Palin: I understand the temptation of abortion

posted at 12:15 pm on May 14, 2010 by Ed Morrissey

Sarah Palin’s address to the Susan B. Anthony List Celebration of Life breakfast today gives a good emphasis on the earlier Gallup poll showing continuing strength in pro-life identification. No one in the pro-life movement believes that there are always easy answers, and Palin uses an example from her own life when she understood the fear that women have that can lead them to destroying the life inside of them:

Speaking at the Susan B. Anthony List Celebration of Life breakfast, Palin said that when she learned during her pregnancy that Trig would be born with Down syndrome, she “had no idea how I was going to handle the situation of raising a special needs child.”

She said she was struck by “not knowing if my heart was ready, not knowing if I was patient and nurturing enough.”

While she had previously believed that “God will never give me something I cannot handle,” she said, she was left thinking, “I don’t think I can handle this. This wasn’t part of my life’s plan.”

As a busy mother who already had four kids and who was serving as Alaska governor, she wondered how she would handle raising the child, she said. She wondered if her sister, who has a child with autism, would have been better equipped to raise him.

Palin said the experience helped her understand how a woman would consider “even for a split second” having an abortion, “because I’ve been there.”

Many of us have “been there,” a point missed by those who accuse pro-life activists of heartlessness. I rarely speak of my own “been there” moment, mainly because it’s really not my story anyway. When your high-school student comes home and tells you that his girlfriend is pregnant, many things run through your mind. I’d be lying if I said that abortion never came into those thoughts; however, as with Palin, it had to do with fear of the unknown and of our my own strength. I never considered it an option, however, and instead provided as much love and support for my son as I could in order to allow the best choice to be made. Our granddaughter turns eight years old this month, and is a testimony to the blessings that supporting life over fear can bring.

The Right Scoop has all of Palin’s speech in this video clip. As she did in Chicago, Palin uses the speech to also defend her endorsement of Carly Fiorina.


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She’s your “tool.”
AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

The only tool I see, is you.

upinak on May 14, 2010 at 12:56 PM

Don’t speak for me, and don’t pretend this is purely a woman’s issue. This disgusting tactic has been overplayed. Kindly, DROP IT.
Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 12:40 PM

I skip over all anninca post. She is a liar and a rabid pro murdering children in their mother’s womb l e s b I a n. She makes up stories to fit every post. She is going to park herself on this thread making inflamatory statesments all day. In her mind this is her chance to get the mostcattention she can in her pathetic lonely morally vacant life. Ignore her…

CCRWM on May 14, 2010 at 12:57 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

Women Women Women Women Women Women!
To Hell with the Children!
Women Women Women Women Women Women!
To Hell With the Children!
Its all about the Women!
Kill them, gut them, clean them, smash them!
To Hell with the Children!
Its all about the Women!

Holger on May 14, 2010 at 12:57 PM

I for one and am awesome, and the entire world is better off with more versions of me in it

…wow. All hail Esthier the Grand, oh world! Bow before the mighty womb-en!

AnninCA may be a threadjacker, but darned if she didn’t nail you types to the letter.

…you are suggesting that she’s nothing but a vessel for birth.

She’s your “tool.”

I suggest you all start creating life in a test tube.

That’ll skirt this problem.

Women have the right to vote, people.

And they have the right to their own medical decisions.

Dark-Star on May 14, 2010 at 12:57 PM

The mother is the existing person, with rights.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

So then she has sex, and creates anther person, who then… exists… and has rights.

rightheaded on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

Duh. We all know you are a liberal who hikacks threads and probably gets paid to do it.

What a concept there moron.

upinak on May 14, 2010 at 12:53 PM

Funny. They say the same thing on HuffPo.

I think you’re just paranoid.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

Liberal Term!
========================

UnViable Tissue Mass!

canopfor on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

If you can’t grant her that, then you are suggesting that she’s nothing but a vessel for birth.

She’s your “tool.”

Bull sh!t, Ann. No one’s forcing anyone to get pregnant.

I suggest you all start creating life in a test tube.

That’ll skirt this problem.

It would if women would stop getting themselves pregnant and if the technology were at all even here now.

Women have the right to vote, people.

And they have the right to their own medical decisions.

STAY OUT!

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

Seriously. Stop making this all about women. I am one, and I completely disagree with you. This affects all people, and it’s disgusting that you keep linking it to women as though we all agree even though a plurality OF WOMEN disagree with you.

Also, since when did you ever vote with us, Ann? You’ve never hidden your Democrat associations.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

In my Doctoral class I just read a longitudinal study on women between 1933 and 1985 who had abortions. It was a qualitative research project on 55 women, some who gave birth and some who had abortions. The majority consensus was their need to maintain relationships with family members and friends as their reason for their abortions.

The bibliography is:

Patterson, Maggie Jones, Ronald P. Hill, and Kate Malloy (1995), “Abortion in America: A Consumer Behavior Perspective,” Journal of Consumer Research, 21 (March), 39112.

I leave it here for anyone who would wish to read it.

itsspideyman on May 14, 2010 at 12:59 PM

I’m honestly going to listen to Palin. I don’t think she’s a nutcase anti-abortionist, although I think a bunch of them would like to believe that she is.

I will never vote for one of the anti-abortion nuts.

If they want to join her platform, fine.

But I don’t think she’s about that.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:59 PM

AnninCA may be a threadjacker, but darned if she didn’t nail you types to the letter.
Dark-Star on May 14, 2010 at 12:57 PM

To quote AllahPundit’s post to you the other day:

Your snotty derision is not appreciated.

kingsjester on May 14, 2010 at 1:00 PM

I don’t understand the obssession with abortion in this country. I know I am going to get beaten up for this, but before viability, why not stay out of it?

bopbottle on May 14, 2010 at 12:24 PM

Beyond the sanctity of life issues, I think a big part of the objection is that the SCOTUS imposed a one size fits all solution on the country and used the flimsiest of excuses for doing it.

Kafir on May 14, 2010 at 1:00 PM

And they have the right to their own medical decisions.
AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

So if my doctor says that removing you will relieve me of mental pain, it’s okay to off you? Kool. I didn’t know that killing people was a simple medical decision.

docdave on May 14, 2010 at 1:00 PM

we’ll keep your hands off your body when you stop making us pay for your abortions

blatantblue on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

AnninCA just can’t seem to grasp that concept.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:01 PM

I can’t stand the anti-abortionists.

I really can’t.

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

bopbottle on May 14, 2010 at 12:24 PM

Because if a society can’t continually bring in life, it can’t do much of anything else.

BradSchwartze on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

I didn’t know that killing people was a simple medical decision.

docdave on May 14, 2010 at 1:00 PM

What do you think Obamacare is all about?

Holger on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

…wow. All hail Esthier the Grand, oh world! Bow before the mighty womb-en!

Hyperbole go over your head a bit?

AnninCA may be a threadjacker, but darned if she didn’t nail you types to the letter.

Dark-Star on May 14, 2010 at 12:57 PM

What does me not wanting to terminate my offspring and the sadness that so many people do have anything to do with forcing women to be baby makers?

Except in cases of rape (and most are fine with abortion then as a rare exception) no one’s forcing women to get pregnant.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Why are we talking about this Hillbilly from Wasilly?

PappyD61 on May 14, 2010 at 12:43 PM

PappyD61:I`m in the sticks and bush,in Northern Ontario,
Canada,but not as harsh as Alaska!!!:)

canopfor on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Pregnancy is a perfectly natural punishment for irresponsible sexual activity.

No different than being ‘punished’ by gravity for jumping off a cliff without a parachute.

Dark-Star on May 14, 2010 at 12:50 PM

nah
it ain’t punishment man. it’s a natural byproduct of gettin’ down

it’s only punishment through your prism

blatantblue on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM

And they have the right to their own medical decisions.

STAY OUT!

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:54 PM

But that is against the law.

exception on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM

The Abortion debate can be summed up in two statements:

1: “A woman has the right to decide when and if she has children.”

That essentially is what drives the pro-choice position. And it’s powerful because it is a true statement.

2: “A mother should never kill her baby.”

That essentially what drives the pro-life movement. Abortion is an abomination, repugnant and evil in the eyes of both God and men. If you can not comprehend that fact, then you have a seriously crippled moral sense.

So we have these two powerful true statements that should guide us in determining our position. The way I see it abortion is not the only method a woman can exercise her right to choose. Therefore the moral imperative to protect the human life/potential human life of an unborn child takes precedence.

That said, I can see why a moral person might be persuaded that as evil as abortion is, that the government should not interfere. What I can not comprehend is why people can’t recognize the legitimacy of the pro-life position- even if they disagree with it.

Sackett on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM

Get out of women’s medical decisions, people.

Just drop it.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:27 PM

IMO you do a disservice to not only yourself but to women in general when you push the meme that all women think abortion is purely a medical issue. We’re not talking about women having the right to determine whether or not they get their tubes tied – that is a medical decision. Gutting your unborn child is unfortunately more often than not an elective decision done at the will of the woman.

Feminists complain that no one but them should have any input to abortion but those same feminists are pretty quick to demand that the biological father step up if they decide they do want the baby. Are you prepared to give the father the right to decide he’s not interested in having a child? They also seem to think that they are owed support by the same government that they think should have no input.

katiejane on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM

I’d like to bump this important post while AnninCA’s head spins around in 360 degree circles.

jeff_from_mpls on May 14, 2010 at 12:41 PM

Goes against her narrative to point out that THE LAST MAN MURDERED BECAUSE OF THE ABORTION ISSUE WAS KILLED BY A PRO-CHOICE ADVOCATE. She’ll ignore and pretend she never heard about it. The “issue” of pro-lifers killing abortionists is a red herring. It rarely happens and doesn’t invalidate our position.

Narutoboy on May 14, 2010 at 1:04 PM

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

I mean, God forbid that some people be so cuhhraaazy that they rabidly fight to protect unborn babies from being slaughtered. I mean, I simply, like, can’t abide this type. Icky icky icky!

rightheaded on May 14, 2010 at 1:05 PM

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

You’re a nut. You’re the one that places a higher value on screwing than a child’s life. Go away. Go vote for the most radical ass you can find to save your precious death rite.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:05 PM

So then she has sex, and creates anther person, who then… exists… and has rights.

rightheaded on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

The legislature can begin protecting that life at around 24 weeks, based on a viability criteria. At what point do you propose that the legislature should be allowed to step in and what methods should they be allowed to use?

dedalus on May 14, 2010 at 1:05 PM

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

1. Women have so many contraception available to them today. The idea that sex is the enemy here is ignorant.

2. Please answer me. Why do you think a child is punishment?

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:06 PM

Get out of women’s medical decisions, people.

Just drop it.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:27 PM

It’s not a woman’s medical decision.

Sorry – that’s pap you’ve been fed all your life – but it’s your fault for believing it.

If you are an intellectual – then you are PRO-LIFE. :)

The fact is … in order to logically support the practice of abortion – you have to first separate it from murder. How do you do that? Well, you have to first ascertain when life begins. If you cannot ascertain when life begins – then logic dictates that you refrain from the practice.

When I was training on submarines – I was told not to be a “button pusher”. I was told – not to go around pushing buttons on machinery if I didn’t have a clue what those buttons did. Some buttons on a submarine put water in places you don’t normally want them. It’s the same logic here – if we, as a society, cannot define when life begins – then we must refrain from the practice.

The most illogical idiot of them all is Obama – because he embraces the most extreme forms of abortion – including partial birth and, infanticide in cases of failed abortions. Yet this idiot has said that the notion of when life begins is above his “paygrade”.

Abortion is NOT a woman’s choice – it’s a societal issue on whether or not we’re going to take human life – and under what kind of circumstances we’re going to take it.

Amazing to me – half of these idiots that cry … “WOMAN’s CHOICE” also want to REMOVE CHOICE for the kind of foods we eat. “No Salt” … “No Transfat” … “No Sugar!”. The Democrats and the libby pissy pants want to remove every choice in life we have – except for abortion.

Hey how about this … they want to tax soda pop now … ask them tax ABORTION.

They ARE taxing tanning salons now … ask them to tax ABORTION.

Hehe.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:07 PM

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Ladies, I’d like to disprove this claim. My phone number is…

Daggett on May 14, 2010 at 1:07 PM

You’re a nut. You’re the one that places a higher value on screwing than a child’s life. Go away. Go vote for the most radical ass you can find to save your precious death rite.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:05 PM

Well, at least on this topic, I am not confused about you.
You’re really a pro-life “ick” type.

You have no respect.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:08 PM

Get out of women’s medical decisions, people.

Just drop it.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:27 PM

Then tell your liberal friends to get out of whether I have health insurance or not.

Does your precious “right to privacy” not include my medical records or whether or not I have health insurance?

ladyingray on May 14, 2010 at 1:08 PM

It’s not a woman’s medical decision.

Absurd. Of course it is.

Again, I’m going to relax with Palin’s attitude.
She’s reasonable.

Those of you into this stuff really aren’t. I think you’re neurotic.

Twigs bent.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:10 PM

AnninCA, you don’t speak for me. You don’t speak for a lot of women, probably more than you know.

I, too, understand the temptation. When I got pregnant, I was young and scared and had no money. My landlord threatened to evict me. My mother-in-law offered to pay for an abortion.

After looking at a book about the developmental stages of a baby, week-by-week in the womb, I just couldn’t do it.

My son just turned 20. He has brought more joy to my life than anything. He’s also brought joy to many other’s lives. Being his mother was a sacred trust, and the highest privilege.

surfhut on May 14, 2010 at 1:10 PM

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

This isn’t even a serious comment.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:10 PM

Well, at least on this topic, I am not confused about you.
You’re really a pro-life “ick” type.

You have no respect.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:08 PM

Yeah whatever … I told you earlier that we’ll stop when the government stops spending millions of dollars pumping up abortion and abortion organizations. I see you have no problem with government involvement when it favors baby killing.

Your thinking is squirrelly. You’re a squirrelly hypocrite.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:12 PM

Funny. They say the same thing on HuffPo.

I think you’re just paranoid.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:58 PM

Who is paranoid? Seems it is only you .. since you HATE anti-abortionists. Worried about something?

upinak on May 14, 2010 at 1:12 PM

The godless demand child sacrifice for prosperity and convenience sake!

Inanemergencydial on May 14, 2010 at 1:12 PM

Removing a wart is a medical decision.

Killing your own child is murder.

Daggett on May 14, 2010 at 1:13 PM

Women are a huge, huge voting bloc, and Independent women WILL, HAVE DONE SO, and WILL DO IN THE FUTURE…..vote against pro-life activists.

That is changing. America, including women, are becoming more pro-life.

The mother is the existing person, with rights. If you can’t grant her that, then you are suggesting that she’s nothing but a vessel for birth.

BOTH the mother and the baby have rights. If the mother wishes to kill the baby, then they have conflicting rights. Your solution is to just ignore the baby’s rights. That’s no better than a solution that ignores the woman’s rights.

But law exists to deal with people’s conflicting rights. In this case, according to Roe v. Wade, if it’s “early,” the mother’s wishes win. If it’s “late”, the baby’s wishes win unless it would kill the mother. “Early” and “Late” are political terms, defined by the states. I’m sorry you can’t see your way to that baby being a person, but perhaps that’s what those who’ve had abortions have to tell themselves to sleep at night.

alwaysfiredup on May 14, 2010 at 1:15 PM

ninjapirate on May 14, 2010 at 12:40 PM

———————————————
As a woman and mother who considered an abortion, I think every woman should look at those pictures before making a decision.

surfhut on May 14, 2010 at 1:15 PM

I don’t care about abortion. It is simply not important to me.
AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:27 PM

You make this political?
You’ll lose.

Women are a huge, huge voting bloc, and Independent women WILL, HAVE DONE SO, and WILL DO IN THE FUTURE…..vote against pro-life activists.

Stay out.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:34 PM

With apologies to Sesame Street:

One of these things is not like the other. One of these things just doesn’t belong….

You seem awful worked up about something you profess to care little about.

VelvetElvis on May 14, 2010 at 1:15 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:38 PM

I wonder if you understand that the abortion argument is now more focused on the belief that “It may be legal, but it’s EVIL.”

You don’t have a counter-argument for that.

BradSchwartze on May 14, 2010 at 1:15 PM

My son just turned 20. He has brought more joy to my life than anything. He’s also brought joy to many other’s lives. Being his mother was a sacred trust, and the highest privilege.

surfhut on May 14, 2010 at 1:10 PM

Are you sure you are an independent woman?
Independent women kill their babies, kind of a right of passage for “womenhood”…according to some posters.

right2bright on May 14, 2010 at 1:16 PM

I have been fine with no federal funds to abortions. That seemed to me, anyway, to be commonsense, given the obvious 50/50 devide on this issue.

My opinion is that Sarah represents most people’s ideas. It’s a lot more acceptable today to have a child without a husband. If there’s not a medical issue, it’s really a moral/practical issue.

I agree with her. I agree with the current trend with women to NOT go the direction of abortiton simply over criticisms that they had sex.

but….the antiabortionists have inserted themselves into much bigger issues. They push women to give up their very lives.

I’ll never back that ilk.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

AnninCA:
=======================

Oh gawd,you have got to be kidding me,with cliterus butchery,women being beaten,stoned to death,and your
making reference about the Tall-ee-Bon,

where is the Lefty Activist FemaNazi`s of Womens
Rights!!

There is NO womens rights,its just another arm of the
Liberal Party to raise campaign funds,period!!

Islam gets a free once again!!

canopfor on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:10 PM

Ann, whether or not I have health insurance is my choice. Why isn’t that “right to privacy” honored?

ladyingray on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

I’ll never back that ilk.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

So you really did vote for Obama (pro-abortion) and not McCain (pro-life) as you have repeatedly said.

ladyingray on May 14, 2010 at 1:19 PM

You’re really a pro-life “ick” type.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:08 PM

Icky? That’s so juvenile. Come back when you attain adulthood so you can discuss this issue intelligently and unemotionally.

docdave on May 14, 2010 at 1:19 PM

AnninCA, are you reacting so vehemently because you had an abortion yourself?

OhioCoastie on May 14, 2010 at 1:19 PM

My stance remains: Stay OUT of my medical choices.

You are mostly likely jerks. I simply don’t think jerks should have control over my life.

I’ll get along with you. But there are limits.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:20 PM

She has experienced the balancing of risk and reward that every woman is entitled to settle herself, in consultation with medical advice.

I respect her choice and praise her acceptance of risk. But is was her choice and that’s the way it should remain.

SarahW on May 14, 2010 at 1:20 PM

I think Ann is off her meds again.

upinak on May 14, 2010 at 1:21 PM

“Kill baby kill” – slow down just a tad to see the sticker.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 12:46 PM

When I first saw that image… I thought “Why is Bill Richardson wearing wearing pearls?”

LegendHasIt on May 14, 2010 at 1:21 PM

I can’t stand the anti-abortionists.

I really can’t.

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.
They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Holy ….

Do you have tourettes syndrome? How do you leap from anti-abortionists feeling abortion is murder and shouldn’t be allowed … to them wanting to stone women to death like the Taliban because they don’t want them to have sex?

You can disagree with an idea without pounding out random, incoherent strings of words that have no bearing on the discussion.

Thank you for the laughs though! I’m printing out that post because you simply cannot fake that level of air-headed insanity, and it must be saved for posterity.

Heralder on May 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM

My stance remains: Stay OUT of my medical choices.

You are mostly likely jerks. I simply don’t think jerks should have control over my life.

I’ll get along with you. But there are limits.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:20 PM

What do you think about the individual mandate to have health insurance? What do you think about privacy of medical records?

ladyingray on May 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM

My son is my only child. I absolutely loved being his mom, adore him, and he’s now a grown man.

We’ve forged a nice adult relationship.

I loved, loved, loved being his mom. I think I grieved worse about giving up that role more than any other in life.

I loved being a mom.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM

Your “backstory” is slipping again…

ladyingray on May 14, 2010 at 1:25 PM

They push women to give up their very lives.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

^^ Steeped in selishness. It’s all about Ann.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:25 PM

Really, there is no need to get upset about abortion because – as I’ve said … the PRO-LIFE position is the logical and intellectual position. You don’t have to involve religion to come to that conclusion. Liberal pissy pants who insist otherwise should be mocked and ridiculed for their ignorance. Here are the facts …

1. Human societies don’t condone murder. In fact, in most societies today – the taking of human life is punished. The only exceptions are the death penalty and war and these are two exceptions which human society has endorsed since virtually the beginning of civilization.

2. A fetus … is … LIFE, there is no question about this. If a fetus were discovered in the sands of Mars tomorrow the news headline would read “LIFE FOUND ON MARS”. Question is … is it HUMAN LIFE? It may not be – but at some point – IT BECOMES HUMAN LIFE.

3. If you are going to permit abortion in a society then you must take the facts above and REACH A SOCIETAL CONSENSUS ON WHEN “HUMAN” LIFE BEGINS. This is completely obvious to a third grader with half a brain. You must reach a consensus on when human life starts – because an abortion performed after that “humanizing” point is MURDER. Why would you endorse a practice without first knowing it’s boundaries? That’s illogical.

4. YOU CANNOT USE “VIABILITY” AS THE “HUMANIZING” POINT. Many babies born full term … are not “viable”. In addition, the point of viability has been slipping to the left for decades due to medical advances. A humanizing point does not move with technology.

At some point you are human – and it’s murder to abort.

What I’m asking … nay, demanding for folks like AnninCA to do is to produce for me some consensus on when the humanizing point is. I’m sorry – but I have no tolerance for intellectual laziness when it comes to a heavy societal issue such as abortion vs murder. So all the liberal pissy pants need to get their act together – and stop killing humans with lazy logic, hyperbole, and demagoguery.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:27 PM

I loved being a mom.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM

Then why do you consider children punishment? Do you actually have an answer? I’d genuinely like to read it.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:27 PM

I can’t stand the anti-abortionists.

I really can’t.

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Wow. Little cranky, there, aren’t you, Ann?
Maybe you should find yourself a nice, quiet hobby, and leave the nice folks here at HotAir alone.

uncivilized on May 14, 2010 at 1:28 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:20 PM

I don’t need to have control of any woman’s life in order to press my point on the evil of abortion, and the evil of people making justifications for abortion.

BradSchwartze on May 14, 2010 at 1:28 PM

Ann doesn’t mind government involvement to promote and pay for abortion … but wants medical decisions to be “private”, except for the rest of our health care of course. She doesn’t mind the government sticking it’s nose in there.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:28 PM

My stance remains: Stay OUT of my medical choices.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:20 PM

No doctor licensing required?
No prescriptions required?
That’s something I can get behind, but I actually believe in men making their own medical decisions.

exception on May 14, 2010 at 1:28 PM

Not to split hairs, but she said “my life’s plans.” I’m sure she understands the difference between what she had planned and, as a Christian believes, what God had planned for her (and Trig).

NebCon on May 14, 2010 at 12:30 PM

Correct.

Conservative Samizdat on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

They push women to give up their very lives.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:17 PM

Abortionists have done the same to about 25 million women over the past 40-ish years.

CDeb on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

I think you guys have just run into a natural “STOP”

The conservative move is about fiscal matters.

Do not be stupid.

Do not think that’s about your other agendas, which includes this issue.

Either pay attention or don’t. Dems didn’t pay attention to thing I said, either.

And I was quite right. They are reaping the rewards of the DC agenda.

But if you think this reaction gives power to the anti-abortionists?

you are so wrong.

I think most people are pretty much like me.

OK, no federal funds. After that, stay out and shut up.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

AnninCA sounds an awful lot like a woman lashing out due to guilt.

OhioCoastie on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

I’m reminded of how our troops liberated the concentration camps in Germany then had to force the local citizens to march through those camps to see what they had permitted, endorsed, in the name of convenience and destiny.

The 20th Century provides several reminders of how a populace can be hoodwinked into mechanized slaughter as long as they can have someone manage the killing for them and inspire in them a warped sense of entitlement to privacy as they write a check to nothing less than an exterminator of their progeny.

viking01 on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

What I can not comprehend is why people can’t recognize the legitimacy of the pro-life position- even if they disagree with it.

Sackett on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM

Well said. I could never understand that either. To argue that it is a necessary evil is one thing. But the argument that abortion in itself is not horrible, I will never understand.

Missy on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

Wow. Major red herring. I’m a woman. I’m hugely in favor of contraception because it does give women the choice about when and how many children she will have, which frees her to participate in other parts of society as she chooses.

If that rhetoric hasn’t already exposed me, I freely and clearly admit to being a capital-F Feminist. But being in favor of women’s rights does not include support for killing babies. Feminists for Life is just as old as NOW. Feminists have merely succeeded in convincing scores of Third Wave adherents that it is necessary and proper for a woman to have an abortion if she becomes pregnant unexpectedly. That’s crap. Heck, I managed to complete an Ivy League undergrad degree with an unexpected infant and a law degree with the second somewhat-unexpected infant. Parenting ain’t rocket science.

It’s really a shame that people tell their daughters that if they get pregnant they will never achieve their dreams. I’ve been there and done that, and what do you know: my dreams are alive and well, and well on their way to becoming reality!

alwaysfiredup on May 14, 2010 at 1:30 PM

1. Women have so many contraception available to them today. The idea that sex is the enemy here is ignorant.

2. Please answer me. Why do you think a child is punishment?

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:06 PM

This is exactly right…there are far too many ways NOT to get pregnant in the first place for anyone to claim that she got pregnant “by accident”.

uncivilized on May 14, 2010 at 1:32 PM

The conservative move is about fiscal matters.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

Yes, and abortion organizations get millions from the taxpayer every year and ObamaCare will not only give them more … it’ll actually fund abortions.

Feel free to abort as many children as you want … just do it on your own dime.

darwin on May 14, 2010 at 1:32 PM

AnninCA sounds an awful lot like a woman lashing out due to guilt.

OhioCoastie on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

AnninCa has atleast One son that made it out to live. She is proud of him. I’ve seen her praise him in other posts.

I wonder if he had any siblings?

portlandon on May 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM

I can’t stand the anti-abortionists.

I really can’t.

You’re really all about women not having sex. Admit the truth.

You’d like to kill them with rocks, too, just like the Taliban.

They should be PUNISHED.

I simply can’t abide this type. *ick*

I can understand why you may feel this way. However, like many on your side of this issue, you seem to be very confused.

Being against abortion is not being against women (my wife hates abortion, thinks it’s the greatest crime against humanity ever, would you accuse her of being against women?).

Nor is it against sex. After all, if more people survived rather than got aborted, they would grow up to have sex too, and there would be even more love-making going on. You do have one point though – abortion is supported by men who want to have consequence free sex, and to simply use women as sex objects – which makes pro-abortionists more mysoginist than anti-abortionists!

Every abortion leaves one dead and one wounded. I love every woman, and I want what’s best for them, so if I could, I would steer them away from abortion, and into proper loving relationships, into Christianity, into everything that enriches life (using all my limited powers of persuasion, not of force, in case you want to accuse me of anything).

Also, your reasoning is silly. Christians do not stone anyone, so comparing them to the taliban says more about your ignorance than it makes your point.

Johnny 100 Pesos on May 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM

I think most people are pretty much like me.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

Escaped mental patients?

Sorry, I usually don’t just resort to name calling, but I’m still just laughing over your women-stoning Taliban post!

Heralder on May 14, 2010 at 1:35 PM

Feminist tears sustain me when they cry about the pro-life crowd. Nothing has removed the value of women more than ‘consequence-less’ sex.

Want to get laid without having to treat a woman with any respect? Go to a pro-choice rally.

Inanemergencydial on May 14, 2010 at 1:36 PM

2. Please answer me. Why do you think a child is punishment?

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:06 PM

Because that is what Obama told me.

oldyeller on May 14, 2010 at 1:37 PM

1. Women have so many contraception available to them today. The idea that sex is the enemy here is ignorant.

2. Please answer me. Why do you think a child is punishment?

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:06 PM
This is exactly right…there are far too many ways NOT to get pregnant in the first place for anyone to claim that she got pregnant “by accident”.

uncivilized on May 14, 2010 at 1:32 PM

–Really. Then why did Doctor Zero (or someone else) have an article in the Green Room in the last two weeks on the Pill which suggested that the pill failed about 8% of the time over the course of a year.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:39 PM

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 12:27 PM

And at what age do these women get to make these decisions?

Cindy Munford on May 14, 2010 at 1:40 PM

What I can not comprehend is why people can’t recognize the legitimacy of the pro-life position- even if they disagree with it.

Sackett on May 14, 2010 at 1:03 PM
Well said. I could never understand that either. To argue that it is a necessary evil is one thing. But the argument that abortion in itself is not horrible, I will never understand.

Missy on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

–Let me turn that around. Why can’t the pro-lifers recognize the validity of at least part of what pro-choicers are saying without resorting (at least most of the time on this board) to hatred and name calling.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

Do not be stupid.

Do not think that’s about your other agendas, which includes this issue.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

You’re the only one being stupid here … because you endorse a practice even though no scientific or societal consensus has ever been reached on the point where life becomes HUMAN LIFE.

Please – you can pound the table all you want. You can quote Roe V. Wade and the wisdom of SCOTUS justices (the same way slavers quoted them on Dread Scott) … but the fact is – you can’t define when life becomes human life. We know – scientifically – that at the point of conception THERE IS LIFE THERE. Is it human life? If not – it’s fine to abort but … at what point, Ann, does it become life? You can’t say. You can say what you believe – but what you believe is not what the consensus of society is – and it’s the societal consensus that counts.

It would appear from the polls – that societal consensus is against you. But I’m not even going to stipulate that even though it helps my arguement. I’m just simply going to say that we don’t know when the humanizing point in gestation is and we should – LOGICALLY – not kill that life if we can’t define it as non-human.

Period.

That’s logic Ann – that’s common sense. That’s not Gloria Steinham I know – but you know what? Gloria was a batshirt idiot.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

They should be PUNISHED.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:02 PM

Punish them with a baby.

Daggett on May 14, 2010 at 1:43 PM

–Really. Then why did Doctor Zero (or someone else) have an article in the Green Room in the last two weeks on the Pill which suggested that the pill failed about 8% of the time over the course of a year.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:39 PM

I didn’t read it, but stats on the pill are generally with “perfect” use which doesn’t just mean she takes it every day but that she takes it at the same time everyday.

I will agree that contraceptives aren’t perfect and are directly related to a large number of abortions, but I don’t agree that they make up the majority of them, especially considering the repeat offenders who don’t even bother with birth control, opting instead to use abortion as birth control.

But really, even EC is better despite its potential risks of causing a miscarriage.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:43 PM

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

Because there is no validity in the lazy logic of Pro-Choicers. I’m sorry. At some point life becomes HUMAN LIFE – get back with me when you can define when that point is. Until them – I’m anti-abortion (as all THINKING men and women are).

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:43 PM

We know – scientifically – that at the point of conception THERE IS LIFE THERE. Is it human life?

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

There’s an easy way to find out. Check the DNA. It’s certainly not a beaver, although one might have been involved.

Daggett on May 14, 2010 at 1:45 PM

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM
Because there is no validity in the lazy logic of Pro-Choicers. I’m sorry. At some point life becomes HUMAN LIFE – get back with me when you can define when that point is. Until them – I’m anti-abortion (as all THINKING men and women are).

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:43 PM

-Brain waves, heart beat, ability to feel pain. Defined.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:46 PM

AnninCa has atleast One son that made it out to live. She is proud of him. I’ve seen her praise him in other posts.

I wonder if he had any siblings?

portlandon on May 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM

My guess is yes, but the unfortunate likelihood is that they ended up in the bottom of a bucket marked medical waste.

Roc on May 14, 2010 at 1:46 PM

there are far too many ways NOT to get pregnant in the first place for anyone to claim that she got pregnant “by accident”.

uncivilized on May 14, 2010 at 1:32 PM

Um, no. Accidents still happen. Particularly as we push girls to delay having kids until they are “ready”, generally meaning in their thirties. An eighteen-year-old’s body is begging to procreate, and girls around that age are much more likely to have the Pill fail because their natural hormones can overpower the drug’s hormones.

The better approach would be for government and/or charities to help unmarried mothers and mothers-to-be more, such as giving extra assistance to young parents, helping pregnant girls remain in their school classrooms, and providing unbiased counseling and true information to pregnant girls to help them understand the legal and practical realities of abortion, adoption and motherhood in order to make a truly informed and empowered choice.

alwaysfiredup on May 14, 2010 at 1:47 PM

Google what a baby looks like, and what has developed, at 7 or 8 weeks (where I was when considering an abortion).

AnninCA, you say you loved being a mom.

Speaking from personal experience, the second your baby shoots out (in my case, was cut out), you fall so incredibly in love. For life. After having experienced that, as you say you have, I could never ever support abortion. There are other options.

Being a mother is the hardest job I’ve ever had. It is also the best job I’ve ever had.

surfhut on May 14, 2010 at 1:48 PM

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

Because we hate your morally and intellectually bankrupt position on the issue and because there is little to nothing we can do to stop it.

If you think abortion should be legal, it is and it will likely always be that way. Congratulations

Those of us who hate abortion are not going to accept it and we’re not going to think that pro-choicers are fine people who just happen to have a different opinion.

Not going to happen. You don’t want to catch the heat, stay out of the argument, you have no hope of convincing us that your position is reasonable or moral.

NoDonkey on May 14, 2010 at 1:48 PM

–Let me turn that around. Why can’t the pro-lifers recognize the validity of at least part of what pro-choicers are saying without resorting (at least most of the time on this board) to hatred and name calling.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

It seemed to me that Ann, as a pro-choicer, was the one who started with that in this thread, though I realize I could be mistaken because of my own bias.

That said, when viewing the fetus as a person, obviously the debate changes, and those people are more likely to get heated. That doesn’t excuse it but could explain it, the same way it explains what’s going on against Arizona, especially with people who never read the law.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:48 PM

There’s an easy way to find out. Check the DNA. It’s certainly not a beaver, although one might have been involved.

Daggett on May 14, 2010 at 1:45 PM

I would tend to agree with you on this.

To me, it’s logical that HUMAN life begins at conception – because that life was produced by two humans – it’s DNA is completely human. So if I were making this arguement – I could make a very fine one by saying that life begins at conception – and my arguement would never be inconsistent no matter the scenario involved.

However – others might say that life begins at birth – but then, where’s the logic there and how does a born baby differ from one that is about to be born in five minutes? Some would say that it’s human life when there is a heartbeat – well, most of the aborted fetuses today have a heartbeat.

Pro-Choice folks … and really they aren’t pro-choice these are the same people that don’t want you eating transfats – they are really PRO-ABORTIONISTS … are completely illogical and stupid people. I’m sorry – but they are because their arguments for abortion are easily torn to shreads with the simplist of logic.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:50 PM

Want to get laid without having to treat a woman with any respect? Go to a pro-choice rally.

Inanemergencydial on May 14, 2010 at 1:36 PM

I thought the punch line was stand outside an abortion clinic.

Holger on May 14, 2010 at 1:51 PM

-Brain waves, heart beat, ability to feel pain. Defined.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:46 PM

Then that excludes about 90 percent of the abortions we’re actually performing today.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:51 PM

The better approach would be for government and/or charities to help unmarried mothers and mothers-to-be more, such as giving extra assistance to young parents, helping pregnant girls remain in their school classrooms, and providing unbiased counseling and true information to pregnant girls to help them understand the legal and practical realities of abortion, adoption and motherhood in order to make a truly informed and empowered choice.

alwaysfiredup on May 14, 2010 at 1:47 PM

I support this but would take out the “and/or” choice and just make it charities. It’s a shame that pro-lifers tend to focus more on stopping abortion than helping women in those situations.

I’ve talked about doing something myself but have no excuse for why I’ve actually done nothing. If ever actually presented with a direct opportunity to help though, I would.

Esthier on May 14, 2010 at 1:52 PM

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:41 PM

Because we hate your morally and intellectually bankrupt position on the issue and because there is little to nothing we can do to stop it.

If you think abortion should be legal, it is and it will likely always be that way. Congratulations

Those of us who hate abortion are not going to accept it and we’re not going to think that pro-choicers are fine people who just happen to have a different opinion.

Not going to happen. You don’t want to catch the heat, stay out of the argument, you have no hope of convincing us that your position is reasonable or moral.

NoDonkey on May 14, 2010 at 1:48 PM

–Good. Then there’s no point in my giving you any respect–or consideration for any of your views–in return, is there.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:53 PM

I think most people are pretty much like me.

OK, no federal funds. After that, stay out and shut up.

AnninCA on May 14, 2010 at 1:29 PM

I disagree. They may think they are like that, and they may say they are like that, but once you see the ultrasound of that tiny little being growing in the uterus of someone you are close to, it changes everything. You know this is a baby, not a “fetus” – in fact, women put those pictures in the baby books as their baby’s first picture.

Queen0fCups on May 14, 2010 at 1:54 PM

Brain waves, heart beat, ability to feel pain. Defined.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:46 PM
Then that excludes about 90 percent of the abortions we’re actually performing today.

HondaV65 on May 14, 2010 at 1:51 PM

–That would cover only about 2% of them. Pro-life scientists have said pain is only felt around the twentieth week at the earliest.

Jimbo3 on May 14, 2010 at 1:54 PM

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