Rush: Bachmann really jumped the shark on Gardasil

posted at 3:25 pm on September 13, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

After my earlier post strongly objecting to Michele Bachmann’s attempt to link the Gardasil vaccination to “mental retardation,” the response has been nearly unanimous among commenters — and as it turns out, pundits too.  The Boss Emeritus, whose rational objections to Perry’s Gardasil mandate threaten to be overwhelmed by Bachmann’s demagoguery, tries offering Bachmann some advice on how to deal with the issue in the future.  Rush Limbaugh, on the other hand, concludes that while Bachmann had an otherwise strong showing in last night’s debate, she “jumped the shark” last night and today by repeatedly using an attack that Rush says deserves “shame.” 

First, Rush defends Perry to some extent on the issue, calling it a “giant distraction“:

If you want to get directly to the “jump the shark” quote and see Rush deliver it, click the image to watch:

If Bachmann’s listening, here is Michelle Malkin’s advice, in part:

After successfully highlighting Perry’s troubling abuse of executive power during last night’s debate, Michele Bachmann risks blowing it with some factually inaccurate assertions.

She’s RIGHT on the principles, wrong on some of the details.

She needs to stay on message and stick with the facts.

The Texas state legislature repealed the order (over Perry’s hysterical objections) before any girl was forcibly vaccinated.

And while individual stories of Gardasil harm may or may not be true (Bachmann cited a mother who thinks the vaccine caused mental retardation in her child while making the post-debate rounds), it’s not the primary case she should be making.

Again: Bachmann is RIGHT on the principles, but it gets dicey citing cases where individual anecdotes need to be vetted before tossing them out on TV. She came dangerously close to using the same demagogic tactics Perry employed in obstinately defending the order even after it was repealed.

The main issue for Perry’s actions were the way he attempted to impose the mandate (by executive order) and the connections to Merck, both of which are fair game. As long as critics both inside and outside the race stick to those points, it’s an effective attack.  If the debate broadens to Gardasil itself as Bachmann tried to do, Perry may not be the only governor who will have to answer questions about Gardasil itself, however.  Pajamas Media’s Bryan Preston reaches into the Wayback machine and discovers the state of Alaska cheerfully accepting federal funds in order to distribute Gardasil for free during Sarah Palin’s tenure as Governor:

The Alaska Department of Health and Social Services announced today that an increase in federal funding will make it possible for all Alaska girls ages 9 through 18 to receive Gardasil ®, the vaccine to prevent cervical cancer, at no cost.

Earlier this spring, the department had said it could provide free Gardasil only to Alaska girls who met certain eligibility requirements. Since then, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) provided additional funds for Alaska to obtain more vaccine. This boost in federal aid will enable more Alaska girls to receive Gardasil. Distribution of this vaccine to providers is just beginning, so state health officials suggest calling providers before visiting local clinics to find out if the vaccine is available.

“We are thrilled that this unanticipated funding will allow us to provide the vaccine for all eligible girls,” said Laurel Wood, Alaska’s immunization program manager. “Although we have no guarantee that this funding will be available in future years, we hope to immunize as many Alaska girls as possible while we have this unique opportunity.”

The Boss Emeritus calls this a “really, really stupid attack on Palin” in an update to the linked post above, but I’m not entirely convinced. In the same post, Michelle argues:

The point is that Perry rushed to mandate the Merck-pushed order less than 8 months after it had received FDA approval. Clinical trial and safety data was extremely limited at the time. And scientific assessments are still coming in about the long-term and synergistic effects of this and other vaccines.

If the argument is that Gardasil was not ready for large-scale usage, then it’s not just about the mandate or the connections to Merck. The same argument against the mandate also apply in this case to taxpayer funding for massive vaccinations, do they not? And in this case, it’s the taxpayers who didn’t get to decide whether they wanted 12-year-old girls injected with a supposedly questionable vaccine at their expense, for a virus that isn’t easily spread through mandated proximity such as school attendance.

It’s not a problem on the same scale as Perry’s, but it’s not an unfair question to raise, either, if Gardasil itself is the problem, as it seems it is for some Perry critics.

Update: Worth noting — Perry actually has received nearly $30,000 from Merck over the past decade. Also worth noting — that doesn’t put Merck in the top 200 of Perry’s donors during that period. Seriously.

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I never imagined we would have a Gardasil election.

NotCoach on September 13, 2011 at 3:28 PM

The Boss Emeritus calls this a “really, really stupid attack on Palin” in an update to the linked post above

I saw this. Between her and Mark Levin, what is it that causes some very good, strong conservatives to launch fusillades against other conservatives in service of Sarah Palin?

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:28 PM

Regardless, I still think Jenny McCarthy is dreamy.

El_Terrible on September 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

Oh Ms. Malkin – you’ve lost all sense of objectivity on this issue.

As for the Palin angle – hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

gophergirl on September 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

The main issue for Perry’s actions were the way he attempted to impose the mandate (by executive order) and the connections to Merck, both of which are fair game. As long as critics both inside and outside the race stick to those points, it’s an effective attack.
posted at 3:25 pm on September 13, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

As shown by the previous posts and the comments in them, the critics won’t.

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

After successfully highlighting Perry’s troubling abuse of executive power during last night’s debate, Michele Bachmann risks blowing it with some factually inaccurate assertions.

She’s RIGHT on the principles, wrong on some of the details.

She needs to stay on message and stick with the facts.

“Factually inaccurate assertions?”

Isn’t that a fancy way of saying ‘lies?’

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Agreed Michelle bachmann was winning the message until the sillyness. Perry made a bad choice and admitted as much. You pointed out now move on.

Michelle Bachmann wins on her own message. Heck if Perry is to lose front runner status it wont be because of attacks it will be because he needs a personality transfusion. The guy is dull as dishwater.

This feild really does leave me cold.

William Amos on September 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Didn’t he go the EO route so insurance would pay for it?

I know how we are with mandates, but still…as a justification, isn’t that a good point?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:31 PM

So Alaska offering Gardisil to children whose parents approve is the same as Texas Giving a Mandatory prescription to children with a Parent opt out?

Sorry Ed, not seeing a tie in here.

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:31 PM

Oh my..:)

Dire Straits on September 13, 2011 at 3:31 PM

Blog War brewing?

zmdavid on September 13, 2011 at 3:28 PM

Its worse on twitter. Michelle Malkin and Ace are really arguing to no end there. Its sad because too many jumped too quickly on the Perry bandwagon. He hasnt been vetted yet.

William Amos on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

Regardless, I still think Jenny McCarthy is dreamy.

El_Terrible on September 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

Maybe when she isn’t talking.

NotCoach on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

Color me shocked that Malkin thinks the lob back at Palin is unfair…

changer1701 on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

“Factually inaccurate assertions?”

Isn’t that a fancy way of saying ‘lies?’

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Only if the speaker is aware that what she’s saying is not true.

If I sincerely believe that the moon is made of green cheese and tell you so, I’m factually wrong, but not lying.

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

Pajamas Media’s Bryan Preston reaches into the Wayback machine and discovers the state of Alaska cheerfully accepting federal funds in order to distribute Gardasil for free during Sarah Palin’s tenure as Governor

In other words, Perry doesn’t wanna talk about it anymore, Bachmann should quit while she’s behind, and Palin better tread very carefully if she still intends to enter the race. So why don’t we drop the damn thing? Nearly 20 minutes of the last 2 debates have been devoted to the topic. Job creation hasn’t gotten as much run and that’s the central issue in 2012 for chrissakes!

Doughboy on September 13, 2011 at 3:33 PM

Its sad because too many jumped too quickly on the Perry bandwagon. He hasnt been vetted yet.

William Amos on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

Ace will never change his mind now. He’s got to save face.

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:33 PM

I don’t have a problem trying to stop cancer. I have a hard time getting upset over this Gardasil thing. I think Perry had his heart in the right place, but did it in a massively stupid way.

He’s admitted as much… lets move on.

Bachman painting Vaccines as causing retardation and autism gets me angrier than Perry’s Gardasil problems. Parent’s who don’t vaccinate their kids because of this kind of idiocy should be drug out in the street and shot before their kids die a horrible preventable death.

E L Frederick (Sniper One) on September 13, 2011 at 3:33 PM

Sorry Ed, not seeing a tie in here.

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:31 PM

Not trying to be picky but I hardly think you’re an unbiased critic.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:33 PM

So Alaska offering Gardisil to children whose parents approve is the same as Texas Giving a Mandatory prescription to children with a Parent opt out?

One (alaska’s) is done with federal tax dollars. Another’s (texas) is done with state tax dollars.

lorien1973 on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

I saw this. Between her and Mark Levin, what is it that causes some very good, strong conservatives to launch fusillades against other conservatives in service of Sarah Palin?

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:28 PM

Yes. What would entice tireless, staunch warriors for the conservative cause to rally around Palin and support/defend her.

Are you serious? Really?

I hope you are missing the sarc tag because if not, then you cannot follow a train of thought. If this was meant to have a sarc tag, then my apologies.

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

For the record, I don’t think the evidence in this case suggests that Perry or Palin is guilty of crony capitalism. No need to get all wee’d wee’d up.

And yes, Bachmann threw herself into the lava pit for unexplained reasons.

El_Terrible on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Yes, she probably did jump the shark. Perry may have also. I don’t like seeing so many EO’s. Who do our electeds think they are? Kings? Princes? tinhorn dictators?

Wouldnt the average person be extremely reluctant to use such an instrument?

dogsoldier on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Keep your eye on the real war: $447 BILLION in new taxes on job creators!

publiuspen on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Not trying to be picky but I hardly think you’re an unbiased critic.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:33 PM

I am a Perry supporter.

Does that change your opinion now?

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Didn’t he go the EO route so insurance would pay for it?

I know how we are with mandates, but still…as a justification, isn’t that a good point?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:31 PM

It no longer matters. They have something they think has traction and now they are on a roll.

I’m still trying to figure out MM claiming Perry was hysterical.

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

Only if the speaker is aware that what she’s saying is not true.

If I sincerely believe that the moon is made of green cheese and tell you so, I’m factually wrong, but not lying.

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

So, Bachmann’s not a liar, she’s just ignorant and reckless.

Got it.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

One (alaska’s) is done with federal tax dollars. Another’s (texas) is done with state tax dollars.

lorien1973 on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

Ahhhh.

Palin must be destroyed.

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

I am a Perry supporter.

Does that change your opinion now?

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Who’s the Palin person who’s moniker also starts with a ‘p’? If it isn’t you, I apologize. Isn’t there one?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

Its worse on twitter. Michelle Malkin and Ace are really arguing to no end there. Its sad because too many jumped too quickly on the Perry bandwagon. He hasnt been vetted yet.

William Amos on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

It’s not like this issue was some big secret. Sure, people outside of Texas didn’t know much about it, but it was there for everyone to read about if they were interested. I think what people are slowly discovering about Perry is that he has some positions that a lot of conservatives will find objectionable, but more importantly, he’s a dude who sticks to his guns(no 2nd amendment pun intended). It’s frankly a welcome change from Obama who was more than happy to be the blank slate in 2008 in order to please everyone, but I suppose some folks prefer being pandered(i.e. lied) to.

Doughboy on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

Yes. What would entice tireless, staunch warriors for the conservative cause to rally around Palin and support/defend her.

Are you serious? Really?

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

They’re not warriors anymore. They’re brickthrowers. Levin calls Christie a fat slob and Coulter and Ingraham RINOs. Ditto Malkin, except to her it’s Perry who’s Satan. And the single unifying thread is that both have latched themselves firmly to Palin, and are really starting to grate on not only those conservatives who don’t want Palin to be president, but also those who like her.

They’re painting themselves into a corner, and starting to use language that people won’t easily forget even after the primary is over.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:38 PM

Wouldnt the average person be extremely reluctant to use such an instrument?

dogsoldier on September 13, 2011 at 3:35 PM

http://politicalhumor.about.com/cs/quotethis/a/reaganquotes.htm

“My fellow Americans. I’m pleased to announce that I’ve signed legislation outlawing the Soviet Union. We begin bombing in five minutes.” -joking during a mike check before his Saturday radio broadcast

To be fair, Ronald Reagan was hardly an average person, and he didn’t say he’d outlawed the Soviet Union by executive order… :-)

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:38 PM

A good thing to remember about Guardasil (if this is to be a Guardasil election) is that Michelle Obama barred U of Chicago from participating in the studies because it was too much like the Tuskegee syphallis experiment.

So that’s pretty sound and sciency.

MayBee on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

Perry received more than $28,000 from Merck…

http://www.nationalreview.com/primary-event/277073/perry-underestimated-merck-donations-debate-katrina-trinko

idesign on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

The “Way Back Machine” can be brutal..:)

Dire Straits on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

Isn’t that a fancy way of saying ‘lies?’

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Not necessarily. Lying speaks to intent behind speaking or writing an untrue statement/falsehood, while “wrong” speaks to the content itself.

“factually inaccurate” definitely means “partly or wholly false”, and the intent of the speaker may turn that into “lie”.

unclesmrgol on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

Palin had no choice but to accept this money. Could you imagine the outrage had she refused it and some people couldn’t get the shot? Yes, people could reach into their own wallets to pay for it, but we know how well that thought warms hearts of the populace, especially when the opportunity was there that they didn’t have to.

People in the state would be harping that she is wasting state taxes on something the feds would have picked up.

Plus, she’d be hectored on how she loves cancer, right? I see nowhere that she mandated that people have to go out of their way to avoid it rather than willingly choose it.

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

I can’t believe so many of you pushed her as a credible, even strong candidate for the presidency. After everything you said about Obama’s inexperience and seemingly radical leanings, you give us this loon???

ernesto on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

So, Bachmann’s not a liar, she’s just ignorant and reckless.

Got it.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

Never thought I would hear someone try and justify a politician’s stupidity by saying, oh, sorry… she was using MIDOL that week. /facepalm

E L Frederick (Sniper One) on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

There are no unbiased critics on Hot Air. Everyone who comments here has their own pre-set, pre-determined opinion.

kingsjester on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

So, Bachmann’s not a liar, she’s just ignorant and reckless.

Got it.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

Yep, I’d say that’s about right. :-(

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

As usual, Rush is right. It is a giant distraction.

There was an opt-out. Not as good as an opt-in, but still.

It was dumb to use an executive order. Perry has agreed.

Bachmann is marginalizing herself by continuing this line. Then again, she is only marginally involved anyway.

Pablo Snooze on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

Never thought I would hear someone try and justify a politician’s stupidity by saying, oh, sorry… she was using MIDOL that week. /facepalm

E L Frederick (Sniper One) on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

What? Who said that?

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:40 PM

Who’s the Palin person who’s moniker also starts with a ‘p’? If it isn’t you, I apologize. Isn’t there one?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

Promachus?

Anyway, doe the question lose merit depending on who asks it?

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 3:40 PM

They’re not warriors anymore. They’re brickthrowers. Levin calls Christie a fat slob and Coulter and Ingraham RINOs. Ditto Malkin, except to her it’s Perry who’s Satan. And the single unifying thread is that both have latched themselves firmly to Palin, and are really starting to grate on not only those conservatives who don’t want Palin to be president, but also those who like her.

They’re painting themselves into a corner, and starting to use language that people won’t easily forget even after the primary is over.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:38 PM

And meanwhile, the media and the Democrats sit by and giggle while conservatives throttle each other and ignore the elephant in the room (Obama’s economy).

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM

Ahhhh.

Palin must be destroyed.

portlandon on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

But maybe just maybe taking the pot shots at Perry last night and taking Bachmann’s side wasn’t the smartest thing to do.

Just my humble opinion and all that.

gophergirl on September 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM

Oh Ms. Malkin – you’ve lost all sense of objectivity on this issue.

As for the Palin angle – hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

gophergirl on September 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

No, I think you’re the one not being objective. How is Alaska accepting Federal funds for vaccinations in any way akin to Perry’s mandate-by-executive-fiat? The Federal government provides the states with all types of vaccinations all the time (e.g., influenza, meningitis). Palin never expressed opposition to Gardasil per se, but to the mandating of the vaccination, to the executive order by which it was mandated, and to the appearance of cronyism.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM

The Boss Emeritus, whose rational objections to Perry’s Gardasil mandate threaten to be overwhelmed by Bachmann’s demagoguery, tries offering Bachmann some advice on how to deal with the issue in the future.

Uh, no. Sorry, Ed, but there is very, very little that Malkin is rational about on this issue.

She’s half a step away from the tinfoil hat brigade.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM

There are no unbiased critics on Hot Air. Everyone who comments here has their own pre-set, pre-determined opinion.

kingsjester on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

I just hope we finish gnawing one another’s backbones before the primaries…

:-(

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

I think what people are slowly discovering about Perry is that he has some positions that a lot of conservatives will find objectionable, but more importantly, he’s a dude who sticks to his guns(no 2nd amendment pun intended). It’s frankly a welcome change from Obama who was more than happy to be the blank slate in 2008 in order to please everyone, but I suppose some folks prefer being pandered(i.e. lied) to.

Doughboy on September 13, 2011 at 3:37 PM

Which is what really gets me.

This particular issue isn’t really even an issue anymore. He’s already addressed it, admitted he was wrong, etc.

I like Perry but on the issues, his stance on toll roads/TTC/eminent domain is worse. He was dead wrong on it. But we’re vetting this crap?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

As a soft Perry supporter (he hasn’t closed the deal yet for me) I’m actually thankful to Bachmann, as I said in the headlines thread. The more she pulls crap like this, the more she pushes Rush into Perry’s camp.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

Ed, your Perrykrishna tendencies are showing. BACHMANN raised the issue of Gardasil itself, not Palin. She criticized the PROCESS by which Perry issued his Exec Order and the hints of “crony capitalism” in it. It’s beneath you trying to link Palin to Bachmann’s criticism of Gardasil when she’s never said a thing about the product itself.

SCSoxFan on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

The point is that Perry rushed to mandate the Merck-pushed order less than 8 months after it had received FDA approval. Clinical trial and safety data was extremely limited at the time.

I respectfully submit that it very likely wouldn’t have received FDA approval if clinical trial and safety data was extremely limited at the time.

Extensive safety and clinical data is required for FDA approval. And even after some drugs get it with initial data, subsequent follow-up data has caused some drugs to be recalled or quashed (Vioxx, etc).

Did that happen with this drug? Nope.

Good Lt on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

Rush did Sarah Palin and Greta “jump the shark” too.

Sarah did just as much damage to Perry as Michelle.

Sarah and Greta took his lousy HPV answer and broadened it to the more fundamental character question of crony capitalism.

Perry will start getting attacked on all of his pay to play dealings over the last 11 years.

Do Perry’s cheerleaders (Rush, Beck) really think the Perry is going to be able to withstand Obama in a debate?

If the answer is yes, then they are the ones that have jumped the shark.

Because Perry looked equally as bad on immigration. I cringed when kept repeating the line about someone’s last name, implying people who are against him in this issue are somehow racist….this guy is nowhere near ready for the national stage.

sheryl on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

I’m still trying to figure out MM claiming Perry was hysterical.

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

Didn’t you hear? That’s just “vetting”. That’s all MM is interested in…

changer1701 on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

The point is that Perry rushed to mandate the Merck-pushed order less than 8 months after it had received FDA approval. Clinical trial and safety data was extremely limited at the time. And scientific assessments are still coming in about the long-term and synergistic effects of this and other vaccines.

Malkin is brushing up against the same argument nutty that she’s criticizing Bachmann for making.

Eight months of FDA approval- which takes years of tests and clinical trials- and safety date was “extremely limited”? Really?

She’s getting dangerously close to Jenny McCarthy territory here. If you have legitimate reasons to believe that this or any other vaccine is dangerous- or more dangerous than not getting it- make your case. What Michelle Malkin is doing here comes terribly close to baseless scare mongering.

Hollowpoint on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:36 PM

Hey champ. An apology on the poverty thread for calling me a liar and/or a crook would be nice.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

I just hope we finish gnawing one another’s backbones before the primaries…

:-(

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

Exactly what I was thinking.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

So Alaska offering Gardisil to children whose parents approve is the same as Texas Giving a Mandatory prescription to children with a Parent opt out?
One (alaska’s) is done with federal tax dollars. Another’s (texas) is done with state tax dollars.

lorien1973 on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

So, is that kind of like when the feds offer the flu vaccine to states, are the states supposed to turn it down?

ConservativePartyNow on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

ernesto on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

A lot of us have compared her to Obama in regards to her inexperience. Many just see her as an alternative to Romney.

El_Terrible on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

Only if the speaker is aware that what she’s saying is not true.

If I sincerely believe that the moon is made of green cheese and tell you so, I’m factually wrong, but not lying.

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:32 PM

So, Bachmann is either a liar, or an idiot.

Hot damn, where do I sign up to vote for her to be President.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

Hey champ. An apology on the poverty thread for calling me a liar and/or a crook would be nice.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

You first, and you know what I’m talking about.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

SCSoxFan on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

Distinction without difference.

lorien1973 on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 3:40 PM

I don’t want to accuse anyone of bias who isn’t. I thought portlandon was a Palin supporter. So yeah, it does matter. At least to me.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

If the argument is that Gardasil was not ready for large-scale usage, then it’s not just about the mandate or the connections to Merck.

That’s not Malkin’s argument, though. Sarah Palin did sign or say anything forcing parents to vaccinate their daughters (oh, yeah forgot the “opt out”). I think the only angle you can come at Palin with this is

1) Someone in her gov’t was excited about federal funds coming in.

2) She endorsed Perry at one point.

That’s a HUGE stretch.

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

Once again, we see what damage occurs when someone doesn’t know how to quit when they’re ahead.

Bachmann made her point, Perry was pathetically unprepared to respond to an issue that he HAD to have known would come up.

In the process of trying to spike the football in the end zone, Bachmann accidentally breaks her ankle with the ball.

They’d both better do better and fast, if it’s not already too late.

DrAllecon on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

its a legit question, she’s a quitter not a fighter. why does anyone support her?

chasdal on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

They’re painting themselves into a corner, and starting to use language that people won’t easily forget even after the primary is over.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:38 PM

Nothing new in that. Levin hasn’t changed much — if at all — since he got on the air, and Malkin was screeching like a gut-shot manatee about McCain in ’08 when some positive words might have helped him defeat the SCoaMF.

(NOTE: I’m not saying McCain would have been a great or even good president…it’s just that the bar has been brought shamefully low by Osama Obama, and anyone who doesn’t consciously act to shred the Constitution and otherwise destroy the nation would be better.)

The danger with the my-way-or-the-highway crowd is that being overly doctrinaire too often leads to a bad result.

MrScribbler on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

People do change and disagree over time, but my Wayback Machine registers Bryan Preston as Ed’s predecessor here at HA when the Boss Emerita was in charge?

Wethal on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

I can’t believe so many of you pushed her as a credible, even strong candidate for the presidency. After everything you said about Obama’s inexperience and seemingly radical leanings, you give us this loon???

ernesto on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

How many of us did? Show your work.

Pretty much all major public polling indicates and had indicated before last night that even the right doesn’t think she’s a good candidate.

Meanwhile, your President continues to impress on the important issues of the day:

http://news.yahoo.com/census-us-poverty-rate-swells-nearly-1-6-142639972.html

President Downgrade supporters don’t get to lecture anybody on anything. EVER.

If you haven’t gotten he memo, get it.

Good Lt on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

Also worth noting — that doesn’t put Merck in the top 200 of Perry’s donors during that period. Seriously.

Well golly gee. I guess it costs a lot of money to run for governor of the second most populous state in the Union three separate times.

Perry’s got weaknesses, but campaign donations ain’t one that will hurt.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

You first, and you know what I’m talking about.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

No idea. Edify me and if I’m in the wrong I’ll apologise.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

Do Perry’s cheerleaders (Rush, Beck) really think the Perry is going to be able to withstand Obama in a debate?

sheryl on September 13, 2011 at 3:43 PM

Rush isn’t Perry’s cheerleader. You clearly don’t listen to his show.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:46 PM

There are no unbiased critics on Hot Air. Everyone who comments here has their own pre-set, pre-determined opinion.

kingsjester on September 13, 2011 at 3:39 PM

Not me…

/

Seven Percent Solution on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

No idea. Edify me and if I’m in the wrong I’ll apologise.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:45 PM

Did we have a conversation about the FBI and the ATF?

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

Yes. What would entice tireless, staunch warriors for the conservative cause to rally around Palin and support/defend her.

Are you serious? Really?

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:34 PM

I won’t speak towards Malkin, but as for Levin, there’s a difference between “rallying” around a conservative politician, and pursuing a complete scorched earth policy against those who offer even mild criticisms of that politician.

That’s what Levin does. Disproportionate force. He’s ready and EAGER to sledgehammer anyone who would so much as dare to offer a wrist-slap rebuke to Palin.

That’s not a “brave, staunch warrior” for the conservative cause. That’s the portrait of someone who’s become a liability.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

Let’s not forget that the Texas Legislature only meets once every two years, so an Executive Order might not be as “aggressive” of an action as many think, though I don’t know the timeline of the issuance of the EO and the legislative session.

That said, we’re in the weeds here… everyone needs to be on the bash Obama, bash now program…

phreshone on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

I don’t want to accuse anyone of bias who isn’t. I thought portlandon was a Palin supporter. So yeah, it does matter. At least to me.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

Most here have a dog in the fight whether they admit it or not. I thought the question was legitimate on it’s own. Another commenter put it better than I can in a headline thread:

Did Palin take donations from Merck then issue an Exec Order to MANDATE the use of Gardasil? Was her ex-Chief of Staff or the mother of a current staffer on Merck’s payroll as a lobbyist? No? Then stuff it and quit trying to confuse the issue. Palin was not talking about Gardasil itself, but the process by which Perry issued his Exec Order.

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

I saw this. Between her and Mark Levin, what is it that causes some very good, strong conservatives to launch fusillades against other conservatives in service of Sarah Palin?

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:28 PM

Get it through your skull. They are not doing it for Sarah Palin.

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

The point is that Perry rushed to mandate the Merck-pushed order less than 8 months after it had received FDA approval. Clinical trial and safety data was extremely limited at the time. And scientific assessments are still coming in about the long-term and synergistic effects of this and other vaccines.

It would not have received approval if there had not been adequate data demonstrating safety and efficacy at the time.

Follow-up data is important, but to imply that little or nothing was known of the drug at the time of its approval is false.

Good Lt on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

The Boss Emeritus calls this a “really, really stupid attack on Palin”

Agree. Ace is rabid.

This is a good summary of HPV legislation by state.

Fallon on September 13, 2011 at 3:48 PM

SCSoxFan on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

Did you see the “post game” interviews? Bachmann was definitely going after the potential health issues of vaccination. The tinfoil hat is hers to own. She needs to walk this back — and even then it may be too late, given how the media works.

She’s just put herself, on this topic, to the right of Ron Paul. As a candidate, that’s not a good place to be — if you are at all interested in getting elected.

unclesmrgol on September 13, 2011 at 3:48 PM

Who would have thought the word of the day yesterday would have been Ponzi and today it’s Gardasil. And the only one who got apparently mortally wounded was Bachmann, who comes off as a hysterical chicken little.

Marcus on September 13, 2011 at 3:48 PM

Hot damn, where do I sign up to vote for her to be President.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 3:44 PM

I don’t think you’ll need to worry about that — I agree with the general consensus here that Michele Bachmann, whatever her other possible strengths as a candidate, has pretty much sunk her campaign with those remarks.

Mary in LA on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

Did we have a conversation about the FBI and the ATF?

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

Actually, I was talking about the FBI and the Solyndra search warrants, you brought the ATF into it. But yes, we did.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

Rush isn’t Perry’s cheerleader. You clearly don’t listen to his show.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:46 PM

Rush doesn’t kiss the ground Romney treads, though…

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

Can this be reported to fishy.guv?

hillbillyjim on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

Get it through your skull. They are not doing it for Sarah Palin.

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM

Yes, they are. If they were doing it on their own behalf, they wouldn’t have a cross word to say about Coulter or Ingraham whom both of them agree with down-the-line with the notable exception of their attitudes concerning Palin. They tipped their hand with that.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM

I like Perry but on the issues, his stance on toll roads/TTC/eminent domain is worse. He was dead wrong on it. But we’re vetting this crap?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:42 PM

That’s the unfortunate downside to having 2 debates within 5 days of each other and candidates so close on the issues(most of them anyway) that they need to nitpick crap like this in order to resuscitate their own flailing campaigns. It’s part of the process though, and it ain’t just the GOP who succumb to it.

If you’ll recall back in late 2007/early 2008 when Hillary was leading comfortably in the Democrat primary, it was the issue of drivers licenses for illegals that began to bring down her campaign. It had to be a seemingly trivial matter like that because the candidates agreed on 99% of the other topics.

Doughboy on September 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM

Ed show me evidence that Palin lobbied for the federal funding to benefit Merck and then I will say she’s a crony.

Rick Perry had a campaign contribution from Merck and had his chief of staff work for them and then tried to implement an executive order mandating its vaccination, which was thankfully over turned overwhelmingly by the state legislature. How can you even try to compare the two? Yeah as Malkin says, stupid attack on Palin.

milemarker2020 on September 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM

Actually, I was talking about the FBI and the Solyndra search warrants, you brought the ATF into it. But yes, we did.

Trafalgar on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

Then you’ll recall your statements to me at the time, and your deliberate dismissal of my evidence.

So no, my comment stands.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM

Update: Worth noting — Perry actually has received nearly $30,000 from Merck over the past decade.

At least that we know of – since vetting Perry on this issue has just started. But he did say less than a 5 grand cut in pay2play deals would be offensive, so 30Gs ain’t bad.
:D

whatcat on September 13, 2011 at 3:51 PM

Yes, they are. If they were doing it on their own behalf, they wouldn’t have a cross word to say about Coulter or Ingraham whom both of them agree with down-the-line with the notable exception of their attitudes concerning Palin. They tipped their hand with that.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM

Whatever. I wouldn’t be surprised if Malkin starts attacking Palin. It’s all a conspiracy theory, right?

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:51 PM

this whole crony capitalist attack is populist BS. rich and powerful businessmen have access to pols, its the way it is. they use that access to get legislation passed. we the voters have to be vigilant that its not abused (i.e. curly fry lightbulbs) business friendly laws allow economic growth, creates wealth and jobs and helps us all. legislation w/ an opt out may not be great but it aint crony capitalism. if sarah and michele want to be anti-business then we’ll end up w/ just as crappy an economy as obama has got us. and if you really believe perry is into crony capitalism than what other companies are there? so far just one instance and for just 28 grand at the most. really? if he was for sale no one seemed to know.

chasdal on September 13, 2011 at 3:51 PM

Rush doesn’t kiss the ground Romney treads, though…

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:49 PM

So? He also says that he would be 100 times better than Obama. Either way, that’s irrelevant because I wasn’t responding about Romney. I was answering the charge that Rush is Perry’s cheerleader, which he isn’t.

Today he criticized him for getting tired during the debate.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:52 PM

They’re not warriors anymore. They’re brickthrowers. Levin calls Christie a fat slob and Coulter and Ingraham RINOs. Ditto Malkin, except to her it’s Perry who’s Satan. And the single unifying thread is that both have latched themselves firmly to Palin, and are really starting to grate on not only those conservatives who don’t want Palin to be president, but also those who like her.

They’re painting themselves into a corner, and starting to use language that people won’t easily forget even after the primary is over.

KingGold on September 13, 2011 at 3:38 PM

They’ve always been brick throwers. You are now objecting to the target.

And how did you determine that they’re starting to grate on all these people? Polls? Book sales? Loss of clicks to the websites? Do all these people email or call you and tell you this.

I just love the generalized, sweeping statements of all these mice in the pockets that are speaking out, but you seem to be the only person who hears them.

I’d guess that they aren’t worried about what anyone thinks after the election. That’s why they’ve been successful and if we had any sense of gratitude and/or loyalty, we’d realize that this has been what has helped the conservative cause progress. It certainly hasn’t been the Marquess of Queensberry rules that the GOP seems to cling to.

BTW, how *has* the M of Q rules been working for you? Enjoying the four years of Obama? If only McCain had some fight in him, huh?

I’ll continue to pay attention, appreciate, assess and make my own decisions from info from brick throwers like Levin and Malkin, thanks. They’ve steered me right more than wrong so far.

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 3:52 PM

The Boss Emeritus calls this a “really, really stupid attack on Palin” in an update to the linked post above.

Why is it a stupid attack? Since she appeared to enjoy Bachmann’s demagoguery of Perry’s decision, she should as well enjoy the ensuing demagoguery of everyone else.

And trust me… it is just beginning. Everyone will be bloodied by the time this is over.

TheRightMan on September 13, 2011 at 3:52 PM

but to the mandating of the vaccination, to the executive order by which it was mandated, and to the appearance of cronyism.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM

As far as the mandating goes, the states mandate vaccinations all the time, even those for diseases which aren’t airborne (which was an interesting distinction i saw you mention in another thread). I get the problem people have with the EO, I do. But to me, making all this hay about the vaccination itself is kinda stupid.

As for the cronyism, sure. But is it really? Is it in the context we’ve all come to think of the use of the term? If Texas were the only state for which this would have benefited Merck I would understand it better. But Merck had tons of states, including Alaska, using its vaccine. Again – to me – this looks worse than it actually appears to be.

And I still have anyone refute the EO so insurance would pay for the vaccinations? Of course, I haven’t heard Perry’s campaign say it either (that I know of) which is troubling, but doesn’t make the point any less valid should he end up saying it at some point.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 3:53 PM

So? He also says that he would be 100 times better than Obama. Either way, that’s irrelevant because I wasn’t responding about Romney. I was answering the charge that Rush is Perry’s cheerleader, which he isn’t.

Today he criticized him for getting tired during the debate.

fossten on September 13, 2011 at 3:52 PM

Don’t be so edgy. I’m just giving you insight into sheryl’s worldview.

MeatHeadinCA on September 13, 2011 at 3:53 PM

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