Wisconsin residents finally regain their Second Amendment rights

posted at 5:00 pm on June 23, 2011 by MadisonConservative

This leaves Illinois as the only state without any legal concealed carry legislation, and a few states that need seriously improved laws(New York, New Jersey, California, Hawaii, and a couple of others).

The GOP-controlled Assembly approved the bill on a bipartisan vote of 68-27.
The Senate backed the bill last week on a 25-8 vote, and the measure now goes to Walker, who supports it, for his signature.
Wisconsin would become the 49th state to legalize the carrying of concealed guns.
The legislation would require those who want to carry concealed firearms to obtain permits. It would allow people to carry concealed weapons in the state Capitol and other public buildings but not places like police stations and courthouses. Weapons also would be prohibited in buildings where posted notices bar them, and in places like Summerfest music festival at Milwaukee’s lakefront.

Ultimately, this is a victory with one casualty: Constitutional Carry. A couple of months ago, activists were energized at the concept that Wisconsin would join the rank of Alaska, Wyoming, Arizona, and New Hampshire in having pure Second Amendment freedom: open and concealed carry anywhere, without a permit. Sadly, this effort was undermined by local law enforcement and so-called “conservative” radio hosts like Charlie Sykes and Mark Belling on 620 WTMJ and 1130 WISN, with the help of milquetoast Jeff Wegner. They took the paranoid view that Constitutional Carry would lead to the cliche “wild west shootouts in the streets” that every anti-gun advocate talks about, yet somehow only materialize in places like Chicago, where they have the strictest gun laws. The chairman of Wisconsin Carry, Inc. claims he was refused airtime by Sykes himself, despite Sykes having called him out on the same show. Their damage to the fight to restore the rights of Wisconsin citizens will not go unforgotten.

Thankfully, it was Madison’s conservative host, Vicki McKenna, that kept the fight going even while Walker and members of the Wisconsin Senate and Assembly began to fold. Unfortunately, it wasn’t enough to keep them from deciding permits and minimal training would be necessary. The requirements are still significantly less stringent than a lot of states, but it was a blow to those who hoped that Wisconsin was taking a sharp turn to the right. Certain legal details regarding Castle Doctrine have yet to be hashed out, and the bill won’t even go into effect until four months after Walker signs it…but when it comes down to it, this is what many of us have been waiting years to come to fruition. Finally, the people of Wisconsin have the ability to defend their lives, their families, and their property.

A side note: unfortunately, the creation of the permit has further complicated the school zone issue, where in Wisconsin it is illegal to possess a firearm within 1000 feet of a school(which makes going through cities like Madison and Milwaukee into a sadistic game of hopscotch). While it is now legal to carry in your car without a permit, you MUST have a permit to carry within the school zone. It makes no-permit open carry both more accessible and more dangerous, in that you can now open carry in your car, but if you are pulled over in a school zone, you have to face the penalty for doing so. Basically it’s an attempt by some lawmakers to give the finger to open carriers, and impel them to buy the permits. Wisconsin liberals are a particularly potent kind of overlord.

This post was promoted from GreenRoom to HotAir.com.
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one casualty: Constitutional Carry.

Congratulations all the same. I know we disagree on certain things but not on this one.

fourdeucer on June 23, 2011 at 5:05 PM

If they Regained their 2nd Amendment Rights they would not have to have a Permit…

So no they have not regained their rights, they just have been given back the option of carrying a gun should the government approve of them doing so….

the_ancient on June 23, 2011 at 5:05 PM

Congratulations Wisconsin!

portlandon on June 23, 2011 at 5:06 PM

Congrats Madison Conservative- I know we’ve squabbled in the past but I’m sure you’re mostly pleased today with this news, as you should be. Hopefully one small step for Madison; one giant leap for Wisconsin! Now you all can work toward open carry.

BKeyser on June 23, 2011 at 5:06 PM

Wisconsin joins the civilized world?

MeatHeadinCA on June 23, 2011 at 5:07 PM

Congratulations Wisconsin. Now start recognizing out of state permits, castle doctrine and stand your ground laws. Illinois is the only sh!thole left, what a surprise. Kansas has a fairly well written law as does Florida, try to copy the best of the best laws for your own.

MJZZZ on June 23, 2011 at 5:08 PM

Bishop just fired up the Harley and is heading East…

Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:11 PM

Great news.

The Packers still suck.

Nelsen on June 23, 2011 at 5:18 PM

I can’t even own a pistol without a permit in NY state,and good luck with the permit.

heshtesh on June 23, 2011 at 5:19 PM

You read, you decide.

Citizens are supposed to have all of the power in society.
Have we slowly lost our authority?

Seton Hall Constitutional L.J. 2001, 685

ARE COPS CONSTITUTIONAL?

Roger Roots*

ABSTRACT

Police work is often lionized by jurists and scholars who claim to employ “textualist” and “originalist” methods of constitutional interpretation. Yet professional police were unknown to the United States in 1789, and first appeared in America almost a half-century after the Constitution’s ratification. The Framers contemplated law enforcement as the duty of mostly private citizens, along with a few constables and sheriffs who could be called upon when necessary. This article marshals extensive historical and legal evidence to show that modern policing is in many ways inconsistent with the original intent of America’s founding documents. The author argues that the growth of modern policing has substantially empowered the state in a way the Framers would regard as abhorrent to their foremost principles.

LAW ENFORCEMENT AS A UNIVERSAL DUTY

Law enforcement in the Founders’ time was a duty of every citizen.32 Citizens were expected to be armed and equipped to chase suspects on foot, on horse, or with wagon whenever summoned. And when called upon to enforce the laws of the state, citizens were to respond “not faintly and with lagging steps, but honestly and bravely and with whatever implements and facilities [were] convenient and at hand.“33 Any person could act in the capacity of a constable without being one,34 and when summoned by a law enforcement officer, a private person became a temporary member of the police department.35 The law also presumed that any person acting in his public capacity as an officer was rightfully appointed.36

Speakup on June 23, 2011 at 5:19 PM

So MadCon, is that a glock in your pocket, or are you happy to see me? :) welcome to the fray.

upinak on June 23, 2011 at 5:19 PM

I wish Texas had Constitutional carry. Of all the states you’d think would have it, we don’t.

Congrats to Wisconsin, though!

catmman on June 23, 2011 at 5:20 PM

The school zone issue is strange. When I grew up in Columbus, Ohio in the late 60s, early 70s, we used to brings guns to my suburban Catholic school in the trunks of the cars to go hunting after school. No one thought anything of it. Of course, most of the nuns grew up in rural Southeastern Pa.

On Wisconsin.

AcidReflux on June 23, 2011 at 5:23 PM

Bishop just fired up the Harley and is heading East…
Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:11 PM

Don’t have to, we here in Minnesota joined the civilized world back in 2003. Besides, even with CC, Wisconsin is still the Bangladesh of the United States (though Bangladesh has better water).

MadCon can now carry his ladies AirLite .25 and swagger down the mud streets of Kenosha.

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:25 PM

Congrats MadCon…welcome to the land of the free.

I know it wasn’t perfect, but one step at a time.

A suggestion about the school issue:

Introduce legislation to hold schools liable if anyone is ever harmed due to their lack of ability to carry near one.

fossten on June 23, 2011 at 5:26 PM

I remember when we got “Controlled Carry” here in Florida, it was said there would be shootouts in the streets. Needless to say, Florida did not become the “Wild West”, but safer because the Thugs never know who is packing and think twice about who to attack on the street. Congratulations Wisconsin!

hpk1942 on June 23, 2011 at 5:28 PM

Just a quick correction: New Hampshire doesn’t have pure 2nd amendment freedom. The legislature passed a good Castle Doctrine bill yesterday by a veto-proof majority, but the compromise stripped out the provision that would have eliminated the need for a carry permit.

RedMindBlueState on June 23, 2011 at 5:30 PM

A couple of months ago, activists were energized at the concept that Wisconsin would join the rank of Alaska, Wyoming, Arizona, and New Hampshire in having pure Second Amendment freedom

You forgot Vermont.

Socratease on June 23, 2011 at 5:32 PM

More good news for Wisconsin! Congratulations!

Additional congrats on the front pager, MC. :)

Bee on June 23, 2011 at 5:34 PM

Very good news!!!

bernzright777 on June 23, 2011 at 5:34 PM

we here in Minnesota joined the civilized world back in 2003.
Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:25 PM

Maybe up the 94 corridor you are, but here in the Cities – well, two words: RT Rybek.

Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:41 PM

I’m wondering what is going to happen, as the TSA begins expanding searches to bus stations, trains and the highways, (which they have this past week) … what it’s going to be like the first time some TSA stooge pats down some guy legally carrying. I can imagine what is going to happen…. the TSA guy screams “He’s got a gun!” Even if the law abiding citizen informs TSA ahead of time, “He’s got a gun!” is going to be standard operating procedure.

JellyToast on June 23, 2011 at 5:43 PM

Maybe up the 94 corridor you are, but here in the Cities – well, two words: RT Rybek.
Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:41 PM

Is there some city law I don’t know about, I thought CC was state/county jurisdiction?

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:46 PM

Nelsen proclaims his broad ignorance about football during the year the THIRTEEN TIME WORLD CHAMPION GREEN BAY PACKERS are finding proper display locations for their SUPER BOWL RINGS!

As stated by RedMindBlueState, we in NH have a concealed carry permit requirement but it is accompanied by what is generally a ‘must issue’ law.
In other words, very hard to deny.
Congrats to WI on the law changes, and let’s make REPEAT the goal in Green Bay!

HammerNH on June 23, 2011 at 5:47 PM

Finally, the people of Wisconsin have the ability to defend their lives, their families, and their property.

Not only from criminals … but also against thuggish union members who seem to be getting more and more aggressive all the time.

darwin on June 23, 2011 at 5:48 PM

Maybe this will reduce some of those shooting sprees in Milwaukee. When only the bad guys have guns, they can do pretty much whatever they want.

I never did understand the logic that says letting the law abiding people have guns would increase gun crimes. Criminals ignore gun bans anyway. Because they’re criminals.

crosspatch on June 23, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Good article, but you really should give this guy some props for writing about it first in the Green Room

Seriously, though congrats! It’s one large step closer towards the Constitutional carry, and a great improvement over the existing law.

Hopefully, that issue of school zoning can be fixed, too, since it seems like a well organized trap at the moment.

Sadly, in NY, I’m lucky to still be able to play Duck Hunt for the NES without needing a permit (but I don’t want to give them any ideas)

DrAllecon on June 23, 2011 at 5:52 PM

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:46 PM

I could be wrong, but I’m thinkin’ the city council passed some kind of CC ban.

I think RT ran on repeal, too.

Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:56 PM

Mark Belling is an ignorant idiot who subs for Rush periodically but isn’t much of a Conservative. What can Rush be thinking?!?!

SilentWatcher on June 23, 2011 at 6:01 PM

Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:56 PM

I would check into that, Hennepin County issues the permits so I don’t believe MPLS can outlaw them.

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 6:05 PM

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:46 PM

I could be wrong, but I’m thinkin’ the city council passed some kind of CC ban.

I think RT ran on repeal, too.

Bruno Strozek on June 23, 2011 at 5:56 PM

In the State of Minnesota local laws cannot limit the right to carry with a permit (called “Permit to Carry” in MN not CCW, although you can do either with a permit).

infidel on June 23, 2011 at 6:08 PM

Good place to go for MN info on carrying:

http://www.deftac.com/intel-faq.html

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 6:08 PM

infidel on June 23, 2011 at 6:08 PM

Meant to say a “Permit to Carry” in Minnesota allows you to carry open or concealed.

infidel on June 23, 2011 at 6:11 PM

I’m wondering what is going to happen, as the TSA begins expanding searches to bus stations, trains and the highways, (which they have this past week) … what it’s going to be like the first time some TSA stooge pats down some guy legally carrying. I can imagine what is going to happen…. the TSA guy screams “He’s got a gun!” Even if the law abiding citizen informs TSA ahead of time, “He’s got a gun!” is going to be standard operating procedure.

JellyToast on June 23, 2011 at 5:43 PM

I was thinking about that this morning. Volatile situation to be sure when the TSA tries to get out there on the open road and randomly stop people at roadblocks.

I predict a massive shootout, maybe several, then the TSA will cower back in airport terminals where they are ‘safe’.

Does anyone in the USA, going to the grocery store, work, the gym, want to be stopped at any hour of the nite or day and be given a PAT DOWN by the TSA?????

WTF ARE WE PUTTING UP WITH THIS????

orbitalair on June 23, 2011 at 6:12 PM

Here in Maryland, I can only be jealous. Although, I’ll take solace in the fact that we still have it better than Illinois.

Anna on June 23, 2011 at 6:19 PM

“wild west shootouts in the streets”

Yeah, I’ve seen a lot of those on the streets of Cheyenne and Laramie – not.

I checked the SchoolShooting.org site, and tried to compare the open carry states with everyone else. Frankly, there really aren’t enough school shootings to be able to tell.

New Hampshire has had one, Wyoming one, Alaska zero, and Arizona 5. For Arizona, one was domestic violence, a man killing his estranged wife and himself, the rest were gang-related, most of them Hispanic. I suspect that with stronger border control, most of those wouldn’t have happened.

Does anyone really think that criminals intent on shooting kids in school would have obeyed the carry laws anyway? Not likely.

Common Sense on June 23, 2011 at 6:22 PM

infidel on June 23, 2011 at 6:11 PM

Good correction, I read where open carry w/o permit in MN is prohibited in all public places.

bernzright777 on June 23, 2011 at 6:24 PM

Remember when Feinstein said the streets would run red with blood when the Assault Weapon Ban ended?

Not two months ago, she was beating the drums for AWB renewal because of ‘all the guns going across the border into Mexico’. Anyone asked her lately how that’s been working out?

Oh, yeah, THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION had a lot to do with that.

The same administration that says we “have a duty to protect” the people of Libya. Not so much the people of Mexico.

GarandFan on June 23, 2011 at 6:25 PM

Don’t have to, we here in Minnesota joined the civilized world back in 2003. Besides, even with CC, Wisconsin is still the Bangladesh of the United States (though Bangladesh has better water).

Bishop on June 23, 2011 at 5:25 PM

Up in Minnesota you need to carry to be able to bring down your state bird the Mosquito…

WhoU4 on June 23, 2011 at 6:26 PM

Here in Maryland, I can only be jealous. Although, I’ll take solace in the fact that we still have it better than Illinois.

Anna on June 23, 2011 at 6:19 PM

Anna, come on down to VA for godsakes :)

bernzright777 on June 23, 2011 at 6:26 PM

Congratulations Wisconsin. Now start recognizing out of state permits, castle doctrine and stand your ground laws. Illinois is the only sh!thole left, what a surprise. Kansas has a fairly well written law as does Florida, try to copy the best of the best laws for your own.

MJZZZ on June 23, 2011 at 5:08 PM

One of those was already addressed – out-of-state permits from states that have similar permitting requirements as Wisconsin (which is based on Florida’s concealed-carry law) will be valid in Wisconsin.

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 6:30 PM

We’ve got the Cubs, Quinn and no concealed carry. Illinois, leading from behind.

Fallon on June 23, 2011 at 6:32 PM

DrAllecon on June 23, 2011 at 5:52 PM

Actually, this came out of the Green Room; note the green title, the MadisonConservative name in the byline, and the link back to the original Green Room post.

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 6:33 PM

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 6:30 PM

Better yet, didn’t see that.

bernzright777 on June 23, 2011 at 6:33 PM

I can’t understand why we here in Texas of all places don’t yet have no permit CC or better yet open carry. I keep a piece in the car at all times, but I refuse to pay for the privilege of filling out a bunch of paperwork, sitting in a class to “learn” how to safely handle something I grew up handling, and then being subjected to an in depth check on my by who knows who. No thanks, until they do away with the permit BS I’ll just have to leave mine in the car…and be prepared to sue the shiite out of the gov for not protecting me while I was away from my car.(Yes I know you can’t sue the gov. for that…and that brings up another rant entirely!Hah!)

BadMojo on June 23, 2011 at 6:47 PM

We were stationed in Virginia a few years back. Had to move due to military orders. We live in my husband’s hometown, and he’s getting out in a week. I wish we could move back south of the Potomic, but with the likelihood of where my husband will be working (Ft. Meade), the commute would be killer. Le sigh.

Anna on June 23, 2011 at 6:48 PM

We’ve got the Cubs, Quinn and no concealed carry. Illinois, leading from behind.

Fallon on June 23, 2011 at 6:32 PM
And no death penalty! Quinn, Durbin, Madigan, Mayor Rahm running businesses out of the State and welcoming Fleabaggers and criminals with open arms!! Hmmm… were did Obama keep a Senate seat warm?

shov74 on June 23, 2011 at 6:54 PM

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 6:30 PM

Read the law last night but did not see any part of “shall issue”. CA has CC but it’s a joke as only PC need apply. Maybe I missed something? /XX crossed fingers

Caststeel on June 23, 2011 at 6:56 PM

Seems that the idea of packing heat worries an odd assortment: criminals, Liberals and the police.

Dr. ZhivBlago on June 23, 2011 at 7:02 PM

I never did understand the logic that says letting the law abiding people have guns would increase gun crimes.

crosspatch on June 23, 2011 at 5:49 PM

Liberals don’t see law-abiding people with guns as a normal part of society, they see us as a threat to their plan to control society.

infidel4life on June 23, 2011 at 7:02 PM

HammerNH on June 23, 2011 at 5:47 PM

I still don’t like em.

And I will be back in the state of Wisconsin this weeekend watching my Twins sweep through Milwaukee.

Nelsen on June 23, 2011 at 7:08 PM

Here in Maryland, I can only be jealous. Although, I’ll take solace in the fact that we still have it better than Illinois.

Anna on June 23, 2011 at 6:19 PM

QFT. Any place where an emotionally traumatizing event is more justification for packing concealed than years of weapons training needs some serious work.

And yes, being a victim of physical or sexual assault is more likely to get you a CCW Permit than years of military training. I’ve already been turned down for my concealed carry permit. I can try against next calender year.

Sgt Steve on June 23, 2011 at 7:11 PM

The ultimate sign of intolerance: conservatives aren’t afraid of liberals packing heat, but liberals are afraid of conservatives packing heat.

Knott Buyinit on June 23, 2011 at 7:17 PM

Knott Buyinit on June 23, 2011 at 7:17 PM

This.

bernzright777 on June 23, 2011 at 7:20 PM

Three Cheers to Wisconsin and Wisconsinites!

Congrats to Mad Con.

We may not agree on much, but we can at least agree on this.

Oh, and dissolve the BATFE. Permanently…

rightwingyahooo on June 23, 2011 at 7:28 PM

Congrats to Wisconsin. Welcome aboard.

BTW my consignment of S. B. Gun Oil just arrived.

Caststeel on June 23, 2011 at 7:51 PM

Add Hawaii to the NOT list.
Although the state passed a CCP it has NOT issued a single permit.
NONE

SERFER62 on June 23, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Actually, this came out of the Green Room; note the green title, the MadisonConservative name in the byline, and the link back to the original Green Room post.

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 6:33 PM

I was kidding MadCon a little. When an article in the main blog covers a topic a Green Room writer has written about, he’ll often post a link back to the Green Room post (if it’s not linked to in the main blog, which it isn’t always).

I thought I covered it with the “Seriously though” in the next line, but no one ever accused me of having a particularly awesome sense of humor ;)

DrAllecon on June 23, 2011 at 8:01 PM

Just a quick correction: New Hampshire doesn’t have pure 2nd amendment freedom. The legislature passed a good Castle Doctrine bill yesterday by a veto-proof majority, but the compromise stripped out the provision that would have eliminated the need for a carry permit.

RedMindBlueState on June 23, 2011 at 5:30 PM

You forgot Vermont.

Socratease on June 23, 2011 at 5:32 PM

Ugh, sorry. I always get NH and Vermont mixed up as to which has Constitutional Carry.

MadisonConservative on June 23, 2011 at 8:33 PM

I thought I covered it with the “Seriously though” in the next line, but no one ever accused me of having a particularly awesome sense of humor ;)

DrAllecon on June 23, 2011 at 8:01 PM

It’s not your sense of humor (which I’m sure is pretty good) that’s the issue; it’s the inability of just about everybody to accurately portray that on the ‘net.

Steve Eggleston on June 23, 2011 at 9:06 PM

Unfortunately, it wasn’t enough to keep them from deciding permits and minimal training would be necessary. The requirements are still significantly less stringent than a lot of states, but it was a blow to those who hoped that Wisconsin was taking a sharp turn to the right.

Wouldn’t be too depressed over this. Arizona has had open carry for a long time, but only last year passed Constitutional Carry for concealed carry. These things take time.

You are going to have a breathless media looking for something that will make the law look bad. First case of a use of a firearm will be attempted to be portrayed as “wild west shootout”.

After crime numbers don’t go up (probably will go down), and there is not open gunplay, the libs will be shown for the fools they are and then more freedom can be pushed.

AZfederalist on June 23, 2011 at 10:11 PM

If they Regained their 2nd Amendment Rights they would not have to have a Permit…

So no they have not regained their rights, they just have been given back the option of carrying a gun should the government approve of them doing so….

the_ancient on June 23, 2011 at 5:05 PM

Sadly, yes.

tom on June 23, 2011 at 10:35 PM

Good.

Sherman1864 on June 24, 2011 at 1:03 AM

We’ve got the Cubs, Quinn and no concealed carry. Illinois, leading from behind.

Fallon on June 23, 2011 at 6:32 PM

When the Cubs are the least offensive thing about Illinois, you know you’ve got problems (native of Galesburg and believer that Ron Santo got hosed). As a Hoosier for the past three decades, I’m mostly happy with our shall-issue licensed open carry system although I still choose to carry concealed (I just hate it when people stare at me – I can’t get past that).

SKYFOX on June 24, 2011 at 6:07 AM

Nelson – Any truth to the rumor that the NFL may try putting a PROFESSIONAL football team in Minnesota?

Didn’t think so.
No more likely than needing a security guard for the viQueen trophy room. Maybe in another 50 years…

HammerNH on June 24, 2011 at 11:00 AM

Ultimately, this is a victory with one casualty: Constitutional Carry. A couple of months ago, activists were energized at the concept that Wisconsin would join the rank of Alaska, Wyoming, Arizona, and New Hampshire in having pure Second Amendment freedom: open and concealed carry anywhere, without a permit.

But as the supreme said, some restrictions are legal. And this would easily be one of them. GOOD for Wisconsin residents. It’s about DAMN time this happened, as long as it SHAL-ISSUE.

49 other states may have this, but only 38 or so of them actually ISSUE the license, the rest wont unless your chuck schumer, or have a NEED.

Open-carry? Thats just dumb for an average person to do. Unless you are working as a security guard, an officer on duty etc, open-carrying your gun so everyone can see it, removes the element of surprise and makes you an immediate target.

Criminals don’t open-carry their guns for the same reason, SURPRISE, so why would anyone want to, other than those ” on duty ” as stated above, want to have a target on their back?

tx2654 on June 24, 2011 at 12:37 PM

I can’t even own a pistol without a permit in NY state,and good luck with the permit.

heshtesh on June 23, 2011 at 5:19 PM

One big reason I would never live there. I’d feel like I was in prison. We Texans have a much lower tollerance for too damn many rules like there.

saiga on June 24, 2011 at 1:59 PM

Open-carry? Thats just dumb for an average person to do. Unless you are working as a security guard, an officer on duty etc, open-carrying your gun so everyone can see it, removes the element of surprise and makes you an immediate target.

tx2654 on June 24, 2011 at 12:37 PM

That’s your opinion. Meanwhile, until now, open carry has been the only legal way to carry in the State of Wisconsin, and many, including myself, have been open carrying for a while. If not for the open carry movement over the last few years, we would likely not have gotten this far. So, no, open carry is not “dumb” in any way, though I do realize some people hold this incredibly elitist view.

MadisonConservative on June 24, 2011 at 3:32 PM