Dopey Hawaii governor figures out new way to tease Birthers

posted at 6:17 pm on January 21, 2011 by Allahpundit

I started writing about this yesterday, got sidetracked by something else, and now Dave Weigel’s written the post I wanted to write. Half a dozen people e-mailed us the link to Abercrombie’s comments with some variation of the claim that “he admits the birth certificate doesn’t exist!” Does he?

Q: You stirred up quite a controversy with your comments regarding birthers and your plans to release more information regarding President Barack Obama’s birth certificate. How is that coming?

A: I got a letter from someone the other day who was genuinely concerned about it; it is not all just political agenda. They were talking on Olelo last night about this; it has a political implication for 2012 that we simply cannot have.

(Abercrombie said there is a recording of the birth in the State Archives and he wants to use that.)

It was actually written I am told, this is what our investigation is showing, it actually exists in the archives, written down …

…What I can do, and all I have ever said, is that I am going to see to it as governor that I can verify to anyone who is honest about it that this is the case.

If there is a political agenda then there is nothing I can do about that, nor can the president.

So there is some sort of written record — which jibes with what the state’s director of health has been saying all along — but because Abercrombie didn’t use the words “long-form birth certificate” or claim that he’s seen the document himself, somehow this magically transforms into him being unable to find anything in the file. What I think happened here is that this well-meaning doofus, who knew Obama’s parents personally and who’s indignant at the accusations about his citizenship, spoke up in anger with a vow to put them to rest. Which, entirely predictably to everyone except Abercrombie himself, kick-started a whole new round of excitement and expectations among Birthers, who’ll never be satisfied no matter what document is finally presented. The state could produce a birth certificate signed in the doctor’s blood and it’ll be dismissed instantly by true believers as a forgery. So this whole endeavor is counterproductive to Abercrombie’s goal, which I assume he’s now realizing and which explains why he might not be doggedly following up on his investigation. If he follows up and reveals a document — which he’s still not legally empowered to do — it’ll be declared bogus; if he decides to lay off and let this drop, it’ll be taken as proof that there’s no document in the file and he’s engaged in a cover-up for his pal Barack. This is the sort of shrewd, farsighted political mind who’s now at the head of Hawaii’s ship of state.

Exit question: I’ve asked this before, but what’s the endgame here for Birthers? Let’s say the only thing in the file is an affidavit from one of Obama’s long-dead grandparents attesting to the fact that he was born in Hawaii. How do we get from that point A to the point B of the Supreme Court ruling that a sitting president is constitutionally disqualified from office?


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FTFY.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:13 PM

You didn’t fix anything at all. Like Abercrombie and Allahpundit you just made a complete ass out of yourself even though you are too stupid to realize it. Anyone with a functioning brain has to know by now that if there was a Hawaiian Birth Certificate for Obama, in all likelihood, beyond any reasonable doubt, it would have been released by now. Abercrombie could not find a Hawaiian Birth Certificate for Obama for, beyond any reasonable doubt, the same reason that he would not be able to find a Hawaiian Birth Certificate for me.

Joe Bloggs on January 21, 2011 at 10:36 PM

The exit is thataway, loser. Mind the doorknob doesn’t hit your butt and get stuck in your a$$ crack on the way out.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:15 PM

You sound like someone who is in the third grade who would not have been promoted out of the first grade if not for affirmative action.

Joe Bloggs on January 21, 2011 at 10:41 PM

The exit is thataway, loser. Mind the doorknob doesn’t hit your butt and get stuck in your xxx xxxxx on the way out.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:15 PM

You sound like someone who is in the third grade who would not have been promoted out of the first grade if not for a-ffirmative a-ction.

Tuco on January 21, 2011 at 10:44 PM

You sound like someone who is in the third grade who would not have been promoted out of the first grade if not for a-ffirmative a-ction.

Tuco on January 21, 2011 at 10:44 PM

And you sound like a knuckledragging tinfoil-hat conservatard.

Oh wait…you are.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:46 PM

If any member of the GOP happens to be reading this thread, you could gain some easy points with the public by disowning the Birther Brigade. You know, like you should have done months ago. And if you don’t you entirely deserve any bad PR that results from these Looney Tunes.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:51 PM

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:51 PM

uh yeah thanks for the advise…we really appreciate concern trolls…we’ll continue to ignore it, and win.

right4life on January 21, 2011 at 11:02 PM

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 10:51 PM

The issue is already moot – five states at least will require a long form birth certificate for ballot access. 0bama will have to produce it, or not run for a second term.

“Birthers” win, you lose.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:05 PM

If Abercrombie keeps stirring the pot, and no one finds a long-form birth certificate, could someone start impeachment proceedings in the House?

Just sayin’

Steve Z on January 21, 2011 at 11:11 PM

Gov of Hawaii Miraculously finds a Handwritten Birth Certificate of Obama Archived
mrt721 on January 21, 2011 at 10:48 PM

Ya gotta love it. So much for the meme that it’s the people demanding a birth certificate who look like idiots.

Basilsbest on January 21, 2011 at 11:22 PM

Never got the licking though? bummer

darwin-t on January 21, 2011 at 11:06 PM

No worries, you can practice on your wife.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 11:27 PM

“Birthers” win, you sanity loses.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:05 PM

FTFY.

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 11:28 PM

Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 11:28 PM

Your tears of anguish sustain me.

Say them with me: Montana… Pennsylvania… Georgia… Arizona… Texas… more later? Very likely.

Your despised “birthers” are changing state election laws, sane or no, they have won – those who shill for the liar 0bama have lost.

Count it.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:35 PM

“Birthers” win, you sanity loses.
Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:05 PM
FTFY.
Dark-Star on January 21, 2011 at 11:28 PM

You demonstrate your stupidity to perfection. Birthers will only win if it is proved Obama was not born in Hawaii.

Basilsbest on January 21, 2011 at 11:45 PM

AP moves in mysterious ways…………..indeed!

dmann on January 21, 2011 at 11:53 PM

Say them with me: Montana… Pennsylvania… Georgia… Arizona… Texas… more later? Very likely.

Your despised “birthers” are changing state election laws, sane or no, they have won – those who shill for the liar 0bama have lost.

Count it.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:35 PM

Amen. I’ll be satisfied with 27 states.

Opinionator on January 21, 2011 at 11:57 PM

Say them with me: Montana… Pennsylvania… Georgia… Arizona… Texas… more later? Very likely.

Your despised “birthers” are changing state election laws, sane or no, they have won – those who shill for the liar 0bama have lost.

Count it.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:35 PM

Amen. I’ll be satisfied with 27 states.

Opinionator on January 21, 2011 at 11:57 PM

27 out of 57 isn’t bad.

Mason on January 22, 2011 at 12:19 AM

27 out of 57 isn’t bad.

Mason on January 22, 2011 at 12:19 AM

Exactly. ;) I had a tough time choosing between the number of states (currently) dismantling OCare and the number of O’s affiliates.

Opinionator on January 22, 2011 at 12:24 AM

The former governor of Hawaii stated that she saw the birth certificate

Cindy Munford on January 21, 2011 at 6:23 PM


So I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health,…”-Linda Lingle

She never saw it herself. I don’t disagree that it’s there. I just think, like others have surmised, that there is something that he doesn’t want seen. I was born on Maui. Since all of this started I have been refused a copy of my LFBC by the state of HI. No real answer as to why I can’t have one other than “You just don’t need it”. They can’t point to laws/rules/regs, anything at all as to why I can’t. I offered to have my father, a state resident and attorney, come get a copy of it for me. Nope. Silly games being played that are making a lot more than Obama look dumb.

mauioriginal on January 22, 2011 at 12:46 AM

Bummer, he can’t release the information unless he gets Obama’s consent.

Conservative Samizdat on January 22, 2011 at 2:38 AM

mauioriginal on January 22, 2011 at 12:46 AM

I’m hearing Twilight Zone music playing…

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on January 22, 2011 at 4:31 AM

My take on this, for what it’s worth :)

Obama believes more or less his narrative, it was what he had always been told by his mother.

Obama’s mum was not legally married to O sr. (We’re told O Sr was a bigamist, but no proceedings ensued, why not? Cos it’s not true.)

Very possibly Obama’s dad was the Communist poet guy.

As I understand it, this makes O a natural born citizen (either by virtue of his mother, or both mother and father being US citizens. Interestingly if Ann were married to O Sr then he isn’t a Natural Born Citizen …)

Also.

O’s mum married an Indonesian, who adopted Barry. His sister says so. Barry went to an Indonesian only school. He went to Pakistan at a time where it was not possible to do so on a US passport, ergo he had a non US one. Had Obama gone to Pakistan totally illegally on a US passpart, don’t you think going through customs would have made a tale for one of the biographies?

As I understand it, this would have obliged him to renounce his US citizenship, which he then however reverted back to at some point. (Probably not at 18, but later.) Which as I understand it makes him legally not a Natural Born Citizen but a naturalised one. Simple as.

Whether the Natural Born Citizen thing should preclude people like Obama from POTUSship I have no idea, but I do think the issue needs to be clarified, and also that it is perfectly reasonable to demand that the law be applied.

There may be a side issue, O may have used his status as a non-citizen for grant money at college.

I applaud the states who are indroducing laws to demand requisite paperwork, since it makes issues like this impossible in the future.

Hope on January 22, 2011 at 4:38 AM

I just reread my 6:45pm post about how I think conservatives will have eggs on their faces: I meant conservatives like Erikson and Allah who make fun of other conservatives (like me) who are “birthers”. Sorry about any confusion!

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on January 22, 2011 at 4:39 AM

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on January 22, 2011 at 4:39 AM

You’re awesome AG… Love your passion. Keep on!

Keemo on January 22, 2011 at 6:47 AM

AP, you seem to be presuming how the birthers will react before they’ve presented with what they’re asking for.

Shouldn’t you extend a little grace there?

Barrack on January 22, 2011 at 7:35 AM

On the other hand I think it would be better if we swept this under the carpet. The man is President, he was elected. If he’s not eligible that just opens a whole kettle of fish that isn’t helpful.

I mean it sets some kind of precedent that I’d rather not set.

petunia on January 21, 2011 at 6:27 PM

Kee-rist! What kind of coward are you? If the man is president illegally under false pretenses, you think that should be swept under the carpet? You’re afraid of the presumed fallout becaue it wouldn’t be ‘helpful’? Gawd almighty. TJ, Jimmy Madison and the rest of the band are spinning in their graves.

Rome fell by committing suicide. You’re suggesting we do the same. Thanks, but no thanks. We are a Nation of Laws, not Men.

RickZ on January 22, 2011 at 7:44 AM

who’ll never be satisfied no matter what document is finally presented

WTF?

No, if Obama produces a real circa 1960s (ink / paper / typeface) document proving he is a natural born citizen the controversy is over for 99% of the folks that want to see proof.

However, if he can not, he should immediately be charged, tried and if convicted serve his jail time, pay his fine and be deported.

esnap on January 22, 2011 at 9:04 AM

It was never about the birth certificate. That is just the narrative the left has focused on.

shar61 on January 22, 2011 at 9:06 AM

Keemo on January 22, 2011 at 6:47 AM

Well, thank you very much, Keemo! You, too!

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on January 22, 2011 at 9:31 AM

Now that the Commodore has proven himself to be an acid addled ass, can we get back to proving Obama’s Frank Marshall Davis’ boy and how Obama’s entire life story has been a well constructed fraud. The thing is, Obama’s starting to get the hang of this president thing. I think we are stuck with the commie for 8 years.

pc on January 22, 2011 at 9:57 AM

Also being the bastard child of Davis instead of some Kenyan yokel is going to appeal to people on a certain level. There will be pity for the guy like there is for any child victim of circumstance.

pc on January 22, 2011 at 10:00 AM

The notation is in the computer system. An actual birth cerficate does not exist and is why Obama hasn’t released one.

Someone added his phony information to the database.

Obama wasn’t born in the USA He can not be President and everything he’s done since being in office is null and void.

LeeSeneca on January 22, 2011 at 10:08 AM

He was probably midwifed into life in Hawaii, hence no hospital birth certificate. The circumstances of his birth are similar to ones that come along very often. His out of wedlock mother was impregnated under embarrassing circumstances and the family did it’s best to keep the birth a low-key affair. Happens all the time.

pc on January 22, 2011 at 10:19 AM

Exit question: I’ve asked this before, but what’s the endgame here for Birthers? Let’s say the only thing in the file is an affidavit from one of Obama’s long-dead grandparents attesting to the fact that he was born in Hawaii. How do we get from that point A to the point B of the Supreme Court ruling that a sitting president is constitutionally disqualified from office?

It is obvious that bribes will be necessary.

percysunshine on January 22, 2011 at 10:19 AM

There is no birth certificate. There never was. Obama is an “light worker” sent down from heaven to heal the planet and give us broccoli, arugula and health care.

darwin on January 22, 2011 at 10:28 AM

I’ve never been a birther and HAD found the whole thing boring but this is so damn funny, it’s got my attention.

If Obama gets on the ballot in those 5 states, that settles it fer sher but if he doesn’t … imagine the MSM trying to not report (or spin) that.

My guess is he’ll get on the ballots, but if not it’ll be great fun. In that scenario, he would presumably drop out, making an announcement reminiscent of LBJ’s.

Now suppose he does drop out (for any reason). Then the speculation will be that he knew he couldn’t get on some ballots. That scenario is unlikely too but, IMHO, a lot more likely than him actually failing to get on some ballots.

That would really be fun to watch.

Pythagoras on January 22, 2011 at 11:06 AM

Egad, the birthers are still creating a fuss, nothing will satisfy them. Defeat Obama on the issues, where he needs to be defeated.

SC.Charlie on January 22, 2011 at 11:10 AM

darwin on January 22, 2011 at 10:28 AM

Now, now. there’s no evidence he has gave us brocolli.

sloopy on January 22, 2011 at 11:20 AM

What gets to me is that he’s touted the transparency of his administration. It’s like every other lie he’s told. His history is so transparent it’s invisible. No Republican would ever have gotten away with this.

Eren on January 22, 2011 at 11:26 AM

He was probably midwifed into life in Hawaii, hence no hospital birth certificate. The circumstances of his birth are similar to ones that come along very often. His out of wedlock mother was impregnated under embarrassing circumstances and the family did it’s best to keep the birth a low-key affair. Happens all the time.

pc on January 22, 2011 at 10:19 AM

Ah, that’s why the newspaper announcement. I understand now.

slickwillie2001 on January 22, 2011 at 12:37 PM

You know, I don’t have an original of my birth certificate either, it’s a white on black photocopy. There are soooooo many other things that can be used against the empty suit besides a birth certificate. How about those Columbia transcripts or his transcripts from Harvard? For being the smartest man in the world, he sure acts pretty dumb.

flytier on January 22, 2011 at 12:39 PM

citizenship = natural born citizenship. If not that, then amend the Constitution to remove the requirement.

Sailfish on January 21, 2011 at 7:17 PM

Actually no. Being a citizen is not being a Natural Born Citizen.

America1st on January 21, 2011 at 7:56 PM

Actually, that was a quick and clumsy correction I made for neglecting to include “natural born” in my post of a few posts back, fwiw.

Sailfish on January 22, 2011 at 12:49 PM

The state could produce a birth certificate signed in the doctor’s blood and it’ll be dismissed instantly by true believers as a forgery.

Perhaps, but I wonder… could that have anything to do with the stonewalling and word game playing that has characterized the State’s and Obama’s response so far?

Maybe this is a job for Dan Rather, who after all is lauded as a finder of critical documents by the left, no?

drunyan8315 on January 22, 2011 at 1:07 PM

I’m not a birther but see a consipiracy here. There has got to be something on that birth certificate that would embarrass Obama to no end. Not that he wasn’t born in Hawaii, but that maybe, just maybe, his real name is Barry Jones and the Kenyan isn’t really “daddy”. So much for the book, “Dreams of my Father.”

Barry had to submit an official birth certificate to attend law school. He was called, Barry throughout his time there. Why aren’t people barking up Harvard’s tree?

kens on January 22, 2011 at 1:22 PM

Dopey Hawaii governor figures out new way to tease Birthers

Dopey? As a fox maybe. Before going through this exercise, did he know any more than the rest of the masses as to whether a real long-form birth certificate existed and, if not, what the full circumstances regarding it were?

Doubtful.

Does he now?

Most assuredly. Does this information now give him more or less political clout with the administration?

Sailfish on January 22, 2011 at 1:29 PM

Exit question: I’ve asked this before, but what’s the endgame here for Birthers?

Conspiracy theories are the endgame.

Count to 10 on January 22, 2011 at 1:50 PM

Egad, the birthers are still creating a fuss, nothing will satisfy them. Defeat Obama on the issues, where he needs to be defeated.

SC.Charlie on January 22, 2011 at 11:10 AM

Actually this fuss was made by the Governer of Hawaii promising to put an end to this once and for all.

He can’t because of privacy laws.

The only one who can is Obama himself and he won’t.

Why?

petunia on January 22, 2011 at 2:58 PM

Question for the birthers.

blink on January 22, 2011 at 2:34 PM

The question is irrelent. Once a state requires a long form birth certificate for ballot access, which is certain to happen, the ball is now in 0bama’s court – he will have to produce it or forfeit that states electorial votes.

The whole “birther” vs. “gullibles” debate is over, AP just throws out the topic to chum for page hits.

Rebar on January 22, 2011 at 2:59 PM

You know, I don’t have an original of my birth certificate either, it’s a white on black photocopy. There are soooooo many other things that can be used against the empty suit besides a birth certificate. How about those Columbia transcripts or his transcripts from Harvard? For being the smartest man in the world, he sure acts pretty dumb.- flytier on January 22, 2011 at 12:39 PM

I don’t have my birth certificate either.

SC.Charlie on January 22, 2011 at 3:01 PM

I have it on good authority that the Lovely and Gracious Sarah will go where no man has had the guts to go before and in their first debate/date tell OBlahBLah I’ll show you mine if you show me yours!

Then whats a Manchild, a Boy King to do?

from my post on Lucianne not stolen!

dhunter on January 22, 2011 at 3:40 PM

from one of Obama’s long-dead grandparents

talking about his maternal grandmother who died as he took office

maverick muse on January 22, 2011 at 4:17 PM

SC.Charlie on January 22, 2011 at 3:01 PM

You’re not POTUS either.

DanaSmiles on January 22, 2011 at 4:25 PM

SP should have already demanded the elusive birth certificate, she has standing.

DanaSmiles on January 22, 2011 at 4:28 PM

I don’t have my birth certificate either.

SC.Charlie on January 22, 2011 at 3:01 PM

It is an extraordinarily easy process to get a certified copy of your long form birth certificate – you should get one.

Rebar on January 22, 2011 at 4:39 PM

Sailfish on January 22, 2011 at 1:29 PM

Good point.

-Aslan’s Girl

Aslans Girl on January 22, 2011 at 5:56 PM

Personally, I think this is all a plan by the Digressives to political nullify Obama without the embarrassment of having to nominate another Democrat to run against him in 2012.

Now that he has done his job (damage), they no longer need him, his moronic, imbecilic lack of qualification for the job of President is no longer “hide-able.” They are setting the stage to “shuffle him off to Buffalo,” and put in a newer “viable” candidate.

PJ Emeritus on January 22, 2011 at 6:04 PM

This has been one big joke since day one, hatched by Axlerod and Obama as a big laugh on everyone. They’ve kept it going for over 2 years and will use it in the upcoming campaign.

Kissmygrits on January 22, 2011 at 6:31 PM

Abercrombie has created millions of new birthers now. His main agenda was finding the birth certificate but has failed miserably.

Is Allahpundit curios as to what exactly was issued by the state to parents when giving birth to a child at that time? Did they just write them down in some archive that will never be found at later times? Did it have a state embossed seal and signature by the county clerk? How did he get through those colleges without proof of citizenship or birth?

Just call Hussein and ask him to release them? Then he can later release those awesome grades he made in college.

Bleed_thelizard on January 22, 2011 at 7:21 PM

whole new round of excitement and expectations among Birthers, who’ll never be satisfied no matter what document is finally presented. The state could produce a birth certificate signed in the doctor’s blood and it’ll be dismissed instantly by true believers as a forgery.

Not really. Genuine proof of what the Establishment’s been claiming over the last few years would satisfy me.

But I could believe that the Obama supporters out there would not buy proof that he wasn’t born here.

Dr. ZhivBlago on January 22, 2011 at 7:35 PM

blink on January 22, 2011 at 7:31 PM

Personally?

I think this idea that he hasn’t produced it to make “birthers” look bad is idiotic – if he had one that matched his narrative he’d have released it long ago. The election results since the left started banging the “birther” drum has been disastrous, for the democrat party, it’s a losing issue for them and they know it.

The question now is – what part of the narrative doesn’t the document match? A million dollar question. If it’s something that calls into doubt his “natural born citizenship”, he won’t produce it, try to get the courts to attack the states election laws, and if that doesn’t work – he’ll drop out blaming “racist America teabaggers”. If it’s something merely embarrassing, he’ll produce it and try to brazen it out with heavy use of the “race card”.

Regardless, it will be interesting to see how it all plays out in the end.

Rebar on January 22, 2011 at 7:46 PM

Which, entirely predictably to everyone except Abercrombie himself, kick-started a whole new round of excitement and expectations among Birthers, who’ll never be satisfied no matter what document is finally presented. The state could produce a birth certificate signed in the doctor’s blood and it’ll be dismissed instantly by true believers as a forgery.

All that I (and many other people want) is to see the bare minimum required to prove that he was born in Hawaii- a long form Birth Certificate. That is all I, or anyone else that I know, wants to see. Once I see that, my curiosity will be satisfied. I have to produce one in order to get a driver’s license. Why won’t he show his in order to be President? It smells.

Theophile on January 22, 2011 at 10:01 PM

According to interpretations by the Supreme Court, a natural born citizen must be born in the US and have US citizens as parents. Clearly, Obama doesn’t qualify on that account because his father was a British citizen. What’s more, because under British law, a child born before 1983 to a British FATHER, but not in the UK, is considered a British citizen for one generation, Barack Obama is a British citizen as well as a US citizen. Can a dual citizen be considered a natural born citizen? The intent of the founders when they insisted that both parents be US citizens for a child to be “natural born” was to prevent conflicts of interest. In Obama’s case, the conflict of interest is prevalent in his identification with his father rather than his mother and his antipathy towards the UK.

NNtrancer on January 22, 2011 at 10:41 PM

Yeah, thats it AP, just keep ignoring all the smoke until the house burns down. Intellectual coward.

allahallahoxenfree on January 23, 2011 at 9:31 AM

Many,of Hawaii citizens (I among them) consider our new Governor has his pony tail wrapped a bit toooo tight when he makes claims, such as this.

However, actions such as this clearly indicate why he gave up his Federal Representative job to come back to Hawaii to run for Governor. Many sense he was asked to return for the good of D.C. representatives.

MSGTAS on January 23, 2011 at 9:34 AM

The issue is already moot – five states at least will require a long form birth certificate for ballot access. 0bama will have to produce it, or not run for a second term.

“Birthers” win, you lose.

Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:05 PM

In two years, the form they are forging should be sufficiently aged for presentation to the states….

theaddora on January 23, 2011 at 12:08 PM

Your tears of anguish sustain me

.

Hopefully other things sustain you as well.

Say them with me: Montana… Pennsylvania… Georgia… Arizona… Texas… more later?

.

Have these five states passed this requirement? Have these five states even brought bills up for a vote?

Say it with me: one of these states is not like the other.

Very likely.

Not so fast. The birther marathon continues.

Your despised “birthers” are changing state election laws,

You now believe we live in a Constitutional Republic under rule of law. Not quaint.

sane or no,

No.

they have won

Won what? The race is not over.

– those who shill for the liar 0bama have lost.

Yes, more the result of his actual policies, less the result of birther concerns.

Count it.
Rebar on January 21, 2011 at 11:35 PM

Okay, let’s count it.

Which means that 0bama will either produce said document, forfeit those electoral votes (around 85), or not run.

The assertion, if all five states pass this requirement he will ‘forfeit’ 85 (which should now read 88) electoral votes, is false. He has already ‘forfeited’ 68 of these 88 2012 electoral votes, irrespective of any pass/fail vote on this requirement in any single state. The 68 votes were awarded to the winners of the ‘red state blue state’ marathon and the ‘electoral map change’ marathon respectively.

However, there is a trophy of 20 electoral votes still available for 2012. It waits in the single state of these five that was blue in 2008. It must be said that those in the ‘his policies are terrible’ marathon will lay claim to the trophy for 2012, irrespective of any birther marathon results.

Seems the only trophies available for the birther marathon are those resulting from a red state legislature seizing same in the event its’ own state would vote blue in 2012.

Some will do anything for a trophy.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 12:46 PM

He’ll get on the ballot in all 57 states by going to court and arguing that a short form birth certificate is just as good as a long form one. Of course, a long form birth certificate is about a 1,000 times hardier to “correct” than a short form one, but hay, who worried about that happening?

Isn’t it amazing that there are professors who spend their whole carreers researching the smallest points of a president’s background but no one is interested in settling the most basic questions regarding Obama’s?

Fred 2 on January 23, 2011 at 1:05 PM

Aha, my own personal troll makes a (late) apperence!

Have these five states passed this requirement? Have these five states even brought bills up for a vote?

All five have bills pending in their new sessions.

You now believe we live in a Constitutional Republic under rule of law

These are sovereign states, not the federal government.

Won what?

Won the battle to force 0bama to produce his documentation, at least in part.

Yes, more the result of his actual policies, less the result of birther concerns.

It is possible to have concern for both.

Some will do anything for a trophy.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 12:46 PM

If 0bama decides to forfeit even one state, even a red state he would be sure to lose regardless, by refusal to produce his documentation – the impact will resonate far beyond those electoral votes. It would be a de facto admission that he is ineligible for the office.

Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 1:21 PM

The question of Obama’s birth has been a subject of speculation, rumor and a lot of questions with no facts to put anything to rest. It has been muddy water since he first appeared on the political scene and now it is about as clear as Mississippi mud.
This latest exposure, combined with other questions such as what happened to his mothers passport records for this critical stretch of time, just ratchets up the doubt but more importantly, it opens a whole new set of questions concerning Obama’s birth certificate.
One of the things that was new to me at least was learning that there was more than one announcement of his birth in the newspaper. The one that has been reported all along and held up by the liberals as proof of his birth in Hawaii, list an address that was occupied by long term residents. It has been assumed that the filing of the Certificate of Live Birth was the source for that announcement. The major problem and question for that announcement is the address given was for one occupied by long term residents. It is also known that no one in that neighborhood can recall Obama’s mother and baby living in that area. Where did the information giving that address come from? The second one recently revealed is an announcement of live birth gives the grandparents address. This is much more likely the address considering that we know Obama’s father moved into the men bachelors’ dormitory of the University when he returned to Hawaii. It also makes more sense with consideration that Obama’s mother left Hawaii to move to the states a few weeks later. Perhaps they were not aware of the other birth announcement, or perhaps as suggested, the grandfather had arranged for the Certification of Live Birth to be created. The notations that Governor Abercrombie references are speculated to be notes made by someone who took care of creating the Certificate of Live Birth. Such notes would reference the birth as stated by the Governor but obviously would not be of a nature he would want to release.
For those liberals who do not understand what a Certificate of Live Birth represents, let me explain. When Hawaii became a state in 1959, a large number of the population did not have birth certificates. With such requirements as social security and other legal matters requiring a birth certificate, the certificates of a live birth were created for anyone that applied for one. This was also made available for children of foreign parents. The short form of the certificate is the same for both natural born and foreign born children. The long form that the short form is derived from would show the country of birth for foreign born children and the state or territory for American Citizens. That is why the short form as shown by Obama is not acceptable as proof of being a natural born citizen, though for other uses as Identification it would suffice.
Clearly Governor Abercrombie thought the record of his birth in Hawaii was in the archives. After all he was given a letter to deliver to a hospital that supposedly Obama claimed to have been born in. That he did not find it raises some serious concerns, especially in light that obviously there did exist records before Obama took office. In 2007 Snoops allegedly obtain by some method, a copy of Obama’s Certification of Live Birth, short form. They uploaded high res photos showing the document with its raised seal. It also shows the certificates number. It might help Governor Abercrombie to know that the number is 151 1961 – 010641. Obama’s on line photo shopped versions number was redacted out with the explanation that they were not sure if it was legal to show it.
This creates some serious questions. We know that a record existed at the time Obama was running for president. We know this because Obama allegedly had a Certificate of Live Birth even if he photo shopped it. Snoops and Newsbusters managed to obtain copies of the short form allegedly from Hawaii’s state department. Those should have been generated only if there existed the long form in the data base. Then there was Dr. Chiyome Fulcino of the Hawaii State Department of health who stated shortly after the controversy began that he had seen the original and that it did exist. So up to that point it seems to have existed. Then last year an election official administrator with legal access to all data bases used to verify an identity, checked to see if Obama had a record of his birth. They did not find one, nor did they find any record in either hospital, or any doctor who was on record for delivering him. That raises the question of how did the records suddenly become none existent and why. How is it that no record exists in the state archives but there is notes concerning his birth? It would appear that the record was removed but the notes were not with the records and therefore missed, as least for the moment. Associated to his birth is another set of records that have curiously disappeared; the passport records of his mother during the time she would have traveled to Africa and returned to Hawaii.
The common factor in all the records is that they would show if Obama were a natural born citizen or foreign born. The question is where is this leading, especially as we see Obama preparing to run and Governor Abercrombie thought he was going to help smooth the way for that to happen. How is he going to overcome the states who demand he prove eligibility to get on the ballot, without a Certificate of Live Birth somehow showing him born in Hawaii. I am waiting for the announcement that both the state archive and one of the hospitals found lost records proving him to be a citizen and his other more troublesome records remaining sealed.

Franklyn on January 23, 2011 at 2:00 PM

Aha, my own personal troll makes a (late) apperence!

Your assertion was wrong. For telling you so, I am your personal troll. Got it.

All five have bills pending in their new sessions.

Pending, not voted on.

It is nice you believe we live in a Constitutional Republic under rule of law – today.

These are sovereign states, not the federal government.

The Individual is sovereign to both.

Won the battle to force 0bama to produce his documentation, at least in part.

Not yet. Keep running.

It is possible to have concern for both.

It’s also possible to have concern for neither, the former and not the latter, or the latter and not the former.

If 0bama decides to forfeit even one state, even a red state he would be sure to lose regardless,

He will not decide to forfeit any red state electoral votes because if this law. The voters have already forfeited the votes on his behalf, irrespective of this law.

Quite possible he will use any state passing this law as part of his reelection strategy.

by refusal to produce his documentation – the impact will resonate far beyond those electoral votes.

Where will it resonate more? Red states that already will not vote for him or blue states that might vote for him?

It would be a de facto admission that he is ineligible for the office.

Not quite. However, your conerns will increase if he refuses to produce it.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 2:04 PM

Your assertion was wrong

My assertion that when a state demands documentation for ballot access, 0bama will have to produce it or forfeit those votes? Please explain how this is incorrect.

Pending, not voted on.

At least one is certain to pass, last I spoke to Leo Berman (Texas district 6), he seemed quite confident of passing his bill.

Quite possible he will use any state passing this law as part of his reelection strategy.

That’s pretty dumb: “I won’t run in Texas because they are a bunch of racist red neck meanie teabagging poo-poo heads”.
We should be so lucky.

However, your conerns will increase if he refuses to produce it.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 2:04 PM

I think a lot of folks, including people who formerly didn’t care or even those who felt obligated to mock “birthers”, will take a renewed interest if 0bama actually forfeits ballot access rather than produce his documentation.

Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 2:20 PM

Please explain how this is incorrect.

Already did, risk of forfeiture because of this law exists in potential blue states, not existing red states.

At least one is certain to pass, last I spoke to Leo Berman (Texas district 6), he seemed quite confident of passing his bill.

It matters not to him if Texas passes this law, except as part of his reelection strategy.

That’s pretty dumb: “I won’t run in Texas because they are a bunch of racist red neck meanie teabagging poo-poo heads”.

He will use any state denying him ballot access as part of his reelection campaign.

I think a lot of folks, including people who formerly didn’t care or even those who felt obligated to mock “birthers”, will take a renewed interest if 0bama actually forfeits ballot access rather than produce his documentation.
Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 2:20 PM

States blocking ballot access has been tried. It failed.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 2:48 PM

Already did, risk of forfeiture because of this law exists in potential blue states, not existing red states.

If 0bama gives up ballot access in a particular state, that does not make me “wrong”.

It matters not to him if Texas passes this law, except as part of his reelection strategy.

Giving up Texas, the second largest state, will certainly have a huge impact in the swing states – if he gives up in all five, even more.

To my knowledge, no president has ever won election without being on the ballot in every state, and in this particular instance with the controversy on this one issue, it would cripple his chances.

States blocking ballot access has been tried. It failed.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 2:48 PM

Non sequitur. Each state has the responsibility to check candidates for eligibility, that now some are taking this responsibility seriously will not trigger a war, or even a serious court challenge. Which is exactly why the 0bama regime is playing the “birther” card this far from any election – they are vainly trying to bully/shame/embarrass these state legislatures/Governors to not pass the bills, because they have no real recourse except to follow the law or forfeit the ballots.

Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 3:08 PM

If 0bama gives up ballot access in a particular state, that does not make me “wrong”. Giving up Texas, the second largest state, will certainly have a huge impact in the swing states – if he gives up in all five, even more.

We have been over this. He has already lost Texas and three other states on the wish list, irrespective of this law.

How about moving to PA to help out the cause there?

Non sequitur.

Not when it corrects your knowledge:

To my knowledge, no president has ever won election without being on the ballot in every state, and in this particular instance with the controversy on this one issue, it would cripple his chances.

Each state has the responsibility to check candidates for eligibility, that now some are taking this responsibility seriously will not trigger a war, or even a serious court challenge.

It would be irresponsible for those taking this responsibility seriously to start a war.

It would be responsible for those taking this responsibility seriously to challenge in court. Many have tried, all have failed.

Which is exactly why the 0bama regime is playing the “birther” card this far from any election – they are vainly trying to bully/shame/embarrass these state legislatures/Governors to not pass the bills, because they have no real recourse except to follow the law or forfeit the ballots.
Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 3:08 PM

The birthers play the birther card. He is playing the birthers playing the birther card.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 3:45 PM

We have been over this. He has already lost Texas and three other states on the wish list, irrespective of this law.

If you want to change the definition of “forfeit” to prove that I’m “wrong” somehow, we’ll let the readers decide who is in error.

How about moving to PA to help out the cause there?

I’m quite happy in Texas with so many like minded folks, you would be a much better fit for PA I think.

It would be irresponsible for those taking this responsibility seriously to start a war.

Pure hyperbole – in no way can a state or states demanding proof of eligibility possibly cause violence of any type. But I guess trolls will be trolls, when they have no other hook to hang an argument on.

He is playing the birthers playing the birther card.

rukiddingme on January 23, 2011 at 3:45 PM

He been playing the “birther” card for two years now, and has brought his party electorial defeat after brutal defeat – so why should we be afraid if he keeps using it?

Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 3:59 PM

Three groups of people are playing this game: The MFM who think it will protect Obama by keeping attention on the fringe, the Birthers who think they can actually unseat an elected President because of a missing document, and bloggers who want traffic.

I normally hate the “don’t do what you want because you *should* be doing something else argument” (in politics), but we have scandals, crimes, and cover-ups that we can actually *achieve* something about, and people just absolutely WILL NOT let go of the one that is guaranteed to end in nothing.

Obama definitely got his money’s worth from those millions he spent on this one.

We can’t even get the government to justify 2/3 of its budget Constitutionally and there are still people willing to die on the Birth Certificate hill so we can… what? Get Biden in? Maybe with Clinton as well? Yeah, that’d be magic.

Merovign on January 23, 2011 at 4:15 PM

If you want to change the definition of “forfeit” to prove that I’m “wrong” somehow, we’ll let the readers decide who is in error.

On Friday, 88 electoral votes are placed on a table in a grand ceremony. These votes may be claimed, starting on Saturday, by either ‘because his policies are terrible’, ‘because of this law’, or the President. Unfortunately, all three are absent the grand ceremony.

On Saturday, ‘because his policies are terrible’ arrives to claim some of the votes. Since ‘because of this law’ and the President are still absent, ‘because his policies are terrible’ is duly awarded 68 of the electoral votes.

On Sunday, ‘’because of this law’ calls to let everyone know he will arrive on Monday, or Tuesday, or some day thereafter. What is not important is when he arrives, what is important is he will arrive and when he does he claims all 88 votes. ‘Because of this law’ is informed 68 of the votes were claimed Saturday, there are only 20 left if he arrives to claim them.

‘Because of this law’ cries foul. The fact he was absent when 68 of the votes were duly awarded to ‘because his policies are terrible’ on Saturday should not prevent him from claiming the 68 already awarded and the 20 remaining.

Got it.

I’m quite happy in Texas with so many like minded folks, you would be a much better fit for PA I think.

I am quite happy in Texas with so many like minded folks as well. I will stay too.

Pure hyperbole – in no way can a state or states demanding proof of eligibility possibly cause violence of any type.

This statement: that now some are taking this responsibility seriously will not trigger a war is not pure hyperbole. My response to your statement is pure hyperbole. Got it.

But I guess trolls will be trolls, when they have no other hook to hang an argument on.

I am a troll for gathering 68 hooks Saturday. All 88 hooks should have been left for ‘because of this law’, who may arrive on Monday, or not. Got it.

He been playing the “birther” card for two years now, and has brought his party electorial defeat after brutal defeat – so why should we be afraid if he keeps using it?

Rebar on January 23, 2011 at 3:59 PM

He is playing the birthers playing the birther card.

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 8:36 AM

Prove you were born in the U.S. then. My guess will be, since he’s been in the places where witnesses wouldbe, and his grandma died the day he took office, that they just try and use hearsay testimony as proof. Well, The federal requirement trumps the state privacy law on the certificate.
Its a Constitutional requirement, especially after seeing a guy come into office and ‘unbuild’ our nation. We need to know if he is friend or foe, dont we?

johnnyU on January 24, 2011 at 8:59 AM

It could be that the Obama backroomers that initially knew that he wasn’t born IN this country (like McCain) may have ignorantly assumed since his Mother was a natural born citizen, it immediately transferred to him. Subsequent revelations by the backroomers that with his travels as an infant, and then his travels as a lad to Indonesia and later Pakistan, probably triggered a level of concern in the backroomers that his citizenship COULD be questioned and if proven, disqualify him from the Presidency. Can’t have that now can we? SO, knowing that George Soros is one of the MAJOR backroomers and money magicians for the campaign, they probably have already forged a document, aged it and have it in repository somewhere. Now, they can titillate the birthers when they need a distraction, and if ever pushed to absolutely have to produce it, guess how long that’ll take to do?
Yeah.

44Magnum on January 24, 2011 at 2:01 PM

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 8:36 AM

Little early in the day to be hitting the sauce, don’t you think? But I guess it’s 5pm somewhere.

44Magnum on January 24, 2011 at 2:01 PM

You have made good points – one of the concerns is 0bama was born in Hawaii as claimed, but subsequently when he was adopted in Indonesia, his name was changed then amended to his birth certificate – at that point his name was legally “Barry Soetoro”. The rub is, there is no record of him legally rechanging his name back to “Barack Obama”. If so, then every oath he took, every paper he signed, has been done under an illegal alias and are null and void – including his presidential oath of office and all the bills he signed into law.

Rebar on January 24, 2011 at 2:34 PM

Little early in the day to be hitting the sauce, don’t you think? But I guess it’s 5pm somewhere.

Yesterday you thought you would win 88.

Tomorrow you might win 20, but first you must finish the race.

Today you have nothing except a yearning for 20 and a lamenting for 68.

Since you will do anything for a trophy, you also hit the sauce because it is 5 pm somewhere.

Got it.

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 2:57 PM

The rub is…
Rebar on January 24, 2011 at 2:34 PM

Here is some sauce for this one rub, of many rubs. Try it on your other rubs too.

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 3:13 PM

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 3:13 PM

You really are a tiresome and stupid troll, I tried to engage in civil conversation, but clearly that is an impossibility with you – so just go away.

Rebar on January 24, 2011 at 3:27 PM

How about we all compromise and let Obama remain unvetted for the 2008 election.

Assuming that we give Obama a pass because the election of 2008 is over, and we do not want to remove a sitting president, who here believes, for the sake of national stability, that that pass should be extended to a second term, and that no presidential candidate should be vetted for constitutional eligibility until the 2016 campaign?

If you seriously believe that, just come out and say it.

One rationale would be that if Obama were to fail the 2012 vetting, well then you would have to overturn every single law he signed – instigating chaos in America.

Though this might be a good thing for those opposed to ObamaCare.

Please discuss.

We may as well, rationally and non-hyperbolically, as this problem is NOT going away, and is a national hazard.

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 4:17 PM

You really are a tiresome and stupid troll, I tried to engage in civil conversation, but clearly that is an impossibility with you – so just go away.

Rebar on January 24, 2011 at 3:27 PM

Peeling your onion not only makes you cry, it makes you uncivil, tired, and very angry.

Provided you use ‘a potential of 20 electoral votes from PA’ in your future claims, your surrender is accepted.

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 4:23 PM

rukiddingme,

I have followed your arguments with Rebar for several days.

I understand what you are saying – that if the states that force Obama to prove he is an eligible candidate are already ones that would not vote for him, then he is not losing electoral votes.

But I would like to point out the following to you;

American people are basically fair-minded- at least they’d like to think so.

In my opinion, for your scenario to work, the American people would have to observe Obama refusing to be on the ballot in states, because he values keeping his birth certificate hidden, and then not penalize him.

Don’t you think that once it was announced that he would not compete in – say – Texas, and the reason would immediately come out on the news was that it was over his birth certificate – that a rapidly building media snowball that he is a cheater wouldn’t bury him?

Yes, the MSM are corrupt and in the tank. But, as yet, the American people are not.

I think if Obama tried to play chicken like this with the 2012 election, it actually would devolve into an ugly, but unstoppable, impeachment AND conviction.

And – it wouldn’t be over the actual birth certificate – it would be over the cover-up.

Mark my words – this pot is beginning to boil.

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 4:31 PM

Another political moron. The more you still crap, the more it stinks. I do wish this story would die. at this point it hardly matters.

pgrossjr on January 24, 2011 at 4:46 PM

In my opinion, for your scenario to work, the American people would have to observe Obama refusing to be on the ballot in states, because he values keeping his birth certificate hidden, and then not penalize him.

First, it will be some states denying him access because he met the requirement yesterday, the state was not happy he met the requirement, so the state changed the requirement.

Second, the majority of red and blue Americans are satisfied with the evidence produced and have no further concerns about his eligibility.

Don’t you think that once it was announced that he would not compete in – say – Texas, and the reason would immediately come out on the news was that it was over his birth certificate – that a rapidly building media snowball that he is a cheater wouldn’t bury him?

No. Does a court of law demand more evidence tomorrow when yesterday the evidence was sufficient to dismiss the charge?

Only a certain small segment of our side refuses to let this issue go and get on with voting him out of office. Birthers have failed in court multiple times. Now some fools actually want state legislatures to strip his ballot access because he refuses to release his long form birth certificate.

I think if Obama tried to play chicken like this with the 2012 election, it actually would devolve into an ugly, but unstoppable, impeachment AND conviction.
And – it wouldn’t be over the actual birth certificate – it would be over the cover-up.

Mark my words – this pot is beginning to boil.

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 4:31 PM

I think if a state plays chicken little like this with the 2012 election, it will only serve to benefit him. The pot continues to be stirred by the birthers. The Governor of Hawaii merely turned up the heat on the stove to achieve boiling point. Part of an overall plan in my opinion.

For birthers, voting him out in 2012 is not good enough. They have to save the Constitution or something. They want nothing less than preventing ballot access or impeachment.

If he releases this document, some will accept it as fact, others will not, still others will continue to claim he is not natural born. He will never satisfy all the birthers, or even most, no matter what he does.

rukiddingme on January 24, 2011 at 6:12 PM

“No. Does a court of law demand more evidence tomorrow when yesterday the evidence was sufficient to dismiss the charge?”

i am trying to complete multiple projects in the rain right now, so can’t answer you point by point, but the preceding stood out to me.

I think this is a key misunderstanding.

Not one SINGLE court out of any involved in the dozens of lawsuits has ever allowed one piece of evidence to be submitted against Obama.

All case were thrown out pre-emptively based upon a “lack of ‘standing.”

The courts uniformly said that the plaintiffs did not have the right – “standing” to sue Obama.

There has not yet been one rejection based upon any evidence.

This is key, and critical, to the misunderstanding so many still carry.

The matter has not been adjudicated in toto – just thrown out.

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 6:50 PM

I would like Obama to make a good-will gesture of releasing his long-form birth certificate, to “humor” voters and citizens like me.

I used to be a Little League umpire, and was presented with long-form certificates before championship games regarding 12-year-old (or not! ;-)) pitchers.

If Obama does not want to do so, either he is not willing, in all his innocence, to humor a voter asking in good faith, or he is guilty.

Either way, this far down the line, seeing as this is such a fundamental stone-walling by him, he definitely is an A$$ hole.

I’m not the jerk

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 6:53 PM

“If he releases this document, some will accept it as fact, others will not, still others will continue to claim he is not natural born. He will never satisfy all the birthers, or even most, no matter what he does.”

———————-

Had he released it at the get-go, as was successfully demanded of John McCain, there either would have been no “birthers,” or it would have been shown that Obama was ineligible.

Either way, Obama created the problem, and he owns it.

cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 7:03 PM

From time to time recently we have heard that so-and-so BELIEVE??? that Obama was born in Hawaii. WE DO NOT NEED OBAMA’S BIRTH CERTIFICATE TO KNOW THAT OBAMA IS NOT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. Obama’s father WAS NOT a citizen of the United States; therefore, OBAMA IS NOT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. The propaganda from Hawaii’s governor and recently from others is an attempt to end the debate. But like the Tea Party, the “Birthers” will not cease and desist from insisting that Obama be removed for failure to qualify according to our Constitution.

What is incredible is that ALL of those who have uttered that Obama is qualified have been sworn to uphold the Constitution. Like the vial and corrupt Nixon, Obama should be removed immediately.

AdrianS on January 24, 2011 at 9:57 PM

Not one SINGLE court out of any involved in the dozens of lawsuits has ever allowed one piece of evidence to be submitted against Obama.

What evidence?

All case were thrown out pre-emptively based upon a “lack of ‘standing.”

There are three requirements to obtain standing before the court.

What is the injury, what is the causation, what is the likely redress?

Had he released it at the get-go, as was successfully demanded of John McCain, there either would have been no “birthers,” or it would have been shown that Obama was ineligible.

First, he was not required to release it.

Second, even if he does, the ‘LFBC is a fraud’ and the ‘non natural born’ do not disappear.

Either way, Obama created the problem, and he owns it.
cane_loader on January 24, 2011 at 7:03 PM

He created the problem by not releasing a document he was not required to release?

Birthers own this.

rukiddingme on January 25, 2011 at 12:19 PM

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