Cain on China: “They’re trying to develop nuclear capability”; Update: Cain getting a bad rap?

posted at 9:05 pm on November 1, 2011 by Allahpundit

Via Ace, skip ahead to 11:30 or so for the key bit. The quote:

HERMAN CAIN: I do view China as a potential military threat to the United States.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And what could you do as president to head that off?

HERMAN CAIN: My China strategy is quite simply outgrow China. It gets back to economics. China has a $6 trillion economy and they’re growing at approximately 10 percent. We have a $14 trillion economy — much bigger — but we’re growing at an anemic 1.5, 1.6 percent. When we get our economy growing back at the rate of 5 or 6 percent that it has the ability to do, we will outgrow China.

And secondly, we already have superiority in terms of our military capability, and I plan to get away from making cutting our defense a priority and make investing in our military capability a priority, going back to my statement: peace through strength and clarity. So yes they’re a military threat. They’ve indicated that they’re trying to develop nuclear capability and they want to develop more aircraft carriers like we have. So yes, we have to consider them a military threat.

The phrasing’s slightly ambiguous so it becomes a rorschach test on Cain. If you like him and trust that he has a grasp on policy, you’ll think he’s referring here to developing nuclear-powered aircraft carriers. The Pentagon’s chief worry right now is China building any sort of carrier, not necessarily a nuclear one, so this would be an odd bit of specificity from Cain. But fair enough — a Chinese nuclear carrier would indeed be a big deal. If you don’t like him and/or don’t trust him on policy, you’ll think he’s referring here to China developing a general nuclear capability, i.e. nuclear weapons. Which, as pretty much everyone in the world except maybe him knows, they’ve already had for decades. The way the sentence is phrased, with the two parts separated by “and,” it sounds like he’s distinguishing the nuclear component conceptually from the carriers. Could a guy who didn’t know what the “right of return” was and who whiffed on the biggest softball question ever about Gitmo really not know that China has a nuclear deterrent? I’m thinking … maybe. Although it won’t be spun that way tomorrow, needless to say.

The fact that we’re about to have a debate in the comments about whether he knows China has nukes doesn’t bode well for the general election campaign against Obama.

Watch Cain Confident He Can Win Nomination, Says Harassment Claims Are ‘Baseless’ on PBS. See more from PBS NewsHour.

Update: I didn’t see it last night, but here’s what commenter Jason Coleman had to say about Cain’s background with China and nukes:

Herman Cain spent the Vietnam war evaluating the capabilities of the Chinese to deliver a nuclear weapon onto the heads of our forces in South Vietnam.

He examined the test launches of the Dongfeng 1 (SS-1) and plotted out the trajectories for a 500kg warheads.

When China started testing the Dongfeng 2 (CSS-1) Cain plotted out the trajectories and capabilities of it’s delivery of 15 kiloton nuclear weapons.

Both of these missiles were provided to the PRC by the Soviets, Cain analysed data from the Russian test launches and determined the risk to U.S. troops in SE Asia.

Cain also observed the development of China’s first domestically produced missile, Dongfeng 3 (CSS-2) and plotted out it’s use with China’s 15-20KT fissile devices as well as China’s new thermonuclear devices.

Finally, Cain was involved in the determination that China’s Dongfeng 4 (CSS-3) was capable of delivering both fissile and thermonuclear devices to both Moscow and Guam as well as cover the entire deployment of U.S. forces in SE Asia.

Cain is well aware of China’s nuclear missile capability, the only reasonable conclusion is that Cain was indeed referring to China’s attempts to develop and sail their first nuclear aircraft carrier and their attempts to develop more dangerous nuclear cruisers.

I would have broken this out into a separate post except that, after googling, I can’t find anything to confirm Coleman’s claims that Cain spent time on Chinese nukes while he worked on ballistics in the Navy. I e-mailed Coleman to ask for his source but haven’t heard back. He mentioned in another comment last night that some of this is in Cain’s book; I haven’t read it yet but anyone who has is welcome to confirm or deny. Cain’s website says of his time working for the Navy, “Herman continued his education by earning his Master’s degree in computer science from Purdue University while working full-time developing fire control systems for ships and fighter planes for the Department of the Navy,” but Coleman claimed in his second comment that that description is incomplete. If so, I’m surprised Cain hasn’t talked more about his Navy work as a foreign-policy credential. We’ve heard endlessly about Pillsbury and Godfather’s Pizza, but the only time I remember him talking at any length about his Navy work was when Lawrence O’Donnell tried to demagogue him for being some sort of draft dodger. (He told O’Donnell he worked on a “rocket-assisted projectile.”) In any case, there’s at least some reason to doubt the theory that Cain didn’t know about China’s nuke stockpile. Duly noted.

Update: Jason Coleman e-mails to say that some of the details he provided are in Cain’s book, some have been gleaned from bits of info dropped by Cain on the trail, and some he knows from chatting with Cain’s former colleagues. He has no online links to point me too (Cain’s work for the Navy long predated the Internet, obviously) but will send them along if he finds any.

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To defend Cain, people point to Obama… conservatives’ standards should be higher than that low bar.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 9:44 PM

Well.. it’s like.. normal people do make mistakes. But we’ve become so sensitized to mistakes these candidates make while talking. Heck, I make up my own words sometimes. It’s so much easier, you know, just to keep the flow of speech going.

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:50 PM

Get back to me when Cain makes real foreign policy gaffes–y’know, bowing to foreign leaders, dissing the USUK special relationship, dithering on A-Stan, botching the Iraq SOFA, backing Zelaya, making the Dalai Lama use the back door near the trash, backing A-jad over Neda, killing 100s of Mexicans via F&F, Chicago is OUT?!, not knowing the proper Austrian term, Polish missile defense, getting punked by Medvedev, days not weeks, and on and on…

Mkay?

Christien on November 1, 2011 at 9:50 PM

andy85719 on November 1, 2011 at 9:49 PM

Where are you reading/hearing this?

thphilli on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:18 PM

Uh, what?

Palin’s statement was objectively true. That is, not indicative of a lack of knowledge whatsoever. But it was still portrayed as wrong.

“Exceptionally well-informed,” and three dollars gets you a coffee. We’re in narrative-based politics now. Cain’s narrative is that he’s a policy doofus, so naturally his words are going to have to be parsed by those looking for (or generating) error.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 9:21 PM

It was a while ago that I started muting the set whenever Palin made one of those belabored speaking appearances on Greta Van Susteren’s show on Fox. She is not a brilliant mind, is an irritating speaker (says far too many words without making any specific point — call it “nervousness” or not ready for prime time, whatever, it’s not a good aspect about her capabilities for the Oval Office.

There are Personality Cults on the Left and the Right. Unfortunately, some people latch onto a public figure like an idol and they just can’t let go, sorta’ like a video I saw recently of a crying girl child about Justin Bieber (she “wants him to come and live with us and be part of our family” and is upset and crying because he’s now ‘gone’ off the set…).

It’s called obsession, it displaces objectivity.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

This week will be non-stop coverage of Cain, the accuser, and his litany of unusual gaffes. Be prepared.

andy85719 on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

They stated last year that they were developing more and better nukes to increase their nuclear strike capability. Pretty much exactly what he said.

“The United States and China’s Asian neighbors remain concerned about the pace and scope of China’s current military modernization efforts, including its quantitative and qualitative modernization of its nuclear capabilities…”

Heywood U. Reedmore on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

Prepare your anus.
rickyricardo on November 1, 2011 at 9:30 PM

yuk, ricky…speak for yourself.

I really think Cain intended to say China wanted to grow their nuclear capabilities and aircraft carriers like we have. He’s been doing an awful lot of talking lately amd makes a lot of misspeaks like “legal lawyers” on Fox tonite.

His words are really being parsed and it is a giant pile on of Herman Cain.

gracie on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

http://t.co/i20T3Ye3

http://t.co/azisFzOr

andy85719 on November 1, 2011 at 9:51 PM

I’m hoping he meant “develop their nuclear capability”, but I can’t be sure.

OldEnglish on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

Why are you so afraid of Cain?

jimw on November 1, 2011 at 9:39 PM

Are you ready to come out of the closet for Romney too, Jim? The gig is up, Herman is toast.

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

Can we move on from this guy? Please.

joepub on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

I thought it was unfair to attack Palin for being a newbie because she was only a VP candidate, so her lack of experience was really not that important. Palin was also nowhere near as bad as Cain. I’ve seen plenty of interviews with both of them, and I had more confidence in Palin ’08 than I do when I was Cain now.

The expectations are much, much higher for President than for VP. Cain did great at the early debates because he was able to give brief answers and throw big slabs of red meat. Once he really gets put on the spot, he squirms. You can literally see it happen because he starts to dig in and refuse to answer follow-ups by repeating his canned answers, even when they make no sense in response to the new questions. So I really don’t think Cain knows what he is talking about, and I really don’t think that is excusable.

It has been well documented that he was not campaigning like a serious candidate. He is either running for VP, or he is simply doing this to raise his profile nationally. Either way, that partially explains why he has not done his homework on foreign policy.

For what it’s worth, I would fully expect Perry to be just as ignorant as Cain is about many political issues that he has never had to deal with in Texas, like foreign policy questions about China.

kaltes on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

Could “develop” in his answer mean “increase”?

China has been doing a lot of development. Aircraft carrier, stealth fighter, and across from Taiwan they have increased amphib. capabilities, offensive missile sites, and defensive anti-air sites.

They made a move during Clinton’s administration against Taiwan. Clinton responded with two aircraft carrier task forces.

aigle on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

The man who suggests that punditry is allowed in Islam speculates as to whether Cain knows China has nuclear weapons. Is there anything as ludocrous as being palinized by someone with a risible pseudonym?

Basilsbest on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

Cain’s narrative is that he’s a policy doofus, so naturally his words are going to have to be parsed by those looking for (or generating) error.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 9:21 PM

I don’t think that this is something necessarily being “done to” Cain, but that Cain is providing ample evidence for people desperate for a crack in his credibility, so to speak.

Cain can only rely on “my statement was misunderstood” for so long and eventually he’s going to be known by his “misunderstood” statements.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:53 PM

annoyinglittletwerp on November 1, 2011 at 9:48 PM

Well your child has a firmer grasp of what’s going on in the world then Cain does. How does that make you feel? As a parent, you should proud that your child understands these issues cause most kids these days don’t give a damn. But how does it make you feel that our potential nominee is winging it? It’s gives me very cold feet.

Lance Murdock on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 9:46 PM

I’ve never once said “at least Perry’s better than Romney” and neither have most of my fellow Perry supporters here at HA. We defend him because he, in and of himself, not only has the best record but is also one of THE most qualified candidates the GOP has ever run. There is no “lesser of two evils” with Perry.

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

5-5-5?

OK…how about 4-4-4?

Electrongod on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 9:48 PM

At the risk of hurting some feelings, I have been given no indication that Mr. Cain would have ever utter a remark about this event or any knowledge of it occurring. I may be misjudging him but I think this area might be where he is a bit thin.

Cindy Munford on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

Could “develop” in his answer mean “increase”?

Peter: It’s already done. I dropped them all off at Toys for Toddlers last night.

Brian: All? Peter, only only one gift was for charity, the rest were for the family.

Peter: No, the rest were from the family. Weren’t they? (Pauses.) Oh crap…since when did they change the meaning of “for” to “from”?

Brian: They had a meeting about it last night.

Peter: Why wasn’t I told?

Brian: They sent you a card, but it said “for Peter” on it so you must of thought it was from you, so you didn’t…you know, its just easier to call you stupid.

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Cain’s still a loooong way from winning the Biden Dumbass Award.

Dr. ZhivBlago on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

I lobe Romney, but this is a BS attack.

Chudi on November 1, 2011 at 9:16 PM

You lobe Romney? Is that like lobbing him over the flip-flop fence?

LOL… just kidding… :)

TheRightMan on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

ludicrous

Basilsbest on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

I’m hoping he meant “develop their nuclear capability”, but I can’t be sure.

OldEnglish on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

I’m sure that’s what he meant! I’m sure it is! Seriously! Good that you thought of that!

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

I’m coming back around to Newt Gingrich. He’s intelligent, he’s capable and I’d still like to see and hear him debate Obama, one on one, no teleprompters and Obama’s forbidden the cheating with any earbuds.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

Highly debatable.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Mkay?
Christien on November 1, 2011 at 9:50 PM

u forgot my favorite: corpsman

gracie on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Good Lord!! What is this HA lets pile on Cain week? Do you really think he doesn’t know that China has nuclear missiles? A man who studied rocket ballistics? Come on. Now people are just piling on.

Cain is far far from the perfect candidate. I don’t think anyone can deny that. But what are the alternatives?

Romney? A good man who loves his family. But he has flip flopped on so many issues, and not just small ones. Some of the biggest and most important ones. Gun rights and abortion anyone? And he couldn’t even support the collective bargaining bill in Ohio, when was he was AT the call center for it. And he can be portrayed as a out of touch wall street guy, at a time when the only enthusiasm on the left is against RICH WALL STREET guys. He will feed into the narrative Obama wants. Why do you think they want him so bad?

Perry? A good and and successful governor. I was all for him until the debates. But I wouldn’t have known if that fake lip reading video of Perry was fake unless Allah had labeled it so. He has been so bad as to be incoherent at times. I just can’t see him one on one in a debate with Obama. And calling people who want to enforce our laws “heartless”? Has any candidate made a statement that awful? Also, and I know this isn’t fair, but he will remind people of Bush. In time, this will not be a bad thing, but for now I don’t think this helps us.

Gingrich? Great at the debates, but he has more baggage then anyone, and has a built in negative view from a lot of people. But I would take him over Romney or Perry.

Now Cain has had many flubs. But I have also seen him go on MSNBC and take on 4 or 5 left wing reporters and OWN them. Does he need to get help on foreign policy? Absolutely. But all he has to do is promise never to buy the Queen of England and Ipod loaded with Godfathers pizza songs for her birthday or bow to Saudi Kings when he is in office. He probably needs to cut back on the appearances with the media a bit too. If Perry or Romney did half the appearances Cain is doing, they would be doomed.

I know Cain isn’t perfect. But what we need to win this time is enthusiasm. The only thing thing that keeps Obama in office is if our side loses heart. Cain gives that enthusiasm. Nobody else seems to. And when you look at the negatives of the other candidates honestly, it is the enthusiasm that makes the difference. I will back whoever wins the nomination. But for the nomination, for the reasons stated, I back Herman Cain.

tottoritodd on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

So in summary, Cain is not able?

El_Terrible on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

I’m hoping he meant “develop their nuclear capability”, but I can’t be sure.

OldEnglish on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

I’m sure that’s what he meant! I’m sure it is! Seriously! Good that you thought of that!

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Cain isn’t viable for the Presidency IF we now must have a Cain Decoder Ring at the ready every time he speaks.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

Hey AP, could you give a message to Ace for me?

Just because Ace wants to parse words about Herman Cain, doesn’t mean we’re coming back Rick Perry no matter how hard he tries.

Thanks.

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

To defend Cain, people point to Obama… conservatives’ standards should be higher than that low bar.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 9:44 PM

This is coming from a Perry backer? lmao.

bw222 on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

I’ve never once said “at least Perry’s better than Romney” and neither have most of my fellow Perry supporters here at HA. We defend him because he, in and of himself, not only has the best record but is also one of THE most qualified candidates the GOP has ever run. There is no “lesser of two evils” with Perry.

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

There is only evil by and of itself.

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

How can you not know China is a nuclear power? Where has Cain been his whole life? He was on talk radio, was he not?

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 9:42 PM

Take a minute and check his resume. He knows.

katy the mean old lady on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

The man who suggests that punditry is allowed in Islam speculates as to whether Cain knows China has nuclear weapons. Is there anything as ludocrous as being palinized by someone with a risible pseudonym?

Basilsbest on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

When you have to attack the messenger you are losing the argument.

sharrukin on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

Peace through strength and clarity. :-)

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

It doesn’t matter one iota if we give Cain the benefit of the doubt here or not. I’m sure everyone here can see a pattern arising—-he’s being Palinized. Every word, gesture, movement is going to be scrutinized to the nth degree. I can already sense that the stready drip, drip, drip of stories, soundbites, gossip, etc. is producing doubt in the minds of potential voters. The opposition strategy is working.

KickandSwimMom on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Just because Ace wants to parse words about Herman Cain, doesn’t mean we’re coming back Rick Perry no matter how hard he tries.

Thanks.

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

At least give Huntsman a chance.

El_Terrible on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

But what would we call this feature about Obama’s amateurisms? Any suggestions?

Allahpundit on November 1, 2011 at 9:41 PM

But one a day is way too limiting for Odipstick…

And we need a weekly ranking, not just the worst since there are so many bad ones…

*sigh*

China doesn’t have anything to worry about from him either…

ajacksonian on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

I sure am getting sick of the anal probes on every GD word Cain uses.

Where was the anal probe when we were hearing we had 57 states or that children need a breathalyzer for asthma attacks.

katy on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

This is a bad week for Cain.

He is making mistakes, when he can’t afford to. He’s never held elected office. That means he has no room for error for a Presidential run, and keeps tripping over himself.

Is Cain the Hindenburg?

Oh the Humanity????

portlandon on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

Bingo. Theres the rub, I think there is an assumption that if Cain implodes that his supporters run to Perry, from what Ive seen here, I dont think thats going to be the case. I think if it does happen we will see a Newt surge. Were already seeing evidence of it in the polls with Newt edging out Perry for third.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

For what it’s worth, I would fully expect Perry to be just as ignorant as Cain is about many political issues that he has never had to deal with in Texas, like foreign policy questions about China.

kaltes on November 1, 2011 at 9:52 PM

You sure? Wanna bet?

:)

TheRightMan on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Cain isn’t viable for the Presidency IF we now must have a Cain Decoder Ring at the ready every time he speaks.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

You don’t need a ring. You just need to believe.
But, a decoder ring would be kinda cool.

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:59 PM

gumble on November 1, 2011 at 9:28 PM

Here’s a great article supporting Newt from Townhall.

IrishEi on November 1, 2011 at 9:59 PM

Why’s he talking to Judy Woodruff, anyway? She’s married to Al Hunt, by the way.

Imagine the dinner conversation between Al Hunt and Judy Woodruff.

SlaveDog on November 1, 2011 at 9:59 PM

Id dont think cain is ready for this at all , but an excuse could be that he meant “expand nuclear capability”.

But “trying to develop nuclear capability” always means trying to get nuclear weapons , not reactors.

the_nile on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

O/T…

Oh, ick, now Condoleezza Rice is reprimanding “America” for not passing that Amnesty bill from the Bush Administration (trying to justify it because “Bush, McCain and Ted Kennedy” tried to get it passed).

She’s claiming that “we’re a nation of immigrants and we’ve got to get our immigration system straightened out” (to avoid becoming “like Europe and Russia”…whattheheck).

I always wonder about people who make these claims, why they think it’s only due to “immigrants” that America achieves; what about all us citizens who aren’t “immigrants”?

Condoleezza Rice, Progressive.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

How come every time the press brings up a moral failure for one of our candidates we can’t say, “Yeah, well, Obama did cocaine!”.

Cindy Munford on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Arent the next two debates foreign policy only? That should be interesting.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Newt balanced the budget when he was in office.

Newt wins. Sorry guys. It’s really as simple as that.

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 10:01 PM

If this accuser thing blows over and he does well in the two foreign policy debates, maybe, maybe I’ll get back on the train. Otherwise it’s a bridge too far.

andy85719 on November 1, 2011 at 10:02 PM

But what would we call this feature about Obama’s amateurisms? Any suggestions?

Allahpundit on November 1, 2011 at 9:41 PM

Not sure what to call it, but could you possibly run it every day?

massrighty on November 1, 2011 at 10:02 PM

Good grief AP, nice prejudicial headline. You need to pray for forgiveness.

exdeadhead on November 1, 2011 at 10:02 PM

I’m not going to denigrate Cain because he doesn’t deserve it.

But I’m sure he’s not who I want for President. Too much James T. Kirk in him for me.

We tolerated “The Deciderer”. Why punish ourselves?

BobMbx on November 1, 2011 at 10:02 PM

Lance Murdock on November 1, 2011 at 9:54 PM

My son is casting his first vote in 2012 and wants to be an informed voter.

annoyinglittletwerp on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 10:01 PM

Oh but its not…lol. The baggage on Newt is legion, it wont be simple for him at all should he emerge in top tier.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Arent the next two debates foreign policy only? That should be interesting.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Well, if Cain’s as incurably stupid as his critics assert, the others ought to wipe the floor with him, oughtn’t they?

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Take a minute and check his resume. He knows.

katy the mean old lady on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

He doesn’t know.

They’ve indicated that they’re trying to develop nuclear capability and they want to develop more aircraft carriers like we have.

He also did not know anything about the neoconservative movement.

You can read it here:

http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2011/10/16/cain-foreign-policy-ignorance-neoconservatism/

:-(

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

JellyToast on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

Here’s hoping. :)

OldEnglish on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Just because Ace wants to parse words about Herman Cain, doesn’t mean we’re coming back Rick Perry no matter how hard he tries.

Thanks.

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

In other words, my suspicion that you are a Romneybot at heart is gradually panning out?

:) or my trademark ‘Tee hee hee™’

TheRightMan on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

But what would we call this feature about Obama’s amateurisms? Any suggestions?

Allahpundit on November 1, 2011 at 9:41 PM

Allahpundit:Brilliant…wait a tick….the first Hot Air posty
in da morning has the exact same name….oh your
a trickster..haha..(I kid):)

canopfor on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

The baggage on Newt is legion, it wont be simple for him at all should he emerge in top tier.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

I’ll run Newt’s personal baggage against Obama’s economic baggage every day of the week.

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

Bingo. Theres the rub, I think there is an assumption that if Cain implodes that his supporters run to Perry, from what Ive seen here, I dont think thats going to be the case. I think if it does happen we will see a Newt surge. Were already seeing evidence of it in the polls with Newt edging out Perry for third.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Well Ace is a huge Perry supporter just like Erick Erickson over at RedState. The more people try and tear down Cain, the more we like him. If I wanted to read their crap I’d go over there.

America loves an underdog or something like that.

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

I sure am getting sick of the anal probes on every GD word Cain uses.

Where was the anal probe when we were hearing we had 57 states or that children need a breathalyzer for asthma attacks.

katy on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Or get ice cream in Arizona for their kids?!?!

THE BIG STORY from 2008 was (and continues to be, unfortunately) that the media waged a third-leg relationship with the DNC in electing Obama and in doing so, created some fictional character that he isn’t (thus, got him elected).

This has all been swept away as mere grumbling about “Journolisters” while the actual deeds have remained almost entirely uninvestigated and no one named responsible. Axelrod and Anita Dunn, the mastermind-uglies behind it…not to mention their eager Toadies in Hollywood.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

What I do comment about is antagonizing the media in a video in the wake of the Giffords shooting. You know, stuff that actually matters.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 9:42 PM

It’s the fact that so many backstabbing Republicans joined MSM’s efforts to destroy Palin that I’m probably going to write her in in ’12 even though I’m not a huge fan. She may not be perfect but she is despised by the GOP establishment and is a reformer so she is alright be me. Paul is a reformer too and is fantastic on most domestic issues but terrible on foreign policy so he’s my preferred VP.

Palin/Paul ’12!!!

FloatingRock on November 1, 2011 at 10:05 PM

When you have to attack the messenger you are losing the argument.sharrukin on November 1, 2011 at 9:57 PM

He chooses the topics. He’s hardly the messenger. He hardly ever attacks Obama. Or didn’t you notice?

Basilsbest on November 1, 2011 at 10:05 PM

annoyinglittletwerp on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Well its a shame that a leading GOP contender doesn’t care.

Lance Murdock on November 1, 2011 at 10:05 PM

My son is casting his first vote in 2012 and wants to be an informed voter.

annoyinglittletwerp on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Good little twerp! Maybe he’ll be more excited for his first vote than I was – Bob Dole YUCK!

gophergirl on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

Agreed, sadly. Now, more than ever, we need clarity of intent.

OldEnglish on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

Oh but its not…lol. The baggage on Newt is legion, it wont be simple for him at all should he emerge in top tier.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

Newt will be fine. He is actually a conservative, can talk, knows the issues, and has a good track record.

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

The other thing about Palin/Paul ’12 is that together they represent the lions share of tea partiers, IMO.

FloatingRock on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

Breaking News: Herman Cain says he would cut funding to the Manhattan Project and limit our building of Atomic bombs.

portlandon on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

KickandSwimMom on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

He’s not “being Palinized”, he’s doing this to himself. This is ALL Cain. Every mistake and gaffe he’s made, he’s the one who made them.

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

FloatingRock on November 1, 2011 at 10:05 PM

I hope you’re aware that Palin’s style of governing Alaska was to work with a bipartisan majority coalition in the Alaska Senate, with conservative Republicans in the minority.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 10:07 PM

Bingo. Theres the rub, I think there is an assumption that if Cain implodes that his supporters run to Perry, from what Ive seen here, I dont think thats going to be the case. I think if it does happen we will see a Newt surge. Were already seeing evidence of it in the polls with Newt edging out Perry for third.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 9:58 PM

LOL… a Romneybot hoping Gingrich becomes the next flavor.

You do know that your candidate is pathetic if his only strategy is in keeping the conservative field divided long enough for him to render most of the early state wins meaningless or to sweep them with a plurality?

Romney’s greatest nightmare… the implosion of Cain and the comeback of Rick Perry… game over for the Mittster.

:)

TheRightMan on November 1, 2011 at 10:08 PM

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

Its not just personal baggage, he has a lot of political baggage as well.

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

Yeah I think there is some of that going on for sure, people can get more protective of their candidates the more they are hit. It may help Cain not hurt to have this going on, not sure yet.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

I suspect the second tier is going to jump on him for these remarks and others, we’ll see how he handles it.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:08 PM

Hey AP, could you give a message to Ace for me?

Knucklehead on November 1, 2011 at 9:56 PM

Knucklehead:Just to clarify….Ace is the USS Hot Airs,sistership,

called,the USS Tepid Air!!(sarc):)

canopfor on November 1, 2011 at 10:08 PM

I can’t wait for tomorrow’s What Herman Meant to Say Was.

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 10:09 PM

Anybody who give two sh**ts about this country and has some good ideas to put it on the right track and who don’t see in either party anyone who is willing to stand on principle, please don’t run.

Just stand pat and watch your country go down in flames because the party Establishments and Elites want to bilk this nation’s riches and bring us down. Don’t run. Don’t add to the debate. Don’t demand boldness. Don’t push the GOP field to the conservative side. Don’t do it, because they will destroy you and those on the Right will watch them do it and some will even help them!

milemarker2020 on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

I hope you’re aware that Palin’s style of governing Alaska was to work with a bipartisan majority coalition in the Alaska Senate, with conservative Republicans in the minority.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 10:07 PM

Oh well, the other candidates are worse. They sat around on the sidelines waiting for their effort to climb the political ladder while Palin stuck her neck out to help us put a stop to Obama agenda.

Palin/Paul ’12!

FloatingRock on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

How come every time the press brings up a moral failure for one of our candidates we can’t say, “Yeah, well, Obama did cocaine!”.

Cindy Munford on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Gee, maybe because our standard ought to be higher than the worst POTUS ever?

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

The baggage on Newt is legion, it wont be simple for him at all should he emerge in top tier.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:03 PM

I’ll run Newt’s personal baggage against Obama’s economic baggage every day of the week.

lorien1973 on November 1, 2011 at 10:04 PM

@ nswider: all that “baggage on Newt” that you allege is “huge” boils down, in reality, to three repeated bits of gossip, the worst being that he “handed his wife divorce papers when she was dying in bed with cancer.”

A lie, didn’t happen, been addressed and explained but some people just have to gossip to the contrary.

Then there’s that “baggage” that he supports global warming or that Green Mess. Yes, he’s made some statements about his support of ethanol, growing corn and other biofuels for energy use but that’s simply smart economics as long as he continues (as he has) to support continued petroleum exploration and extraction (and use).

The whole Dede-Scuzzafava-thing (spelled?) that Gingrich endorsed…she WAS a Republican IN A LEFTWING STATE AND VOTER ENVIRONMENT, so Gingrich endorsed her over the more Leftwing in the race (though I thought this was a complicated and objectionable event, I can understand why he did what he did for political reasons, an attempt to win the House majority).

EVERYone has “baggage.” Some people just won’t concede they were involved in gossip, however, once proven they were. But everyone has “baggage.”

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

This is like 2008 W.O.R.M. What Obama Really Meant.

andy85719 on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

I’m probably writing in Palin/Paul in ’12 even if they both endorse other candidates that I don’t like….

FloatingRock on November 1, 2011 at 10:11 PM

I hope you’re aware that Palin’s style of governing Alaska was to work with a bipartisan majority coalition in the Alaska Senate, with conservative Republicans in the minority.

KingGold on November 1, 2011 at 10:07 PM

And that’s a bad thing because….

idesign on November 1, 2011 at 10:11 PM

Too much James T. Kirk in him for me.

We tolerated “The Deciderer”. Why punish ourselves?

BobMbx on November 1, 2011 at 10:02 PM

It’s not logical for you to disparage the captain in this way.

massrighty on November 1, 2011 at 10:12 PM

gracie on November 1, 2011 at 9:55 PM

“Corpse man” was a gaffe, albeit not a foreign policy gaffe.

Christien on November 1, 2011 at 10:12 PM

TheRightMan on November 1, 2011 at 10:08 PM

Your guys in fourth place man, lol, I dont think Romneys that worried. I dont think its Romneys only strategy, I think his main strategy is to get a ground game in the early states, debate well and be coherent and let his opponents implode on their own.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

And how is Obama’s foreign policy brilliance and command of the facts looking these days? Egypt is his pet project, the outreach speech about Islam there, demanding Mubarak step down, and now chaos and the rise of Islamic radicals equals bad news for Coptic Christians and the rest of the Middle East.

Blue Collar Todd on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

portlandon on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

LOL!

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

Good little twerp! Maybe he’ll be more excited for his first vote than I was – Bob Dole YUCK!

gophergirl on November 1, 2011 at 10:06 PM

My husband’s was for Reagan in 1980 and mine was for Bush I in ’88.
In 1996 I was at the Dole ‘victory’ party in Downtown Chicago and the soon-to-be former Cook County States Attorney(a Republican) was having his party across from the Dole gig. Since THAT party had better food than ours me and a friend kept sneaking across the hall and snagging treats. I also had covered myself from head to toe in Dole and Al Salvi(lost to Al Durbin) stickers and ended up being interviewed by a Kentucky TV station.
15 years later I still refer to the combined Dole/ Salvi/Jack O’Malley parties as ‘The Wake’. LoL

annoyinglittletwerp on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

He also trashed Paul Ryans budget. Look I like Newt, but its not going to happen.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

How come every time the press brings up a moral failure for one of our candidates we can’t say, “Yeah, well, Obama did cocaine!”.

Cindy Munford on November 1, 2011 at 10:00 PM

Gee, maybe because our standard ought to be higher than the worst POTUS ever?

Aslans Girl on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

Obama’s hush-up about his past indicates he has a lot to conceal. He could very well have been a street hustler to explain why he claims he “worked his way through college” (while at Occidental, Columbia and Harvard Law, all three of which are very expensive schools and Obama’s employment history ONLY involves scooping ice cream for a few weeks and writing classified ads, yet he “worked his way through college” and also traveled the globe during college, unexplained as to how that was paid for).

He could just as well have been a street hustler, a drug dealer, none of which would surprise me about him.

BUT, no one can test the Obama waters because we’re “racist” if we do, according to the Left and Leftmedia. So he’s using Blacks to cover his own arse and the media is getting paid off by an Obama Oval Office. Den of thieves, hustlers, all of them.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:14 PM

You fools! The severance pay was pittance. A nuisance settlement. From the NYTimes

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/02/us/politics/herman-cain-accuser-got-a-years-salary-in-severance-pay.html?_r=1

Destroying Cain for something resolved for a pittance 12 years ago because Cain got uppity to lead the GOP field in the polls!

milemarker2020 on November 1, 2011 at 10:14 PM

He chooses the topics. He’s hardly the messenger. He hardly ever attacks Obama. Or didn’t you notice?

Basilsbest on November 1, 2011 at 10:05 PM

Can’t say that I have. In fact he seems to take a shot at Obama every damn day.

But other than that you have a point.

Rep. Schweikert to Obama: Stop buying your own books with taxpayer money, please

Obamateurism of the Day

sharrukin on November 1, 2011 at 10:14 PM

And how is Obama’s foreign policy brilliance and command of the facts looking these days?

Blue Collar Todd on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

Oh, joy! Another “Our guy is dumb but not as dumb as Obama” post.

Punchenko on November 1, 2011 at 10:15 PM

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:10 PM

He also trashed Paul Ryans budget. Look I like Newt, but its not going to happen.

nswider on November 1, 2011 at 10:13 PM

By what specifics did he “trash Paul Ryan’s budget”? From what I recall, Gingrich said it wasn’t the right time to promote Ryan’s more drastic or severe alterations…

which doesn’t mean Gingrich doesn’t support reducing spending and taxes, though I can’t speak for him.

Gingrich is certainly the most intelligent of the candidates available.

Lourdes on November 1, 2011 at 10:16 PM

Herman Huntsman is not fluid in Manchurian.

(Note to self: Build additional shelf for thread winner awards)

Christien on November 1, 2011 at 10:17 PM

Destroying Cain for something resolved for a pittance 12 years ago because Cain got uppity to lead the GOP field in the polls!

milemarker2020 on November 1, 2011 at 10:14 PM

No one here is attacking him for the politico hit piece. The problem is that Cain keeps shooting himself and is demonstrating why he is not a top tier candidate.

El_Terrible on November 1, 2011 at 10:17 PM

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