Group of psychiatrists wants to redefine pedophilia to promote tolerance

posted at 5:25 pm on August 24, 2011 by Tina Korbe

When I wrote about an objectionable spread of photographs in Paris Vogue – a spread that featured 10-year-old fashion model Thylane Blondeau styled in provocative ways — I fretted that such a magazine feature might, in some way, normalize the concept of sexual attraction to minors:

It’s often said, but bears repeating, that the TV, magazine and advertising images we absorb train our minds as to what is considered attractive — and, yes, specifically sexually attractive — in our culture. So, what does a magazine feature like this say? That it’s OK, even encouraged, to look at a child in a sexual way. …

But it’s adamantly not OK to look at a child in a sexual way, as harsh laws against pedophilia and child pornography attest. Maybe it seems like a leap of logic to move from provocative pictures to pornography and pedophilia, but again, images train the mind’s eye. The more readers and viewers see children in adult poses and in adult clothes, the less jarring it will be to those readers and viewers to see children in adult roles. It’s all highly inappropriate — and in territory better avoided entirely.

What’s crazy is, at the time, I thought we were still years away from any sane person seriously suggesting such a distorted disposition of attraction to minors — i.e. pedophilia — should be repackaged as less a problem and more a disorder to be understood and, yes, tolerated. But one group of psychologists is calling for such a redefinition even now. Megyn Kelly and Shannon Bream were just talking about this appalling push on “America Live.”

B4U-Act is a 501(c)(3) organization in Maryland that was established “to publicly promote services and resources for self-identified individuals (adults and adolescents) who are sexually attracted to children and seek such assistance, to educate mental health providers regarding the approaches helpful for such individuals, to develop a pool of providers in Maryland who agree to serve these individuals and abide by B4U-ACT’s Principles and Perspectives of Practice, and to educate the citizens of Maryland regarding issues faced by these individuals,” according to the group’s website.

Perhaps that sounds innocent enough (although I don’t think so). Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt for a second: What’s wrong with psychiatrists seeking to help those attracted to children better understand why they have that tendency? Perhaps those psychiatrists could even be an instrument of crime prevention or of after-the-fact justice. But no. Consider: At least one psychiatrist in the bunch has been known to treat child molesters without reporting them, Bream said.

Last week, the group hosted a scientific symposium to discuss a proposed new definition of pedophilia in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) of the American Psychiatric Association. Presenters expressed a wide range of views — but the thrust of the B4U-Act movement appears to be, ultimately, to decriminalize pedophilia, Bream said.

As all too often happens with any kind of push for political correctness, with a twist of language, the blameless are forgotten. Let’s remember whom both the social stigma against “minor-attracted persons” and the outlawing of sexual activity between an adult and a minor aim to protect. Yes, I’m talking about children, whose innocence deserves to be preserved, whose minds and bodies haven’t fully developed yet, who depend upon adults for their moral formation. Advocacy on this issue must be on behalf of those who cannot advocate for themselves — not on behalf of those who, however troubled and however tempted, still bear ultimate responsibility for their actions.

Update: At least one reader wondered my justification for the assertion that the B4U-Act movement appears to be headed in the direction of pushing to decriminalize pedophilia. According to Shannon Bream’s report on Fox News, some — although not all — of the presenters at the symposium expressed the view that some level of sexual activity between adults and children should be permissible. That sounds like the decriminalization of pedophilia to me.

Update: B4U-Act is not alone in the effort to normalize pedophilia. Big Hollywood’s John Nolte has reported on the entertainment industry’s attempt to glamorize sex with children, as well.

Update: Here’s the video from the “America Live” segment that tipped me off:


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Let me help you. Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia.
bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Unless the adult is involved with a child of the same sex. The Leftist argument that same sex pedophiles are not Gay is pure legend. It’s a sham to distance the perversion of same sex from the perversion of adults wanting power over children sexually of the same sex.
Hening on August 24, 2011 at 6:04 PM

Correct. I can’t improve on that.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:08 PM

It’s often said, but bears repeating, that the TV, magazine and advertising images we absorb train our minds

Ironically, just this moment on the local Cincinnati news, was someone pondering why local kids are pulling kids on cops and pulling the trigger, which until a few months ago was very rare. They suggested, perhaps video games like Grand Theft Auto desensitized them to such violence. Any, we got a brand new Cincinnati police chief recently, who is taking this seriously. And he’s black, so at least he won’t be called a racist.

Yeah, culture matters.

Paul-Cincy on August 24, 2011 at 6:08 PM

Just a comment that may be simply ancedotal but the 4 situations of such abuse close to my life were male on male abuses. Maybe the males messing around with female teachers just didn’t happen when I was a teen or they kept it quiet(yeh right).

CW on August 24, 2011 at 6:08 PM

Oops. I meant to say pulling GUNS on cops. My bad.

Paul-Cincy on August 24, 2011 at 6:09 PM

But but but, they were born that way….

TOUGH SHIT.

Leave the kids alone.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:10 PM

Pedophilia is rampant in Hollywood.

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:57 PM

Have you noticed the increase of shows out of Hollywood that positively portray incest? Game of Thrones comes to mind immediately. They don’t suggest or imply incest, but show brothers & sisters having sex.

batterup on August 24, 2011 at 6:11 PM

The simple fact is, every single argument for homosexual marriage, applies exactly the same to pedophilia, consanguineous marriage, polygamy – the whole gamut of deviance that Western civilization tried to stamp out.
Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:07 PM

Another spot on summation on which I’d be hardpressed to improve.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:11 PM

I wouldn’t bet money on that, Hombre.

There’s a lot of ways pedophilia will be described in this country, but “acceptable” will never be one of them.

The academics have finally reached for their “Bridge Too Far”…the backlash on this will not be pretty.

SuperCool on August 24, 2011 at 6:01 PM

and yet, this is EXACTLY what people in this country said for a couple centuries about Homosexuality, that it would NEVER be accepted, etc.

jp on August 24, 2011 at 6:11 PM

When you remove God, you remove morality.

We mock morality and then are shocked at the immorality that takes over our society. None of this is surprising.

JellyToast on August 24, 2011 at 6:12 PM

Awww, there’s no slippery slope…

That’s a strawman argument.

Oh wait…

When you give an inch on morality, you’ve given up the game.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:13 PM

You’re a sad, nauseating, hateful excuse of a human being.

Vyce on August 24, 2011 at 5:59 PM

Yes, I’m just a “pedophiliaphobe”.

Blue Collar Todd on August 24, 2011 at 6:13 PM

Last week, the group hosted a scientific symposium to discuss a proposed new definition of pedophilia in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM)

Changes in the DSM seem too often to be more about not hurting someone’s feelings, rather than in refining for the better some diagnostic category. As if sheltering peoples’ feelings is in itself therapeutic. When it comes to understanding deviancy, why don’t we just call it whatever it is. And not worry about hurting peoples’ feelings.

Paul-Cincy on August 24, 2011 at 6:13 PM

Yes, I’m just a “pedophiliaphobe”.

Blue Collar Todd on August 24, 2011 at 6:13 PM

Don’t be a hurter. /

Paul-Cincy on August 24, 2011 at 6:14 PM

The simple fact is, every single argument for homosexual marriage, applies exactly the same to pedophilia, consanguineous marriage, polygamy – the whole gamut of deviance that Western civilization tried to stamp out.
Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:07 PM

You are exactly right. But there are people who will still not see it.

JellyToast on August 24, 2011 at 6:14 PM

Homosexuality – the love that once could not speak its name. Today it is the “love” that just won’t shut up.

honsy on August 24, 2011 at 6:15 PM

Pedophilia is rampant in Hollywood.

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:57 PM

“I like girls. And they seem to like me” — Roman Polanski, gifted movie director, philosopher, and child rapist (not that there’s anything wrong with THAT)

Paul-Cincy on August 24, 2011 at 6:16 PM

You’re a sad, nauseating, hateful excuse of a human being.

Vyce on August 24, 2011 at 5:59 PM

Yes, I’m just a “pedophiliaphobe”.

Blue Collar Todd

LOL! Well stated!

honsy on August 24, 2011 at 6:17 PM

They were born that way, weren’t they? No one would choose to be a child molester.

Just change the names and recycle the arguments for the next batch of aggrieved hyphenated americans. That’s the slippery slope.

For all the talk of puritanism and bigotry, the truth is that same sex marriage proponents favor regulation of marriage only to a lesser degree.

rw on August 24, 2011 at 6:17 PM

Funny, this same thing happened with homosexuality in the 1970s.
Vashta.Nerada on August 24, 2011 at 6:04 PM

True. And the psychiatrist who led the drive to remove homosexuality as a mental illness was hailed by militant homosexuals as a hero. That is until 2001, when he did a study demonstrating that homosexuality is not a fixed condition and can be reversed with therapy. Then he was attacked by the same militant homosexuals.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:19 PM

he simple fact is, every single argument for homosexual marriage, applies exactly the same to pedophilia, consanguineous marriage, polygamy – the whole gamut of deviance that Western civilization tried to stamp out.
Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:07 PM
You are exactly right. But there are people liberals who will still not never see it.

JellyToast on August 24, 2011 at 6:14 PM

FIFY

Tim Zank on August 24, 2011 at 6:19 PM

The simple fact is, every single argument for homosexual marriage, applies exactly the same to pedophilia, consanguineous marriage, polygamy – the whole gamut of deviance that Western civilization tried to stamp out.
Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:07 PM

Exactly!

Blue Collar Todd on August 24, 2011 at 6:20 PM

If you accept the arguments that homosexuals are born that way, then the 13 year old boy is just as gay as the 30 year old man. Who are we to stand in the way of biology then, with our narrow minded and intolerant ways?

Blue Collar Todd on August 24, 2011 at 5:43 PM

? What??? We don’t accept a hetero relations with children, either.
Homosexual marriage has nothing to do with pedophilia.

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:46 PM

Sex was made and designed for a man and a woman. One glance at basic anatomy makes that clear.

Anything else is a perversion. Some perversions we tolerate because they don’t seem to affect anyone but the perverts. Others are unacceptable because they hurt others.

So no, there’s no hard link between homosexuality and pedophilia. They’re totally different and presumably independent perversions.

That said, both are perversions, and both raise the question of tolerance. Obviously, pedophilia lacks the ability of a child to offer informed consent, so there’s a solid consensus to reject it.

But all it would take to make it legal would be for someone to be given the power to consent for the child, which could happen if the stigma of pedophilia were removed. It would probably start by lowering the age of consent provided permission was given by parents or guardians. Not too much at first, maybe just to 15. Then it could be gradually lowered to 13 or 14. How low could it go? I hope we never find out.

Ridiculous? It could never happen? If you think that, then you haven’t been paying attention to our society over the past couple of generations. All it would really take is persistent effort to remove the stigma over a period of years, and it could very possibly be first winked at, then tolerated, then trumpeted.

didymus on August 24, 2011 at 6:20 PM

I’ve always thought, as offensive as gays claim it to be, if two guys can diddle each other and we’re not allowed to say anything about it, lest I be tagged a homophobe and a pariah forever…what stops us from saying that people who are sexually attracted to kids are weird?

Why is it okay to stray from what is clearly normal and biological (the human body is made for male-female sex only)…but in only some situations? Why is pedophilia wrong if we’re getting closer and closer to a world without concrete absolute morality?

TheBlueSite on August 24, 2011 at 6:22 PM

I repeat myself in part:

Gays on the whole do not advocate for lowering the age of consent, which is in it’s own right a strange and uneven concept even in our country, and has no biblical or religious constraint or guide.

HOGWASH! About 20 years ago, the (Socialist) NDP member of Parliament in Canada – an openly gay adult named Sven Robinson (who also was nabbed 5 years ago for shoplifting a $50,000 bracelet for his boyfriends’ birthday present) – browbeat the governing Liberals into lowering the age of consent in that country to 14!!! Only under the current Prime Minister Stephen Harper was it raised about 3 years ago to 16 – with certain caveats that legally discourage more than a 3-4 year age difference between consenting youths.

honsy on

honsy on August 24, 2011 at 6:22 PM

Gee, Tina, it sure would have been nice if you had included some sort of sourcing link that I could post without people dismissing it as just another right-wing homophobic hate blog.

fusionaddict on August 24, 2011 at 6:24 PM

Have you noticed the increase of shows out of Hollywood that positively portray incest? Game of Thrones comes to mind immediately. They don’t suggest or imply incest, but show brothers & sisters having sex.

batterup on August 24, 2011 at 6:11 PM</blockquote

Positive? Hardly, the sis/bro that were having the relations are two of the main villians. Nice try but Terrific show.

whiskeytango on August 24, 2011 at 6:25 PM

Michael Jackson’s zombie says:

Thrilla.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:26 PM

B4U-Act is a 501(c)(3) organization in Maryland that was established “to publicly promote services and resources for self-identified individuals (adults and adolescents) who are sexually attracted to children and seek such assistance, to educate mental health providers regarding the approaches helpful for such individuals, to develop a pool of providers in Maryland who agree to serve these individuals and abide by B4U-ACT’s Principles and Perspectives of Practice, and to educate the citizens of Maryland regarding issues faced by these individuals,” according to the group’s website.

Perhaps that sounds innocent enough (although I don’t think so). Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt for a second: What’s wrong with psychiatrists seeking to help those attracted to children better understand why they have that tendency?

I had a pedophile on my caseload when I was in MH. He had just gotten out of prison. Had several child victims. Went into counseling and he told me that his counselor, ( all of this was after he had been released from prison) he told me his counselor had told him that he shouldn’t think that all of his victims were really victims. That maybe some of them were just relationships. I was furious! I reported it to my supervisor and it went nowhere. I would have gone to the counselor myself but I was already on my way out! I told the pedophile that his counselor was dead wrong!

This is the kind of crap that is going on in the mental health field. That is just one of a hundred reasons why I resigned! The whole system needs to be scrapped, many of the individuals need to be returned to the hospitals and/ prisons the money needs to be returned to the taxpayers!

Honestly and in all seriousness.. the craziest people in the mental health field are some of the ones employed by it.

JellyToast on August 24, 2011 at 6:26 PM

I wonder – since the euphemism for “homosexual” is “gay”, will the PC inclined now demand we refer to pedophile offenders as “really, really happies”?

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:27 PM

Yes, I’m just a “pedophiliaphobe”.

Blue Collar Todd

I like it.

You h8tr/

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:27 PM

Let me help you. Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia.
bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Unless the adult is involved with a child of the same sex. The Leftist argument that same sex pedophiles are not Gay is pure legend. It’s a sham to distance the perversion of same sex from the perversion of adults wanting power over children sexually of the same sex.
Hening on August 24, 2011 at 6:04 PM

Correct. I can’t improve on that.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:08 PM

It is no different than a heterosexual human being wanting power over children sexually. No different at all. Because one person is gay and one is not makes no difference. The issue is Pedophilia. Adults that prey on children.

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:27 PM

I knew it would come to this. Not just the toleration of but the EMBRACING OF AND CELEBRATION AND GLORIFYING OF AND EVEN THE PROSELYTIZING OF HOMOSEXUALITY was the opening of Pandora’s Box that allowed the floodgate to open for any type of other perversion that came along. Child molesters next. Then what? Serial sexual killers?

MaiDee on August 24, 2011 at 6:28 PM

My husband just came in and I read him the headline of this story. He said, “I’ll give you tolerance. Crucify them on Route 80.”

Can’t say that I disagree.

Naturally Curly on August 24, 2011 at 6:29 PM

Only. A. Matter. Of. Time.

WnHeAcTr oIpSh iNlEiXaT?

KbIeDaDsItNiGa lRiIyGHT?

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:30 PM

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:27 PM

Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:17 PM

Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:31 PM

Roman Polanski was unavailable for comment.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:31 PM

Megan’s Law

Kini on August 24, 2011 at 6:31 PM

Gee, Tina, it sure would have been nice if you had included some sort of sourcing link that I could post without people dismissing it as just another right-wing homophobic hate blog.
fusionaddict on August 24, 2011 at 6:24 PM

I expect you can figure out how to check out “B4U-Act” in Google News, no?

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:32 PM

Funny how we see so much in common between Muslims and liberals, ain’t it?

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:33 PM

Let me help you. Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia. bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Louder!!!

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:34 PM

I expect you can figure out how to check out “B4U-Act” in Google News, no?

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:32 PM

I wouldn’t put an actual link to that site directly from Hot Air either.

hawkdriver on August 24, 2011 at 6:36 PM

This is another case of pushing the envelope. Where do we draw the line? First, it’s okay for men to have sex with men, and women to have sex with women. Next, man/child love.

I predict the big social issue in 2024 will be legalizing human/goat marriage. You’re just a goataphobe if you don’t agree, hater.

Who’s up for a constitutional amendment?

connectthedots on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

And what about adults that simply look for a consensual relationship with a post-adolecent teen? Do you hate such adult? blink on August 24, 2011 at 6:34 PM

What age? that’s kind of general, though it does define the preference of the sodomist RC priests that preyed on boys.

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

Because one person is gay and one is not makes no difference. The issue is Pedophilia. Adults that prey on children.
bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:27 PM

“Gays” who preys on children of the same gender are, by definition and deed, “gay” pedophiles. An inconvenient & politically incorrect truth, but true none the less. To claim there’s no such thing as “gay” pedophiles would be absurdity ad infinitum.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

Other researchers have taken different approaches, but have similarly failed to find a connection between homosexuality and child molestation. Dr. Carole Jenny and her colleagues reviewed 352 medical charts, representing all of the sexually abused children seen in the emergency room or child abuse clinic of a Denver children’s hospital during a one-year period (from July 1, 1991 to June 30, 1992). The molester was a gay or lesbian adult in fewer than 1% in which an adult molester could be identified – only 2 of the 269 cases (Jenny et al., 1994).

and it goes on and on. (this is in response to Rebar @ 6.31pm)

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

Where is the rule of law? Doesn’t apply to liberals, I guess.

ultracon on August 24, 2011 at 6:38 PM

So NAMBLA wins.

Where’s JetBoy? Oh JetBoy…

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:38 PM

We should redefine pedophilia.

To include loading down children with trillions of dollars in debt.

And, to include abortion.

For all of their misdirection and bluster, liberals hate children.

jaime on August 24, 2011 at 6:39 PM

This is a hornets nest for the gay movement whether they like it or not.

If gays are “born that way” and their sexual preference is not “learned”, then the gay movement’s activists cannot deny the same rationale from a pedophile.

That being said, what does a gay person suggest one do with a “born” pedophile?

Treatment? Wouldn’t that be like trying to “treat” a gay person?

If heterosexuality is the “norm” are all other preferences “deviant”?

If gays are not deviant, why are pedophiles?

If both are “born” into a person, what then do we do?

Any gay folks out there want to answer this?

Opposite Day on August 24, 2011 at 6:40 PM

And what about adults that simply look for a consensual relationship with a post-adolecent teen? Do you hate such adult?
blink on August 24, 2011 at 6:34 PM

Anybody that targets “post-adolescent teens” for sex probably won’t have too many fans here or much anywhere else.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:41 PM

Let me help you. Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia.

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Disagree. They are both aberrations of normal sexual behavior.

Sex has a single purpose: t0 procreate. Sex with members of the same sex or with children violates that purpose.

connectthedots on August 24, 2011 at 6:42 PM

How about you, Vyce? You seem to take a strong stand against the haters. Do you agree that it’s wrong to hate someone simply because they’re looking for a consensual relationship with a post-adolescent teen? blink twink on August 24, 2011 at 6:38 PM

So one can advocate for pedophilia on HA and not get the ban hammer. Huh.

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:42 PM

In 1973, the American Psychiatric Association declassified homosexuality as a mental disorder.

faraway on August 24, 2011 at 6:42 PM

The simple fact is, every single argument for homosexual marriage, applies exactly the same to pedophilia, consanguineous marriage, polygamy – the whole gamut of deviance that Western civilization tried to stamp out.
Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:07 PM

The funny thing is the advocates/activists now are stuck. Even though they were dead wrong claiming this would never happen, they still cling to the name calling and ad-hominem.

catmman on August 24, 2011 at 6:43 PM

“Gays” who preys on children of the same gender are, by definition and deed, “gay” pedophiles. An inconvenient & politically incorrect truth, but true none the less. To claim there’s no such thing as “gay” pedophiles would be absurdity ad infinitum.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

The distinction between a victim’s gender and a perpetrator’s sexual orientation is important because many child molesters don’t really have an adult sexual orientation. They have never developed the capacity for mature sexual relationships with other adults, either men or women. Instead, their sexual attractions focus on children – boys, girls, or children of both sexes.

Over the years, this fact has been incorporated into various systems for categorizing child molesters. For example, Finkelhor and Araji (1986) proposed that perpetrators’ sexual attractions should be conceptualized as ranging along a continuum – from exclusive interest in children at one extreme, to exclusive interest in adult partners at the other end.

Typologies of offenders have often included a distinction between those with an enduring primary preference for children as sexual partners and those who have established age-appropriate relationships but become sexually involved with children under unusual circumstances of extreme stress. Perpetrators in the first category – those with a more or less exclusive interest in children – have been labeled fixated. Fixation means “a temporary or permanent arrestment of psychological maturation resulting from unresolved formative issues which persist and underlie the organization of subsequent phases of development” (Groth & Birnbaum, 1978, p. 176). Many clinicians view fixated offenders as being “stuck” at an early stage of psychological development.

By contrast, other molesters are described as regressed. Regression is “a temporary or permanent appearance of primitive behavior after more mature forms of expression had been attained, regardless of whether the immature behavior was actually manifested earlier in the individual’s development” (Groth & Birnbaum, 1978, p. 177). Regressed offenders have developed an adult sexual orientation but under certain conditions (such as extreme stress) they return to an earlier, less mature psychological state and engage in sexual contact with children.

Some typologies of child molesters divide the fixation-regression distinction into multiple categories, and some include additional categories as well (e.g., Knight, 1989).

For the present discussion, the important point is that many child molesters cannot be meaningfully described as homosexuals, heterosexuals, or bisexuals (in the usual sense of those terms) because they are not really capable of a relationship with an adult man or woman. Instead of gender, their sexual attractions are based primarily on age. These individuals – who are often characterized as fixated – are attracted to children, not to men or women.

Using the fixated-regressed distinction, Groth and Birnbaum (1978) studied 175 adult males who were convicted in Massachusetts of sexual assault against a child. None of the men had an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation. 83 (47%) were classified as “fixated;” 70 others (40%) were classified as regressed adult heterosexuals; the remaining 22 (13%) were classified as regressed adult bisexuals. Of the last group, Groth and Birnbaum observed that “in their adult relationships they engaged in sex on occasion with men as well as with women. However, in no case did this attraction to men exceed their preference for women….There were no men who were primarily sexually attracted to other adult males…” (p.180).

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:43 PM

How about you, Vyce? You seem to take a strong stand against the haters. Do you agree that it’s wrong to hate someone simply because they’re looking for a consensual relationship with a post-adolescent teen? blink twink on August 24, 2011 at 6:38 PM

So opposing men bowling boys is not hate.

I detect a pattern…

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:43 PM

Any gay folks out there want to answer this?

I guess you don’t know the difference between two consenting adults an an adult abusing a child.

One act is victimless, one isn’t.

See the difference?

Isn’t that easy.

Pablo Honey on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

I find it interesting that some people’s first reaction to a story about the mainstreaming of pedophillia in NOT “Hell no”, but is instead “Keep your hands off my gay sex”. I’m sure it is because the latter are so concerned about the children, in about the same way that the Slut Walkers make it their full time priority to be concerned about rape, or muslims complain about profiling instead of acts of terrorism. It is actualy NOT about your rights, and if you had any decency you’d react entirely differently.

AnotherOpinion on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

So NAMBLA wins.

Where’s JetBoy? Oh JetBoy…

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:38 PM

Was that necessary?

Cheap shot.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

In 1973, the American Psychiatric Association declassified homosexuality as a mental disorder. faraway on August 24, 2011 at 6:42 PM

You mean the crowd that gave us the lobotomy and electroshock “therapy”? Imagine that.

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

This is a hornets nest for the gay movement whether they like it or not.
If gays are “born that way” and their sexual preference is not “learned”, then the gay movement’s activists cannot deny the same rationale from a pedophile.
Opposite Day on August 24, 2011 at 6:40 PM

Indeed. I’d say it’s their Achille’s Catch-22 Heel.

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:45 PM

Was that necessary? Cheap shot. hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

I want him on the record on this. He could be a voice of reason among his compadres by denouncing this.

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

Sex has a single purpose: t0 procreate.

I think vast majority sexually active people would disagree.

Pablo Honey on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

This is a hornets nest for the gay movement whether they like it or not.

If gays are “born that way” and their sexual preference is not “learned”, then the gay movement’s activists cannot deny the same rationale from a pedophile.

That being said, what does a gay person suggest one do with a “born” pedophile?

Treatment? Wouldn’t that be like trying to “treat” a gay person?

If heterosexuality is the “norm” are all other preferences “deviant”?

If gays are not deviant, why are pedophiles?

If both are “born” into a person, what then do we do?

Any gay folks out there want to answer this?

Opposite Day on August 24, 2011 at 6:40 PM

That is going to leave a mark.

catmman on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

Oh, brother. Here we go with the usual suspects crying how accepting gays will lead to pedophiles demanding the same. Pedophilia is a crime, hurts children. Gay is not a crime, and is between two consenting adults.

It’s like apples and oranges.

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 6:37 PM

bt, I’m actually heading out, but I wondered if you’d read my comment back to you. If you did, I take it you think I was reading that portion of the comment I posted out of context? What do you think he meants in the portions I highlighted?

Gays on the whole do not advocate for lowering the age of consent, which is in it’s own right a strange and uneven concept even in our country, and has no biblical or religious constraint or guide.

I read the rest of his comment and agree, it would seem he is clearly trying to assert the two acts are separate. But what I reposted here just seems so out of place with the rest of his comments. Again, I sort of struggled to understand what it meant in the middle of his comment. Sort of like when you say something loud at a party just when everyone got quiet?

hawkdriver on August 24, 2011 at 6:47 PM

Pedophilia is a disorder. A disease. So is rabies. Put down the dog with rabies. Put down the pedophiliac. Problem solved.

john1schn on August 24, 2011 at 6:47 PM

The pedophilia caboose on the Gay/Lesbian train is coming into view.

Hening on August 24, 2011 at 5:53 PM

I don’t think it’s the caboose. I don’t think there’s even a word yet for what’s going to be at the end of this wreck.

BigWyo on August 24, 2011 at 6:47 PM

It’s like apples and oranges.

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

Come on now. You can do better than that.

It’s like apples and…. corn fritters?

Anyway, don’t take the trollbait; it ain’t worth it.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:48 PM

lol, means…

hawkdriver on August 24, 2011 at 6:48 PM

Any gay folks out there want to answer this?

Opposite Day on August 24, 2011 at 6:40 PM

Again, the anti-gays try to keep tying strawmen to gays. If you want to keep going with the “born this way” thing, if you’re straight, weren’t you born that way too?

Take it from a teh ghey….I WAS BORN THIS WAY. Period.

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:48 PM

Oh, brother. Here we go with the usual suspects crying how accepting gays will lead to pedophiles demanding the same. Pedophilia is a crime, hurts children. Gay is not a crime, and is between two consenting adults. It’s like apples and oranges. JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

Anymore, and when this thread’s topic was used as a reason against voiding those laws, the hue and cry was deafening. “That will never happen you hater!”

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:49 PM

See the difference?
Isn’t that easy.
Pablo Honey on August 24, 2011 at 6:44 PM

No, his “born that way” question still stands unanswered:

“If gays are “born that way” and their sexual preference is not “learned”, then the gay movement’s activists cannot deny the same rationale from a pedophile.
That being said, what does a gay person suggest one do with a “born” pedophile?”

whatcat on August 24, 2011 at 6:50 PM

Come on now. You can do better than that.

It’s like apples and…. corn fritters?

Anyway, don’t take the trollbait; it ain’t worth it.

hillbillyjim on August 24, 2011 at 6:48 PM

Yeah, I know. Been down this road far too often, nothing ever changes with the peanut gallery. Corn fritters? Mmmm…

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:50 PM

When you remove God, you remove morality.

We mock morality and then are shocked at the immorality that takes over our society. None of this is surprising.

JellyToast on August 24, 2011 at 6:12 PM

Jelly, glad someone said this….

chai on August 24, 2011 at 6:51 PM

So JetBoy is on record as opposed to pedophilia. That’s encouraging. Welcome to the ranks of the haters JB!

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:52 PM

Akzed, Rebar, Hawk…once again, the axis of feeble.

Y’all spend a heck of a lot of time on gay-related threads. Makes one think a little…those who doth protest too much and all…

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:52 PM

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:52 PM

Yeah, you nailed us. We’re all self-hating buggers in real life. We were born that way I guess.

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:53 PM

Oh, brother. Here we go with the usual suspects crying how accepting gays will lead to pedophiles demanding the same. Pedophilia is a crime, hurts children. Gay is not a crime, and is between two consenting adults.

It’s like apples and oranges.

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM

But aren’t they? They may not have come out and said as much yet. But their arguments are the same we heard from the gay-rights crowd beginning decades ago.

Pedophilia is a crime – for now. Homosexuality was a crime until just a few years ago.

You honestly don’t see any similarities (not in the act itself, but in the maneuvering for ‘acceptance/tolerance’)?

catmman on August 24, 2011 at 6:53 PM

I suspect they have pedo tendencies themselves. You wouldn’t believe how many whackjobs go into the field of psych.

Also, don’t forget that judge who is now on the 2nd Circuit who found sexual sadism to be a mitigating circumstance in a death penalty case where they guy raped and murdered countless women.

They are trying to turn this country into weenies.

Blake on August 24, 2011 at 6:53 PM

Take it from a teh ghey….I WAS BORN THIS WAY. Period.

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:48 PM

I can’t remember being born.

faraway on August 24, 2011 at 6:54 PM

i think it just reveals the profound hypocrisy of our society and culture- a culture that hyper sexualizes children, presenting them as acceptable objects for and of adult sexual desires ( although technically this is nothing new as anyone who has ever read victorian era pornography can attest. it was just not mainstream and widely tolerated/accepted as it is now.). or it just shows that a remarkable number of psychiatrists are pedophiles opps i mean child lovers.

as for the opposing view – it reveals that it knows nothing about the nature of sex crimes against children and nothing about the statistics around all of the most heinous crimes against the most vulnerable among us- those we should be protecting instead of defending criminals at the expense of their victims( which defines psychology as it is used by our legal system) or endless self righteous indignant harping about adult gays anytime criminality involving sex and children is mentioned.

most children who are murdered are killed by a family member, not a roving unknown mad dog pedophile. stranger child abduction is rare- most children are kidnapped by, again, family members. as with adults, most children are raped and or sexually assaulted by family members (in the loving bosom of the church sanctified, god approved boy/girl heterosexual marriage)or those known to them and their families.

3 out of 4 victims of ‘ molestation’ are female and the majority of offenders(96+ %) are male which means their ‘pedophilia’ is technically overwhelmingly heterosexually oriented. even the majority of stranger abductions and stranger sexual assaults upon children and teenagers are upon females perpetrated by males. what does that have to do with gay marriage?

2/3rds of child molesters are married( not ‘ gay married’). as with most sexual crimes( and like the rape of adults of either gender ,the sexual abuse of children is criminally and dangerously under reported) their punishment, if they are even brought to trial, in western legal systems is negligible. it shows just how much we as a society do not care about the victims that we consider their victimization so trifling as to warrant itty bitty sentences and lots of therapy with psychiatrists who could give a rats butt about the victims but drool their sympathy all over the perpetrators.

with most of the victims of sexual abuse and molestation being female and the majority of offenders being male it’s just as god intended, isn’t it? or is always blaming the gays just projection to lead people away from the truth- our children are most vulnerable to those who are suppose to protect and love them- their own traditional families . our insistence on obscuring this enables it to continue, ruining far more lives then adam and steve getting hitched or putting their no nos where it’s frankly none of your business. why don’t we tend to our own before we start correcting the lives of other adults. do it for the children.

mittens on August 24, 2011 at 6:54 PM

Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:17 PM

Homosexuals are BORN that way, remember? So how do the men who molest these kids KNOW that the children they’re molesting are going to grow up liking this kind of thing – decades before they’re old enough to legally go to gay bars? It’s not like they’re doing saliva swabs – at least not in a hygenic enough manner to test the kids’ DNA.

Ergo, there must be some kind of pre-adolescent “gaydar” at work. Now, granted, the liberal scientologists haven’t yet figured out the mechanism behind it. But whether it’s subtle clues, like which side the kids button their bibs on — or even if it’s completely involuntary, like pheremones…. There has to be SOMETHING to even out the otherwise beyond-astronomical odds of these pair-ups between adult homosexuals and pre-adolescent homosexuals happening completely at random.

In other words, if you believe that the desire for homosexuality is inborn, these kids must must in some way be putting out the signals. So, according to liberal dogma, for all practical purposes, they’re asking for it.

logis on August 24, 2011 at 6:55 PM

Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia.

A ludicrous, specious and even irrelevant argument. It would be true to say that not all homosexuals are pedophiles but, certainly men attracted to young boys would eminently qualify. BTW chronic bed wetters, serial axe murderers and people who believe the inside of their heads are filled with rotten meat have NOTHING to do with pedophilia.

MaiDee on August 24, 2011 at 6:55 PM

Yes, I’m just a “pedophiliaphobe”.

Blue Collar Todd on August 24, 2011 at 6:13 PM

That’s a funny +1!

Gang-of-One on August 24, 2011 at 6:55 PM

Let me help you. Homosexuality has NOTHING TO DO with Pedophilia.
bridgetown on August 24, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Except that they are both are undeniably unnatural sexual perversions.

Rod on August 24, 2011 at 6:55 PM

No, his “born that way” question still stands unanswered:

I have yet to hear one straight person ever recollect the day that they chose to be straight, including myself.

Perhaps you are the exception…how did you learn to be a normal moral straight person…did your pastor guide you? Were you ever tempted to go “teh ghey”? Was it a tough choice?

Pablo Honey on August 24, 2011 at 6:56 PM

mittens on August 24, 2011 at 6:54 PM

Regardless of whether the pedophile is gay or straight, it’s a horror. It’s also a perversion. The acceptance and tolerance of perversion A is the camel’s nose under the tent, the rest of the camel is every other perversion.

NAMBLA wins! And they said it w/couldn’t be done!

Akzed on August 24, 2011 at 6:57 PM

Y’all spend a heck of a lot of time on gay-related threads. Makes one think a little…those who doth protest too much and all…

JetBoy on August 24, 2011 at 6:52 PM

Ah, that old chestnut – I’m really a self-hating homosexual, as if that somehow invalidates my points.

Fact is, I for one post on a lot of different threads, on a lot of topics. One thing I notice, is I don’t see your name hardly ever – except on gay-related topics.

Like all progressives, you project far too much.

Rebar on August 24, 2011 at 6:58 PM

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