The “Lost” finale, according to someone who didn’t watch it
posted at 7:50 pm on May 24, 2010 by Allahpundit
I never watched the show, having learned my lesson from “Twin Peaks” to stay away from ambitiously cryptic serials, but (a) this is the big story of the day, to my amazement, so we owe the fanboys among us a thread and (b) not knowing what I’m talking about has never stopped me from blogging before. Besides, it’s the last 10 minutes that’s getting the buzz and you don’t really need to have followed “Lost” to form a judgment on that. (Skip ahead to 1:34:30 below to watch.) Everyone knows the basic plot outline: They crashed on a mysterious island years ago, they’ve had a thousand unexplainable things happen to them since then, and in lieu of explaining those things last night, they gave you … this. Which, I have to say: I really like. I understand why a lot of Losties detest it. You’ve been reading a thousand-page mystery novel that’s gotten more convoluted with each chapter, and on the very last page, instead of the whodunnit — they gave you a poem. The question is, was it a mystery novel or was it something else? Via Jim Treacher, this rings true with what I’ve heard from other “Lost” fans:
Ultimately, “Lost” didn’t succeed because of the mythology. We’ve seen too many examples of mythology-heavy, character-light series fail over the last six years to think that. “Lost” succeeded on emotion, whether that emotion was fear of the monster in the jungle, or grief over Juliet dying, or joy at Desmond reuniting with Penny, or thrills at Sayid’s breakdance fighting and Hurley riding to the rescue in the Dharma bus. When “Lost” was really and truly great, it locked you so deep into the emotions of the moment that the larger questions didn’t really matter.
My question for the people who are disappointed: Given the sheer volume and inscrutability of the show’s subplots, didn’t you already know that you weren’t going to get answers? It sounds like it would have taken a full season to wrap up the loose ends. And from what little I know of the individual gimmicks, I’m not sure any satisfying account was possible. How do you elegantly explain something as goofy as the “smoke monster,” for instance? Answer: You don’t, and luckily, you don’t really need to. It’s simply part of the ride.
As for the last 10 minutes, as hokey as some of it is (the ecumenical stained glass is awful), it actually appeals to my atheist eye. Not entirely, of course — it’s overtly spiritual — but the idea that the mysterious “mythology” they obsessed over during the course of the show didn’t really matter in the end is gratifying to a skeptic. I also like the ambiguity in the fact that the lead character isn’t dead until the final shot. Is the scene in the church real or a comforting vision with which he consoles himself in the last moments of consciousness before he closes his eyes — at which point it’s all over (literally)? Food for thought, or at least a light snack, although I don’t think that question’s important either. They’re going for the heart here instead of the brain, and they managed to reach it. How many shows can you say that about?
Blowback
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That crash stuff on the beach was not the result of the repaired plane not making it either? I’m going back to watching Jewelry TV. Lost seem lost on me.
jeanie on May 24, 2010 at 9:50 PM
Ah, what is an online community of Lost “fans” without a vociferous minority that gets off on bashing the show. They try to find fault like there’s a reward for it. And yes, it gets very obnoxious, and is pretty much unavoidable if you want to discuss Lost.
Haters gon’ hate etc.
jjraines on May 24, 2010 at 9:55 PM
The idea that you have a meaningful story about characters and therefore the details of the setting or plot don’t matter much is completely undermined when you have a bunch of deus ex machina events that specifically effect the relationships of the characters. If the story between the characters was actually up to par you would not need such devices.
Resolute on May 24, 2010 at 9:55 PM
I am really glad I missed the whole series.
Disturb the Universe on May 24, 2010 at 9:56 PM
I’ve been lurking there as well for a bit. Interesting theories people came up with.
It wouldn’t suprise me that the writers changed their minds about the storyline in significant ways several times throughout the series.
aikidoka on May 24, 2010 at 9:58 PM
Wow pops, you sure are cutting edge. You know what else they have? These litte gizmos’s called NAS devices which are low-power consuming headless computers. Hack them to install Debian linux, bittorrent client and web front end and I can steal any sheety television you are funding lefty hollywood with. Crazy huh?
Besides, what grown individual would be entertained by goofy garbage like Lost, when there are just a few decent television programs. Damages, Breaking Bad…and that is about it.
Then again, this is the perfect metaphor for the phony outrage of conservatives.
ClassicCon on May 24, 2010 at 9:58 PM
I always hoped they would end the series with them either walking in on a Tribal Council, finding the descendants of Gilligan & MaryAnn, or meeting Mr. Roarke.
pablo5108 on May 24, 2010 at 10:02 PM
It did matter, as part of the journey, and seeing how our characters acted and reacted in that environment. But ultimately, it is a backdrop to our characters’ journeys.
LOST is great not just because of characters, or solely about them, but a sum of all the parts: thematic elements, mystery, mythology, easter eggs, drama, acting, writing, production scale, meaning, entertainment, etc.
It’s just that in the end, their story mattered more than anything else. People trumped mythology. Just like in The Constant, where the conflict (deeply rooted in science fiction/mythology elements) could only be resolved through Desmond and Penny’s love for each other.
jjraines on May 24, 2010 at 10:02 PM
Dark UFO is where I’ve read all the season finales for the past few years, except for this season. I did see 5 pages of script for part of the finale so I knew those parts in advance:
http://spoilertv.iimmgg.com/image/2145f48490babac83638ee19b5805ec2
beachgirlusa on May 24, 2010 at 10:03 PM
Am I the only one here who watched The Simpsons season finale last night?
It opened with a spoiler.
The writing on Bart’s chalkboard said that “Lost” was just the dog’s dream, so don’t bother watching.
mrt721 on May 24, 2010 at 10:03 PM
No, not at all.
beachgirlusa on May 24, 2010 at 10:05 PM
Walt is the son of Michael. Michael spoke to HUrley. The reason Walt or even an older Aaron, son of Claire, aren’t in the church at the end is because a) this isn’t THE event or people in their lives (they go onto to their own special events/people and b) baby Aaron is how he impacted the lives of the people in the church.
Each character’s interaction, their struggles, hopes, loves, hates and redemption is what drove this show IMO.
The ending for this show began weeks ago with events, moments and comments. Things which made some sense now viewed through the prism of now make enormous sense. Take Kate’s comment to Jack at the party when they “meet” around 1:12:30. On the surface her comment to Jack “I’ve missed you so much Jack.” seems innocent enough until you look at it from the view, Jack died on the island and Kate survives for probably years without Jack. And she MISSED him.
VikingGoneWild on May 24, 2010 at 10:06 PM
They want you to pay for the answers.
Personally I figured they wouldn’t tell all of the “mysteries” but I figured there’d be a unifying logic beyond “Getting Jack to let go”
Iblis on May 24, 2010 at 10:09 PM
Things which made some sense
nowthen viewed through the prism of now make enormous sense. ………….whoops!VikingGoneWild on May 24, 2010 at 10:10 PM
Terry O’Quinn, Michael Emerson, Nestor Carbonell, Jeremy Davies and Elizabeth Mitchell—these in particular made the show worth watching imo.
beachgirlusa on May 24, 2010 at 10:11 PM
It was a satisfying ending. I never expected them to supply all the island mysteries anyway.
Pablo Honey on May 24, 2010 at 10:18 PM
I watched “Lost” from the beginning. I thought the series finale was one of the best things I’ve ever seen on TV.
AP is exactly right: the show could not have explained all the twists and turns of the past 6 years without a speech as long as John Galt’s. A lot of convoluted gobbledygook about time travel, parallel universes, and quantum physics wouldn’t have been satisfying on any level. Instead the showrunners made the smart but gutsy call to focus on the characters and their emotions.
Does it all make complete sense? No. But they explained enough to answer the major questions, and left enough unexplained to keep viewers speculating for years.
sauropod on May 24, 2010 at 10:20 PM
Never missed an episode. Loved the finale.
I’m still a little freaked out actually.
rollthedice on May 24, 2010 at 10:21 PM
I just got to your comment. Spot….I guess I should have read them all b4 making my comment!
VikingGoneWild on May 24, 2010 at 10:22 PM
Hurly was the island’s new protector and Ben was his assistant (replacing Richard). Desmond survived also and I’m sure Hurly and Ben got him off the island back to Penny and his baby son, Charlie.
The first shot of LOST is of Jack opening his eyes (right eye to be exact) while lying in a bamboo field. Jack first encounters Vincent (Walt’s dog) and then walks towards the beach where he sees the wreckage and survivors.
The very last scene in the Finale is of a dying Jack returning to the same bamboo field to lay in. Vincent(now Rose and Bernard’s dog) comes to lay beside him. As Jack watches the plane fly away, Jack closes his eyes (right eye shot) and dies. A very poetic ending to the show.
RedRobin145 on May 24, 2010 at 10:24 PM
I love comments like this that add nothing to what is being discussed…so why bother posting something here since you didn’t watch the “Lost” finale?
StevefromMKE on May 24, 2010 at 10:33 PM
They had the final episode of Ashes to Ashes on this weekend.
Lost…Pllllltthhhbbtt!!!!
BigWyo on May 24, 2010 at 10:37 PM
I loved the first season, the characters and writing were great, but then gave up on it after countless promises that “all questions will be answered.” The plot just got weird to fill up episodes.
That said, the finale was pretty good. It was a sort of Purgatory thing I guess where everybody worked out their sins. So Allah, it was spiritual–like universalist church spiritual, but spiritual.
PattyJ on May 24, 2010 at 10:42 PM
Agreed, I enjoyed watching their odd characters and circumstances. The show was about the characters, most with flaws, and how they reacted to the unusual and the reactions of each other. What and where is the “island”? I don’t really care. It was a fine ending, much better than most. Hell, with that ending they could even do a follow on series with Hugo and Ben.
ray on May 24, 2010 at 10:43 PM
It wouldn’t surprise me either, but I’m not necessarily among those who think the writer never had a plan. I’m guessing they tweaked it a bit, but I believe they had a basic outline in mind since at least the first season.
Esthier on May 24, 2010 at 11:10 PM
I am sooooo glad that I never got sucked into this. The few times I watched (rather late in the series) I realized that I could’nt appreciate what was happening as I didn’t know what went before.
Turns out NOBODY could figure out what was happening because it was all a figment of a dying man imagination.
Secular writers screwing with everyone’s heads.
jcw46 on May 24, 2010 at 11:22 PM
And hot Desmond. I don’t know the actor’s name, but the few times I saw Lost, he was awesome. Love a man with an accent.
mjk on May 24, 2010 at 11:25 PM
That was right up there with my top ten favorite scenes. I might have even cried a little.
Esthier on May 24, 2010 at 11:28 PM
LOL, you perhaps wish, for some odd reason. You know what they say, don’t speak about what you don’t know.
ray on May 24, 2010 at 11:29 PM
No, it really wasn’t. Not at all. That’s a complete misunderstanding of the finale and the series as a whole. The show’s a bit confusing, but it’s not really that hard to follow.
I don’t get why so many Christians are being offended by a show that has done an insane number of Christian references and provided a nice Christian allegory in a number of episodes.
No, it wasn’t The Passion: The Series, but that doesn’t make it anti-Christian. In fact, it’s easy to see some Narnia influence.
Esthier on May 24, 2010 at 11:33 PM
gnostics are so precious.
Inanemergencydial on May 24, 2010 at 11:34 PM
It was so Christian that it denied the saving power of Christ. Are you catholic?
Inanemergencydial on May 24, 2010 at 11:35 PM
it all makes sense if they died in the crash. everything else is just purgatory!
patrick neid on May 24, 2010 at 11:39 PM
He had already died in what was presumably our level of existence. The island level of existence was both a distinct level of existence and an existence which existed for the purpose of the people who had died in the original dimension to experience what they needed to experience in order for them to be prepared to move on beyond the realm of the living. That’s what I thought, anyway. Jack was dead long before he died on the island.
I loved the ending, because I suck.
galenrox on May 24, 2010 at 11:41 PM
They didn’t die in the crash, everything that happened on the island was real, the only thing taking place in the afterlife (or purgatory or what-have-you) were the flash-sideways in this final season. If you didn’t watch the finale or the show, please don’t act like you know what you’re talking about. And if you did, and you still think that they were all dead in the crash (when tons of evidence throughout all of the seasons refutes this, and even more evidence in the finale itself), then you are rather dense and I’m surprised you made it through all 6 seasons of Lost.
zauriel on May 25, 2010 at 12:06 AM
Carlton Cuse (one half of Lost’s showrunners) is, and contributed heavily to much of the Catholic imagery and influence seen throughout Lost’s 6 seasons.
Are you seriously suggesting that Lost should have ended with Jesus coming out in the church and picking who gets to go with him and who doesn’t? Yeah, that would have gone over well. The ending was perfect as-is.
zauriel on May 25, 2010 at 12:09 AM
As for the religious worldview of the show, look no further than the theme of the concert: Fusion Rock.
That doesn’t make it a morally “relative” show, or secular, or any similar charges. You decide what that light was, and where they were headed. Keeping it thematic and spiritual while avoiding an overt religious message is perfect, and fittingly consistent with what the show has always done:
LOST is essentially a fusion of influences, from Narnia to Alice in Wonderland to the Bible, from Locke to Rousseau to Milton, from Hinduism to Buddhism to Christianity. They took from all that and more to create this beautiful story, and let the audience take from it what it wants.
jjraines on May 25, 2010 at 12:09 AM
And another obvious example of why one should not speak of what one does not know, along with a little self loathing. Jewish democrat?
ray on May 25, 2010 at 12:09 AM
What? I’d suggest at least that or end with something much more ridiculous than multi-culti spiritualism. How weak and pathetic.
Inanemergencydial on May 25, 2010 at 12:17 AM
Your tears of negativity feed your burden.
ray on May 25, 2010 at 12:32 AM
Esthier on May 24, 2010 at 11:33 PM
Can you admit that there was some major Dhimmitude with having the crescent above ALL other religions? Or are you so taken with this series that you’ve forgotten it was put out by the Hollywood machine?
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:42 AM
Esthier on May 24, 2010 at 11:33 PM
And can you at least admit that making all religions equal is multi-culti, LIBERAL mumbo-jumbo?
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:44 AM
jjraines on May 25, 2010 at 12:09 AM
Which is exactly why it is multi-culti, liberal nonsense. But, with Islam taking precedence at the end. How lovely. And how typically liberal of Hollywood.
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:50 AM
Leaving the Muslim and Buddhist characters out of the ending would have been awkward storytelling.
exception on May 25, 2010 at 12:51 AM
exception on May 25, 2010 at 12:51 AM
I love how you’ve defended the crescent above all other symbols… by avoiding that part of my argument completely.
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:55 AM
And, exception, it *is* the liberals who created the idea of all religions being equal. I don’t care if it would’ve been “awkward”, it’s liberal and I’m surprised to see so many conservatives simply not care.
-Aslan’s Girl
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:58 AM
Because it was utterly trivial. They should be alphabetical? Also, since both Arabic and Hebrew read from the right, Jews come first in the window.
What was the name of the character that looked over the group gathered in the church? The one who opened the doors letting the Light in?
exception on May 25, 2010 at 1:02 AM
It’s called effective writing. Seeing as how there were members of various faiths within the group of Losties, it would have alienated a lot of viewership to have some of their favorite characters denied entry into Heaven (or the great beyond, etc., etc.). That would be the stupidest thing ever and would make no sense in the context of this particular universe we are watching. It wasn’t liberal, hollywood multi-culti instituted just to piss you off. It fit the storytelling so that all of the Losties, after they died, could move on together.
And as exception pointed out (and even the character of Kate noted herself in the finale), it was “Christian Shephard” who guided them into the afterlife.
Get a grip.
zauriel on May 25, 2010 at 1:18 AM
So, did they finally reveal who killed Laura Palmer or not?
Kasper Hauser on May 25, 2010 at 1:53 AM
Christain Shephard. Jack Shephard was candidate 23 to replace Jacob. Jack was the leader of the LOSTIES whom looked to him.
Psalm 23(A Psalm of David)
The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not be in want.
He makes me lie down in green pastures,
he leads me beside quiet waters,
he restores my soul.
He guides me in paths of righteousness
for his name’s sake.
Even though I walk
through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil,
for you are with me;
your rod and your staff,
they comfort me.
You prepare a table before me
in the presence of my enemies.
You anoint my head with oil;
my cup overflows.
Surely goodness and love will follow me
all the days of my life,
and I will dwell in the house of the LORD
forever.
Jack’s son’s name in the Sideways Universe: David.
In the begining of the show Jack was a man of science who became and died a man of faith. The show never bashed the christian faith Aslan’s girl. (The Narnia books influence has been presented on the show.)
RedRobin145 on May 25, 2010 at 2:02 AM
I was much more interested in seeing the final episodes of “Law & Order” and “24″ last night. Both series had lost some steam (the past few seasons of “24″ in particular were pretty ordinary TV), but I’ll miss them. When they were good, they were very, very good.
KyMouse on May 25, 2010 at 7:32 AM
For those of you interested, this is a great read.
Supposedly it is written by someone with access to the writters room.
Even if not true, it is very nice.
http://forum.lostpedia.com/someone-bad-robots-take-finale-t59261.html
Also, i think the reason for the wreckage at the end was to show the evolution of th island.
When the losties crashed they found Darhma, a statue foot, a ship called the Black Rock, etc, etc.
From now on future visitors will find airplane wreckage as well.
Thune on May 25, 2010 at 8:52 AM
zauriel on May 25, 2010 at 12:06 AM
Watched all 6 seasons, and I disagree. So does Jimmy Kimmel, so obviously I win.
galenrox on May 25, 2010 at 8:55 AM
I predicted everything.
Akzed on May 25, 2010 at 8:55 AM
Aslans Girl on May 25, 2010 at 12:58 AM
theological “liberals”, sure, but equating political and social conservatism with theological conservatism isn’t a justifiable leap. Like, personally, I can take the presence of God on faith, I can take the divinity of Jesus Christ and how essential he was to the existence of mankind on faith. Following that with “all of the crazy stuff that follows is true and everything everyone else believes is wrong an inherently less valuable than my personal beliefs” is a bridge too far. There’s right and there’s wrong, and I have a hard time believing the non-Christian world has been existing without use of “right” for the entirety of their existences.
galenrox on May 25, 2010 at 9:04 AM
Here is the problem with the Losties who are disappointed with the show…..They are too ignorant to ask themselves logical questions.
Such as:
Why do hydrogen bombs create 40 foot deep holes in the earth and destroy concrete, yet a human being that was right next to the devise survives? In that context, why in just a few moments before the blast, did a simply flying projectile (called a bullet) create massive damage to a human?
What they refuse to see is that the entire series from the moment of the crash comprised of events that took place on a spiritual plane. Much like the Catholic purgatory, but instead of doing penance for unresolved sins, it is more like the LDS version of spirit prison.
This means we never saw what really happened after the crash on the island. We know all the survivors had deep personal involvement with each other. So much so that none of them could or would move on until they all were ready. We don’t know if Jack and Kate were married before the crash, or if their relationship developed on the island.
There were no such things as magic donkey wheels, smoke monsters, mysterious lighthouse mirrors, disappearing islands, or selectively destructive hydrogen bombs.
Once you accept the spiritual nature of the story, you will understand that all those mysterious events were similitude’s of the struggles were fight internally. The black and white theme represented the struggle we all have with the good we can do verses the evil we can do. Jacks struggle was with letting go. When he accepted the role of protector of the island, the previous protector simply disappeared from the story. So he was never real, but rather the representation of good that we all need to follow.
The best way to understand the show, and this is where Atheists have their epic fail, is to understand that the emotion of love is a real feeling on a plane other than the physical one. But you cannot see it, hold it in your hand, or put it in a jar. But it is real none the less. This is the evidence of the eternal soul and those feelings and experiences are the most important times we can ever experience.
This is the reason the writers never showed us the real lives these people led while they were alive. It just doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of life.
So people, learn a lesson…focus on your interpersonal relationships and moral code. They are the only things you take with you.
csdeven on May 25, 2010 at 9:11 AM
Actually, this was all about Palin. The final episode is the meeting of all the Palinistas when it has become clear that 2012 was just a dream and it is time to move on.
The smoke monster represented Obama and the liberals and Locke represented Romney, whom she could never be sure of in terms of consistency. The pregnancies were all allusions to the rebirth of Reaganism and the destruction of the island caused by taking the stone from the light represented unchecked liberalism.
The person called Christian Shepherd was the symbol for Newt as he ushered the Palinistas off the stage and into the light of infamous trivia….
Bradky on May 25, 2010 at 9:17 AM
I’m very late to this thread cause I DVRd it and only saw it last night…. I LOVED it.
I thought I would be disappointed by the finale because I knew that there wasn’t enough time to explain half the mysteries of the island. But the episode was a lot better than I expected because they didn’t even try – they focused on the relationships and the growth of all the characters. That’s what made it simple and beautiful.
CityFish on May 25, 2010 at 9:48 AM
So many flush backs that the commercials were a welcome break. Really, never watched “Lost”. I understand that there are many fans just as there were Treckies (I be one of those).
But, even just watching the last episode of “Lost” I can understand how the fans are still as lost in what directions the series is trying to take you.
My short experience is that the series plays on peoples fear of the unknown, and how each different group/demographic deal with them.
In the end, it is assumed that the end entails going into the light and surviving on the other side with ones personality showing the opposite person that entered the light.
The last scene showing the cast in a “Last Supper” representation tells us who who really has the power.
MSGTAS on May 25, 2010 at 10:34 AM
I’m not going to tell people what to think about LOST. Everyone has their own interpretation and that’s part of what makes LOST great!
I watched LOST from the beginning. It is a great story. While you can make conclusions from and get something out of watching the last bit of it, you can’t get the full effect w/o investing all of the time. That being said, I loved the whole ride, even Season 3. :P
Curse channel 5 in Cleveland for have technical difficulties during the finale.
ConDem on May 25, 2010 at 10:57 AM
Yeah, you clearly never really watched “Lost.”
Blacklake on May 25, 2010 at 10:58 AM
No more than Narnia did.
Do you at all know what allusions are? It’s not a Christian program, but to call it anti-Christian is blatantly and willfully ignorant.
Seriously, one scene out of millions. You’ve completely missed the point. Try actually watching the show before making such a pointless comment and looking for something to be offended by.
I wouldn’t argue that they made all religions equal. You’d have to watch the show to understand that.
What they did was pull from many religions to create their own mythology on the show. That’s what you saw in that last frame, not some liberal message about all religions being equal.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 10:59 AM
I wouldn’t find solace in agreeing with Jimmy Kimmel.
Seriously though, Christian Shepherd spelled it out clearly to Jack in the end, explaining that everyone there was dead but that they all died at different times.
If they died on the initial crash, then how’d they go back to the real world? How’d Ben know about the Red Sox? Do they get cable in purgatory? How was Miles’ mother able to leave the island and raise him in LA? How was Widmore able to leave it and raise Penny? How was Charlotte able to leave as a child?
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 11:03 AM
Exactly. What’s more, explaining the mysteries of the island would’ve undermined the entire overriding theme of the show, the relationship (sometimes adversarial)between reason and faith, understanding and meaning. Locke (the real one) had faith in the island, Jack (throughout most of the series) didn’t believe there was anything special about it, and Ben was engaged in trying to rationally comprehend it. People who complain “they didn’t explain everything!” apparently wanted a story in which Ben turned out the hero, as his approach would have been right. It wasn’t. The island was and remains beyond the capacity of human reason.
Blacklake on May 25, 2010 at 11:03 AM
Well said, Blacklake.
ConDem on May 25, 2010 at 11:05 AM
That’s simply not at all true. They showed us their past lives, and they spelled it all out so clearly that I don’t understand why so many people think they died in the crash.
Juliet wasn’t killed during the bomb explosion because it pulled them into the future. The explosion happened in 1977, but by the time it went off, they were all in 2007, back where they should have been all along.
These were real people, doing real, albeit weird, things. The writers said early on that the island was not purgatory, but people just didn’t want to let go of it, because it seems to explain everything except that it doesn’t.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 11:08 AM
I skipped ahead to the point where AP suggested and one of the first things I noticed was the stain glassed window where they put all the religious symbols together in a new agey way. Also they put the Muslim crescent higher than the cross. I rolled my eyes and was thankful I gave up on the show around season 3.
Benaiah on May 25, 2010 at 11:12 AM
Did they ever explain how the fat guy stayed fat after being stranded on a desert island for years?
Musta been a lot of trans fat in the coconuts or something?
catmman on May 25, 2010 at 11:13 AM
I like your explanation, and you’re right. Probably The main theme was science vs. faith, so having Jack become a man of faith in the end and just let go of looking for these answers, was completely appropriate.
That said, I am interested in learning some of these answers anyway, as a part of a DVD bonus or something, specifically stuff like: the sickness, questions about the cabin (I’m assuming MIB was in it and was the one Ben went to, but then why was he asking for help? Did the ash keep him in and if so, how’d he kill all those people while trapped there?), if there’s any significance to women not being able to conceive on the island (I’m willing to believe there isn’t any), and a few other random things.
I don’t think I would have enjoyed seeing them answered in the finale, but I think it’d be interesting to have the creators talk about them.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 11:13 AM
I’m no fan of Islam and wasn’t thrilled to see it side-by-side with it’s betters. But Lost is just pop entertainment trying to entertain without offending. I don’t see any reason to make a mountain out of a molehill.
Overall I enjoyed Lost’s run. It was a unique experience. But I hope that TV writers don’t take the show as permission to try to replicate its success with similar formulas. Lost still had massive continuity problems, gigantic plotholes, and a meandering sometimes senseless storyline…but it kept us involved with excellent characters and a sense of mystery and adventure. The audience had a lot of good will for Lost as an experiment but the formula isn’t going to work twice. Any copycat will be crushed by expectations of doing it one better.
RAB on May 25, 2010 at 11:15 AM
Now “Justified” is a really good TV show.
Not much ambiguity in that one, refreshingly.
catmman on May 25, 2010 at 11:22 AM
I didn’t watch, but my girlfriend thinks that the real story is that they all died in the crash at the beginning, and everything since has just been them coming to terms with their deaths and moving on. A form of Purgatory, if you will.
Count to 10 on May 25, 2010 at 11:22 AM
Dharma food drops he kept to himself. Eating too much at the nut-house. Obciously ,they weren’t on the island for 6 years, the show lasted 6 years.
rollthedice on May 25, 2010 at 11:24 AM
Yes, repeatedly.
1. He wasn’t on the island for years. After they first crashed, he was rescued after two months or less, and even during that time, they not only had plenty of boar to hunt and plenty of fruit everywhere, they also received food drops that were meant for Dharma people.
2. When he finally went back to the island (after being off of it for three years – back in the real world where he was a lottery winner), he ended up working for Dharma, and they have a cafeteria.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 11:25 AM
Yeah, that’s what most people thought from day one, but they’re wrong.
You’re completely missing the point. It’s not a Christian story, but it’s not a new agey liberal spiritualism thing either. The writers used all sorts of religions, not to promote one or any of them, but because it’s an interesting concept to explore.
Those of you “outraged” by this, are simply looking for something offensive and finding it.
If you really want to be offended, be upset that they kept killing off all the black people, one right after another. It’s clearly a racist show.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 11:29 AM
Perhaps they put the moon above the cross because the moon is in the sky and the cross is on the ground? I may be spit-balling here, but it could just be simple physical logic.
ConDem on May 25, 2010 at 11:43 AM
Beautifully written, csdeven. I got so aggravated with the show after season 1 (or 2?). I didn’t understand it, I’d read that the writers were replaced, and the new season had subtitles to try to make sense of the previous season/s. I do remember thinking that those first writers must have just been writing as they went along, with no outline or inkling of the endgame. After hearing about the finale and reading your comments, I wish I had seen this one through.
mtb on May 25, 2010 at 11:44 AM
That’s not how I’d put it. The theme was meaning vs. understanding. In the end Jack found meaning in the island, even though he never understood it (nor did anyone else–including, it seems, even Jacob).
Blacklake on May 25, 2010 at 11:47 AM
I didn’t say it was purgatory, so that is consistent with the writers claims. I also said they did survive the crash, but we weren’t shown those events.
There was no science fiction aspect to the story (unless you believe faith is science fiction).
There were also no flash forward, flashback, or flash sideway events. The entire story was told in chronological order. The events you think are flashes are really only the character creating a past that justifies the current situation.
Every character imagined an outcome they desired and then created the conditions to achieve it after the fact. Much like people do in dreams they have when they create a ideal reality and then create the conditions that achieved it later. This is required to make sense of the ideal event.
IE: The very first “flash forward” was the bearded Jack sitting in his apartment. This event was created by Jack because he wanted off the island. So spiritually he created it. The scenes afterward were the events he created to justify how he got off the island to make his rescue a reality.
But the twist is that the writers instead of making this a dream or using the same tired old religious plots, they combined the two to create a story that gives a unique perspective on how we might deal with our spiritual lives after death. Another twist is that instead of creating a dream in which we control all the events, these very close people created an world in which their collective desires created the story. Much like our lives on earth. You and I are interacting right now, but neither one of us is subjugated to the others whims. We have choices.
csdeven on May 25, 2010 at 11:51 AM
She’s wrong. Indeed, the purgatory-like state clearly depicted and was constructed from the idea of them not crashing. The crash and ensuing (and preceding) events on the island were quite real. As Christian put it at this “funeral” with Jack, some of the survivors died before Jack, others much later. If they had all died in the plane crash, they would’ve died at the same time.
Blacklake on May 25, 2010 at 11:52 AM
The time travelling, replete with its (refreshing!) purely deterministic depiction and explications from Faraday, was very much science fiction. However, to the extent science fiction unfolded on the island, it did little to help the characters understand the island (though it did help several of them along the path of finding personal meaning).
Blacklake on May 25, 2010 at 11:56 AM
You nailed it Siobhan. Great stuff from Esthier and jiraines as well. I thought the finale was brilliant. Great, great show.
dakine on May 25, 2010 at 11:58 AM
I hardly think the tone of my post suggested outrage. I said I rolled my eyes. Getting outraged at Hollywood’s interpretation of the afterlife is silly since they don’t have christian beliefs to begin with. It’s the reason I can watch House and not feel anger when he attacks my faith. I look at it as the ignorant rantings of a egotistical drug addict and who in their right mind is going to take spiritual advice from one of those?
Lost actually lost me as a viewer in season 3 (I think). Whichever season it was where they kept changing the schedule and you never knew if you were getting a new episode, a repeat, or yet another recap show. I dropped it more for the network’s decision on how to air it than the writing or story.
I’m just saying that the whole new age religion stuff at the end just tells me to not bother going back on Netflix and watching from where I left off.
Benaiah on May 25, 2010 at 12:00 PM
What did I say several years ago?
Oh yeah: “Now they’re just makin’ shit up.”
mojo on May 25, 2010 at 12:24 PM
I agree that outrage isn’t the appropriate word for you, but it is appropriate for many people.
If you’re a Christian, why not view House as someone being honest about why he doesn’t agree with religion in general and use that as a way to understand people like him better in order to reach out to them?
My point is that interpretation is completely missing the point. It’s one tiny scene. It’s not the show, and that’s not the message being sent in the show.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 12:50 PM
Maybe so, but you’re claim isn’t far off from calling it purgatory. It’s practically a semantical difference rather than a substantive one.
How does that explain Jack being shown the Red Sox victory? How would he have known about this? And why would it be shown if not to drive home the point that what was happening on the island was real and was happening in real time?
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 12:54 PM
I can accept that but don’t completely agree with it simply because towards the end, Jack was taking things on faith without either meaning or understanding. He simply had faith in Jacob and relied on that to help him complete the task Jacob gave him.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 12:57 PM
Gee..I thought the show was about Obama..at the least the title indicated it was..L O S T
SANTA on May 25, 2010 at 1:01 PM
There is no trans -fat in coconuts.
jsunrise on May 25, 2010 at 1:10 PM
IMO, Lost was the most compelling show in the history of television. The blend of philosophy, mythology and science fiction could have easily turned out to be a train wreck but they somehow made it work, largely because of the characters we shared the journey with. So it’s fitting that the finale was largely about finding closure with those characters rather than explaining all the secrets to the island. That would have been a fool’s game since many fans would have been unsatisfied with the answers they got, no matter what they were. I found the finale to be very emotionally satisfying and a fitting end to the journey.
As for the island…it is whatever the viewer chooses it to be.
rsrobinson on May 25, 2010 at 1:24 PM
LOST is fiction, what do you mean now they are making shit up?
They been making shit up since the pilot.
Best show to ever be on TV.
Thune on May 25, 2010 at 1:45 PM
Lost had me hooked from the pilot episode to Sundays finale. No show has ever kept me as intrigued as this one and I doubt there will ever be another show like it. The acting was terrific. I absolutely loved the finale and the last scene when Vincent goes and lays down beside a dying Jack. Oh I was bawling like a baby.
jewells45 on May 25, 2010 at 2:08 PM
Yes, the writers used science fiction as plot devices, but as far as the characters reality, there was no “real” science fiction such as smoke monsters and donkey wheels.
csdeven on May 25, 2010 at 2:20 PM
Well ,the writers dealt in semantics through the entire show, so I always take their claims with a grain of salt.
The Red Sox don’t fit within the explanation I have come to believe. But it’s use in the show could fit and I haven’t yet figured out how. Those real time events don’t mitigate the spiritual narrative of the rest of the events.
csdeven on May 25, 2010 at 2:28 PM
I personally loved the ending of LOST. It’s been one of the best shows on television for a while. Yes, it got a little ugly there in the middle, but, in the end, it was amazing.
Some of the things that I thought were very poignant were things like Ben Linus being at the church. It was obvious (to me, anyway) that only those who had gone through the redemption process were there–those that hadn’t at the time they died were still stuck on the island. And yet, Ben Linus was there. He went through the redemption process, too, even though we never saw that onscreen. Yet he didn’t feel like he had deserved it. So when Locke told Ben that Locke forgave him for everything he’d done to Locke, Ben’s response was “that helps more than you know.” He was still struggling with the guilt. How many living people feel like they’re unworthy? Ben Linus could be anyone.
I also enjoyed the idea that you take your love with you. How awesome it was when Sawyer and Juliette found their way back to each other. Charlie and Claire. Even Kate and Jack.
In the end, the show was not about the island, but about people. People who were broken. Alone. They had no one else to depend on, so they were unable to ever ask for help. Through the six seasons, the writers were able to take these people, put them through a refiner’s fire, and bring them out the other end in much better condition than they started. Take, for example, Sawyer. He was a con in real life, but had completely changed. Hence why he was a cop in the “afterlife” place. Hurley went from feeling like the most unlucky person on the planet to the exact opposite. Ben went from hurting people to helping them become more than what they were. The list goes on.
This was one of the best endings to a show since, well, maybe MASH or Newhart or Star Trek: Voyager. It was awesome. And I’m glad I took the time to watch it, even when people ridiculed me for it.
jedijson on May 25, 2010 at 2:44 PM
There was a show on TV called “Lost”? Sorry, never heard of it.
Carl on May 25, 2010 at 3:47 PM
Correct, the scene where Richard asks Jack to light a stick of dynamite in the Black Rock shows Jack becoming a man of faith. “Wanna try another stick?”
RedRobin145 on May 25, 2010 at 3:58 PM
Sure, but I don’t even think believing it was all real hurts the spiritual aspect of it either. To me, it’s like the Bible itself. If you believe all of the events are real or don’t, it doesn’t change the stories’ meanings.
That was almost a creepy line. I wasn’t sure if Jack had lost it at that point or finally figured it all out. I’m still not completely sure, even in hindsight. I’m starting to think it was a bit of both in that he had to lose it completely to finally understand why he was there and just go with it.
Esthier on May 25, 2010 at 4:01 PM
Ok, the issue of he numbers. I have not checked but this season in the lighthouse and in smokeys cave, you see numbers associated to the names of the survivors. Not all the survivors were canidates to replace Jacob. I think the series of 6 numbers corresponds to the 6 cannidates.
mechkiller_k on May 25, 2010 at 4:08 PM
Yes, the ending of “The Last Battle” is very much like the ending in LOST.
mechkiller_k on May 25, 2010 at 4:14 PM
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