Mitt Romney: Vote for me — or for Herman Cain

posted at 8:46 pm on October 10, 2011 by Allahpundit

I don’t get it. Why would Romney want to promote a “true conservative” competitor who’s, er … much less organized and lightly funded than Rick Perry?

You know who this benefits?

Mitt Romney’s affection for Herman Cain has been well documented, at POLITICO and elsewhere. Romney took it to the next level at a New Hampshire town hall this evening.

“We each have our own experiences, he’s a great guy. Vote for either one of us and you’ll be happy,” Romney said, per POLITICO’s Reid Epstein.

Romney also called Cain a “terrific guy” and said voters should “give him a good look.”

So obvious and cynical is the game here that if I were Cain, I’d find it patronizing. Don’t agree? Here’s what else he said at the town hall tonight:

After talking about his experience going from Bain Capital to the governor’s mansion, Romney suggested that Cain was, perhaps, not quite as ready as he is for the Oval Office.

“I was able to find ways to use my skills in a public sector setting, probably something — if I were Herman — I’d say I wish I had that too because you don’t want to necessarily learn that for the first time as the president of the United States,” Romney said.

Romney’s jab at the former Godfather’s Pizza CEO came in response to a question from a college student who has asked Romney to contrast himself with Cain.

Translation: “He’d be a risk due to his inexperience, but that’s okay as long as you’re not thinking about voting for the guy who governed Texas for 10 years with terrific job growth.” As a gloss on this, go read Philip Klein’s short but insightful post about the persistent weakness of the GOP field. Since 1959, no Republican has gone on to win the presidency without earning at least 40 percent of the primary vote at this point in the race. Our top tier, meanwhile, is chronically mired in the mid to low 20s, with Romney so desperate to break through the 25-percent ceiling that he’s now actually touting other candidates in the race to try to force the most advantageous hold-your-nose Romney vs. Not Romney showdown that he can. It’s come to this, my friends. Or no, rather — it’s come to this.

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I just want to know where someone upthread got the idea that Perry is for ‘open borders’.

We are in so much trouble.

Cain, by the way, has raised some eyebrows on state restriction of firearms. Setting aside his despicable treatment of Perry, I have to wonder if his shooting from the lip is ever going to catch up with him. He’s like Obama in that people seem to see what they want to see in him. If he’s teaming with Romney, if you’re conservative, don’t you think that’s a red flag?

My fear is people want to love him, need a savior, and don’t want to look too closely.

Big mistake.

Appreciate hearing from those praying for Governor Perry. I am too.

capitalist piglet on October 11, 2011 at 1:53 AM

bluefox on October 11, 2011 at 1:11 AM

Me too.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 11, 2011 at 1:57 AM

Perry’s new ad picks off where the last debate ended – Mitt Romney’s lies on Romneycare.

The Perry Team is just getting started on Romney and it’s not going to be pretty. It doesn’t help Romney also that Jon Stewart and the Dems have also started to attack him on his flip-flops.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 12:54 AM

Glad to hear that. I’m like Hank Williams Jr., I’m ready for some football:-) He has a new song out and it’s free for download from his website. I heard it, it takes Obama/Fox&Friends & ESPN on!!!
Keep the Change is the name of it.

I’m reminded of what Palin said, it’s going to be an Unconventional election. I’m ready to see Perry on Offense again!!

bluefox on October 11, 2011 at 2:14 AM

I just want to know where someone upthread got the idea that Perry is for ‘open borders’.

capitalist piglet on October 11, 2011 at 1:53 AM

Well he has made statements that would easily lead to that conclusion.

In 2001…

Shortly after George W. Bush was elected president, Perry wrote a letter to the editor of the Dallas Morning News, “I take strong issue with a news report in the Dallas Morning News mischaracterizing my position on amnesty for undocumented immigrants from Mexico. The truth is, I am intrigued and open to the Bush administration’s amnesty proposal. Most Texans would agree that it’s better to have legal, taxpaying immigrants from Mexico working in the United States than illegal immigrants living in fear of the law and afraid to access basic services.

He also sent a letter during the 2006 Bush amnesty push to urge Congress to pass the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act.

sharrukin on October 11, 2011 at 2:15 AM

capitalist piglet on October 11, 2011 at 1:53 AM

Many posters here and elsewhere blame Gov. Perry for everything from Gardasil and on. You can give them the facts and it doesn’t matter. I’ve learned to ignore them. I don’t know of anyone that is for open borders other than Mexico and those in the Gov here (for votes). That’s why our Fed Gov does nothing. Blaming the border State Governors is easier than blaming the Feds I guess.

Same as with In-State Tuition, they don’t like Perry so they misquote, and reject any facts or truth. Forget them. They wouldn’t vote for him anyway, they just like to accuse and argue.

Keep the faith!!

bluefox on October 11, 2011 at 2:27 AM

sharrukin on October 11, 2011 at 2:15 AM

I think when Bush first started talking about it that may have been a good idea. Same as Gov. Perry wrote about Health Care. But after it goes along and the Congress adds all of their nonsense, the bill became intolerable.

Same with McCain/Kennedy.

A decent plan for Immigration is one thing, but what has been put forth so far no one wants.

I’m sure Gov. Perry would have had nothing to do with whatever Bush & Congress came up with that took the Country to make their voices heard and finally killed it.

Perry has some good ideas, but the border needs secured first and that’s where Bush & Congress and all plans since then fail.

bluefox on October 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM

I think when Bush first started talking about it that may have been a good idea. Same as Gov. Perry wrote about Health Care. But after it goes along and the Congress adds all of their nonsense, the bill became intolerable.

bluefox on October 11, 2011 at 2:33 AM

Well maybe that’s true though he seemed pretty clear that it was amnesty he was talking about. There are legitimate reasons for thinking Perry may not be a staunch border hawk.

sharrukin on October 11, 2011 at 2:39 AM

So care to tell me when the GOP last had a strong field? Bush vs. McCain? Bob Dole vs. Pat Buchanan? Reagan vs. Bush?

TheRightMan on October 10, 2011 at 11:45 PM

There you go! If I’m going to call my fellow commenters demeaning names and question their intelligence for their choices, I need better candidates.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 3:50 AM

bluefox, csdeven, terrye, Cindy, darwin, et al
Everyone needs to check this website out and many of the myths that are discussed about MA Healthcare are explained.

MA Healthcare explained:
http://intorightfield.com/romney-myths-red-state/

Bottom line:
MA has a “requirement” not a mandate written in their Constitution that MA citizens have agreed to participate in for the benefit of all written into their Constitution by none other than that liberal….John Adams. This is the LAW that Romney as Governor was following. So continue to bash him but it was what the MA citizens agreed to NOT Romney pushing his OWN agenda.

The US Constitution does not have mandates or requirements as we all agree (now lets hope the SCOTUS does as well).

Some posters on here disappoint me as when Romney “plays” politics and hits back it is dirty, scheming, slimy, etc but it is okay for your candidate to attack Romney. I think it shows Romney’s grit and that he is ready to take on Obama and the MSM as they are going to play a lot dirtier.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 4:32 AM

Also all you that say Romney is not conservative check out these sites with actual facts and you’ll find you have been PLAYED by our side as well into believing untruths and misstatements by people like Allah, some Townhall columnists, etc that take Romney’s statements and twist them. I know you all WANT to believe them because he may not be your guy but I would think as a conservative you would want facts against facts in a fair political fight.
I have always come on this site and if something that was said by Palin, Perry, Gingrich, Paul, Cain, etc was wrong I stood up for them even though they were not my first choice but I believe in being honest in a debate and frankly some of you outright lie about Romney and some of the other candidates statements.
http://intorightfield.com/romney-myths-red-state/
http://whyromney.com/
http://mittromney.com/blogs/mitts-view/2011/10/fact-sheet-mitt-romneys-strategy-ensure-american-century

Reduce corporate tax burden, streamline business regulation.
Implement trade agreements with Columbia, Panama, South Korea.
Issue waivers to states from health reforms approved under President Obama.
Initiate energy resources exploration leases, implement drilling in pre-approved areas.
Cut discretionary federal spending.
Sanction China for unfair trade.
Modernize national defense, oppose military cuts.
Revitalize relationships with allies, especially bolstering Israel; improve America’s standing in foreign policy.

What is not conservative about the above? I believe there are OBVIOUS reasons our own Senators and Congressmen are backing Romney in droves because they see he is the best candidate to take back the WH. The man also knows policy and will make a great president.
PS we in the military out here deployed, that I am with, all like him as our next CinC.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 4:42 AM

OK, why the hate? I don’t get it. Romney says something gracious about his rival and he’s a bad guy. The fact is that Romney and Cain both are experienced business men who respect each other. Oh the horror.

Given the two, Romney is ready and Cain clearly is not. Romney’s plan reflects that. It is realistic and will provide a drastic improvement to our economy without trying to uproot tree and branch our entire system over night. His plan is one that can bring people along rather than keep people scratching their heads over where this will lead.

Cain’s plan is a radical change that may or may not be beneficial. It is a regressive system that will help those who have income that they can save and hurt those who don’t. That will make it divisive right from the start. It will require years to bring about assuming that Congress can made to go along with it. Even if they are, it is certainly not going to get through the legislature in a recognizable form. Cain has no experience governing (forming a political consensus) or running a campaign.

It is clear that Mitt is our guy.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 5:16 AM

I like Perry and I support him-but not in a go all out rah rah sort of way.

annoyinglittletwerp on October 10, 2011 at 11:22 PM

I had hoped and thought that Perry would be a better candidate. I haven’t and won’t criticize him for the petty stuff that seems so fashionable (immigration, vaccinations, etc). I think that he was a very good governor and I thought he would be a stronger candidate than he has shown himself to be.

I had my doubts about Romney and wanted to see a strong challenge to him. As I’ve heard and read more about Mitt I’ve become very enthusiastic about him. Particularly, when he put out his plan he won me over. I waited for Perry’s plan before telling myself that Mitt was the guy. I’ve stopped waiting for the bell that won’t ring (Perry’s plan).

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 5:38 AM

New NBC/Marist poll has Mitt first in Iowa, with Cain just a couple points behind.

Jon0815 on October 11, 2011 at 5:46 AM

Particularly, when he put out his plan he won me over. I waited for Perry’s plan before telling myself that Mitt was the guy. I’ve stopped waiting for the bell that won’t ring (Perry’s plan).

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 5:38 AM

And who says that bell won’t ring?

You have a liberal (Romney c. 1994) masquerading as a RINO (Romney c. 2003), a conservative (Romney c. 2008), and now a mish-mash of anything you want him to be (Romney c. 2011).

He has been running for President since 2006, kept quiet while Tea Partiers wept and fought against Obama’s horrible policies, advocated nothing and waited until the primary to release a 59-point plan full of generalities that no one bothers to read.

And you want a sitting Governor successfully steering his State through the Obama Depression to release an ill-thought plan within six weeks of his entering the race just to tickle your fancy?

Did Romney keeping quiet while Americans lived through the past three horrible years ever bother you? You cannot see his shameless quest for power?

Doesn’t it surprise you that Palin, who decided not to run, has taken the fight to Obama in a way Romney can only dream of? And yet she was supposed to be the unelectable one?

Nope – your choice for Romney says more about you than anything else. I see someone manipulated easily by the media to go along with whoever has been anointed as the frontrunner.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

MJBrutus and all,
I just do not understand all the angst against Romney? Much of the constant “flip-flopping” label against him if you look at his record is not based in reality. There are things applied to him which are not correct. Like this one:
“I support the Second Amendment as one of the most basic and fundamental rights of every American.” (Governor Mitt Romney)

National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF.org) – Candidates Speak – Sep 24, 2007
“Let me speak very directly and candidly about where I stand. I support the Second Amendment as one of the most basic and fundamental rights of every American. It’s essential to our functioning as a free society, as are all the liberties enumerated in the Bill of Rights…
As president, I’ll honor the right of decent law abiding citizens to own and use firearms in defense of their families, their property and for all other lawful purposes, including the common defense.”

NRA – A Celebration of American Values
NRA-ILA – Sep 10, 2007
Or this:
“ “When it comes to protecting the Second Amendment, I do not support any new gun laws including any new ban on semi-automatic firearms. As President, I will follow President Bush’s precedent of opposing any laws that go beyond the restrictions in place when I take office. The laws I do and will support include decades-old restrictions on weapons of unusual lethality like grenades, rocket launchers, fully automatic firearms and what are legally known as destructive devices and would include similar restrictions on new and exotic weapons of similar or even greater lethality. I am proud of my record of defending life and the Second Amendment.”
“Dec. 30, 2007 Mitt Romney”
2008election.procon.org – Are more federal regulations on guns and ammunition needed?

“Governor Romney has stated that he would not reinstate that Assault Weapons Ban. In fact, Governor Romney does not support any new gun laws including a ban on semi-automatic firearms. He would consider limitations on weapons of unusual lethality like grenades, rocket launchers, fully automatic firearms and what are legally known as destructive weapons.”
Targeted News Service – The Real Romney Record – Dec 30, 2007

however, many on HA will continue to spout lies about Romney…

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

New NBC/Marist poll has Mitt first in Iowa, with Cain just a couple points behind.

Jon0815 on October 11, 2011 at 5:46 AM

You appear to be enjoying the polls with your man Mitt in front. Ready to live and swear by those same polls when he falls behind Perry again?

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:01 AM

however, many on HA will continue to spout lies about Romney…

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

How is it lies if you use Romney’s own words against him? You think people just upped and accuse Romney of not being so friendly with respect to the Second Amendment?

Nope, my friend – Romney’s chickens (words) are coming home to roost. And most of the ads that his rivals (GOP and Dem) will use against him will come from his own words and record.

If Romney wants us to ignore his record and just swallow his promises, which shift with the wind – why then is he attacking Perry on the Texas Dream Act? Even though it had nothing to do with border security or being pro-illegal immigration?

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:07 AM

Nope – your choice for Romney says more about you than anything else. I see someone manipulated easily by the media to go along with whoever has been anointed as the frontrunner.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

You OBVIOUSLY have not been following Romney as throughout the last 3 years he has been through his PAC raising money and showing up ALL over the country funding and supporting candidates for the 2010 elections and now for 2012. These are all over the place just because the MSM has not covered it does not mean he has not done it. You just were not looking for it. Many, many congressmen/women have thanked Romney for his support in helping them in 2010. He also came out early and stated he was for Cut, Cap, and Balance and that was what needed to be implemented BUT because the MSM says Romney has been silent we all believed what they said.
Romney’s positions have been the same for a long time.
Yes, he evolved on his abortion position from 18 years ago but then again many people evolve over 18 years ago. I’m sure if you are 35-40 y/o now your beliefs have changed since you were 16-18 y/o. The same can happen for grown adults as well as circumstances change. We are in a totally different financial situation than 5-10 years ago and yet we would not apply the same thinking from just a decade ago to what is needed today would we?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:08 AM

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

No. I wanted a candidate for President to release a comprehensive well thought plan. Romney did. Perry didn’t. See the difference? Perhaps some day Perry will actually give us a plan. At that point I’ll take another look at him. You say he’s been too busy governing. Maybe you’re right, but excuses (legitimate and otherwise) aside, he hasn’t delivered.

While I have been waiting for him, Romney has given me something to look forward to with enthusiasm. You haven’t bothered to read his plan, so you just carp about it in ignorance. Shame, because if you had you would know that it is full of specifics and not the generalities your preferred non-candidate spouted at traveling carnivals. I have read it carefully and I’m the one being unthinkingly being led around the nose, huh?

Your ad hom about my slavish adherence to the media is just risible. As is your continued devotion to a candidate who played you for a fool.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:15 AM

You think people just upped and accuse Romney of not being so friendly with respect to the Second Amendment?

RightMan, I just gave you his quotes on the 2nd Amendment!!!! He has always believed in the Second Amendment and that it is important to our country. Look at the links I sent as well. The NRA in MA praised Gov. Romney for his signing of bills which strengthened NRA rights in MA!! Again though, people will GLAZE over ACTUAL statements by Romney and will grab a quote from the Boston Globe supposedly quoting Romney’s stances on an issue…

Massachusetts —
S.2255 Signed by Governor Romney!
“This week, Governor Mitt Romney (R) signed S.2255, a bill addressing a conflict in Massachusetts law concerning the difference between a loaded and unloaded muzzleloading shotgun or rifle…

“The bill contained an “emergency preamble”. Under normal circumstances a bill does not become law until 90 days after the governor signs it. With the emergency preamble, the bill became law immediately. On behalf of our members, we would like to thank the Gun Owners Action League as well as Senator Stephen Brewer (D-Franklin, Hampden, Hampshire, Worcester) and Representative George Peterson (R-Worcester-9) for their special efforts in seeing this bill through the legislative process in time for the upcoming muzzleloader season.”

NRA-ILA :: Massachusetts S.2255 Signed by Governor Romney! – Nov 23, 2005

“In November 2005, Governor Romney signed legislation… simplifying the gun laws in Massachusetts… Hunters now no longer face the lengthy, complex and unnecessary task of cleaning the barrel every time they encounter a public way, nor will they unknowingly violate the law by only removing a gun’s priming device.

“GOAL Executive Director James Wallace: “This new law addresses a conflict that had previously caused great concern in those who use traditional muzzle loading rifles and shotguns. Now they confidently know what is expected of them and can enjoy their heritage without the fear of being prosecuted for violating a poorly written law.” ”
Encyclopedia.com – The Real Romney Record: Setting The Record Straight About Governor Romney’s Record – Dec 30, 2007

“Governor Romney supported and signed into law legislation that clarified the term “loaded gun” so that hunters wouldn’t have to unload their guns every time they crossed a public road in pursuit of game.”
AmericansforMitt.com

I post these so that people will STOP the LIES and half truths about ALL OUR CANDIDATES!!

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:17 AM

NBC/Marist Iowa Poll

Romney 23
Cain 20
Ron Paul 11
Perry 10
Bachmann 10

Jon0815 on October 11, 2011 at 6:17 AM

You OBVIOUSLY have not been following Romney as throughout the last 3 years he has been through his PAC raising money and showing up ALL over the country funding and supporting candidates for the 2010 elections and now for 2012.

There has never been a candidate more willing to wake up and put his finger to the wind before getting out of bed that morning ever than this guy. Everything is “how will it affect me”. Romney has been a candidate for 4-5 years. Where was he in the

two weeks

after Gabriele Giffords was shot and the Tea Party Conservatives were getting slimed? Under the covers is where. Not one speech, statement, TV appearance, or interview. Prove me wrong, because I really really really want to like the guy.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 6:24 AM

why then is he attacking Perry on the Texas Dream Act?

Simple question for all: Does a child who has entered into our country ILLEGALLY via himself or by his parents get the opportunity to attend a TX University? And additionally at a lower cost than a student from an American state such as CA, AZ, TN, MI, IA, etc…?

This is what the American people are upset about Perry for in his stance. Being from AZ, even the legal Hispanics living in our State do NOT want benefits for illegals. They believe in coming in the right way like they did.

PS Romney vetoed the same bill in his state with a 85% Democrat majority. Even before the DREAM Act was popular.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:26 AM

Not one speech, statement, TV appearance, or interview. Prove me wrong, because I really really really want to like the guy.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 6:24 AM

How is the same day for you? Are you liking him more or was your comment just disingenuous like some on Romney are?

“Today’s horrifying shooting in Tucson shocks the conscience of decent Americans everywhere. When such an unspeakable act occurs, and lives are taken in violence, we rightly respond with comfort and support because that is the only way we know to show that evil does not triumph over goodness in the world. I offer my prayers to all the victims and their families, including Representative Gabrielle Giffords, and look forward to the swift and harsh punishment that awaits the perpetrator of this cowardly attack.” Mitt Romney

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:30 AM

Here is something we need to focus on as conservatives if you have not seen this post at Townhall. This link shows you the destruction that Obama has wreaked on our country:
http://townhall.com/columnists/luritadoan/2011/10/10/obama–the_numbers_dont_lie

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:34 AM

Since 1959, no Republican has gone on to win the presidency without earning at least 40 percent of the primary vote at this point in the race.

Since 1959 there hasn’t been a Great Depression, until now. We haven’t had half the manufacturing jobs shipped to China, the major retailers united to offer only China goods in de facto monopoly, a government so intrusive smaller business is being destroyed, an elite so intent on importing replacement workers, a population so decadent, and a debt pushed into insurmountability. The game has changed

The reason Cain has gone up, and Romney has not fallen further, is that both are deemed slightly more likely to be able to do what they promise, and slightly more likely to be trustworthy on their promises

Our top tier, meanwhile, is chronically mired in the mid to low 20s, with Romney so desperate to break through the 25-percent ceiling that he’s now actually touting other candidates in the race to try to force the most advantageous hold-your-nose Romney vs. Not Romney showdown that he can

Cain is not exactly chopped liver. I wouldn’t call this one a low blow.

Meanwhile, John Batchelor tonight characterized Perry’s interaction with the “Mormonism is a cult’ pastor as a possible Sister Souljah setup.

Romney’s jab was flyweight, the type you get at a board of directors meeting, and Cain has been CEO too. CEO vs CEO. Cain can wrap up Romney on this one, but he probably will play it like a card game. If Romney takes a right from Cain, Romney will make a good natured retreat and come back from the other corner. That’s how you survive board meetings. Smile and punch

The problem is not the candidates, it’s the party, which is at war with the conservatives. The big field is the inevitable result. It’s Party vs Base, and neither has enough in common to give an inch.The Party has the advantage in election gaming. The party doesn’t want the country the base wants. this isn’t an election, it is a purge

entagor on October 11, 2011 at 6:36 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:34 AM

It’s why we can’t mess around with an inexperienced candidate. This election is far too important to hope that our man doesn’t trip up on rookie mistakes. We cannot go with some one who will allow the other side to make it a referendum on our guy or some social issue.

We need a candidate who will keep this election a referendum on the record of PBHO. We must keep him on the defensive trying to excuse away his disastrous record. That means presenting a candidate who we can be sure will be acceptable to, even if not loved by, the large majority Americans. We need to give America a choice!

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:40 AM

No. I wanted a candidate for President to release a comprehensive well thought plan. Romney did. Perry didn’t. See the difference? Perhaps some day Perry will actually give us a plan. At that point I’ll take another look at him. You say he’s been too busy governing. Maybe you’re right, but excuses (legitimate and otherwise) aside, he hasn’t delivered.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:15 AM

You call Romney’s plan comprehensive and well-thought? Have you wondered why Cain’s 999 plan is being discussed but Romney’s 59-point plan has received no mention aside the day it was released?

Romney’s plan is just a load of crap released for the purpose of the debates in order for him to say: “Look at me… I have a plan!” You think it’s that difficult to pay a bunch of policy wonks to come out with pages of useless mantra, which is what Romney did?

You do not need a 59-point plan to get America out of the mess we are in. Reagan didn’t need it. Our founding fathers didn’t need it.

Just get the government out of the way.

Is that specific enough for you?

When you have both parties in Congress competing to see who can pass the most legislation every single session – then you have a big problem.

Congress should be simply sitting down to repeal a lot of the laws on the book not adding to them.

Face it – your only beef with Perry is that he doesn’t talk pretty enough in the debates the way snake oil salesman Romney does.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:41 AM

You call Romney’s plan comprehensive and well-thought? Have you wondered why Cain’s 999 plan is being discussed but Romney’s 59-point plan has received no mention aside the day it was released?

No I haven’t wondered. Cain is proposing a radical departure that has us (thinking people) all scratching our heads over just what it will do to/for us. It is being so widely discussed because it such a huge unknown.

You know nothing abut Romney’s plan, but go ahead and call it crap. Your intellectual critiques are so enlightening.

Face it – your only beef with Perry is that he doesn’t talk pretty enough in the debates

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:41 AM

I told you what my beef with Perry is. Do you know me better than I do? Are you clairvoyant now?

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:47 AM

This is why I will never vote for Romney. He’s a politician through and through.

disa on October 11, 2011 at 6:50 AM

disa on October 11, 2011 at 6:50 AM

Yeah. The nerve of him to say something kind about his opponent. The skunk.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:54 AM

Have you wondered why Cain’s 999 plan is being discussed but Romney’s 59-point plan has received no mention aside the day it was released?

Hopefully America learned from sticking with people giving us simple and catchy phrases and now an EXPERT at turning things around KNOWS you have to lay out what it will take to turn America around and I guess some people just do not want to do any heavy lifting and actually read bills or policies anymore.

This should…should show why Romney is the best qualified because he can actually articulate what needs to be done for the country to be turned around. There are too many questions with those out with a plan and then others who do not even have a clue…errrr…plan.

Tonight’s debate should be interesting but I also believe everyone will jump out and think their guy did the best and tomorrow we’ll all be back sniping…haha gotta love it!

Just so you all know I will vote for Perry, Paul, Cain, SATAN, over Obama this time around! I even hear Satan is part of a cult but he’ll have my vote over Obama.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:57 AM

You know nothing abut Romney’s plan, but go ahead and call it crap. Your intellectual critiques are so enlightening.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:47 AM

You claim I know nothing about Romney’s plan. Let me throw your own question back at you. :)

Are you clairvoyant now?

I did take some time off my schedule to go through Romney’s plan – it was time I consider wasted. I shouldn’t have bothered.

Romney’s plan is “full of sound and fury signifying nothing.” In it, he proposes starting a trade war with China with an EO – he was forced to quickly backtrack after China fired back.

The basic issue, MJBrutus, is not who can come up with the best-looking plan on paper. It is who has the record of doing what they say they will do.

On that, Romney fails – Perry wins.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:59 AM

This is why I will never vote for Romney. He’s a politician through and through.

disa on October 11, 2011 at 6:50 AM

I have no idea what that means? As our country is built on politics and run by politicians who represent us and we legally (hopefully) elect.

Romney is not this boogeyman some make him out to be…

I feel you all have been taken over by the Force
“these are not droids you are looking for…” without looking at FACTS about Romney. Is he the PERFECT candidate? No. Is he the most qualified for our CURRENT situation we face today? Yes. and with a track record that shows America he knows how to turn things around.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:01 AM

How is the same day for you? Are you liking him more or was your comment just disingenuous like some on Romney are?

“Today’s horrifying shooting in Tucson shocks the conscience of decent Americans everywhere. When such an unspeakable act occurs, and lives are taken in violence, we rightly respond with comfort and support because that is the only way we know to show that evil does not triumph over goodness in the world. I offer my prayers to all the victims and their families, including Representative Gabrielle Giffords, and look forward to the swift and harsh punishment that awaits the perpetrator of this cowardly attack.” Mitt Romney

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:30 AM

I’m more interested in the day after and the day after. You know, when Sarah Palin and the Tea Party were being blamed in every MSM headline. I specifically recall waiting to hear what Mitt the Candidate had to say then. He said nothing, waiting you can bet to see how it played out.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 7:03 AM

You claim I know nothing about Romney’s plan. Let me throw your own question back at you. :)

What do you want to know?

Is cutting the corporate tax to 25% nothing?
Is a territorial tax to allow repatriation of corporate money nothing?
Is elimination of taxes on middle class savings and invetments nothing?
Is eliminating tax loopholes and flattening the tax code as Reagan did nothing?
Is protecting intellectual property from theft by the ChiComs and others nothing? And no, that is not starting a trade war. The Chinese have declared war on us through theft and we are doing nothing but take it on the chin.

I could go on.

The basic issue, MJBrutus, is not who can come up with the best-looking plan on paper. It is who has the record of doing what they say they will do.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 6:59 AM

Romney has a long and proven record of fixing financial messes. He has also won election in one of the bluest states in the union. He has proven that he can get votes and that he can govern.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 7:08 AM

I’m getting a little concerned the more I think about this.

Surely……surely this is not some kind of political game? With the results Pre-ordained?

Here’s a good laugh……remember when people here thought Palin was so smart for waiting and letting all the flavors of the month get pummeled? And it turned out she was just milking the attention for all it was worth?

That thought crossed my mind too at the time so I kick myself for being wrong too.

KICK KICK! :-)

PappyD61 on October 11, 2011 at 7:11 AM

I’m more interested in the day after and the day after. You know, when Sarah Palin and the Tea Party were being blamed in every MSM headline. I specifically recall waiting to hear what Mitt the Candidate had to say then. He said nothing, waiting you can bet to see how it played out.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 7:03 AM

So Marcus, When I show you that Romney came out the VERY day it happened that is not good enough when you asked for proof? I think everyone on HA just saw that you were disingenuous.

I at least will admit that if Romney or any statement that I represent is factually incorrect I will own up to it. This is what is frustrating to me with some posters is that they will go down with their candidate even if it is against what they say they believe as a conservative or just are flat out lying.

I get it though…Romney is not your guy.

I am just pointing out that he is NOT what some posters state he is despite his actual stances he has maintained for years and years…except his abortion stance and I do not fault him because he came to our side. This is why I scratch my head when some use this as an argument “against” him?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:14 AM

No. Is he the most qualified for our CURRENT situation we face today? Yes. and with a track record that shows America he knows how to turn things around.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:01 AM

What track record does Romney have? His record in Mass. that he never mentions?

Face it – Romney took the governorship in Mass. after highlighting his business experience. And failed massively. Come on, Dukakis performed even better than he did. What does that tell you?

Now he’s telling GOP primary voters what they want to hear in order to win the nomination.

I daresay Romney doesn’t care a hoot if he wins the GOP nomination but loses to Obama. As it is with RINOs, their greatest enemies are conservaties. They share similar ideals with Dems so they don’t care much if they lose to them.

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 7:15 AM

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 7:15 AM

MA was a basket case when he took over and set it on a positive trajectory:

Governor Romney convinced the legislature to allow him to immediately make changes to the existing budget. He immediately slashed spending and balanced that budget. [6] He then balanced each of the four annual budgets he created. He was dealing with a veto-proof legislature that was 85% democrat, but he was able to ‘hold the line on all the spending that the democrats up there wanted to do.’ [7] The budgets he submitted, fought for and succeeded in obtaining not only were balanced each year, but provided a surplus of $700 million in 2004, [8] nearly $1 billion in 2005 [9a],[9b],[9c] and a surplus of $700 million in 2006. He balanced the budget every year without raising taxes. [10] By the end of his term, he had taken “Massachusetts from billions in deficit to billions in surplus”. [11] He turned in a $2 billion rainy day fund at the end of his term in office. [12]

The unemployment rate in Massachusetts had doubled from January 2001 to January 2003, the year Romney took office, and was continuing to increase at a fast rate. He implemented pro-growth policies and programs. By summer the increase in unemployment had stopped and by fall unemployment was dropping. [13] While Massachusetts was 50th, or nearly the worst in the nation in the increase in unemployment rates the year that just ended when he took office, he got it down to 38th place by the end of his first year in office. [14] The unemployment rate continued to rapidly drop for nearly two years, hit a plateau for about a year and a half, then started dropping again at the end of his term of office (see chart below). The year he left office (2007), the trend in Massachusetts’ unemployment rate was in the top ten in the nation [15], a big improvement from the 50th place it was in the year he won office.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 7:22 AM

So Marcus, When I show you that Romney came out the VERY day it happened that is not good enough when you asked for proof? I think everyone on HA just saw that you were disingenuous.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:14 AM

Show me one quote where he had something to say when Sarah Palin or the Tea Party were being pilloried. He didn’t say one thing, because he couldn’t determine how it would play

for him

. Even Karl Rove fought back ferociously. He went into hibernation, when it was the talk of the nation, playing safe. If the media was going to take down the Tea Party, they weren’t touching him.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 7:25 AM

Face it – Romney took the governorship in Mass. after highlighting his business experience. And failed massively. Come on, Dukakis performed even better than he did. What does that tell you?

Like Reagan used to say…There you go again! Taking something the MSM has trumpeted and not the actual record.

FactCheck: Reduced unemployment in MA from 5.6% to 4.7%. (Sep 2011)

Tax Burden in Massachusetts
They claim the total tax burden in MA went up under Romney. This falsely implies that Romney raised taxes. In truth, some communities in MA chose to raise property taxes at the local level which Romney had no control over (7).
Some critics claim that Romney’s cuts in state spending forced local communities to raise their taxes, but the fact is they were under no obligation to raise taxes. Romney also closed loopholes in existing tax law, allowing the state to collect taxes from those who had been using schemes to reduce income reported on state tax returns (8).
Some critics falsely assert that Romney raised capital gains tax rates. In truth, the tax increase was enacted before Romney was elected governor but took effect during Romney’s term after having been tied up in court for several years(9). Critics are unable to point to any tax increases from Romney. Moreover, they fail to note that Romney repeatedly proposed tax cuts, which were shot down by the Democratic MA legislature, starting as soon as he began to turn around the economy, prompting the liberal Boston Globe to complain after Romney’s first year in office, “The first signs of life appear in the Massachusetts economy and the governor calls for a $225 million tax cut.”(10)
http://whyromney.com/#taxburden

FactCheck: 844 line item vetoes; but over 700 overridden. (Oct 2007)

This one above is HUGE because it SHOWS that Romney tried to govern as a conservative but because of his 85% Democrat-led Congress they vetoed his bills at almost every turn…yet, he still was able to leave MA a 2 Billion dollar fund that the following Gov quickly spent!

Am I changing anyone’s thought processes on Romney?

Do not believe what you have been fed!

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:28 AM

What do you want to know?

Is cutting the corporate tax to 25% nothing?
Is a territorial tax to allow repatriation of corporate money nothing?
Is elimination of taxes on middle class savings and invetments nothing?
Is eliminating tax loopholes and flattening the tax code as Reagan did nothing?
Is protecting intellectual property from theft by the ChiComs and others nothing? And no, that is not starting a trade war. The Chinese have declared war on us through theft and we are doing nothing but take it on the chin.

I could go on.

Romney has a long and proven record of fixing financial messes. He has also won election in one of the bluest states in the union. He has proven that he can get votes and that he can govern.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 7:08 AM

And how many of those are you ready to bet that a President Romney will accomplish?

Didn’t Boehner and his ilk also promise us a lot of things? I remember him saying he will cut $100 billion from the 2011 budget – did that happen?

You see, this is what I absolutely detest about RINOs. They play the conservative base like a fiddle – they see the base as a bunch of rubes who can be lied to and left flapping in the wind.

I daresay you – MJBrutus – will be back on Hot Air telling us that we are not being realistic when a President Romney fails to accomplish even one of his promises. It is then that you will tell us that he holds only 1/3rd of the Govt. blah…blah…blah… so the base should go to work again and elect what? An 80-member GOP Senate?

So here is the point:

Is Candidate Romney well aware now that he will be holding only 1/3rd of the Govt., should he win, and modifying his promises accordingly? Or is he giving us “suckers” promises that we want to hear?

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 7:30 AM

And how many of those are you ready to bet that a President Romney will accomplish?

All of them. I noticed now that at least you agree there is a lot of good stuff in there and not “nothing.” I’m glad to see the progress.

So you want to criticize Mitt because he will only be able to do what the office of POTUS permits? Have you held Cain’s 999 plan to that standard? Have you held Perry’s … never mind, he doesn’t have any plan. I suppose that offering no promises will be easier for him to live up to, so you got me there.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 7:35 AM

RightMan, Marcus, et al you will never be satisfied when some of us are showing you actual facts and statements of Romney and you refuse to move at all…your stance is what is infuriating to many on the conservative side in your reluctance to accept facts. Your positions remind me of everyone that stayed home in Nov of 2006 and we are still recovering from that election because a small percentage decided to stay home or vote write in.

Romney will govern effectively because he knows how to as opposed to the current resident that throws a tantrum…”pass my bill” Romney will also bring respect back to the Oval Office and from our Allies because he will treat them as Allies. Also we will again pick up more seats this time around in both Houses so Romney will have the weight of the Congress with him. I cannot honestly believe that you all think he will govern as a liberal. HE DID NOT DO IT AS A GOV! Do not give me the MA Healthcare crap either because that was happening whether Romney wanted it or not. The bill he actually signed was not the original Bill he proposed but I do not want to show you facts on that either.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:40 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 7:40 AM

Still waiting for the one statement he had defending the Tea Party from the media onslaught after the shooting. One. Anything.

Marcus on October 11, 2011 at 7:49 AM

If you think that Romney is a Conservative, you probably also like to be taken snipe hunting.

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 7:51 AM

OK, why the hate? I don’t get it. Romney says something gracious about his rival and he’s a bad guy. The fact is that Romney and Cain both are experienced business men who respect each other. Oh the horror.

Given the two, Romney is ready and Cain clearly is not. Romney’s plan reflects that. It is realistic and will provide a drastic improvement to our economy without trying to uproot tree and branch our entire system over night. His plan is one that can bring people along rather than keep people scratching their heads over where this will lead.

Cain’s plan is a radical change that may or may not be beneficial. It is a regressive system that will help those who have income that they can save and hurt those who don’t. That will make it divisive right from the start. It will require years to bring about assuming that Congress can made to go along with it. Even if they are, it is certainly not going to get through the legislature in a recognizable form. Cain has no experience governing (forming a political consensus) or running a campaign.

It is clear that Mitt is our guy.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 5:16 AM

And now to apply primary logic:

Mitt Romney’s plan has 57 different ways liberals can warp, distort, and ruin to their hearts content if Mitt manages to put it in place.

Herman Cain’s has three.

And people are so, so worried that the liberals are going to warp Cain’s plan have no such worries about Romney’s. It’s quite amusing.

As for Perry, he’s not going to improve on public speaking any time soon. He has no possible chance against Obama. He will easily be painted as the third George W. Bush term by the media, and since he can barely formulate a coherent argument, and since he has no platform other than “Not Mitt Romney, Not Barack Obama 2012″ he is not ready for prime time.

Don’t get me wrong here, I despise having to live under Romney’s mandate (and it is a mandate g-numbers. You must not be from Massachusetts because everyone here who lives under it calls it a mandate. Because it is a mandate. Because if you don’t purchase health insurance you are subject to fines and other penalties.)

But it’s nigh impossible to tie the Bush noose around Mitt Romney’s neck. And lets be honest here. Is Obama really going to criticize Mitt on health care? Really? What’s he going to say? “My massively upscaled version of your health care plan which ended up being unconstitutional is clearly the way to go.”

Get real. The chief concern with Mitt is that like John McCain he’ll be afraid to throw a punch. Rick Perry is incapable of throwing punches at all. He ends up clocking his own face in every attempt to criticize an opponent. He’s like an overcooked cream puff: tough and rugged looking on the outside, but mushy and squishy when you actually grab him.

BKennedy on October 11, 2011 at 7:59 AM

Marcus
I do not need to show you anything about Romney as I already did when you wanted proof on Romney and the Gabby Giffords shooting. Mitt stands with ALL people, including Tea Party people, who abhorred that act of violence. btw I am from AZ and live an hour up the road from there.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:02 AM

It’s happening, guys. They’re greasing the skids and the republican establishment (as well as the media) are setting it up so we get stuck with a milquetoast like Romney. And with all the similarities of Romney with Obama, we know full well who people will vote for when given the choice of a republican-lite or democrat? Do we ever learn or do we just follow the definition of insanity: keep doing the same thing over(Dole) and over (Bushes) and over (McCain) and expect a different result each time. I just saw Perry’s latest campaign ad – not bad!

mozalf on October 11, 2011 at 8:04 AM

Get real. The chief concern with Mitt is that like John McCain he’ll be afraid to throw a punch.

BKennedy…what in the H*** do you thnk Romney has been doing 90% of the campaign? He has not been pulling punches and has been going right after Obama. Many of you must have tunnel vision when it comes to not wanting to see Romney’s strong points.

Also just because you call it a mandate it is still by law called a requirement written into your Constitution. The US Constitution does not (for the time being) have that requirement OR mandate to purchase insurance or anything else for that matter we do not want to electively participate in.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:08 AM

Whatever. The topic is not Palin and you pounced on one mention of Palin to divert the topic. My main point was that Cain was no more than stalking horse shill for Mittens.

I’ve noticed in the past that you lost your mind when Palin called Cain by a wrong name but you are surely alright with Cain calling Perry a racist. Whatever your game is, enjoy the fruit.

promachus on October 10, 2011 at 9:49 PM

I’m not the one that brought Palin up. I’m not the one that claimed she was unfairly kept out of the game because of Bachmann, Cain, ____??? You’re a complete nutjob. Take some time off – it’s OK, now.

I suppose you can handily sweep away any objections I have to this present field by quoting my past support for Palin. Nice trick.

promachus on October 10, 2011 at 9:53 PM

What I can do (with mind-melting games, apparently), is show the posts where you claimed that Cain and Bachmann were stalking horses for Mitt, where you claimed Bachmann was used to keep Palin out of the race, where you implied that only Palin was TEA enough for you, and so on.

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:13 AM

mozalf, kengsjester, etc

Start showing me actual FACTS of Romney being just like Obama and where he is not conservative?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:14 AM

Also just because you call it a mandate it is still by law called a requirement written into your Constitution. The US Constitution does not (for the time being) have that requirement OR mandate to purchase insurance or anything else for that matter we do not want to electively participate in.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:08 AM

Yeah. Just because IT’S A MANDATE, doesn’t mean it’s a mandate.

Oh, wait…

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 8:14 AM

If you think that Romney is a Conservative, you probably also like to be taken snipe hunting.

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 7:51 AM

Lawdy, lawdy… not only is Mitt conseeeervative; he’s gonna be betta than RAYGUN!

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:15 AM

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:15 AM

By the way, what does he stand for…today?

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 8:19 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 6:26 AM

You feel strongly about TX allowing children of illegals to qualify for in-state tuition… how do you feel about Romney touting his latest endorsement form Mel-AMNESTY-Martinez? Mel not only supports in-state tutition for illegals, he all out supports AMNESTY. And Romney’s proud of the endorsement, LOL!

Perry does not support amnesty, btw.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

Lawdy, lawdy… not only is Mitt conseeeervative; he’s gonna be betta than RAYGUN!

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:15 AM

haha MH…I love Reagan and Romney is not Reagan.

However, we also gloss over some things that Reagan did that today’s Tea Party crowd, which I am a part of, look over yet HAMMER today’s candidate’s on. This is where some of us long time conservatives cannot understand the intransigence of some of you.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

mozalf, kengsjester, etc

Start showing me actual FACTS of Romney being just like Obama and where he is not conservative?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:14 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFMdK0TWtks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQCInYfDEY4

And he should stop comparing car insurance mandates to Obamacare mandates.

That’s a start.

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:21 AM

But it’s nigh impossible to tie the Bush noose around Mitt Romney’s neck. And lets be honest here. Is Obama really going to criticize Mitt on health care? Really? What’s he going to say? “My massively upscaled version of your health care plan which ended up being unconstitutional is clearly the way to go.”

Get real. The chief concern with Mitt is that like John McCain he’ll be afraid to throw a punch. Rick Perry is incapable of throwing punches at all. He ends up clocking his own face in every attempt to criticize an opponent. He’s like an overcooked cream puff: tough and rugged looking on the outside, but mushy and squishy when you actually grab him.

BKennedy on October 11, 2011 at 7:59 AM

No, the chief concern is that Mill will win and govern like a liberal. that he will put forth no leadership or effort to repeal Obamacare, that he will make deals left and right with the dems, that he will push for and pass some form of amnesty. Romney will govern in such a way as to make the liberal policy failures of the last 4 years bi-partisan, giving the dems/liberals the cover they need to regroup and take back the house/senate and or presidency. In my opinion, a Mitt administration will be worse – long-term – for america than 4 more years of Obama. Certainly Mitt will get us nothing positive. At best he will hold the line for 4 years. He is not a leader, has no vision, is not a conservative and will fight for nothing.

He has never fought a single conservative battle. He did not do it running for Senate, he did not do it as Governor, he did not do it running for President last time, and he has not been anywhere near the front in fighting Obama’s agenda. If he has never fought for any conservative principal before now, what makes anyone think he’ll do it as President? Seriously?

Look, one of the problems with having a squish as president, particularly when you hold both houses of congress, is that the party will follow him and swallow a lot of crap. We saw it during W’s years with No Child Left Behind and Medicare Part D, as well as many other things. So, if Mitt the middle-of-the-road is President, he is going to force the party to the left to make “bi-partisan” deals with the dems. Do you really think this guy is going to spend effort or political capital repealing Obamacare? In what world does that make sense? And deal with entitlements? Mitt? Really? the guy who has never put forth even so much as an op-ed that tackles a tough issue? He’s really going to go out on a limb and deal with entitlements? He’s going to cut spending? Mitt? If you think Obama leads from Behind, what does that make the guy that preemptively surrenders to the liberals and passes Romneycare, or that has never come out first on any issue but waits until the dust settles before penning a tepid op-ed on an issue that all other conservatives have already come out swinging about? W

hat leadership has this guy ever shown on any conservative issue. And don’t point out his skill as a businessman – it is not the same thing. Yes, that experience is important, but it needs to be coupled with something – a governing philosophy that makes sense. Mitt does not have that. Or even his work on the SLC Olympics. So what? he worked behind the scenes organizing an event. Like that is the same thing as selling unpopular entitlement reform to voting seniors. Please. Mitt doesn’t have it in him to do anything but follow the polls. Even his campaign this time around is not leadership. His whole strategy is to wait out the conservative candidates and be the last man standing. He is not running on doing anything. He put out a “plan” to try and pacify the conservative base, but that is it. The guy is a non-entity.

With Obama as president, the GOP in the house and senate can have a stiff spine and fight him AND, more importantly, make it clear to America the failure and emptiness of liberalism. I don’t even have any faith that Romney will nominate conservative judges to the bench.

How many lies are we to swallow from this guy? How many times can he change his positions on important issue and say “this time I mean it”? I realize that Perry and/or Cain are not perfect in any way, but Mitt is a disaster in the making for the GOP. 1) I have my doubts that he has a better chance against Obama than either Cain or Perry and 2) I think a Mitt admin will actually be worse for the U.S. than 4 more years of Obama.

Monkeytoe on October 11, 2011 at 8:21 AM

haha MH…I love Reagan and Romney is not Reagan.

However, we also gloss over some things that Reagan did that today’s Tea Party crowd, which I am a part of, look over yet HAMMER today’s candidate’s on. This is where some of us long time conservatives cannot understand the intransigence of some of you.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

Some of your fellow Mitt buddies made that absurd claim. I don’t give Reagan a free pass on anything. People are stupid if they use Reagan as their “standard.” Conservative ideas are very simple and never require bigger government.

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:23 AM

Yeah. The nerve of him to say something kind about his opponent. The skunk.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 6:54 AM

But on the same day that he’s sending bouquets to his BFF, Cain, Romney called Perry every name in the book. See why this sticks out? If Romney was nice to everyone like Newt is, I would never have pieced together that Romney’s hired Cain (and several others) to be his stalking horses and attack dogs. But then, he wouldn’t be Romney if he hadn’t done such a disgusting thing.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on October 11, 2011 at 8:24 AM

mozalf, kengsjester, etc

Start showing me actual FACTS of Romney being just like Obama and where he is not conservative?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:14 AM

From freerepublic.com, 1/26/2008:

A myth coming out of the Romney camp is that he is the ‘economy candidate’. The problem is, and we’ve seen this movie before, his rhetoric doesn’t match his record. His four-year record as Governor of Massachusetts shows a substantial increase in fees and taxes, low job growth, and a large exodus of residents from the state. As Michael Widmer, president of the independent Massachusetts Taxpayers Foundation, told Reuters, “There’s never been under his watch an economic turnaround to speak of,” further saying, “We added a few jobs over the last three years of his tenure but very few. He also raised corporate taxes and fees and the (deficit) gap turned out to be less than $3 billion.”

By the way, are you a paid poster for the Romney campaign?

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 8:24 AM

Aslans Girl on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

Romney appreciates Martinez’ support DOES NOT mean he believes ALL that supporter stands for…we all know that. There is no comparison. Perry is showing that with his appreciative support of Pastor Jeffress but not his actual comments.

So this is not contradictory at all. This happens in every election in politics and you should know that. :o)

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:25 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:14 AM

Click my username for your answer. It’s one of several such vids on youtube. Romney has done this to himself.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on October 11, 2011 at 8:28 AM

Click my username for your answer. It’s one of several such vids on youtube. Romney has done this to himself.

-Aslan’s Girl

I cannot access it as I am in Afghanistan and they block sites generally with any video/audio where I am located. I call it the PFC Manning issue! :o)

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:32 AM

g2825m, you’re missing out on some slip-n-slide by Mitt Romney.

MeatHeadinCA on October 11, 2011 at 8:36 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

First, thanks for you service, you are in my prayers. I love your enthusiasm and appreciate the absence of name calling. It’s quite refreshing. In my view, the problem is this, we are in a sweet spot in history where a lot of problems could get fixed and none of these people appear to be the person to lead us through that challenge. All we are being offered is the same old go along to get along type politicians who think that a reduction in spending slated 10 years in the future (and won’t happen) is going to get us where we need to be. We’ll see a bump in the economy and we will have to be happy with that, until the next bubble bursts. I think you are going to have accept that most of us will vote for the nominee but grouse about it.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 8:40 AM

By the way, are you a paid poster for the Romney campaign?

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 8:24 AM

haha No! Just a sailor living in the sand and enjoying the “suck” over here and defending Romney against half-truths and some outright lies. I would defend ANY of our candidates if what was being reported was false. That is just me but some feel it is okay to slander or slime Romney because they do not like him.

btw your quote from freerepublic is incorrect or their claim I should say.
Tax Burden in Massachusetts
They claim the total tax burden in MA went up under Romney. This falsely implies that Romney raised taxes. In truth, some communities in MA chose to raise property taxes at the local level which Romney had no control over (7).

Some critics claim that Romney’s cuts in state spending forced local communities to raise their taxes, but the fact is they were under no obligation to raise taxes. Romney also closed loopholes in existing tax law, allowing the state to collect taxes from those who had been using schemes to reduce income reported on state tax returns (8).

Some critics falsely assert that Romney raised capital gains tax rates. In truth, the tax increase was enacted before Romney was elected governor but took effect during Romney’s term after having been tied up in court for several years(9). Critics are unable to point to any tax increases from Romney. Moreover, they fail to note that Romney repeatedly proposed tax cuts, which were shot down by the Democratic MA legislature, starting as soon as he began to turn around the economy, prompting the liberal Boston Globe to complain after Romney’s first year in office, “The first signs of life appear in the Massachusetts economy and the governor calls for a $225 million tax cut.”(10)
Back to top
Fees
They claim Romney’s increases in fees are identical to taxes. On the contrary, Romney saved millions of tax dollars by ending the taxpayer subsidizing of fees. A fee covers the cost for a special good or service provided to an individual by the government; when a fee is not high enough to cover the cost of the service provided, taxpayers end up subsidizing. Romney shifted the burden from the community onto the individual who benefits from the service provided. http://whyromney.com/#taxburden

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:41 AM

However, we also gloss over some things that Reagan did that today’s Tea Party crowd, which I am a part of, look over yet HAMMER today’s candidate’s on. This is where some of us long time conservatives cannot understand the intransigence of some of you.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:20 AM

Let’s not forget that when Reagan was president, the conservative movement in this country was much younger and much smaller. What was possible for Reagan to accomplish and what was even considered important to accomplish, were different in Reagan’s day than is true today.

So saying that Reagan was not a “pure” conservative by today’s standards is a staw-man. the reverse is also true, most of yesteryear’s liberals were not “pure” by today’s liberal standards.

Conservative thought has evolved and the movement has grown. Thus, both what is possible to accomplish and what we want to accomplish have changed since Reagan’s day. We cannot simply say that what Reagan did or did not do defines conservatism and therefore, if someone today holds the same exact views as Reagan did, they are conservative. It is actually true that 1980 Reagan would likely be considered something of a squish by today’s standards. That doesn’t mean that Reagan was not a solid conservative for his time and extremely important for the movement (and the Country).

We admire Reagan for his leadership and ability to communicate conservative ideas, not for the exact specific set of policy positions that Reagan took – meaning that because Reagan passed amnesty for illegals, for instance, that does not make amnesty “conservative”.

Thus, a call to more “moderate” conservatives of yesteryear is a straw-man argument, one mostly used by the left. The left loves a dead conservative. I can just as easily say that I really miss those former democrats of yesteryear – the JFK’s and the HST’s – who were far, far more conservative than any of today’s dems. the left loves JFK but would hate him if he ran for office today on the same platform he ran for then.

So, yes, Reagan gets a pass on positions he took that today’s conservatives don’t get a pass on. that is b/c most of us realize that Reagan was a product of his time and that conservatism has evolved in the U.S. political sphere. It is actually the people who look to Reagan and say “why can’t we support a candidate with the exact same policy positions today” that is strange. Not that some of us can both admire Reagan and still hammer conservatives today that hold similar positions on some issues.

Monkeytoe on October 11, 2011 at 8:41 AM

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 8:40 AM

Cindy, thank you for the support. I have been reading your posts for years here at HA. and the back adn forth you and hawkdriver and several others have had…I know many of you via name on here…I have been deployed basically since 2005 to Iraq and now AFG. I love what do and care about my country!

I just cannot stand by when people say things about Romney that are NOT factually correct. What is actually on record and not what some paper or website said he did or did not do.

I will also vote for Perry, Bachmann, Cain, etc over Obama. What is maddening is those that say “I will stay home and not vote…” because I and many others have fought over here to give you that right and to waste it is a true shame! Especially when we see Iraqis and Afghani’s at the actual risk of their lives leave their homes and walk miles in some cases to go vote! We have lost sight of our freedoms and we all need to be thankful for the great country we live in.

Agree btw with the opportune time to make some changes but I do not believe a Romney presidency will inhibit ANY of what we want.

I WILL BE ON HA IF HE DOES NOT COME THROUGH AND I WILL MAN UP TO IT!

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:48 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:48 AM

I have to tell you that I am not very happy at all these primary date changes that seem to have his fingerprints all over them. I can live with ideological differences a lot easier than dirty tricks and political hackery.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 8:52 AM

This is a few clips that the libs are just salivating to us against Robamney. If he is allowed to win the GOP nomination, Obama’s campaign WILL USE THESE VIDEO CLIPS TO DEFEAT HIM, and we’ll be stuck with another 4-years of the socialist-in-chief. I like the woman’s comment that “Romney isn’t pro choice or anti-choice, he’s multiple choice!” That’s the way people are going to see him on everything else too. Because that’s who he is. Just another lying career politician who will say whatever it takes to get elected.

DanaSmiles on October 11, 2011 at 8:54 AM

So sick of political games and politicians.

Genuine person with real solutions. Herman Cain!

balkanmom on October 11, 2011 at 8:58 AM

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 8:52 AM

I would be upset as well, IF, I could see where he literally had a hand in it. But I read the way Allah phrases and sets up the premise that Romney has to be behind because it benefits him.
Like Rush always says, “I am not going to buy into your premise” and I concur in this instance.
Allah (HA) knows that Romney drives traffic here so what better way than to make insinuations about Romney and make him look slimy.

My belief is that I take the States for their word that they are trying to be more relevant in the voting process and not necessarily trying to benefit one candidate over the other. This makes more sense to me than “Romney is behind it”

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:58 AM

Just another lying career politician who will say whatever it takes to get elected.

DanaSmiles on October 11, 2011 at 8:54 AM

What? What has he said that is lying?

Let me start, he changed his abortion position from ’94 to OUR position. Why are we upset about that? What is wrong with that? So did many other storied conservatives.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:01 AM

My belief is that I take the States for their word that they are trying to be more relevant in the voting process and not necessarily trying to benefit one candidate over the other. This makes more sense to me than “Romney is behind it”

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:58 AM

I don’t support Romney whatsoever, but I have to agree that I doubt he is behind this. I doubt Romney is pushing the changes. We went through all of this nonsense in 2007/8 as well regarding states trying to change primary dates. I have a feeling that until the national GOP comes up with a system that all states agree to, we are going to see this garbage every 4 years.

Monkeytoe on October 11, 2011 at 9:05 AM

It is clear that Mitt is our guy.

MJBrutus on October 11, 2011 at 5:16 AM

Only if you want milquetoast as a leader…you show me some of the debates with Kennedy (you know the one from the other side of aisle) where he kicks @ss…what I have seen is he kisses @ss.
He embraced abortion, he stated he was not a conservative, than to make sure everyone understood, he implemented RomneyCare and embraced it…the man is a RINO, through and through…but if that is what you want, it is your choice…but not the choice of real conservatives.
Plus, you talk about “crony capitalism” (I don’t care that much but to some it’s a big deal), Romney is the poster child.
After Bechtel, a long time supporter of his dad and of him, was complicit and found guilty of negligence in the death of a young woman, he was forced to fine them, the maximum, and he was ordered by the courts to do it…so the next year he awarded Bechtel with a multi-million dollar contract, I am sure just by coincidence…also a coincidence, his list of supporters is heavily “salted” with the same supporters of his father.
The ultimate insider, the ultimate flip flopper, and the ultimate milquetoast candidate…that is who you want has a leader.
Great cabinet guy (where you can control him and direct him), great VP, to take advantage of his fund raising from his corporate cronies…but a disaster if President….and I don’t think even this election he can beat Obama.

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:06 AM

Enough! Palin has made her decision. I am still behind her 100% for anything she does to help win this election.
The constant sniping this week is sure showing some nasty sides to people.

katy the mean old lady on October 10, 2011 at 9:47 PM

Bwahahahahaha!!! I find it knee slappingly hilarious that you despicable St Palin the Victimized worshipers are having your come to Jesus moment after the vile, rude, and immature nastiness you reveled in all summer long!

You can sit in the stew you made for a while.

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:09 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 8:58 AM

It’s always good to look at who benefits. I also have to hope that he is not going to pick Huckabee as his VP since his shenanigans in the 2008 cycle made him persona non grata for me. Huckabee is not how you pander to the South.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 9:11 AM

What? What has he said that is lying?

Let me start, he changed his abortion position from ’94 to OUR position. Why are we upset about that? What is wrong with that? So did many other storied conservatives.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:01 AM

For me, it’s not whether or not he is lying. It is that he is not believable in his switch on this position and he has never strongly held a conservative position that he has fought for. He is just disingenuous. I don’t believe him when he claims conservative positions this time around. To run for president the first time, he switched positions on a bunch of issue. But he did not move that far right. He did not win. Now, he is claiming to be even farther to the right (but still not too far that he can’t tack back to the center immediately). He claimed to not like Reagan / Bush when he ran for Senate. Now he wants to be likened to Reagan.

And, on things like Amnesty, he did support the Bush/McCain amnesty and now claims he never did.

I, and many others, simply do not believe that he has a principled position on anything, or if he does, don’t believe that it is conservative. All politicians lie or dissemble. That is the nature of the beast. It is picking and choosing what you lie about and how you do it that tells the story of what you really believe. To me, Romney’s choices display that at heart, he is not conservative.

Monkeytoe on October 11, 2011 at 9:11 AM

Did someone say Beetlejuice three times?

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 9:11 AM

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:06 AM

Question: on Nov 2012 IF the choice is between Romney or Obama who do you leave the hanging chad for?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:12 AM

Let me start, he changed his abortion position from ’94 to OUR position. Why are we upset about that? What is wrong with that? So did many other storied conservatives.

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:01 AM

He changed his position when he decided to run as a conservative, and he also had to change his position on being a conservative, since he ran away from that also…how many “changes” do you need to convince you, he will say whatever he needs to say just to be elected.
You tell me, how many issues beyond these two major ones, will you allow him before you decide he isn’t trustworthy….3 more, 5 more, an unlimited?

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:13 AM

DanaSmiles on October 11, 2011 at 8:54 AM

Get off of the social issues because they will be moot in 2012. The economy, jobs, and foreign policy will be the issues debated. And in that arena, Romney is the best we have to offer and is the only one that has shown that he can beat Obama.

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:13 AM

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:01 AM

You’re going to have to narrow that down for me. Maybe you prefer the term ‘flip-flop’? Worked for President Kerry.

DanaSmiles on October 11, 2011 at 9:16 AM

I can live with ideological differences a lot easier than dirty tricks and political hackery.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 8:52 AM

Hahahaha!!! Yeah, unless it is St Palin the Victimized engaging in the dirty tricks and political hackery. Then it is wise and part of her super duper unconventional campaigning!

ROTFLMMFAO!

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:16 AM

Monkeytoe,
I appreciate your openness.
On Ronald Reagan
They claim Romney changed his views on Ronald Reagan, because Romney was an independent during the Reagan-Bush era and said in a 1994 debate that he was “not trying to return to Reagan-Bush,” but later became a big fan of Reagan. However, Romney, who is not a career politician, was involved in the private sector and in raising his family during the Reagan era.
Romney’s political involvement and focus on political issues came later, not unlike many Americans who do not have fully formulated political views. Ronald Reagan himself was a Democrat until the age of 50 when he switched to the Republican party. Like Romney, when Reagan was involved in the private sector he largely stayed out of politics. The more involved Reagan became in politics, the more conservative his views became. For example, Reagan changed from being prochoice to being prolife.
On Amnesty
Critics falsely charge that Mitt Romney supported McCain-Kennedy in 2005 and as Governor instituted sanctuary cities. The reality: sanctuary status was instituted on a city level outside Romney’s purview. With a liberal legislature, no bill outlawing sanctuary cities would have passed. Romney did not endorse McCain’s bill in 2005; in an interview with the Boston Globe he explicitly refused to endorse it (11). Romney did say in the same interview that the bill was “reasonable,” but the 2007 bill is very different from the 2005 bill; the provisions Romney most strongly objects to, like the z-visa (12), were not in the 2005 bill. Accordingly, his position did not change when he opposed the 2007 bill, but the bill itself had changed.

Vetoed in-state tuition; turn off the magnet. (Sep 2011)
Of course a border fence; of course no free tuition. (Sep 2011)
Build 2,600-mile fence with enough guards to secure it. (Sep 2011)
Turn off the magnet that attracts immigrants. (Sep 2011)
I like legal immigration; let business determine visas. (Aug 2011)
GovWatch: 2005: Called comprehensive reform “reasonable”. (Feb 2008)
Deport illegal immigrants in 90 days under the ideal setting. (Jan 2008)
Found Z-visa & McCain-Kennedy bill to be offensive. (Jan 2008)
FactCheck: Yes, his ads DID accuse McCain of “amnesty”. (Jan 2008)
Illegal immigrants should go home eventually. (Dec 2007)
No mandatory prison term for employers who hire illegals. (Dec 2007)
AdWatch: Huckabee ok’ed tuition & scholarships for illegals. (Dec 2007)
Welcome the people who have been standing in line first. (Dec 2007)
Employers have no means of knowing who’s legal & who’s not. (Dec 2007)
Avoid chain migration; disallow families from one citizen. (Dec 2007)
Illegal immigrants shouldn’t get tuition break in schools. (Nov 2007)
http://www.ontheissues.org/Mitt_Romney.htm

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:19 AM

Appreciate hearing from those praying for Governor Perry. I am too.

capitalist piglet on October 11, 2011 at 1:53 AM

I’m praying for Gov. Perry… praying for him to get out of the race.. he’s obviously not up to the rigors of the campaign as he needs more sleep, and all the campaign prep must be working a number on his mind because he looks so terribly challenged when trying to respond to a question. It must be difficult to be hiding out all the time from those big meanies on tv too, so yes, I will keep praying for him that he will do the good and honorable thing and bow out of the race… for his family of course.

gatorboy on October 11, 2011 at 9:20 AM

Did someone say Beetlejuice three times?

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 9:11 AM

Evidently. Like the iStink Hippie was to the police car, so is csdeven to Hot Air.

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 9:20 AM

Get off of the social issues because they will be moot in 2012. The economy, jobs, and foreign policy will be the issues debated. And in that arena, Romney is the best we have to offer and is the only one that has shown that he can beat Obama.

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:13 AM

the problem is, even absent social issues, Romney is not conservative. Who cares if he can win (which I disagree with – I think Romney would get crushed by Obama) if he wins and then governs like Obama lite? how does that help anything?

As an aside, I hate that we distinguish the “economy” and “jobs” as two separate issues. As if the gov’t can “create” jobs. All the gov’t can do is set policies that help the economy (lower taxes, less regulation) by helping businesses grow. Thus, the only issue is the economy. If the gov’t gets out of businesses way, the economy will grow and jobs will be created. There is no policy the gov’t can put forth to “create” jobs separate from that (unless we are talking simply about the gov’t creating more gov’t jobs).

Finally, as to social issues, I am not a huge social issues voter. However, I have found that the politicians most likely to stay true to conservative principals fiscally, are those who also hold strong social-conservative positions. those who don’t tend to “grow” in office and move left. I think this is b/c social conservatives are used to being ostracized by polite company and don’t get troubled by it, while non-social fiscal-conservatives get hit with the hatred when they get to DC and can’t handle it and thus move left.

I can think of only a very few fiscal conservatives who are not also social conservative that did not move left and abandon conservatives on big issues. but the list going the other way is long and distinguished.

Monkeytoe on October 11, 2011 at 9:22 AM

Question: on Nov 2012 IF the choice is between Romney or Obama who do you leave the hanging chad for?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:12 AM

That’s a stupid question that I have answered dozens of time….
Let me explain something…
This is now an intra-mural contest, Republican against Republican, RINO’s against conservatives. It is bloody and they fight among themselves, and we get to choose who we want to support and define why, and be as bold and as aggressive as we want…but it is a “family” contest/fight, and outsiders, dems/liberals, are allowed to cheer, jeer, and say what they want, but they are not part of this fight.
That is why it disgusts me when people like Shurrukin goes to Mother Jones, a liberal rag, and uses those words against our people.
This is a vetting contest, the best leader, the man with the best ideas, and I hope the most conservative, will win…but whomever wins, wins the Republican nomination…my tone changes, my focus changes, and yes I am a neighborhood/city/county involved active participate in raising money and votes for Republican’s, very active and I give—time/talent/money.
Who ever is selected I will do whatever is in my power to have that person elected to the President of the United States, and conversely do whatever I can to remove every last vestige of this horrible, destructive administration.
Got it? It is difficult for people to put aside their little egos and understand that this is now an intra-squad fight to see who is going to be quarterback…but these foolish attacks, that many of you embrace from the left is disgusting, reprehensible, and irresponsible.

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:23 AM

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 9:20 AM

Well at least we have confirmation of its’ preferred candidate. Poor Gov. Romney, how very unhelpful.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 9:24 AM

Evidently. Like the iStink Hippie was to the police car, so is csdeven to Hot Air.

kingsjester on October 11, 2011 at 9:20 AM

Like sand through the hourglass… these are the politics of our lives….

*Ques music*

LOL!

upinak on October 11, 2011 at 9:24 AM

Right2bright:

He changed his position when he decided to run as a conservative, and he also had to change his position on being a conservative, since he ran away from that also…how many “changes” do you need to convince you, he will say whatever he needs to say just to be elected.

you still NEVER specifically told me anything…As a Governor he has been pro-gun, pro-military, pro-life, cut taxes, was against illegal immigration and vetoed bills before the DREAM act even had its name, saved the State of MA that was awash in the red with its budget, etc etc etc. These are ALL facts and he is a conservative. The only thing you all like to revert to is his 1994 debate with Kennedy. You know how many videos are out there on people who have changed their stances from 18 years ago? and again he CHANGED to OUR position and we are upset with this?

g2825m on October 11, 2011 at 9:25 AM

TheRightMan on October 11, 2011 at 5:59 AM

How is that performing arts degree working out for you? talk about drama queen

gatorboy on October 11, 2011 at 9:25 AM

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:23 AM

Hey, he is serving in Afghanistan and I know he sees worse than your attitude all day long but I’d appreciate it if you would lighten up.

Cindy Munford on October 11, 2011 at 9:26 AM

I am sure just by coincidence…also a coincidence,

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:06 AM

Provide the proof or admit you are ignoring the facts about why Bechtel was granted an $8 million extension.

You wont because you can’t. Just like your lies about how Romney has rode his fathers coattails to success, you never have provided the proof.

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:27 AM

And in that arena, Romney is the best we have to offer and is the only one that has shown that he can beat Obama.

csdeven on October 11, 2011 at 9:13 AM

He is the only one who has shown that he can’t win a conservative election…the only one. He has never won a conservative nomination, even after spending record amounts of money.
He has not proven he can increase jobs…when he was Gov. it was during a time that the whole nation prospered, every state was growing and creating jobs… was riding the strong national economic tide.
But he never nominated, never selected a conservative to serve in his term…always a liberal.
Be honest and say he is the most qualified RINO, but be aware, that he has buckled every time he has met a liberal in debate…he certainly is dashing thou…

right2bright on October 11, 2011 at 9:27 AM

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