Why Veena Malik’s smackdown of a mullah was a seminal moment for feminism

posted at 3:00 pm on April 2, 2011 by Susannah Fleetwood

[This week], Allahpundit picked up the story of gorgeous Pakistani actress, Veena Malik, courageously going off on an Egyptian Mullah who accused her of “immorality” because he didn’t approve of her appearance, or the fact that that she appeared on an Indian equivalent of the television show Big Brother. Jonah Goldberg was the first major blogger to report on this story, and it has been all over the right-wing blogosphere ever since. So, what makes this a possible seminal moment for feminism instead of just another viral video? Well…several things.

First of all, the liberal mainstream media has hardly been chomping at the bit to report any story regarding Islamic violence towards women. For example, when Time magazine featured a cover with a picture of a woman whose face had been disfigured by the Taliban, The New York Times called it “war porn” (see the image below).

Furthermore, when an Iranian woman was sentenced to be stoned to death last summer, and when a fourteen year old Bangladeshi girl was recently lashed to death for being raped by her cousin, you could pretty much hear crickets from the MSM because those were pesky, politically incorrect stories that didn’t fit their multicultural narrative. (Not to mention, you probably won’t hear that much about the woman who was recently raped by Gaddafi’s thugs in Libya either.)

Second of all, liberals seem to have an overwhelming tendency to downplay Islamic abuses towards women (as well as towards gays) under the guise of multiculturalism. Don’t believe me? Well, then I suggest that you read the column by liberal Boston Globe columnist Susan Jacoby where she asks the question, “Why are liberals excusing religious abuses on grounds of cultural relativism?” To be specific, Jacoby makes some great points when she writes the following:

The latest example of the Left’s blind spot on this issue is the antagonism of so many liberal reviewers toward Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s recent memoir, Nomad. The Somali-born Hirsi Ali immigrated to the United States in 2006 after her close friend, the Dutch film director Theo Van Gogh, was murdered by a radical Islamist. Hirsi Ali still needs bodyguards because of frequent death threats.

She was educated as a child in Muslim schools, subjected to genital mutilation, and broke with her family when she refused to consent to an arranged marriage. She first settled in Holland, where she worked as a Somali-Dutch interpreter, and her convictions about violence in many (though not, she emphasizes, all) Muslim families are rooted in her work with immigrants as well as her own upbringing. Yet Nicholas D. Kristof, reviewing Nomad for The New York Times Book Review, writes that “I couldn’t help thinking that perhaps Hirsi Ali’s family is dysfunctional simply because its members never learned to bite their tongues and just say to one another: ‘I love you.’”

I was startled by this patronizing comment, because I admire Kristof for being one of the few male columnists who writes frequently about violence against women. Somehow, “I love you” isn’t the first thing that would come to mind if I were being held down by female relatives while my clitoris was maimed or if my father told me I had to marry a stranger.

Moreover, Jacoby really finished off her column with a bang when she shared the following anecdote:

An 80-year-old friend of mine — a woman of forceful intellect who used to teach Renaissance history — now lives in a Florida retirement community where many of the part-time staff are teenaged children of recent Afghan immigrants. When my friend saw one of her favorite young Afghan-American women — a high school senior — weeping in the dining room, she asked what was wrong. “Oh, madam professor,” the girl replied, “my father has arranged for me to meet my future husband. He is 40 years old, and the wedding will take place in six months. I wanted so much to go to college, and this will not be permitted.

My friend replied gently, “You know, Yasmin, you don’t have to marry anyone in this country because your parents say so. There are organizations to help girls like you think these things through. There are college scholarships. I can give you the names of people to talk to.” Another resident of this community sharply reproved my friend, saying, “We have no right to interfere with her culture, her religion, her family,”

Wrong. This type of “interference” — telling a troubled young woman that she has choices other than an arranged marriage — is exactly what a true liberal ought to be doing. The idea that someone should ignore the tears of a 17-year-old who says she is being pushed to give up her education is utterly perverse.

Now, if you still aren’t satisfied, here is another example of liberal moral relativism with regard to radical Islam’s abuses towards women (as well as gays). Da Tech Guy wrote an excellent column titled, “You can tell a lot about a person by what they bold when quoting”. First, Da Tech guy demonstrated what liberal blogger, Matthew Yglesias, thought was important enough to put in bold type when he quoted Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s writings in her New York Times column about the Egyptian revolution:

I’ll tell you why: because Islam is the new fascism. Just like Nazism started with Hitler’s vision, the Islamic vision is a caliphate – a society ruled by Sharia law – in which women who have sex before marriage are stoned to death, homosexuals are beaten, and apostates like me are killed. Sharia law is as inimical to liberal democracy as Nazism. Young Muslims need to be persuaded that the vision of the Prophet Mohammed is a bad one, and you aren’t going to get that in Islamic faith schools.

Next, Da Tech re-pastes the exact same quote from the exact same column, but puts in bold type what he finds to be important in Ms. Ali’s column:

I’ll tell you why: because Islam is the new fascism. Just like Nazism started with Hitler’s vision, the Islamic vision is a caliphate – a society ruled by Sharia law – in which women who have sex before marriage are stoned to death, homosexuals are beaten, and apostates like me are killed. Sharia law is as inimical to liberal democracy as Nazism. Young Muslims need to be persuaded that the vision of the Prophet Mohammed is a bad one, and you aren’t going to get that in Islamic faith schools.

Nifty little trick ain’t it? Furthermore, it’s pretty telling that Mr. Yglesias found Ms. Ali’s supposed “intolerance” to be the most bothersome part of that passage, whereas the rest of us find the whole stoning of women and beating of gays to the most troublesome part. (Oh, but best not to mention that politically incorrect line, because then you have just officially sinned on the liberal alter of multiculturalism.)

And finally, the ultimate examples of liberals downplaying the Islamic abuses of women are Naomi Wolf writing a column about how sexy the burka is, and Amanda Marcotte (she of “Godbag Christofascist” fame) writing that the traditional Western wedding is comparable in misogynist tradition to female genital mutilation. (I’m not kidding.)

Now, the third and final reason why Veena Malik’s smackdown of an Egyptian cleric is a seminal moment for feminism is because the liberal MSM tends not to air the voices of Muslim women who don’t parrot their talking points. For instance, during the Ground Zero Mosque brouhaha, moderate Mulsim, Neda Bolourchi (whose mother was killed in 9/11), wrote a column in The Washington Post titled, “Build Your Mosque Somewhere Else”–needless to say, she was never invited on any MSM outlets/talk-shows. Not to mention, the liberal MSM has hardly rolled out the welcome wagon for Ayaan Hirsi Ali either. Furthermore, when moderate Muslim, Raheel Raza, was speaking out against the Ground Zero Mosque and calling it “a slap in the face to all Americans”, only conservative talk show hosts, like Bill O’Reilly and Sean Hannity, would have her on as a guest.

So, when a Muslim woman from a Muslim country feels free to, you know, actually speak her mind without the threat of stoning when attacked by a real misogynist for her appearance, does she talk about how awful the “Godbag Christofascists” are…or how much better FGM is to endure than a wedding ceremony…or how sexy the burka is…or how racist America is for not wanting the Ground Zero Mosque? Well, not exactly. When Veena Malik gets really fired up at around 3:00 into the embed below, she let’s loose about how people are “killing in the name of Islam”, how the politicians in Pakistan are “committing murder, bribery and theft”, and how clerics are “raping children in the mosques in Pakistan”. Then, Ms. Malik really handed that cleric his arse when she told him that “Pakistan is infamous for many reasons other than Veena Malik”. In other words, she looked like she had absolutely no interest in donning a burka, but a lot of interest in her country not being overrun by true misogyny, corruption and violence.

In conclusion, I think that David Frum hit it out of the park in his excellent column titled, “Feminists need to admit that Western men are not the enemy”, when he wrote the following:

A generation ago, feminists could romanticize non-Western misogyny from a safe distance. In 1984, the Australian feminist Germaine Greer published a book, Sex and Destiny, denouncing birth control as a Western plot against Third World women. But since the 1980s, a great movement of populations has erased the distinction between the First World and the Third. Europe now receives more immigrants than does the United States. European cities are now crowded with hijabs and burkas. European police investigate honour killings. European hospitals confront female genital mutilations.

And these things all happen in North America, too, albeit to a lesser degree.

On this 100th International Women’s Day, the challenge for feminists has become both imperative and anguishing: Will they argue forever against American television sitcoms of the 1950s — or are they morally and intellectually capable of recognizing the dangers to women’s aspirations in the 21st century? Can they transcend their inherited ideology, and recognize that the best and only guarantee of women’s equality is Western liberal democratic capitalism? Will they accept critics of Third World misogyny — such as Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Irshad Manji — into the pantheon of feminism along with Mary Wollstonecraft, Susan B. Anthony and Simone de Beauvoir? Can they perceive that the people who would destroy Israel hate women even more than they hate Jews?

In short, can they accept that the irony of history has reoriented feminism into a fundamentally conservative movement? Or will their inherited ideological prejudices entrap them forever in a vanished world — dooming feminism to obsolescence and subjecting the dwindling rights of women to the aggressions of “multiculturalism”?

In other words, those nasty “Godbag Christofascists” aren’t the ones trying to suppress the rights of women all over the world; however, radical and fundamentalist Muslim clerics, like the one yelling at Veena Malik, are. Someone needed to finally get angry and say–nay, shout–what everyone (except the liberal MSM) has known to be true for a long time.

Thank you Veena Malik for having the courage and forbearance–even in the face of death threats–to shout out the truth.

Cross-posted at Parcbench, The Minority Report, and Right Wing News.

This post was promoted from GreenRoom to HotAir.com with minor edits by Ed Morrissey.
To see the comments on the original post, look here.


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A Muslim woman on TV once suggested that a conversation between Muslims often ends up in shouting. As in this case. And you have to wonder, what kind of level, what kind of standard for discourse is that? How about discussing issues in a normal tone of voice? Is that beyond their culture?

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 3:02 PM

Saw it, liked it, loved it, respected it.

Snake307 on April 2, 2011 at 3:05 PM

Wrong. This type of “interference” — telling a troubled young woman that she has choices other than an arranged marriage — is exactly what a true liberal ought to be doing. The idea that someone should ignore the tears of a 17-year-old who says she is being pushed to give up her education is utterly perverse.

Lefties are neither liberal, nor progressive, nor democratic, just thugs. They hijacked the terms.

crr6, come in here and defend all that has been written, you weasel. This is way more important than your legalese posturing.

Schadenfreude on April 2, 2011 at 3:12 PM

Excellent.

MikeknaJ on April 2, 2011 at 3:13 PM

A Muslim woman on TV once suggested that a conversation between Muslims often ends up in shouting. As in this case. And you have to wonder, what kind of level, what kind of standard for discourse is that?

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 3:02 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

excellent post.

sarainitaly on April 2, 2011 at 3:20 PM

Outstanding post!

When I watched her video debate with this “cleric”, it brought tears to my eyes. She is so beautiful and so brave and so confident in her beliefs that Human Rights trump the oppression of islamic hell.

She is an amazing woman and I hope she remains safe; perhaps in America where she can be a force for Freedom. Where the islamic women who are bound with the chains of the islam can find hope, and life, through her message.

She is brave. I would protect her at any cost.

Key West Reader on April 2, 2011 at 3:25 PM

Links are scrubbed on You Tube

Can you please re-post the original?

Key West Reader on April 2, 2011 at 3:28 PM

It’s important realize that here in America, there is an open campaign of lies and smears against the people of Israel. It is being carried out on American universities.

The media either ignores or blames the victims of Islamic violence, as Melanie Phillips point out.

Just like in Ed’s previous posts, where unions bully people into complying to their brand of tyranny, the islamist that carries out violence and murder, is glorified and used as a method to intimate people. When confronted with the truth, the islamist will resort to violence as seen from Penn State University on April 1, 2011.

It’s one thing for an islamic cleric to bully a woman and threaten her, it’s another thing for the media, liberals and so called feminists completely ignore these acts of violence. And not just against women, bet against all peoples that don’t bend to islamic rule.

Whoopi Goldberg and the girls on the view can ignore the problem with islamic oppression and violence, but people need to see it, before it takes hold here in America.

We already have Judges complying to Sharia Law. How much more do you need to see?

Kini on April 2, 2011 at 3:35 PM

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 3:02 PM

Ahhh, the ‘ol “Can’t we all just get along” Gambit.

Seems like a simple ‘dialogue’ with psychotic Muhammadans would be a tad counter-productive.

catmman on April 2, 2011 at 3:47 PM

can they accept that the irony of history has reoriented feminism into a fundamentally conservative movement?

No.

will their inherited ideological prejudices entrap them forever in a vanished world

Yes.

is feminism doomed to obsolescence and subjecting the dwindling rights of women to the aggressions of “multiculturalism”?

Yes.

Because like Leftists everywhere, in every generation, the only thing that matters is WHAT THEY WANT. These are the same people who have insisted for decades that “right” and “wrong” don’t exist, those are just “mad-made ideas”.

[25]…everyone did what was right in his own eyes. Judges 21:25

If you interested, you might also pick up the prophet Jeremiah in chapter 6. I’ve edited this, but it’s applicable to our nation, today so you should read it yourself rather than trusting my paraphrase. Like ancient Israel, we’ve been blessed and we’ve blown it.

Thus says the LORD of hosts:
[10] To whom shall I speak and give warning,
that they may hear?
they cannot listen;
behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn;
they take no pleasure in it.
[11] Therefore I am full of the wrath of the LORD;
I am weary of holding it in.
“Pour it out upon the children in the street,
and upon the gatherings of young men, also;
both husband and wife shall be taken,
the elderly and the very aged.
[12] Their houses shall be turned over to others,
their fields and wives together,
for I will stretch out my hand
against the inhabitants of the land,”
declares the LORD.
[13] “For from the least to the greatest of them,
everyone is greedy for unjust gain;
and from prophet to priest,
everyone deals falsely.
[14] They have healed the wound of my people lightly,
saying, ‘Peace, peace,’
when there is no peace.
[15] Were they ashamed when they committed abomination?
No, they were not at all ashamed;
they did not know how to blush.
Therefore they shall fall among those who fall;
at the time that I punish them, they shall be overthrown,”
says the LORD.
(Jeremiah 6:9-15 ESV)

oldleprechaun on April 2, 2011 at 3:53 PM

Nice blog post. What unites the Left and the Muslims is their hatred of Christianity. How else can someone explain what has been described above?

pearson on April 2, 2011 at 3:57 PM

Thanks so much Ed for the FP promotion–I really appreciate you!! You’re the bomb!

Take care, and have a nice weekend. :-)

X0X0, Suzi

PS–Thanks so much to all of the Hot Air commenters here, and in The Green Room, for their kind words.

Susannah Fleetwood on April 2, 2011 at 4:07 PM

Strong post. I saw this video yesteday and was blown away by her courage, character and conviction.

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 4:07 PM

+1000 to Susannah! Loved what you brought to the table here. Should have been promoted sooner, but better late than……

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 4:11 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

I take it you’ve never seen Queef Uberman?

cableguy615 on April 2, 2011 at 4:15 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

I take it that you can’t take it when anybody gets excoriated for his behavior who isn’t a member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy?

Aitch748 on April 2, 2011 at 4:25 PM

Could you imagine the absolute meltdown if she turned up on Fox with her own show…

wldfowlr on April 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

By all means, let’s bring Bill O’Reilly into the picture!!!

No big fan of his, but pretty sure he would condemn the behavior of them Muslim men who see fit to condemn Malik.

MeatHeadinCA on April 2, 2011 at 4:44 PM

^them=the

MeatHeadinCA on April 2, 2011 at 4:45 PM

Could you imagine the absolute meltdown if she turned up on Fox with her own show…

wldfowlr on April 2, 2011 at 4:27 PM

By closeted Muslim men or Jerry Rivers?

MeatHeadinCA on April 2, 2011 at 4:58 PM

She. Is. So. HOT.

KMC1 on April 2, 2011 at 5:00 PM

No big fan of his, but pretty sure he would condemn the behavior of them Muslim men who see fit to condemn Malik.

MeatHeadinCA on April 2, 2011 at 4:44 PM

So do I, and I’m not hearing a lot of defense of that dude from the left either.

I was responding to someone who said that Muslims always seem to end up shouting. I don’t think that’s a fair point, we have plenty of shouters of our own and they’re the ones who get the most attention.

Imagine what Muslims would think of the state of political discourse in America if all they heard was Glenn Beck, O’Reilly, Sean Hannity, Keith Olbermann, and Ed Schultz.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 5:11 PM

“Establishment” Feminism is about as obsolete and useful as traveling cross country in a covered wagon. The New Feminism is the hope of the women of the world. Hopefully our MSM and all the elites will wake up to that!!

DL13 on April 2, 2011 at 5:18 PM

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 5:11 PM

What dude from the left?

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 5:20 PM

Establishment” Feminism is about as obsolete and useful as traveling cross country in a covered wagon. The New Feminism is the hope of the women of the world. Hopefully our MSM and all the elites will wake up to that!!

DL13 on April 2, 2011 at 5:18 PM

+1

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 5:32 PM

I was responding to someone who said that Muslims always seem to end up shouting. I don’t think that’s a fair point, we have plenty of shouters of our own and they’re the ones who get the most attention.

First of all, I don’t think you and I are on the same “side” so I don’t know what “of our own” means. Secondly, even if it’s unfair to claim all Muslims shout, what good does it do to point out that “our own” shout as well? Thirdly, if I look at your point, I’d counter by saying that the type of shouting exhibited by the likes of Bill O’Reilly is much more civil and lighthearted compared to that demonstrated by above “holy man.” Finally, if you must compare “our own” to Muslims, look at the data. How many American non-Muslims go on violent rampages because books are burned, women go on television, or someone loses their virginity? Are you more disturbed by the violent trends of Muslims or American non-Muslims? BTW, you aren’t American are you?

Imagine what Muslims would think of the state of political discourse in America if all they heard was Glenn Beck, O’Reilly, Sean Hannity, Keith Olbermann, and Ed Schultz.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 5:11 PM

I think they’d believe America was too liberal (and not in the political party sense of the word).

MeatHeadinCA on April 2, 2011 at 5:42 PM

Strong post. I saw this video yesteday and was blown away by her courage, character and conviction.

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 4:07 PM

Hear hear! I pray for the Lord to protect this brave woman!

MCGIRV on April 2, 2011 at 6:23 PM

A Muslim woman on TV once suggested that a conversation between Muslims often ends up in shouting. As in this case. And you have to wonder, what kind of level, what kind of standard for discourse is that? How about discussing issues in a normal tone of voice? Is that beyond their culture?

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 3:02 PM

As this is the case? A Muslim woman makes an assertion on TV and it becomes the truth? Please. Have you ever been to a predominately Muslim country? Have you ever worked with Muslims? I can ensure you that with the countless Muslim members of the Saudi and Jordanian military I have worked with (outranked by all in most cases) that the woman you referenced is full of poop. Lastly, why even bring that up?

Shock the Monkey on April 2, 2011 at 6:32 PM

As this is the case? A Muslim woman makes an assertion on TV and it becomes the truth? Please. Have you ever been to a predominately Muslim country? Have you ever worked with Muslims? I can ensure you that with the countless Muslim members of the Saudi and Jordanian military I have worked with (outranked by all in most cases) that the woman you referenced is full of poop. Lastly, why even bring that up?

Shock the Monkey on April 2, 2011 at 6:32 PM

You think the woman in the video is full of sh!t?
Maybe I am misundersanding.

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 6:50 PM

When she is killed the media will make a 5 second note in passing.

And fail to mention Islam.

profitsbeard on April 2, 2011 at 7:05 PM

You think the woman in the video is full of sh!t?
Maybe I am misundersanding.

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 6:50 PM

No, that isn’t what he/she is saying, if I’ve understood the discussion. Shock was replying to something paul-cincy wrote about another muslim woman at another time lamenting how Muslim conversations resulted in shouting and then paul-cincy noted that the same happened in this video (shouting). Shock was disagreeing with the assessment, no? I don’t think anyone posting here thinks this woman, Veena Malik, is full of anything but awesome!

pannw on April 2, 2011 at 7:21 PM

As this is the case? A Muslim woman makes an assertion on TV and it becomes the truth? Please. Have you ever been to a predominately Muslim country? Have you ever worked with Muslims? I can ensure you that with the countless Muslim members of the Saudi and Jordanian military I have worked with (outranked by all in most cases) that the woman you referenced is full of poop. Lastly, why even bring that up?

Shock the Monkey on April 2, 2011 at 6:32 PM

To answer your questions:

I believe so, as each was yelling through most of the video.
It fits with what I observe, though it’s a generalization.
No.
No.
I bring it up because it’s hard to focus on the meaning of their words when they’re screaming at each other. As of today, I believe that’s a more common component of Muslim or Arab arguments (screaming at each other), because I see it more often there. I also believe people who argue with that amount of emotion and anger and volume and intensity may encourage others to approach these issues in the same way.
I think of the protests against the Danish cartoons, or against burning the Koran. There is what they seem to believe is righteous rage there. How about just making your point and not going off the deep end about it.

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 7:49 PM

Isn’t the fundie Pakistani, not Egyptian? His Urdu sounds native. Also, I find Malik rather annoying, like constantly stroking her hair while referring to herself in the third person during interviews and bragging about how she has a second house just for storing her 500 pairs of shoes and massive wardrobe. But she’s a Bollywood heroine wannabe, so I guess it’s par for the course.

Regardless, she delivered a well-deserved beatdown of the fundie creep and deserves an attagirl.

Christien on April 2, 2011 at 8:37 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

You almost have a point, but just because people yell at each other on almost all of the political talk/news shows we have, doesn’t mean that all of our normal conversations are like that. If they were, that would mean something else about us entirely.

As it is, the fact that entertainers yell, only proves that we find conflict entertaining. With a few exceptions, that’s not really abnormal for a culture.

That said, I have no idea if Muslims do often yell in normal conversation.

Esthier on April 2, 2011 at 8:39 PM

I never could, or will, understand why the same feminists who readily paint every other man as a potential rapist, aren’t DEMANDING that we blast any and all Islamic countries back to the Stone Age based solely on how they treat women.
Where’s your Take Back The Night for your sisters in the Middle East ? Or is it all just talk ?

teacherman on April 2, 2011 at 8:52 PM

Thank you for such a great post.

As Jim Quinn says, “Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of it’s stated intent”. I know that well, but your post highlights it in it’s most frightening realm.

“Liberalism is a mental disorder” also comes to mind.

Those who considered themselves feminists should have had the rug pulled out from under them when “Billy-Jeff” was up to his shenanigans in Ar-Kansas and in the White House.
When all the sudden they made excuses, I knew then feminism was done in the USA (and up for sale).

If there are still any feminists left today, they have so much LEGITIMATE work to do in Haiti, Congo and the Islamic World. Funny, where the hell are they?

Great post and one I hope we see more of a HA.

Gob on April 2, 2011 at 8:58 PM

teacherman on April 2, 2011 at 8:52 PM

Teach, your post reminded me of a great article recently by
Robin of Berkley.

It talks about how Liberals (sickly) size up victims and predators NOT by right or wrong, but by identity politics.

Gob on April 2, 2011 at 9:16 PM

Oh, and this one, too!

Gob on April 2, 2011 at 9:23 PM

You almost have a point, but just because people yell at each other on almost all of the political talk/news shows we have, doesn’t mean that all of our normal conversations are like that. If they were, that would mean something else about us entirely.

Sure, but we have no idea how regular conversations go between Muslims. We’re not seeing a representative sample. That was my point, which you obviously missed.

That said, I have no idea if Muslims do often yell in normal conversation.

Esthier on April 2, 2011 at 8:39 PM

Of course you don’t.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 9:39 PM

Is it possible for feminism to have a “seminal” anything?

Snaqwels on April 2, 2011 at 10:42 PM

Gob @ 9:16.
Thanks for the link. Revolting, isn’t it ?

teacherman on April 2, 2011 at 10:51 PM

I take it you’ve never seen the O’Reilly Factor?

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 3:15 PM

I’ve watched BOR most every weekday night for the last year and a half. You obviously haven’t. BOR still loses his temper and angrily yells at his guests like Rush is still fat. Some people are hopelessly mired in the past.

And some other people have a very difficult time, for no good reason, understanding why a discussion between a moderate Muslim and a conservative one is likely to end up in a yelling match. Wow, who could guess that a moderate Muslim female wouldn’t appreciate being told by a conservative Muslim that Muslim men are justified by Allah to value Muslim women as lower-class people.

Bizarro No. 1 on April 2, 2011 at 11:33 PM

I saw this video yesterday and was blown away by her courage, character and conviction.

KCB on April 2, 2011 at 4:07 PM

Ditto.

MEMRI does good work.

AshleyTKing on April 3, 2011 at 12:09 AM

So do I, and I’m not hearing a lot of defense of that dude from the left either.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 5:11 PM

That’s because the left is pretending that this never happened. Just like they pretend that real misogyny only exists in the Western world, and that it is not our place to question the barbaric customs of most Muslim countries. Of course the left doesn’t defend female genital mutilation, honor killings, forced marriages and rapes by Muslim men — they simply pretend it doesn’t ever happen.

holygoat on April 3, 2011 at 1:11 AM

Paul-Cincy on April 2, 2011 at 7:49 PM

I agree entirely. It would be great if people would just shut up, listen to each other and have a respectful debate.

Needless to say, shouting and arguing is not an Islamic trait. There are so many nationalities and ethnic groups that practice Islam which are completely different. Indonesians are different than Saudis, and Pakistanis are different from the Moros (MILF!) in the Phillipines, etc.

Shock the Monkey on April 3, 2011 at 2:12 AM

Wow! She’s Good!

I wish there were more people like her standing up for condemning what is more serious first, and not being cowered by a mullah (who appears to have mis-learned his religion) on TV.

Kevin K. on April 3, 2011 at 4:09 AM

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 5:11 PM

No, your point, and it’s obvious to everyone who posts on Hot Air except possibly you, is to take any and every conversation and give a moral equivalence in defense of liberalism.

You are the most liberal “Republican” I have ever heard or read.

hawkdriver on April 3, 2011 at 10:37 AM

hawkdriver, Proud Rino’s just another Copperhead wrapped in a RINO skin. Lying: it’s what liberals are.

SDN on April 3, 2011 at 11:20 AM

I wonder if the New York Slimes will still consider it “war porn” when this young woman shows up with her face burned away?

Which is all too likely no matter what country she tries to run to. Just ask the “Draw Mohammed Day” cartoonist.

Islam is incompatible with a civilized society. Period. Full stop. The only reason we don’t have more incidents like that Time photo in the US is that, like Mohammed in his early career, Muslims are well behaved until they’re sure they’re in charge.

SDN on April 3, 2011 at 11:24 AM

No, your point, and it’s obvious to everyone who posts on Hot Air except possibly you, is to take any and every conversation and give a moral equivalence in defense of liberalism.

You are the most liberal “Republican” I have ever heard or read.

hawkdriver on April 3, 2011 at 10:37 AM

It must be really easy to respond to my points when you decide what my points are, after I have to make it clear to even the most willfully obtuse commenter here, and only then do you address them. That’s a textbook straw man argument set-up.

In any event, I”m not drawing any kind of moral equivalency between these guys and Bill O’Reilly. I kind of like Bill O’Reilly. My point (AGAIN) is that it’s not fair to say, “This is how Muslims speak to each other” based on a few intervews between a few select people. You wouldn’t get a fair characterization of how Americans speak to each other based on the most popular cable news personalities either. That’s my point. It has nothing to do with anyone’s ideology.

I’m really surprised this is so difficult to understand.

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 11:35 AM

It must be really easy to respond to my points when you decide what my points are, after I have to make it clear to even the most willfully obtuse commenter here, and only then do you address them. That’s a textbook straw man argument set-up.

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 11:35 AM

You’re absolutely right, long-term, pathological behavioral patterns are all caused by the observer.

fronclynne on April 3, 2011 at 12:25 PM

Of course the left doesn’t defend female genital mutilation, honor killings, forced marriages and rapes by Muslim men — they simply pretend it doesn’t ever happen.

More precisely, they do not defend it — they attack anyone who criticizes it. They are, just as they were “anti-anti-communist”, the “anti-anti-genital mutilation” movement.

And “Proud Rino” — perhaps if you made yourself clearer, you wouldn’t all the time be misunderstood. Consider that the sole common factor in you constantly being at the center of “misunderstandings” is yourself.

Crawford on April 3, 2011 at 12:26 PM

I’m really surprised this is so difficult to understand.

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 11:35 AM

Color me obtuse as I freely admit I don’t “try to understand” a single thing you post anymore. Your track record of comments has me relegated to assuming your point is always, always to talk down to your fellow Republicans; we unwashed and unsophisticated Conservatives.

hawkdriver on April 3, 2011 at 12:28 PM

And “Proud Rino” — perhaps if you made yourself clearer, you wouldn’t all the time be misunderstood. Consider that the sole common factor in you constantly being at the center of “misunderstandings” is yourself.

Crawford on April 3, 2011 at 12:26 PM

I think my point was pretty clear, but I think some people willfully choose to misunderstand what I’m saying (hawkdriver just admitted to as much) and others assume that, because I might be critical of something a conservative says, I hate all conservatives and all their ideas. Obviously I’m more liberal than most people here. But I’m a lot more right wing than you think. I don’t see the point in commenting on stuff where I basically agree with what everyone else is saying. Where’s the fun in that?

Color me obtuse as I freely admit I don’t “try to understand” a single thing you post anymore. Your track record of comments has me relegated to assuming your point is always, always to talk down to your fellow Republicans; we unwashed and unsophisticated Conservatives.

hawkdriver on April 3, 2011 at 12:28 PM

That’s too bad. I think you are a pretty good commenter but since you’re basically admitting you’re not going to bother with trying to understand what I’m saying, I’ll try not to bother responding to anything you say. What’s the point, right?

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 1:52 PM

Sure, but we have no idea how regular conversations go between Muslims. We’re not seeing a representative sample. That was my point, which you obviously missed.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 9:39 PM

Came an hour after:

That said, I have no idea if Muslims do often yell in normal conversation.

Esthier on April 2, 2011 at 8:39 PM

You sir, are a willful fool.

alwaysfiredup on April 3, 2011 at 3:15 PM

Sure, but we have no idea how regular conversations go between Muslims. We’re not seeing a representative sample. That was my point, which you obviously missed.

Proud Rino on April 2, 2011 at 9:39 PM

Came an hour after:

That said, I have no idea if Muslims do often yell in normal conversation.

Esthier on April 2, 2011 at 8:39 PM

You sir, are a willful fool.

alwaysfiredup on April 3, 2011 at 3:15 PM

Cutting up quotes and leaving out context, not to make an argument, but so you can call me a name based on the quotes that you deliberately took out of context.

Congrats. I hope that makes you feel better.

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 3:46 PM

That’s too bad. I think you are a pretty good commenter but since you’re basically admitting you’re not going to bother with trying to understand what I’m saying, I’ll try not to bother responding to anything you say. What’s the point, right?

Proud Rino on April 3, 2011 at 1:52 PM

Clearly the point. We have an understanding.

Then again, maybe you’d consider not jading your comments with so much contempt for your own party and return to where your comments at least were balanced with the subject.

hawkdriver on April 3, 2011 at 5:11 PM

Dude. she is powerfull!
Good looking, smart, strong DAMN !
Good for her, she knows her stuff.
100% respect for her !
Class class class!

ColdWarrior57 on April 4, 2011 at 2:50 AM

I like the part where the douche cleric says he never saw the show. Using that logic I am an expert on the koran because I never read it.

ColdWarrior57 on April 4, 2011 at 2:51 AM