Uh oh: Witness found to Cain incidents?

posted at 1:25 pm on November 2, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

So far, neither of the two alleged complainants from Herman Cain’s tenure at the National Restaurant Association have come forward publicly, although it appears at least one would like NRA to release her from her confidentiality agreement to do so.  However, a pollster who worked for NRA at the time told KTOK in Oklahoma that he witnessed both incidents — and that if the women talk, Cain’s candidacy would be over:

Interviewed today on KTOK’s Mullins in the Morning, [Chris] Wilson, of Wilson-Perkins-Allen Opinion Research headquartered in Washington, D.C. explained he was a witness to the incident.  “I was the pollster at the National Restaurant Association when Herman Cain was head of it and I was around a couple of times when this happened and anyone who was involved with the NRA at the time, knew that this was gonna come up.”

Wilson described the woman as a low level staffer who was maybe two years out of college.  “This occurred at a restaurant in Crystal City (Virginia) and everybody was aware of it,” he continued.  “It was only a matter of time because so many people were aware of what took place, so many people were aware of her situation, the fact she left—everybody knew with the campaign that this would eventually come up.”

Wilson claims that he also can’t discuss the specifics, for legal reasons.  I’m not quite clear as to what that might be.  He may have signed a broad non-disclosure agreement with NRA to get the polling work, but if that’s the case, he just violated it with this statement today.  Unless he also participated in the settlement/severance agreements with the women, he’s as free to discuss the details as the fact that he witnessed them.  And it’s difficult to see how Wilson would have been involved in a settlement between NRA and the two employees.

However, Wilson isn’t only linked to NRA and Cain from years gone by.  His firm has conducted polling in this presidential race for the Make Us Great Again PAC.  And guess which candidate is favored by MUGA-PAC?  Why, none other than … Rick Perry.  The PAC has no formal connection to Perry’s campaign, but it’s certainly boosting Perry as the Republican nominee in the primary.

Could Wilson be more than just a witness in this story?  Could he be a source?  It could just be a coincidence that a witness to these alleged incidents did work for an organization pushing Perry, and that the story mysteriously got to Politico as Cain took support away from Perry in mid-October.  If he is the source, then conducting an interview on the topic has to be one of the dumber political moves I’ve seen.

Update: Some are saying that this indicates Romney as the source of the leak, but I’m not terribly convinced that a one-time donation means much.  Romney has less to fear with Cain as his main opponent than others in the race, and besides, no one knows whether Anderson ever knew about the incidents at all.  Other board members say they didn’t.  YMMV, however.

Update II: There have been plenty of developments that we have covered in other posts, but this development should be noted here:

Wilson emails THE WEEKLY STANDRD: “To be clear, and you can ask any of the reporters covering this story, I had nothing to do with leaking this in any way, and I’ve never discussed or shared this story with any of my clients – period.”

I’m pretty sure Politico won’t confirm or deny on any speculation on sources, but Wilson’s denial should be noted on this post.  However, John McCormack notes that Wilson has another indirect connection to the Perry campaign:

But pollster Tony Fabrizio, who was Wilson’s boss at Fabrizio, McLaughlin & Associates at the time of the alleged incidents, was hired by the Perry campaign in October.

Although Wilson claims that “anyone who was involved with the NRA at the time knew that this [incident with Cain] was gonna come up,” Fabrizio says he didn’t now that Cain was accused of sexual harassment.

“Our firm worked for the NRA prior to Herman Cain’s ascendancy there, during his presidency, and even for a little bit after that,” Fabrizio tells THE WEEKLY STANDARD. “But I was never witness to any of what Chris is saying, or at least what I’ve read as the account of what he’s saying.”

But did Wilson ever tell his boss about any of these incidents or allegations? “No, not that I recall, no,” says Fabrizio.

We’ll see.

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HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:13 PM

BTW, I quoted the whole paragraph…it has taken you almost a day to figure out what to say…isn’t that your complaint with Cain, and his was 12 years old….
Okay, than show us the links where the “complaints” were filed, or do you mean they were discussed and negotiated, and resolved?

right2bright on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Being gay would HELP Rick Perry in the polls.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:11 PM

Until people find out about his Saddam Hussein fetish.

MeatHeadinCA on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Ah, I see it’s another fine day for a lynching.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

You’re gonna need more wagons. Via the AP, A third woman has come forward, says Cain called her attractive and invited her to his private suite.

capitalist piglet on November 2, 2011 at 4:13 PM

Speaking of threes, guess how many stories you can find when you use AP’s search engine for “fast and furious”—that’s right folks, three.

Rovin on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

right2bright on November 2, 2011 at 4:13 PM

talk about gall!! you hit others whwen they wont provide the info you want but you continually duck requests for cites of a criminal code that sends people to jail for violating an NDA. your pathetic.

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Pete, how would you like to join the FBI? We could use a good sleuth like you. :-)

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:15 PM

He’d be a better FBI guy than you! ;)

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Of course, and rumors are not facts, a difficult thing for some posters to understand.

right2bright on November 2, 2011 at 3:31 PM

Party A did something to Party B to warrant a pay out of $35,000.

Where is the rumor?

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:18 PM

Oh, the humanity.

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:16 PM

She fears retaliation…well, seeing this crowd here vowing to destroy anyone who utters a negative word about Cain, I can’t really say I blame her for that part.

Cain campaign said they had no comment.

capitalist piglet on November 2, 2011 at 4:18 PM

The employee described situations in which she said Cain told her he had confided to colleagues how attractive she was and invited her to his corporate apartment outside work. She spoke on condition of anonymity, saying she feared retaliation.

Sheesh, no wonder his wife Gloria doesn’t want anything to do with his campaign.

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:19 PM

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:15 PM

Leave Mr. Obama out of it. What did he ever do to you?

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:19 PM

Ah, I see it’s another fine day for a lynching.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

If he did these things (and I’m not saying he did, but it isn’t looking great since he himself said this would be coming), why the hell would you rather not know about it?

capitalist piglet on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

Sheesh, no wonder his wife Gloria doesn’t want anything to do with his campaign.

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:19 PM

Haha, I was wondering the same thing.

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

He’d be a better FBI guy than you! ;)

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

This is true. This is true.

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

BTW, I quoted the whole paragraph…it has taken you almost a day to figure out what to say…isn’t that your complaint with Cain, and his was 12 years old….
Okay, than show us the links where the “complaints” were filed, or do you mean they were discussed and negotiated, and resolved?

right2bright on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Most of a day? Bro – I never commented on your post because I never saw it. This might surprise you – but I don’t read every post on HotAir and I reserve the right to walk away from the computer to engage in Real Life anytime I feel like it.

You’ve since pointed out the post – and you got my attention. I told you that I incorrectly wrote “charges” in the first sentence but that any idiot would know what I was trying to say because, in the second sentence I use the word “complaints”.

Herman Cain had two SH complaints filed against him.

Now tell me how many lawyers will go to jail for talking about this case? Which is something you assert.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

Party A did something to Party B to warrant a pay out of $35,000.

Where is the rumor?

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:18 PM

“Something”? Whoa, way too many details.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

I know what ya mean – I’m waiting for more on the Rick Perry being gay stories. Can’t sweep it under the rug, y’know. Maybe under the rug in the closet, but even then…..

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:10 PM

Just when I think my fun with you is over. You crawl back into your sewer and come out with more Perry hatred.

You put the whatta’cattoy in moron.

cozmo on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

so there’s a third bimbo now?? back in the 90′s this is about the time we started saying “where’s there’s smoke there’s fire” does the same hold true for cain?

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

Leave Mr. Obama out of it. What did he ever do to you?

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:19 PM

Where to begin… :-)

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

The employee described situations in which she said Cain told her he had confided to colleagues how attractive she was and invited her to his corporate apartment outside work. She spoke on condition of anonymity, saying she feared retaliation.

Oh, the humanity.
petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:16 PM

Me, me, me!! I want in on this, too!! When do I get paid?

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

It only takes a small drop of blood in the water to attract the sharks. Cain is experiencing and will continue to experience what its really like to be the front runner, its not pretty.

nswider on November 2, 2011 at 4:22 PM

If he did these things (and I’m not saying he did, but it isn’t looking great since he himself said this would be coming), why the hell would you rather not know about it?

capitalist piglet on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

No – the Cainlusionals think they can bury their heads in the sand – and this will all just evaporate.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:22 PM

“Something”? Whoa, way too many details.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

The “something” is slowly being revealed.

Drip.Drip.Drip.

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:22 PM

No – the Cainlusionals think they can bury their heads in the sand – and this will all just evaporate.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:22 PM

And what, precisely, is “this”?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:23 PM

Sorry liberalORomney supporter , but there was NO settlement. this weren’t lawsuits.

It was an agreement for pay of two employees who made claims to bolster their severence pay. THAT is why their is no actual “sexual harrassment” in the “sexual harrassment”

LeeSeneca on November 2, 2011 at 3:49 PM

You’re a lunatic. I’m a Newt/Perry/Cain supporter. They are all flawed, and I prefer them in that order, but I will vote with my fellow conservatives for whichever one of them has momentum as the primaries approach. I’m from Atlanta, I can definitely support Cain in the primaries if he is to be the anti-Romney, but that doesn’t mean he should not be vetted. He needs to reveal what happened ASAP so that this story gets out of the headlines.

Also, I don’t think you entirely understand the relationship between settlements and lawsuits. You see, settlements are contractual waivers of legals claims in exchange for consideration, such as payment. There does not have to be a lawsuit to be a settlement of the underlying claim. The settlement forecloses the lawsuit. I think, based on the settlement, that it is more likely than not that the underlying claim was weak and the NRA settled to avoid legal expenses and the ever-present chance of a unwelcoming jury pool. But Cain is running for President of the United States, he needs to arrange to make the details public so that voters can evaluate their seriousness and relevance.

Get used to saying President Cain with some respect in your tone

LeeSeneca on November 2, 2011 at 3:49 PM

I’d be happy to vote for Cain in the primaries and the general, but he needs to be vetted, this is part of that process. In the mean time, you need learn how to talk about Cain without the liquored-up drill sergeant in your tone.

Lawdawg86 on November 2, 2011 at 4:23 PM

so there’s a third bimbo now??
chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

This is a job for… Betsey Wright! Light the beacons!

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:23 PM

The “something” is slowly being revealed.

Drip.Drip.Drip.

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:22 PM

As?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:24 PM

New story up:

New woman comes forward about Cain ……

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:24 PM

I think if Romney were such an evil genius as to manage such a convoluted twisting theory, then he should be President! But with the culprit who’s the topic of this blog entry being a Perry-fan, I’m not sure there’s much of a need for pretzelized plots.

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:00 PM

Romney has spent millions of his personal fortune on his quest for the presidency and devoted the last several years of his life to it. It’s not like he lacks motive or means or opportunity.

Which, again, doesn’t prove anything. But I have to wonder why anyone treats it as less than plausible.

And don’t forget that the trashing of Palin by Republicans started with Romney staffers before the 2008 election was even over.

Let’s not pretend that Romney or one of his many paid supporters is incapable of conceiving such a plot.

didymus on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:17 PM

Why, thanks partner. I get a kick out of trying to speculate out ahead of stuff like this. Too much time on my hands.

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

I know what ya mean – I’m waiting for more on the Rick Perry being gay stories. Can’t sweep it under the rug, y’know. Maybe under the rug in the closet, but even then…..
whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:10 PM

You crawl back into your sewer and come out with more Perry hatred.
cozmo on November 2, 2011 at 4:21 PM

No, I’m the first to say we should accept Perry’s denials of being gay, at least until the full details come out.

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

So yeah – I think Romney’s dad was responsible for getting Mitt a high lottery number.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 3:53 PM

Fairly vicious accusation to make, especially when it’s without proof. While not a big Romney supporter, at least try to keep it within the ballpark. I was too young to fight in Vietnam, but I remember when some of the older boys where I grew up drew high lottery numbers. I grew up in a trailer park. It’s safe to say those trailer park kids with high numbers didn’t have influential parents. For them, it was purely luck of the draw. I’m sure it was the same for Romney.

But hey, while we’re talking about draft dodging, let’s talk about Rush Limbaugh and his life-threatening pilonidal cyst.

troyriser_gopftw on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

Being gay would HELP Rick Perry in the polls poles.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:11 PM

Fixed that for you.

Lawdawg86 on November 2, 2011 at 4:26 PM

She spoke on condition of anonymity, saying she feared retaliation.

Well, by golly! That ought to be enough!

csdeven on November 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

And what, precisely, is “this”?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:23 PM

“This” – being the questions generated by these allegations of sexual harassment.

They’re not going to go away until Herman Cain does something substantive make them go away – like asking the NRA to REALLY release these gals from their non-disclosure agreement so they can tell their side of the story.

Right now – the only side we’re really getting is Herman Cain’s. What’s wrong with allowing these women to speak? If Cain is innocent – what does he have to fear?

The allegations are one thing – but acting guilty is a total other “thing” that will get hung up in people’s minds.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

If you want a better system of politics then it is time to start calling these people out to remind them that their word can and must mean something for them to be trusted. That is if you like a Nation ruled by laws, and not men. And an excuse of this being the way of things is in complete support of this utterly corrupt and corrupting process. Getting a better process means that these people who will demonstrate no personal integrity and yet still have positions of trust is one that cannot stand because it does destroy people and the Nation.

ajacksonian on November 2, 2011 at 1:54 PM

Amen. As I commented elsewhere yesterday:
Heh. It’s not just the LSM. Rove is doing his part just as a concern troll. Heard one caller to talk-radio, state that because of Rove’s concerns, he was persuaded to write Cain off — facts of the hit piece be damned. The only fact that mattered was that Cain botched the rapid response, ergo, there must be truth to the accusations.

Too many so-called conservatives are too quick to eat their own without due diligence and elitists like Rove are just as anxious to usher them to the feast while running interference for their chosen quisling.

AH_C on November 2, 2011 at 4:28 PM

No, I’m the first to say we should accept Perry’s denials of being gay, at least until the full details come out.

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

Yet, you get positively wet at the thought of bringing up an allegation that KBH wouldn’t even touch.

Bless your heart.

You can go back and fluff for Romney some more.

cozmo on November 2, 2011 at 4:29 PM

“This” – being the questions generated by these allegations of sexual harassment.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

And what is he supposed to have done? I realize these are petty details.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:30 PM

Fairly vicious accusation to make, especially when it’s without proof.

troyriser_gopftw on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

Sue me. Mitt’s dad was politically influential and it’s obvious that Mittens was going to avoid Vietnam come hell or high water.

Sue me man.

But – you can’t avoid the fact that Romney is a “ChickenHawk” – poster child “ChickenHawk” – his whole family (even ancestors) never signed up to serve – and never got drafted either.

ChickenHawk.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:31 PM

And what is he supposed to have done? I realize these are petty details.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:30 PM

No – they are VERY important details Jim – that’s why I want all sides to air this out.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:32 PM

Herman Cain had two SH complaints filed against him.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

So merely filing complaints means you did them?

Wonder if you’ll apply that to Saint Sarah or Saint Rick?

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:32 PM

No, I’m the first to say we should accept Perry’s denials of being gay, at least until the full details come out.

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

Romney needs his wingtips buffed and his hair slicked back. Chop chop!

Punchenko on November 2, 2011 at 4:33 PM

If he did these things (and I’m not saying he did, but it isn’t looking great since he himself said this would be coming), why the hell would you rather not know about it?

capitalist piglet on November 2, 2011 at 4:20 PM

Good point. He must be guilty of something or else this web site would not be buying so much rope. Let’s keep hanging him now and if some of the things we hung him for were bogus we can always loosen the rope later.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:33 PM

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:30 PM

how about answering them in a consistent fashion, w/o changing the story and “remembering” new “facts” every other interview. the whole “i know you are but what am i” type answer at the start was just way out of the norm, especially since his campaign had a 10 day lead on this. he is sounding dumber and dumber. and this new accusation while anonymous isnt unexpected. Ace said the other day he had heard this kinda talk a week or so ago and it was not just 2 incidents, but many.

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:34 PM

The allegations are one thing – but acting guilty is a total other “thing” that will get hung up in people’s minds.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

That’s the sad part, isn’t it.

I don’t think there’s enough specificity in the story yet to rule out some kind of astroturfing. But even if it’s no more than astroturfing, the danger is that it will be successful.

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:35 PM

So merely filing complaints means you did them?

Wonder if you’ll apply that to Saint Sarah or Saint Rick?

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:32 PM

Show me where I said Saint Herman was GUILTY of Sexual Harrassment.

He’s guilty of being a clown and a poor campaigner – and for adding to his problems – but I don’t that he’s guilty of SH.

I’d like to know a bit more about the allegations though – which Cainlusionals don’t want me (or anyone else) to know.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:35 PM

New story up:

New woman comes forward about Cain ……

portlandon on November 2, 2011 at 4:24 PM

No, she doesn’t.

Another anonymous person makes an accusation.

Same rules as for Saint Sarah and Saint Rick. If you are going to argue that accusations from anonymous people represent fact, than you are going to apply them equally.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:35 PM

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:33 PM

nice strawman there, but wanting to hear the other side of the stories isnt teh same as “hanging him now”.

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:36 PM

Same rules as for Saint Sarah and Saint Rick. If you are going to argue that accusations from anonymous people represent fact, than you are going to apply them equally.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:35 PM

You know – I agree with this. I don’t even really count this third woman’s complaints – she could be totally made up.

However – the first two ARE NOT made up – they filed complaints … complaints which Herman Cain doesn’t want them to talk about now.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:37 PM

When I first heard about this story I blogged that the Politico story wasn’t all they knew and that they and other media would drip new details. This is all rumor and innuendo at this point, including any connection to Romney’s campaign. Sometimes political donors act like college fans who “help out” star players and getting the school/campaign in trouble.

On one hand, if the allegations prove to be true (and who will ever know?) it’s something the voters have a right to know, but if all they have is vague charges like Anita Hill’s, I’d be ashamed of any rival campaign who shopped this story.

Where there’s smoke, there may be a smoke machine. It’s too early to tell.

flataffect on November 2, 2011 at 4:37 PM

So he’s an agent for Rove

And Rove has been pushing Romney/Perry

BAM! It’s the GOP machine THAT EVERYONE HATES left/right/middle

The same machine that gave us McCain , gosh he was a real winner huh?

The GOP hate Reagan too. Declared he was unelectable and only had the support of the far right

LeeSeneca on November 2, 2011 at 4:38 PM

Show me where I said Saint Herman was GUILTY of Sexual Harrassment.

You have been saying it all the way through the thread. You have stated that all of these allegations are valid. You have repeatedly smeared Herman Cain as guilty.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:38 PM

Good point. He must be guilty of something or else this web site would not be buying so much rope. Let’s keep hanging him now and if some of the things we hung him for were bogus we can always loosen the rope later.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:33 PM

I really hope you get banned for that comment – asserting that HotAir is trying to “lynch” Herman Cain.

Race Card – dealt just the way Obama likes to deal it.

Stay Classy.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:40 PM

No – they are VERY important details Jim – that’s why I want all sides to air this out.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:32 PM

Air what out? So far all we’ve had are anonymous, unspecified allegations.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:40 PM

Wilson claims that he also can’t discuss the specifics, for legal reasons.

Is Gloria Allred out of the country or something? Seems like she’s way overdue.

Barnestormer on November 2, 2011 at 4:40 PM

You have been saying it all the way through the thread. You have stated that all of these allegations are valid. You have repeatedly smeared Herman Cain as guilty.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:38 PM

Then show me one instance of it.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:40 PM

However – the first two ARE NOT made up – they filed complaints … complaints which Herman Cain doesn’t want them to talk about now.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:37 PM

And once again you claim that complaints equal guilt.

And you don’t have names. You don’t have dates, you don’t have times, you don’t have evidence.

But you claim Herman Cain is guilty.

Guess what? Complaints were filed against Saint Sarah and Saint Rick, too.

Please state that, since complaints were filed, they are automatically valid and that both Saint Sarah and Saint Rick are guilty of anything involving a complaint being filed.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:41 PM

Being gay would HELP Rick Perry in the polls poles.
HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:11 PM

Fixed that for you.
Lawdawg86 on November 2, 2011 at 4:26 PM

His numbers would rise as he thrust toward the end of the campaign.

whatcat on November 2, 2011 at 4:41 PM

how about answering them in a consistent fashion, w/o changing the story and “remembering” new “facts” every other interview. the whole “i know you are but what am i” type answer at the start was just way out of the norm, especially since his campaign had a 10 day lead on this. he is sounding dumber and dumber. and this new accusation while anonymous isnt unexpected. Ace said the other day he had heard this kinda talk a week or so ago and it was not just 2 incidents, but many.

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:34 PM

You have perfect recall of every single thing that happened to you 10-15 years ago at a moment’s notice, with no mistakes? That’s thrilling.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:41 PM

Air what out? So far all we’ve had are anonymous, unspecified allegations.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:40 PM

No we haven’t. Herman Cain admits that he had two complaints filed on him. He even tried to provide specifics (he wasn’t very good at them).

He’s told his story – he’s said these women were basically complaining about nothing.

I’d now like to hear their side of the story please.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:42 PM

I’m not sure why there is confusion.

If these tales are false or planted or based on grubby opportunism and Cain knows this and knows he’s not guilty of lewd or unwanted behavior, why doesn’t he hit this head on?

Shutting doors in reporters faces and refusing to answer questions from reporters you must know are going to ask them is simply not good PR problem-solving or good politics.

rrpjr on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

You have perfect recall of every single thing that happened to you 10-15 years ago at a moment’s notice, with no mistakes? That’s thrilling.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:41 PM

I got accused of discrimination by a junior member of my submarine crew almost 20 years ago.

Yeah – I remember every detail. It’s funny how those things get “etched” into your mind when you’re accused of something serious.

Unless you’re Herman Cain that is. :P

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

Sue me. Mitt’s dad was politically influential and it’s obvious that Mittens was going to avoid Vietnam come hell or high water.

Sue me man.

But – you can’t avoid the fact that Romney is a “ChickenHawk” – poster child “ChickenHawk” – his whole family (even ancestors) never signed up to serve – and never got drafted either.

ChickenHawk.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:31 PM

Cheney sure avoided Vietnam and so did Bush. Kerry tried to but his plans didn’t fully work out, and a “chickenhawk” has to be someone who pushes war to fit the “hawk” part of “chickenhawk”.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:44 PM

Wilson claims that he also can’t discuss the specifics, for legal reasons.

Mmmm, how does that work? Not a NRA officer at the time. Not a party to the NDA’s. What might those legal reasons be?

petefrt on November 2, 2011 at 4:44 PM

If these tales are false or planted or based on grubby opportunism and Cain knows this and knows he’s not guilty of lewd or unwanted behavior, why doesn’t he hit this head on?

Shutting doors in reporters faces and refusing to answer questions from reporters you must know are going to ask them is simply not good PR problem-solving or good politics.

rrpjr on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

Because you are the ones making the accusations; therefore, it is incumbent upon you to provide the evidence of them.

Unless, of course, you’d like to state publicly that you should be able to make whatever smear you want and the other person has to prove it’s not true.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:46 PM

I got accused of discrimination by a junior member of my submarine crew almost 20 years ago.

Yeah – I remember every detail. It’s funny how those things get “etched” into your mind when you’re accused of something serious.

Unless you’re Herman Cain that is. :P

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

Well maybe you have a guilty conscience and Cain does not.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:46 PM

Cheney sure avoided Vietnam and so did Bush. Kerry tried to but his plans didn’t fully work out, and a “chickenhawk” has to be someone who pushes war to fit the “hawk” part of “chickenhawk”.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:44 PM

So because those guys avoided Vietnam this makes avoiding Vietnam okay?

Sounds like Liberal Moral Relativism – just exactly what I’d suspect Romney supporters to pull.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:46 PM

No we haven’t. Herman Cain admits that he had two complaints filed on him. He even tried to provide specifics (he wasn’t very good at them).

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:42 PM

So that means they’re not anonymous, unspecified allegations? You’re not making sense, hon.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:47 PM

I got accused of discrimination by a junior member of my submarine crew almost 20 years ago.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

So you admit that you discriminated, since you claim that any complaints or accusations equal absolute proof.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:47 PM

Well maybe you have a guilty conscience and Cain does not.

InkyBinkyBarleyBoo on November 2, 2011 at 4:46 PM

The allegations against me were investigated and dismissed as false. There’s a military record of it. I’m fine with you viewing it.

Cain doesn’t seem to want to be that forthcoming. Hmmmmmm

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:48 PM

I’d now like to hear their side of the story please.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:42 PM

You already have.

Now they’re spinning and making excuses as to why they can’t tell the facts.

Funny, though, you’re not holding them accountable, or asking why they would blabber to a reporter when they’re desperate to hide their identities.

It’s all about Cain. Again, guilty until proven innocent. The Obama/Perry way, apparently.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:48 PM

I got accused of discrimination by a junior member of my submarine crew almost 20 years ago.

Yeah – I remember every detail. It’s funny how those things get “etched” into your mind when you’re accused of something serious.

Unless you’re Herman Cain that is. :P

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

And you wouldn’t make any mistakes when describing it, because you just wouldn’t. I like this hypothetical scenario you’ve established. You’d do a better job of it because you just would.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:49 PM

So you admit that you discriminated, since you claim that any complaints or accusations equal absolute proof.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:47 PM

I’ve never said that and I’ve repeatedly asked you to link me to where I said that.

I’ve said repeatedly that I don’t know whether or not these allegations against Cain are true.

But I do believe that all sides need to be aired.

They’ll be aired one way or the other.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:49 PM

And you wouldn’t make any mistakes when describing it, because you just wouldn’t. I like this hypothetical scenario you’ve established. You’d do a better job of it because you just would.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:49 PM

I wouldn’t make as many mistakes as Cain has … no.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:50 PM

The allegations against me were investigated and dismissed as false. There’s a military record of it. I’m fine with you viewing it.

Cain doesn’t seem to want to be that forthcoming. Hmmmmmm

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:48 PM

That’s interesting…

Say, did anyone involved in that case get a year’s salary worth of possible hush money?

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:50 PM

I wouldn’t make as many mistakes as Cain has … no.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:50 PM

I think you’d make more. Prove otherwise.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:51 PM

Now they’re spinning and making excuses as to why they can’t tell the facts.

Funny, though, you’re not holding them accountable, or asking why they would blabber to a reporter when they’re desperate to hide their identities.

It’s all about Cain. Again, guilty until proven innocent. The Obama/Perry way, apparently.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:48 PM

We have not heard the women’s stories. We’ve heard Politico’s accusations and Cain’s explanations – we haven’t heard from the women themselves.

I think that might be relevent – their side of the story.

You seem to disagree.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

Because you are the ones making the accusations; therefore, it is incumbent upon you to provide the evidence of them.
northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:46 PM

What accusation did I make? I asked a question about Cain’s PR management skills. Pay attention or don’t play.

rrpjr on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

Say, did anyone involved in that case get a year’s salary worth of possible hush money?

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:50 PM

Where did you go to law school?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

I think you’d make more. Prove otherwise.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:51 PM

Prove I wouldn’t.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

Yeah – I remember every detail. It’s funny how those things get “etched” into your mind when you’re accused of something serious.

Unless you’re Herman Cain that is. :P

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:43 PM

I’m guessing you don’t have a history of alcohol abuse… because you know that will do terrible things to your memory…

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:53 PM

Where did you go to law school?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

Yeah… gotta be a Philly lawyer to recognize hush money when ya see it.

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:54 PM

I’m guessing you don’t have a history of alcohol abuse… because you know that will do terrible things to your memory…

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:53 PM

I don’t drink Jim. Sorry – I was a Sailor and did a lot of whoring but never drank. :D

Women – my only vice. :D

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:55 PM

Prove I wouldn’t.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

That’s not how it works. I’ve made the accusation, now you have to prove otherwise. You just failed the first test.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:56 PM

Yeah… gotta be a Philly lawyer to recognize hush money when ya see it.

JohnGalt23 on November 2, 2011 at 4:54 PM

So it wasn’t in Philadelphia. Where was it?

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:56 PM

I’ve said repeatedly that I don’t know whether or not these allegations against Cain are true.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:49 PM

Oh, so you don’t know that they’re true? Then why are you and your buddy JohnGalt23 screaming that Cain is guilty?

I mean, given that JohnGalt23 is a Paulbot, the reason he’s going nuts has to do with the Paulbot belief that black people are evil and out to rape white women. What’s your excuse?

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:57 PM

how about answering them in a consistent fashion, w/o changing the story and “remembering” new “facts” every other interview. the whole “i know you are but what am i” type answer at the start was just way out of the norm, especially since his campaign had a 10 day lead on this. he is sounding dumber and dumber. and this new accusation while anonymous isnt unexpected. Ace said the other day he had heard this kinda talk a week or so ago and it was not just 2 incidents, but many.

chasdal on November 2, 2011 at 4:34 PM

Maybe you should consider that if and when your turn comes to be accused. SH can be filed on the whim of any accuser – doesn’t mean you’re guilty. As been stated before, a five-figure amount only means that they paid her off to get lost, not that there was any truth to the matter.

As for the accusation of changing stories, consider the following: do you know exactly what was said when Politico contacted Cain ten days ago? For all you know, they could have asked; “is there anything you care to say about a charge of sexual harassment back in the 90s?” A negative response would be all they needed to amp this hit piece by expressing a bit of concern that he didn’t come clean when given the chance.

On the flipside, imagine the superlotto euphoria, had they actually flushed a serial harasser to sing like a canary about habitual abuses going all the way back to the ‘janitor hitting on the cute cashier’ days. Go reread all that politico and Cain said/wrote in sequence. In all the back & forth, Politico dropped a little more info, to which Cain responded with a little more info, based on the story Politico was framing.

Bottomline, Cain was on the TP circuit for a year & half, and running for POTUS for over 1/2 year and all of a sudden this comes out??? If Cain was serial, much more would have been dropped by now, as all the “victims” would have been in a race to be 1st to get a payout from the media bonanza.

Simply put, Politico was on a fishing expedition and wanted Cain to snag himself on their hook. And for that, some of us are ready to jump off the train. Only question is where will you land?

AH_C on November 2, 2011 at 4:57 PM

That’s not how it works. I’ve made the accusation, now you have to prove otherwise. You just failed the first test.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 4:56 PM

I see your point – but I’m not asking Herman Cain to prove anything.

I’m simply asking that he ask the NRA to allow these women to talk. He’s not going to get beyond this issue until those women have their say. They will have their say eventually anyway. Why not just let it all come out now?

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:58 PM

We have not heard the women’s stories. We’ve heard Politico’s accusations and Cain’s explanations – we haven’t heard from the women themselves.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:52 PM

Sure we did. Politico quoted them.

Unless you’d like to state that Politico wasn’t in fact quoting them and was just making accusations — in which case, you’ve been bawling that Herman Cain was guilty of sexual harassment for four days now based on Politico’s unsourced and unreliable accusations.

Oh, that’s right, you have.

Looks like you lynched before you got evidence, Honda.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:59 PM

Oh, so you don’t know that they’re true? Then why are you and your buddy JohnGalt23 screaming that Cain is guilty?

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:57 PM

I have asked you THREE TIMES to link me to the post where I accuse Cain of being guilty. And you have not done it. You keep repeating the lie – but you haven’t provided any truth.

The only thing remotely I’ve said is that Herman Cain is “acting guilty” by his inability to explain things without numerous appearances on television to clarify his statments – which have been conflicting. First he didn’t know about a settlement – then he recalls one … yada yada.

And – the fact that he hasn’t come out and asked these women to tell their side – is supicious to me.

But I have never said he was guilty – not once. Because – I really think there’s probably not a lot to these allegations.

But I want to be as sure of that as I can – I want to hear the women.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 5:02 PM

I see your point – but I’m not asking Herman Cain to prove anything.

I’m simply asking that he ask the NRA to allow these women to talk. He’s not going to get beyond this issue until those women have their say. They will have their say eventually anyway. Why not just let it all come out now?

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:58 PM

Yes you are. You’re asking Herman Cain to prove that he’s guilty after you’ve made the accusation that he is.

Where is your proof? Where is your evidence? If the women haven’t talked, as you allege, on what did you make the accusation in the first place?

Answer the questions, HondaV65. You claimed Cain sexually harassed these women. You must provide the evidence.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 5:02 PM

Sure we did. Politico quoted them.

Unless you’d like to state that Politico wasn’t in fact quoting them and was just making accusations — in which case, you’ve been bawling that Herman Cain was guilty of sexual harassment for four days now based on Politico’s unsourced and unreliable accusations.

Oh, that’s right, you have.

Looks like you lynched before you got evidence, Honda.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 4:59 PM

Race Card – sign of a weak argument. Obama uses that a lot – Cain does now too. See any similarity?

Next – no … we haven’t heard from the women. Yes – Politico has reported some things – and you guys say that the politico story is false – so why wouldn’t their reports of what the women said be false also?

I’d like to hear from the women themselves thank you.

I have a feeling I will hear from the women – we all will.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 5:04 PM

I see your point – but I’m not asking Herman Cain to prove anything.

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 4:58 PM

Test #2: Failed.

Jim Treacher on November 2, 2011 at 5:04 PM

The only thing remotely I’ve said is that Herman Cain is “acting guilty”

So you’ve declared him guilty. You have judged him and found him to be guilty based on your biased perception of his behavior.

Well, that’s at least better than your buddy JohnGalt23′s bias based on skin color.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 5:04 PM

Just wondering, Romney was the frontrunner for a good long while and none of this crap happened to him.

You think it might be because a) Romney isn’t conservative and b) Romney poses no threat to the left, but Herman Cain is a MASSIVE, EXISTENTIAL threat to them?

BKennedy on November 2, 2011 at 5:04 PM

Yes you are. You’re asking Herman Cain to prove that he’s guilty after you’ve made the accusation that he is.

Where is your proof? Where is your evidence? If the women haven’t talked, as you allege, on what did you make the accusation in the first place?

Answer the questions, HondaV65. You claimed Cain sexually harassed these women. You must provide the evidence.

northdallasthirty on November 2, 2011 at 5:02 PM

Ah – I remember when I was twelve years old – like you. Don’t worry – the hormones will balance out soon enough.

LINKS TO YOUR CHARGES PLEASE (fifth time I’ve asked)

HondaV65 on November 2, 2011 at 5:05 PM

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