all over again.
My guess is we are being played one more time by the hard left.

rodguy911 on December 22, 2011 at 8:34 AM

Nomas has it exactly right. This is the second time that McConnell cut the legs out from under Boehner and the House Republicans. During the debt increase debate, it was McConnell who dreamed up the whole Super Committee scheme. How did that work out? We got a meaningless vote on the BBA and another trillion-plus in debt. Now, we get an accounting nightmare, a permanent hidden tax, a demand for a decision, and the prospect of going through this whole mess again in two months. Why should the Democrats negotiate? They know that if they so much as scowl, the Republican establishment will weep piteously and wet all over the floor.Actually standing up for principle is an alien concept.

FirelandsO3 on December 22, 2011 at 8:36 AM

Rove carrying water for Reid – Unbelievable. The Pubbies in the Senate rolled over and gave Reid a useless win. They deserve to be ridiculed for acting stupidly. The House is on the right side of the issue; the RINO led GOP Senate not so much!

With Rove leading the way in 2012, GOP will lose the Senate. Bah humbug!

Bob in VA on December 22, 2011 at 9:04 AM

Rove is dead wrong…
He is making way to big a deal about $40. Americans are not dumb. Nobody will remember this 11 months from now.
It as if the Rove/Will types are at war w/ conservatives.

mjbrooks3 on December 22, 2011 at 9:35 AM

Well caving seems what they have alot of practicce at!

Jpalm on December 22, 2011 at 9:51 AM

Frankly, I’m sick to death of Karl Rove and Fox News telling me who to like and what policies to support.

My guess is if the House caves and goes for a two month extension, the Senate on March 1, will begin screeching, “Why didn’t you go for a one year extention?”

For all of you who seem to have forgotten: KARL ROVE helped get us into this mess and he gets paid handsomely by Fox News to spread his blather.

Mr. Grump on December 22, 2011 at 10:28 AM

” if the House caves on a two month deal, and expects to cut a better deal in January .. “
– we’ll be seeing endless replays of Lucy with Charlie Brown’s football

bet ya $10,000
/.

CaveatEmpty on December 22, 2011 at 11:21 AM

I used to think, “Do they think the American people are that stupid?” Now I’m thinking that the American people might just be that stupid. Everyone knows that Obama and the Democrats set this whole scenario up on purpose because it’s part of every story, yet we are also to believe that it’s working? I give up. I just don’t care anymore. Good night.

lea on December 22, 2011 at 11:24 AM

It would be much easier for all if Rove would tell us the one issue or policy, if any, that the Republicans should fight for, or should we just always do it the Democrat way?

RJL on December 22, 2011 at 3:12 PM