Scarborough: Newt Gingrich dismisses Michele Bachmann because she’s a woman

posted at 8:18 pm on December 16, 2011 by Tina Korbe

Anyone who watched last night’s debate surely detected the uneasiness between Newt Gingrich and Michele Bachmann. In true “fire-breather” fashion, Bachmann made no pretense of affection for or agreement with Gingrich on a couple of key issues. To my great delight, for example, she very transparently lambasted Gingrich’s defense of government-sponsored enterprises. To my slight confusion, she introduced a new line of attack on Gingrich — claiming that, at some point in the past, he plainly stated his intention to campaign for Republicans who supported partial-birth abortion. On that issue, the details were, admittedly, a bit hazy — but, on GSEs, at least, Bachmann was right on the money. Yet, against any brilliant militant advance of Bachmann’s (and against the less-brilliant advances, too), Gingrich forwarded only this defense: “Ms. Bachmann doesn’t have her facts straight.”

At last, Bachmann could take the condescension no longer. Half desperately, half determinedly, she reminded him, “I am a serious candidate for president of the United States,” and insisted that she did have her facts straight, thank him very much. Gingrich looked a little abashed. It wasn’t his best moment. For that matter, it wasn’t hers — but not because she wasn’t justified in her frustration.

This morning, pundits pondered the meaning of the exchange. MSNBC host Joe Scarborough offered, perhaps, the most interesting take on the tiff. The Daily Caller reports:

On Friday’s “Morning Joe” on MSNBC, host Joe Scarborough said that he perceived an exceptionally harsh tone from Gingrich when he addressed Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann in Thursday night’s Fox News debate.

“You know – did you notice something, too, Michael [Steele], about Bachmann and I think Bachmann’s getting tired of it,” Scarborough said. “Newt Gingrich when he attacks Michele Bachmann sort of speaks in a different tone and is far more condescending to Michele Bachmann than he is to the men on the stage. And she is starting – she’s actually starting to push back on the fact. It’s something we noticed a couple of debates ago. But I think Michele Bachmann’s about had enough of him being condescending to her.”

Former RNC Chairman Michael Steele, now a MSNBC contributor, agreed with Scarborough and praised Bachmann for pushing back.

“I think it’s the irritation that really came through there at several key moments where, you know, they were going back and forth and she just took the stance,” Steele said. “Look, I am a serious contender for this office just like you are. And the only thing I could write was, ‘you go girl.’ I tweeted that out. I mean she was just – she hit it in a way that made it very clear. You’re not going to get away with pushing back on me to make me look less than capable or less than worthy to being on the stage.”

Last night, I contentiously tweeted, “OK, I’ve been debating about tweeting this all night, but I kinda think I think it: If Bachmann were a man, she’d be in the top two.” Followers quickly corrected that idea, reminding me of all the ways she’s “crazy” (their word, not mine) — but it took Joe Scarborough to show me the error of my ways.

Hear me out. Bachmann is arguably the most conservative member of Congress and probably the most conservative GOP presidential candidate. She’s also one of the best debaters on the stage. She speaks clearly and compellingly — constructing broad themes, which she filigrees with knowledgeable detail. Yes, she went a bit overboard on Gardasil and some would say she was disingenuous when she suggested the government would be able to function without a debt ceiling increase (I’m not one of those “some,” however) — and, arguably, she’s even more culpable for her more “extreme” statements because she often utters them in TV interviews or other settings that are less pressured than a debate.

But, by and large, she has conducted her campaign with drive, she has presented an admirable grasp of the issues, and she has kept her record — insofar as she has a record — clean. What’s not to like — especially for the rightmost conservatives who’ve clamored from the beginning for a “full spectrum” representative of their views? So, I cast about for some explanation and came up with a superficial one: She doesn’t exactly look like a president. By that, I mean she’s a woman and she’s very, very tiny. Perhaps I was projecting my own sexism on the rest of the electorate: I have, all along, felt she lacked something presidential and I begin to think that that feeling arose vaguely from my subconscious, which has been taught to expect that a U.S. president is male.

Now, I see that I was wrong. It’s not that the electorate doesn’t take Bachmann seriously because she’s a woman. Republicans in Iowa, for example, voted her to the top of the Ames Straw Poll. And, while her support has been marginal, she’s consistently polled in the relative “middle” of the pack, always ahead of Rick Santorum and Jon Hunstman, both of whom — to state the obvious — are men. She was beating Gingrich for ages.

But a partial reason for her decline might be that Mitt Romney — and now Newt Gingrich — never seemed to be too troubled by her. Bachmann never caused Romney to break a sweat. Newt Gingrich swats her away like a gadfly. Perhaps the electorate absorbed the attitudes of Michele Bachmann’s competitors, who — with the exception of Tim Pawlenty — never saw her as someone to beat and, consequently, never saw her as someone who could win.

But, then, to bring up the other two underdogs again, neither Romney nor Gingrich has ever seemed the least bit threatened by Santorum or Huntsman.

Who knows how these things go? Our attitudes toward presidential candidates are mercurial and all kinds of factors play a part. It’d be foolish to say we don’t take gender into account in our assessments of other people — and no doubt voters and fellow candidates alike have taken Bachmann’s apparent femininity into account as they’ve sized her up as a potential president — even if only subconsciously. But, in the end, to say Romney, Gingrich or the electorate has dismissed Bachmann because she’s a woman is to be the ultimate sexist, to reduce Bachmann solely to her womanhood, as though that’s the only factor by which she can be judged. Bachmann has been dismissed — by those who’ve dismissed her, that is — because she is Bachmann. Her person encompasses her gender, but her gender doesn’t encompass her person.


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Jazz thinks Stuart Stevens is a serious person. Bless his heart.

steebo77 on April 6, 2013 at 11:39 AM

Your idea is stupid too… the problem isn’t who is moderating the debates but the idea that debates need moderators to begin with.

Just set a debate topic and let the candidates speak on their own… and then let them ask questions to each other.

ninjapirate on April 6, 2013 at 11:40 AM

So far the Rs are proving to be LESS SMART on so many levels.

CoffeeLover on April 6, 2013 at 11:41 AM

The 2016 primary is a bit unusual in that there is a clear top-tier of candidates (whoever runs from the Jeb Bush, Paul Ryan, Marco Rubio, Chris Christie group.) As a result, it’s likely to be easier to control the debate process if they can be convinced that’s in their best interest to limit appearances.

Mister Mets on April 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM

Nevermind… I just skimmed over and I thought your entire idea was have Hugh Hewitt et al moderate the debates…

I think we need to just do Lincoln Douglas the whole way though… just have random drawings to keep the debates small at the beginning.

ninjapirate on April 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM

Just set a debate topic and let the candidates speak on their own… and then let them ask questions to each other.

ninjapirate on April 6, 2013 at 11:40 AM

That’s a great idea. I’d also say that each candidate should be given equal speaking time, to use as they wish – give them a button to activate their microphone, and cut it off permanently when they’ve run out of allotted time. If one guy wants to talk for 10 minutes on a single topic and then have no time for any other exchanges, let him.

Inkblots on April 6, 2013 at 11:44 AM

And change the format entirely. Why do we need eight people at eight podiums fighting with each other in the first place? Take a page from Newt Gingrich’s playbook instead. Have two chairs, one for the host and one for a single candidate. Give each of them fifteen minutes. Ask them the same questions on general policy issues, mixed in with specific questions for each candidate on proposals they have made or areas where they haven’t provided a solid plan yet. You could fill up the same two hours and give the voters a clear, uninterrupted look at where each of them stands without turning it into either a softball love festival or a planned attack by hostile, liberal guard dogs.

How is this any different from a series of interviews? Presumably, the candidates will be engaging in more than enough of those?

The emphasis on policy proposals is a bit problematic since it ignores other things that will determine whether someone can be an effective President, such as their accomplishments in the past. In a discussion that is just about policy, there’s nothing to distinguish a failed state legislator from a popular Governor.

Mister Mets on April 6, 2013 at 11:45 AM

I say run a tournament of one-on-one debates.

Count to 10 on April 6, 2013 at 11:50 AM

Imagine Candy Crowley moderating the Lincoln-Douglas debates, and therein lies the problem…

Khun Joe on April 6, 2013 at 11:50 AM

I think we need to just do Lincoln Douglas the whole way though… just have random drawings to keep the debates small at the beginning.

ninjapirate on April 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM

Sounds good.

Count to 10 on April 6, 2013 at 11:51 AM

I agree with Jazz, Republicans are running to be the Republican NOMINEE not the DEMOCRAT Party nominee. I don’t get why they want to appear on Democrat news. If they want to go on ONE big cable news it should just be Foxnews moderated by Hannity and Erick Erickson.

Rush should also have his own debate forum. Republicans should just stick with going on blogs and conservative places like Glenn Beck.

No MORE going to debate hosted by Marxist.

BroncosRock on April 6, 2013 at 11:52 AM

Imagine Candy Crowley moderating the Lincoln-Douglas debates, and therein lies the problem…

Khun Joe on April 6, 2013 at 11:50 AM

From what I remember, the moderators of Lincoln-Douglas debate don’t get to ask questions. It’s a strait up one-on-one point and counterpoint about a single topic.

Count to 10 on April 6, 2013 at 11:53 AM

Rush should also have his own debate forum.
BroncosRock on April 6, 2013 at 11:52 AM

How about a radio debate on Rush’s show?

Count to 10 on April 6, 2013 at 11:54 AM

How about duct taping the mouths of the leftard moderators and let the candidates talk?

Old Country Boy on April 6, 2013 at 11:55 AM

A new way to handle primary debates…..


Don’t listen to ANYONE connected to the failed gop that has had anything to do with any national election since 1988.

Limited government Conservative values haven’t been on the ballot since 1984 (and to be honest that wasn’t really smaller government). It at least had the veneer of having someone at the head that preached it constantly (and appeared to believe it).

PappyD61 on April 6, 2013 at 12:02 PM

View the DOTUS and all his glory (his fundamentally transformed United States of America) here.

http://glennhenson.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/image001-obama.jpg

2017 here we come.

PappyD61 on April 6, 2013 at 12:11 PM

I would love to see mark levin moderate a debate.

karenhasfreedom on April 6, 2013 at 12:12 PM

Surprised no one suggested the Republican candidates stand silently on the stage while the liberal media debates how bad each Republican candidate is compared the the Democrat running for office.
;-)

albill on April 6, 2013 at 12:12 PM

PappyD61 on April 6, 2013 at 12:11 PM

Awesome picture. That needs to be used in campaign ads next year to help dethrone Reid in the senate.

karenhasfreedom on April 6, 2013 at 12:14 PM

It is about time the GOP did what the Democrats do. Hire moderators that share the philosophy. We simply are not interested in Stephanopolis’s delusional presumptions.

pat on April 6, 2013 at 12:16 PM

Nice article Jazz Shaw..You made some very valid points..:)

Dire Straits on April 6, 2013 at 12:30 PM

This debate situation is a problem to be sure. But it’s not a problem without a solution. We just have to be smarter than the people who are causing the real problem in the first place.

Hear!..Hear!..:)

Dire Straits on April 6, 2013 at 12:31 PM

We just have to be smarter than the people who are causing the real problem in the first place.

You’d think this would be the easy part, but no…… *shakes head*

GWB on April 6, 2013 at 12:41 PM

Given the recent trajectory of events, the first debate we see in 2015 will be sponsored by MSNBC, hosted by Chris Hayes, and feature the opening question, “Show of hands… which of you will do the least damage to the country if you somehow manage to steal this election?”

A version of this scenario is what we saw over and over ad infinitum in 2012. If Republicans allow this outrage to be repeated … They. Will. Lose. Again. And deserve it.

marybel on April 6, 2013 at 12:49 PM

The first thing I would do is refuse to have any debate on CNN. After Candy Crowley set Mitt Romney up there is no reason to give that network any recognition until such time as they recognize the harm they did and rectify the situation.

bflat879 on April 6, 2013 at 12:53 PM

Stuart Stevens (of Romney campaign fame shame) understandably feels that the circus has made far too many stops in the same town.

No political circus would be complete without Mr. “Etch-a-Sketch,” Stevens, Andrea Saul, Mike Murphy, Kevin Madden, Alex Castellanos, Ed Gillespie or the rest of the clowns from Team Romney.

bw222 on April 6, 2013 at 12:59 PM

There have been some watchable formats that differed greatly from the ‘stand around the stage as targets’ venue.

Huckabee did a very good job with the candidates and they each got to answer questions but on their own, no back and forth, just state your position without knowing what anyone else had said before that.

The Value Voters Summit is, perhaps, one of the best venues that has happened and is a very good format style as a table-talk discussion not a ‘please indict yourself for the moderator’ junk we normally get.

Then there is always the strange concepts of asking the campaigns to each submit moderators and put their names into a hat and pick out two and then go to an online venue for this stuff.

Or ask Brian Lamb to host them on CSPAN with someone on the clock to cut off microphones.

Anything but the last two go-arounds all over again.

ajacksonian on April 6, 2013 at 1:02 PM

Jazz thinks Stuart Stevens is a serious person. Bless his heart.

steebo77 on April 6, 2013 at 11:39 AM

But, does anyone think Jazz is a serious person? Doubtful.

bw222 on April 6, 2013 at 1:03 PM

Offer events hosted by Hugh Hewitt, Jim Geraghty, Al Cardenas… hell, let’s have Ed Morrissey and Erick Erickson host a couple. And change the format entirely.

Geraghty and Erickson are the only ones from that list that aren’t total RINOs and Erickson is a complete jerk.

bw222 on April 6, 2013 at 1:08 PM

I’ve always been a proponent of the Lincoln-Douglas format with moderators serving only time-keeping functions. That just isn’t practical with eight debaters. Jazz’ suggestion of 15-minute segments would yield far more substance than the current system, but I wonder if the lack of confrontation would cause the networks to lost interest in covering them.

It is insane to allow the media to control the selection process for the Republican nomination. They are not neutral brokers, but active enemies of our side and agents for the other side.

Adjoran on April 6, 2013 at 1:14 PM

Here’s an idea: how about having real debates that force the candidates to actually answer the question by ADDRESSING THE ISSUE?! And stop allowing them to drone on and on about anything but the issue. O/T a bit, but how about fielding candidates with iron balls instead of the shriveled little ones the dweebs we now see seem to possess? And clear the field of ANYBODY who was even the slightest associated with the last election. Fresh meat is what we need.

HiJack on April 6, 2013 at 1:50 PM

At this stage the only near-”absolute” I think that needs to be corrected is a new way of picking moderators.

No more hostile lib/pro Dem questioners who live for the chance to embarrass and marginalize GOP candidates…ever. And no wire hangars either!

Sacramento on April 6, 2013 at 1:53 PM

Nein, nein, nein

Schadenfreude on April 6, 2013 at 2:20 PM

HiJack on April 6, 2013 at 1:50 PM

+1

Schadenfreude on April 6, 2013 at 2:21 PM

There need to be some debates.You can’t let candidates just get away with spouting their ideas unchallenged.And debates are good practice for the 3 in the general against the Dem candidate.Under no circumstances should any GOP candidate agree to appear onstage with a liberal moderator,and this should be insisted upon in advance by having each candidate take a pledge not to do so.If the networks want to host a debate they will provide a conservative moderator.Lastly,the sheer number of debates was ridiculous.Limit them to one each on economic policy,social issues,and foreign policy.

redware on April 6, 2013 at 2:30 PM

Maybe your problem is the answers, not the questions.

If your argument is sound, why should it matter how it gets asked… a candidate is interviewing to be president of the united states, and they’re afraid of MSNBC?

triple on April 6, 2013 at 3:32 PM

I would love to see mark levin moderate a debate.

karenhasfreedom on April 6, 2013 at 12:12 PM

…someone should insist on it!

KOOLAID2 on April 6, 2013 at 4:20 PM

Maybe your problem is the answers, not the questions.

If your argument is sound, why should it matter how it gets asked… a candidate is interviewing to be president of the united states, and they’re afraid of MSNBC?

triple on April 6, 2013 at 3:32 PM

I think the moderators should be Michelle and Hussein official jock holders from the white house staff.

fair and balanced

tom daschle concerned on April 6, 2013 at 4:35 PM

I am thinking we should bring back “Win Ben Stein’s Money” to weed out the unprepared.

Jimmy Kimmel can’t be any more partisan than Candy Crowley, and far more intelligent and easy on the eye’s to boot.

Snowblind on April 6, 2013 at 4:52 PM