“SlutWalk” comes to South Africa, where rape is on the rise

posted at 7:00 pm on August 20, 2011 by Tina Korbe

In a country in which more than 55,000 rapes and sexual assaults were reported from 2009 to 2010 alone, some 2,000 protesters marched the streets of Cape Town to contest the notion that what women wear might play into their victimization. The Washington Post reports:

Women draped sexy lingerie over their street clothes as they marched through Cape Town on Saturday, bringing an international campaign against the notion that a woman’s appearance can excuse attacks to a country where rape is seen as a national crisis.

Some 2,000 protesters walked a route where fans partied during last year’s football World Cup. Men joined in, some of them wearing miniskirts in solidarity. Some protesters pushed their children in strollers and carried signs declaring, “Rapists rape people, not outfits,” and “Weak men rape.” …

“SlutWalks” originated in Toronto, Canada, where they were sparked by a police officer’s remark that women could avoid being raped by not dressing like “sluts.”

One of the walkers said it was important for women to know their dignity “should not be taken away from them.” Yes, but it’s also important that women carry themselves with dignity in the first place — and that, I’m sorry to say, means adopting a modicum of modesty. I pity the poor police officer who tried to speak truth and instead sparked an international campaign to excuse women from taking any responsibility at all for the situations in which they place themselves. The police officer was not excusing rape — and neither am I. It is never, never OK. Nor is it ever, ever deserved: The rapist is always the perpetrator, the victim always the victim. But he was pointing out the obvious — that by taking care to dress in a self-respecting manner and by not putting themselves in potentially compromising situations, women reduce the likelihood that they will be that victim in the first place.

As a college coed, I sat through my fair share of women’s safety lectures. No presenter ever wanted to say it, but it had to be acknowledged as true: No way a girl who stays in her secured dorm room or heads to the local movie theater with friends on a Friday night runs the same risk of date rape as a girl who dances on the tables or falls down drunk at a college kegger. That’s just common sense.

On a separate but related note, the “SlutWalk” phenomenon troubles me for another reason. The bald-faced use of terms once universally accepted as offensive has become too common. Anti-rape activists aren’t the only women who have taken to referring to themselves with labels that suggest they have little to contribute to the community other than brazen sex appeal. Young girls, too, have hijacked formerly disparaging terms and held them hostage in desperate pleas for attention. Facebook walls are plastered with girl-to-girl messages that use these terms affectionately. Women do themselves a disservice when, instead of outright rejecting the use of insulting language, they try to redeem it by using it themselves. Regardless of who uses it, disgusting language is just that – disgusting. Why not a “Walk Like a Lady” anti-rape demonstration?


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kim roy on August 21, 2011 at 4:08 PM

Oh but kimmy I did not joke about rape. Nice try.

Keep feigning your outrage.

Your comebacks are lame.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:52 PM

There are those here that by their actions do in fact embolden the rapist. T Boy, Inviolet, and kimmy included. You all should be ashamed.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

I think we can all agree to teach awareness and arm, if necessary, the vulnerable.
I consider myself vulnerable because I weigh a buck o five and many days walking to my car from a grocery, so simple, but I read stories in the news all of the time about abductions in broad daylight in a parking lot.
I would still feel vulnerable, even in a burka.

I’m glad to hear that we all mostly agree that even if a woman is dressed ‘differently’….doesn’t matter. Rape is rape is rape is wrong and good for these women marching. (bras showing and all!)
Awareness is part of the fight against evil.
I just wish the arguments didn’t have to happen on this thread. It would be nice if everyone came together and said, hear hear…rape is wrong, and you have NOT a smidgen of an excuse, even if you’re drunk and naked at the club. Yes, that would be sad to see a drunk naked woman at a club, but that does not change the way I look at rape. The point should be to turn all guns at the rapist. The talk about clothing confuses the insane idiots.
I don’t like excuses being offered to madmen, even if just inferred.
:)

The talk about how a woman dresses simply should not matter, so to young women….dress how you like, and carry a weapon (and know how to use it). ;)

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

There are those here that by their actions do in fact embolden the rapist. T Boy, Inviolet, and kimmy included. You all should be ashamed.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

That’s what I’m sayin! :)

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 4:55 PM

There are those here that by their actions do in fact embolden the rapist. T Boy, Inviolet, and kimmy included. You all should be ashamed.
CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

Pfft.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 5:13 PM

Wow, there are some delusional idiots here. Zombie’s take on this is excellent. Thank you to whoever posted that link. It was eye-opening seeing these confused babes who don’t even know what the hell they are protesting.

Basically, they want to dress like a slut, act like a slut, and then they get pissed off when they are treated like sluts. Then they blame men for their own complete lack of (common) sense.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 5:20 PM

There are those here that by their actions do in fact embolden the rapist. T Boy, Inviolet, and kimmy included. You all should be ashamed.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

So, you don’t like common sense? You are a very deluded individual, who has no right to tell anyone they ought to be ashamed of their opinion.

Rapists are emboldened by getting away with rape. Unrealistic idiocy, like you are preaching here, helps rapists get away with rape. Women who put themselves in compromising positions, like getting so drunk at a party that they don’t even remember what happened the next morning, embolden men who will take advantage of such a situation. Common sense says that, as a woman, you don’t put yourself in such a risky situation. Idiocy demands that you can do whatever you please and expect nothing bad to happen. Actions have consequences. That’s reality.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 5:29 PM

Common sense says that, as a woman, you don’t put yourself in such a risky situation. Idiocy demands that you can do whatever you please and expect nothing bad to happen. Actions have consequences. That’s reality.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 5:29 PM

Correct. I gave a link to one page (one of a great many like sites) about how to avoid being mugged, here are some tips from it:

“1)Dress to discourage unwanted attention from muggers. Some things that might make you a more likely target are:
Dressing like a tourist. If you’re obviously not a local, you’re more likely to be targeted, as tourists tend to be less aware and carry cash on them.
Avoid wearing obvious, flashy jewelery or watches. Turn diamond rings around into palm.
Carrying a large purse, briefcase or backpack. Anything that might contain valuables makes you a potentially more lucrative target.”

Those who work in law enforcement can add even more tips, such as walking with head up, being aware, not looking as if you’re strolling along in a daze, etc.

Obviously a person has a right to ignore any and all such common sense suggestions and can, in fact, do the total opposite. But as you said, the consequences remain.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 5:57 PM

I hear it. We all know it.

Common Sense.

How about we focus on making it ‘common sense’ that it Doesn’t Matter How A Person Is Dressed when it comes to RAPE ????

Or, is that too practical for men who want to tell women that what they may or may not wear phucking matters?!!!!!!!!?!!!!!!!!!!!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 6:09 PM

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 5:57 PM

And, again….comparing getting robbed of material things you have is NOT THE SAME, in ANY UNIVERSE, as getting Raped.

sometimes it’s fun to use all caps. I said those words REALLY HARD. lol~

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 6:13 PM

I hear it. We all know it.
Common Sense.
bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 6:09 PM

Do you think the common precautionary advice I quoted above is helpful in lessening one’s chance of being a victim of a mugger?

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 6:16 PM

Wow, there are some delusional idiots here. Zombie’s take on this is excellent. Thank you to whoever posted that link. It was eye-opening seeing these confused babes who don’t even know what the hell they are protesting.
JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 5:20 PM

I think they’re against war too. And worry about climate change and stuff.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 6:21 PM

bridgetown

Let’s take rape out of the discussion for a moment. Are you sticking with your advice that women dress however the ‘phuck’ they want? I gather anything goes no matter how undignified or inappropriate, so I’m curious: Can you articulate why you think this is good advice? I’ll even narrow it down to make it e.z.4 u: Who benefits from this advice and why?

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 6:29 PM

It seems obvious to me you’ve not seen Michelle Malkin or SE Cupp or Ann Coulter in a short sleeved shirt or attractive short dress.

I’m sorry that despite repeated attempts at conversation you seem to be of the opinion, without justification, that “Hot Air social cons” want you in “frumpy nun wear.” (why, it sounds like you have some other beef with social cons besides their purported interest in your clothing, I wonder why that is) You’ve mentioned the Duggars several times and though I have respect for them, most conservatives simply do not dress like that nor do they want women in burkas or nun habits.

it’s a bit frustrating all due respect to have someone so committed to a strawman argument that they refuse to listen to what anyone has to say.

Since you’re absolutely convinced this woman wants you in a convent behind a 20 foot fence in a burka from head to toe, never having any fun, dressing like the Duggars, go ahead and believe that. I gotta go — gotta (no joke, no lie) go to the gym to get my swim in. And I won’t be wearing a burkini, as difficult as that may be to believe ;).

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 1:59 PM

So now it is okay to wear a short dress and showing breasts? When it was all about dressing modestly about a few posts earlier. Based on your logic, it should be perfectly okay for male sleazes to hurl nasty things at conservative female commentators because their hemlines are a few inches too short.

And yes, Fox News, Ann Coulter, etc. are definitely playing up the sex appeal angle. All the women anchors on Fox News happen to be ex models and beauty queens who wear revealing suits. All are also good reporters, but I do think that looking good in short skirts helps them get the jobs.

As for the Duggars, I have nothing but contempt for the entire bunch. I’m a big fan of equality between the sexes and I think that the entire Duggar phenomenon has a notion of sexual roles that is about 100 years out of date. I highly doubt that any of the Duggar girls are going to become high powered executives or contribute anything positive to society even if they were the next Einstein.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 6:30 PM

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 6:30 PM

DimBulbDiva – I specifically stated that no one is asking you to dress like a Pentecostal frump. You immediately proceeded to complain that we were asking you to dress like one of the Duggars. You don’t seem to want to read or comprehend what anyone has said – you just want to blather on about how to “attract men”. Maybe you should write for Cosmopolitan or something (although I’m not sure you’re even up to their standards).

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 6:41 PM

And yes, Fox News, Ann Coulter, etc. are definitely playing up the sex appeal angle. All the women anchors on Fox News happen to be ex models and beauty queens who wear revealing suits. All are also good reporters, but I do think that looking good in short skirts helps them get the jobs.
Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 6:30 PM

To be fair, with television, movies and the visual media as a whole you just don’t see a whole lot of butt-ugly people at all – not even in the “reality shows”. Pretty much the nature of the business to display attractive people.

As for the Duggars, I have nothing but contempt for the entire bunch.

I don’t care much one way or another about them. People can live their lives as they choose, it doesn’t affect me. So it doesn’t get my nose out of joint.

Based on your logic, it should be perfectly okay for male sleazes to hurl nasty things at conservative female commentators because their hemlines are a few inches too short.

I hope you can address the questions/issues that inviolet has actually brought up as opposed to the strawmen and what you imagine she thinks. You seem like an intelligent person capable of doing so, if you so chose.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 6:56 PM

I think I just reiterated pretty much everything you said. Apologies. That’s what happens when I leave mid-comment to clean a kid-spill off the carpet and come back ten minutes later. :)

Bee on August 21, 2011 at 4:43 PM

Except you said it much better and more succinctly than I did. Thank you.

I hope you can address the questions/issues that inviolet has actually brought up as opposed to the strawmen and what you imagine she thinks. You seem like an intelligent person capable of doing so, if you so chose.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 6:56 PM

Thank you. I didn’t say anything remotely resembling “okay for male sleazes to” do anything.

I too think these people are intelligent. Which is why the football field size group of strawmen brought into this discussion appear to be deliberate distortions or outright lies.

I’m not ashamed of a single thing I wrote, BTW. I think those who are accusing us of defending rapists are the ones who should be ashamed.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:03 PM

You seem like an intelligent person capable of doing so, if you so chose.
whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 6:56 PM

I think she sounds like an airhead. But kudos to you for being nice.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 7:04 PM

You seem like an intelligent person capable of doing so, if you so chose.
whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 6:56 PM

I think she sounds like an airhead. But kudos to you for being nice.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 7:04 PM

No, I meant it. Even the most intelligent person can have a thing or two that sets off counterproductive reactions & reasoning. Something like “pet peeves”, except they are much more magnified.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:11 PM

Oh but kimmy I did not joke about rape. Nice try.

Keep feigning your outrage.

Your comebacks are lame.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:52 PM

There are those here that by their actions do in fact embolden the rapist. T Boy, Inviolet, and kimmy included. You all should be ashamed.

CW on August 21, 2011 at 4:54 PM

You really are this stupid, aren’t you? I never said that you were joking *about* rape. I said after you attempted your “it was a joke” excuse that I wasn’t expecting *a joke in a rape thread*. You really haven’t caught onto the concept that your previous posts and your sad attempt at backtracking is here for everyone to see. You remind me of a cat who falls off something and then licks its butt afterwards as if to say “I meant to do that”.

Plus, I have yet to read a post here that says that a victim deserved it. The only things I have read is of risk minimization, which is entirely reasonable. With the lack of reading comprehension and brain death that you seemed to have suffered, it seems this distinction is lost on you.

Keep digging nitwit.

And no, I won’t pay rent on the space in your head that you have assigned to me. Keep obsessing creepy loser.

kim roy on August 21, 2011 at 7:13 PM

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:11 PM

True, but the fact remains that (in addition to her odd speech about how she likes to “attract men”) she misinterpreted just about every comment which went her way. I’m sticking with my theory that she’s an airhead.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 7:18 PM

Plus, I have yet to read a post here that says that a victim deserved it. The only things I have read is of risk minimization, which is entirely reasonable.
kim roy on August 21, 2011 at 7:13 PM

Indeed. But like I always say, when a person battles strawmen they risk no chance of losing the debate – at least within their own mind. A silly bit of useless mental self-pleasuring which accomplishes little other than boring others.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:24 PM

bridgetown

Let’s take rape out of the discussion for a moment. Are you sticking with your advice that women dress however the ‘phuck’ they want? I gather anything goes no matter how undignified or inappropriate, so I’m curious: Can you articulate why you think this is good advice? I’ll even narrow it down to make it e.z.4 u: Who benefits from this advice and why?

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 6:29 PM

No. I will not take RAPE out of the discussion for a moment.
This post is ABOUT
RAPE.
And I will always stick with ‘women can and should dress however the phuck they please, and how they dress doesn’t excuse men who want to rape them” yep, stickin’ to it.

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:30 PM

True, but the fact remains that (in addition to her odd speech about how she likes to “attract men”) she misinterpreted just about every comment which went her way. I’m sticking with my theory that she’s an airhead.
Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 7:18 PM

I try to avoid trading insults, waste of time. I do mock and poke fun on occasion though, hehehe.

But I don’t find it odd at all about an interest in “attracting men”. Errr, for a woman I mean, lol. And in this case, it’s actually a helpful illustration.When you go fishing and put the hook in the water, you could just as easily end up trying to get a snapping turtle off the hook as you would a trout. All sorts of water-critters just see it as bait, no matter the fisher’s intentions.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:31 PM

But I don’t find it odd at all about an interest in “attracting men”. Errr, for a woman I mean, lol. And in this case, it’s actually a helpful illustration.When you go fishing and put the hook in the water, you could just as easily end up trying to get a snapping turtle off the hook as you would a trout. All sorts of water-critters just see it as bait, no matter the fisher’s intentions.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:31 PM

yeah, yeah, yeah…and you could meat a gold digger, or worse, a phucking serial husband murderer…yeah, they do happen…blah blah.

You can have your intentions. I’m raising you a punishment.

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:35 PM

yeah, yeah, yeah…and you could meat a gold digger, or worse, a phucking serial husband murderer…yeah, they do happen…blah blah.
You can have your intentions. I’m raising you a punishment.
bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:35 PM

Sorry – though I am conversant in several languages I’ve never taken a course in Incoherent Illiterate Ranting. If you “meat” a translator send him this way, please.

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:49 PM

You can have your intentions. I’m raising you a punishment.

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:35 PM

Heh. Yes of course, because what several of us have been saying this whole thread is that rapists shouldn’t be punished if the woman he rapes had the gall to wear a shirt that left (gasp!) her shoulders uncovered. Or wore a skirt shorter than 5-1/4 inches below her knees.

Come on. You are a more intelligent person than this.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:54 PM

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 6:30 PM

DimBulbDiva – I specifically stated that no one is asking you to dress like a Pentecostal frump. You immediately proceeded to complain that we were asking you to dress like one of the Duggars. You don’t seem to want to read or comprehend what anyone has said – you just want to blather on about how to “attract men”. Maybe you should write for Cosmopolitan or something (although I’m not sure you’re even up to their standards).

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 6:41 PM

Okay I am still confused… What exactly is appropriate wear again? You still haven’t answered my question. Perhaps this is because what is considered appropriate for 99% of the population isn’t what you consider to be appropriate. What I wear is probably considered slutty prostitute wear by y’all, but is just considered a nice pair of skinny jeans and a demure tank top with a nice make up job by everyone else.

Point is that y’all think that I deserve to be raped by guys because I am not living up to your standards of dressing “modestly.” And since what I pointed out is basically what people wear to bars, I’m not sure exactly what you expect me to wear other than Duggar-wear.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Heh. Yes of course, because what several of us have been saying this whole thread is that rapists shouldn’t be punished if the woman he rapes had the gall to wear a shirt that left (gasp!) her shoulders uncovered. Or wore a skirt shorter than 5-1/4 inches below her knees.

Come on. You are a more intelligent person than this.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:54 PM

Actually this is what you are inferring.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:58 PM

Come on. You are a more intelligent person than this.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:54 PM

That’s quite a claim.

Do you have any evidence for that?

sharrukin on August 21, 2011 at 7:59 PM

I think she sounds like an airhead. But kudos to you for being nice.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 7:04 PM

How do you report a violation to the moderators? Frankly, I don’t appreciate personal attacks on my intelligence.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:04 PM

What I wear is probably considered slutty prostitute wear by y’all, but is just considered a nice pair of skinny jeans and a demure tank top with a nice make up job by everyone else.

What’s wrong with that? Sounds nice. BTW you realize of course that it doesn’t exactly match the description you gave earlier, of a shirt that, quote, “shows my boobs” (whatever that means, it could mean many different things) and, MUCH more to the point, sounded very defensive and pre-assumptory about what “our” “Hot Air” “social con” “standards” would be about you.

You know what shocks me? Not women’s clothing. I’m scandalized about women’s risk of getting raped, especially date raped, these days. What they choose to wear? Not so much.


Point is that y’all think that I deserve to be raped by guys because I am not living up to your standards of dressing “modestly.” And since what I pointed out is basically what people wear to bars, I’m not sure exactly what you expect me to wear other than Duggar-wear.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Again with the “you think I deserve to be raped.” My previous comments (and others’) already addressed this so I’ll just add this:

My dear, you owe us an apology for your slander. This discussion with you appears to be otherwise fruitless. Good night.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 8:06 PM

No. I will not take RAPE out of the discussion for a moment.
This post is ABOUT
RAPE.
And I will always stick with ‘women can and should dress however the phuck they please, and how they dress doesn’t excuse men who want to rape them” yep, stickin’ to it.

bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:30 PM

Nobody said it excuses men who want to rape them. But there are consequences to actions, and if you are going to dress in a way that is going to heterosexual males to gawk at you, then you don’t have any right to get pissed off when they do.

As a white woman, if I wander through a rotten neighborhood at 3:00AM, do you think I would be safer, and less likely to suffer abuse if I were wearing a nun’s habit, or if I was dressed like a slut?

Sure, women, in an ideal world SHOULD be able to dress any way they want, but it isn’t an ideal world, and deliberately putting yourself into risky situation is just plain stupid. Too bad you can’t accept this obvious concept and get past your silly outrage.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 8:06 PM

You can have your intentions. I’m raising you a punishment.
bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:35 PM

Heh. Yes of course, because what several of us have been saying this whole thread is that rapists shouldn’t be punished if the woman he rapes had the gall to wear a shirt that left (gasp!) her shoulders uncovered. Or wore a skirt shorter than 5-1/4 inches below her knees.
inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:54 PM

Ah, so he was offering up yet another strawman. I’m actually surprised that you could decipher any kind of meaning from it without a Rosetta Stone of sorts to serve as a guide!

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 8:07 PM

Sorry, I mixed up bold with quotes. Y’all know what I mean.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 8:07 PM

Ah, so he was offering up yet another strawman. I’m actually surprised that you could decipher any kind of meaning from it without a Rosetta Stone of sorts to serve as a guide!

whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 8:07 PM

I think bridgetown is a female. I think.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 8:08 PM

Point is that y’all think that I deserve to be raped by guys because I am not living up to your standards of dressing “modestly.” And since what I pointed out is basically what people wear to bars, I’m not sure exactly what you expect me to wear other than Duggar-wear.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:57 PM

This is a lie, so you have no point, but keep up the slander.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 8:09 PM

What’s wrong with that? Sounds nice. BTW you realize of course that it doesn’t exactly match the description you gave earlier, of a shirt that, quote, “shows my boobs” (whatever that means, it could mean many different things) and, MUCH more to the point, sounded very defensive and pre-assumptory about what “our” “Hot Air” “social con” “standards” would be about you.

You know what shocks me? Not women’s clothing. I’m scandalized about women’s risk of getting raped, especially date raped, these days. What they choose to wear? Not so much.

Point is that y’all think that I deserve to be raped by guys because I am not living up to your standards of dressing “modestly.” And since what I pointed out is basically what people wear to bars, I’m not sure exactly what you expect me to wear other than Duggar-wear.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Again with the “you think I deserve to be raped.” My previous comments (and others’) already addressed this so I’ll just add this:

My dear, you owe us an apology for your slander. This discussion with you appears to be otherwise fruitless. Good night.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 8:06 PM

Tank tops show boobs. What I consider a demure tank top is low cut. Which you apparently consider an invitation to get raped.

I’m glad your backing away from your position though however.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:11 PM

How do you report a violation to the moderators? Frankly, I don’t appreciate personal attacks on my intelligence.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:04 PM

While you’re at it, don’t forget to report your own slanderous posts.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 8:11 PM

Tank tops show boobs. What I consider a demure tank top is low cut. Which you apparently consider an invitation to get raped.

I’m glad your backing away from your position though however.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:11 PM

No backing away was done. If you’d read my previous posts with less defensiveness you’d know that.

inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 8:15 PM

Nobody said it excuses men who want to rape them. But there are consequences to actions, and if you are going to dress in a way that is going to heterosexual males to gawk at you, then you don’t have any right to get pissed off when they do.

As a white woman, if I wander through a rotten neighborhood at 3:00AM, do you think I would be safer, and less likely to suffer abuse if I were wearing a nun’s habit, or if I was dressed like a slut?

Sure, women, in an ideal world SHOULD be able to dress any way they want, but it isn’t an ideal world, and deliberately putting yourself into risky situation is just plain stupid. Too bad you can’t accept this obvious concept and get past your silly outrage.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 8:06 PM

Difference between how people dress and what situations that you put yourself in. A nun or a prostitute would be equally harassed in a bad neighborhood at 3AM. I’m a nerd and don’t stay out later than 10 PM.

As pointed out, a girl studying late at night alone and walking back to a dorm or working late at night and walking to her car is more likely to be raped than a woman out at a bar with her girlfriends who gets a taxi back to her apartment. The women in the former scenarios are alone, not the latter scenario.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:19 PM

While you’re at it, don’t forget to report your own slanderous posts.

JannyMae on August 21, 2011 at 8:11 PM

Never questioned anyone’s intelligence. Just pointing out the obvious.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:20 PM

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Is this really what you think the moderators are for? To address someone who has hurt your feelings by “attacking” your “intelligence”? Perhaps you should read the Terms of Use more closely, although your inability to get past the straw men you have erected and address the points people have actually made indicates the Terms will be lost on you.

DrMagnolias on August 21, 2011 at 9:02 PM

No. I will not take RAPE out of the discussion for a moment.
This post is ABOUT
RAPE.
bridgetown on August 21, 2011 at 7:30 PM

Um:

One of the walkers said it was important for women to know their dignity “should not be taken away from them.” Yes, but it’s also important that women carry themselves with dignity in the first place — and that, I’m sorry to say, means adopting a modicum of modesty….
- Tina Korbe

But I don’t find it odd at all about an interest in “attracting men”.
whatcat on August 21, 2011 at 7:31 PM

I find it odd that she talked about it in such intimate detail: I’m sorry, but when I go out to clubs, I do dress a certain way to attract guys. This generally involves wearing revealing tops, tight jeans, and short dresses. This doesn’t mean that I deserve to be raped by anyone because I am wearing a sleeveless shirt that shows my boobs

She seems to think it’s de rigeur to have one’s boobs hang out in order to “attract men”. That is ridiculous of course. Maybe she needs people to focus on her boobs because [_________]I’ll let you fill in the blank. And of course no one has said that she deserves to be raped.

Come on. You are a more intelligent person than this.
inviolet on August 21, 2011 at 7:54 PM

Don’t say I didn’t warn you:)

Okay I am still confused… What exactly is appropriate wear again?… Point is that y’all think that I deserve to be raped by guys because I am not living up to your standards of dressing “modestly.” And since what I pointed out is basically what people wear to bars, I’m not sure exactly what you expect me to wear other than Duggar-wear.
Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Here you go again with your straw man premise. Slut wear or Duggar wear – Choose or Lose! I’d be happy to look through your closet but it’s irrelevant to my point (and to what numerous other commenters have noted). By the way I looked through Vogue on-line tonight. Even checked out their party pages to see how they’re dressing when they go out. It didn’t match your description of your outfits. The girls were sophisticated, elegant, yet sexy.

How do you report a violation to the moderators? Frankly, I don’t appreciate personal attacks on my intelligence.
Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Ha! Just how blonde are you? Here’s the address: allah@hotair.com or ed@hotair.com.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 10:39 PM

I’m a nerd and don’t stay out later than 10 PM.
Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:19 PM

Missed this – Really? Now you’re a “nerd”? I thought you were a diva! Didn’t you say you go to “clubs”? Perhaps there are new hours for early birds sweeping the nation, but my experience has been that clubs don’t usually begin to get going until after 10 PM.

Buy Danish on August 21, 2011 at 10:51 PM

How do you report a violation to the moderators? Frankly, I don’t appreciate personal attacks on my intelligence.
Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Oh please. In the first place, a personal attack on your intelligence would be like trying to swat a fly with a sledgehammer. What’s being ‘attacked’ is your unbelievable naivete, coupled with an attitude like a rebellious tweenager, and arguments that range from wrong to outright absurd.

If you want to report THAT, dial whine-one-one and ask for the waaahmbulance.

Uncle Sams Nephew on August 21, 2011 at 11:25 PM

Never questioned anyone’s intelligence. Just pointing out the obvious.

Illinidiva on August 21, 2011 at 8:20 PM

No, you were not pointing out anything. You were making a false accusation.

Sorry folks. This one is stupid and a liar.

JannyMae on August 22, 2011 at 12:20 AM

Ms. Korbe,

I don’t know how to say this, but I’m afraid there may be a serious flaw in your argument: first, if my research is correct, the Canadian policeman said this:

An international series of protests known as SlutWalks, sparked by a Toronto police officer’s flippant comment that women should avoid dressing like “sluts” to avoid being raped or victimized, is taking root in the United States.

With all due respect, there was something vulgar in his statements, to say nothing of naive to think rapists are picky in every way, shape and form. They certainly aren’t in many Islamic-dominated countries. That aside, it is the rapists who should know better, regardless of how the victim is dressed.

Next, let’s have a little look at your comments. First, you said:

The police officer was not excusing rape — and neither am I. It is never, never OK. Nor is it ever, ever deserved: The rapist is always the perpetrator, the victim always the victim.

But THEN you say:

But he was pointing out the obvious — that by taking care to dress in a self-respecting manner and by not putting themselves in potentially compromising situations, women reduce the likelihood that they will be that victim in the first place.

Ms. Korbe, I don’t know if you realized it, but there is a backhand slap in your argument as you basically double back on a subtle blame-the-victim message and suggest it’s ALL because of how a women – or even a man – dresses that makes them a lightning rod for rape. No, I do not go by that rather naive form of thinking, and I’m afraid that even if you didn’t mean offense, it’s still very awkward to be leaning toward that whole argument.

Out of curiosity, do you go to the beach and swimming pools, whether by day or night, and wear a bathing suit? By the logic you’re going by, one could think even that was dangerous and the cause for rape. It is bad education that leads to barbarism, not simply how one dresses.

What your argument could be is something like, “even so, women should still make an effort to dress self-respectfully because poor taste in clothes is bad”, and should not have been directly linked to the main issue here. Unfortunately, that’s clearly not what you set out to say. I will shed no tears over any embarrassment the Canadian fool caused himself.

Besides, did it ever occur to anyone that most women who dress skimpily may be doing it because it’s the summertime and it’s sweltering hot? If it’s not wrong for a man to dress skimpy, then it’s not wrong for a women either, and we all need vitamin D provided by the sun’s rays. Even older women have dressed skimpily for this reason. In the winter, few dress like that.

I will say that if there’s something that bugs me, it’s why women are lectured about defense against predators but men aren’t being lectured about why it’s wrong to be predators. The whole notion that an adult mind is incorruptible is a little naive, if you ask me. And even older women have unfortunately been targeted by rapists.

I do agree that the “Slutwalk” is very poorly thought out with some absurdly contradictory messages, but that doesn’t mean we should allow it to obscure a most important factor: that better education is badly needed if rape crimes are to be prevented.

Avi Green on August 22, 2011 at 12:21 AM

Seeing as Illinadiva seems to be prostesting women even dressing a tiny bit more modest, my guess is that she has been filled out like a loan application more then a few times. I notice the women who been aroudn the block most are the ones taht do the whole “What? You think it’ s abad idea if I dress like a hooker? You must think I should wear a burka 24/7.” Of course it’s also those type of women that are the biggest “pro-choice” advocates and are the ones going around saying how great “friends with benefits” is and that Abstinance Only education is plain evil.

DethMetalCookieMonst on August 22, 2011 at 7:45 AM

I’m getting tired of the preachiness.

In South Africa, men go around raping little girls. This is not about how they dress or college girls getting drunk at a kegger.

These slutwalk protestors are stupid in their approach, but the rape issue is so ghastly and horrific in places like South Africa that marrying these two sides is rather sickening!

CambellBrown on August 22, 2011 at 8:28 AM

If you want to be perceived as a sex object, dress like one…if you want to be perceived as a business person, dress like one…if you want to be perceived as an Indian Chief, dress like one…if you want to be perceived as a ” “, dress like one.
It’s really pretty simple, if you want children to be seen as sex objects, put them in revealing nighties, do up their hair, put lipstick on…the irony is they won’t be the ones raped, unless they go to meet Polanski…
Put them in a “burka” and they are still an object to be told what to do, without say…it’s not the “dress” it’s the perception, the image you project and buy into.
Market yourself, how you want to be seen…pretty simple, and as someone stated, just ask any HR person.

right2bright on August 22, 2011 at 9:24 AM

Dress does not cause rape. True.

Unocked doors do not cause theft. True.

Do you leave your doors unlocked when you sleep, or when you aren’t home?

Q.E.D.

Freelancer on August 22, 2011 at 9:26 AM

Out of curiosity, do you go to the beach and swimming pools, whether by day or night, and wear a bathing suit? By the logic you’re going by, one could think even that was dangerous and the cause for rape. It is bad education that leads to barbarism, not simply how one dresses.
Avi Green on August 22, 2011 at 12:21 AM

This has already been addressed at this thread. Let me ask you some equally stupid questions: Do you wear a bathing suit to work? How about to church?

As for the last sentence, great job joining the army of straw men. Not one, not one single person, least of all Tina Korbe has said it’s “simply how one dresses”. As for your theory that the cause is “bad education”, that too is debatable. It can be a cultural thing (see, say, Muslim rapes in Australia) but most rapes are committed by people who are sick in the head, not because they weren’t educated that rape is a no no.

Buy Danish on August 22, 2011 at 10:58 AM

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