New Fast & Furious document: ATF bought guns with taxpayer money and sold them to illegal buyers directly

posted at 4:45 pm on September 26, 2011 by Allahpundit

In case anyone’s still bitterly clinging to the “botched sting” theory of this clusterfark, cling no longer:

According to documents obtained by Fox News, Agent John Dodson was ordered to buy six semi-automatic Draco pistols — two of those were purchased at the Lone Wolf gun store in Peoria, Ariz. An unusual sale, Dodson was sent to the store with a letter of approval from David Voth, an ATF group supervisor.

Dodson then sold the weapons to known illegal buyers, while fellow agents watched from their cars nearby.

This was not a “buy-bust” or a sting operation, where police sell to a buyer and then arrest them immediately afterward. In this case, agents were “ordered” to let the sale go through and follow the weapons to a stash house.

According to sources directly involved in the case, Dodson felt strongly that the weapons should not be abandoned and the stash house should remain under 24-hour surveillance. However, Voth disagreed and ordered the surveillance team to return to the office. Dodson refused, and for six days in the desert heat kept the house under watch, defying direct orders from Voth.

A week later, a second vehicle showed up to transfer the weapons. Dodson called for an interdiction team to move in, make the arrest and seize the weapons. Voth refused and the guns disappeared with no surveillance.

Here’s the PDF of the alleged letter from Voth authorizing the purchase by Dodson. For context on what’s going on here, you need to read this post at Sipsey Street Irregulars, which has been covering Fast & Furious relentlessly and apparently got a copy of Voth’s letter before even Fox News did. According to SSI, Dodson had made clear his opposition to Fast & Furious to his colleagues at the Phoenix ATF office even before he was tasked to make this purchase. Why choose him for the assignment then? Because, the theory goes, Voth figured that by involving Dodson in the scheme directly, he’d keep quiet about it going forward if only to protect himself. Dodson, it’s assumed, realized that it was a set up, which is why he demanded something in writing from Voth documenting that he ordered the purchase. In fact, SSI claims there’s a second letter from Voth authorizing Dodson to puchase two more pistols and, what’s more, that both Darrell Issa and Grassley have copies of the letters. Two obvious questions, then. First, why hasn’t Issa been trumpeting this letter? He hasn’t been shy about unloading on the DOJ for other sins. Is he still trying to authenticate it or is he simply holding back for the time being for strategic reasons, possibly to see if others come forward? Second, if Voth’s letter is what it appears to be, why would he put the authorization in writing given the risk that it might be used against him later? Isn’t there some other way he could have arranged the purchase without getting his fingerprints on it, like, say, by tasking a third agent to write his own letter to buy the guns and then have Dodson sell them to the illegal buyers in order to “dirty him up”?

Here’s an interview with Dodson from back in March. He hasn’t turned up on the news lately because — well, read the SSI post for that.

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In the military, and in those civilian agencies with whom I worked over the years, in order to expend funds one had to have “orders” and more important, a “fund cite.” Both had to be signed off on by higher ups, otherwise the spender would be left holding the bag or worse, face jail time for misappropriation of federal funds.

With this large a sum, there is a finance officer within the DoJ who signed off on the expense allotment, and then there was a DoJ official higher than ATF who signed off on the overall program.

Something this “important” to the Administration was not approved and signed off on by a mere division chief or branch chief. An Undersecretary at least had to be the approving official, I’d surmise.

Find him/her. Put their feet to the fire (can’t waterboard ‘em) and then wait for them to sing loudly.

I’ll bet that the words “Obama” and “Holder” are in the lyrics.

coldwarrior on September 26, 2011 at 6:25 PM

I’m going to go now and prepare for my audit.

:>)

hillbillyjim on September 26, 2011 at 6:11 PM

hillbilljim:Speaking of audits,how about the Obama Campaign
Bundlers!:)
==========================

Video: Obama Bundler George Kaiser Discusses Securing Stimulus Funds
Sept 22 2011
(Video)
**********

“More cash in American history,going out the door”,and Tesla
is mentioned!:)

http://blog.heritage.org/2011/09/22/video-obama-bundler-george-kaiser-discusses-securing-stimulus-funds/

canopfor on September 26, 2011 at 6:25 PM

Can we extradite Obama and Holder to Mexico to stand trial for conspiracy to commit mass murder?

Lon Chaney on September 26, 2011 at 6:28 PM

Seriously – Doesn’t responsibility for the actions of the executive branch ultimately rest on the Chief executive?

Chip on September 26, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Like with everything this SCoaMF does there’s always a way to “bypass”. I posted an example of an episode of “24″; whether it’s possible or not, that depends on Johnny Mac, who made a cameo on that show-you know, the delivery boy?

Yeah can’t get my hopes up, he thinks highly of President Obama.

Remember this? “McCain Booed For Calling Obama A “Decent Man You Don’t Have To Be Afraid Of”

“Revenge is sweet, when served cold”-Kill Bill

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 6:30 PM

I have no idea, but I do know that you guys come up with really cool names for your fake scandals.

crr6 on July 10, 2011 at 1:24 PM

Del Dolemonte on September 26, 2011 at 6:31 PM

Can we extradite Obama and Holder to Mexico to stand trial for conspiracy to commit mass murder?

Lon Chaney on September 26, 2011 at 6:28 PM

Heh it’s a miracle (or a done deal, whichever way you want to look at it) that we are not engaged in war. Their Constitution is pretty straightforward-no invasion, no war.

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 6:34 PM

Question for those on the left:

If Dick Cheney were responsible for what Haliburton did 6 years after he became Vice President, 10 years after he left the company and 8 years after he sold all his stock; then why isn’t Obama responsible for this?

barnone on September 26, 2011 at 6:06 PM

Uh, because he says he was born in Honolulu.

Oh, and because he’s cool. Cheney’s not.

Del Dolemonte on September 26, 2011 at 6:37 PM

Here’s an interview with Dodson from back in March. He hasn’t turned up on the news lately because — well, read the SSI post for that.

I read that.

I hope Dodson has a cabin in the backwoods somewhere so that he can survive this until it’s thoroughly exposed.

INC on September 26, 2011 at 6:38 PM

Is it possible, that the intent was to get cartels to use, and dispose of these weapons at murder scenes, to insure gun controls would be part of the end result, and I mean severe gun controls?

Imagine if that’s what the end game was? Our tax payer paid agents, using our tax dollars, to make a deal with cartels, to do senseless murders of innocents, just to get gun control? Waste of life, for that??? Is that really the lefts mentality? You have no problem with murder, just so you get your ideology in place?

capejasmine on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 5:40 PM

Thanks for the link!

White House answers Congress in Gunwalker

although CBS should have headlined it: White House Stonewalls Congress in Gunwalker–and you know if the President was a Republican they would have done so!

An administration official Congress wanted to interview before the end of the month may be unavailable. That’s according to a new letter from a White House counsel to members of Congress investigating the ATF Fast and Furious “Gunwalker” scandal….

The new letter from the President’s counsel doesn’t say O’Reilly can’t be interviewed by Congressional investigators, but neither does it provide an availability date. Instead the letter states that

O’Reilly, who has moved from the White House to the State Department from where he was tasked, is “currently on a previously scheduled assignment to Iraq.”

The members of Congress also asked for other documents and communications within the White House staff regarding Fast and Furious by September 23rd. No materials were provided, but the President’s Attorney indicated some could be handed over by the end of this week.

Delay and hope it goes away.

INC on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

http://www.sheriffpaul.com/category/latest-news/

I think tonight is a Townhall in Sheriff Paul Babeau’s county in AZ where the topic is operation Fast and Furious.

**update worthy.

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 6:55 PM

http://www.sheriffpaul.com/petition/

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 6:56 PM

WWJBD??

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 6:13 PM

What would Jack Bauer Do.
What would James Bond Do.

Slowburn on September 26, 2011 at 6:57 PM

Seriously – Doesn’t responsibility for the actions of the executive branch ultimately rest on the Chief executive?

Chip on September 26, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Like with everything this SCoaMF does there’s always a way to “bypass”. I posted an example of an episode of “24″; whether it’s possible or not, that depends on Johnny Mac, who made a cameo on that show-you know, the delivery boy?

Yeah can’t get my hopes up, he thinks highly of President Obama.

Remember this? “McCain Booed For Calling Obama A “Decent Man You Don’t Have To Be Afraid Of”

“Revenge is sweet, when served cold”-Kill Bill

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 6:30 PM

Given the timing, it would seem like it would be all the better that the Walkergate scandal to play itself out and have whoever is to bused under happen now rather than later on, whilst closer to the campaign.

A quick, cooperative investigation would lead to the person who authorized this travesty with she or he quickly booted out of the administration and perhaps into well deserved Federal detention.

One would think that the administration would wish to have this affair done with and out of the way for El Presidente Downgrade’s glorious re-election.

Nevertheless, this isn’t how events are playing out, each delay and stonewall only serveing to push the ultimate revelation closer to November 2012.

This should lead one to the inescapable conclusion that it would be better to have this proceed at is has to protect someone…….

Chip on September 26, 2011 at 6:59 PM

Delay and hope it goes away.

INC on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

Fast and furiously redacting.

capejasmine on September 26, 2011 at 7:03 PM

To me it’s so amazing that there is so much information out there, and yet…nothing. The cup is full, and it’s starting to overflow.

Questions/Inquiries: The family’s lawsuit is in place. Does that have to kick in if the investigation goes nowhere, or they go in par with Issa’s investigation?

Do(es) the family’s attorney(s) are in touch with Issa’s team?

Also, as information changes their lawsuit should be changing as information comes along. Lots of threads, make sure to tie all these knots. Nobody likes misinformation in such a serious case as this;

I wonder how that goes into play, because I don’t know if they will sue from O all the way down, or from Justice all the way down;

Since this is such a big effin’ deal, maybe they can file multiple lawsuits to cover more bases?

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 7:03 PM

What would Jack Bauer Do.

Dunno how “24″ ended but this crap can be a whole season. Wish Keifer would reconsider/

ProudPalinFan on September 26, 2011 at 7:11 PM

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2011/09/fast-and-furious-town-hall-in-tucson.html

A group of Tucsonans are upset about the alleged failures of the ATF’s “Fast and Furious” operation, and tonight, a congressman and a whistleblower will be at a town hall to answer questions and discuss the facts about the program.

The Tucson Tea Party is hosting a “Fast and Furious” Town Hall from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m. tonight at the CDO High School’s Performance Auditorium. Congressman Paul Gosar, representing Arizona’s 1st District, and a member of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, will be at the town hall. A well-known whistleblower for the Fast and Furious program will also be present, organizers say.

AllahP: This townhall is getting ready to kickoff in ~20mins.

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 7:35 PM

MSM (with fingers stuck in their ears):
la-la-la-la-la-la….I can’t hear you….la-la-la-la-la-la-la.

Dr. Carlo Lombardi on September 26, 2011 at 7:52 PM

Obama Scandal Checklist: Operation Fast And Furious
http://wizbangblog.com/2011/09/24/obama-scandal-checklist-operation-fast-and-furious/

So the official explanation simply makes no sense.

OK, so much for the official explanation. How about some of those crazy, crackpot, nutjob conspiracy theories?

Then there’s another, even bigger theory — that the whole operation was part of a grand scheme to benefit the Left politically. In that theory, here’s how it works out:

1) As the cartels get better armed, more Mexicans flee Mexico to escape the terror — and come to the US, where they would be far more likely to support Democrats.

2) As the gun violence ramps up and more and more guns are traced back to the US, support for tighter gun control laws

3) As that fails to do anything to stop the violence, finally someone pushes a law to decriminalize many drugs in the US

Now, I happen to think both those theories are thoroughly crackpot. But I can’t help but notice — they’re actually less crazy than the official story.

Colbyjack on September 26, 2011 at 7:54 PM

Have any of the Republican candidates for POTUS even brought up this subject during the debates?

Really Right on September 26, 2011 at 8:00 PM

What a freakin’ disaster. Whoever is to blame I hope they have to face some consequences but even if/when this happens this is a nightmare. Clusterf**k doesn’t even begin to describe.

Yakko77 on September 26, 2011 at 8:12 PM

How much “deeper” can this get? It’s simply grotesque. The horrifying thing is the double standard. If this had happened in a Republican administration, the MSM coverage would be incessant and all the operations of government would have ground to a halt. It would be Watergate on steroids.

But there’s hardly a peep from the MSM on this, even though it’s one of the most truly dastardly things ever done by the US government.

J.E. Dyer on September 26, 2011 at 8:46 PM

Can we impeach Him now?!?!?

KMC1 on September 26, 2011 at 8:47 PM

Again: this operation was primarily conducted to give proof to the lie repeatedly touted by the State Department and other officials in the Obama Administration that 90% of the weaponry used by the drug cartels originated via straw buys in gun shops in the United States.

The purpose was to influence state legislative gun control efforts and fuel greater regulatory restrictions on gun sellers throughout the country, specifically in the Southwestern states bordering Mexico–evinced by the fact that border state gun shops are now limited in the number of guns they can sell in a given transaction–through no fault of their own and not because they are in any way corrupt or dishonest. In fact, gun shop owners cooperated fully with law enforcement throughout this dismal affair, thinking they were being good citizens.

Of course, what I’m saying is what Ace of Ace of Spades calls ‘The Big Theory’, and he doesn’t buy it because it’s…too big. The implication is that hundreds of people have died purposefully, that the carnage caused by putting these guns–including a number of Barrett .50 sniper rifles–into the hands of mass-murdering criminal cartels was intentional. In short, innocent people were meant to die. Good God.

No one died as the result of the break-in of the Watergate Hotel all those years ago, yet a President went down for it. And now, the MSM absolutely refuses to give this story the coverage it deserves, finally transforming itself from cheerleader to accessory.

troyriser_gopftw on September 26, 2011 at 9:04 PM

Is anyone out there expecting a left-leaning, anti-second amendment media to actually get passionate about this administration’s naivete’ and/or incompetence actually causing deaths of innocent Mexicans?

Not me.

BigAlSouth on September 26, 2011 at 9:27 PM

According one source close to the Issa committee and knowledgeable of its workings, this revelation “puts a stake in the heart of the ‘botched sting operation’ lie.” He continued, “There never was any ‘sting,’ there was only a deliberate effort to provide weapons to the DTO’s (Drug Trafficking Organizations).” He added, “this was one hundred percent us — our money, our guy, our (gun)walking.”

Vindication! I have been saying this since Day One!

novaculus on September 26, 2011 at 9:38 PM

He added, “this was one hundred percent us — our money, our guy, our (gun)walking.”

well, that’s not entirely true. It was our money, our guy, but it was the criminals doing the walking.

BTW, what was it about this operation that was either “fast” or “furious”??? I’m at a loss to see the connection between those adjectives and what went on…

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 9:42 PM

But the NYT said this was a non-troversy.

holygoat on September 26, 2011 at 9:45 PM

Imagine if that’s what the end game was? Our tax payer paid agents, using our tax dollars, to make a deal with cartels, to do senseless murders of innocents, just to get gun control? Waste of life, for that??? Is that really the lefts mentality? You have no problem with murder, just so you get your ideology in place?

capejasmine on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

That bears repeating. The answer is YES.

NOW do you know who you are dealing with?! Are you all awake.?
But you forget that in order to get their precious gun control they have to SUBVERT AND DESTROY the CONSTITUTION of the United States.!

THEY ARE TRAITORS.

Traitors will be hung by the neck until dead.

No mercy, no quarter…because you shall get none.

orbitalair on September 26, 2011 at 10:13 PM

This is a bigger scandal than Teapot Dome, bigger than Watergate. Funny how it isn’t being reported except for on blogs.

Vashta.Nerada on September 26, 2011 at 4:55 PM

Was Dome ever used as a scandal suffix? Why was Watergate not Watergatedome?

Can we stop using “gate”?

What to replace it?

bbhack on September 26, 2011 at 10:23 PM

Tucson Tea Party Town Hall update

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 10:38 PM

Each time a new piece of information is released regarding this abomination, I wonder why Mexico hasn’t declared war on the United States.

Snake307 on September 26, 2011 at 11:09 PM

Our good friends over in Britain at the Daily Mail are now covering this story.

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 11:10 PM

and gettin even more play here….!

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 11:11 PM

Is it possible, that the intent was to get cartels to use, and dispose of these weapons at murder scenes, to insure gun controls would be part of the end result, and I mean severe gun controls?

capejasmine on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

Not only possible, but the only logical conclusion one can draw. Occam’s razor and all that. There is no other rational explanation.
a) They weren’t tracking the firearms,
b) they didn’t arrest those who were moving the arms before they disappeared, they were only waiting for them to show up at crime scenes.
c) Hillary and other minions were telegraphing the statements about how much of those arms traced from violent crimes in Mexico came from the US.
d) Obama told Sarah Brady they were working on gun control “under the radar”.
e) … and that’s just off the top of my head, there’s way more, including the work being done by the ATF leaders.

How much more clear can things be? What do people want, a billboard paid for by the Obama administration outlining the plan!?

AZfederalist on September 26, 2011 at 11:28 PM

Is it possible, that the intent was to get cartels to use, and dispose of these weapons at murder scenes, to insure gun controls would be part of the end result, and I mean severe gun controls?

capejasmine on September 26, 2011 at 6:43 PM

that’s what perplexed me. Its as if they wanted those guns to be found. It makes no sense to fire your weapon, then drop it, unless you got capped yourself. They do talk about the weapons at the Brian Terry scene as being “left there” at the scene. Who does that?

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 11:35 PM

BTW, Allah. Whatever happpened to all of those national guard soldiers who were supposed to deploy to the southern border? did it happen?

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 11:37 PM

Can we stop using “gate”?

What to replace it?

bbhack on September 26, 2011 at 10:23 PM

The scandals are coming so “fast-and-furious” that a suffix recognizing this administration would seem only proper.

-ama ? -bama? -ack? -rack? -rama? -obamanation?

Walkerama? Walkerbama?

Solindrarama?

Or perhaps just refer to everything as having been “baracked” or an “obamaed”.

Yoop on September 26, 2011 at 11:43 PM

Was Dome ever used as a scandal suffix? Why was Watergate not Watergatedome?

Can we stop using “gate”?

What to replace it?

bbhack on September 26, 2011 at 10:23

I suggest “Way”: The Chicago Way, The Acorn Way, The Planned Parenthood Way, Drug Cartel Gun Way, The Solyntra Way, The Light Square Way, Obama Way Is Way An Way Accomplice Way to Urder May.

KW64 on September 27, 2011 at 12:11 AM

They do talk about the weapons at the Brian Terry scene as being “left there” at the scene. Who does that?

ted c on September 26, 2011 at 11:35 PM

Umm, suspects who have been shot and/or captured. Which is what happened in the Terry case. Unfortunately, Terry was mortally wounded in the exchange.

From the AZ Red Star report on the incident:

Four people, including one who suffered gunshot wounds, were taken into custody. Authorities were searching for a fifth suspect Wednesday, said Rick Barlow, deputy chief in the Border Patrol’s Tucson Sector.

Read more: http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_c6fe2e25-8813-502b-867a-c796638fcec0.html#ixzz1Z7fc4CZC

Hmm, interesting how the Red Star added that little html tag to my copy and paste, even though the paragraph was in the middle of the story.

AZfederalist on September 27, 2011 at 12:11 AM

With all due respect to Ace, the theory he rejects as ‘too big” isn’t big enough, not by a long shot.

It wasn’t a sting, it was a deliberate transfer of weapons to Mexican drug criminals, specifically members of the Sinaloa cartel. It was a criminal conspiracy in violation of Mexican and US law that involved members of multiple law enforcement and national security agencies and multiple cabinet level departments. Involving multiple cabinet level departments as it did, authority must have come from above. The perpetrators had to know there would be blood, and the blood trail leads straight to the Oval Office. The risks were huge, and discovery of the scheme was more and more likely the longer it went on. The desperation reflected by the absolute stonewalling demonstrates those responsible realize the stakes couldn’t be higher.

All this to promote a wildly unpopular and demonstrably ineffective gun control agenda? That purpose simply doesn’t justify the massive risks taken. Other and bigger agendas were being served.

As I have said before, the involvement of this many players requires that multiple agendas were being served. Creating statistics and a political climate favorable to more gun control was likely one agenda, but it wasn’t the only one; it wasn’t even the primary one.

Los Zetas pose an existential threat to the Mexican government. A Mexican narco-state in the hands of those bloody murderers would pose a tremendous threat to American national security. Someone was arming the Sinaloa cartel and using them to engage in a war by proxy against Los Zetas.

The only question remaining is who authorized the scheme, and only one person in the federal government can move all these agencies in concert. He lives in the White House. This deadly scandal will bring him down, and a bunch of his corrupt and criminal cronies are going down with him.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 12:31 AM

Los Zetas pose an existential threat to the Mexican government. A Mexican narco-state in the hands of those bloody murderers would pose a tremendous threat to American national security. Someone was arming the Sinaloa cartel and using them to engage in a war by proxy against Los Zetas.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 12:31 AM

Does arming a militaristic 3rd world gang w/ piles of cash with civilian firearms from civilian gun shops make sense?

This screams incompetence. The kind of incompetence that needs to be put away for a long time.

Just to say: civilian firearms kill, I know.

bbhack on September 27, 2011 at 12:52 AM

Yoop on September 26, 2011 at 11:43 PM

-rama or -bama, depending on which has more ear appeal.

bbhack on September 27, 2011 at 12:55 AM

Los Zetas pose an existential threat to the Mexican government. A Mexican narco-state in the hands of those bloody murderers would pose a tremendous threat to American national security. Someone was arming the Sinaloa cartel and using them to engage in a war by proxy against Los Zetas.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 12:31 AM

It that is the case, this is one of the clumsiest, most inefficient ways to provide what are essentially commercial class weapons and not even very high volume to the Sinaloas. Pure amateur hour. Seems an awful lot of work for a few thousand guns that the Sinaloas could have purchased more readily and more effectively through third world black market arms dealers.

AZfederalist on September 27, 2011 at 1:05 AM

AZfederalist on September 27, 2011 at 1:05 AM

If that is the case …

/if, if, dang fingers

AZfederalist on September 27, 2011 at 1:06 AM

I suggest “Way”: The Chicago Way, The Acorn Way, The Planned Parenthood Way, Drug Cartel Gun Way, The Solyntra Way, The Light Square Way, Obama Way Is Way An Way Accomplice Way to Urder May.

KW64 on September 27, 2011 at 12:11 AM

or gate-way? It’s a baby step.

bbhack on September 27, 2011 at 1:08 AM

Does arming a militaristic 3rd world gang w/ piles of cash with civilian firearms from civilian gun shops make sense?

This screams incompetence. The kind of incompetence that needs to be put away for a long time.

Just to say: civilian firearms kill, I know.

bbhack on September 27, 2011 at 12:52 AM

It makes more sense than mobilizing all these resources and taking all these risks just to promote more gun control which they had to know would mobilize one of the most powerful political forces in the country, the NRA and its 4.3 million members. No argument on the incompetence.

It that is the case, this is one of the clumsiest, most inefficient ways to provide what are essentially commercial class weapons and not even very high volume to the Sinaloas. Pure amateur hour. Seems an awful lot of work for a few thousand guns that the Sinaloas could have purchased more readily and more effectively through third world black market arms dealers.

AZfederalist on September 27, 2011 at 1:05 AM

In this case the commercial class weapons, mostly AKS semi-auto civilian versions of the AK-47, are equal or better in quality than the military issue AK-47s, the only significant difference being the lack of a select-fire full auto option. We know more than 2,000 weapons were transferred, including at least a few high quality extremely powerful .50 BMG tactical rifles, and hand grenade parts. That is a very significant arsenal by any estimation. We don’t know how much of the cost was born by the Sinaloas, as more evidence is being revealed of US taxpayer dollars being used to finance the initial purchases, and we have no idea how much, if anything, the Sinaloas were actually paying. Current treaty restrictions, and the highly developed methods used to track compliance with them, would make transfer of US military issue weapons virtually impossible. And just giving the Sinaloas the money to buy mil-surp AK-47s on the black market doesn’t provide those ultimately responsible with the multiple layers of cover this scheme does, or serve any of the other agendas that had to be served to motivate some of the actors. As it is, whoever is behind it had at least two levels of cover, the first being “sting gone bad” and the second being “corrupt politicians advancing political agendas”. The first has been penetrated, but the second is still providing cover.

I realize I am speculating here, but a great American once said we must not be afraid to see what we see. We must see what we see, count the numbers, do the math, and connect the dots. Some of us saw from day one that the “sting gone bad” story was nonsense. The very fact that a nonsensical cover story was being floated meant there was something corrupt behind the smoke. The massive scale of the operation and the magnitude of the risks taken are completely disproportionate to the possible benefits of enacting more gun control, particularly when doing so creates its own risks of political backlash. Some of the actors may have been motivated by that agenda, but not those ultimately responsible. They had to have bigger goals.

I might be wrong about the overarching agenda being a proxy war with Los Zetas, but I am certain that there is one, and it is much bigger than promoting an unpopular gun control agenda that would have serious political consequences if attempted.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 2:18 AM

Did these corrupt boobs at least make money onthe deal? or is even that too much to ask?

Lonetown on September 27, 2011 at 5:12 AM

Arizona Rep. Paul Gosar described Operation Fast and Furious as “A Few Good Men being played out in real life,” adding that humans were used as collateral damage while the federal government armed Mexican cartel members with .50 caliber sniper rifles, a weapon strong enough to take down a helicopter, and AK-47s.

“I want to remind you, we had a couple of guys break into a hotel take down an administration, nobody died,” Gosar said. “When are we going to hold agencies and bureaucrats to task?”

Gosar, Babeu and Cefalu all called for accountability from the Obama Administration multiple times throughout the evening and questions from the audience were centered around who ultimately would be held responsible for not only the death of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry, but also for the deaths of thousands of innocent Mexicans.

“These people are now being killed wholesale,” Cefalu said.

In the past 18 months, 22,000 Mexicans have been killed.

“President Obama is not above the law and he and this administration will have to account for this,” Babeu said.

ted c on September 27, 2011 at 7:49 AM

Just imagine for a moment, if the Bush administration was involved in a scandal of this proportion, it would be front cover news, on every television network, and the pundits would be screaming from their rooftops “It’s Bush’s fault!” Bush would have been crucified just for the scandal itself, never mind the scrutiny.


Where are you New York Times​?

ted c on September 27, 2011 at 7:51 AM

It is a false statement from the Department of Justice — they knew about this — I made reference to this in my first letter as they indicated, and the order came directly to an ATF agent to make the sale,” Grassley said. “He had the money to make the sale — he bought the guns — he transferred them to another person of the underworld. That other person actually paid more for the guns than what the taxpayers paid to buy the guns in the first place, and then they went to a storehouse.

“It’s a lie — it’s a lie — and just to make things clear for your listeners: The ATF ordered this ATF agent to purchase these guns and in turn sell them, and supposedly track them,” he said. “But he was a lone wolf in the operation — they wouldn’t give him any help for 24-hour surveillance.”

ted c on September 27, 2011 at 7:55 AM

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/morning_call/2011/09/arizona-lawmaker-wants-fast-and.html

U.S. Rep. Trent Franks, R-Ariz., wants the Obama administration to release all its documents and data for its ill-fated Operation Fast and Furious gun-running investigation.

Franks made the request today as Republicans press the White House on the gun investigation. That investigation involved trying to track guns purchased in Arizona and other states by straw buyers and then transported back to Mexico for use by drug cartels.

ted c on September 27, 2011 at 7:56 AM

Unchecked power corrupts,” he said, adding that there are no longer checks and balances within ATF.

In his speech, Cefalu made the larger argument that this is a major government corruption problem, not only surrounding Operation Fast and Furious, but about a runaway government that doesn’t answer to the people, saying ATF agents and the Department of Justice shouldn’t be able to say no to Congress when asked for documentation surrounding operations within the Bureau. The Obama Justice Department has been stonewalling the House Oversight Committee in its investigation into Operation Fast and Furious since day one.

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2011/09/tucson-tea-party-town-hall-on-gunwalker.html

ted c on September 27, 2011 at 8:04 AM

Of course, what I’m saying is what Ace of Ace of Spades calls ‘The Big Theory’, and he doesn’t buy it because it’s…too big. The implication is that hundreds of people have died purposefully, that the carnage caused by putting these guns–including a number of Barrett .50 sniper rifles–into the hands of mass-murdering criminal cartels was intentional. In short, innocent people were meant to die. Good God.

troyriser_gopftw on September 26, 2011 at 9:04 PM

Would you have thought what our goverment did at Ruby Ridge was too big? How about Waco? Many, if not most of us, would have, before seeing/knowing all of the involved evidence – the evidence in those 2 cases told a different story than we wished we was possible. “too big” is why so many people scoff at the notion of Vince Foster’s death being a murder rather a suicide, so they blithely ignore the truth that the “official” story doesn’t fit the facts we have at hand.

“too big”? If you drop incredulity and go by the evidence that we have now alone, “innocent people were meant to die” is the inescapable conclusion, unfortunately.

Bizarro No. 1 on September 27, 2011 at 8:22 AM

This Dodson document was meant to cover Dodson, because he knew he was being setup for the fall on this buy. What Issa will need is a statement that this was ‘normal’, and not isolated to Dodson.

orbitalair on September 27, 2011 at 8:37 AM

I realize I am speculating here, but a great American once said we must not be afraid to see what we see. We must see what we see, count the numbers, do the math, and connect the dots. Some of us saw from day one that the “sting gone bad” story was nonsense. The very fact that a nonsensical cover story was being floated meant there was something corrupt behind the smoke. The massive scale of the operation and the magnitude of the risks taken are completely disproportionate to the possible benefits of enacting more gun control, particularly when doing so creates its own risks of political backlash. Some of the actors may have been motivated by that agenda, but not those ultimately responsible. They had to have bigger goals.

I might be wrong about the overarching agenda being a proxy war with Los Zetas, but I am certain that there is one, and it is much bigger than promoting an unpopular gun control agenda that would have serious political consequences if attempted.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 2:18 AM

You are so, so right here. When the individual facts we already know about this scandal are pieced together as pieces of a puzzle, the picture we are beginning to see isn’t completely obscure. This is BIG.

People need to take a step back from their preconceived notions not only of what they believe members of our government aren’t capable of doing to the innocent citizens of a neighboring country like Mexico, but also of what they believe these people aren’t capable of doing to fellow Americans.

Bizarro No. 1 on September 27, 2011 at 8:49 AM

The FBI raids a guitar manufacturer because of maybe having a species of wood in their inventory…
But the FBI can’t go into the ATF office and do the same when they are suspected of being part of a plan that ended up killing people?
A species of wood is treated with more respect than hundreds of people killed…amazing.

right2bright on September 27, 2011 at 8:57 AM

right2bright on September 27, 2011 at 8:57 AM

Because this government we have created is an all powerful monster that answers to no one.
I don’t know how Issa/Grassley take down the beast but take it down they must.

ORconservative on September 27, 2011 at 9:33 AM

The only question remaining is who authorized the scheme, and only one person in the federal government can move all these agencies in concert. He lives in the White House. This deadly scandal will bring him down, and a bunch of his corrupt and criminal cronies are going down with him.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 12:31 AM

If this takes down the Obama Administration, I cannot see how the media as it is now survives. How do they explain not pursuing this story to the end? Or jumping in once it can no longer be contained?

piglet on September 27, 2011 at 9:42 AM

Again, I submit that while heinous, neither this nor Solyndra are going to cause this administration any harm – ever.

Well-positioned Democrats are simply above the law – their party will never harm them while in power, and when Republicans are in power, they’ll adopt the “let’s move on, not going to spend our entire administration on petty “pay back” investigations, blah blah blah.”

But by all means, keep f@#$ing this chicken. Let us know when you get fed up and finally ready to acknowledge that the system is well beyond broken.

Midas on September 27, 2011 at 10:51 AM

If this takes down the Obama Administration, I cannot see how the media as it is now survives. How do they explain not pursuing this story to the end? Or jumping in once it can no longer be contained?

piglet on September 27, 2011 at 9:42 AM

Same way they explain their blatant bias for the libs for the last few decades – they won’t explain it, and will move along as though nothing ever happened.

“You going to believe me or your own lying eyes?” And too much of the public will continue to believe *them* despite the evidence. *shrug*

Midas on September 27, 2011 at 10:53 AM

A Draco Pistol is an AK-47 in pistol form. Just calling it a Draco pistol (for most people) is understating what it actually is.

Pole-Cat on September 27, 2011 at 11:54 AM

And just giving the Sinaloas the money to buy mil-surp AK-47s on the black market doesn’t provide those ultimately responsible with the multiple layers of cover this scheme does, or serve any of the other agendas that had to be served to motivate some of the actors.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 2:18 AM

That raises an very interesting point

Most likely the cartels would prefer military grade select-fire weaponry to semi-automatic civilian versions – it would give them fire power that would be at par with the Mexican government and rival cartels.

The facts bear this out despite the 90% lie the Downgrade Administration tried to push for so long.

So if the stated intention was to take down the cartels through their arms purchases, why wouldn’t have they gone after the biggest and most desirable source of the cartel’s weapons?

Why didn’t they come up with a sting operation to sell them select fire weapons from other South-American nations or from surplus stock from the US military?

Again, if we are to believe they are being true to their word in as to their stated intention, why didn’t they follow the most expedient course of action to do so?

Why instead did they go after an unlikely source of these arms?

Chip on September 27, 2011 at 1:32 PM

I pray for Dodson’s safety.
Bcs I’m sure someone has designs on him.

Badger40 on September 27, 2011 at 2:28 PM

Pole-Cat on September 27, 2011 at 11:54 AM

Well, they are actually pistol versions of the semi-auto AKS, but the point is well taken. These “pistols” shoot 7.62×39 rifle ammunition, and accept high capacity magazines that fit the AKS/AK-47 rifles. Their smaller dimensions make them particularly handy in close-quarters.

Another point should be made. Altering these weapons for full automatic fire is beyond the skills of the average person, but a competent gunsmith with the right tools can certainly do it. If you knew you were going to have a batch of semi-autos coming in, it wouldn’t be hard to do the job assembly-line style and crank them out.

I wonder how many of the recovered guns have been altered, if any?

“…Why didn’t they come up with a sting operation to sell them select fire weapons from other South-American nations or from surplus stock from the US military?…”

Chip on September 27, 2011 at 1:32 PM

As I said above, the arms treaties are very restrictive and their enforcement mechanisms are robust, so moving anything that has been in a US or South American military inventory would be fraught with its own problems of exposure. Los Zetas, originally founded by ex-Mexican military and special forces, get American mil-spec weapons through their corrupt contacts in the Mexican military and police. Most of the black market in mil-spec AK-47s is from former Soviet block satellites, and Los Zetas may have the major traffickers into Mexico under their thumbs. I just don’t know, but I’m sure there are reasons, multiple reasons, for doing it this way.

novaculus on September 27, 2011 at 2:48 PM

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