Video: Union protester grabs FreedomWorks staffer’s camera, hits her with sign
posted at 6:23 pm on February 23, 2011 by Allahpundit
Via the boss emeritus. The FreedomWorks staffer in question is Tabitha Hale, whom some of our readers will know from her role in helping to organize events for conservative activists. Ed e-mails to say that he’s known her for years and that she’s never been less than perfectly pleasant and friendly, in case you’re wondering if she was likely to have been harassing this guy before the camera started rolling. Lefty Tommy Christopher of Mediaite also knows Hale and says, “I’ve never known her to be anything but completely honest.”
So what happened? Quote: “They threatened and yelled, then hit me with a sign and threw my phone. But none of us were hurt.” And so an obvious Narrative question presents itself: She must have been asking for this somehow, but … how? Perhaps she was invading this fine gentleman’s “personal space?” Or perhaps she somehow “manufactured” the confrontation to precipitate a little thuggery, thereby painting poor liberals in a bad light. I bet if we dig deep, we might find that it was her, not union protesters, who was carrying those “Scott Walker is the new Hitler” signs last weekend. Besides, even if we conclude that the man in red is at fault, is it fair to draw conclusions about all the demonstrators based on the incivility (and possible fraud!) of a select few? Based on the left’s attitude towards tea partiers, I’d say … yeah. Absolutely.
Exit quotation from AmSpec’s Philip Klein: “I bet [Tabitha] is gonna get a sweet bonus from the Koch bros for staging that video of her being assaulted.”
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 Next »
I guess the comparisions by the media to the Cairo uprisings were not that far off base, albeit in not quite the way they were inferring.
Koa on February 23, 2011 at 8:16 PM
I’m just glad they’re wearing red. Much more appropriate than that silly purple.
Literally showing their true colors.
How they think they can get away with this in today’s internet age and cameras everywhere, I’ll never know.
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on February 23, 2011 at 8:17 PM
No matter the color of shirt a union thug is wearing, it’s still brown in spirit. Welcome to Weimar America.
Blacklake on February 23, 2011 at 8:26 PM
Judging by the expression on this goon’s face right before the assault, I’d say this is a classic example of flashpoint rage, in which the mind of a low IQ person ceases to function during a verbal confrontation that’s out of their intellectual depth. All cognitive faculties are shut down except the most primitive, and the savage lashes out physically.
Sharke on February 23, 2011 at 8:28 PM
Typical union NAZI clown. The trouble with so-called conservatives is that they have NO BACK BONE! The time for talk is over! It’s time to start smashing these NAZI scum on there heads & spill what little brains they have!
Confederate on February 23, 2011 at 8:30 PM
Well, the Union members can afford their own if they wanted them… so they don’t need the help.
If you want to start a charity to arm the homeless remember that they still have to pass the background check, so a real address is necessary… that means you will need to give them a place to stay along with a firearm. I’ll kick in $50 to the charity once you set it up.
Remember, they still have to buy cleaning supplies and their own ammo. Which means they will have nice looking pieces of metal that are firearms but get pretty useless without ammo and with rust once they don’t care for them. Those that want to learn how to use, maintain and actually practice on a regular basis will soon find this thing known as a ‘job’ pretty handy.
And over the last three years we have sold enough handguns, not to speak of long guns, to arm up over three Chinese armies. Strangely enough the actual armed violence, and violence in general, has decreased drastically over the last three years.
So remember, you have to set up the charity, it will have to be extensive, and once they are armed they then spring for their own supplies. You would not get a bloodbath from that… it would be very expensive, though, so you might want to hit up Soros for a billion or two. I’m sure he would just love a wide open, highly armed America. You learn civility very quickly when you know just about everyone is armed. Human nature tends to get curbed hard, and fast, when any argument can go lethal… and the bad actors get self-weeded from society by being unable to keep a civil tongue.
ajacksonian on February 23, 2011 at 8:32 PM
Oh, MAN-O-MAN! Such cynicism. If I could get paid for my “trolling,” I’d gladly sign up.
I know you just can’t bear to hear it, but I actually enjoy the exploration of the conservative mind — and mindless — that Hot Air generously affords me. I am grateful that I haven’t been tossed out. I’ve actually been a lurking member for at least two years. I waited a long time for an open registration and I feel really grateful to be a guest here. Seriously.
You would be amazed how similar Hot Air is to common-association group-hug sites such as Kos and TPM. You’ll never know, of course, because you could never hang out at a lib site without your head exploding.
I actually despise the far left — and I can practically hear your head explode with fury as I post this, because you live in a world of neat, pat, cookie-cutter
cubbyholes and comfortable labels.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 8:33 PM
It’s really too bad, but I think you nail it. He should be expelled from the union and charged. He does no service to progressivism.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 8:40 PM
The troll is back.
CWforFreedom on February 23, 2011 at 8:41 PM
Nah, we just know you’re lying.
Anyway, if you can’t see a difference between the perspectives offered here (AP, Ed, MadCon, Jazz Shaw, other GR posters, etc) and that offered at Kos, then you’re not someone worth taking seriously.
Oh, yeah…*flushes*
Good Solid B-Plus on February 23, 2011 at 8:43 PM
FIFY
CWforFreedom on February 23, 2011 at 8:45 PM
Your excuse that they were baiting the guy doesn’t hold
water. If I came up to you and called you a socialist/
marxist/progressive witch you would still have no right
to assault me.
Amjean on February 23, 2011 at 8:45 PM
bfidis—
what name have you posted under here before?
CWforFreedom on February 23, 2011 at 8:47 PM
Look, I respect your honest effort to address what I said … but (you knew that was coming) … I don’t want to live in a country where public speech is circumscribed by the threat of murder.
I am haunted by the ghosts of thousands of young men and some women who died for my right to talk trash without being murdered for it. When I read your post, all I could think was “Guadalcanal. He obviously doesn’t know what happened there. Or at Bull Run/Manassas. Or Saratoga. Or you don’t want to be reminded, I guess.” Sad.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 8:47 PM
Any student of American history and the horrors of civil violence in America would desire peaceful, nonviolence solutions to such problems.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 7:02 PM
Can we start with the Revoltionary War?
Oh, wait.
artist on February 23, 2011 at 7:14 PM
So you’re calling for a second revolutionary war?
…..
Um, no.
But as a student of history, I understand that war not desire, founded this nation.
And a lot more.
artist on February 23, 2011 at 8:49 PM
No, I didn’t say that. You Hotairheads struggle with gray — I knew that already. But what I said was not what you are trying to pretend I’m saying. Which demonstrates my point. You can’t bear to hear the truth.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 8:52 PM
And war almost destroyed it, too. We were REAL damn close. Cf. 1861-65.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 8:54 PM
GrowFins
belad on February 23, 2011 at 8:56 PM
Baiting, pure and simple. She was trying to provoke the guy, she got her desired reaction. Her deserved reaction.
DngrMse on February 23, 2011 at 8:58 PM
Union racist:
http://gatewaypundit.rightnetwork.com/2011/02/seiu-protester-harasses-black-tea-partier-do-you-have-any-children-that-you-claim-video/
CWforFreedom on February 23, 2011 at 8:58 PM
GF I suspect there are two different people posting under your bfidis nic right?
CWforFreedom on February 23, 2011 at 9:00 PM
Just ONCE, I’d like to see a video view of a creep like this from 20 feet away. And when the creep hits someone, he gets his clock cleaned instantly by the victim. Single strike knock-down by the victim in obvious self-defense. Pepper spray would be a nice touch, as well.
AmericanDad on February 23, 2011 at 9:03 PM
UNION
THUG
=
REDUNDANT
CatchAll on February 23, 2011 at 9:07 PM
Your exact quote:
“You would be amazed how similar Hot Air is to common-association group-hug sites such as Kos and TPM. ”
Where exactly did I misrepresent what you said, buddy?
Good Solid B-Plus on February 23, 2011 at 9:09 PM
Now the Tea Partiers are bad Jews also.
mizflame98 on February 23, 2011 at 9:15 PM
Have you seen the girl this thug hit, Allah?
No matter to you, as long as it was done “civily”.
Remove my comment, it matters not.
Little Green Lizards live by it-
Nothing “violent” in my comment–only pointing out that we watch…and we stew…..
This is just a place to say so–removing the words typed on a screen mean nothing.
Chickenshi-t if I don’t say so myself.
We are about done being bullied–you, apparently, still have plenty of lunch money to offer–you, know, for peace.
Browndog on February 23, 2011 at 9:19 PM
Wisconsin’s Baghdad Bob moment
mizflame98 on February 23, 2011 at 9:19 PM
A swift kick in the nuts was definitely in order! Missed opportunity!
GFW on February 23, 2011 at 9:23 PM
That video wasn’t very clear. Did this happen after she was hit by the sign and her phone thrown or was it during? It just wasn’t clear who was doing what and when. And what were the Communication Workers of America doing there anyway. It isn’t their fight. Aren’t they a private sector union?
jeanie on February 23, 2011 at 9:28 PM
The deserved reaction you’re in need of is an thorough a$$kicking – I guess that would make it justifiable, right?
Midas on February 23, 2011 at 9:36 PM
Hey, thug in red shirt and headband. Consider your a$$ on a wanted poster now.
watch over that shoulder….
ted c on February 23, 2011 at 9:41 PM
Union goons mobilized and coordinated by the White House…
… Union goons instructed to cause violence.
State Run Media reports that America is on fire due to the TEA Parties…
… Obowma declares Martial Law for the “good of the country”.
Union goons become Obowma’s Civil Defense force with a budget that surpasses our military…
… You are in a “re-education camp” whilst your children are turned into Union Goons.
Do you really think the unions, if they loose, will go quietly into the night…?
Seven Percent Solution on February 23, 2011 at 9:43 PM
Huh?
jeanie on February 23, 2011 at 9:52 PM
It sounded like there were 3-4 Freedom Works guys surrounding and badgering him. It LOOKS pretty despicable, but I’d like to see a third party camera of it to actually see what happened.
Rainsford on February 23, 2011 at 9:55 PM
What the firetruck?
Cindy Munford on February 23, 2011 at 9:58 PM
After rewatching it, I REALLY hope you guys don’t try to run with this. She’s pretty clearly ok (listen to her saying whoa whoa), and immediately after she responds by saying “what did you do to my personal property”, and the guy seems kind of baffled. If you get “assaulted”, and your first reaction is to say something like that with a threatening tone, I doubt it was much of an “assault”. Besides, if this guy assaulted her, then we should prosecute every celebrity in the country for assault on paparazzi. They were CLEARLY trying to get this reaction out of him.
Rainsford on February 23, 2011 at 9:59 PM
Just looked at this thread and too lazy to read 3 pages.
Has anyone blamed Sarah Palin yet?
kringeesmom on February 23, 2011 at 10:01 PM
For the record, who exactly are these Freedom Works guys? The ones who usurped the Tea Party movement to turn a profit? They are essentially professional “community organizers”, right? The real conservatives are the ones working 9-5′s, not these guys. Every day any hope of winning in 2012 slips further and further away.
Rainsford on February 23, 2011 at 10:04 PM
Hey, CW, I consider sock-puppetry shady. I’m not into that. I prefer to be a vox clamantis in deserto, as bombastic as that sounds.
I said the Hotair and Kos/TPM etc. share amazing similarities, not that there’s no difference between the perspectives. The either/or rhetoric, the group-think, the feeding-frenzies at the first sight of oppositional thought, the conformity, the hatred for moderate politics of any stripe — these are just a few commonalities. It goes without saying that the differences are myriad.
bifidis on February 23, 2011 at 10:06 PM
After watching the video, Kenneth Gladney clearly got the reaction he was looking for while handing out Gadsden flags at a townhall meeting in August 2009.
After reading the news reports, Lara Logan clearly got the reaction she was looking for in Egypt, by being a woman.
/AnninCA
/Rainsford
/DngrMse
Left Coast Right Mind on February 23, 2011 at 10:13 PM
As the boss said… Sometimes you have to get bloody in the streets.
jeffn21 on February 23, 2011 at 10:15 PM
Hey Midas:
That should be “a thorough a$$kicking”, not “an”. Try to pass third grade next time, mkay?
It is clear, from watching the video several times, that the pair is trying to provoke a reaction. That doesn’t make for good journalism, and doesn’t award any points to either side. If anything, the right is stained by an obviously manufactured stunt.
DngrMse on February 23, 2011 at 10:17 PM
Can you give us some examples of Hot Air posters actively celebrating the suffering and dying of people they didn’t like? Kos, HuffPo, etc. all actively cheered for and celebrated Bush Press Secretary Tony Snow’s painful death from colon cancer, have on countless occasions wished for Dick Cheney’s heart to finally quit, and hoped prominent Republican’s families contract AIDS.
Sorry, kid, you don’t even deserve my usual F-. You get a G-
Del Dolemonte on February 23, 2011 at 10:18 PM
You forgot to mention the baiting, idiot trolls.
fossten on February 23, 2011 at 10:20 PM
Amusing.
Del Dolemonte on February 23, 2011 at 10:20 PM
Tell me about it.
Is it despicable? Of course. But nitpicking 1-2 posts on blogs that literally have more commenter in a week then HA has traffic in a month is a little much. Can you even link any of them?
Rainsford on February 23, 2011 at 10:23 PM
Did any of you see the Scott Walker fatwas captured on twitter? http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/260519/scott-walker-fatwas-daniel-foster
onlineanalyst on February 23, 2011 at 10:27 PM
Don’t try and figure it out. It will only make your head hurt.
Rod on February 23, 2011 at 10:35 PM
It’s the internet, -within 24 hours we will know who he is.
slickwillie2001 on February 23, 2011 at 10:43 PM
And your point is what? That people that share the same perspectives and political philosophies tend to gather together and, when they do, reinforce their mutual beliefs?
And you’re just figuring this out and thought you’d share it because you’re … what … so smart?
Are you patting yourself on the back too?
Let me guess: you’re a college freshman who’s just had an epiphany in phychology 101.
Right?
Rod on February 23, 2011 at 10:49 PM
You’re right – it wasn’t assault; it was ASSAULT AND BATTERY.
Dopenstrange on February 23, 2011 at 10:57 PM
Yes we will. And let’s pray that no idiot does him harm.
Rod on February 23, 2011 at 11:01 PM
When I was a member of ProtestWarrior-Chicago it was the standard practice of the left to go after us girls.
During our first ‘mission’, one of my sister patriots got roughed up pretty badly. I was never touched-despite my short stature-because I kind of give out a ‘don’t screw with me’ vibe…(I WAS called every name in creation)or maybe I was just very lucky.
annoyinglittletwerp on February 23, 2011 at 11:18 PM
I see plenty of disagreement here on HotAir, especially regarding social issues.
I agree with your general point, though. It’s all factional circle jerking. That’s what many people like, obviously. I come here to actually get news. I don’t post much except to amuse myself. I think many here are the same way. Those here like me are not necessarily trying to convince anyone of anything, just having fun. I’m sure that goes on everywhere.
I find HotAir to be more grounded in political philosophy than a place like dailykos, which to me is more conspiratorial-minded and Marxist in tone. HotAir seems to be concerned about the functioning of government and society/culture whereas Kos seems to focus on power relations and how the wealthy call all the shots. That line sort of rings hollow for me, because the establishment left is every bit as much about power as the establishment right. So, I accept that both sides are imperfect and corrupt, and then it becomes about which world view I subscribe to and which side is less hypocritical. Therefore, I pick limited government and individual liberty with a strong aversion to “experts” and social engineering. I don’t give a horse’s sack which side that’s on. Am I left? Fine. Am I right? Fine. I don’t give a sh*t. Both major parties can go screw themselves as far as I’m concerned and the only place I see people share my view is a place like HotAir, Breitbart’s sites and a few other places.
And I will also say this: Ed and Allah are much more legit thinkers, journalists, and philosophers than Moulitsas, who I find to be practically blinded by ideology. They are just more fair if you ask me. I find that to be generally more true of the right than of the left, although there are exceptions, of course.
Metro on February 23, 2011 at 11:33 PM
For Metro, Cuda
Inanemergencydial on February 23, 2011 at 11:34 PM
Yesterday, I attended a Tea Party rally in opposition to the Union rally held in Des Moines. You wouldn’t believe the slurs and vulgar comments from the big, tuff union goons. Our side never said vile things, but we were called names. Of course, I had to reply…and had the nice policeman come up to me three different times asking me if I was provoking them…
Afterwards, I saw three men with t-shirts saying the policeman’s union, walk up to his car…
So of course, it’s obvious, it was all Tabitha’s fault.
lovingmyUSA on February 23, 2011 at 11:48 PM
Look on the bright side, at least the Union is not Muslims celebrating in a large square in Egypt.
Also on a bright note, Tabitha was not mobbed by 200 or more males, dragged away, stripped, sexually molested, beaten, etc.
Of course, if the guy doing the attack were identified as a “Conservative,” or a “Pro-lifer,” or a “Tea Partier,” or a “Republican,” or a “Christian,” or an “Israeli,” or a “Jew,” or a US soldier, then you can bet your sweet whatever that the media would be making this out to be the attack of the flesh eating aliens from outerspace.
William2006 on February 23, 2011 at 11:52 PM
Yesterday, I attended a Tea Party rally in opposition to the Union rally held in Des Moines. You wouldn’t believe the slurs and vulgar comments from the big, tuff union goons. Our side never said vile things, but we were called names. Of course, I had to reply…and had the nice policeman come up to me three different times asking me if I was provoking them…
Afterwards, I saw three men with t-shirts saying the policeman’s union, walk up to his car…
So of course, it’s obvious, it was all Tabitha’s fault.
lovingmyUSA on February 23, 2011 at 11:48 PM
I KNOW you had it all in hand.LoL
The police in Chicago are usually very kind to protesters like…’us’-'Course it helps that I say LOTS of nice things to them.
OT: FYI My FB account got hacked(‘it’ changed my password around 0230 today) and I got it under control-but I temporarily deactivated it to be on the safe side.
If you can’t find my page for a little while-that’s why.
annoyinglittletwerp on February 24, 2011 at 12:02 AM
+ One trillion
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 12:04 AM
Awwwwww…aren’t you precious! Our own little concern troll! Your breath stinks and you have something brown stuck between your teeth.
csdeven on February 24, 2011 at 12:05 AM
Something you learn around grade and beyond is that you DO NOT TOUCH PEOPLE. In grade school you get detention, beyond that age detention is in the county jail.
scotash on February 24, 2011 at 12:18 AM
Stay out of other peoples’ space and use your inside voice.
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 12:24 AM
When you sign in to fb, if it isn’t the page where it has the side by side sign-in (in the upper right hand corner), then its a fake sign in page. Go out and sign in on the internet. This is how the hackers get your password.
lovingmyUSA on February 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM
Mark my words folks, if things get ugly we are not going to be able to depend on unionized police forces.
slickwillie2001 on February 24, 2011 at 12:34 AM
annoyinglittletwerp on February 24, 2011 at 12:02 AM
When you sign in to fb, if it isn’t the page where it has the side by side sign-in (in the upper right hand corner), then its a fake sign in page. Go out and sign in on the internet. This is how the hackers get your password.
lovingmyUSA on February 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM
I took care of it earlier.
I was perpetually signed-in.
I have a hunch I know who did it-and he shouldn’t have been able to even find me since I blocked him.
annoyinglittletwerp on February 24, 2011 at 12:44 AM
Speaking of manufactured stunts … have you seen the union thug protests going on in Wisconsin and other states? All manufactured stunts.
Elections have consequences. Why are democrats so afraid of the democratic process?
Shiny_Tiara on February 24, 2011 at 12:52 AM
Who was counting on those twags?
Inanemergencydial on February 24, 2011 at 12:53 AM
Isn’t it interesting that these movements all feel the need to wear a special colored shirt to identify themselves as separate and above everyone else?
Brown shirts. Black shirts. Red shirts. Silver shirts. Now we have the Purple shirts.
EasyEight on February 24, 2011 at 1:19 AM
Need to fight fire with fire:
Slap a civil rights suit on the thug and/or prosecute him for a ‘hate crime’!
landlines on February 24, 2011 at 2:08 AM
Perhaps this should be viewed another way. Belonging to a union and being in service to progressivism was what caused the behavior.
unclesmrgol on February 24, 2011 at 2:12 AM
There are no trolls on DailyKos — there is, unamazingly, great uniformity of thought over there.
unclesmrgol on February 24, 2011 at 2:16 AM
I just read the update on MM site by the young woman who was hit. She’s only 5’1″ and he was standing on a little wall. I don’t like bullies.
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 2:38 AM
Right on Bro.
AZCON on February 24, 2011 at 3:22 AM
Wow. More “You made me hit you!” posters on this thread than I ever would have imagined.
Can you say dysfunctional?
capitalist piglet on February 24, 2011 at 3:33 AM
It appears to me that the liberal-progressive definition of civility is more like servility to their demands. They are too little different from Muslims in this regard for it to matter.
{+_+}
herself on February 24, 2011 at 4:16 AM
‘AnninCA on’ is semantically equivalent to ‘/stupid’
DarkCurrent on February 24, 2011 at 4:18 AM
That’s worth another modest donation. Thanks, Freedom Works.
petefrt on February 24, 2011 at 6:36 AM
Why are all the union thugs always Democrats? Is this the “Chicago way” too?
Roy Rogers on February 24, 2011 at 7:10 AM
Obamah Akbah…
Roy Rogers on February 24, 2011 at 7:14 AM
I have, indeed, examined the whole scope of both World Wars, and the factors that led to them, and the major battles and many minor ones – from ‘Operation Canned Worms’ with the deceit of Germany to the Tank Battle of Kursk which would pre-sage the end of the war in Europe. In the Pacific Theater such things as the engagement of Task Force Taffy all the way to Iwo Jima are telling engagements not just in loss of life but how the Japanese military operated in a different mode than the US forces.
As an American I am familiar with Bull Run, Manassas (both), Gettysburg, Vicksburg, and the March through Georgia. The battles of the Civil War should have taught lessons to Europe about the necessary differences of what an industrial based war is like versus one that is not done by industrialized Nations.
I am also a war historian, so that a top general, to me, is Belisarius just for the height of his ingenuity and use of force (or non-use as the case may be). If you go far back into the written records of mankind you will find accounts of warfare from before the Bronze Age across Asia, Africa, Europe and the Americas.
I can, must and do distinguish between Public War and Private War as any civilized person must learn to do.
I also distinguish between the use of arms in defense of personal liberty and the use of arms for criminal means, as this is a necessary requirement to understand where all liberty comes from and how it is defended, far beyond freedom of speech.
I have examined warfare as a product of Nations, States, human culture and those who participate in it for Private means who are the enemies of all Mankind. There is a stark difference between a well armed civil population, the Swiss, say, and individuals looking to carve out their personal and petty territories and extortions, like in modern day Somalia or with the Sea Peoples post-Bronze Age collapse.
There reason we have Public War is so that our Nations and States can clearly state why they go to war, inform other Nations (not just enemy but neutrals, as well) of our intents and reasons for war. Thus there is a huge differnce in type and scale between something like the Somme 1917 campaign and the attacks done by MS-13 or those done by Hezbollah or Black Bart’s ships and crews.
A well armed civil population has no fear of their fellow citizens protecting themselves: that is a requirement for civilization and the exercise of liberty.
That is not Private War. Nor is it Public War.
I can, do and must distinguish between them so that I can see who is acting civilized around me and who is not, so that I can properly respond in public and private venues as any citizen can, no matter how rich nor how poor they may be. Some can afford better defense of self than others, but that is a matter of material recompense for one’s works in life, not a judgement that is set in stone, and the poor can and must have as much leeway to defend themselves from those seeking to end their liberty as you or I or the richest man on the planet. Our means do differ, but we all have the exact,same liberty and freedom. I do not eleveate the rich nor denigrate the poor, and am disgusted by any who seek to diminish those who have had problems in life monetarily for they are my fellow man.
Can you understand these differences and their sources in man’s nature and his works? You cannot compare the lawless rogue Armies of Thieves that dot history with your fellow citizen nor with modern, Nation State public military systems. They each have roots in different basis and all, every single one, is an exercise in the positive and negative liberties of war. Civilized man can, shouold and must distinguish between them for the exercise of positive liberties of self-defense is far different than the negative liberty of offensive war. They are both based in man, and how we handle them differently tells the tale of being civilized or uncivilized.
I am more than willing to do that. It has taken me over 35 years to reach my views on this, much of it studying war. Now I study machine tools, metal casting, and the fine art of machining (both hand and computer controlled). That is because I do study the basis of civilization and how they wax and wane that I do that… I know why I do that at this time, in this place. My body deteriorates quickly, and yet this must be done. I trust my analysis of this world because I do know warfare very, very well. I am more than willing to build a civil society and not attack nor denigrate others. Although armed I now study tooling and machining…I know why and trust my analysis in that. I will do what is necessary to sustain civilization because that is what each of us must do. And I do not fear my fellow citizens who follow to that same goal on their own paths. I neither lead nor follow, but find that path on my own and welcome all of those who head towards civil ends… I do not fear the armed poor who are civil and civilized. I cannot speculate on why you do for the poor rarely cause world wars, and are mostly the victim of all war, and they do need to be armed in times of trouble to protect themselves from its effects. I do not mistake their position and means in life with their ever-present liberty as that is within all of us from birth.
ajacksonian on February 24, 2011 at 8:10 AM
Most of these union folks are so ignorant of history and the facts that they actually think they’re in the right … literally forcing taxpayers to supply high wages, full retirements, lavish benefits and health care.
They have groups all around them waving banners that say Socialism Now! along with the Communist party handing out their literature.
The Communists, Socialists, Enviro-Nazis, Islamists and radicals of every stripe urge them on yet somehow they can’t put two and two together.
darwin on February 24, 2011 at 8:13 AM
This is the quintessential idiot baiting troll. HotAir is anything but groupthink, if you’ve ever visited a Christine O’Donnell thread, a Palin thread, a Chris Christie thread, or an evolution/religion thread. There are many examples where conservatives are at each other’s throats on this site.
To paint HotAir as a site with nothing but red meat is ignorant and myopic.
fossten on February 24, 2011 at 8:41 AM
What an evil looking Santa.
BowHuntingTexas on February 24, 2011 at 8:44 AM
The GOP has to start making it clear everywhere just how Union grabs affect the rest of us. I don’t think people understand this and it’s not being shouted from the roof tops as it should be. The Unions reach into all of our pockets, the Democrats help them and none of them see any reason to change. Instead of being so civilized about it(Daniels)–we need to be telling the non-union majority again and again and again just how much the unions steal from them…as loud and nasty as the folks in Madison. The difference–the Unions are organized(the key in this case)…the Tea Party may be one day but is just getting started, this is a good place to begin. They need to rev up and go after these unions. Not a Tea Partier yet but will definitely join their ranks if they can fight the union blight. How this turns out will determine the 2012 election. That’s why our brave leader has abdicated any interest.
jeanie on February 24, 2011 at 8:45 AM
The only thing left the radicals have is to compare us to … uh, them.
Doesn’t work except in their little venom and hate filled minds.
darwin on February 24, 2011 at 8:48 AM
Doubt that this ‘Gentleman’ is going to care much for his 15 minutes of fame.
TimBuk3 on February 24, 2011 at 9:10 AM
I didn’t know Sean Connery was a union protestor out there in WI, when did he move there?
Tom66 on February 24, 2011 at 9:23 AM
One of the things about the rhetoric coming from the left and especially from the unions, is how eerily similar it is to Soviet propaganda.
If anyone has the wherewithall, I highly recommend picking this up and checking it out:
http://www.amazon.com/Animated-Soviet-Propaganda-Revolution-Perestroika/dp/B00003YSMK/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1298557497&sr=1-1
The similarities in the rhetoric, complete with race baiting and the raised fist motif, is chilling.
jjrakman on February 24, 2011 at 9:30 AM
The guy has that sort of douchebag look to him to begin with.
If you can’t judge a book by its cover, then why do they make them each look different?
John Deaux on February 24, 2011 at 9:33 AM
I totally disagree with. //
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 9:42 AM
Has anyone been able to identify who this thug was, considering he is now eligible to have an assault charge leveled on his empty skull?
Oh I forgot. This guy also assaulted a woman, which makes him a gutless, cowardly thug!
pilamaye on February 24, 2011 at 9:44 AM
I bet you actually believe this too.
I was a troll on both those sites, for 2 days each. Know why I got the ban hammer on them? For quoting leftists. Yup, that was it. All I did was find a thread on a particular subject, figure out what the slant was (left, always….it’s never hard to do), and post the words of a leading leftist that were 180 degrees out from what the leftists were then saying (in all cases, I used the words of the very subject of the thread, who was then saying the exact opposite).
I never commented beyond that. All I did was put the subjects words out there. I never elaborated or churched it up in any way. I never included my own words, or changed the subjects words.
And for this I was banned from the major leftist sites. And you have the nerve to tell me that HotAir suffers from groupthink? Try again, young’un.
runawayyyy on February 24, 2011 at 10:02 AM
I have to laugh at the peace at any price people. If you desire peace at any price then you will be a slave to those who dont.
abcurtis on February 24, 2011 at 10:05 AM
I am a bit surprised his bio isn’t all over the place by now.
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 10:07 AM
There are plenty of examples, I’m sorry to say. Just a quick scan of “Richard Holbrooke RIP”:
Another atheist gone on to his great reward.
Inanemergencydial on December 14, 2010 at 8:52 AM
This man should be remebered for the destruction of Yugoslavia, the creation of two failed states controlled by the Ikhwan Mafia whose greatest exports are drugs, white slavery and the finance of islamic terrorism. Namely Bosnia and Kosovo.
He is now before his maker. I’ll bet he has a shocked look on his face. As for me – no loss…
Kuffar on December 14, 2010 at 10:39 AM
Now, it should be said to Hotairheaders’ credit that at least one of these posters suffered from blowback for his comments. But really, all this is truly beside my point, which is that similar extremist, factionalized political rhetoric dominates both the far left an far right in our country, and I for one think it requires a daily bitch slap.
Hopefully, I answered this above.
Phonetically speaking, “phychology 101″ sounds hilariously like “f**kcology 101,” a course many college freshman indeed take with relish.
More grounded in political philosophy? I see plenty of “legit” Marxist thought on Kos, although the discussions here DO tend to seem a mite more philosophical rather than activist-news-oriented. I can’t speak to the “fairness” of the editors. I’ve never had my posts deleted or edited here or at Kos, to my knowledge, although I would be shocked were that to happen. My posts are usually scrupulously about adhering to the TOS, even if they bug the heck out of people. In terms of politics, the editors all strike me as “true believers.”
Dunno what to say, other than you’re quite incorrect. Kos has all species of trolls.
Honestly, your post is just way more elevated and profound than I feel like I can do justice to in answering. If you were typical of 2nd Amendment champions, hell, I’d join the NRA myself. Sadly, what I encounter among gun-rights people more commonly isn’t so noble. Three weeks ago, I saw a drunk man stumble up to the gun counter at Walmart and, slurring, try to buy a shotgun because “I don’t like the way this country’s goin’.” I admire the sincerity of your thinking, but I think you’re a Spartan born around 2,500 years too late.
I’m not sure how much your comment deserves a response, but I sense a genuine hatred in you that has absolutely nothing to do with politics as much as just … you. Let me know how that works out for you in the long run. If you think a center-left independent like me is a “radical,” you’re just way beyond reason.
bifidis on February 24, 2011 at 10:10 AM
Show me the posts. As far as I know, if someone is banned, their posts don’t disappear. Let’s see the evidence.
If it’s as you said, then I join you in condemning those bastards.
bifidis on February 24, 2011 at 10:15 AM
If you actually think you’re “center-left” then it’s you who are way beyond reason.
You’re ignoring the most blatant, obvious attack from the enemy within this country has ever seen and you’re too busy worried about how you’ll be perceived to stand up and say anything against it.
Thanks by the way, for validating exactly what I said. I said the left was full of hate and you turn right around and accuse be of being filled with … hate.
Good job.
darwin on February 24, 2011 at 10:33 AM
I can’t speak for other sites but if someone is banned at HotAir, the offending comments are deleted. Even those who repeat the comments to chastise the offender are deleted.
Cindy Munford on February 24, 2011 at 10:37 AM
I see that you don’t deal well with shades of gray. Shame, that.
TexasDan on February 24, 2011 at 10:37 AM
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 Next »