The All Naked Bradley Manning Show

posted at 2:00 pm on March 6, 2011 by Jazz Shaw

Another week passes and another bizarre story emerges concerning the case of alleged traitor Pfc Bradley Manning, currently a long term guest of the United States Marines at the Quantico brig. This time it seems that feathers are being ruffled over a report that Manning is being forced to strip naked during sleeping hours and for morning muster.

The Brig has stripped PFC Manning of all of his clothing for the past three nights, and they intend to continue this practice indefinitely. Each night, Brig guards force PFC Manning to relinquish all of his clothing. He then lies in a cold jail cell naked until the following morning, when he is required to endure the humiliation of standing naked at attention for the morning roll call. According to Marine spokesperson, First Lieutenant Brian Villiard, the decision to strip him naked every night is for PFC Manning’s own protection. Villiard stated that it would be “inappropriate” to explain what prompted these actions “because to discuss the details would be a violation of PFC Manning’s privacy.”

This, of course, has the usual suspects up in arms, describing this treatment as everything from brutalization to being on par with Abu Ghraib style torture.

Even my friend Doug Mataconis, an attorney and one of the more sane voices on the web, raised questions about the propriety of this treatment.

If he’s convicted of these charges, he deserves to be punished to the fullest extent of the law. While he’s awaiting trial, though, and even after he’s convicted, he still must be treated humanely and, at present, Manning is receiving worse treatment than a Prisoner Of War would, and the only purpose behind it seems to be to break him psychologically. That’s simply unacceptable.

So what was the mysterious course of events that led to this decision to strip Manning down each night? It’s provided, ironically enough, by one of his biggest cheerleaders at Fire Dog Lake.

In response to PFC Manning’s question, he was told that there was nothing he could do to downgrade his detainee status and that the Brig simply considered him a risk of self-harm. PFC Manning then remarked that the POI restrictions were “absurd” and sarcastically stated that if he wanted to harm himself, he could conceivably do so with the elastic waistband of his underwear or with his flip-flops.

Mystery solved. Jane Hamsher excuses Manning’s “sarcastic” remark as justifiable given his frustration at being kept under special watch to ensure he doesn’t harm himself. (Not a surprise, since she and Glenn Greenwald would probably find a way to laud his actions even if he – or Julian Assange – were found feeding kittens into a wood chipper.) But in the military we had a different way to describe something like that. It’s known as mouthing off or being a smartass. And doing so to your superiors is generally not a wise move under the best of circumstances, say nothing of when you’re in the hoosegow on charges which equate to treason.

But can this treatment really be justified? There are two points to address on this front.

First and most simply put, Manning made the comment about being able to kill himself with his underwear, sarcastic or not. Can you imagine what would be said if the brig commander did nothing and then he actually did turn up dead in his cell by his own waistband? It would be a movable feast for the media and several careers would come to an abrupt end. How does the commander ignore something like that?

The second point is a bit more complicated and far less clear, and one that we’ve touched on here in the past. It boils down to some of the fundamental differences between civilian society and the military community. Just as civilians, used to all their freedoms of free speech, etc. don’t understand the restrictions on military personnel, those familiar with the civilian justice system are frequently shocked by many of the “unofficial” aspects of the U.C.M.J. Lots of things like this go on all the time in the military, or at least they used to back in the day. But normally you don’t have the civilian press watching and reporting on it.

Does that make it right? I leave that to the judgment of the reader.

Also, life in the military in general is just a bit more physical and harsh than in the civilian world. A lot of things happen which would probably shock many of you who have never served. In the Navy, for example, there is an old tradition of an initiation rite of passage the first time a sailor crosses the equator on a war ship. It is the time when you graduate from being a “pollywog” (or just “wog” for short) to being a “shellback.” Trust me, it’s an ordeal, usually lasting 24 hours or more.

The third time I made the passage, two enlisted men wound up in sick bay with broken arms. Everyone got to experience the joys of crawling through plastic chutes filled with garbage, rotting food and bilge water, all the while being “herded” by shellbacks wielding foot long lengths of fire hose, loving called, “shillelaghs.” (During my own initiation it took more than a week before the bruises finally faded.) And this is all for your friends who have done nothing wrong.

I’ll leave it for one of the veteran submarine sailors to tell you about the grand old tradition of having your dolphins “tacked on” if they wish to do so in comments.

So I suppose our final question is, does any of this make it acceptable for Manning to be treated in this fashion, either to cover the brig commander’s butt or for the sake of teaching a lesson to somebody mouthing off to their superiors? I really don’t know. Maybe we do need to shine a light on this and review military procedures, both official and “under the covers.” But I do know that life in the military community is a lot different than in the civilian world, and having lived it for a number of years myself, this story honestly didn’t shock me at all.

(The author would like to apologize in advance to friends, family and readers for the title of this column. What can I say? The devil made me do it.)

Now you can yell at Jazz for being a stupid, wrong-headed RINO even faster than by leaving a comment. Follow him on Twitter! @JazzShaw

This post was promoted from GreenRoom to HotAir.com.
To see the comments on the original post, look here.

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Don’t you dare question my patriotism.

If you love america so much you’ll hold it to a higher standard.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:03 PM

You’re not patriotic – you’re just a goof. And I won’t hold America or anybody to some bizarre standard that only exists in your head.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:05 PM

Don’t you dare question my patriotism.

If you love america so much you’ll hold it to a higher standard.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:03 PM

Don’t you dare question the professionalism of Chief Barnes. I you loved America so much, you’d have a little more faith in it’s military.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:05 PM

Don’t you dare question my patriotism.

If you love america so much you’ll hold it to a higher standard.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:03 PM

…or make the effort to capitalize “America”. You know, out of respect, and stuff.

spinach.chin on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

As if you have any room to judge what decisions Chief Barnes made. What do you do for a living?

Pro photographer. I’m engaged to a psych major.

What do you do?

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

You’re not patriotic – you’re just a goof. And I won’t hold America or anybody to some bizarre standard that only exists in your head.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:05 PM

You answered that better than me.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

OMG, he has a FIRM MATTRESS!!
spinach.chin on March 6, 2011 at 7:04 PM

And, nobody fluffs his pillow at night!!1!!!1

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:07 PM

Don’t you dare question the professionalism of Chief Barnes. I you loved America so much, you’d have a little more faith in it’s military.

Funny how you forget that Bradley Manning is a part of our military.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:07 PM

Don’t you dare question my patriotism.

If you love america so much you’ll hold it to a higher standard.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:03 PM

How can we dare not? You’ve spent this entire thread on some delusional rant, simply because a tratorous cretin is being made to sleep naked as a precaution against his committing suicide. When you are challenged on your points, you dance away like Pee Wee Herman on a Broadway stage. You’ve made up things to back up your falseties, including quoting a community -based website from San Francisco.

It doesn’t matter to you what Manning has done. This is an opportunity for you to strike out against America’s Best and Brightest. Nothing more.

kingsjester on March 6, 2011 at 7:08 PM

You answered that better than me.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

I don’t want see page after page of his/her silly comments that have no basis in reality or common sense. It’s pretty obvious that he/she is just making shit up.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:08 PM

It’s not about what manning has done or hasn’t done.

I’m sure people in that same prison have killed, raped, done awful crimes.

And yet – manning gets special treatment.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:10 PM

Hey, give it a few minutes. I’m in the middle of making dinner. Keep poking sticks at triple, OK? Frothing mad would be perfect when I jump back into the pit!

This will be so much fun! I majored in psych, too, way back before I got my doctorate! Stick around, triple. Fun times comin’ up!

creekspecter on March 6, 2011 at 7:10 PM

I’m engaged to a psych major.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

You might need his/her services soon. Congrats. It’ll save you some cash.

spinach.chin on March 6, 2011 at 7:10 PM

Pro photographer. I’m engaged to a psych major.

What do you do?

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

Military contractor Instructor Pilot teaching the Mike Model Black Hawk transition to Active Duty, Guard and Reserve pilots. (So I get a bit of Phycology in my FOI Instruction too, Bub) And I just retired from the Army last December after 34 years.

And BTW, my unit was deployed to OEF 10/11 when Manning was giving away state secrets to Mr. Assange.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:11 PM

Funny how you forget that Bradley Manning is a part of our military.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:07 P

M

And he is being treated like someone in the military, in custody, facing serious charges, and who made comments about committing suicide. So what the fk is your point?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:11 PM

And, nobody fluffs his pillow at night!!1!!!1

He doesn’t have a pillow.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:11 PM

It’s not about what manning has done or hasn’t done.

I’m sure people in that same prison have killed, raped, done awful crimes.

And yet – manning gets special treatment.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:10 PM

He’s not being treated any differently than anyone similarly situated. So again, what the fk is your point?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:12 PM

And he is being treated like someone in the military, in custody, facing serious charges, and who made comments about committing suicide. So what the fk is your point?

No – he’s not. If he was being treated just like anyone else, id have no problem. Treat him like a normal prisoner. Hell send him to solitary.

It’s the fact that his conditions go beyond simple solitary confinement, and are so extreme as to warrant speculation that they are punitive in their design, not for his safety as some might suggest.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:13 PM

It’s not about what manning has done or hasn’t done.

I’m sure people in that same prison have killed, raped, done awful crimes.

And yet – manning gets special treatment.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:10 PM

Again, you don’t know if other prisoners get the same (or even worse). You’re making a blanket assumption.

Manning is hihg-profile. All you know is what’s been said by his publicity-seeking lawyer.

spinach.chin on March 6, 2011 at 7:13 PM

Triple it seems to me you simply want to argue for arguments sake. The simple fact is Manning is acting like a spoiled whining child. He wants to be treated special. Frankly, if my child said what Manning said I would take away his undies, watch him like a hawk and be concerned. He’s a smarta** , my son , but he his not stupid he knows his words have consequences. My guess is Manning knew exactly what would happen and got exactly what he wanted. Attention and a pity party.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:13 PM

He’s not being treated any differently than anyone similarly situated. So again, what the fk is your point?

Name one prisoner who gets similar treatment.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:13 PM

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:08 PM

Yep, and I tell myself to not continuously feed the trolls, but I can’t help myself with some of them. They get my goat when they invent these “outrages” committed by respectable military people.

My excuse and I’m sticking with it.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:14 PM

He doesn’t have a pillow.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:11 PM

So? Did you really think if he had one he would be entitled to have it fluffed? LOL

I don’t sleep with a pillow. I’m being tortured!!!1!!!!

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:14 PM

And, nobody fluffs his pillow at night!!1!!!1

He doesn’t have a pillow.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:11 PM

My crew chief didn’t have a pillow when he had to sleep in the back of our helicopter for three nights straight in RC West either. What the heck is your point?

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:15 PM

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:14 PM

So, who is this guy? Some leftard troll that wondered in?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:16 PM

I’d like to see the people here last one week in his conditions.

I’d guess you’re not as tough as you think.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:16 PM

lefty troll? No, I’m a 2x bush voter, malkin commenter who came over here when michelle opened the site.

I’ve been here longer than you.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:17 PM

I’d like to see the people here last one week in his conditions.

I’d guess you’re not as tough as you think.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:16 PM

People live under much worse restriction in prisons for decades. Even the prisoners in Florence ADX have an opportunity to have restrictions removed and to even be transferred out based on their good behavior.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:19 PM

lefty troll? No, I’m a 2x bush voter, malkin commenter who came over here when michelle opened the site.

I’ve been here longer than you.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:17 PM

You have no idea how long I have been here, kid. That you say that you voted for Bush is meaningless. Your comments regarding Manning are ridiculous.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:21 PM

So, who is this guy? Some leftard troll that wondered in?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:16 PM

Dunno. First thread I’ve seen him on. He isn’t a very good troll though. Even Fins can continuously find links to send you off on a wild goose chase over. Most of the attention this one has gotten is because you have to ask him a question 10-20 times before he can even come up with a cogent albeit “invented” response.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:23 PM

You have no idea how long I have been here, kid.

So you came here first day HA was launched then, did you?

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:24 PM

PS malkin’s site is currently infected with a JS exploit. I’d avoid it.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:24 PM

I hate to be the bearer of bad news triple. But, he seems to still be getting 3 meals a day, access to attorneys, clothes during the day, and an hour of exercise daily. I’m having problems finding torture in this. He also seems to be allowed to voice his complaints for the world. This is not torture this is what happens when you break the law ANY law.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:25 PM

Manning’s new facebook ID: BareAss87.

James on March 6, 2011 at 7:28 PM

I was laughing and cracking jokes when lefties whined that Manning was being forced to sleep without a pillow and that he didn’t get cable TV in his cell . . . But, strip naked?

This is fucked up and over the line. Even if the brig’s CO wanted to make sure the little bitch couldn’t kill himself with his underwear waistband, what’s the problem with simply taking his underwear and then leaving him the rest?

Ryan Anthony on March 6, 2011 at 7:28 PM

“WHAT? ME WORRY?”

You damn well BETTER worry, you idiot!

“Aid and comfort to the enemy”. That’s a capital offense acccording to the UCMJ.

No sympathy ………NONE! for the damage you did to your country.

Better get used to sleeping naked bozo. You’re going to spend the rest of your miserable life behind bars, and in the buff. Deal with it.

bannedbyhuffpo on March 6, 2011 at 7:32 PM

So you came here first day HA was launched then, did you?

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:24 PM

How is your alleged length of time here make you comments regarding Manning any less stupid? It doesn’t.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:34 PM

I’d like to see the people here last one week in his conditions.

I’d guess you’re not as tough as you think.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:16 PM

You mean like sleeping in or under a helicopter for a week or two at a time in the middle of the desert? You mean like drinking local water and getting sick because you’ve run out of clean water supplies on an extended mission? You mean like your whole crew not being able to shave or bathe for the same time period?

You’re talking to a lot of people on this site who have either been in the military or have pretty austere occupations.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:35 PM

I have just given my 16 yr old son and 2 of his friends a rundown on Mannings crime, punishment and current complaints. They all agree that this is not torture but, if they were not given access to pictures of pretty girls naked or otherwise it would rise to that level.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:38 PM

Give him some dainties out of the Fredericks of Hollywood catalog, nothing that would support his weight. That’s probably more his style anyway.

slickwillie2001 on March 6, 2011 at 7:40 PM

I am a single mother with 3 teenagers. My husband died a little over a year ago. A week in Mannings conditions sounds like a vacation triple.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:43 PM

Give him some dainties out of the Fredericks of Hollywood catalog, nothing that would support his weight. That’s probably more his style anyway.

slickwillie2001 on March 6, 2011 at 7:40 PM

Unfortunately, that won’t work. All they have to do is wrap it around their neck a few times, find something to anchor it to which could be extremely low, and slump. There’s a name for it but I forgot it.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:43 PM

Sorry slickwillie Mannings gay so tomtriple that would constitute torture.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:44 PM

Wait…maybe edible underwear would work. What’s it made out of?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:44 PM

Oops sorry meant to say TO TRIPLE

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:47 PM

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:43 PM

Sorry to hear. What did your hubby do?

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:47 PM

It sucks that I have to remind all of you that prison is the punishment for his crime.

What we’re talking about here is not if he deserves to be punished or if his crime is serious – he does and it is – but that I’m asking if the prison has a right to place a clearly non-suicidal individual on suicide watch for punitive reasons, which this seems to be.

What you’re essentially arguing is that a warden, or a brig commander.. has the right to favorably or unfavorably treat certain prisoners beyond the normal course of justice. I’m sure the brig commander is a great one. But I’m not sure she has the right to grant and deny rights based upon how serious she thinks a crime is – without any sort of opposing argument from his representation, without any evidence or justification.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:47 PM

You’re basically telling me she’s above the law.

BS.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:49 PM

Hawkdriver, he was an airplane fueler at DFW.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:50 PM

No, what we are arguing is that when you make cracks about suicide, the warden has the right to order that your clothes be removed at night so you don’t tear them into strips and use them to kill yourself.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:50 PM

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:47 PM

So you’re telling us you don’t trust the word of your military?

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 7:51 PM

So you’re telling us you don’t trust the word of your military?

The military lies all the time. It’s perfectly okay because it’s in the interests of national security, and they have every right to, but LOL no I don’t.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:53 PM

Obviously you’ve never been contacted by a recruiter.

“oh yea, boot camp is just like summer camp, if you can run a mile you’ll be fine!”

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:54 PM

I still say that if you black out one tooth in that photo, he bears a striking resemblance to Alfred E. Newman.

crosspatch on March 6, 2011 at 7:55 PM

I still say that if you black out one tooth in that photo, he bears a striking resemblance to Alfred E. Newman.

crosspatch on March 6, 2011 at 7:55 PM

Actually, that would make a good Halloween costume: fatigue, beret, freckles, and blacken tooth.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:56 PM

fatigues

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:57 PM

Triple the fact remains, he made a threat. If no one had acted on that threat and he followed through on that threat. You would be screaming from rooftops about their irresponsibility. So basically you’re saying that no matter what they do they are wrong.
they

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:57 PM

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:47 PM

You have no clue about the military. None whatsoever.

James on March 6, 2011 at 8:00 PM

I’m engaged to a psych major.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:06 PM

This is some kind of joke, right?

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:00 PM

You have no clue about the military. None whatsoever.

You have no clue about America. None whatsoever.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:03 PM

That the military determined he was a threat to himself and deprived him of basic material to which he would do harm to himself.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 5:42 PM

Putting aside the fact that it’s fairly impossible to kill yourself with a pair of briefs, the real problem is that the military did NOT determine that Manning is a threat to himself by the lawful procedures for such:

The officials told NBC News, however, that a U.S. Marine commander did violate procedure when he placed Manning on “suicide watch” last week.

Military officials said Brig Commander James Averhart did not have the authority to place Manning on suicide watch for two days last week, and that only medical personnel are allowed to make that call.

And, in this case, it seems that determination was made improperly again:

The defense was informed by Brig officials that the decision to strip PFC Manning of all his clothing was made without consulting any of the Brig’s mental health providers.

I don’t hold any affection for Bradley Manning, but even soldiers are entitled to some process protections in this country. I will not stand for them being ignored and undermined, because ultimately that imperils my own freedoms, as well.

Inkblots on March 6, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Actually, that would make a good Halloween costume: fatigue, beret, freckles, and blacken tooth.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 7:56 PM

Better than going in his evening costume, just freckles and black tooth.

kringeesmom on March 6, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Triple is starting to win me over. That poor boy should be put into the general population with all of the rapists and murders. He should also be given a pillow with a pillow-fluffer to fluff for him every night.. Oh and a kitten, and a cup of hot cocoa to help him sleep.

kringeesmom on March 6, 2011 at 8:07 PM

Oh, and triple my mom is a psychiatrist who happens to work with the prison system here in TX. So I know of which I speak. Educate yourself on the subject. If you do you might not sound like such an idiot military hater.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:08 PM

You have no clue about America. None whatsoever.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:03 PM

Oh please, the usual sanctimonious harping from the usual sanctimonious scolds.

Never mind the fact that this moron and his buddy Assange got people killed…Manning is a soldier and the truth is the rules are different..the fact that you don’t understand that just goes to show what little you really know.

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:09 PM

Everyone supports human rights when it’s popular.

Egypt. China. Iran.

That’s not always the case, especially when they are the rights of people you hate.

Westboro Baptist Church. Bradley Manning.

I support and defend the right to basic human rights for everyone. If you have a problem with me for that, maybe you should reassess if you really support the values this country was founded on.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

And to those in the military, maybe you should think about what you’re really fighting for.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

Hawkdriver, he was an airplane fueler at DFW.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 7:50 PM

Sorry to take so long to respond. Took a call from a co-worker.

A refueler is a great guy to know on the flight line. I know. And I also know it’s hard work. And an honorable way to have made a living for your family. I hope you are doing alright since and have been able to be strong.

Prayers and blessings to your and your children.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

And to those in the military, maybe you should think about what you’re really fighting for.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

Ah, it’s always comes out eventually.

Pathetic.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:13 PM

So you’re telling us you don’t trust the word of your military?

The military lies all the time. It’s perfectly okay because it’s in the interests of national security, and they have every right to, but LOL no I don’t.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:53 PM

Coming from someone who lied right on this thread tonight, that’s rich.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:14 PM

Inkblots on March 6, 2011 at 8:04 PM

Where is your link to back up those quotes?

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:14 PM

I will not stand for them being ignored and undermined, because ultimately that imperils my own freedoms, as well.

Inkblots on March 6, 2011 at 8:04 PM

And you’re welcome not to.

BTW, if you don’t think you can strangle yourself with a bit a cloth, you’re naive.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:17 PM

Everyone supports human rights when it’s popular.

Egypt. China. Iran.

That’s not always the case, especially when they are the rights of people you hate.

Westboro Baptist Church. Bradley Manning.

I support and defend the right to basic human rights for everyone. If you have a problem with me for that, maybe you should reassess if you really support the values this country was founded on.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

For a guy who thinks that Manning is not getting a fair shake you sure don’t have any problems playing judge, jury and executioner with the entire US military..and you don’t really know the facts either. You are just shooting your mouth off, with the usual anti military crap…and btw, this man is a soldier, he took an oath and he violated it..there is no doubt that he did that, there is also no doubt that people in places like Afghanistan died because of it..in fact there were human rights activists who actually pleaded with Assange not to release a lot of that information…and apparently you could care less.

The thing is we are talking about whether or not the man should be naked..it is not as if they have water boarded the poor baby.

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:17 PM

Thanks hawkdriver. We are doing well. And yes it is a difficult job but his father did it for 34 years and my husband loved it.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:17 PM

Inkblots: You need to learn to read more critically. I googled where you found that and it’s comprised of weasel words. I also have this vague recollection that someone refuted this too. However, I’m too lazy to look it up.

I’ll tell you on it’s fact it’s silly just by the fact that you don’t wait to put someone on suicide watch until you get the permission of a psych. Think about it.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:19 PM

I didn’t lie. You didn’t believe my source. Apparently his legal representation isn’t good enough for you.

The whole “military hater” line is the most absurd of the night. You’re basing that off of one position on a basic human rights issue? The military aspect is inconsequential – I’d be against this if he was being held in a civie prison, too.

My brother is an OIF vet twice. Oh, you teach pilots? He cleaned up nuclear waste because the Iraqis were looting the nuke plants. Imagine being in a dark old nuclear reactor, with a flashlight, unsure if you’d be exposed to any hazmat. Those things were designed to be circular mazes to dampen the radiation, and he had to find his way in the dark through that crap. So you can kindly STFU.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:19 PM

The military lies all the time. It’s perfectly okay because it’s in the interests of national security, and they have every right to, but LOL no I don’t.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 7:53 PM

Yes, you are anti military. You are not objective, and you have a chip on your shoulder and you don’t know what you are talking about.

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:21 PM

I said it’s perfectly okay that they lie, because its in the interests of national security. Apparently you glossed over that part.

They need to lie. It’s practically in the job description.

You can’t fight a war honestly.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:23 PM

Oh, Lawdy! Triple’s another proponent of the Pee Wee Herman School of Debate. Not worth my time or effort.

Clue, Pee Wee… at HA we rarely, if ever, refer to the boss emeritus as “malkin.” Screwed the pooch, boyo. You’re just another half-@assed troll, smarty-pants wanna-be. Go back to your Dostoevsky, and wander back over to Political Fail and hang out with your anarchist play group. Take your make-believe psych major girlfriend with you, before Jody knocks her up.

Bye bye, little boy. Don’t let anyone steal your undies!

creekspecter on March 6, 2011 at 8:25 PM

I didn’t lie. You didn’t believe my source. Apparently his legal representation isn’t good enough for you.

You didn’t provide “any” source. I think you just lied again.

The whole “military hater” line is the most absurd of the night. You’re basing that off of one position on a basic human rights issue? The military aspect is inconsequential – I’d be against this if he was being held in a civie prison, too.

Every anti-military clown eventually gets around to asking people they learn are military to question what they’re fighting for. You’re outed, transparent, obvious.

My brother is an OIF vet twice.

Tell him I said thanks for his service. You, not so much.

Oh, you teach pilots?

Yep, the kind of guy professional photographers love to take pictures of.

He cleaned up nuclear waste because the Iraqis were looting the nuke plants. Imagine being in a dark old nuclear reactor, with a flashlight, unsure if you’d be exposed to any hazmat.

Well, I was exposed to automatic machine gun fire most of the time. Does that count? But again, my praises for your brother. I might have given him a ride in Iraq one day.

Those things were designed to be circular mazes to dampen the radiation, and he had to find his way in the dark through that crap. So you can kindly STFU.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:19 PM

How rude.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:26 PM

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:17 PM

Hugs across the wires to you and your children.

kringeesmom on March 6, 2011 at 8:26 PM

I support and defend the right to basic human rights for everyone. If you have a problem with me for that, maybe you should reassess if you really support the values this country was founded on.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:10 PM

Pajamas are a basic human right now? LOL!

I don’t think they have pjs in prison, more like a right to underwear and a t-shirt.

According to triple, Americans died fighting in foreign wars to protect our right to tighty-whities.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:27 PM

When you dismiss his rights, you’re dismissing your own rights as well.

Manning sets a precedent, remember that. Everyone does.

And that’s why this is so important.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:29 PM

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:21 PM

Well said.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:29 PM

Give me boxers or give me death!

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:29 PM

Triple you are all over the map. This is not an issue of basic human rights. This is an issue of prisoner safety and security. Civilian or military. Manning made a threat of self harm. ANY jail or prison must take those seriously. If you think that this is unusual you know very little about about prison or jail. And you still have not addressed the issue of WHAT they are supposed to do about the threats Manning made.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:30 PM

Oh, Lawdy! Triple’s another proponent of the Pee Wee Herman School of Debate.
creekspecter on March 6, 2011 at 8:25 PM

My mind plays tricks on me and I play tricks back. Pee Wee Herman.

One of the PWH quotes I live by!

kringeesmom on March 6, 2011 at 8:30 PM

When Mubarek and his intelligence services tortured prisoners for years before the revolution, no one blinked an eye. Because the people he tortured were criminals, extremists, political upstarts. Not popular people.

People didn’t care that rights were being violated because they weren’t their own.

So when it came time that he cut off the internet and started throwing everyday people and international journalists into that same prison.. only then did people figure out why it was so important to raise a stink.

I guess the lesson hasn’t stuck over here yet.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:33 PM

When you dismiss his rights, you’re dismissing your own rights as well.

I don’t think we’re dismissing his rights so much as dismissing the argument that his jailers deprived him of skivies for anything other than his own safety.

Manning sets a precedent, remember that. Everyone does.

But not everyone commits treason and then jokes about killing themselves.

And that’s why this is so important.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:29 PM

Yes, his privacy over his safety is paramount.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:34 PM

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:33 PM

What the schnickies are you talking about now? Are we even supposed to be trying to follow the logic of the last couple comments or are you praying we’ll just scratch our heads and leave?

PS, For one of the “original” first day commenters, you aren’t represented at all in the Vault.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:37 PM

When you dismiss his rights, you’re dismissing your own rights as well.

Manning sets a precedent, remember that. Everyone does.

And that’s why this is so important.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:29 PM

Who is dismissing his rights? The man was told to sleep naked because he threatened to hang himself with his underwear…I looked it up…it says life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness..nothing about underwear.

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:38 PM

Triple you are a weasel wording moral relativist. You go from Manning not having his undies at night to Egyptian prisons. I’m fairly sure if Manning was Egyptian and was in prison there for what he did here the least of his worries would be not having undies to sleep in. If you want to defend Mannings right to undies, fine, but at least attempt to sound coherant when you do.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:40 PM

People didn’t care that rights were being violated because they weren’t their own.

So when it came time that he cut off the internet and started throwing everyday people and international journalists into that same prison.. only then did people figure out why it was so important to raise a stink.

I guess the lesson hasn’t stuck over here yet.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:33 PM

What a self righteous little person you are. Manning and his friend Assange got people killed…plain and simple and as usual the left is passing judgment on anyone and everyone else…all my life I have been listening to lefties lecture everyone else on human rights while they sit atop a pile of bones. Hypocrite.

Terrye on March 6, 2011 at 8:42 PM

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:40 PM

Thank God, I thought it was just me not understanding WTH he was trying to say.

But we should show more respect. He was one of the “original” commenters you know!

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:42 PM

When they came for Manning’s skivvies,
I remained silent;
Because I like going commando….

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:43 PM

It’s just an analogy to demonstrate how the rights of people you HATE and you think probably deserve to die – are completely relevant to your own self-interest.

I defend manning’s rights in jail like i’d defend my own.

I don’t plan on leaking any documents, but just in case I’m wrongfully accused, I want some goddamn rights.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:44 PM

You think 5 seconds into the future, I swear to god.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:45 PM

I myself have been a commenter from the beginning. However, that does not give me liscense to be an absolute moron. I promise to never demand respect just because I managed to register in the beginning.

hboulware on March 6, 2011 at 8:46 PM

It’s just an analogy to demonstrate how the rights of people you HATE and you think probably deserve to die – are completely relevant to your own self-interest.

I defend manning’s rights in jail like i’d defend my own.

I don’t plan on leaking any documents, but just in case I’m wrongfully accused, I want some goddamn rights.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:44 PM

I don’t know the actual evidence against the guy and he has not been convicted. Therefore, I have not demanded that he be put to death. You, otoh, have made several comment about how he should be killed. So, STFU.

And if you ever end up in prison or jail, which I believe is highly likely with your big mouth, start talking about suicide and I assure you that you, too, will end up in a cell naked.

Blake on March 6, 2011 at 8:48 PM

I never intended to “demand respect”, only to stop the BS accusations that I was some lefty troll who snuck in to cause trouble.

Apparently conservatives who don’t go lock step into the hivemind consensus are labeled trolls, as such, im out.. bye.. guess any sort of critical thinking is beyond you guys.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:48 PM

It’s just an analogy to demonstrate how the rights of people you HATE and you think probably deserve to die – are completely relevant to your own self-interest.

Well dang it was one poor analogy. We are discussing the fine point of whether a persons tightie-whities were sercured to prevent physical harm to said tightie-whitie wearer or whether they were being “tortured” and you give an example of how a third rate country with a tin-horn dictator turned of the internet? And what makes you know who we hate or not?

I defend manning’s rights in jail like i’d defend my own.

Don’t commit treason and you should be okay.

I don’t plan on leaking any documents, but just in case I’m wrongfully accused, I want some goddamn rights.

triple on March 6, 2011 at 8:44 PM

If your rights are Goddamned, they will probably not be very effective.

hawkdriver on March 6, 2011 at 8:49 PM

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