Global Warming Alarmists in Retreat. Glaciers, Not So Much.

posted at 4:32 pm on January 29, 2011 by Jimmie Bise, Jr

The Church of Global Warming has faced an uphill battle lately. The average person is not likely to accept the message that the planet is warming and that only an unprecedented shift of power and money to progressive policy makers will brings things back to normal once they’ve lived through a couple horrible winters and witnessed the massive fraud perpetrated by the climate science community. So it has come to pass that the number of Britons who believe that global warming is both real and dangerous has shrunk rapidly in the past four years.

The number of climate change sceptics has almost doubled in four years, official research showed yesterday.

A quarter of Britons are unconvinced that the world is warming following successive freezing winters and a series of scandals over the credibility of climate science.

The figures suggest that a growing proportion of the public do not share the belief of all three major political parties and Whitehall – that climate change is a major and urgent challenge requiring radical and expensive policies.

According to the article, 86 percent of those surveyed were at least “fairly convinced” that global warming was a big deal in 2006. That number is now 75 percent and the number of those unconvinced has risen from 12 percent to 23 percent. What’s worse for the climate science alarmists is the part of the survey that asked if people were willing to sacrifice to end the “crisis”. Less than half of those surveyed are willing to switch from driving to using public transportation to help the cause. That number drops even lower when it comes to giving up air travel.

The reasons people see global warming alarmists are less credible is not limited to the “Climategate” fraud or cold winters. Better scientific studies are turning the tide from faith-based politics and toward — dare I say it — a more reality-based position (via memeorandum).

Researchers have discovered that contrary to popular belief half of the ice flows in the Karakoram range of the mountains are actually growing rather than shrinking.

The discovery adds a new twist to the row over whether global warming is causing the world’s highest mountain range to lose its ice cover.

It further challenges claims made in a 2007 report by the UN’s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that the glaciers would be gone by 2035.

Although the head of the panel Dr Rajendra Pachauri later admitted the claim was an error gleaned from unchecked research, he maintained that global warming was melting the glaciers at “a rapid rate”, threatening floods throughout north India.

What’s more, the new study, which included almost 290 glaciers, showed that global warming isn’t the chief reason a glacier melts, but terrain and how much debris covers the glacier’s surface. That makes sense, if you take a few moments and noodle it through.

This study is just the latest scientific nail in the global warming alarmism coffin. The general population is running away from the alarmists and toward the far more reasonable position that the global climate is an enormous beast whose course we can not easily nor carelessly change but whose workings we should study more earnestly. To quote Michael Rubin Ledeen in a different context, “Faster, please”.


Jimmie runs The Sundries Shack and has his own very entertaining podcast called “The Delivery”. He is also an amateur musician, an aspiring composer, an unrepentant geek and an avid fan of Twitter.

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This is the problem with the right. A general contempt for science,

bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:47 PM

I just love how the left keeps repeating that little axiom. They’ve all bought it hook line and sinker.

The problem with the left: you guys destroy the meaning of words. There is no scientific problem whose solution is wealth redistribution. We have a contempt for wealth redistribution. We love real science.

strictnein on January 29, 2011 at 8:23 PM

global warming science.

bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:31 PM

It isn’t.
CO2 concentrations follow warmer temps.
It is not the other way around, so far as can be seen.
Satellite surface temps do not reflect the ‘cloud cover’ effect.
A former cloud scientist for NASA made it a point to try & have this corrected.
It hasn’t been, so far as I know.
The few measly years of temp data mankind has been taking for the last century or so (with modern equipment) is a drop in the bucket compared to geologic time.
Ice cores show the 1st point I made. And there has been no one that has proven any other way. If they do genuinely, so be it.
CO2 is not a driver of climate.
Climate is too chaotic & not understood well enough to make sweeping long term predictions.
Sea ice has & will again melt.
This has happened many times before. For example, it allowed the Vikings to reach N. America, Greenland & Iceland.
There are active volcanoes under the ocean up in the Arctic near Iceland. They affect sea ice.
Polar bears are not in danger of extinction.
There is at least one polar bear gene pool group declining that I know of, for reasons other than climate. The rest are thriving.
Glaciers have always changed in size. They will continue to do so, no matter what we are doing.
The E. Anglia emails: I read them the day they were released. I spend quite a while doing it.
They conspired to hide & cheat & lie.
It is obvious to anyone who spends the time to read through them.
Climate models cannot predict anything.
And in fact, much of this AGW crap has been nothing more than untestable hypotheses that have been floated around to get grant money.
A Krippendorfer’s Tribe of huge proportions.
Man kind is not significant enough to change the climate on large scales.
And as I said before, there is no experimentation that show CO2 drives climate.
None.
Climate may be changing, but it happens naturally.
And the ENSO phenomenon is not even fully understood.
All of this hysterical fear mongering about climate change, danger in reducing Biodiversity, Gaia-a rejected hypothesis that is untestable anyway, does nothing more than line the pockets of self important scientists eager to hold onto their positions.
Isostasy, volcanism, the heating & cooling of the ocean, ENSO, the SUN, etc. are all things that have a large effect on climate.
And we do not understand them all.

Badger40 on January 29, 2011 at 8:28 PM

This is the problem with the right. A general contempt for science, with almost no young righties studying science at top research universities or pursuing careers in scientific research. Less than 5% of polled young scientists even belong to the Republican Party.

The problem with you Poly Sci retards, is that you’ve been caught just making things up, one too many times. 95% of scientists are now leftist trash. Ya, right. Maybe it’s you frauds pulling polls out of your @$$ to “prove” science, is what has this particular group of Marxist trash on the run.

The scientific method had always worked, until the era of Mann/Hanson. A fraud like you should get a clue from that.

MNHawk on January 29, 2011 at 8:31 PM

To quote Michael Rubin Ledeen in a different context, “Faster, please”.

I thought that was a Glenn Reynolds thing.

disa on January 29, 2011 at 8:32 PM

This is the problem with the right. A general contempt for science,

bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:47 PM

I just love how the left keeps repeating that little axiom. They’ve all bought it hook line and sinker.

The problem with the left: you guys destroy the meaning of words. There is no scientific problem whose solution is wealth redistribution. We have a contempt for wealth redistribution. We love real science.

strictnein on January 29, 2011 at 8:23 PM

As a person ‘on the right’, & a geologist & HS science teacher, I beg to differ with our troll here.
I love science that follows the scientific method.
Testing real hypotheses that can actually be tested, instead of computer models that cannot predict anything, & if they do, it’s stuff 50-100 yrs in the future when everyone involved is dead anyway.
You look at what Michael Mann did in his research & you will understand why many scientists hold him in contempt.
He is a fraud.
It doesn’t matter if you have a PhD & are a scientist & think you’re the smartest guy in the room bcs if your research & methodology do not pass the mustard with other scientists, you are done.
The peer review process for this AGW junk science is a joke.
And you don’t have to have a PhD to see that.

Badger40 on January 29, 2011 at 8:32 PM

As long as 95% of major research universities in the US, including the very independent Notre Dame, continue to stand firmly behind global warming science, I think my statement is accurate.
bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:50 PM

Link please

Chuck Schick on January 29, 2011 at 8:33 PM

As long as 95% of major research universities in the US, including the very independent Notre Dame, continue to stand firmly behind global warming science, I think my statement is accurate.
bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:50 PM

While you are providing the link to back up this, please provide a link to the amount on money(gubmint grants) these esteemed center of knowledge and integrity are getting to support their research.

Thanks!

belad on January 29, 2011 at 8:49 PM

Heads Up Everybody: More Global Warming on the Way.

What: Major winter storm complete with heavy snow, sleet and freezing rain to impact Rockies, Plains, Midwest

When: Monday Night (January 31) through midday Wednesday (February 2)

100 Million Potentially Impacted by Next Storm

H/T: Drudge.

Geochelone on January 29, 2011 at 8:55 PM

If you don’t like the science, at least keep an open mind.
bayam on January 29, 2011 at 6:20 PM

It’s not about “not liking the science”…
It’s about asking people to believe “scientist” that have been shown to have lied,manipulate data,make bogus prediction after bogus prediction,and collect billions of dollars in the process.

bayam…you are continuously railing about the “science” when we have the leaders of the Global Warming sect that can’t even produce their work.
That’s not scientific.

Most of the major claims by the eco-fundamentalist crowd have been shown to either be based on manipulated data or to just be plain false:


UN climate chief admits mistake on Himalayan glaciers warning

Jeremy Page, South Asia Correspondent

The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) said yesterday that the prediction in its landmark 2007 report was “poorly substantiated” and resulted from a lapse in standards. “In drafting the paragraph in question the clear and well-established standards of evidence, required by the IPCC procedures, were not applied properly,” the panel said. “The chair, vice-chair and co-chairs of the IPCC regret the poor application of IPCC procedures in this instance.”

….this report of falsified data also earned this board the Nobel Prize.
Well at least it probably took them longer to cut’n'paste this than the 9 days it took Obama to earn his Nobel Prize.


UN climate change panel based claims on student dissertation and magazine article

The United Nations’ expert panel on climate change based claims about ice disappearing from the world’s mountain tops on a student’s dissertation and an article in a mountaineering magazine.

In its most recent report, it stated that observed reductions in mountain ice in the Andes, Alps and Africa was being caused by global warming, citing two papers as the source of the information.
However, it can be revealed that one of the sources quoted was a feature article published in a popular magazine for climbers which was based on anecdotal evidence from mountaineers about the changes they were witnessing on the mountainsides around them.
The other was a dissertation written by a geography student, studying for the equivalent of a master’s degree, at the University of Berne in Switzerland that quoted interviews with mountain guides in the Alps.

What’s next….they going to start basing their conclusions on the rants coming from Rosanne Barr’s blog??????


UN wrongly linked global warming to natural disasters
Jonathan Leake, Science and Environment Editor

THE United Nations climate science panel faces new controversy for wrongly linking global warming to an increase in the number and severity of natural disasters such as hurricanes and floods.
It based the claims on an unpublished report that had not been subjected to routine scientific scrutiny — and ignored warnings from scientific advisers that the evidence supporting the link too weak. The report’s own authors later withdrew the claim because they felt the evidence was not strong enough.

Wow….
…this is the definition of activism….not science.


After Climategate, Pachaurigate and Glaciergate: Amazongate

 
By James Delingpole Politics Last updated: January 25th, 2010
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100023598/after-climategate-pachaurigate-and-glaciergate-amazongate/

But the IPCC’s shamelessness did not end there. Dr North has searched the WWF’s reports high and low but can find no evidence of a statement to support the IPCC’s claim that “40 per cent” of the Amazon is threatened by climate change. (Logging and farm expansion are a much more plausible threat).
Watts Up With That provides a further, worryingly long list of the non-peer-reviewed papers from the World Wildlife Fund cited as evidence in the IPCC’s Fourth Assessment report. Time, it asks, for the IPCC to be stripped of its Nobel Peace Prize?


IPCC warnings about African crops also bogus

posted at 9:30 am on February 15, 2010 by Ed Morrissey

Another key element of the IPCC report on anthropogenic global warming (AGW) turns out to be based on deliberate decisions to use the most hysterical claims by advocates rather than on science.  The IPCC warnings of the African crop projections have a more demonstrably corrupt basis, as the report deliberately ignored actual science that showed little risk of crop yields — science funded by the British government at a cost of over £2.5 million.  Who compiled the IPCC Synthesis that ignored peer-reviewed science for the speculation of one Moroccan activist, whose report didn’t even agree with its cited sources?  Rajendra Pachauri’s own business — and he got over £400,000 for the work:

Works out pretty good…
….cook the books to help us push our agenda and get paid big bucks…

How scientific!!!!!

Glacier scientist: I knew data hadn’t been verified

By David Rose
Last updated at 12:54 AM on 24th January 2010

The scientist behind the bogus claim in a Nobel Prize-winning UN report that Himalayan glaciers will have melted by 2035 last night admitted it was included purely to put political pressure on world leaders.

However, an analysis of those 500-plus formal review comments, to be published tomorrow by the Global Warming Policy Foundation (GWPF), the new body founded by former Chancellor Nigel Lawson, suggests that when reviewers did raise issues that called the claim into question, Dr Lal and his colleagues simply ignored them.

…So lets include false data to put pressure on politicians so that they will support our agenda..

How scientific!!!!!!

Rise of sea levels is ‘the greatest lie ever told’
The uncompromising verdict of Dr Mörner is that all this talk about the sea rising is nothing but a colossal scare story, writes Christopher Booker.

Christopher Booker
Published: 6:25PM GMT 28 Mar 2009

But if there is one scientist who knows more about sea levels than anyone else in the world it is the Swedish geologist and physicist Nils-Axel Mörner, formerly chairman of the INQUA International Commission on Sea Level Change. And the uncompromising verdict of Dr Mörner, who for 35 years has been using every known scientific method to study sea levels all over the globe, is that all this talk about the sea rising is nothing but a colossal scare story.

….over and over and over and over the politics of fear and predictions of disaster are exposed as lies pushed by nothing but money hungry frauds.

….but according to the “adults”…
………if you don’t take their word the Global Warming science is settled…..you are a dumb, right wing idiot, that doesn’t “believe in science”.

I certainly believe what this scientist stated:

If you have to argue your science by using fraud, your science is not valid.

Professor Pilmer

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 9:02 PM

Scientists, academics, politicians, computer models…who would ever think that this mix could result in fraud?

BTW, the computer simulations on economics are about on the same level of quality.

IlikedAUH2O on January 29, 2011 at 9:05 PM

75% is still a heckuva lot.

Jewels on January 29, 2011 at 9:06 PM

Heads Up Everybody: More Global Warming on the Way.

What: Major winter storm complete with heavy snow, sleet and freezing rain to impact Rockies, Plains, Midwest

When: Monday Night (January 31) through midday Wednesday (February 2)

100 Million Potentially Impacted by Next Storm

H/T: Drudge.

Geochelone on January 29, 2011 at 8:55 PM

That’s the trouble with global warming… if the weather isn’t perfect it is due to global warming. Only 72 and Sunny is normal. /s

Dasher on January 29, 2011 at 9:07 PM

Out here in the Midwest, we’ve resumed using hairspray, and have encouraged cow farts at every opportunity….

and still we have to shovel 9″ of snow off our streets and driveways…

Apparently this Global Warming thing hasn’t read the manuals published by the Left.

…or could it be that a climate theory which ignores both water and the sun is actually pure B.S.??

landlines on January 29, 2011 at 9:08 PM

The Church of Global Warming has faced an uphill battle lately.

Yea…it sure has some people pretty stressed out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-PI2vCA9ck&feature=player_embedded

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 9:08 PM

Badger40 on January 29, 2011 at 8:28 PM

“CO2 is not a driver of climate..”

On what authority do you make such a claim? What is your scientific background?

As far as I can tell, your list of things that you think disprove modern theories of antropogenic global warming have nothing or very little to do with the matter.

“And as I said before, there is no experimentation that show CO2 drives climate.
None”

Again, no authority whatsover for this statement. No reference no scientific standing. A simple bit of reading scientific literature would show this to be absolutely baseless, unless you are inventing your own paradigm about how the universe operates.

“The E. Anglia emails: I read them the day they were released. I spend quite a while doing it.
They conspired to hide & cheat & lie.”

Not that E.Anglia carries any scientific authority on AWG on its own, but there is no basis for this assertion you have made. The “hide & cheat & lie” you are referring to, does it have anything to do with the focus of the reasearch or the acquisition or processing of data? If you think it does, then please connect the dots. None of the investigations that have been done by independent agencies has revealed anything on the level you have asserted.

“”Isostasy, volcanism, the heating & cooling of the ocean, ENSO, the SUN, etc. are all things that have a large effect on climate.
And we do not understand them all”

And so does carbon dioxide, in the quantities that humans spew out year after year.

BTW, there are entire divisions of scientific research that deal with these matters.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:13 PM

Apparently this Global Warming thing hasn’t read the manuals published by the Left.

Did global warming theories ever state that winter would be cancelled? Please quote source.

From what I have read, global warming would result in more precipitation (due to higher temperatures), allowing for winter precipitation events of greater severity (when they happen). This is not something new, but has been predicted widely for decades.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

And now sauerkraut is here to threadsit and spread disinformation…

The only solution is confiscation of personal property and limited liberty!

Inanemergencydial on January 29, 2011 at 9:18 PM

I love this part of the article.

Dr Pachauri, head of the Nobel prize-winning UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, has remained silent on the matter since he was forced to admit his report’s claim that the Himalayan glaciers would melt by 2035 was an error and had not been sourced from a peer-reviewed scientific journal. It came from a World Wildlife Fund report.

He angered India’s environment minister and the country’s leading glaciologist when he attacked those who questioned his claim as purveyors of “voodoo science”.

Love the fact that when you expose the fraud of activists they go straight to the condescending name calling.


Just like here when you expose the fraud of Global Warming alarmist….you are a “dumb,right wing,flat earther.

Don’t agree with Obama….you are a racist,nazi…

Don’t want your taxes raised…especially during “the worst economic environment since the Great Depression”…..you are un-patriotic…..

Don’t want a government run Health Care system…..you are a dumb,racist,right winger that wants to kill Grandma….

Support our Soldiers and their mission in Iraq/Afghanistan…you are a blood thirsty,nazi,and a war monger…

Got to love all that intelligence and civility coming from the left.

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 9:24 PM

It’s been known for a long time that most glaciers that disappear are due to particulate matter from human activity. That’s quite different than catastrophic global warming and is completely unrelated.

Also, the whole runaway CO2 alarm seems to have been a false alarm. Seems that new research is underway, in Alaska amongst other places, that show the MWP (Medieval Warm Period 1000 years ago) and the RWP (Roman Warm Period 2000 years ago) were warmer than today and was indeed global.

However, the planet is getting warmer. Just happens to be a natural cycle and not unusual at all.

MrX on January 29, 2011 at 9:26 PM

However, the planet is getting warmer. Just happens to be a natural cycle and not unusual at all.

MrX on January 29, 2011 at 9:26 PM

You mean higher taxes will not reverse AGW.

darwin-t on January 29, 2011 at 9:34 PM

Testing real hypotheses that can actually be tested, instead of computer models that cannot predict anything, & if they do, it’s stuff 50-100 yrs in the future when everyone involved is dead anyway

So, Badger, you are a “HS science teacher”. So was I. Always good to know that there are people with scientific backgrounds who are getting into the debate.

It seems that computer models have gotten quite advanced. Now, climate is not weather, though, as you know, they are related. The same types of mathematics and computer algorithms that are involved in predicting weather are also employed in climate modelling (though there are also major differences). If modelling atmospheric events “cannot predict anything”, then how are we able to get fairly reliable weather reports days in advance? Heckuva lot better than a couple of decades ago. And getting better all the time.

Do you ever make plans based on weather reporting from your local weather service?

Now, back in the 1970s (mid), a rather sizeable consensus of scientists were predicting that temperatures would begin to rise significantly, and by the beginning of the 21st century, the rising temperature trends would be unmistakeable in terms of human influence.

2010 is the hottest year in recorded global history (along with 2005). The “aughts” were the warmest decade – globally – known to man. There are no known forcing factors that can account for this anomaly, other than carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere being higher than at any other time in this age.

Cause for concern? The overwhelming consensus of scientists and scientific professional societies agree that there is.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:37 PM

The overwhelming consensus of scientists and scientific professional societies agree that there is.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:37 PM

Which part of Oakland do they let you keep chickens in?

darwin-t on January 29, 2011 at 9:47 PM

blink on January 29, 2011 at 9:25 PM

Actually….only a few years ago….the eco-fundamentalist stated that global warming did reduce moisture in the air:

Al’s Latest Global-Warming Whopper

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/03/02/als-latest-global-warming-whopper/?test=latestnews

According to “State of the Climate” from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, “Global precipitation in 2009 was near the 1961-1990 average.” And there was certainly no pattern of increasing rain and snow on America’s East Coast during the post-1976 years, when NOAA says the globe began to heat up.

In late January, Scientific American reported: “A mysterious drop in water vapor in the lower stratosphere might be slowing climate change,” and noted that “an apparent increase in water vapor in this region in the 1980s and 1990s exacerbated global warming.”

The new study came from a group of scientists, mainly from the NOAA lab in Boulder. The scientists found: “Stratospheric water-vapor concentrations decreased by about 10 percent after the year 2000 . . . This acted to slow the rate of increase in global surface temperature over 2000 to 2009 by about 25 percent.”


Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past

By Charles Onians
Monday, 20 March 2000
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/snowfalls-are-now-just-a-thing-of-the-past-724017.html

winter ends tomorrow with further indications of a striking environmental change: snow is starting to disappear from our lives.
Sledges, snowmen, snowballs and the excitement of waking to find that the stuff has settled outside are all a rapidly diminishing part of Britain’s culture, as warmer winters – which scientists are attributing to global climate change – produce not only fewer white Christmases, but fewer white Januaries and Februaries.

However, the warming is so far manifesting itself more in winters which are less cold than in much hotter summers. According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia,within a few years winter snowfall will become “a very rare and exciting event”.

Plus many democrats on the Hill stated that the lack of snow was the result of Global Warming and stated that the IPCC backed this up:

BYRD 2002: We need a climate change strategy badly. Look at the kind of winter we’ve had here in Washington. One snow, three inches? What can we expect for the spring and summer seasons? What’s going to happen to our crops, our livestock, our economy? This is serious. I’ve lived a long time, 84 years. Something’s going wrong out there. I don’t need a scientist to tell me that. We had better do something about it.


BOXER 2007:
He also remarked that the most optimistic climate models for the second half of this century suggest that 30 to 70% of the snow pack will disappear. Now, no wonder we have people visiting our offices who are just already hurting from the recreation industry in this nation. They see what’s happening. They see the handwriting on the wall. We have to act.


KLOBUCHAR 2008:
I heard it from the head of our snowmobile association who testified at a forum that I had with our governor on climate change in January because they’ve seen decreasing snow levels. I hear about it from ice fishermen because they have seen that it takes longer for the ice to freeze and they can’t put their fish house out.


BOXER 2009:
Looking at the United States of America, the IPCC clearly warned that unchecked global warming will lead to reduced snow pack in the western mountains, critically reducing access to water, which is our lifeblood.

FEINSTEIN 2005:
The Sierra Nevada snow pack is the largest source of water. The snow pack equals about half the storage capacity of all of California’s man-made reservoirs. By the end of the century, the shrinking of the snow pack will eliminate the water source for 16 million people.


BOXER 2007:
The potential consequences will be devastating for our families in the future and for the world. Now we’re seeing the early warning signs. People can come down to this floor and say whatever they want. We’ve seen melting of snow, we have seen melting of permafrost, increased temperatures, warming of lakes, rivers, oceans, changes in the seasons.


INSLEE 2005:
The ski industry in the Cascade Mountains in Washington essentially was shut down this year. My son’s on ski patrol and he worked for three days this year, there was no snow. And having no snow is consistent with what the models will predict will become a significant problem for us in the future.

…Now that Countries all over the world are getting buried in Snow….
………….The adults claim “We always said that Global warming meant more snow”….

..and that it was proof the Glaciers were melting…

………..and that it caused severe weather like increased Hurricane activity…

………and that it was proof the oceans would rise…

………….and that the Amazon forest was being destroyed

….and….and…and..since we can;t back any of this up with valid data,our predictions have all been wrong,and we have been caught cooking the books….
…….well then …………….it must be Palin’s fault.

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 9:50 PM

However, the planet is getting warmer. Just happens to be a natural cycle and not unusual at all.

MrX on January 29, 2011 at 9:26 PM

The MWP has not been shown to be anything other than a local “event”. To my knowledge, there has not been any body of data that suggest or support claims that it was a world-wide “event”. Please provide supporting scientific research to show me I am incorrect about this.

But, lets just assume that it was a global event, and, of course, “natural”. What then does that really tell us about the present time? Can you say positively that present events and climate states exactly mirror those in that time?

With climatic patterns shifting around the globe, how would the massive disruption in agriculture that inevitably result be of benefit to the global community? Are we to be reassured that some folks managed to survive the previous significant warming “event”?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:51 PM

2010 is the hottest year in recorded global history (along with 2005). The “aughts” were the warmest decade – globally – known to man. There are no known forcing factors that can account for this anomaly, other than carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere being higher than at any other time in this age.

Cause for concern? The overwhelming consensus of scientists and scientific professional societies agree that there is.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:37 PM

Do your “hottest years” and “hottest decades” include the intentional moving of sensors into hotter locations, and have they been adjusted for the various errors that have been found?

In your last sentence, you refer to overwhelming consensus. This is the very opposite of science. Stop citing it.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 9:55 PM

The “aughts” were the warmest decade – globally – known to man.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:37 PM

Hotter, even, than either the Medieval or Roman warm periods?

Which, BTW, were beneficial to humans.

OldEnglish on January 29, 2011 at 9:57 PM

OldEnglish on January 29, 2011 at 9:57 PM

You may not get an answer from Oakland. Your question is too direct to be dodged.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 9:58 PM

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 9:50 PM

You managed to quote only one scientific source in your entire post. That was a fragment of a SI article that, without the rest of the context, has nothing of any value to ponder.

Also, do you really consider those television reporters and politicians you quote to be authoritative in the matter of AWG (as opposed to those who have devoted years in training and practice in the relevant scientific disciplines)?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:01 PM

Did global warming theories ever state that winter would be cancelled? Please quote source.

From what I have read, global warming would result in more precipitation (due to higher temperatures), allowing for winter precipitation events of greater severity (when they happen). This is not something new, but has been predicted widely for decades.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

-
Give it a rest dude… We all know that GW will result in floods/droughts, blizzards/snowless winters, hurricanes/no hurricanes, heat waves and cool summers… Pretty much whatever weather pattern happens… is covered.
-
The real kicker is that the huge snow here in the Philly area last week was predicted to be very unlikely (9 to 1 odds against) when using certain indicators concerning large December snow falls and their predictive use for January snow fall amounts.
-
The science is there, and so are the deep piles of fresh January snow that show that the climate scientist was wrong.
-
Climate and weather care not for your ramblings…. and Al Gore is a snake oil salesman who took advantage of your gullibility.
-

RalphyBoy on January 29, 2011 at 10:02 PM

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 9:58 PM

It’s always the little things that get in the way of an agenda.

OldEnglish on January 29, 2011 at 10:04 PM

You managed to quote only one scientific source in your entire post.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:01 PM

Best I can tell that’s one more than you’ve quoted in the entire thread.

Oldnuke on January 29, 2011 at 10:05 PM

This is the problem with the right. A general contempt for science,

bayam on January 29, 2011 at 5:47 PM

You couldn’t be more dead wrong.

Science is science. It is what it is. Most on the right have a deep respect for it.

Contempt is held for the assumption, void of any reflection at all, that the mere happenstance of being born in the modern age is qualification into the realm of enlightenment, without the slightest suspicion of having been robbed of a rigorous training in critical thinking.

Saltysam on January 29, 2011 at 10:05 PM

blink on January 29, 2011 at 10:03 PM

But, but, but – we have consensus on our side!
You dare challenge our non-supported data?
Nobody sees the wizard! Not nobody, not nohow!

/oakland mode off

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:07 PM

Stop citing it.

I will cite what I feel is relevant. You can take it or leave it. Freedom of choice.

Do your “hottest years” and “hottest decades” include the intentional moving of sensors into hotter locations, and have they been adjusted for the various errors that have been found?

They include the best available data, to my knowledge. Do you have any better to quote?

Also, I don’t understand where you get the “intentional moving of sensors into hotter locations”. Have you seen where the sensors that NOAA keeps are located? Also, what do you mean by “adjusted for various errors that have been found”. Do you understand why temperature data – or any other data collected by a digital or analog device – needs to be “adjusted”?

Now, if by “adjusted” you mean “falsified”, then please provide evidence of that falsification. Nobody that I know of has been able to demonstrate “falsification”.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:08 PM

2010 is the hottest year in recorded global history (along with 2005).


Only 9,099 Of Last 10,500 Years Warmer Than 2010

December 30, 2010 9:00 A.M.
By Brian Bolduc
http://www.nationalreview.com/planet-gore/256079/only-9099-last-10500-years-warmer-2010-brian-bolduc

So where do the 1934/1998/2010 warm years rank in the long-term list of warm years? Of the past 10,500 years, 9,100 were warmer than 1934/1998/2010.  Thus, regardless of which year ( 1934, 1998, or 2010) turns out to be the warmest of the past century, that year will rank number 9,099 in the long-term list.

…When is someone going to provide links or irrefutable data that proves there is global warming and that it is responsible for the seas rising…

………the glaciers melting..

………………the destruction of the Amazon forest

…………………….increase in Hurricanes

…………………………increase in snow storms (would like to see how they refute the claims of “less snow” being because of global warming just a few years ago).

and proof that the core of the earth is over 1 MILLION DEGREES!!! according to the fantastic climate expert (in liberal circles) Al Gore.

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 10:10 PM

Interesting. And didn’t Mann’s Hockey Stick rely on “local” tree rings?

Can you show how “tree rings” demonstrate a global MWP?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:10 PM

Like roaches to crumbs.

Hello Oakland. GAFL.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:15 PM

Best I can tell that’s one more than you’ve quoted in the entire thread.

Oldnuke on January 29, 2011 at 10:05 PM

This might be a good place to start:http://ncar.ucar.edu/learn-more-about/climate

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:15 PM

Oakland just wants to believe. Don’t bother with the dimwit.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:15 PM

AND a phucking couple years ago BELIEVERS like Oakland bought into the predictions about the increasing hurricanes AND their increasing intensity. OAKLAND you have NO credibility. Like I said get a life. Sheesh..these AGW threads draw you in. You are lacking in all other areas. That is QUITE evident.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:17 PM

Like roaches to crumbs.

Hello Oakland. GAFL.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:15 PM

Hello CW. I know you. Sorry, won’t bite – unless you might have an objective contribution to the discussion.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:18 PM

They include the best available data, to my knowledge.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:08 PM

GRASPING. Laughable.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:18 PM

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:08 PM

Watts and others have written about sensor shennanigans. Nasa, amongst others, “revised” a bunch of data, after it was questions. All of this has been brought to this debate before. Attempting to deflect questions about the underpinnings of your quasi-religous junk science doesn’t feed the bulldog, Jake.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:18 PM

Hey Oakland I you ahole. Tell me- you bought into the BS about the hurricanes. What happened . Bite that believer.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:19 PM

AND a phucking couple years ago BELIEVERS like Oakland bought into the predictions about the increasing hurricanes AND their increasing intensity. OAKLAND you have NO credibility. Like I said get a life. Sheesh..these AGW threads draw you in. You are lacking in all other areas. That is QUITE evident.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:17 PM

…or perhaps something with even a modicum of demonstrable intelligence
With that, you can have the last word…

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:19 PM

Oakland tell me. Do you have other interests? Really? Why are you rarely on other threads? This IS YOUR RELIGION. Don’t you get it? You get purpose from this scare tactic. Without it your life has little meaning..that is very clear.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:20 PM

Watts and others have written about sensor shennanigans. Nasa, amongst others, “revised” a bunch of data, after it was questions.

James Hansen at NASA was minded concerning a mistake in his analysis concerning temperature data. He thanked the contributor and made the correction. This is the way science is done.

Now, what “shennanigans” are you referring to?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

With that, you can have the last word…

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:19 PM

Ahhh in other words your belief that we would see more and more hurricanes at greater intensity never materialized. You were crushed but in no way were you going to let that get in the way of your FAITH. Seriously GAFL.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

Everyone needs to notice how the Oaklands just totally FORGET about their predictions about hurricanes. See the games he plays.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:23 PM

OAKLAND what other interests do you have? You are worse than the Mormons who knock on my door every spring.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:24 PM

Now, what “shennanigans” are you referring to?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

Again, you know full well what I’m referring to.
Lazy, obtuse, or both?

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM

oakland, do you agree that the Mann Hockey Stick has been materially debunked?

oakland, do you agree that there will be no CAGW unless water vapor behaves as positive feedback?

blink on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

You asked me these two questions before. I responded that I don’t know what YOU mean by “catastrophic anthropogenic global warming” and by the “hockey stick”. Until you can define those terms to me to your satisfaction, I can’t answer what I “believe” in.

And, why would you be so concerned about what I, a non-expert, might “believe” in?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM

Again, you know full well what I’m referring to.
Lazy, obtuse, or both?

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM

Maybe both. I know you’re not too lazy to give a more precise meaning to your reference of “shennanigans”.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:27 PM

This is the way science is done.

Now, what “shennanigans” are you referring to?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

Needlessly smug there, sporto.
Save your condescension someone else.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:28 PM

Oakland …your silence is proof you cannot explain away the reality that hurricanes did not increase in number and intensity. That is ok we both know you won’t let facts get int the way of your “beliefs”. Have a blast. Sheesh.

What are those other interests again?

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:28 PM

Save your condescension someone else.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:28 PM

Ever notice extreme believers in any religion resort to condescension?

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:29 PM

global warming would result in more precipitation (due to higher temperatures),…

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

More precipitation than when? Where?

And what about areas that have seen less precipitation? (again, less than what? Where?)

allowing for winter precipitation events of greater severity (when they happen).

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

More severe than when? Where?

This is not something new, but has been predicted widely for decades.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

The predictions include the comparative data for when and where, right? And that data goes back a long long time, right? And the data has been consistently collected from the same hundreds of thousands of collection points on all land and ocean masses around the entire globe for a long, long time, right?

You are struggling to believe. You must have faith. Do not lose faith.

Saltysam on January 29, 2011 at 10:30 PM

allowing for winter precipitation events of greater severity (when they happen).

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:16 PM

Grasping. Seriously you are a hoot.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:31 PM

Do not lose faith.

Saltysam on January 29, 2011 at 10:30 PM

Don’t worry it ain’t going anywhere.

/

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:31 PM

Hmmm nothing on those scary hurricanes from the expert. Silence speaks VOLUMES.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:33 PM

Wait, do you seriously not understand the all the problems associated with the temperature record????

blink on January 29, 2011 at 10:18 PM

There are always “problems” with data. But, astute scientists can find “problems” and suggest solutions. Do you know of any scientists that have found “problems” with the data or its analysis and have not been afforded the means to provide remedies?

But (with apologies to Don Rumsfeld) you go to research with the data that you have.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:34 PM

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:33 PM

Nothing on the hurricanes. Nothing on the hockey stick. Nothing on the willfully falsified data. Nothing on the funky placement of sensors. No direct answers to direct questions.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:35 PM

But (with apologies to Don Rumsfeld) you go to research with the data that you have.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:34 PM

But, we only ask that you stop insisting that the imperfect data allows you to conclude with settled certainty, that your conclusion is absolute truth.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 10:37 PM

Also, I don’t understand where you get the “intentional moving of sensors into hotter locations”.

This has been well documented:


Strange case of moving weather posts and a scientist under siege

In the first part of a major investigation of the so-called ‘climategate’ emails, one of Britain’s top science writers reveals how researchers tried to hide flaws in a key study
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/feb/01/dispute-weather-fraud

The Guardian has learned that crucial data obtained by American scientists from Chinese collaborators cannot be verified because documents containing them no longer exist. And what data is available suggests that the findings are fundamentally flawed.

The paper became a key reference source for the conclusions of succeeding reports of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change – including a chapter in the 2007 one co-authored by Jones. It said that globally “the urbanisation influence … is, at most, an order of magnitude less than the warming seen on a century timescale”. In other words, it is tiny.


He pointed out that the data showed that 49 of the Chinese meteorological stations had no histories of their location or other details. These mysterious stations included 40 of the 42 rural stations. Of the rest, 18 had certainly been moved during the study period, perhaps invalidating their data.


Russian IEA claims CRU tampered with climate data – cherrypicked warmest stations

16 12 2009
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/12/16/russian-iea-claims-cru-tampered-with-climate-data-cherrypicked-warmest-stations/

It’s true, and it’s huge. Today another example of CRU having their foot on the scale, Russian papers are reporting that the Russian surface station data was sorted by CRU to use the highest warming stations only.


Was there any actual warming to begin with?

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/02/14/was-there-any-actual-warming-to-begin-with/

“The temperature records cannot be relied on as indicators of global change,” said John Christy, professor of atmospheric science at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, a former lead author on the IPCC.
The doubts of Christy and a number of other researchers focus on the thousands of weather stations around the world, which have been used to collect temperature data over the past 150 years.
These stations, they believe, have been seriously compromised by factors such as urbanisation, changes in land use and, in many cases, being moved from site to site.

…Oakland has yet to back up any of his claims..
…….continues to move the goal posts when his claims don’t hold water and distract by throwing out other questions…..

…….and has yet to provide any proof to back up anything he states and yet demands others show proof.

How scientific!!!!!

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 10:39 PM

More precipitation than when? Where?

And what about areas that have seen less precipitation? (again, less than what? Where?)

We have seen less precipitation here.

Now, as an average, global (and that is the issue) precipitation has indeed increased, although there is not a clear connection discernable to global warming.

More severe than when? Where?

Again, as global average. We have seen this in the eastern US and europe this season. The issue is the amplifiation in snowfall volumes. Note the record snowfalls in the northeast. This is not inconsistent with the prediction of more extreme precipitation rates.

The predictions include the comparative data for when and where, right? And that data goes back a long long time, right? And the data has been consistently collected from the same hundreds of thousands of collection points on all land and ocean masses around the entire globe for a long, long time, right?

…compared with the best available data known. More data, including proxy data, are being collected with time. I would suggest that you, if you haven’t already, read the relevant data on NOAA or NCAR.

G’nite mate.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:44 PM

Oakland runs. Laughable.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:46 PM

Oakland you’re just a b*tch

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:47 PM

.and has yet to provide any proof to back up anything he states and yet demands others show proof.

How scientific!!!!!

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 10:39 PM

Heh

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 10:47 PM

With climatic patterns shifting around the globe, how would the massive disruption in agriculture that inevitably result be of benefit to the global community? Are we to be reassured that some folks managed to survive the previous significant warming “event”?
oakland on January 29, 2011 at 9:51 PM

this coming from the side that has destroyed Californias fertile fields for an inedible smelt

bwahahaha

what a joke

sure you still want to sell that load of BS

still, in the end you also try to sell that somehow giving up freedom, because having your wealth stolen is giving up your freedom, will somehow cure this

haha jackass

your side cries about slavery and you want to help them put he chains on

drop _____

Sonosam on January 29, 2011 at 10:55 PM

Bayam got tossed around like a beachball at a concert I guess it’s oaklands turn

first thing I think when I hear Oakland is not flattering

Sonosam on January 29, 2011 at 10:59 PM

More precipitation than when? Where?

And what about areas that have seen less precipitation? (again, less than what? Where?)

We have seen less precipitation here.

Now, as an average, global (and that is the issue) precipitation has indeed increased, although there is not a clear connection discernable to global warming.

More severe than when? Where?

Again, as global average. We have seen this in the eastern US and europe this season. The issue is the amplifiation in snowfall volumes. Note the record snowfalls in the northeast. This is not inconsistent with the prediction of more extreme precipitation rates.

The predictions include the comparative data for when and where, right? And that data goes back a long long time, right? And the data has been consistently collected from the same hundreds of thousands of collection points on all land and ocean masses around the entire globe for a long, long time, right?

…compared with the best available data known. More data, including proxy data, are being collected with time. I would suggest that you, if you haven’t already, read the relevant data on NOAA or NCAR.

G’nite mate.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:44 PM

Thanks for the chuckles.

I didn’t know a Bachelor of Arts was offered on the subject.

Saltysam on January 29, 2011 at 10:59 PM

Oakland was getting crushed so Oakland ran. He has one interest in life and he is pathetic at pursuing it.
He almost only shows up on AGW threads then essentially ignores questions and says to go talk to NOAA. I think he is like those people in so many religions who actually hope for the end of days. You know 2012 and all that. It brings him meaning and likely gives him respite from whatever is really going on in his life. Just a guess.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 11:00 PM

I guess it’s oaklands turn to get smackEd around after bayams humiliation

Sonosam on January 29, 2011 at 11:02 PM

and by the “hockey stick”. Until you can define those terms to me to your satisfaction, I can’t answer what I “believe” in.

And, why would you be so concerned about what I, a non-expert, might “believe” in?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM

What a pathetic dodge…..

James Hansen at NASA was minded concerning a mistake in his analysis concerning temperature data. He thanked the contributor and made the correction. This is the way science is done.

Now, what “shennanigans” are you referring to?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:22 PM

Once again revealing how clueless you are:

Leading climate change cheerleader James Hansen has ‘lost the plot’
 
By Milo Yiannopoulos Last updated: February 17th, 2009
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/technology/miloyiannopoulos/8607047/Leading_climate_change_cheerleader_James_Hansen_has_lost_the_plot/

My dear colleague Professor Hansen, I believe, has finally gone off the deep end. When you have dedicated the bulk of your career to a cause, and it turns out the cause has been proven false, most people cannot bring themselves to admit the truth. [Hansen's recent claims] contain neither reason nor truth when compared to the volumes of daily literature being published in scientific journals today on climate change. It is not difficult to refute the words of Professor Hansen. On the contrary, one feels it is almost unfair. [...] The global warming ‘time bomb’, the ‘present, dangerous situation’, ‘the perfect storm’, ‘global cataclysm’, ‘disastrous climate changes that spiral dynamically out of humanity’s control.’ These are the words of an apocalyptic prophet, not a rational scientist.


James Hansen’s Former NASA Supervisor Declares Himself a Skeptic – Says Hansen ‘Embarrassed NASA’, ‘Was Never Muzzled’, & Models ‘Useless’

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/01/27/james-hansens-former-nasa-supervisor-declares-himself-a-skeptic-says-hansen-embarrassed-nasa-was-never-muzzled/

“Hansen was never muzzled even though he violated NASA’s official agency position on climate forecasting (i.e., we did not know enough to forecast climate change or mankind’s effect on it). Hansen thus embarrassed NASA by coming out with his claims of global warming in 1988 in his testimony before Congress,” Theon wrote. [Note: NASA scientist James Hansen has created worldwide media frenzy with his dire climate warning, his call for trials against those who dissent against man-made global warming fear, and his claims that he was allegedly muzzled by the Bush administration despite doing 1,400 on-the-job media interviews!


Put oil firm chiefs on trial, says leading climate change scientist

James Hansen, one of the world’s leading climate scientists, will today call for the chief executives of large fossil fuel companies to be put on trial for high crimes against humanity and nature, accusing them of actively spreading doubt about global warming

Washington Times: Scientist Hansen who alleged Bush administration muzzled him — did 1,400 on-the-job media interviews – March 20, 2007


Excerpt: Hansen Claims NASA Muzzled Him – But – A NASA scientist who said the Bush administration muzzled him because of his belief in global warming yesterday acknowledged to Congress that he’d done more than 1,400 on-the-job interviews in recent years.

James Hansen, director of NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies, who argues global warming could be catastrophic, said NASA staffers denied his request to do a National Public Radio interview because they didn’t want his message to get out. But Republicans told him the hundreds of other interviews he did belie his broad claim he was being silenced. “We have over 1,400 opportunities that you’ve availed yourself to, and yet you call it, you know, being stifled,” said Rep. Darrell Issa, California Republican.


James Hansen’s Boldest Lie To Date **Update**

by Bill Hennessy on November 10, 2008 · View Comments

Dr. Hansen apparently believes the world is as stupid as, well, as stupid as the world seems to be.

All of the October surface station temperature from Russia was corrupted. So what did Hansen do? He simply copied and pasted Russia’s temperatures for September into October and reported that October 2008 was the hottest October on record.

……..these “shenanigans” genius……

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 11:06 PM

You all know Oakland was seriously disappointed when all those scary hurricanes and the death and destruction never materialized.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 11:07 PM

And, why would you be so concerned about what I, a non-expert, might “believe” in?

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM

So don’t post here jackass.

CWforFreedom on January 29, 2011 at 11:09 PM

It seems that computer models have gotten quite advanced. Now, climate is not weather, though, as you know, they are related. The same types of mathematics and computer algorithms that are involved in predicting weather are also employed in climate modelling (though there are also major differences). If modelling atmospheric events “cannot predict anything”, then how are we able to get fairly reliable weather reports days in advance? Heckuva lot better than a couple of decades ago. And getting better all the time.

As an ex-computer science guy I will tell you now that those computer models cannot accurately predict the weather. It is technologically impossible.

“How do you figure?”

Well, scientists still do not know all the factors that go into predicting the weather. Computer models are based solely upon input. Garbage in, garbage out.

Now, seeing as how they cannot predict the weather, it is absurd to think that they could predict the future climate. If you believe that, then I have this odorless, tasteless super special medicine that will heal all ails, including cancer and HIV. I’ll give it to you for only $5,000…a steal when you think about it.

Pattosensei on January 29, 2011 at 11:11 PM

But instead of us acting like a bunch of cats batting at a frightened mouse, maybe we should take turns so that we can try to stretch out the fun longer. You know, keep the mouse alive longer.

blink on January 29, 2011 at 11:10 PM

Nah, pile on – much more fun.

massrighty on January 29, 2011 at 11:13 PM

More precipitation than when? Where?
…..

And what about areas that have seen less precipitation? (again, less than what? Where?)

……

More severe than when? Where?

………

The predictions include the comparative data for when and where, right? And that data goes back a long long time, right? …. long time, right?

………….
G’nite mate.

oakland on January 29, 2011 at 10:44 PM


Where….what???….where….what?????
……..Where……..what????…………Where….What????

The absolute flailing of someone who is getting their a$$ handed to them….can’t back up their own statements….can’t refute anyone else’s statements….

Just dodging…..distracting…and running.

In this thread…Oakland has not provided one ounce of proof that global warming exits or is responsible for all the global events and weather that he and the eco-fundamentalist claim.

..not from what I have read…not according to how I think….not according to what I have seen…

Real persuasive argument and factual rebuttal you have there.

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 11:16 PM

In this thread…Oakland has not provided one ounce of proof that global warming exits or is responsible for all the global events and weather that he and the eco-fundamentalist claim.

I don’t think he’s that ignorant but his mental defect, which we all have seen in people, is one that he will support an onerous position if it hurts the person next to him too

it’s a sado/maso thing

Sonosam on January 29, 2011 at 11:24 PM

Wow! You guys are great! The warmies got PWNED, as my teen age son would say!

Baxter Greene, outstanding research, as usual.

JannyMae on January 29, 2011 at 11:30 PM

He really needs to get current on the debate. He doesn’t realize how silly he looks by being ignorant about the problems with the temperature record, etc.

His talking points are about 5 years old!

blink on January 29, 2011 at 11:19 PM

Agree 100%…

I am still laughing at the “What hockey stick do you speak of??????…..

“Please tell me more about this hockey stick”??????

The video of that would go great with the video’s of all the other global warming experts that want to ban “air” and “water”………

Maybe we can get oakland an interview with Monckton:

Lord Monckton adresses a Greenpeace-campaigner on global warming
December 12th, 2009 § 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuovqFwUtDc

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 11:32 PM

Wow! You guys are great! The warmies got PWNED, as my teen age son would say!

Baxter Greene, outstanding research, as usual.

JannyMae on January 29, 2011 at 11:30 PM

Thanks..

This is not huffpo…..
Hot Air is not the place for pushing baseless,ignorant talking points.

Baxter Greene on January 29, 2011 at 11:35 PM

Anybody who doesn’t know what Mann’s hockey stick graph refers to is Ill-informed on the subject.

JannyMae on January 29, 2011 at 11:43 PM

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