Open thread: The “I can’t believe it’s time for another debate” debate

posted at 7:48 pm on October 18, 2011 by Allahpundit

8 p.m. ET on CNN. Look at it this way: Eventually, per the law of averages, something interesting has to happen at one of these debates. It can’t be an endless sequence of Romney looking unflappable and never taking a punch, Cain charming the audience while sometimes not quite knowing what he’s talking about, and Perry underwhelming everyone at every turn. Sooner or later, something will happen to justify the time you’ve put in watching these things. Tonight could be that night.

This evening’s dumb subplot is that New Hampshire is miffed at Nevada for moving up its primary (possibly at the behest of Romney’s campaign), which threatens the super-specialness of NH’s first-in-the-nation status. Huntsman, pandering desperately, decided to boycott tonight’s Las Vegas debate in order to show solidarity with New Hampshire or whatever. Romney, who was taken to the woodshed by New Hampshire’s leading newspaper this morning for the Nevada move, will participate tonight but paid lip service to NH a few hours ago by insisting that he respects the state’s primary pride of place. Good enough to soothe angry New Hampshire Republicans, or will they now dump Romney in favor of … er, there’s really no one seriously competing with him up there anymore, is there? If they really want to punish him, they should follow through on their threat to move their own primary all the way up to early December. Mitt will still win but the new schedule will kill any momentum he might gain from victory. Would NH really sacrifice its own relevance simply to get back at Mitt for snubbing them? Stay tuned!

Here’s the Hot Air/Townhall livetweet widget. Exit question: Second look at Gingrich?

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Perry was booed. THAT is the clue that you are out of step with the populace.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 6:42 AM

You mean Perry was booed by the Mitt rent-a-crowd in Mitt-friendly Nevada?

Ron Paul chooses to organize his supporters for straw polls – Mitt organizes them for debates.

Go figure. :)

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 6:48 AM

FIFY and no need to thank me.

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 5:38 AM

You’re as wise and as bad of a debater as everyone else who says, ‘I say you’re stupid, only because you disagree with me!”

FIFY and no need to thank me! :)

Bizarro No. 1 on October 19, 2011 at 6:56 AM

National Review rundown:

Romney Wins
Romney Wins
Romney Wins
Romney Wins
Romney Wins

Unanimous opinion:

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner

The Perrywinkles delight in the fact their guy actually spoke some coherent sentences. But he’s still sucks at debates and now he comes across as mean.

swamp_yankee on October 19, 2011 at 6:59 AM

By the way, speaking of Romney pressuring select Western states to move up their primaries, remember earlier this summer when Romney similarly pushed Utah to hold an early primary? Huh?

Don’t that beat all? I wonder why Romney didn’t push, I dunno, Arizona or Colorado to move up their primaries? Why Nevada and Utah?

Lawdawg86 on October 18, 2011 at 11:18 PM

Did you even bother to read the article? Utah moved up their primary to February in 2008 in order to make their delegates relevant and to head off Huntsman for the LDS vote.

“Utah now knows what it feels like to be relevant in a presidential contest,” Jowers said, referring to the state’s February 2008 primary in the last election. “I can’t imagine Utah wants to go back to being irrelevant.”

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 7:04 AM

To Asians Girl re your reply at 10:30 PM on October 18 to my 10:28 PM October 18 post:

No, I am not being led by my nose by referring to Sarah Palin’s laudatory comments about Newt. I respect Sarah Palin’s political acumen, but for the last several years, I had been expecting to be supporting Newt as the right candidate in 2012, having been in the audience in 2009 and 2010 at several of Newt’s speeches and hearing Newt articulate better than anyone else a path forward for the country from Obama’s socialism and an understanding of Ronald Reagan’s conservatism. Newt’s campaign started out terribly, but he seems to have righted things.

Newt won the debate last night.

Phil Byler on October 19, 2011 at 7:04 AM

You mean Perry was booed by the Mitt rent-a-crowd in Mitt-friendly Nevada?

Ron Paul chooses to organize his supporters for straw polls – Mitt organizes them for debates.

Go figure. :)

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 6:48 AM

Yeah, you keep telling Perry that is why he was booed! lol The guy made a fool of himself attacking Romney for an issue that was put to bed last election. And everyone knows that a consumer cannot vet every employee of the company that contract from. Even if a private citizen does vet the company’s employees, that doesn’t mean they don’t hire an illegal 2 months after the vetting takes place. I suppose you would want every home owner to demand the papers of every person of color that works for a company.

THAT is how Americans understand this issue and Perry came off as a recalcitrant child demanding that truth by assertion be the standard for the debate.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 7:10 AM

swamp_yankee on October 19, 2011 at 6:59 AM

This “Perrywinkle” knows that in a million years, Perry isn’t as big a fraud as to say “I don’t go to bed worrying about the 1 percenters. They’re doing fine by themselves. I’m worried about the 99 percenters.”

Levin NAILS this “Conservative”. I guarantee that Obama, Axelrod, and Valerie Jarrett laughed their asses off when he said that. THE PROTESTS ARE WORKING! Yay!
http://www.therightscoop.com/levin-slams-romney-for-pandering-to-ows/

Marcus on October 19, 2011 at 7:13 AM

The Perrywinkles delight in the fact their guy actually spoke some coherent sentences. But he’s still sucks at debates and now he comes across as mean.

swamp_yankee on October 19, 2011 at 6:59 AM

Have you noticed the similarities between the really whacky Palin fans and a few of these Perry loons? And if I remember correctly, many of them were the Palin loons until she got out! lol

ANYONE who cannot admit that for the most part Perry came off as petty and was stumbling in his comments, are simply not being honest. Sure he had a few good moments, but because of his previous disasters in debates, folks are really focused on his delivery. They will come away from this thinking that Perry still has not figured it out.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 7:15 AM

The Perrywinkles delight in the fact their guy actually spoke some coherent sentences. But he’s still sucks at debates and now he comes across as mean.

swamp_yankee on October 19, 2011 at 6:59 AM

For saying such a thing, you’re obviously a heartless person. Shame on you!

Bizarro No. 1 on October 19, 2011 at 7:16 AM

My take.

kingsjester on October 19, 2011 at 7:19 AM

csdeven….unseen sure has been unseen lately?

For a poster who used to on here almost constantly that is strange./

CW on October 19, 2011 at 7:20 AM

Perry was booed. THAT is the clue that you are out of step with the populace.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 6:42 AM

I’m in agreement that anyone that thinks Perry did well last night is highly disillusioned.

That said, I can tell you either know little about what goes on in Nevada, or you know what goes on in Nevada and are part of the whole song and dance.

Something tells me you live there.

Saltysam on October 19, 2011 at 7:37 AM

CW on October 19, 2011 at 7:20 AM

Hopefully he is reflecting on the thought process he used to inform his comments here and will learn from the rest of us how to be rational. Clearly many of the loony Palin worshipers have not learned.

lol

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 7:40 AM

National Review rundown:

Romney Wins

swamp_yankee on October 19, 2011 at 6:59 AM

Wow! Someone is late to the fact that National Review is mostly in the tank for Romney.

Same with David Brooks, David Frum, Jennifer Rubin, and all the establishment “conservative” pundits.

Stick close to me and you might learn something new everyday… :)

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:40 AM

When csdeven meets up with Bizarro No. 1, swamp_yankee, and the other Mittbots… it devolves to one big Mitt circle jerk.

Have fun massaging your fantasies until you wake up to the reality that Mitt has lost.

And as is typical with RINOs and RINO-lovers, you are sure to stomp off and go vote for Obama.

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:45 AM

Something tells me you live there.

Saltysam on October 19, 2011 at 7:37 AM

I lived there from 1990 until 2004. I let just before the bubble started to burst in the housing market. I made 70K on the home I bought three years previous. As a matter of fact, I closed on that house a few days before 911 and was convinced I made the wrong purchase at the wrong time as I over extended just a bit to buy it.

At any rate, things have changed significantly in Nevada since then. But I have lots of friends and some family still living there and they understand the illegal issue. Perry was lying, he knew it, and Romney stomped him for it. That has nothing to do with whatever conspiracy you think is playing out.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 7:46 AM

Or, as Perry calls Cain, “brutha”. I’m glad there was the intervention of a commercial break so his staff could clue him in and put a stop to that. I don’t think I could have handled Rick flashing gang signals to Herman.
whatcat on October 18, 2011 at 11:27 PM

I think it was funny or did you miss the part that both Rick Perry and Herman Cain arise Christians who have a tendency to call each other Brother- Brutha.
Dr Evil on October 18, 2011 at 11:31 PM

Yup, I also missed where they called Michele B “sistah”.

whatcat on October 18, 2011 at 11:39 PM

Because Michelle Bachmann isn’t from the south and wouldn’t be familiar with the southern mannerism – custom. Duh. Cain is from Georgia and Perry is from Texasm fellow Christians fellow southerner. Apparently there are a lot of Yankees on this thread and twitter. Who haven’t been outside of New England.

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 7:49 AM

Same with David Brooks, David Frum, Jennifer Rubin, and all the establishment “conservative” pundits.
TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:40 AM

Add Joe Scarborough, Mika Boobinski, Meghan McCain, and MSNBC’s Martin Bashir
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/10/18/bashir-gop-debate-everyone-romney-auditioning-job-fox-news
Gee, what’s to be worried about? The Romney love is positively bi-partisan.

Marcus on October 19, 2011 at 7:53 AM

Anyone who wants to know how well Perry did last night at the debate only have to read the attacks from Romney supporters on this thread. If Perry did so terrible there would be no need to attack him non stop. They especially wouldn’t be “reaching” to attack him over something so trivial as Perry addressing a fellow southern Christian Herman Cain – self identified Baptist Minister, as Brother Brutha. If anything Perry was giving a nod to Cain it’s not like there aren’t more than a few Southern Baptist in Texas.

Mitt Romney doesn’t have a Mormon problem. Mitt Romney has an evangelical problem. It’s why he can’t get past 25% in the primary polls after running for President for 6 years.

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 7:55 AM

Marcus on October 19, 2011 at 7:53 AM TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:40 AM

Mitt Witts: We should let the media pick our nominee for us, because they did such a great job last time. Just look how well Barack Obama, the media creation has worked out LOL!

Mittt Romney = Bob Dole redux

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 8:06 AM

as a GOP donor and big time supporter… I will sit out this election if Romney is our candidate…. The libs & elite GOP want him to win. The elite GOP think that Perry & Cain scare old people….

charmingtail on October 19, 2011 at 8:12 AM

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:40 AM

Bingo.

And let’s recall what other rock-solid conservative NR tried to pawn off on us:

“My Pit Bull, George” November 6, 1987 edition of National Review.

“George Bush has been maliciously tagged a wimp, a preppie, a loser and a moderate. The truth is he is thoughtful, articulate, conservative – and a winner. It’s time movement conservatives rallied to Bush’s side.”

History has shown that GHWB was a wimp, a preppie, a loser and a moderate.

Here’s a hint… Romney is a wimp, a preppie, a loser and a moderate.

mankai on October 19, 2011 at 8:38 AM

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 7:55 AM

I have never seen such an epic meltdown as petunia’s last night. Her head exploded before our very eyes. She maxed out her limit on exclamation points, too, lol. It was awesome to behold.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on October 19, 2011 at 8:45 AM

I have never seen such an epic meltdown as petunia’s last night. Her head exploded before our very eyes. She maxed out her limit on exclamation points, too, lol. It was awesome to behold.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on October 19, 2011 at 8:45 AM

Okay, what page? This I gotta’ see.

cozmo on October 19, 2011 at 8:49 AM

Angry Mitt,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RW7iOIh-W4k

Omega_Rage on October 19, 2011 at 9:02 AM

When csdeven meets up with Bizarro No. 1, swamp_yankee, and the other Mittbots… it devolves to one big Mitt circle jerk.

Have fun massaging your fantasies until you wake up to the reality that Mitt has lost.

And as is typical with RINOs and RINO-lovers, you are sure to stomp off and go vote for Obama.

TheRightMan on October 19, 2011 at 7:45 AM

TheRightMan: “If you don’t slavishly support Dick Perry like we PerryKrishnas do, the only possible explanation is that you are a Mittbot, and if you don’t make as many negative comments about Mitt as you do about Dick, you necessarily are participating in a Mitt circle jerk!” LOL

Hey TRM, do you realize that your fellow PerryKrishna HondaV65, a person you are indistinguishable from, has said that he would stomp off and vote for 0bamamessiah if Romney is the GOP nominee? How do you think he feels being called a RINO and/or a RINO-lover by you?

TRM, you are such a simpleton.

Bizarro No. 1 on October 19, 2011 at 9:13 AM

Anyone who wants to know how well Perry did last night at the debate only have to read the attacks from Romney supporters on this thread. If Perry did so terrible there would be no need to attack him non stop. They especially wouldn’t be “reaching” to attack him over something so trivial as Perry addressing a fellow southern Christian Herman Cain – self identified Baptist Minister, as Brother Brutha. If anything Perry was giving a nod to Cain it’s not like there aren’t more than a few Southern Baptist in Texas.

Mitt Romney doesn’t have a Mormon problem. Mitt Romney has an evangelical problem. It’s why he can’t get past 25% in the primary polls after running for President for 6 years.

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 7:55 AM

The brother issue is stupid. We all know he meant it as a term of endearment and not a racial slur. But the response to that issue does not mitigate the rest of Perry’s dismal performance. He had a few good moments but that was when he was NOT attacking his fellow candidates. Every time he goes after a candidate, he gets 8itchslapped. And 8itchslapped HARD. Romney put the finishing touch on it when he pointed out that Perry was being irrational because he is desperately trying to make up for his dismal debate performances.

Perry was spot on with defunding the UN and with his energy/job creation policy. He is right on 9-9-9 and he cannot figure out a way to effectively deal with Romneycare.

He was wrong on the illegal alien landscaper, the job creation in MA (it was 4.7 percent and the number of jobs created has zero to do with it. If there were only 50,000 people unemployed, and 40,000 jobs were created, that is a great percentage. Which is why unemployment is always given as a percentage. And Perry’s percentage was much higher even though he watched more jobs get created).

Romney has RINO, flip-flopper problem…..with the base. But because the base is mostly rational, they are excited about beating Obama and will vote for whomever the GOP nominee is. Romney’s real problem has yet to be examined. And that is with the indies. Right now he has their vote, but how will they react to his flip-flopping? Even though his flop is toward moderation and away from deep conservatism, they should be fine with his positions. The issue will be that of being principled. If the indies are more interested in principle than the economy, it will repress turnout and the contest is a tossup. If the issue is the economy, Romney beats Obama in a landslide.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 10:28 AM

FWIW: My take:
Newt deserves a second look. His baggage is well-known. Other’s baggage still coming out. He is the only one that can tear the Bamster apart in a debate.
Romney is not to be trusted. Actions speak louder than words. I would rather have even Santorum, Bachmann than him.
Cain might be a good businessman and speaker, but he’s way over his head in this election. Seems to have no clue about some issues and shoots from the hip. Could be very helpful in the “personal responsibility” debate, but not a real contender. And 999 will be his downfall because it bets too much on all the right things happening (lowered prices) and none of the wrong things (lowered wages, Congress given another tax to manipulate). And proponents like to call it a step to fair tax and mix up the debate between 999 and fair tax. I say bring on the fair tax and abandon 999.
Perry just doesn’t seem to have it in debates. Has a few baggage items of his own and would get run over by Obama were he to get that far. But he surely is more conservative than Romney, so that at least puts him above Romney for me.
Santorum seems to have drawn blood from Romney in this debate. Maybe that’s his real reason for running. I don’t think he has a chance, but at least he is helping the public to see the difference between Romney and a conservative.
Bachmann – I like her positions for the most part, but don’t think she is experienced enough to win and comes across as a non-leader in the debates.
Paul is great on fiscal issues, but a nut on foreign policy. Has no chance.
My winner: Newt. I had thought I would never vote for him, but am reconsidering.

Christian Conservative on October 19, 2011 at 10:54 AM

If the indies are more interested in principle than the economy, it will repress turnout and the contest is a tossup. If the prissue is the economy, Romney beats Obama in a landslide.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 10:28 AM

Team Obama is already painting Mitt Romney as the Wall Street poster child, Mitt comes in number #5 for Wall Street contributions after Obama in 2008 #1.

Independents understand that the financial industry captured our government - it’s not about principle, it’s about taking the country back. Mitt Romney will be seen as more of the same another Wall Street shill. This is what fiscal conservative Independents want ended -not prolonged.

It hardly helps that he’s been courting Obama’s BFF Jamie Dimon head of JP Morgan Chase for campaign donations. I know Romney needs to raise campaign money, but given what’s gone on with the TEA party’s push back against corporatism, and now OWS, it’s really bad optics to be seen as “Wall Street’s Guy” going into the 2012 election, and Obama is planning on painting Romney as the banksters best buddy.

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 2:11 PM

Dr Evil on October 19, 2011 at 2:11 PM

When OWS started I was positive it was simply a vehicle to start mass dissatisfaction with wall street because they see Romney as the GOP nominee. It has backfired because only the loons are attending.

csdeven on October 19, 2011 at 2:34 PM

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