Bachmann: Gardasil causes “mental retardation”

posted at 10:45 am on September 13, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

Earlier today, I noted that Michele Bachmann finally scored points on Rick Perry by hitting him on his ties to Merck and linking that to the Gardasil mandate Perry imposed through executive order in Texas. This is a fair point on Perry’s record, even given his apology for pursuing the mandate through EO instead of through the legislature, and it’s not surprising that Bachmann was the candidate to first take advantage of the opening. (Mitt Romney passed a mandate on health insurance for all citizens of Massachusetts, which pretty much puts this issue out of reach for him.) However, Bachmann took a winning argument about the method and the wisdom of mandating a vaccination for a limited-spread virus and turned it into an anti-vaccination argument, especially in this post-debate argument on Fox with Greta van Susteren (via The Right Scoop):

There’s a woman who came up crying to me tonight after the debate. She said her daughter was given that vaccine. She told me her daughter suffered mental retardation as a result of that vaccine.

Huh? “Mental retardation” typically takes place in a pre- or neo-natal event. Autism becomes apparent in the first couple of years of life — and primarily affects boys. Gardasil vaccinations take place among girls between 9-12 years of age. Even assuming that this anecdote is arguably true, it wouldn’t be either “mental retardation” or autism, but brain damage.

The FDA has received no reports of brain damage as a result of HPV vaccines Gardasil and Cervarix.  Among the reports that correlate seriously adverse reactions to either, the FDA lists blood clots, Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and 68 deaths during the entire run of the drugs.  The FDA found no causal connection to any of these serious adverse events and found plenty of contributing factors to all — and all of the events are exceedingly rare.

The “mental retardation” argument is a rehash of the thoroughly discredited notion that vaccines containing thimerasol caused a rapid increase in diagnosed autism cases.  That started with a badly-botched report in Lancet that allowed one researcher to manipulate a ridiculously small sample of twelve cases in order to reach far-sweeping conclusions about thimerasol.  That preservative hasn’t been included in vaccines for years, at least not in the US, and the rate of autism diagnoses remain unchanged.

The most charitable analysis that can be offered in this case for Bachmann is that she got duped into repeating a vaccine-scare urban legend on national television.  It looks more like Bachmann sensed that she had won a point and wanted to go in for the kill, didn’t bother to check the facts, and didn’t care that she was stoking an anti-vaccination paranoid conspiracy theory, either.  Neither shines a particularly favorable light on Bachmann.

Rick Santorum took the correct position on the Gardasil issue.  We mandate certain vaccines in children because we mandate children be gathered for educational purposes for many years (in private or public schools), and certain diseases are easily communicable in those settings.  By mandating vaccinations against whooping cough, measles, and mumps, we are protecting children who would otherwise get exposed without any action on their part except compliance with the law.  That’s not true with HPV, and parents should decide for themselves whether to inoculate their sons and daughters with Gardasil or Cervarix.  If Perry wanted to make those inoculations more accessible, he could have crafted an opt-in system rather than forcing parents to opt out.

Update: Politico’s Ben Smith notes that Bachmann’s statement is getting some pushback in the health sector:

The alleged link between vaccination and mental disabilities — autism is the one frequently cited — has been repeatedly debunked, with the key research on the issue in a British journal withdrawn years ago. But the theory has lived on, and contributed to declining vaccine rates and — advocates for autistic children say — scientific distraction.

“Congresswoman Bachmann’s decision to spread fear of vaccines is dangerous and irresponsible,” said Evan Siegfried, a spokesman for the Global and Regional Asperger Syndrome Partnership. “There is zero credible scientific evidence that vaccines cause mental retardation or autism. She should cease trying to foment fear in order to advance her political agenda.”

“Irresponsible” is correct, and a bad tactical error, too.  Instead of highlighting Perry’s faulty actions in Texas, she made herself and (at best) her ignorance on the matter the story.

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Thather, Golda Meir, et al concur.

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 12:49 PM

Angela Merkel as well.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM

None of them were/are American leaders.

American women are not cut out for the Presidency until possibly after menopause when things calm down. Too much sense of entitlement and their over the top need to prove their male bonefides.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

How bout a Constitutional amendment banning women from running for the presidency until their post menopausal period of life?

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:36 PM

Your attacks on women are offensive. Get over yourself.

GrannySunni on September 13, 2011 at 12:59 PM

How many people to man the fence? How much to maintain it? Its like flooding your basement to get rid of a rat, might work, but there are better and less expensive ways.

dpierson on September 13, 2011 at 12:56 PM

Again, like what? How do you stop the flow of illegals in a better and less expensive way? Improving the economy of Mexico? Not our job. Mass deportations? We’re told that’s even less feasible than a wall. Loosen immigration quotas? They’re already looser than they’ve ever been in history. What are the other options?

MadisonConservative on September 13, 2011 at 12:59 PM

Bachmann better be careful or she’s going to be seen as the Ron Paul of her Gender.

to the media it’s like this:

Bachmann goes “CRAZY EYES”.

PappyD61 on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

Perry’s defense of the EO and Merck cronyism basically comes down to, “but, but, but…it’s about CANCER!!!11!1″

Who else uses that defense to cover up their governmental misdeeds? I seem to recall Democrats using pretty much that same line of reasoning to defend their unconstitutional attempts to take over health insurance and socialize medicine.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

Wrong.

And the cost of a wall could be easily calculated. As to whether the costs would be reasonable if it were left completely up to the government…then yes, there may be a problem. Get a private contractor, and it would be feasible.

MadisonConservative on September 13, 2011 at 12:52 PM

Your own reference shows that the number is just a WAG. And the upper limit you provided is still way over the current estimate from the link you provided.

Neither the Census Bureau nor any other U.S. government agency counts the
unauthorized migrant population or defines its demographic characteristics based on
specific enumeration. The “residual method” is, however, a widely-accepted
methodology for estimating the size and certain characteristics, such as age and national
origins, of the undocumented population based on official data. This methodology
essentially subtracts the estimated legal-immigrant population from the total foreign-born
population and treats the residual as a source of data on the unauthorized migrant
population (Passel, Van Hook, and Bean 2004).

Even using all the WAG’s from your link they couldn’t come up with a cost estimate.
So, you still provided no credible source to back up your claim.

WAG=Wild A$$ Guess

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

Again, like what? How do you stop the flow of illegals in a better and less expensive way? Improving the economy of Mexico? Not our job. Mass deportations? We’re told that’s even less feasible than a wall. Loosen immigration quotas? They’re already looser than they’ve ever been in history. What are the other options?

MadisonConservative on September 13, 2011 at 12:59 PM

I already posted that earlier, read the thread

dpierson on September 13, 2011 at 1:01 PM

A wall is not feasible. Nail employers to the wall and you’ve solved the immigration problem.

Cheap and simple.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:02 PM

She is sure a loose cannon. Or stupid for believing some story that a woman out of the crowd told her.

Old Fritz on September 13, 2011 at 1:04 PM

Huh? “Mental retardation” typically takes place in a pre- or neo-natal event. Autism becomes apparent in the first couple of years of life — and primarily affects boys. Gardasil vaccinations take place among girls between 9-12 years of age. Even assuming that this anecdote is arguably true, it wouldn’t be either “mental retardation” or autism, but brain damage.

FYI, One of Mammy’s best friends daughter had a bad experience with a similar vaccine.

The little girl was about 2 at the time (had a normal family, older brother, no history of any kind of genetic problems.

The Mom took her in for her 2 year old “vaccines” (that you are required to have in our state) or you can’t be admitted to public schools.

The little girl had the shots, and within a week she was completely Autistic and has been in a wheel chair with not even the ability to do anything but make grunting sounds. Be glad it wasn’t your child.

Those vaccines were 10 years ago.

PappyD61 on September 13, 2011 at 1:05 PM

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

guess that’s the newest ‘nista talking point huh? he’s admitted he was wrong, keep kicking him for it and see how that works out. Americans are big on forgiving pols who admit their mistake and ask forgiveness, and even bigger on punishing those who try to score cheap points off someone being repentant.

chasdal on September 13, 2011 at 1:06 PM

The little girl had the shots, and within a week she was completely Autistic and has been in a wheel chair with not even the ability to do anything but make grunting sounds.

Correlation does not equal causation.

Tomblvd on September 13, 2011 at 1:08 PM

The little girl had the shots, and within a week she was completely Autistic and has been in a wheel chair with not even the ability to do anything but make grunting sounds.

I had a cup of coffee and the guy next to me died, must have been the coffee.

dpierson on September 13, 2011 at 1:12 PM

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

Excuse me. I’ve been going through the beginnings of the ‘change’ since I was 34. I turn 41 next month and I’m STILL going through the ‘beginnings’. Because I’m young for it-I may be in this ‘condition’ for another 4-5 years. (Good. Gawd. No.)
I didn’t feel a sense of entitlement before and I still don’t feel one. MB and SP are OLDER than I am.
Whatever views they hold have NOTHING to do with weather they have or haven’t been through menopause. Are you gonna accused them of getting the ‘vapors’ next?

You ARE a chauvinist loser.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:12 PM

The little girl had the shots, and within a week she was completely Autistic and has been in a wheel chair with not even the ability to do anything but make grunting sounds.

And while we’re at it; “the plural of anecdote is not data

Tomblvd on September 13, 2011 at 1:13 PM

guess that’s the newest ‘nista talking point huh? he’s admitted he was wrong, keep kicking him for it and see how that works out. Americans are big on forgiving pols who admit their mistake and ask forgiveness, and even bigger on punishing those who try to score cheap points off someone being repentant.

chasdal on September 13, 2011 at 1:06 PM

Sorry if I’m not inclined to forget about what was a monumental overreach by government, an abuse of executive power, and reeked of cronyism.

A politician can be forgiven for an error in judgment when his apology is genuine (and not of the politically expedient variety). Regardless of the sincerity of the apology, that doesn’t mean we should think that he is somehow automatically possessed of suddenly improved faculties of judgment and will be less inclined to err again, just because he has issued an apology.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 1:19 PM

Ricky Ricardo – You ever heard of the Jean Kirkpatrick? She would’ve kicked your ass back into that cave.
How about Golda Meir? She would’ve swatted you down like the irritating insect you are.

lonestar1 on September 13, 2011 at 12:52 PM

Let’s not forget Janet Reno…
Just ask the Branch Davidians.

Fartnokker on September 13, 2011 at 1:19 PM

PappyD61 on September 13, 2011 at 1:05 PM

So they determined the vaccines were the cause? Which vaccine was it?

Correlation does not necessarily equal causation.

As I said in a previous comment, some people do have reactions to vaccines, I did. But it doesn’t negate the entire spectrum of benefits vaccines give to the populace as a whole.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 1:19 PM

So Bachmann is an anti-vaxxer? Somehow I’m not surprised.

Ward Cleaver on September 13, 2011 at 1:20 PM

Santorum approached the Gardasil issue correctly. Are we assuming our children are having sex at school now? The vaccines (it’s a series, not just one shot) only protect against some of the variants of HPV. Girls who are menstruating or sexually active are medically advised to have a pap smear annually to check for cervical abnormalities. Cancerous cervical cells caught within a year can most often be removed through a LEEP excision of the abnormal cervical tissue. Most people who have HPV never know it and their body fights it off naturally.

Asserting vaccines that are for preventing sexually transmitted diseases are necessary to thwart an outbreak of sexually transmitted cancer at school is intellectually dishonest and a way of sexualizing children- not usually something our side condones. The Corporatist link between a governor sort of creating a law that tends to benefit certain companies is a dirty afterthought, in this case, but it’s a daily occurrence in Zero’s administration that needs to be identified and stamped out with a quickness.

Bachmann blew the door open on the legitimate Corporatist concerns of our current administration with dynamite applied to Perry. It could well cause us to downplay the insidious problem. She made a tactical error in that the accusation should have been saved to be thrown at Obama, and only mentioned as a side-note for the electorate to figure out among the GOP field.

Herman Cain 2012! ;P

NTWR on September 13, 2011 at 1:20 PM

The funny thing is, both of those woman probably made a sammich for the men in their lives at some point.
*ducks*
catmman on September 13, 2011 at 12:55 PM

No need to duck, Of course they would’ve been respectful and courteous to those they valued.
Ricky is just having some fun, so I go along to humor him. Now tell him to shut up and start playing those drums.

lonestar1 on September 13, 2011 at 1:20 PM

PappyD61 on September 13, 2011 at 1:05 PM

As you know-I AM on the autistic spectrum. One does not ‘get’ autism or downs syndrome through vaccines.
I was a preemie who suffered oxygen deprivation for a few days before I was born. That certainly contributed to my ‘quirkiness’. Autism also seems to run in my family. My late father almost certainly had Asperger’s.
Autism is caused mostly by genetics, vaccines do NOT cause autism-and I find it offensive that there are those that believe they do.
-Barb

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:21 PM

None of them were/are American leaders. American women are not cut out for the Presidency until possibly aftermenopause when things calm down. Too much sense of entitlement and their over the top need to prove their male bonefides.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

Oh, they weren’t American women. Well that changes everything. /

I’m sorry the gold digger you were dating dumped you for the guy with the ‘vette. Go talk to a shrink about it. Ultimately it will do you a lot more good than railing against American women and their alleged sense of entitlement on the internets.

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 1:26 PM

You ARE a chauvinist loser.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:12 PM

See what I mean? Classic female hysteria and lashing out; another Midol moment.

God forbid a woman gets her finger on the button.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

Your own reference shows that the number is just a WAG. And the upper limit you provided is still way over the current estimate from the link you provided.

The numbers given in that report are from 6 years ago. Given their conclusion that the illegal alien population increased from 8 million in 2000 to 11 million in 2005, it’s a fair bet we’re looking at around 15 million or more today, and that doesn’t take into account the likely increased incentive for Mexican nationals to flee to the US because of the horrible violence in the border regions. Therefore, saying 12-20 is not unreasonable. It’s a range based on a likely median.

Neither the Census Bureau nor any other U.S. government agency counts the
unauthorized migrant population or defines its demographic characteristics based on
specific enumeration. The “residual method” is, however, a widely-accepted
methodology for estimating the size and certain characteristics, such as age and national
origins, of the undocumented population based on official data.
This methodology
essentially subtracts the estimated legal-immigrant population from the total foreign-born
population and treats the residual as a source of data on the unauthorized migrant
population (Passel, Van Hook, and Bean 2004).

Even using all the WAG’s from your link they couldn’t come up with a cost estimate.
So, you still provided no credible source to back up your claim.

WAG=Wild A$$ Guess

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

Particularly relevant portion bolded for you. You can call it a guess all you like, but it’s not like they pulled the number out of their backsides.

MadisonConservative on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

Instead of highlighting Perry’s faulty actions in Texas, she made herself and (at best) her ignorance on the matter the story.

Which is the problem with ideologues. I have to admit though, Palin doesn’t make these type mistakes.

csdeven on September 13, 2011 at 1:29 PM

Let’s not forget Janet Reno…
Just ask the Branch Davidians.

Fartnokker on September 13, 2011 at 1:19 PM

There you go; prime example #1.

Got a problem? Well, let’s just burn the entire village to the ground.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:30 PM

Angela Merkel as well.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 12:50 PM

She went to the dark side, the dogs, a while ago. Ger her out of your good basket. She is a traitor.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:30 PM

Yo Ricky – Jean Kirkpatrick was American, all the way. Where’s the conga line?

lonestar1 on September 13, 2011 at 1:30 PM

Michele Bachmann is pining to be Romney’s VP and has lost her mind/soul.

The TP should see her for what she now is, sadly.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:31 PM

See what I mean? Classic female hysteria and lashing out; another Midol moment.

God forbid a woman gets her finger on the button.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

LOL. Nice trolling. I can’t believe you are snaring some of our regular contributors who know these caricatures of misogynists well.

NTWR on September 13, 2011 at 1:32 PM

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

You are a chauvinist loser.
Just because I’m an uber-tomoy doesn’t mean that I don’t like being a girl…or that I appreciate other women being stereotyped.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:32 PM

Ricky, though pretty good until today, you lost it, here. Cuba has openings.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:33 PM

My mother spent almost a week in the hospital after getting a flu shot. I refuse to get the flu shot because of it. – annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 12:56 PM

I am sorry to here about that, however, she might have died if she had gotten the flu. The last time I got the flu I thought I was going to die.

I had a severe infection and was put on the antibiotic Cipro. It killed all the bacteria in my intestines, giving me severe diarrhea for about three days.

Even with the two stories that I have said above, I think that young women should be be given the HPV vaccine. I checked out the CDC website and the vaccine has not really been approved for young men. I guess they have not done enough testing, yet. However, it is approved for young men under the age of 27.

Frankly, I thought the Tea Party movement was not so much into the religious right dogma of the social issues dealing with the HPV vaccine, abortion or gay rights. That is when they lose me as a supporter. Young women should be encouraged by public officials to take the vaccine, I not in favor of abortion as a means of birth control or sex selection and even though I am gay I am not for gay marriages being recognized by the government. Gays can get married, but the government does not have to recognize them.

SC.Charlie on September 13, 2011 at 1:33 PM

She went to the dark side, the dogs, a while ago. Ger her out of your good basket. She is a traitor.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:30 PM

Thanks for the FYI.
*smiles*

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:34 PM

Which is the problem with ideologues. I have to admit though, Palin doesn’t make these type mistakes.

csdeven on September 13, 2011 at 1:29 PM

Except for the fact that she immediately backed Bachmann up>

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 1:34 PM

You ARE a chauvinist loser.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:12 PM

See what I mean? Classic female hysteria and lashing out; another Midol moment.

God forbid a woman gets her finger on the button.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

You are a much better troll than “you must be on the rag”. This is bad trolling and only worth about a 1/10 and that’s generous.

The Troll Committee is watching you and if you continue with substandard trolling, you will be removed from the Society of Political Trolls.

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 1:34 PM

Ricky, just for you.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:34 PM

Sorry if I’m not inclined to forget about what was a monumental overreach by government, an abuse of executive power, and reeked of cronyism.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 1:19 PM

So let me see if I get this mistake.

He had an idea, which he liked. He tried to make it a state law by proposing it as a bill. Legislators and people complained, and it didn’t get made a law… and he let it drop rather than trying to force others to do it his way regardless.

This is unacceptable to you? Ok.

Is your problem that he had the idea, that he proposed the law, or that he dropped it and didn’t try an end-around using the executive branch to somehow cheat the legislature as many Executive branch leaders do?

I’m really confused by the issue here… we’re talking a proposal he made, that you didn’t like, that got proposed one, shot down in the legislature, and died based on the will of representative congressional action.

Every proposed law of any form is now as awful as if they had forcibly enacted it on everyone?

A politician can be forgiven for an error in judgment when his apology is genuine (and not of the politically expedient variety). Regardless of the sincerity of the apology, that doesn’t mean we should think that he is somehow automatically possessed of suddenly improved faculties of judgment and will be less inclined to err again, just because he has issued an apology.

He proposed a law, accepted the will of the legislature and the people that it not be approved as a law, and dropped it.

What “improved judgement” do you need here exactly? That he never propose a law you don’t like? Or that he start ignoring the legislature and using Executive branch appointees to enforce his will as law without a legislature?

Or is there something I’m missing here?

gekkobear on September 13, 2011 at 1:35 PM

See what I mean? Classic female hysteria and lashing out; another Midol moment. God forbid a woman gets her finger on the button.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

George Will, is that you?

Kataklysmic on September 13, 2011 at 1:35 PM

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:21 PM

My cousin’s daughter had the same thing happen. Her baby was fine(normal) until the vaccine, after the vaccine, they told her it was autism. She wasn’t born that way. What do you suppose? She knew her baby before (normal), and after…she wasn’t the same. Maybe some brain damage that mimics autism?

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:36 PM

Ricky, though pretty good until today, you lost it, here. Cuba has openings.

Schadenfreude on September 13, 2011 at 1:33 PM

Thanks but no thanks. A crusty old commie doc is not my bag.

In any case, I have an attractive female American doctor who examines my prostate with consummate skill.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

None of them were/are American leaders.

American women are not cut out for the Presidency until possibly after menopause when things calm down. Too much sense of entitlement and their over the top need to prove their male bonefides.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

More evidence that Hot Air has been taken over by lunatics. You people have jumped the shark.

Screenshot saved and reposted.

bifidis on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

LOL. Nice trolling. I can’t believe you are snaring some of our regular contributors who know these caricatures of misogynists well.

NTWR on September 13, 2011 at 1:32 PM
Heh. I’m not having a ‘midol’ moment- I’m just normally pretty anti-social…in case y’all haven’t already figured that out. *wink*

“I do not discriminate-I hate everyone.’
*keychain I used to own*

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:38 PM

Frankly, I thought the Tea Party movement was not so much into the religious right dogma of the social issues dealing with the HPV vaccine, abortion or gay rights. That is when they lose me as a supporter.
SC.Charlie on September 13, 2011 at 1:33 PM

At what point AFTER the 2010 elections has the Tea Party movement NOT included social conservatism as a prerequisite?

Can you name me one prominent conservative with a more socially moderate pedigree who is still considered aces with the Tea Party crowd? Republicans like Chris Christie get branded RINOs left and right around here, despite being darlings of the TP movement a short time back.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 1:39 PM

None of them were/are American leaders.

American women are not cut out for the Presidency until possibly after menopause when things calm down. Too much sense of entitlement and their over the top need to prove their male bonefides.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

More evidence that Hot Air has been taken over by lunatics. You people have jumped the shark.

Screenshot saved and reposted.

bifidis on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

That’s good, Nimrod. Quote a fellow Troll as an example of the posters at Hot Air.

Typical Liberal logic…or lack thereof.

kingsjester on September 13, 2011 at 1:40 PM

rickyricardo, you magnificent bastard.

You-Eh-Vee on September 13, 2011 at 1:40 PM

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:36 PM

Maybe. I was diagnosed as LD at 4 and as Asperger’s at 33. Btw:Normal is just a word in the dictionary. NONE of us are ‘normal’.
Autism is a difference-not a disease.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

Nail employers to the wall and you’ve solved the immigration problem.

Cheap and simple.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:02 PM

Yes, step one. Step two, deny them social services.

csdeven on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

In any case, I have an attractive female American doctor who examines my prostate with consummate skill.
rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

But would you let her near you with a knife while you are anesthetized? That is when she’ll have her moment as she remembers all the men who done her wrong. Just wait, you’ll see. Ricky won’t have little ricky anymore.

lonestar1 on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

My cousin’s daughter had the same thing happen. Her baby was fine(normal) until the vaccine, after the vaccine, they told her it was autism. She wasn’t born that way. What do you suppose? She knew her baby before (normal), and after…she wasn’t the same. Maybe some brain damage that mimics autism?

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:36 PM

Define “baby”. Seeing as autism doesn’t usually onset until age 2 or 3, saying the baby was “normal” beforehand doesn’t really mean much at all.

You’re using correlation to “prove” causation. It’s not that simplistic.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

Here in MN I’ve defended Bachmann when people suggested she was a nutcase, countering that she means well and is hardly the only gaffe-prone politician out there.

I’m beginning to think that they had a point.

Hollowpoint on September 13, 2011 at 1:42 PM

Autism is a difference-not a disease.

Actually, it’s a neural development disorder.

You-Eh-Vee on September 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM

The Troll Committee is watching you and if you continue with substandard trolling, you will be removed from the Society of Political Trolls.

kim roy on September 13, 2011 at 1:34 PM

Good one, Ma’am!

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM

Someone really needs to STFU already. I had alot of respect for Bachman….right up until last night.

Another one who opens her mouth, and a whole lotta stupid falls out.

Tim_CA on September 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM

Frankly, I thought the Tea Party movement was not so much into the religious right dogma of the social issues dealing with the HPV vaccine, abortion or gay rights. That is when they lose me as a supporter. Young women should be encouraged by public officials to take the vaccine…. SC.Charlie

Two words: PAP TEST

If anything, the government should change the guidelines to having these tests yearly from menstruation age or age of sexual activity (whichever comes first) instead of from age 21 every 2 years. In California that’s how it works. Especially since the vaccine doesn’t cover all forms of HPV that lead to cancer, it is wiser to have the yearly exam than a vaccine that gives a false sense of security.

NTWR on September 13, 2011 at 1:45 PM

None of them were/are American leaders.

American women are not cut out for the Presidency until possibly after menopause when things calm down. Too much sense of entitlement and their over the top need to prove their male bonefides.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 12:58 PM

Men think of sex every ten seconds. Hence their thinking is always interrupted and biased. It is time we never let them hold office again.

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:45 PM

Men think of sex every ten seconds. Hence their thinking is always interrupted and biased. It is time we never let them hold office again.

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:45 PM

Nonsense. Please (boobs) cite a study showing that (ass) to be the case.

Typical (hot sweaty oily body) sexist thinking.

Tim_CA on September 13, 2011 at 1:48 PM

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 12:46 PM

I received one of those too. I unsubscribed.
My husband was leaning toward supporting MB but she lost him last night. He’s now in the Perry camp.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 12:49 PM

Apparently Rollins wasn’t the problem at Camp Bachmann. I thought her campaign would improve without his direction.

This was a ham handed move on her campaign’s part, and it’s going to leave a mark. Ed should add the solicitation for campaign donations using this “Gardasil” issue as an update.

It was so calculated, and pre meditated. I listened to her charge/attack against Perry during the debate. We turned over to FNC and caught her on Greta relating this absurd retardation caused by Gardasil vaccination, third party anecdote. I commented on it here on hot air, and then I find her solicitation for a campaign donation, waiting in my email in box, using little girls to raise campaign funds…yeah nothing like exploiting little girls for political gains/ I bet this all took place within a half of an hour.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 1:48 PM

Men think of sex every ten seconds.

Trim 6 off seconds off your estimate and you may be in the ball park.

rickyricardo on September 13, 2011 at 1:49 PM

Actually, it’s a neural development disorder.

You-Eh-Vee on September 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM

In my case-it’s a quirk. I’ve been told that I’ve been gifted with a lovely voice. That voice got me into the Chicago School of the Arts and other cool groups/things. I love singing. It’s a much a part of me as breathing-but if I was given a choice between losing my voice or losing my autism…I’d choose to lose my voice.
My autism is a big part of what makes me…me.
Without my autism I’d be some that I couldn’t recognize.
No thank you.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:49 PM

My cousin’s daughter had the same thing happen. Her baby was fine(normal) until the vaccine, after the vaccine, they told her it was autism. She wasn’t born that way. What do you suppose? She knew her baby before (normal), and after…she wasn’t the same. Maybe some brain damage that mimics autism?

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:36 PM

This has been investigated, and the explanation is the human tendency to form patterns and associate unusual events with each other, even when no real connections exist.

Research has shown that parents with autistic children don’t tend to notice the symptoms until the child is around 2 years old… which happens to be the same age that vaccines are given.

Kid gets vaccine and at some point in the future they notice something wrong and the child is diagnosed with autism. The kid was autistic all along, but because they didn’t know it until an indeterminate amount of time after the vaccine was administered, they make the (false) connection between the vaccine and autism, blaming the latter for the former.

Hollowpoint on September 13, 2011 at 1:50 PM

blaming the latter for the former.

Hollowpoint on September 13, 2011 at 1:50 PM

Oops- should read “blaming the former for the latter.”

Hollowpoint on September 13, 2011 at 1:51 PM

Particularly relevant portion bolded for you. You can call it a guess all you like, but it’s not like they pulled the number out of their backsides.

MadisonConservative on September 13, 2011 at 1:27 PM

And even given the intervening years, using their criteria, it comes no where close to your upper end number.

Just for giggles, what is your hard number of illegals in the US?

How much, per year do they cost?

These things have never been calculated.

Carry that forward with a cost per mile of building the fence. I have seen any where from 2 million to 10 million dollars per mile. Almost as big a range as your figure for the number illegals. I will settle for a low number of three million per mile over a 2000 mile length. That’s 6,000,000,000. That’s a paltry sum in today’s government spending.

How much to man and maintain this fence?

These things have never been calculated. Even the border fence supports won’t do it. Nothing like this has ever been attempted.

The number for the fence would have to be less than the number spent on the illegals for it to be cost effective.

Now, take the drug trade as an example. The smugglers are always ahead of the government in trying to stop it. The government has never gotten the upper hand. What makes any one think the government could do a better job at stopping illegals?

The fence is just one of those things people like to complain about, but, It, Will, Never, Happen. Even if Palin wins in a landslide on the TEA Party ticket.

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 1:52 PM

Without my autism I’d be some that I couldn’t recognize.
No thank you.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:49 PM

Hey, power to you, and anyone else who embraces difficulty like that. Seriously.

Just wanted to differentiate between disease and disorder.

You-Eh-Vee on September 13, 2011 at 1:53 PM

Frankly, I thought the Tea Party movement was not so much into the religious right dogma of the social issues dealing with the HPV vaccine, abortion or gay rights. That is when they lose me as a supporter. Young women should be encouraged by public officials to take the vaccine…. SC.Charlie

They aren’t the TEA party is made up of fisical conservatives, republican, democrat, libertarian and independent.

Rick Perry has a huge evangelical base (Social Conservatives)- Bachmann and Santorum share his base, they were trying to peal off evangelicals last night by attacking Perry with the HPV vaccine mandate which never was implemented in Texas.

You want to blame someone for changing the topics from the economy, jobs, small government, the deficit, and a balanced budget, take it up with CNN, and Wolf Blitzer. CNN decided which questions to ask and accept from viewers. Bachmann and Santorum are polling around 4% they are trying to take votes away from the front runner Rick Perry anyway they can.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 1:56 PM

Define “baby”. Seeing as autism doesn’t usually onset until age 2 or 3, saying the baby was “normal” beforehand doesn’t really mean much at all.

You’re using correlation to “prove” causation. It’s not that simplistic.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

Actually I was asking a question. My family has always said it was the vaccination and the government has always said it was not. I cannot remember the exact age of the baby (15yrs ago) I believe she was not over a yr. I did not know when the onset of autism begins.

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 1:56 PM

Can you name me one prominent conservative with a more socially moderate pedigree who is still considered aces with the Tea Party crowd? Republicans like Chris Christie get branded RINOs left and right around here, despite being darlings of the TP movement a short time back.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 1:39 PM

That’s easy: Sarah Palin. Defended GOProud participation at CPAC, doesn’t think medical marijuana should be criminalized, and, what are the other main “social issues” that socially moderate people care about? I forget.

NTWR on September 13, 2011 at 1:57 PM

bifidis on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

He’s actually another one of YOU, trolling in his way, as you do in yours.

Shay on September 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 1:52 PM

Without stationing a lot of people along the fence the illegals are just going to steal it and sell it for scrap metal anyway.

The salaries of all those people needed to properly man the fence will rapidly eclipse the cost of building such a fence in the first place.

dpierson on September 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM

Bachmann is clearly the retarded one in this case.

Get the idiot off the stage and put her in a nice soft room with Ron Paul.

Adjoran on September 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM

Obama smells a winner.

Ban Gardasil and give HPVs to all.

lonestar1 on September 13, 2011 at 1:59 PM

With this, as with Social Security, Bachmann has gone off the rails. She’s too desperate to beat Perry to think straight.

caldfyr on September 13, 2011 at 2:00 PM

Adjoran on September 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM

I don’t think it’s wise to leave MB alone with Grandpa.

Really Right on September 13, 2011 at 2:02 PM

Or is there something I’m missing here?

gekkobear on September 13, 2011 at 1:35 PM

The fact that it wasn’t just a law he proposed. In a blatant abuse of executive power, he declared the mandate by fiat, using an executive order as an end-run around the legislature’s opposition. The outcry from the citizens and the legislature was immediate and intense.

Roughly 60 state lawmakers called on Perry to rescind the order. He refused. Just six weeks after Perry put pen to paper, the Texas House rebuked him on March 14, 2007, passing HB 1098, overturning his executive order by a vote of 119-21. The Senate followed suit the following month by a vote of 30-1.

Realizing both chambers had large enough majorities to override a veto, Perry opted to let the bill become law without his signature. On May 8, the day the law went into effect, Perry held a press conference surrounded by women touched by cervical cancer. He bemoaned the tenor of a debate that he asserted had been “hijacked by politics and posturing,” and blamed future cervical cancer deaths on those who opposed his mandate — many of whom were fellow Republicans.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 2:03 PM

Bachmann better be careful or she’s going to be seen as the Ron Paul of her Gender.

PappyD61 on September 13, 2011 at 1:00 PM

Ron Paul’s an MD. If he came out and said Gardisil causes mental retardation, the State of Texas would come looking for his license.

JohnGalt23 on September 13, 2011 at 2:04 PM

You-Eh-Vee on September 13, 2011 at 1:53 PM

There a big difference between those of us @ the upper-end of the spectrum and those at the lower-end. I understand why the parents/guardians of those people are searching for something-anything-that they can point to as the reason why their family member has autism.
The problem is…when they pin the blame on something false…it has a tendency to come back to bite all of us that are on the spectrum.
Point in case: ‘Autism Speaks’-which pushes anti-vacc, cures, and big government dependency-has done incalculable damange to those on the ‘spectrum’
On the other hand-’Rethinking Autism’ is doing great work in trying to change the narrative.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 2:05 PM

It is weirdness like this that keeps her from rising higher.

But she did sound very much like a neighbor… how many times have your friends said stuff like this and you just keep quiet to get along?

I like her better because of her run. She has been very good really.

Of course I wasn’t ever going to vote for her for POTUS. But I like her.

petunia on September 13, 2011 at 2:06 PM

Wow… I whiffed it didn’t I.

He did mandate it, unilaterally and it took the legislature to shut him down.. but for a few years he did this.

http://governor.state.tx.us/news/executive-order/3455/

That’s more serious than I thought this situation was… guess I needed to do some more research.

On February 2, 2007, Governor Perry issued an executive order mandating that Texas girls be vaccinated with Gardasil.

In May of 2007, state legislators in Texas passed a bill that effectively overturned Governor Perry’s order mandating Gardasil

http://www.thepoliticalguide.com/rep_bios.php?rep_id=56615334&category=scandals&id=1219506227230808

Well, 4 months of an overreaching plan, and one that he let go is worse than I thought; but not the horror I’m seeing from some detractors.

So the Gardrasil vaccination is wrong and anyone who promotes government involvement/usage of it is an evil crony-capitalist fascist?

In June of 2007, Alaska accepted federal funding to boost access to Gardasil, the HPV vaccine.

( Juneau, Alaska) ─ The Alaska Department of Health and Social Services announced today that an increase in federal funding will make it possible for all Alaska girls ages 9 through 18 to receive Gardasil ®, the vaccine to prevent cervical cancer, at no cost.

http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/09/13/sarah-palins-alaska-took-federal-funds-to-increase-access-to-gardasil/?utm_medium=twitter&utm_term=%23tcot&utm_source=twitterfeed

Hmm, who was the governor of Alaska in 2007 that would have directed his (or her) State HHS on this? Must have been an evil government-insider crony politico with fascist designs on…

HA, just kidding.

So the vaccine is evil and wrong… except when Palin gets federal funding for it?

gekkobear on September 13, 2011 at 2:08 PM

JohnGalt23 on September 13, 2011 at 2:04 PM

He still has his licence to practice medicine? Yikes!

Really Right on September 13, 2011 at 2:09 PM

petunia on September 13, 2011 at 2:06 PM

Of course you do.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 2:09 PM

With this, as with Social Security, Bachmann has gone off the rails. She’s too desperate to beat Perry to think straight.

caldfyr on September 13, 2011 at 2:00 PM

No just this. Perry is the idiot. Have you seen his plan to make SS a state thing?

Everyone would want to stay in the same state they were born in so that they knew for sure they didn’t give up their SS if they moved… because even if it is the law now… what will it be in ten years?

Perry does not have the brain power to be President.

Bachmann, and every one else, need to keep letting Perry prove his idiocy.

petunia on September 13, 2011 at 2:09 PM

Me thinks Ricky is looking for attention, and his ploy to get it….worked!!!

capejasmine on September 13, 2011 at 2:10 PM

Without stationing a lot of people along the fence the illegals are just going to steal it and sell it for scrap metal anyway.

The salaries of all those people needed to properly man the fence will rapidly eclipse the cost of building such a fence in the first place.

dpierson on September 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM

Yeah, I stated it in there but didn’t put a figure because there is no way to figure it. Just like the land acquisition. Or the cost of taking that land out of a useful service. Most of us in Texas thought long and hard about the fence when we were fighting about the trans-Texas corridor. And the Super Conducting super Collider before that.

Those who are demanding a fence don’t figure any of these things, they just accuse those who have of being soft on illegals. Just like they think a fence would magically stop illegal’s. I guess it makes them feel better without having to figure anything out.

cozmo on September 13, 2011 at 2:11 PM

Failing to check facts seems to be a reacuring problem with Bachmann.

Count to 10 on September 13, 2011 at 2:11 PM

Maybe. I was diagnosed as LD at 4 and as Asperger’s at 33. Btw:Normal is just a word in the dictionary. NONE of us are ‘normal’.
Autism is a difference-not a disease.

annoyinglittletwerp on September 13, 2011 at 1:41 PM

Yes,…we say normal is a button on the dryer. haha

I meant she was progressing normally.

tinkerthinker on September 13, 2011 at 2:12 PM

Oh my. The Palinistas won’t like this.

Well, too f***ing bad.

Maybe “Mama Grizzly” should think before she speaks, for once.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 2:14 PM

yeah nothing like exploiting little girls for political gains/ I bet this all took place within a half of an hour.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011

The whole thing is rather unseemly and un-Presidential. I don’t mean just your regular hard ball politics Willie Horton stuff. This reeks of desperation and basically living in the gutter.

On one hand I wish Perry would, uh, parry these attacks with reasonable arguments. On the other hand, Bachmann is exposed as a near lunatic. Maybe Perry just gets lucky with this stuff, but it is remarkable how effective he is. Look, Romney flails about on SS like some sort of FDR clone, and now Bachmann is, almost literally, foaming at the mouth in the best Anita Bryant imitation in recent years.

JonPrichard on September 13, 2011 at 2:14 PM

SC.Charlie on September 13, 2011 at 1:33 PM

Why were you given an anti-biotic (cipro) if you had a viral infection (flu)?

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 2:16 PM

Oh my. The Palinistas won’t like this.

Well, too f***ing bad.

Maybe “Mama Grizzly” should think before she speaks, for once.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 2:14 PM

You really aren’t too big on details, are you? She mandated nothing. She declared nothing by executive order.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 2:16 PM

Screenshot saved and reposted.

bifidis on September 13, 2011 at 1:37 PM

Take on of this and be sure to save it as well:

Stuff it.

catmman on September 13, 2011 at 2:18 PM

yeah nothing like exploiting little girls for political gains/ I bet this all took place within a half of an hour.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011

Nothing like exploiting cancer for political gain:

Realizing both chambers had large enough majorities to override a veto, Perry opted to let the bill become law without his signature. On May 8, the day the law went into effect, Perry held a press conference surrounded by women touched by cervical cancer. He bemoaned the tenor of a debate that he asserted had been “hijacked by politics and posturing,” and blamed future cervical cancer deaths on those who opposed his mandate — many of whom were fellow Republicans.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 2:18 PM

You should look a little closer at where that article came from.
kg598301 on September 13, 2011 at 12:55 PM

I know where the article came from. AAPS has been around since the 40’s. They call Obamacare a scourge…They have op-eds titled things like Government Job Creation is Not Always a Good Thing… As Illegals Take, Are Americans Free?…. They are very anti-government expansion into medicine.

From the President of AAPS: AAPS was founded in 1943 to guard against the intrusion of government into the practice of medicine. It is the basic principle of our organization that medicine is a sacred relationship between a physician and a patient—not a relationship between a physician, a government bureaucrat and a patient. We believe in the Hippocratic Oath, and that our duty is to the individual, not the collective, society, or the state.

So, what do you find objectionable with my source?

pannw on September 13, 2011 at 2:20 PM

You really aren’t too big on details, are you? She mandated nothing. She declared nothing by executive order.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 2:16 PM

You are correct. It’s not the same as a mandate (which, of course, had an opt out, something everyone seems to ignore).

But seeing as the default accusation from Bachmann is that “Gardasil CAUSES mental retardation, and Perry mandated it anyway for cash / to help his crony friends”, which Sarah Palin apparently agreed with, her using your taxpayer dollars to help pay for MORE GIRLS TO GET MENTALLY RETARDED~! is pretty relevant stuff.

Rick Perry, Sarah Palin. Why vote for either? They both want our daughters to become mentally enfeebled.

Vyce on September 13, 2011 at 2:20 PM

Sorry if I’m not inclined to forget about what was a monumental overreach by government, an abuse of executive power, and reeked of cronyism.

steebo77

Hyperbole much? Wait, what am I thinking? You’re a nista cult member…hyperbole is pretty much all you know.

xblade on September 13, 2011 at 2:21 PM

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