Chris Christie: Stop playing politics with the Ground Zero mosque

posted at 6:23 pm on August 16, 2010 by Allahpundit

An Obama-esque statement, not only in terms of his stance on the mosque (like O, he’s voting present) but in the way he’s trying to position himself above the fray of normal party politics. That’s actually a big part of his brand: We think of him as a conservative rock star thanks to his crusade against spending but Christie tends to present himself as a pragmatist who’s just doing what needs to be done to restore fiscal sanity to New Jersey. He’s the adult in the room, in other words, making hard choices to solve serious problems while lesser pols jerk around and have food fights. That’s what he’s going for here, I think. Politico’s rough transcript:

“Given my last position, that I was the first U.S attorney post 9/11 in New Jersey. I understand acutely the pain and sorrow and upset of the family members who lost loved ones that day. At the hands of radical Muslim extremist. And their sensitivities and concerns have to be taken into account. Just because it’s nearly nine years later, those sensitivities cannot and should not be ignored. On the other hand, we cannot paint all of Islam with that brush…We have to bring people together. And what offends me the most about all this, is that it’s being used as a political football by both parties. And what disturbs me about the president remarks is that he is now using it as a political football as well. I think the president of the United State should rise above that. And should not be using this as a political football, and I don’t believe that it would be responsible of me to get involved and comment on this any further because it just put me in the same political arena as all of them.

“My principles on this are two-fold. One, that we have to acknowledge, respect and give some measure of deference to the feelings of the family members who lost there loved ones there that day. But it would be wrong to so overreact to that, that we paint Islam with a brush of radical Muslim extremists that just want to kill Americans because we are Americans. But beyond that…I am not going to get into it, because I would be guilty of candidly what I think some Republicans are guilty of, and the president is now the president is guilty of, of playing politics with this issue, and I simply am not going to do it.”

Asked if he’d call upon both parties to stop, he said, “Well, that again will be playing politics with the issue. I said what I feel about it, and I don’t believe it is up to me to pontificate on other people about what they should do. I just observe what I observe. And I don’t believe that this issue should be a political football. I just don’t. And I think that both sides of this issue now are using this as a political football. And I don’t think it brings people together in America, I think it just further drives people apart, and creates divisions, and I think that’s bad for our country. And all people in our country suffer when those kind of things happen.”

So (1) let’s respect public sensitivities about Ground Zero and (2) let’s respect the distinction between Muslims and radical Muslims and (3) let’s not divide people. What that means in terms of resolving this dispute, I have no idea. But I do agree with him that big-name pols weighing in on this does more harm than good. Even if they’re doing it for sincere reasons rather than for cynical political advantage, there’s no way to avoid the perception that they’re doing it for cynical political advantage, which adds a whole new dimension of clamminess to the discussion. It reminds me of Beltway honchos trying to coopt the tea-party label: Grassroots types on both sides are capable of hashing this out without establishment interference. What does Newt Gingrich add to the debate by railing against the mosque in one breath and chatting with reporters about whether he’ll run for president in another?


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We paint Islam with the brush they give us.

Potfry on August 17, 2010 at 9:37 AM

If you build it they will come. Radicals, moderates, and good guys.

Herb on August 17, 2010 at 9:49 AM

It’s kind of funny when a politician derides politics.

But he’s appealing to the independents. Ain’t I cynical?

Seth Halpern on August 17, 2010 at 9:50 AM

How about they move 1 more block north? Would that be okay?

How about 2 more blocks north?

3?

6?

Where can a mosque be built in NYC so people won’t cry?

Dave Rywall on August 16, 2010 at 11:49 PM

There’s been a mosque on Lower Broadway for 20 years.

Del Dolemonte on August 17, 2010 at 9:50 AM

This is strange. I could have swore I posted stuff here.
Am I being deleted?
Hmmm….

Badger40 on August 17, 2010 at 9:17 AM

Frequently my comments get filtered out for around half an hour, I suppose until EP or Ed reviews them. It’s just another part of the filter.

Drudge’s new headline, John Bolton says Israel has 8 days to stop Iran’s nuclear powers.

maverick muse on August 17, 2010 at 9:12 AM

Well, it will be an… interesting eight days to wait and see. One eye on the blog all day. Incidentally, Part 3 of J.E. Dyer’s Bushehr series went up last night. Good read.

KinleyArdal on August 17, 2010 at 9:52 AM

AP not EP*

Spelling is hard, y’know.

KinleyArdal on August 17, 2010 at 9:52 AM

Your perspective needs considerable work. o.0 If you care to learn why, I am always up for a Q&A.

KinleyArdal on August 17, 2010 at 9:05 AM

Actually I HAVE done a lot of work on this. But apart from cutsyness, what was the actual part of my post you did not agree with?

Hope on August 17, 2010 at 9:55 AM

If there is nothing inherently violent or hateful about Islam, then how come we aren’t being asked to form a distinction between moderate and radical Buddhists or Hindus? How come the vast majority of terrorists are Muslims? How come other religions aren’t being perverted and used as a justification for strapping bombs to ones body and blowing up unbelievers?

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 9:57 AM

The building of a mosque at/near the site of an attack in the name of one of the world’s historically most intolerant “religions” is a political issue. No one with convictions should be accused of “playing politics” over a fundamental disagreement.

Andy C. McCarthy pricks the delusions of those claiming the necessity of tolerance. http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/243899/tolerant-pose-andrew-c-mccarthy

Our Founders determined, in guaranteeing the free practice of religious faith, that we would divorce ourselves from having an established church. With its sharia law components, Islam historically claims the mantle of superiority and, thus, the right to be the established law of the land.

The Ground Zero mosque is a symbol of conquest, perverting our rights in order to undermine those rights.

onlineanalyst on August 17, 2010 at 9:58 AM

In case I forgot the McCarthy link: http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/243899/tolerant-pose-andrew-c-mccarthy

onlineanalyst on August 17, 2010 at 9:59 AM

My prior post has not shown up. Let me try to rephrase.

Out Founders established a constitutional government that forbade the establishment of any religion as a national religion. Their aim was to promote the free practice of one’s faith without flying in the face of the governing body.

With its sharia laws, Islam intends that it be the established church wherever it extends its tentacles. Islam is the most intolerant “faith” in history, yet it perverts our tolerance to promote its own ends of conquest.

onlineanalyst on August 17, 2010 at 10:06 AM

See my post: Mosque Mania: Obama Can’t Lecture Americans on Emotional Topics.

On My Watch…the writings of SamHenry at
http://samandimp.wordpress.com

SamHenry on August 17, 2010 at 10:07 AM

It’s not that tough of an issue for Dems, anyway. They can easily say “I personally think a mosque at that location is in poor taste, but it’s a free country”.

That’s a pretty hard position to fumble. Only an expert fumbler like our C-in-C could manage to screw it up.

hawksruleva on August 17, 2010 at 10:09 AM

It’s not that tough of an issue for Dems, anyway. They can easily say “I personally think a mosque at that location is in poor taste, but it’s a free country”.

But when it’s a cartoon of Mohammed that’s in bad taste, lives are threatened until it goes away.

Why do the Dems rarely say, “The cartoon is in poor taste, but it’s a free county”?

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 10:18 AM

Actually I HAVE done a lot of work on this. But apart from cutsyness, what was the actual part of my post you did not agree with?

Hope on August 17, 2010 at 9:55 AM

Probably this part, upon which my post was built.

Actually, from a Pagan point of view the Book religions are very similar, paternalistic, intolerant, and most especially, oppressive to women.

But I agree, Islam is the one which seems to be stuck in the Middle Ages.

to which I then replied that your view needs work. The unspoken meaning was because your view is wrong, but I suppose that has to be stated very flatly, and cannot be inferred from the preceding text. I can derail the entirety of the thread if you so wish and elaborate as to why, if you want, or we can discuss it elsewhere.

o.0 In summation, if you believe that Christianity and Islam are actually “quite similar”, your view needs work.

KinleyArdal on August 17, 2010 at 10:19 AM

He’s the adult in the room, in other words, making hard choices to solve serious problems while lesser pols jerk around and have food fights.

If Christie wants to be the adult problem solver, maybe he should contact the imam of this mosque and make him an offer to bring it to New Jersey.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 10:23 AM

And meanwhile nothing is done to rebuild the Greek Orthodox church that was destroyed in the terrorist attack on 9/11.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 10:25 AM

If there is nothing inherently violent or hateful about Islam, then how come we aren’t being asked to form a distinction between moderate and radical Buddhists or Hindus? How come the vast majority of terrorists are Muslims? How come other religions aren’t being perverted and used as a justification for strapping bombs to ones body and blowing up unbelievers?

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 9:57 AM

“Kill me last”

The epitaph of Western society.

KinleyArdal on August 17, 2010 at 10:27 AM

I like Gov. Christie, but he’s wrong about this.

dczombie on August 17, 2010 at 10:52 AM

“…But beyond that…I am not going to get into it, because I would be guilty of candidly what I think some Republicans are guilty of, and the president is now the president is guilty of, of playing politics with this issue, and I simply am not going to do it.”

This is just plain dumb. I sincerely hope that Christie isn’t going down the “politically correct” road.

moonsbreath on August 17, 2010 at 10:56 AM

It’s nowhere near ground zero. Can’t be seen from ground zero, doesn’t overlook ground zero.

http://media.mcclatchydc.com/smedia/2010/08/12/17/20100810_NY_City_mosque.wide_photo.prod_affiliate.91.jpg

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 10:58 AM

Drywall, they’d build it right on Ground Zero if they could get the land.

But you go right on being a good dhimmi.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:02 AM

Why don’t we just give Islamists Canada?

darwin on August 17, 2010 at 11:09 AM

Why don’t we just give Islamists Canada?

darwin on August 17, 2010 at 11:09 AM

I’m pretty certain they already have it.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:13 AM

Drywall, they’d build it right on Ground Zero if they could get the land.

But you go right on being a good dhimmi.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:02 AM
———
You go right ahead stomping all over the law because you blame all of Islam for 9/11.

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

It’s nowhere near ground zero. Can’t be seen from ground zero, doesn’t overlook ground zero.

http://media.mcclatchydc.com/smedia/2010/08/12/17/20100810_NY_City_mosque.wide_photo.prod_affiliate.91.jpg

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 10:58 AM

I know exactly where it is. It’s steps from Ground Zero, well within the area that was cordoned off and swarming with emergency services on 9/11. A piece of jet engine smashed right through the building that these Muslims want to tear down. It’s very much in the area that I would call Ground Zero, an area that was showered with flaming debris and body parts and the pulverized rubble of two 110-story buildings. But let’s not let that get in the way of a shopworn liberal talking point.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 11:17 AM

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

I suggest where you live.

moonsbreath on August 17, 2010 at 11:18 AM

The Ground Zero mosque is a symbol of conquest, perverting our rights in order to undermine those rights.

onlineanalyst on August 17, 2010 at 9:58 AM

The danger to our rights would come not from a religious minority but from a majority curtailing liberty to avoid being offended.

Let them build it next to Gutfeld’s gay bar and BBQ rib shack. Let them face the anger and protests of those who visit ground zero and realize how demented many of their fellow believers are.

dedalus on August 17, 2010 at 11:21 AM

It’s kind of funny when a politician derides politics.

But he’s appealing to the independents. Ain’t I cynical?

Seth Halpern on August 17, 2010 at 9:50 AM

Cynical but true. I’ve been personally listening to independents and blue dog dems talk of how impressed they are with him…when they previously could have cared less about him.
Anyone who bucks their party mantra looks good to independents like me. The extreme left and right are small percentages.
I also agree this issue is a pox on both houses. The comments on kos etc make me just as sick as the ones here.

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 11:24 AM

You go right ahead stomping all over the law because you blame all of Islam for 9/11.

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

1) If there is nothing about Islam that encourages terrorism then please explain why the vast majority of the world’s terrorist attacks are carried out in the name of Islam instead of other religions.

2) I would prefer they didn’t build their shrines to Islam anywhere in NYC. But if they must, they should do it well out of that neighborhood. There is no mathematical formula to calculate the distance, but I’ll tell you what, you propose a site and we’ll let you know whether or not it could be considered to be inside or outside of the general Ground Zero area. Since the closer the site the more conflict and controversy, I would say the sensible thing for them to do would be to locate it as far away as possible. New York is a big city.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 11:26 AM

I know exactly where it is. It’s steps from Ground Zero, well within the area that was cordoned off and swarming with emergency services on 9/11. A piece of jet engine smashed right through the building that these Muslims want to tear down. It’s very much in the area that I would call Ground Zero, an area that was showered with flaming debris and body parts and the pulverized rubble of two 110-story buildings. But let’s not let that get in the way of a shopworn liberal talking point.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 11:17 AM
——
So where is the no cry zone. How many blocks away.
Should they shut down the other mosques in Manhattan
Should Muslims be allowed to visit ground zero they’re all guilty right

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

First, you tell me where an artist can publish a cartoon of Mohammed without being threatened with death?

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:30 AM

1) If there is nothing about Islam that encourages terrorism then please explain why the vast majority of the world’s terrorist attacks are carried out in the name of Islam instead of other religions.

2) I would prefer they didn’t build their shrines to Islam anywhere in NYC. But if they must, they should do it well out of that neighborhood. There is no mathematical formula to calculate the distance, but I’ll tell you what, you propose a site and we’ll let you know whether or not it could be considered to be inside or outside of the general Ground Zero area. Since the closer the site the more conflict and controversy, I would say the sensible thing for them to do would be to locate it as far away as possible. New York is a big city.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 11:26 AM
——-
Ah, so freedom of religion only applies to non-Muslims.

Have you started a petition to tear down the other mosques in Manhattan?

They’re all too close, right?

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:30 AM

So where is the no cry zone. How many blocks away.
Should they shut down the other mosques in Manhattan
Should Muslims be allowed to visit ground zero they’re all guilty right

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

You’re buying into the idea that this is more than politics. The tears aren’t real. If there is one thing I’ve learned the past few years…no one feels anything anymore. Everything is fake.

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 11:32 AM

You’re buying into the idea that this is more than politics. The tears aren’t real. If there is one thing I’ve learned the past few years…no one feels anything anymore. Everything is fake.

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 11:32 AM
——–
No, what’s happening is this: you people are saying American citizens cannot build a mosque several blocks away from ground zero because you think the people who want to build the mosque are evil. You’re projecting the blame for 9/11 onto all Muslims.

Disgraceful.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:36 AM

No, what’s happening is this: you people are saying American citizens cannot build a mosque several blocks away from ground zero because you think the people who want to build the mosque are evil. You’re projecting the blame for 9/11 onto all Muslims.

Disgraceful.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:36 AM

No, I’m not. I’m not ignorant or fake and agree with what you’ve said.

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 11:41 AM

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

First, you tell me where an artist can publish a cartoon of Mohammed without being threatened with death?

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:30 AM
—–

Are you suggesting that all Muslims believe in death to cartoonists?

Because that would be f’ing stupid.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:41 AM

1) If there is nothing about Islam that encourages terrorism then please explain why the vast majority of the world’s terrorist attacks are carried out in the name of Islam instead of other religions.

2) I would prefer they didn’t build their shrines to Islam anywhere in NYC. But if they must, they should do it well out of that neighborhood. There is no mathematical formula to calculate the distance, but I’ll tell you what, you propose a site and we’ll let you know whether or not it could be considered to be inside or outside of the general Ground Zero area. Since the closer the site the more conflict and controversy, I would say the sensible thing for them to do would be to locate it as far away as possible. New York is a big city.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 11:26 AM
——–
1
I never said there wasn’t plenty of stupid in the Muslin guidebook. There has plenty of violence and terrorism committed in the name of Christianity too, fool.

2
ludicrous

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:45 AM

No, what’s happening is this: you people are saying American citizens cannot build a mosque several blocks away from ground zero because you think the people who want to build the mosque are evil. You’re projecting the blame for 9/11 onto all Muslims.

Disgraceful.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:36 AM

It’s not several blocks away. It’s a few buildings from GZ. Secondly, until Muslims themselves decide that they’re tired of being lumped in with murderers and radicals and clean house, they will always be associated with them.

It’s incumbent on them, if they want to be viewed as peaceful to ensure that’s what Islam is. It’s currently nothing of the sort.

It’s incumbent on everyone else to be wary of Islam and to protect themselves from it’s creeping encroachment. Islam has immigrated to every western nation on the planet and it hasn’t brought peace. There isn’t ONE country that hasn’t been scarred by it’s violence. There isn’t ONE country that Muslims have immigrated to where they live in peace. They do not assimilate, they seek their host nation to bend to their rules and laws.

You’re the one that’s disgraceful. Your “tolerance” will get us all killed or enslaved.

darwin on August 17, 2010 at 11:46 AM

Are you suggesting that all Muslims believe in death to cartoonists?

Because that would be f’ing stupid.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:41 AM

It’s just as stupid as anyone blaming all of Christianity for the Oklahoma city bombing etc, helping Africa prepare for executions of homosexuals etc etc.

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 11:51 AM

Your “tolerance” will get us all killed or enslaved.

darwin on August 17, 2010 at 11:46 AM

Quit being such a wimpy scaredy-cat…Maybe we should chug on over to mamby pamby land where maybe we can find some self confidence for you, you jack wagon!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhlWddAXSRA

fastestslug on August 17, 2010 at 12:03 PM

So where is the no cry zone.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

Canada, apparently. No one here is crying, Dave. We’re saying you’re not building this monument to dhimmitude near the WTC site…period.

Why are you crying about exporting your Canadian dhimmitude to the U.S.? What does it matter to you where we allow Islamites to fester?

Jaibones on August 17, 2010 at 12:06 PM

Are you suggesting that all Muslims believe in death to cartoonists?

Because that would be f’ing stupid.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:41 AM

No more than you were suggesting everyone here blames all Muslims for 9/11.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 12:11 PM

So where is the no cry zone.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

Canada, apparently.

It’s a hate crime to cry in Canada.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 12:13 PM

It’s nowhere near ground zero. Can’t be seen from ground zero, doesn’t overlook ground zero.

http://media.mcclatchydc.com/smedia/2010/08/12/17/20100810_NY_City_mosque.wide_photo.prod_affiliate.91.jpg

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 10:58 AM

Can tell you’ve never been there…okey-dokey, this is for you:

http://www.aipnews.com/talk/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=16201&posts=1

You can tell in this photo, if your synapses are synapping, that this site is actually right next to GZ…actually was part of it, considering plane parts fell on it.

So where is the no cry zone.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

Your backyard? Whaddya say, hmm?

Miss_Anthrope on August 17, 2010 at 12:18 PM

Let ‘em build it in Ayodhya. Oh, that’s right, they already did. Didn’t work out too well, though.

Christien on August 17, 2010 at 12:28 PM

Funny how nobody mentions that Islam is the only religion attached at the hip to a political ideology. Hello…Sharia, anyone?

That’s my main problem with Islam. Not Muslims, Islam. Of course, the fact the Quran contains such sura as “Smite them at the neck” also bother me, considering they’re not related to specific battles and haven’t been abrogated through a Reformation.

but let’s put that aside for now. It’s Sharia, where the subjugation of all non-Muslims is law. Where in dar al-Harb Muslims can practice taqiyya in order to conquer, and only Muslim civilians are ‘innocent.’ Where in dar al-Islam no churches, synagogues, or temple may be built; where homosexuals and ‘accused’ adulterers are hung; where women may be subjected to FGM at best, noses and ears cut off at normal, or stoned at worst; where athiests are forbidden, and so must convert to Islam or die.

So why am I the bigot in this argument? Because I don’t want those who view themselves as our current or soon-to-be masters building a monument to our ultimate demise at the site where they attacked us & declared war on Western culture and freedom?

I’m the bigot???

Miss_Anthrope on August 17, 2010 at 12:31 PM

It’s nowhere near ground zero.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 10:58 AM

That map is wrong. It does not include 7 WTC in the World Trade Center site. Also, why would you considet 30 West Broadway irrelevent?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 12:38 PM

No, what’s happening is this: you people are saying American citizens cannot build a mosque several blocks away from ground zero

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:36 AM

Several? It’s already been pointed out that there are mosques several blocks away, and have been for years without controversy.

exception on August 17, 2010 at 12:42 PM

That map is wrong. It does not include 7 WTC in the World Trade Center site. Also, why would you considet 30 West Broadway irrelevent?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 12:38 PM

When working at the WTC most people are unaware of Park Place unless they have to leave to pick up something for lunch. Even then, the WFC has been a more likely destination.

dedalus on August 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM

dedalus on August 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM

Amish Market FTW.

What about the students living at Fitterman Hall? What do they think about Park Place?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 12:50 PM

Amish Market FTW.

What about the students living at Fitterman Hall? What do they think about Park Place?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 12:50 PM

The Amish market can work for lunch, though it was less of a destination from the WTC than the WFC for those who ventured out of the office.

Not sure what BMCC students think about the whole thing. Based on the few I knew, I’d guess their opinions might skew unpredictably. Usually, local development decisions aren’t reviewed by students.

dedalus on August 17, 2010 at 1:11 PM

Not sure what BMCC students think about the whole thing. Based on the few I knew, I’d guess their opinions might skew unpredictably. Usually, local development decisions aren’t reviewed by students.

dedalus on August 17, 2010 at 1:11 PM

Well, they’re hypothetical anyway, since Fitterman was ruined in the attacks. Since it was half a block away fron the front door of 45 Park Pl it seems disingenuous for people to say the mosque’s location isn’t relevant to the attack.

exception on August 17, 2010 at 1:23 PM

Shut up and eat!

Hilts on August 17, 2010 at 1:25 PM

So where is the no cry zone. How many blocks away.
Should they shut down the other mosques in Manhattan
Should Muslims be allowed to visit ground zero they’re all guilty right

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

I’ll repeat what I said, since you don’t appear to be concentrating. There is no mathematical formula to calculate the number of blocks. There isn’t a mathematical formula for every aspect of human judgment. But building a mega-mosque right next to Ground Zero is wrong. They have the option of finding a more appropriate spot, one that doesn’t so obviously offend the feelings of millions of people, one which would prove that their blurb about “peace and understanding and good will” actually meant something.

Anyone can visit Ground Zero. But not all conduct is acceptable there. The “god flies planes into buildings to punish fags” nutjobs have been free to protest there, but that doesn’t mean their behavior shouldn’t be widely condemned. We are free to pass judgment.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:47 PM

Ah, so freedom of religion only applies to non-Muslims.

Have you started a petition to tear down the other mosques in Manhattan?

They’re all too close, right?

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:30 AM

“Freedom of religion” does not mean that we cannot oppose a mosque and heavily criticize its location and the motives of its founders. Grow up Dave and stop constructing these straw man arguments, ie that we’re proposing some kind of unconstitutional law.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:49 PM

1
I never said there wasn’t plenty of stupid in the Muslin guidebook. There has plenty of violence and terrorism committed in the name of Christianity too, fool.

2
ludicrous

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:45 AM

1) You have no right to call anyone foolish, especially now that you’re playing the card of religious equivalence. Again, I will ask you: if Islam is the same as every other religion, then how come the overwhelming majority of terrorist attacks are carried out in its name? In fact, unlike other religions, Islam is directly opposed to and incompatible with Western civilization, particularly our immoral and decadent preoccupation with freedom and liberty. Not all Muslims are terrorists, but most terrorists are Muslims. In fact, all it takes is a handful of terrorists working on behalf of the rest. Support for violence in the name of Islam is widespread across the Muslim world. It’s also widespread among European Muslims. Young Muslims in the town from where one of the London bombers came from, when interviewed by the Observer newspaper, expressed support for the attacks – not because of George Bush or America or the Iraq war, but because they see Western culture as evil and unIslamic. These were “hip” young kids who wear fashionable urban clothing. Islamism is a direct threat to our civilization because it is intolerant of it and there is no shortage of Muslims dedicated to the goal of destroying it. Our principles of freedom and tolerance do not oblige us to tolerate intolerance of us. I know this is beyond you Dave, like most liberals.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:50 PM

So where is the no cry zone. How many blocks away.
Should they shut down the other mosques in Manhattan
Should Muslims be allowed to visit ground zero they’re all guilty right

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:28 AM

I’ll repeat what I said, since you don’t appear to be concentrating. There is no mathematical formula to calculate the number of blocks. There isn’t a mathematical formula for every aspect of human judgment. But building a mega-mosque right next to Ground Zero is wrong. They have the option of finding a more appropriate spot, one that doesn’t so obviously offend the feelings of millions of people, one which would prove that their blurb about “peace and understanding and good will” actually meant something.

Anyone can visit Ground Zero. But not all conduct is acceptable there. The “god flies planes into buildings to punish f@gs” nutjobs have been free to protest there, but that doesn’t mean their behavior shouldn’t be widely condemned. We are free to pass judgment.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:52 PM

Ah, so freedom of religion only applies to non-Muslims.

Have you started a petition to tear down the other mosques in Manhattan?

They’re all too close, right?

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:30 AM

“Freedom of religion” does not mean that we cannot oppose a mosque and heavily criticize its location and the motives of its founders. Grow up Dave and stop constructing these straw man arguments, ie that we’re proposing some kind of unconstitutional law.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:49 PM
——-
Then let the idiots build their idiot mosque and just complain about it/egg it/firebomb it and get on with your life.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 1:53 PM

Then let the idiots build their idiot mosque and just complain about it/egg it/firebomb it and get on with your life.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 1:53 PM

How about you let us “idiots” protest it before it’s built and get on with your life instead of trolling blog comments?

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:55 PM

How about you let us “idiots” protest it before it’s built and get on with your life instead of trolling blog comments?

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 1:55 PM
—-
Now how about that strip joint near ground zero?
That’s offensive for sure.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 2:00 PM

Now how about that strip joint near ground zero?
That’s offensive for sure.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 2:00 PM

Why? Strippers did not fly planes into the WTC.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 2:06 PM

Now how about that strip joint near ground zero?
That’s offensive for sure.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 2:00 PM

Right, because the hijackers attacked the WTC in the name of sex, didn’t they.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 2:07 PM

Right, because the hijackers attacked the WTC in the name of sex, didn’t they.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 2:07 PM
——
ha ha

Okay so who attacked the WTC?

Was it the people who want to build this mosque?

Because that would make for some real easy arrests.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 2:12 PM

There are two Muslims in Headline articles calling for the mosque not to be built there.

Drywall?

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 2:24 PM

ha ha

Okay so who attacked the WTC?

Was it the people who want to build this mosque?

Because that would make for some real easy arrests.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 2:12 PM

Muslims attacked the WTC, they did it in the name of Islam, a cult religion/ideological movement which is the inspiration behind the vast majority of terrorist attacks worldwide. The mosque is being built by followers of this exact same cult religion/ideological movement – and beyond any shadow of a doubt, they knew how New Yorkers would react to a mega-mosque at GZ, but they went ahead with the plan anyhoo, lying through their teeth about their motive to spread love in the community.

A similar controversy erupted before the building of a mega mosque in Boston – the same concerns about funding and terrorist ties, the same liberal PC baloney about misunderstood Muslims being persecuted for the actions of a tiny minority blah blah blibbety. That mosque went ahead and lo and behold became a viper’s nest of extremist hate speech and shady Muslim figures with links to terrorist organizations, who had previously appealed to American freedom but who subsequently enlisted the help of lawyers to curtail the freedom of speech of anyone who dared publish details of these ties.

It will be the same in this case. Mosques across the Western hemisphere are breeding grounds for radical Islamist preachers, hate speech and the recruitment of terrorists. Islam is not like other religions. Freedom of religion yes, but not freedom of cult movements which would really prefer Western freedom didn’t exist and which inspire their followers to act toward that end with the help of explosives.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 2:34 PM

Then let the idiots build their idiot mosque and just complain about it/egg it/firebomb it and get on with your life.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 1:53 PM

Why do you think the mosque is inappropriate there?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 2:40 PM

There are two Muslims in Headline articles calling for the mosque not to be built there.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 2:24 PM

Sure. This mosque will mostly hurt Islam’s image. It increases the cultural linkage of Islam and the attack.

exception on August 17, 2010 at 2:43 PM

Why do we sidetrack on mosques and vacations when the lack of a vibrant economy by this admistrations policies is the central theme to their losses in Novembers election?

Bring the debate back to the lack of an economy to focus on the democrats failures.

dthorny on August 17, 2010 at 3:01 PM

Why do you think the mosque is inappropriate there?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 2:40 PM
——-
It isn’t inappropriate there.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:09 PM

The mosque is being built by followers of this exact same cult religion/ideological movement – and beyond any shadow of a doubt, they knew how New Yorkers would react to a mega-mosque at GZ, but they went ahead with the plan anyhoo, lying through their teeth about their motive to spread love in the community.

A similar controversy erupted before the building of a mega mosque in Boston – the same concerns about funding and terrorist ties, the same liberal PC baloney about misunderstood Muslims being persecuted for the actions of a tiny minority blah blah blibbety. That mosque went ahead and lo and behold became a viper’s nest of extremist hate speech and shady Muslim figures with links to terrorist organizations, who had previously appealed to American freedom but who subsequently enlisted the help of lawyers to curtail the freedom of speech of anyone who dared publish details of these ties.

It will be the same in this case. Mosques across the Western hemisphere are breeding grounds for radical Islamist preachers, hate speech and the recruitment of terrorists. Islam is not like other religions. Freedom of religion yes, but not freedom of cult movements which would really prefer Western freedom didn’t exist and which inspire their followers to act toward that end with the help of explosives.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 2:34 PM
——–
hilarious

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:11 PM

There are two Muslims in Headline articles calling for the mosque not to be built there.

Drywall?

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 2:24 PM
——–
Who gives a sh*t?

I can find plenty of Catholics who support divorce even though the penalty is excommunication.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:12 PM

The mosque is inappropriate but legal.

Dave Rywall on August 16, 2010 at 11:14 PM

It isn’t inappropriate there.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:09 PM

What changed your mind?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 3:14 PM

Who gives a sh*t?

I can find plenty of Catholics who support divorce even though the penalty is excommunication.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:12 PM

Ahh, the open-minded Drywall doesn’t even want to read what they have to say.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 3:21 PM

What changed your mind?

exception on August 17, 2010 at 3:14 PM

It’s hard to keep track of what taqiyya he was dispensing four hours ago. Give the troll a break.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 3:23 PM

hilarious

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 3:11 PM

And that wins the argument!

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 3:30 PM

Hey govna, thanks for showing us how ignorant you are of the facts and for equating pissing on the memories of 3,000 dead Americans with playing politics. Shove it ignoramus.

gmerits on August 17, 2010 at 3:57 PM

I’m not saying this mosque issue is not important or doesn’t deserve attention but I do not think it is important enough to overshadow everything else going on in our country- and it is certainly starting to do that. Chrisite was saying he has more important things to worry about right now, is how I took his comments.

On the other hand this really seems to be screwing with the Dems so it can’t be all bad- especially this close to elections.

kg598301 on August 17, 2010 at 4:31 PM

At least it’s not like there’s a mosque at the Pentagon. Oh wait.

mmnowakjr85 on August 17, 2010 at 4:44 PM

At least it’s not like there’s a mosque at the Pentagon. Oh wait.

mmnowakjr85 on August 17, 2010 at 4:44 PM

And a couple several blocks away from the World Trade Center. So you understand the uproar is not about mosques in general, and that’s a start.

exception on August 17, 2010 at 4:53 PM

When I see a synagogue in Mecca, I’ll be sympathetic

Dingbat63 on August 17, 2010 at 6:57 PM

When I see a synagogue in Mecca, I’ll be sympathetic

Dingbat63 on August 17, 2010 at 6:57 PM

“Mecca” was for decades the name of a huge chain of bingo halls in Britain, until Muslims kicked up a stink and made them change it because they didn’t want the word “Mecca” associated with gambling. There’s your tolerant, freedom-loving Muslims for you.

Sharke on August 17, 2010 at 7:18 PM

When I see a synagogue in mushroom cloud over Mecca, I’ll be sympathetic relieved.

Dingbat63 on August 17, 2010 at 6:57 PM

had to.

Inanemergencydial on August 17, 2010 at 8:30 PM

Don’t be distracted by false charges of bigotry or intolerance. This has nothing to do with those. It is decency, common sense and TRUTH. It is not about “rights.” It is about what is right.

To rephrase a famous quote: “Don’t spit on my shoe and tell me it’s raining.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 8:34 PM

And meanwhile nothing is done to rebuild the Greek Orthodox church that was destroyed in the terrorist attack on 9/11.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 10:25 AM

One reason the Church is being delayed is because the dome will be higher than the 9/11 memorial.

Of course, the mosque is going to be higher than the 9/11 memorial, but that’s OK.

The reason the new Church will be bigger than the original St. Nicholas’ is because the original was very tiny and had no traditional dome, converted from a tavern.

The congregation wants the new Church to be bigger to be a quiet prayerful place used by everyone who visits the 9/11 site. Still the plans for the traditionally domed Church are not elaborate, but modest and typical.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 8:36 PM

The Muslims building this mosque are not “moderate.” No one is publicizing some of the questionable past statements and alliances. And no one is digging into the matter to learn more. Just the fact that they are building it so close to the 9/11 site after so many have been offended also speaks volumes. I think there are over 100 mosques in NYC already and one not too far from that site.

I heard a true moderate Muslim man on the radio today, God bless him. A true moderate Muslim knows this mosque is not intended to bring peace and understanding. It is a victory lap by their enemies. (I heard construction is to begin on 9/11/2011 – 10th anniversary.)

Like someone said, it’s like our raising of the US flag at Iwo Jima.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 8:38 PM

Drywall proves once again that the most anti-American country is not Iran, not Pakistan, not S. Arabia. It is, sadly, Canada.

angryed on August 17, 2010 at 8:41 PM

When I see a synagogue in Mecca, I’ll be sympathetic

Dingbat63 on August 17, 2010 at 6:57 PM

There won’t be any plans for a new one that’s for sure. And way behind any Christian Church, as well.

People are arrested and jailed for handing out Bibles.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 8:42 PM

Actually, I think Christians have been killed for passing out Bibles, not just jailed.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 8:44 PM

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2010/08/17/paterson-king-hope-for-mosque-compromise/

God bless Governor Paterson. One of the few political leaders in the tri-state area with any sense about this.

Elisa on August 17, 2010 at 9:03 PM

There’s ALREADY a Mosque one block from this site, folks. How many of you have been protesting its existence? Keep the ignorant hypocrisy coming…

pm123 on August 18, 2010 at 12:47 AM

Elisa:

And Muslims would likely be arrested or killed if they handed out Korans at the former World Trade Center site. Which one is more despicable?

pm123 on August 18, 2010 at 1:00 AM

And Muslims would likely be arrested or killed if they handed out Korans at the former World Trade Center site.

pm123 on August 18, 2010 at 1:00 AM

You’re silly.

exception on August 18, 2010 at 1:10 AM

There’s ALREADY a Mosque one block from this site, folks. How many of you have been protesting its existence? Keep the ignorant hypocrisy coming…

pm123 on August 18, 2010 at 12:47 AM

You didn’t read any of the thread, did you? What’s the address of a mosque is closer than Warren Street? There’s no uproar about other mosques not adjacent to the attack’s destruction.

exception on August 18, 2010 at 1:19 AM

Drywall, they’d build it right on Ground Zero if they could get the land.

But you go right on being a good dhimmi.

Disturb the Universe on August 17, 2010 at 11:02 AM
———
You go right ahead stomping all over the law because you blame all of Islam for 9/11.

Please tell us where in Manhattan is far enough away from ground zero so that you don’t cry.

Dave Rywall on August 17, 2010 at 11:16 AM

Drywall: somewhere outside of the Ground Zero debris pattern would be nice… One of the wheels of one of the jets went through the roof of the building… Too close… Not appropriate…

Khun Joe on August 18, 2010 at 3:19 AM

big fat squish

james23 on August 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM

WaPo chirped;

Stop being so mean to the ‘Ground Zero mosque’

…I remember in the cafeteria when I would take my tray and try to sit down somewhere, and everyone would tell me that, sure, they believed in free speech, but I was taking it a little far. So I know what you’re going through.

Sharia for kindergarten.

Terp Mole on August 18, 2010 at 8:57 AM

mmnowakjr85 sneered: “At least it’s not like there’s a mosque at the Pentagon. Oh wait.”

The Pentagon has an interfaith prayer and meditation room– not a 13-story mega-mosque (and 9/11 snuff porn vendor emporium and sharia law library and jihadi recruitment center).

Try to avoid aping Leftist-fascist propaganda in support of Islamo-supremacism your whole life, Quisling.

Terp Mole on August 18, 2010 at 9:18 AM

dthorny on August 17, 2010 at 3:01 PM

Some people can multi-task.

katiejane on August 18, 2010 at 10:30 AM

I’ve really cooled on Christie, and don’t really care for the guy, anymore. He’s shown he’s nothing more than a mealy-mouthed neocon, not a True Conservative. He’s shown himself an amnesty shill, possibly in the same vein as Flimsy Sham, and now a double-talker on this matter of the enemy monument/recruiting station on Ground Zero. I thought I’d like to see a West/Christie ticket, but that would be a mistake. He’s still good at controlling government spending, and would probably be good at a position that did nothing but that, and no longer in possession of any further responsibility, other than being some sort of government financial comptroller (possibly a treasury secretary). I am thoroughly disappointed with the guy, and Mark Levin really had his number when he called him out on his waffling BS of a speech, especially in light of the guy claiming he was so open, didn’t hide from issues, and we’d always know where he stood on issues because he’d always be blunt and up-front in telling us where he stood.

Virus-X on August 18, 2010 at 11:57 AM

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