Video: University makes diploma contingent on supporting gay rights?

posted at 3:35 pm on July 28, 2010 by Ed Morrissey

CNN has an interesting roundtable on the case of Jennifer Keeton, who has sued Augusta State University to keep from getting expelled for not repudiating her statements about homosexuality. Keeton expressed her biblical perspective on the subject in and out of class while working toward a degree in counseling, and the school mandated a “remediation plan” that appears to have required her to renounce her Christian doctrine in order to gain a diploma from the school.  The school has responded that a bias against homosexuality would disqualify Keeton from certification, a position that would put most Christians in Keeton’s position.

Does this amount to a “thought police”?  A religious test for education?  Or does Keeton’s lack of diversity appreciation really make her unqualified for a degree and career in counseling?

It sounds to me like the ACA wants a “don’t ask, don’t tell” rule for religion.  That runs square into the First Amendment, especially for a state-run school.  The ACA’s idea of who comes first doesn’t get to trump the restriction on freedom of religious exercise.  If clients get off-put by Keeton’s approach to counseling, they can look for another counselor.  Now, the ACA can decide not to certify her; as a private organization, they have that prerogative.  If they do that explicitly based on her religious belief, however, they may have a problem with that in court, especially as it will block Keeton’s ability to make a living.

The state-run school has no such leeway.  They cannot impose a religious test for graduation, no matter how they dress it up.

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Make the argument. I want to see it logically posited without snark, then. Seriously.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:13 PM

I just have…sigh…

in a nutshell, pedophilia (or polygamy) is just an alternative lifestyle…so why isn’t pedophilia?

and if homosexuality is genetic, then so is pedophilia…so it has to be a protected class, like race.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:17 PM

you sure are obsessed with my sexuality, no surprise. its called projection loser.

I didn’t say a word about your sexuality, only your anatomy.

given that that is the argument of NAMBLA…which is part of the gay rights movement…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:12 PM

NAMBLA has long been spurned by the gay rights movement. Not that facts matter much to you, given that you’ve already claimed that if someone argues with you, then they must not only be for gay marriage, but also for the “entire gay agenda”. You’re a lunatic.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:17 PM

and what is the age of consent? it used to be 21…now its 18…its an ARBITRARY NUMBER…

and we can change it whenever we want.

get a clue.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:11 PM

Jumping Jesus Christ. It is not an arbitrary number. Just because it changed doesn’t make it arbitrary. Used to you couldn’t vote but your country could send you off to die in war. I guess the voting age is arbitrary to! And hey, even the driving age is arbitrary, let infants drive themselves, vote, buy handguns, buy cigarettes, buy alcohol and vote and hold public office!

You twerp. You maroon. You stupid twunt.

There is a reason you cannot drive until aged 16 on public roads. There is a reason why you cannot vote until 18. There is a reason why consent is 18 as well. Emotional, physical and intellectual maturity. It is not arbitrary.

You are arguing absurdity of absurdities.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

I didn’t say a word about your sexuality, only your anatomy.

and you sure are obsessed with me…as pulling up a post from 2 years ago proves…you are a sick twist cyber stalker…you truly area piece of sh**

NAMBLA has long been spurned by the gay rights movement. Not that facts matter much to you, given that you’ve already claimed that if someone argues with you, then they must not only be for gay marriage, but also for the “entire gay agenda”. You’re a lunatic.

BS

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

its gotten to the point where any viewpoint that doesn’t agree with the homosexual one is soon to be illegal.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:16 PM

Says the guy who fantasizes about outlawing homosexuality, then calls those who disagree “fascists”.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:19 PM

Jumping Jesus Christ. It is not an arbitrary number. Just because it changed doesn’t make it arbitrary.

really now…please…why was it changed?????

Used to you couldn’t vote but your country could send you off to die in war. I guess the voting age is arbitrary to! And hey, even the driving age is arbitrary, let infants drive themselves, vote, buy handguns, buy cigarettes, buy alcohol and vote and hold public office!

obviously it is.

You twerp. You maroon. You stupid twunt.

There is a reason you cannot drive until aged 16 on public roads. There is a reason why you cannot vote until 18. There is a reason why consent is 18 as well. Emotional, physical and intellectual maturity. It is not arbitrary.

You are arguing absurdity of absurdities.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

you’re an idiot…some states let you drive at 15…duhhhh you moron.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

and what is the age of consent? it used to be 21…now its 18…its an ARBITRARY NUMBER…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:11 PM

Biological + emotional maturity. That’s not exactly arbitrary…call it science. Wait, unless you’re the one who said earlier that science couldn’t prove anything conclusively.
FYI, you are aware that Mary was between the ages of 14-17 when she gave birth to Jesus, right? Should we go back to biblical age of consent? Just trying to sort it all out over here.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

BS

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

Ya-huh!

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

Says the guy who fantasizes about outlawing homosexuality, then calls those who disagree “fascists”.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:19 PM

Be reasonable, if right4life had his way it would be outright biblical, I mean real Old Testament Wrath of God stuff. He thinks castration is to merciful.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

Biological + emotional maturity. That’s not exactly arbitrary…call it science. Wait, unless you’re the one who said earlier that science couldn’t prove anything conclusively.
FYI, you are aware that Mary was between the ages of 14-17 when she gave birth to Jesus, right? Should we go back to biblical age of consent? Just trying to sort it all out over here.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

wait, you’re lying about me again. never said that. but thanks for making my point…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

Ya-huh!

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

oh and because YOU say it it must be true…right..laughable…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

I just reiterated what you said re emotional/physical maturity. Didn’t see your post, seriously. Sorry!

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:22 PM

Be reasonable, if right4life had his way it would be outright biblical, I mean real Old Testament Wrath of God stuff. He thinks castration is to merciful.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

nice lie…no surprise considering the source!

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:22 PM

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

Makes you wonder why he keeps asserting that age of consent is arbitrary, and talks about pedophilia so much. Hmmm.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:22 PM

Makes you wonder why he keeps asserting that age of consent is arbitrary, and talks about pedophilia so much. Hmmm.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:22 PM

I don’t wonder about your stupidity or obsession with me…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:24 PM

Says the guy who fantasizes about outlawing homosexuality, then calls those who disagree “fascists”.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:19 PM

oh yeah another lie..

but hey I understand why you fascists would have to lie…since you sure can’t win an argument!

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:25 PM

oh and because YOU say it it must be true…right..laughable…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

I think if Jesus Christ came back from the dead and told you that, you’d insult him. Nevertheless.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:25 PM

wait, you’re lying about me again. never said that. but thanks for making my point…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:21 PM

Sorry, how did that make your point? I assumed you were arguing that the bible was the objective standard. You then argued that our measuring stick for age of consent was arbitrary. I called it “science” and quite a bit more stringent than biblical times. I was making a point that our protection of minors is quite solid and unrelated to the behavior between consenting adults. Not following you.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:26 PM

Not following you.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:26 PM

It’s going to be that way for a long time. Best give up.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

Sorry, how did that make your point? I assumed you were arguing that the bible was the objective standard. You then argued that our measuring stick for age of consent was arbitrary. I called it “science” and quite a bit more stringent than biblical times. I was making a point that our protection of minors is quite solid and unrelated to the behavior between consenting adults. Not following you.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:26 PM

the part of Mary having Jesus at 14-17…thanks for making my point.

I believe you can still be married in some states at a rather young age…

again, its arbitrary…there is no magic number.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

It’s going to be that way for a long time. Best give up.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

its more than obvious why you cannot…you worthless piece of trash .

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

you’re an idiot…some states let you drive at 15…duhhhh you moron.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:20 PM

And yet no state lets children drive on public roads, smoke, drink, buy handguns or vote and hold public office. In fact, some states consider letting a child smoke or drink a crime punishable by jail time and grounds to have your kids taken from you because you are an unfit parent. I wonder why that is? After all, it is all arbitrary isn’t it?

And yet you think we are on the cusp of letting pedophiles rape children fresh out of the womb because all age laws are arbitrary and in a few short years we will suddenly have an age of consent at 3 months gestation.

I still think you are AP’s sockpuppet, no one can be this worthy of contempt and pity.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

again, its arbitrary…there is no magic number.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

10-20 years in prison is a whole range of magic numbers, cretin.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

It’s going to be that way for a long time. Best give up.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

Never. Someone is wrong on the internet, and all. :)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

I think if Jesus Christ came back from the dead and told you that, you’d insult him. Nevertheless.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:25 PM

oh its on wikipedia, of course it must be true…right.

Pedophiles And Homosexual Activists Push For Total Sexual Liberation

In August, 2003, the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) filed a lawsuit against the state of Kansas over the state’s criminal sodomy law involving children. The ACLU is defending Matthew Limon, a homosexual who committed sodomy against a 14-year-old boy in 2000. At the time of his crime, Simon was 18 years old. The ACLU is claiming that Limon’s conviction is unconstitutionally discriminatory because the penalties for sodomy with a minor are different than for heterosexual sex with a minor.

Kansas Attorney General Phill KIine says the fairness of Limon’s sentence should be a state legislative issue, not a constitutional one. According to Kline, “If the ACLU wins in the thrust of their arguments, it means the state has no right to say that it is illegal for an adult to have sex with a 13-year-old child.” Kline also fears that an ACLU victory will make it difficult for the state to enforce laws against polygamy, incest, bestiality, and other sexual perversions.

The effort to abolish “age of consent” laws has been a long-time goal of homosexual activists. The 1972 Gay Rights Platform, for example, called for the abolition of all laws prohibiting sex with children. The platform demands: “Repeal of all laws governing the age of sexual consent.”

In September, 1995, three homosexual activists published an essay entitled, “The State Of Gay Liberation” in Guide, a homosexual publication. The essay was authored by North American Man Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) co-founder David Thorstad, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign Professor Richard D. Mohr, and San Francisco journalist Bruce Mirken.

Thorstad, of course, is a life-long pederast and homosexual activist who clearly describes the important linkage between homosexuality and pedophilia. In a speech given before a homosexual group in Mexico in 1998, Thorstad said: “Pederasty is the main form that male homosexuality has acquired throughout Western civilization-and not only in the West! Pederasty is inseparable from the high points of Western culture-ancient Greece and the Renaissance.” (David Thorstad, “Pederasty And Homosexuality,” NAMBLA web site)

Fellow author Professor Richard Mohr, is a homosexual activist who is an advocate for same-sex marriage and has said he hopes that homosexual marriage will help define “monogamy” out of marriage altogether. (Stanley Kurtz, “Beyond Gay Marriage,” The Weekly Standard, Aug. 4-11, 2003)

Bruce Mirken is a homosexual and San Francisco journalist who was arrested in 1998 for attempting to have sex with a 13-year-old boy he had contacted through the Internet. When he entered a Sacramento park to sodomize the boy, he was met by police who had been tracking his activities on the Internet. The charges were eventually dropped against him on a technicality.
Sexual Liberation For Children

Thorstad and Professor Mohr want sexual liberation for children and Mirken believes that AIDS activism is what will help perpetuate and strengthen the homosexual movement.

According to David Thorstad, in “The State Of Gay Liberation,” homosexuals must get back to a “radical vision of sexual freedom for all. We need to reaffirm our place in the great variety of same-sex behaviors that exist-have always existed-in human societies. We dare not allow our homosexual gift to be alienated from us by the limited vision, stifling political correctness, and erotophobic provincialism.” In short, homosexuals should openly support the promotion of adult/child sex!

Professor Mohr argues that the use of “gay youth” is a key to gaining political and cultural victories in the U.S. He writes: “…these brave youth are key to culture’s change on gay issues. Thanks to them, increasingly people know someone for whom being gay is an issue. Thanks to them the gay movement is achieving critical mass.” Bruce Mirken claims that radical AIDS activism is what will save the homosexual movement from decline.

The effort to push adult/child sex isn’t limited to these three homosexual activists. It is part of the overall homosexual movement. As author Mary Eberstadt wrote in “Pedophilia Chic: Reconsidered” in The Weekly Standard, (Jan. 1, 2001): “The reason why the public is being urged to reconsider boy pedophilia is that this ‘question,’ settled though it may be in the opinions and laws of the rest of the country, is demonstrably not yet settled within certain parts of the gay rights movement.” Eberstadt notes that as the homosexual movement becomes more mainstream, this “question” about adult/child sex will become more prominent. Homosexuals who desire sex with children will do exactly what the ACLU is doing in Kansas: Destroy all laws banning sex between adults and children.

http://www.traditionalvalues.org/urban/nine.php

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:31 PM

And yet no state lets children drive on public roads, smoke, drink, buy handguns or vote and hold public office. In fact, some states consider letting a child smoke or drink a crime punishable by jail time and grounds to have your kids taken from you because you are an unfit parent. I wonder why that is? After all, it is all arbitrary isn’t it?

And yet you think we are on the cusp of letting pedophiles rape children fresh out of the womb because all age laws are arbitrary and in a few short years we will suddenly have an age of consent at 3 months gestation.

I still think you are AP’s sockpuppet, no one can be this worthy of contempt and pity.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

and of course states can NEVER CHANGE THAT AGE!!! right…duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

you’re an idiot…talk about contempt…you’re a piece of trash just like madison…but we’ve talked before…you also worship at the altar of the hairy god of evolution, darwin…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:32 PM

It is not a standard in the Christian community to not accept a person for being gay.

SC.Charlie on July 29, 2010 at 1:40 PM

Again, people here seem unable or unwilling to seperate the act from the person. Yes, in fact, it IS “standard” to accept sinners (that would be every person on earth), but to reject sin. This was Christ’s example, and it is the charge of the church. Do all Christians practice it? No, but then not everyone who calls himself a Christian is.

I can befriend a person and love a person who is living in sin. I’m neither rejecting the person nor accepting their actions as right.

Imagine you have a child with a drug problem. You still love your child, but you hate their drug use. Do you keep your feelings about their drug use quiet? Not if you really love them.

The fallacy here in regard to homosexuals is still the notion that “gay is who they really are as a person.” It’s still false. Gay is what they do, not who they are. The people who take the attitude that people’s identities are inextricably linked to their sexuality are demeaning to gays. You treat them as though they are helpless pawns in life, victims of fate, unable to be the captain of their own vessels. They’re not one-dimensional beings.

And yes, Christians can (and do) love gay people while still opposing their lifestyles. That is no paradox.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:34 PM

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:28 PM

I say we’ve got a rather good handle on age of consent (largely age 18) based on research of human development (read: not arbitrary).

You’re making a lot of noise about the age of consent…how would you arrive at it? Are you OK with the biblical standard?

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:36 PM

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:31 PM

Awesome. Next you’ll link to a Media Matters article where they point out three tea partiers who are racist, as a demonstration that the entire tea party movement is racist.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:37 PM

you worthless piece of trash .

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

Careful…your “christianity” is showing again.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:39 PM

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:31 PM

Oh, and do explain this.

All that pedophilia…but heterosexual. Nothing like NAMBLA, though, right? Nothing like an organization that’s become as much of a joke as the Westboro Baptists. Oh, wait…more people have heard of the WBC.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:39 PM

All that pedophilia…but heterosexual. Nothing like NAMBLA, though, right? Nothing like an organization that’s become as much of a joke as the Westboro Baptists. Oh, wait…more people have heard of the WBC.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:39 PM

how do explain the ACLU DEFENDING NAMBL???? hmmmmm????

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:42 PM

Careful…your “christianity” is showing again.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:39 PM

well I’m not as holy-as-thou obviously!

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:42 PM

Awesome. Next you’ll link to a Media Matters article where they point out three tea partiers who are racist, as a demonstration that the entire tea party movement is racist.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:37 PM

again you show your ignorance…no surprise.

those 3 are not just 3 yahooos…duhhhhhhhh

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:43 PM

It’s definitely an art, though, and amazing to watch them work.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 1:25 PM

I believe it. I can’t imagine having to be that perfect. The body is a delicate canvas.

It is not a standard in the Christian community to not accept a person for being gay.

SC.Charlie on July 29, 2010 at 1:40 PM

I agree, it’s not. The standard is to accept everyone, regardless of who the person is or what the person does.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:43 PM

You’re making a lot of noise about the age of consent…how would you arrive at it? Are you OK with the biblical standard?

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:36 PM

You’ll find the age of consent varies widely around the world even to this day. Less than a century ago in the US, it was common for people to marry as young as 13, 14 years old. Still happens today elsewhere in the world. I’m not saying it’s right; I’m just saying that modern American legal definitions are far from universal, and in the scope of history are more of an anomaly than the rule.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:44 PM

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:39 PM

Oh, but see he’s not saying that at all! /s

When I called him out on that earlier, he said I was lying–he never implicated homosexuals as the chief perpetrators of pedophilia. Interesting knot he’s in.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:45 PM

and of course states can NEVER CHANGE THAT AGE!!! right…duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

And yet, it hasn’t changed. Oh it might be a year earlier or a year later in some states. But the age to drive and consent is still basically mid to late teens.

Before we know it, we will have infant killers going around with assault rifles shooting up the town.

you’re an idiot…talk about contempt…you’re a piece of trash just like madison…but we’ve talked before…you also worship at the altar of the hairy god of evolution, darwin…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:32 PM

I got a quote to sum you up perfectly.

All that most maddens and torments; all that stirs up the lees of things; all truth with malice in it; all that cracks the sinews and cakes the brain; all the subtle demonisms of life and thought; all evil, to crazy Ahab, were visibly personified, and made practically assailable in Moby-Dick. He piled upon the whale’s white hump the sum of all the general rage and hate felt by his whole race from Adam down; and then, as if his chest had been a mortar, he burst his hot heart’s shell upon it.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:45 PM

I say we’ve got a rather good handle on age of consent (largely age 18) based on research of human development (read: not arbitrary).

You’re making a lot of noise about the age of consent…how would you arrive at it? Are you OK with the biblical standard?

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:36 PM

read, it is arbitrary…it used to be 21…in new hampshire you can be married at 13 with parental consent…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:46 PM

Our current “safe schools” czar was a strong supporter of NAMBLA, actually writing for their newsletter. He also counseled an underage teen student how to have sex with an older man. Thus, NAMBLA can’t be that far out of the gay mainstream.

tommyboy on July 29, 2010 at 2:47 PM

And yet, it hasn’t changed. Oh it might be a year earlier or a year later in some states. But the age to drive and consent is still basically mid to late teens.

and you couldn’t vote until you were 21 until a few decades ago….in other words, things change…there is no line in the sand age for the age of consent…

Spain has 13 as the age of consent…why are they wrong, and we right??

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:48 PM

Our current “safe schools” czar was a strong supporter of NAMBLA, actually writing for their newsletter. He also counseled an underage teen student how to have sex with an older man. Thus, NAMBLA can’t be that far out of the gay mainstream.

tommyboy on July 29, 2010 at 2:47 PM

BINGO.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:48 PM

When I called him out on that earlier, he said I was lying–he never implicated homosexuals as the chief perpetrators of pedophilia. Interesting knot he’s in.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:45 PM

you really are delusional.

you are a liar.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:48 PM

how do christians KNOW this? hmmm?? just a feeling…whatever society says? please. its been rather clear what is and is not a sin for the last 2 millenia….

Did you miss the part where I said that it’s the Holy Spirit’s job? You quoted it. Or do you believe it’s not ral and that it’s just some sorta feel good new age Christianity to believe that God convicts us when we sin?

obviously it does…haven’t you read Kurtz’s research on gay marriage in the netherlands??

You’ve posted it enough times. Of course I still wasn’t even talking about marriage, so it’s a bit irrelevant for those outside of Westboro.

sure is not the God of the Bible.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:10 PM

No, cause if I listened to that one, I’d know that he wanted me to call people “stupid piece of trash” and “pathetic little moron,” even though Jesus specifically addresses such insults in The Gospels as being no better than killing someone.

But I’m the one cherry-picking from the Bible for saying that it’s the Holy Spirit who convicts people of sin, so don’t mind me.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

how do explain the ACLU DEFENDING NAMBL???? hmmmmm????

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:42 PM

…what does the ACLU have to do with the gay movement?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

Before we know it, we will have infant killers going around with assault rifles shooting up the town.

…
Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:45 PM

You really have a gift for exageration and melodrama, don’t you? :-)

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

I agree, it’s not. The standard is to accept everyone, regardless of who the person is or what the person does.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:43 PM

yeah as long as they repent….forgot that part didn’t you?

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:46 PM

Tell me how you’d arrive at the proper age of consent, then? Second time I’ve asked.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

…what does the ACLU have to do with the gay movement?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

they are their defenders.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

Our current “safe schools” czar was a strong supporter of NAMBLA, actually writing for their newsletter. He also counseled an underage teen student how to have sex with an older man. Thus, NAMBLA can’t be that far out of the gay mainstream.

tommyboy on July 29, 2010 at 2:47 PM

So Kevin Jennings is the king of the gay movement?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

Tell me how you’d arrive at the proper age of consent, then? Second time I’ve asked.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

there is no great and perfect way to arrive at that age…THATS THE POINT.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

they are their defenders.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

The ACLU also defends Muslims. Explain that, Einstein.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

Tell me how you’d arrive at the proper age of consent, then? Second time I’ve asked.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

so how would you?

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:52 PM

The ACLU also defends Muslims. Explain that, Einstein.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

oh yes the noble ACLU…defends everyone except christians….right…I’m sure you’re a member!

again, why did they defend NAMBLA??? since they are SO FAR out of the mainsream???

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:52 PM

there is no great and perfect way to arrive at that age…THATS THE POINT.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

So because you’re too stupid to figure out an appropriate age for sexual consent, you conclude that there should be no age of consent.

Well, congratulations. You’re on NAMBLA’s side.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:52 PM

No, cause if I listened to that one, I’d know that he wanted me to call people “stupid piece of trash” and “pathetic little moron,” even though Jesus specifically addresses such insults in The Gospels as being no better than killing someone.
But I’m the one cherry-picking from the Bible for saying that it’s the Holy Spirit who convicts people of sin, so don’t mind me.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

Yeah, right4life, whether you make good points or not, you don’t have the moral high ground on this forum. But uh… there are several others here who are claiming to represent Christ and doing a lousy job of it, too. Re-read my post a couple of pages back.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:53 PM

Yeah, right4life, whether you make good points or not, you don’t have the moral high ground on this forum. But uh… there are several others here who are claiming to represent Christ and doing a lousy job of it, too. Re-read my post a couple of pages back.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:53 PM

I never claimed the moral high ground….you really have to ascribe all sorts of things to myself that are not true to try to make yourself feel better.

get some help.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

and you sure are obsessed with me…as pulling up a post from 2 years ago proves…you are a sick twist cyber stalker…you truly area piece of sh**

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:18 PM

So he’s a cyber stalker for using a post of yours from two years ago, but when you do the same with me, it’s somehow different because you say it is?

Never. Someone is wrong on the internet, and all. :)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 2:29 PM

That’s me far too often. It’s not healthy, but it can feel cathartic.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

oh yes the noble ACLU…defends everyone except christians….right…I’m sure you’re a member!

again, why did they defend NAMBLA??? since they are SO FAR out of the mainsream???

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:52 PM

They defended NAMBLA and they defended Muslims. Are you saying Islam supports NAMBLA? Please, oh please be that stupid…

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

So Kevin Jennings is the king of the gay movement?
MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

He’s certainly one of the top dogs. He was founder and President of GLESN oone of the larges gay rights advocacy groups in the county if not the world. I dont’ know how much more “mainstream” in the gay political world one can get.

tommyboy on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

So because you’re too stupid to figure out an appropriate age for sexual consent, you conclude that there should be no age of consent.

Well, congratulations. You’re on NAMBLA’s side.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:52 PM

again nice lie…no surprise.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

They defended NAMBLA and they defended Muslims. Are you saying Islam supports NAMBLA? Please, oh please be that stupid…

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:54 PM

again you prove yourself to be a piece of trash.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:55 PM

yeah as long as they repent….forgot that part didn’t you?

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

Um… no. Romans 5:8
“But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

If you don’t love people just as they are, they will never repent. I’m not sensing much love coming from you.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:56 PM

So he’s a cyber stalker for using a post of yours from two years ago, but when you do the same with me, it’s somehow different because you say it is?

newflash honey, I didn’t pull it up, or search for it..I just used what was there….DUHHHHHHH

I don’t blame you for being ashamed of what you said, it was revolting.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:55 PM

So you cannot account for how ACLU is a gay defender organization, but also defends Muslims, who loathe and despise gays as much as you do?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

in new hampshire you can be married at 13 with parental consent…

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:46 PM

with parental consent… Imagine that. And you should really check out the minutiae of NH consent laws:

In New Hampshire, the age of consent is 16 years old for heterosexual conduct. For homosexual conduct, the age of consent is 18. This makes New Hampshire one of the few states explicitly permitting homosexual conduct by creating an age of consent for it.

Unlike most other states, New Hampshire has a single age of consent. In the majority of other states, there is an allowance for minors who are under the age of consent, but close to the same age. New Hampshire has no such allowance.

So, in New Hampshire, a person who is 16 years old cannot have sex with a person who is 15, even if they are going to turn 16 in a day.

So, they can marry at 13 with parental consent but can’t have sex until 16.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

yeah as long as they repent….forgot that part didn’t you?

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:50 PM

No, I didn’t. Accepting isn’t the same as condoning their actions.

there are several others here who are claiming to represent Christ and doing a lousy job of it, too. Re-read my post a couple of pages back.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:53 PM

I don’t claim to represent him. I only claim that I believe, because I can’t help but see the Truth for what it is, but I will say often that I’m a horrible example. Most people online are.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

If you don’t love people just as they are, they will never repent. I’m not sensing much love coming from you.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:56 PM

so you have no problems with someone, a pedophile say, calling themselves a christian…and not repenting of that sin?

I find it interesting that any disagreement with the gay agenda is HATEFUL.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:58 PM

No, I didn’t. Accepting isn’t the same as condoning their actions.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

you obviously accept homosexual sex as being christian…you sure can’t call it a sin.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:59 PM

So, they can marry at 13 with parental consent but can’t have sex until 16.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

you are just supporting my point…thanks

I know you don’t get it…no surprise.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

So you cannot account for how ACLU is a gay defender organization, but also defends Muslims, who loathe and despise gays as much as you do?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

if you haven’t noticed, the left is a HUGE SUPPORTER OF RADICAL ISLAM…duhhhhhhhhhh

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

You really have a gift for exageration and melodrama, don’t you? :-)

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 2:49 PM

It wasn’t a gift, I had to work at it.

Soon we will have cats and dogs living together.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

you really are delusional.

you are a liar.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:48 PM

Not either. But I do apologize for saying you called me a liar. I went through the thread and saw you said that of two others above my post and I thought you referred to me. My mistake. The rest of my argument stands.

there is no great and perfect way to arrive at that age…THATS THE POINT.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:51 PM

Um….OK. So, you’re rejecting the method which best protects young children and says that most are sexually and emotionally mature to consent (approx. 18)? Just so I’m clear.

Third time: how would you define it? Personal preference and how you arrived at it.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

So you cannot account for how ACLU is a gay defender organization, but also defends Muslims, who loathe and despise gays as much as you do?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

in other words a-wipe, as long as you are against christians, the left LOVES YOU….

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:01 PM

if you haven’t noticed, the left is a HUGE SUPPORTER OF RADICAL ISLAM…duhhhhhhhhhh

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

So wait…the left supports radical Islam…but also supports homosexual activism.

How does that work, exactly?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:02 PM

in other words a-wipe, as long as you are against christians, the left LOVES YOU….

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:01 PM

So that’s a “no, I can’t explain how the ACLU is a gay organization despite defending the biggest group of gay-haters in the world”?

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:04 PM

newflash honey, I didn’t pull it up, or search for it..I just used what was there….DUHHHHHHH

That makes no sense. You either had it on you, saved somewhere on your computer (hopefully not for your personal enjoyment), or you used Google to find it. I didn’t post it in this thread, so clearly it’s not just “there” anymore than your comment about white women was “there”.

I don’t blame you for being ashamed of what you said, it was revolting.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

I’m not ashamed. Some of the puns are horrible, and that embarrasses me as a person who can read and write the English language, but it was all just a joke. Madison understood that, and while I’m sorry for you that you didn’t, it’s not really my problem.

Keep trying to pin that bright red A on my shoulder all you want though. Again, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:04 PM

I find it interesting that any disagreement with the gay agenda is HATEFUL.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:58 PM

I find it interesting that any disagreement with you is full support of gay marriage and “the gay agenda”.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:05 PM

you are just supporting my point…thanks

I know you don’t get it…no surprise.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM

Only if your stupid and obviously you overlooked a part. Need I point it out? I probably do. Pedophilia is not supported by the NH statute. Infact, a 16 year old would be criminal for sleeping with a 15 year old. And a minor married couldn’t go on their honeymoon until each was 16.

As usual, dishonest.

And you missed another part, age of consent for homosexual sex in NH, 18 years of age.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 3:05 PM

you obviously accept homosexual sex as being christian…you sure can’t call it a sin.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:59 PM

And now you’re lying about me, and while it’s wrong when someone does it to you, it’s perfectly acceptable when you do it to others. You really must teach others have to win friends and influence people.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:06 PM

so you have no problems with someone, a pedophile say, calling themselves a christian…and not repenting of that sin?

I find it interesting that any disagreement with the gay agenda is HATEFUL.

right4life on July 29, 2010 at 2:58 PM

I’m sensing you may have problems with reading comprehension. Christians are to love (non-believing, pre-repentant, lost, whatever you want to call it) people regardless of their sin, just as Christ loved us while we were lost.

On the other hand, if somebody claims to be a Christian, yet continually behaves in a way that brings shame to the name of Christ, that person is to be reprimanded in specific ways that are outlined by Paul in the epistles. It is for this reason that *I* am reprimanding *you* for your hateful comments towards others on here while professing the name of Christ. Your attitude is very un-Christlike, and you are further solidifying the anti-Christian attitudes of non-believers here. Cut. It. Out.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:07 PM

I find it interesting that any disagreement with you is full support of gay marriage and “the gay agenda”.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:05 PM

Especially interesting considering Beo has continuously stated in this thread that she’s specifically against gay marriage any so-called gay agenda, and also believes unequivocally that homosexuality is a sin and a choice.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:08 PM

And now you’re lying about me, and while it’s wrong when someone does it to you, it’s perfectly acceptable when you do it to others.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:06 PM

By Jove, I think she’s got it!

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:08 PM

Your attitude is very un-Christlike, and you are further solidifying the anti-Christian attitudes of non-believers here. Cut. It. Out.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:07 PM

Been that way for a while. It was even more hilarious in the old days when he was reduced to simply calling people fat and ugly.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:09 PM

http://www.aug.edu/elcse/faculty_bios/mj_anderson.htm

Looks like the teacher Mary Jane Anderson Hyphen Wiley is judgemental and intolerant. That is the way to teach tolerance eh?

When teachers hate a certain group, it is normal to surprise them with different class requirements.
The faculty needs sensitivity training. I know the law. What does the teacher suggest if a gay male student/patient says they do young boys at least several times a month.

seven on July 29, 2010 at 3:10 PM

And now you’re lying about me, and while it’s wrong when someone does it to you, it’s perfectly acceptable when you do it to others. You really must teach others have to win friends and influence people.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:06 PM

You’re delusional. Now go put on your scarlet letter and sit in the corner and take your punishment like a good, penitent little girl.
;)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:10 PM

Been that way for a while. It was even more hilarious in the old days when he was reduced to simply calling people fat and ugly.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:09 PM

I preferred that. Those were simple times, back when even apacalypse couldn’t stand him, even though the feeling wasn’t mutual.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:11 PM

You’re delusional.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:10 PM

That would explain so much of my interactions with him actually.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:14 PM

I don’t claim to represent him. I only claim that I believe, because I can’t help but see the Truth for what it is, but I will say often that I’m a horrible example. Most people online are.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 2:57 PM

Esthier, if you profess to be a believer, you’re representing Christ whether you intend to or not. Obviously no Christian is perfect, but I don’t want to be an obstacle to somebody else coming to know Christ. People who know I am a Christian are constantly watching to see if I stumble, so that they can discount my faith as worthless. I don’t intend to give them that.

2 Corinthians 5:17-21:

17Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! 18All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: 19that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 20We are therefore Christ’s ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ’s behalf: Be reconciled to God. 21God made him who had no sin to be sin[a] for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:14 PM

Keep trying to pin that bright red A on my shoulder all you want though. Again, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:04 PM

Dammit, you already used the Scarlet Letter reference. *sigh* My typing/commenting speed is shameful.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:15 PM

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:06 PM

You’re delusional. Now go put on your scarlet letter and sit in the corner and take your punishment like a good, penitent little girl.
;)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:10 PM

I like where this is going.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:16 PM

Especially interesting considering Beo has continuously stated in this thread that she’s specifically against gay marriage any so-called gay agenda, and also believes unequivocally that homosexuality is a sin and a choice.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:08 PM

I don’t think I’ve even mentioned gay marriage at all. And I’m not a she. Are you blending my identity with Bee’s again? :-)

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:19 PM

I like where this is going.

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:16 PM

Not surprising. ;)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:20 PM

Not surprising. ;)

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:20 PM

wrong4life’s response:

piece of trash fantasizing about two women just proves hes pushing the gay agenda!!!

duhhhhhhhhhhh

MadisonConservative on July 29, 2010 at 3:22 PM

Esthier, if you profess to be a believer, you’re representing Christ whether you intend to or not. Obviously no Christian is perfect, but I don’t want to be an obstacle to somebody else coming to know Christ. People who know I am a Christian are constantly watching to see if I stumble, so that they can discount my faith as worthless. I don’t intend to give them that.

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:14 PM

I understand what you’re saying, and it’s not that I disagree, but my sinning isn’t proof that my faith is worthless but rather proof that I need that faith.

I can’t reject the idea that God exists and is I AM anymore than I can reject the idea that my mother exists and that she did give birth to me (I have the pictures to prove it – luckily I’m the first and she realized after that pictures like that aren’t necessary or desirable).

I do try to make myself a better person, but it’s a process, one that suffers when I’m specifically targeted for insults.

I’ve probably been a political internet commenter for too long.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:22 PM

Beo needs to stop commenting for my sanity. I’m seeing double…and subconsciously concerned about my personal hygiene. UNCOOL.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:22 PM

Dammit, you already used the Scarlet Letter reference. *sigh* My typing/commenting speed is shameful.

Bee on July 29, 2010 at 3:15 PM

I actually thought that’s what you were referring to.

I don’t think I’ve even mentioned gay marriage at all. And I’m not a she. Are you blending my identity with Bee’s again? :-)

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:19 PM

I thought you had mentioned marriage. You have been talking about homosexuality, right?

And yes, it’s entirely possible that I’m confusing you with her. I even went to the link on your name and saw that you’re a guy and still can’t shake the idea that you’re female.

So sorry.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:24 PM

Oh, and guess what. The Age of Consent to marry in New Hampshire. I did some research and I think it has been that way since 1907.

Holger on July 29, 2010 at 3:34 PM

So sorry.

Esthier on July 29, 2010 at 3:24 PM

LOL! Nope, I’m a guy. And Bee, are you suggesting something about my hygiene? :-)

Beo on July 29, 2010 at 3:38 PM

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