Poll: Is Everybody Draw Mohammed Day a good idea?
posted at 9:30 am on May 20, 2010 by Ed Morrissey
Today, bloggers around the world will participate in a protest against terrorists by drawing cartoons of the Muslim prophet Mohammed. Everyone Draw Mohammed Day started when terrorist threats against Comedy Central pushed its executives to heavily censor an episode of South Park, which still cannot be seen on the South Park Studios website. It got off to an inauspicious start, though, when its creator backed out of the event, citing concerns about being overly provocative.
That’s a good point to consider, especially if one goal of the war on terror is to push an Enlightenment of sorts onto global Islam. A “hearts and minds” campaign, as we discovered in Vietnam, requires some sympathy and understanding of the entire community. If we’re insulting a broad class of Muslims by celebrating what appears to be a heresy in their eyes, we’re pushing them closer to the radicals and not isolating the terrorists. Given the images being celebrated on Facebook’s EDMD page, it won’t be too difficult to see this as an attack on their religion altogether.
On the other hand — and this is where my sympathies lie — a free society has to have the ability to offend as part and parcel of the freedom of expression. To acquiesce to the pressure that cowed Comedy Central is to surrender that freedom and to make terrorism a successful strategy, and not just for radical Islam. A nation of laws provides its citizens freedom from vendettas, and where vendettas succeed, freedom is diminished or lost altogether. That is why it is always un-American to seek political change through violence and terrorism, because it cuts against the fabric of what makes us Americans. In order to stand against the vendetta mentality, we need to make a statement that we will not be cowed into silence and surrender, whether that’s defined as dhimmitude, omerta, or whatever.
My good friend Chris Muir has what I believe may be the most thoughtful entry for EDMD. It’s a good theme for EDMD as a sort of Rohrshach test. What you read into it depends entirely on you. Is this Mohammed? A butterfly?
Update: My friend Beldar makes an intriguing and well-reasoned argument against EDMD in a rebuttal to my post. Be sure to read it all.
What do you think of EDMD? Take the poll:
Blowback
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I haven’t seen skydaddy doing any of that. He may be more moderate than some of the other conservative views on this, but it’s no reason for everyone here to attack him and put him in the same pen with killers.
I’ve experienced the same thing here, when I called someone out for saying every single one of the world’s Muslims was a terrorist. For simply disagreeing with that point I was called a terror apologist and a CAIR lackey.
That doesn’t really promote healthy debate.
Heralder on May 20, 2010 at 12:33 PM
Actually I’m explaining your ‘point’ in the context of Islamic supremacism, sharia, and the Islamist desire to impose an Islamic blasphemy law through the OIC and UN.
Your silly point about being deliberately offensive certainly is selective in when you choose to be outraged. Once we start caving to Islamic restrictions on speech there will be no end to their demands, as we’ve seen already. I especially love the people who prove Muslim-bashing is wrong by immediately ripping the Jews and Christians, which has nothing to do with the topic.
To paraphrase Orwell, anyone who defends Islamic rage over cartoons is objectively pro-fascist. Sorry, but that’s just true.
Beagle on May 20, 2010 at 12:34 PM
Skydaddy says “moderate Muslims” are insulted when infidels depect Mohammed because they don’t worship Muhammed, and because they don’t demand that infidels follow obey their religious laws.
(But, in his defense, skydaddy is pretty freaking stupid.)
logis on May 20, 2010 at 12:34 PM
Agreed, totally.
Heralder on May 20, 2010 at 12:36 PM
Laura,
What you say is true. There are schools of thought. Wahhabism, for example, embraces a very narrow, radical viewpoint. But even among Sunnis and Shias there are ranges, just as within the Evangelical Christian church you have more and less conservative congregations.
And that’s exactly my point. Don’t paint with a broad brush.
Agreed. But mocking just for the sake of insulting people is being a jerk. The South Park guys revel in being jerks. Howard Stern has made millions by being a jerk. Stewart, Coulter, Olbermann, etc. do the same.
So go ahead – be jerks. Be bigots, even. be bigoted jerks, and revel in it. You have that right.
Me, I was raised to be considerate of others. Does that make me a dhimmi? Not on your life. Fear of a fatwah doesn’t prevent me from drawing a picture of Mohammed. I simply have no need to do so. If I needed to use an image of the guy, say for a class I was teaching, I would, with no reservations. But why should I act like a jerk?
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 12:37 PM
Why doesn’t Hot Air have an everyone draw Allahpundit day?
Mr. Joe on May 20, 2010 at 12:37 PM
logis, just to be clear, I ignore trolls.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 12:38 PM
+1000
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 12:38 PM
there is some irony in the fact that facebook continues to delete this image for its offensiveness…
http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad289/LouAsheby/everybodydrawmo.jpg
moseby on May 20, 2010 at 12:41 PM
Our contribution:
http://jumpinginpools.blogspot.com/2010/05/picture-of-mohammed.html
orfannkyl on May 20, 2010 at 12:41 PM
Children are exposed to you?
BL@KBIRD on May 20, 2010 at 12:43 PM
Dude, no one expects you to read any of your your own posts. Even if you know absolutely nothing else, you must realize better than anyone else what a consummate idiot you are.
But trust me on this: You are missing out on some comedy gold there.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 12:44 PM
Unless it’s offensive?
Barnestormer on May 20, 2010 at 12:47 PM
• <— Mohammy spooning with a goat, viewed from space.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 12:55 PM
Like suggesting that everyone who draws Mohammed as a protest against Islamic attacks (threatened, and as in the case of Theo Van Gogh, fulfilled) is a jerk and/or a bigot? You’re perfectly entitled to do as you please in this matter. You’re perfectly entitled to say how you think the rest of us should act. No worries; we’ll defend free speech on your behalf.
Skydaddy, we live in a world that has free speech, and that free speech has to be maintained in the face of threats by people willing to risk exercising the right to use it. Whose gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for Muslims whose feelings are hurt, and you curse the free speech advocates. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That insults to Muslims, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don’t want the truth because deep down in places you don’t talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me to defend free speech. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a paintbrush, and illustrate for Muslims that non-Muslims are not obligated to obey Islamic rules and that we will not do so. Either way, I don’t give a damn what you think you are entitled to.
/couldn’t resist
Laura on May 20, 2010 at 12:55 PM
I guess its just too hard to ask if you will be considerate of other’s wishes to draw Mohammed? You insist their very attempts to draw Mohammed are bigoted and are intended to offend. You do not see it for what it simply is(standing in partnership with moderate Muslims and others against extremism) and you reveal your hidden bigotry in your assumption that moderate Muslims are not tolerant.
canditaylor68 on May 20, 2010 at 12:56 PM
Islamists may have the loudest mouths, but they don’t speak for all Muslims. QED. And I strongly oppose efforts to impose any form of shari’a, or even permit local shari’a courts that run counter to US law.
Oh? When? I generally don’t get outraged over anything. it’s bad for my blood pressure.
Sure, but how is choosing to be considerate of others the same as caving to their demands?
This statement certainly has “nothing to do with the topic.”
I choose to not offend people who haven’t offended me, ergo I’m a Nazi? LOL! Somewhere, Godwin is smiling without knowing why.
Once again, I’m not defending Islamic rage. Never have, never will. A threat of violence is an act of assault, and the perp should do time. You’re welcome to your opinion, Abu, but if you express it or act on it, you’re gonna own it.
Now you’re welcome to spin that as somehow being an apologetic for cartoon rage, but I’m not inclined to try to follow the pretzel logic needed.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 12:57 PM
Calling out a blatant mocker/misunderstander of Christianity for not being as smart as s/he believes s/he is is Christian and loving. If you believe I’m wrong, why don’t you go ahead and complain to Jesus about me? :)
To your point about Christian cultists: they aren’t acting like real Christians are supposed to act, so why would you judge Christianity by them? A positive philosophy can’t fairly be said to be bad just because people who claim to believe in it fail to act it out perfectly.
Bizarro No. 1 on May 20, 2010 at 1:03 PM
Don’t need to draw any image of muhammed; Michelle Obama looks just like his twin sister.
Cybergeezer on May 20, 2010 at 1:09 PM
Islamic rage over cartoons hasn’t offended you?
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 1:11 PM
You’re welcome to start one.
Esthier on May 20, 2010 at 1:12 PM
I agree. But you’re not contesting it either. Which is what EBDMD is about. And unsatisfied with your sanctimonious self-restraint, you chose to condemn the contesters.
Barnestormer on May 20, 2010 at 1:14 PM
Something I did a few years ago, when they said that us infidels were not allowed to even utter his name:
http://www.az123.com/smilies/mohamedpig.gif
LegendHasIt on May 20, 2010 at 1:16 PM
I’ll hold your hand through the argument again, Skydaddy.
Orwell’s quote is specifically applicable to people who don’t advocate for a particular violent group, but defend a position which benefits that group. It was pacifism in the 1930s in the face of fascist aggression, whereas it’s your reflexive willingness to submit to Islamic blasphemy law today.
Supporting those who wish to impose Islamic restrictions on speech is exactly the same, whether or not you’re aware that’s what is really going on or not. Hence, “objectively”.
Beagle on May 20, 2010 at 1:16 PM
I don’t have to be “considerate” of that which is designed to cause offense. The whole point of DMD is to outrage the ragers and dare them to try to “kill us all”. But you’re throwing the baby out with the bathwater by also offending the tolerant moderates.
Nice try to turn my argument. Doesn’t work. I very specifically assume that most Muslims are tolerant. The ragers are few. Being tolerant means choosing not to act out even though you feel offended. By that definition, the vast majority of Muslims are tolerant. Yes, there were riots, but the entire Muslim world didn’t participate in them. I’m offended by Keith Olbermann. But because I’m tolerant and I respect free speech, I choose to simply ignore him. I don’t respect him at all. He’s a jerk. I suspect most Muslims will ignore the DMD cartoons. But they’ll know who the jerks are.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 1:17 PM
Of course. Everyone ELSE besides him is a “troll” and a “jerk” who “paints with a broad brush” and “jerks,” and “jerks” and “bigots” and “bigoted jerks” and a “jerk.”
But moondaddy? Dude, he would never insult anyone. He’s like totally cool about that sort of thing.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 1:18 PM
I guess you haven’t realized that skydaddy deserves to be attacked for insulting those who support EDMD – skydaddy’s arrogantly called them jerks and bigots, and if you don’t approve of people ripping on him for that, you’re part of the problem, too.
Bizarro No. 1 on May 20, 2010 at 1:19 PM
You’re using a straw-man argument. I don’t “support those who wish to impose Islamic restrictions on speech.” I never said that. In fact, I’ve said EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE.
Orwellian, indeed.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 1:20 PM
A Proposed Constitutional Amendment.
Lets make islam illegal, then they can be offended in their own miserable, barbaric hellholes.
Rebar on May 20, 2010 at 1:25 PM
BTW, did you know that Infidels and pigs aren’t allowed to touch the Koran either?
In fact, that should be the next campaign to help the Infidel world get in touch with Islam — literally.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 1:26 PM
Skydaddy is such a blatant hypocrite that it’s amazing he can’t see it himself.
Al in St. Lou on May 20, 2010 at 1:29 PM
Right, skydaddy. You oppose it but support those who are trying to enforce it. Got it. Do you?
Beagle on May 20, 2010 at 1:30 PM
How is that amazing? Liberalism is subjectivism: Seeing the world solely in terms of how it impacts your feelings. All the political positions stereotypically associated with liberalism flow from that one personality defect.
To be a liberal is to be fundamentally incapable of comprehending an external perspective. Hypocrisy isn’t a symptom of liberalism – or vice versa – the two terms are synonymous.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 1:44 PM
Just uploaded my contribution to Everybody Draw Mohammed Day about an hour ago. Yes, this day is a good idea. Facebook bugs me a lot, but major MAJOR props to them if they do the right thing and let this page stay up. They’re bigger folks than Comedy Central.
ThanksMo on May 20, 2010 at 1:49 PM
And here’s my version. And I’m a trained professional artard!
S. Weasel on May 20, 2010 at 1:50 PM
I’m not going to defend his point of view because I don’t agree with what he says, namely because he disagrees with Everybody Draw Mohammed Day and I fully agree with it. I don’t see him making excuses for terrorists killing people.
If I wasn’t clear (and granted, I don’t think I was) it’s the method of attack that I find objectionable, especially because it has been done to me. While I’m more than capable of defending myself, it’s nonetheless annoying to have to deal with that.
Calling someone out for faulty logic or arguments is one thing, creating arguments to further call them out on is a waste of time.
If it is still your opinion that I am part of the problem, I’d take a moment to read my posts so as to get an idea what my thoughts are on the subject matter before posting on it again.
Heralder on May 20, 2010 at 1:50 PM
Personally, I wouldn’t have a problem if everyone there was a “Draw Joseph Smith day.”
Good point.
There have been plenty of things that have been done that could be considered “offensive” to Mormons such as dragging a Book of Mormon on the ground.
If the guy in the video tried to drag a Koran in the streets, he wouldn’t get the same reaction from the Muslims.
Islam needs to grow some thick skin and get used to being offended. Every religion has to tolerate offensive comments, art, and behavior except Islam. They shouldn’t be the exception.
Conservative Samizdat on May 20, 2010 at 1:52 PM
This is a pretty cowardly way to recognize EDMD. Instead of actually giving the day its due, you post it as a poll in hopes to disguise mentioning it as some thoughtful journalistic endeavor; while pacifying your readers who would rightfully call you a bunch of Dhimmis for dismissing it.
It’s not that I mind the poll, per se, but I do mind that HotAir seems to lack the veracity and/or cojones to actually participate in or celebrate the occasion.
Levinite on May 20, 2010 at 1:54 PM
Don’t you think devout muslims will be offended that you implied only moderates are tolerant?
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 1:54 PM
Had to leave and haven’t what happened since my last post at 1:20, so I don’t know where the discussion has gone. Annd, I’ve got stuff to do, so I gotta sign off now.
Heralder, thanks for the support.
Bizarro, I stand by my statements. Saying that there are no moderate Muslims is bigoted, period. Deliberately insulting people who have done you no harm is being a jerk, period.
If the shoe fits, wear it. Wear it with pride.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 1:54 PM
So you don’t read any of your own posts, OR anyone else’s either.
…The last piece of the puzzle falls snugly into place.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 2:00 PM
1st: no such thing as at least one poster on this thread has already demonstrated (APOSTATES), & then you really aren’t a muslim, now are you, if you’re an apostate?
2nd: it may be true that there are many people out there who would glorify in the death a muslims.
I would venture to say that the only good muslim is one who lives in an isolated area of the world where they can do no harm to any infidel, only to each other, which they do on a regular basis bcs of the infighting over who is really a true muslim & who is not.
People who are from muslim parents but are apostate are the only legal immigrants from that group I would ever consider worthy of American citizenship.
Since all muslims are aware of the Koran’s stance on taqiyya, nothing a practicing, believing muslim can do or say is of any value to non-believers.
If you cannot understand that, then read the Koran yourself & figure it out.
They all want you dead or converted or living as a slave AKA dhimmi.
And it doesn’t matter if they are ‘moderate’ or not.
Badger40 on May 20, 2010 at 2:01 PM
You are entitled to your opinion and whether or not you choose to support or not support an event is entirely up to you.
This is not about forcing others to be angry and they cant “kill us all” mentality. This is about standing together in the world against extremism. It is not meant to offend moderate muslims as you have assumed,(the original decree against depictions of Mohammed were meant to deter idol worshipping, Muslims do not worship Mohammed, the cartoons are not meant to encourage Mohammed worshipping).
This is about solidarity and supporting peaceful people which includes moderate Muslims.
canditaylor68 on May 20, 2010 at 2:04 PM
Unless “jerk” is a term of endearment, I believe you’ve insulted every participant in EDMD. And the harm they did to you is what exactly? Not knowing your shoe size?
Barnestormer on May 20, 2010 at 2:05 PM
Muslims who are not ‘doing you any harm’ are still in favor of harm being done to you as a non-believer.
And so if you’ve got a 97yo muslim neighbor who’s nice as peaches to you every morning when you go & get the paper, he is supporting & cursing you as an infidel behind your back.
And by supporting, it could very well mean aiding the enemy militants who are actively killing infidels all over the world through various means, like giving $$ to muslim ‘charities’.
You are extremely ignorant.
Go read the Koran & find out what’s in store for you, kaffir.
Badger40 on May 20, 2010 at 2:05 PM
It’s no more offensive than you continuing to imply that the less muslim someone is, the more tolerant they are — not that I’m disagreeing with that. So, at what point do you decide that the intolerance is unreasonable and irrelevant to your daily life? You don’t seem to have a problem offending devout muslims with text on a blog. Why do you only tuck your tail between your legs when it comes to visual statements?
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 2:06 PM
Well I’m sure there are many muslims who don’t care about the cartoons & think the hype is unfounded.
But I’ll disagree with you that moderate muslims are peaceful people.
I am sure they can live their whole lives without lifting a finger to do harm to ANYONE.And many actually perform acts of kindness in relation to unbelievers.
But that does not mean their lives are without support for the atrocities upon unbelievers that the Koran sanctions.
The unbeliever is an evil thing to them.
Those that do not understand are considered apostates by their peers.
And bcs they are afraid, they do not speak out.
Cowardice & a different kind of support for the evil & destruction that islam is.
Badger40 on May 20, 2010 at 2:10 PM
And to add, it is the same thing as Catholics who go to church & live a pious life in public, but support hideous things like abortion, which are at odds with the teachings of Christianity.
Those kinds of people are just as bad.
Badger40 on May 20, 2010 at 2:11 PM
I think doing things out of spite is childish.
I don’t normally draw anything much, let alone Mohammad. So I would be going out of my way to do something I don’t normally do. That seems spiteful.
Sitting at a restaurant counter and ordering food… that is something you want to do normally. Drinking out of the closest water fountain, taking the most convenient seat on the bus… those things I get.
If they try to stop me from talking about radical Islam, and you had a protest day where we all talked about radical Islam all day, that I might get behind.
I think for people who normally draw cartoons and stuff this makes some sense.
But for me to go out of my way to offend people just to prove that in a free society I am free to offend people… I don’t really get that.
petunia on May 20, 2010 at 2:11 PM
I try to form an opinion and write it before I read other people on subjects like this… then I read to see if I agreed with people or not.
It looks like on this I’m with the more liberal part of the people…. oh well.
petunia on May 20, 2010 at 2:14 PM
“persuading them to be tolerant”
You have to be sh*ting me.
“Now it’s looking more and more like LFG or Freeperville”
Have yo even been to LGF…investigate before shooting off your damn mouth!
Harry S on May 20, 2010 at 2:21 PM
Really? I don’t think you want to speak for a billion people’s deeply and secretly held thoughts and desires, that’s setting yourself up for embarassment.
So only Catholics can go against the teachings of the bible (for good or ill) but Muslims are supernaturally and irrevocably bound to want to kill you once they read the Koran?
Heralder on May 20, 2010 at 2:23 PM
Concern troll is concerned.
He is actually a Muslim Free Speech Terminator! Smell the plastic and patchouli! It gives them away all the time!
BL@KBIRD on May 20, 2010 at 2:23 PM
Spite? Are you serious?
This is about watering down the list of targets. People are getting killed, and if some “moderate” muslims are irked by a cartoon yet apathetic to murder, then I think the childish position is worrying about what those people think. Screw ‘em.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 2:25 PM
Heralder, it’s good that we can agree to disagree in a civilized fashion. Would that others could do the same.
Beagle, you still are missing the point, or else deliberately maintaining your strawman position. How am I “supporting” those who wish to enforce a ban on drawings of Mohammed? I have no desire for drawings of Mohammed to be banned, illegal, or carry any sanction whatsoever.
All I’m saying is that they are rude. That’s not being fascist, or supporting shari’a. Nor is it being P.C. or dhimmi. I’m just calling out puerile, adolescent behavior for what it is. These drawings don’t say, “We proudly support free speech.” They say, “Nyah, nyah, you can’t get me!”
Al, how exactly am I being a hypocrite?
logis, I’m still actively ignoring you, but I would like to point out that I am not a liberal. But then, you seem to be misinformed about a great many things.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 2:25 PM
The fact that Islam integrates its superstitious beliefs with political ideology while Christianity does not hardly make it any less a religion in the dictionary sense. Both are belief systems which demand that their adherents accept ridiculous propositions which have neither basis in fact nor any sort of plausible evidence.
Even the historical evidence for the existence of Christ is flimsy, so on that plane Islam has an advantage.
I can imagine what your view might be of the status Hinduism with its gods imaged in animal forms.
Annar on May 20, 2010 at 2:34 PM
Not exactly. They say, “You can’t get all of us.” Too many artists have been threatened or killed for their speech.
July 10 on May 20, 2010 at 2:34 PM
Who cares if it is provocative? Are they not ALREADY provoked enough to fly jetliners into buildings, and incinerate their own genitals in an effort to murder Americans?
Anything that circles the wagons is a good idea right now, and if this helps build some solidarity against the Islamist brand of censorship through intimidation, it will have served it’s purpose.
Sayan Neviot on May 20, 2010 at 2:38 PM
Concern troll is concerned. He is actually a Muslim Free Speech Terminator! Smell the plastic and patchouli! It gives them away all the time!
BL@KBIRD on May 20, 2010 at 2:23 PM
When it comes to the niggling details, terrorists could could not possibly be more violently opposed to liberals. The only reason they can work together is because they have ONE thing in common: the way they choose their enemies.
Both of those fanatical cults hate you for the same reason: Because you don’t understand why they hate you.
That’s why it is never their job to justify the rules they impose on you; it is always your job to justify why you have a right to question them.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 2:39 PM
You’ve clearly been more thoughtful and nuanced than skydaddy has been on the topic.
I want to clarify that I wasn’t accusing you of being part of the problem; I was saying you were if you didn’t approve of us attacking skydaddy for acting as rudely and stupidly as the people you dealt with who you were justifiably annoyed by.
If you will, go back and look again at what skydaddy has been saying/doing. skydaddy’s been self-righteous and slanderous and while taking the side of the moderate Muslims over the EDMD supporters. As I said before, s/he’s essentially been behaving as the Leftists who cry “racist!” any time someone on the Right criticizes 0bamessiah. People who aren’t actually bigoted against Muslims don’t appreciate being unprovably and falsely accused like that – that is why people are bristling at skydaddy.
Bizarro No. 1 on May 20, 2010 at 2:39 PM
Heralder and petunia, I’m glad that you see reason. Blackbird and badger appear to be immune to it.
Harry, I haven’t been to LGF in several years, except for the occasional link sent by a very libertarian old college chum.
Ronnie, you seem to be confusing the terms moderate and devout. It’s possible to be both.
Barnestormer, people who are submitting cartoons with the express purpose of insulting all Muslims are being jerks, and they know it.
Now there may be some who genuinely feel that they’re only standing up for free speech. Or maybe they think that they’re only cheesing off the ragers. Some may not realize that even the least devout Muslim, one who does not wear the veil or follow shari’a, who’ll never make the hajj, who doesn’t eat halal, who doesn’t even fast during Ramadan (but probably celebrates Eid al Fitr), – even that person is offended by a depiction of the Prophet.
Those who offend without knowing that they offend, those I can excuse.
But if you know that even moderate Muslims will get offended and doing it anyway shows a basic lack of respect for other people. I just wasn’t raised to be rude, and I’ve been a parent long enough to get a bit crotchety when I see it in other people.
Especially on forums where I’ve been used to people acting like grown-ups.
I’m off; got things to do.
skydaddy on May 20, 2010 at 2:42 PM
Now you’re just being obtuse. I find that offensive.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 2:47 PM
Uh huh.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 2:49 PM
Pot, meet kettle.
Dark-Star on May 20, 2010 at 2:51 PM
Are you proud that you need to put this in question form?
What a joke. Yeah, yeah, I know. There is no problem with bigotry on the right.
The Race Card on May 20, 2010 at 2:52 PM
Oh, well, you really backed up that statement. I guess I’ll just have to bow to the superior argument on this one. Well played, dork star.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 2:55 PM
*~@):~{>
Human creativity is more divine than anything in the Koran.
Infantile iconoclasm is the sign of a stubbornly shallow mind.
*~@):~{>
*~@):~{>
*~@):~{>
*~@):~{>
The e-MO-ticon du jour.
profitsbeard on May 20, 2010 at 3:01 PM
But that’s not faaairrr!
What a whiny little brat. Look, just because skydaddy says he practices “active ignorance” doesn’t mean the rest of us have any right to do that.
Like he himself, his argument could not possibly be more simple:
1) If you haven’t PERSONALLY been killed by Islamic oppression, then you have no right to express solidarity with the people who have.
2) And if you do show solidarity with the victims, then all the “unoppressive” Muslims out there will be justified in attacking you too.
Which part of this are you not getting?
logis on May 20, 2010 at 3:01 PM
Ah, that wonderful right-wing logic.
If you can’t tell the difference between supporting free speech and flinging insults from afar (and in perfect safety), you are no better than a bratty child who throws stones at the caged animals in the zoo.
Dark-Star on May 20, 2010 at 3:02 PM
Of course you stand by your unprovable and slanderous statements – what, all of the sudden you are going to realize how wrong, idiotic, and offensive you’ve been?
If you would have taken the mental time to ascertain exactly what those who have said that moderate Muslims don’t exist meant when they said it rather than mindlessly running with your presumption of what they meant, you’d have understood that they consider radical Muslims to be the real adherents of Islam, and that those who’ve been labeled moderate Muslims are in fact not genuine Muslims because if they were, they’d logically end up having to be radical Muslims themselves.
You are stupid because you’ve shown you’re incapable of rational analysis of your beliefs. Your problem is you take it as a given that your opinions (which aren’t facts, just to let you know) are correct, and that’s where your thought process ends.
Bizarro No. 1 on May 20, 2010 at 3:05 PM
The attempt to bring Sharia to the U.S. wouldn’t have such a foothold without (amongst other things) an odd outgrowth of sexual politics/law which let the nose of the camel under the tent. I am referring to the idea/law that a person can be convicted, not because of a specific act, but because of how that act was perceived by another (e.g. sexual harassment).
I am also of the opinion that moderate Muslims are mostly imaginary…their moderation is only in lack of acting on their beliefs…they decry violence committed by Islamists only under duress and rather unconvincingly. Also, the Muslims I’ve spoken with say they are prohibited from acting against any other Muslim or criticizing them to non-believers.
trl on May 20, 2010 at 3:06 PM
I am offended at your use of “right wing” in a derogatory manner. You are now guilty of flinging insults from afar.
canditaylor68 on May 20, 2010 at 3:09 PM
EDMD is a winner if we convince the muslims that they are powerless to stop us. The average muslim resign themselves to it, just as Christian do to various blasphemies here. And denouncing others statements as blasphemy is often a naked power power on behalf of the “offended”.
“Blasphemy” is how the fanatics to empower themselves to control the entire conversation. For instance, I sincerely interpret Parsha Terumah (Exodus 25:1–27:19) in a way that would be considered blasphemous by Orthodox Jews and Fundamentalist Christians on power trips. Yet, it’s just as much my Torah as theirs. I get to interpret it how I want. Isn’t that one of the points of Protestantism in Christianity? It certainly is a point of Reform Judaism.
If I were to touch the fascist filth known as the Koran, I have no doubt that I could sincerely find interpretations that would anger muslims. And I’m not sure why a non-muslim has to be sincere in making a statement about how he or she interprets the Koran. No one is required to interpret the Koran according to Islamic tradition. Keep in mind the muslims don’t really care about these pictures so much as controlling the entire conversation by controlling allowable interpretations.
thuja on May 20, 2010 at 3:09 PM
Actually, I think a better analogy would be rodeo clown. Yeah, you can pretend to be above what you think is just an absurd display of silliness and you can even demean them for hiding in a barrel or two, but that would just prove that you don’t have a clue about what’s happening in the world around you.
Ronnie on May 20, 2010 at 3:10 PM
There were millions of “moderate” Nazis who sat on the sidelines. That’s nothing to be proud of.
If a Fifth Column were fighting AGAINST the stated goals of their leaders, they would be deserving of respect.
In Islam, that’s not happening.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 3:16 PM
Since when is criticism of violent ideology and its adherents bigotry F*ck Tard? Cause they are brown and the mean white honkeys are criticizing them? It that what bugs you Rape Tard?
BL@KBIRD on May 20, 2010 at 3:16 PM
Mohammad is an argument against Intelligent Design.
[;~)]
profitsbeard on May 20, 2010 at 3:19 PM
I hear you, and at the core, I understand why you take exception to what he’s saying, because I do too. My first post about it didn’t as accurately express my problem, admittedly, which is that even sometimes subtle deviations from the status quo here … even if stated thoughtfully, can immediately earn you “concern troll” or “terror apologist” labels.
Like I said, that’s not really a detriment to me stating my point of view, because those folks typically offer no real resistence once you drag them into the light, but it’s tiring.
So in short, I get what you meant now, no hard feelings on that. I’d like at some point to go back and read more fully all of skydaddy’s arguments and the one’s opposing them (I’ve only gotten the basic gist because I’ve been reading other threads too), and maybe I can do that later, since deadlines are beginning to loom here.
And to skydaddy: No problem. I’d liked to have actually tried to show where you were wrong, but I’m out of time for now.
Suffice it to say: We cannot back down for the sake moderate Muslims, because moderate Muslims have shown themselves by and large to be completely ineffectual at slowing or stopping terror.
If, as many say, moderates do not believe Mohammed decrees you should kill for intended slights and so forth, the greatest offense being done to Muslims is by Muslims.
If we all do as they command and do not depict Mohammed, it tells them that they can make demands and we will concede to them out of fear. I don’t think this is an excuse to be offensive, it’s overall a message saying “You cannot tell us what to do.”
And that is right, they cannot, unless we let them out of fear of being offensive.
Heralder on May 20, 2010 at 3:33 PM
My entry: http://exurbanleague.com/Home/tabid/40/EntryId/308/Its-Draw-Mohammed-Day.aspx
My co-blogger’s: http://exurbanleague.com/Home/tabid/40/EntryId/307/My-entry.aspx
ExUrbanKevin on May 20, 2010 at 3:33 PM
Besides albinos, Ayotollah Khamenei is the fairest skin man I’ve ever seen.
If my own brother were to become a muslim, he would by that fact become my enemy. It has nothing to do with race.
thuja on May 20, 2010 at 3:37 PM
I don’t have to be “considerate” of anyone’s desire to make me obey the mandates of their religion, and by the way I find the concept that I should unbelievably offensive.
I ALSO suspect most Muslims will ignore the DMD cartoons. And of those that don’t, we’ll know who the jerks are.
See? We agree. Peace and harmony all around, hmmm?
Laura on May 20, 2010 at 4:01 PM
THESE A$$HOLES ARE OFFENDED BY CRAYON DRAWINGS AND BACON!!!!
WHY is this mamby-pamby war no over yet?
One K-C130, a pallet of PORK RINDS, and 10,000 spring shoats with little tiny parachutes AND I COULD END THIS STINKING WAR BY TEA TIME ON FRIDAY.
WHAT THE HELL ARE WE DOING TO OURSELVES?
seejanemom on May 20, 2010 at 4:04 PM
NANCY PELOSI: “Think of an economy where people could be an artist… without worrying about keeping their day job in order to have health insurance…”
Now that there are more of us artists, thanks to Pelosi and the ObamaCare bill passing, we should be able to draw whatever we want without worrying about being attacked by angry, misinformed Islamo-fascist terrorists.
Muslims are not supposed to worship images of Muhammed. Fine, don’t worship my image but don’t think you have the right to tell me not to draw him if I am so inclined to do so. This is still America.
Nancy said I shouldn’t be worried, and I am not:
@:-{>
Fallon on May 20, 2010 at 4:05 PM
I think massive amounts of Mo-pix would de-sensitize Muslims, but it will take years. No Christian likes the insulting “art” we all remember that used urine or elephant droppings, but I doubt any but a handful are still outraged by those or the aging singer Madonna’s antics.
Of course what I’m thinking about here is the basic human tendency to adapt to about anything. That could be wrong in this case.
alice on May 20, 2010 at 4:17 PM
If that’s not worth four trillion dollars, then no liberal knows what is.
logis on May 20, 2010 at 4:20 PM
Here’s a factoid you’ll be interested in knowing: Sunnis don’t believe in taqiyya. According to the Koran and Shi-ites, since they aren’t opposed to being friends with unbelievers, they aren’t being good Muslims by rejecting the concept.
Bizarro No. 1 on May 20, 2010 at 4:20 PM
skydaddy, I’m glad you weren’t around in the 60s. I’m sure you would have been telling Rosa Parks to go to the back of the bus–there are plenty of “moderate Southerners” who would have been offended because she didn’t want to get up.
That, in a nutshell, is what you don’t seem to get–more, more likely, what you don’t seem to want to get.
CatsGodot on May 20, 2010 at 4:28 PM
LMAO! That’s rich!!!!! How’s that spiteful little boycott going?
speed911 on May 20, 2010 at 4:30 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_-YXmRg2RY
Mark Jaquith on May 20, 2010 at 4:55 PM
Not all Sunnis go by that, but yes, I understand some find it hypocritical.
They are still no different when dealing with infidels.
The Koran says what it says.
So really the choices are not that much different.
It’s an apple. Even if the apple is a different type of apple, it’s still an apple.
Also this crap about some muslims viewing the jihad as an inner struggle is crap.
It’s clear what the Koran commands & the later information trumps everything else that comes before it.
So any peaceful loving thing that might come 1st is later obliterated by other things said after.
It’s plain & simple a nasty book on the murder & conquering of non-believers.
Badger40 on May 20, 2010 at 4:59 PM
Death to jihadists!
ultracon on May 20, 2010 at 5:13 PM
BRILLIANT!
LegendHasIt on May 20, 2010 at 5:56 PM
Wait, your claim of bigotry is about whether or not it’s a good idea to have an Everybody Draw Mohamed Day? I was assuming it was in response to something that was actually bigoted, like the idea that all Muslims should be raped with bacon or something stupid.
I’m actually surprised that you think the day itself is bigoted.
Stop making these drive back accusations of racism. Come back and have this conversation and be fair about this. I didn’t appreciate the comment you made to me the other day and see this becoming more of a habit for you, and I don’t see how you’re at all being fair.
I know you like to stir things up, but I’d always otherwise considered you a fair person.
Esthier on May 20, 2010 at 6:22 PM
Respect is voluntary or it is not respect.
Being quiet and compliant in the despotic islamic dominated lands gains little good for the silent ones.
Somewhere, the rubber hits the road. We have to stop bowing to despots, and we owe nothing to nations harboring terrorist armies intending to destroy us because of our beliefs
If we suppress all expression to suit them, what will we gain? I suggest nothing except an increase in agression against Western values. They will take it as far as we let them
entagor on May 20, 2010 at 6:35 PM
You bet I’m for EDMD! It’s time America stop being a bloody pantywaste and know our enemy!
C’mon. Wake up. Do you see what is happening in America?
Did you see this that happened last week?
Or how bout the fact that the NEW Miss USA is a Hezbollah supporter? Wow. Carrie Prejean (runner up) NO WAY JOSE, but some skank Miss HezbaUSA is a-ok!
There is no America anymore! WAKE UP!
Gob on May 20, 2010 at 6:42 PM
Given the prevailing politically correct winds that have been blowing the often feared – but rarely seen in action – “slipery slope” principle comes to mind. If everyone were to take your advice and say “Why should I care? This doesn’t affect me personally. I really DO support free speech, I just don’t want to do anything about it.” – which has been the case up to now – we would see a continuation of the double standard and asinine political correctness that has the head of Homeland Security referring to terror attacks as “man caused disasters” and the head of our DOJ afraid to even admit that Islamic terrorists are in fact Islamic.
FYI You assume that the point is to “be a jerk, or biggot, or biggotted jerk”. From what I’ve read and seen being a jerk or biggot isn’t a requirement for participation. You can still take action and support free speech in a respectful manner. (That’s why it’s called free speech.) This requires courage, thought and effort, all of which are antithetical to political correctness.
And finally, I am sick and tired of people naively comparing Islam to Christianity (or even Judaism). Having actually read the Koran along with the “scholarly” footnotes and clarifications, this is a false comparison.
Jesus died for his beliefs. Mohammed killed for his. Jesus made speeches to convert his followers. Mohammed made war to convert his. Even the word “Islam” translates to “submission”, not “peace” as so many have tried to claim. Christians “give themselves to God” or are “born again” while Muslims “submit” to God and Mohammed. This implies (and is explicitly stated throughout the Koran) that God is a conquering force, not a loving, nurturing force.
Onus on May 20, 2010 at 7:10 PM
As a follow-up to my previous post, I’d like to expand on something that I should have before – the fact that Christianity was the basis for the Crusades and Inquisitions. Folks like to equate that violence with the current Islamic violence and say “see, Christianity is just as bad. Christianity changed, and so can Islam.”
Again, this is intellectually dishonest. Yes the Crusades and Inquisitions happened, but they were proposed and carried out by individuals who knowingly (the clergy) or not (the mostly illiterate congregations) twisted Jesus’ teachings to suit their own needs. Even a casual reading of the New Testament is enough to understand this. That’s why as more Christians became literate, the more peaceful and “civilized” they became.
To sum up, Christianity’s violence really did result from a twisting of the religion and was rectified as followers became more aquainted with the actual texts.
There are a lot of folks who believe that Islamic violence is caused by the same thing, and will be resolved in the same way. Not so. In fact, it is exactly the opposite.
Historically, Muslims were no more violent than any other religious group. However, as literacy expanded and more followers became familiar with Islamic texts, the violence also expanded. This is because violence is a pillar of Islam.
The fact is, we’re fighting an uphill battle. In trying to convince Muslims to behave in a peaceful civilized manner, we are actually asking them to “twist” their religion to be something other than what it actually is. And since there will always be those who will remain faithful to the true teachings, there will always be Islamic violence.
Onus on May 20, 2010 at 7:44 PM
facebook yanked the page, but left up the draw the holocaust and the against edmd site
clnurnberg on May 20, 2010 at 8:00 PM
Anyone who voted for anything other than the top two choices is a dhimmi.
Disturb the Universe on May 20, 2010 at 8:20 PM
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