Hey, let’s build a mosque at Ground Zero; Update: 9/11 families oppose
posted at 4:25 pm on May 14, 2010 by Allahpundit
“So, in the ruins of a building reduced to rubble in the name of Islam,” writes Mark Steyn, “a temple to Islam will arise.” Indeed. And yet, as repulsive as this is, so ingeniously does it exploit liberal pieties about multiculturalism that I almost want to congratulate the people behind it for their canniness. You know exactly how this debate’s going to go. If we don’t let them build it, we’re blaming all Muslims for the actions of the tiny minority who espouse etc etc, so let’s strike a blow for tolerance instead and greenlight a mega-mosque at the site of the world’s most famous pit of Koranically inspired human misery. Think of it as a way for peaceful Muslims to contribute to rebuilding lower Manhattan, not as … a triumphalist icon that’s going to give every jihadist fanatic in the universe an orgasm when he hears about it.
Scheduled opening date: 9/11/11. To show solidarity with America, you see.
Plans to bring what one critic calls a “monster mosque” to the site of the old Burlington Coat Factory building, at a cost expected to top $100 million, moved along for months without a peep. All of a sudden, even members of the community board that stupidly green-lighted the mosque this month are tearing their hair out.
Paul Sipos, member of Community Board 1, said a mosque is a fine idea — someplace else.
“If the Japanese decided to open a cultural center across from Pearl Harbor, that would be insensitive,” Sipos told me. “If the Germans opened a Bach choral society across from Auschwitz, even after all these years, that would be an insensitive setting. I have absolutely nothing against Islam. I just think: Why there?“…
Called Cordoba House, the mosque and center is the brainchild of the American Society for Muslim Advancement. Executive director Daisy Khan insists it’s staying put.
“For us, it’s a symbol, a platform that will give voice to the silent majority of Muslims who suffer at the hands of extremists. A center will show that Muslims will be part of rebuilding lower Manhattan,” said Khan, adding that Cordoba will be open to everyone.
Says Ace, “Someone who cared for what the dhimmi thought at all would recognize this as singularly, incandescently inappropriate.” My hunch is that we’re going to end up playing a game with the left about this, as even though most of them won’t admit it, the obvious provocation here will bug many of them too. (Especially lefty New Yorkers.) They’ll tut-tut about wingnut overreaction and tolerance and so forth because that’s just how they roll, but secretly plenty of them will be perfectly fine with conservatives kicking up a media fuss until the mosque is forced to relocate. Further to that end, here’s a fun tidbit from Pajamas Media about Faisal Abdul Rauf, the mosque’s developer:
Rauf has often directly contradicted his seemingly tolerant and peace-loving pronouncements with harsh, antagonistic assessments of the U.S. In his May 7 Khutbah (Muslim sabbath sermon), delivered at 1:00 p.m. at 45 Park Place in Manhattan, Rauf implied that Muslims did not perpetrate 9/11 at all, according to writer Madeline Brooks, who attended (26): “Some people say it was Muslims who attacked on 9/11 … ” he stated, before trailing off into another topic.
He also expressed this view in an interview with 60 Minutes aired on Sept. 30, 2001 as well (27):
The attacks were “a reaction against the U.S. government politically, where we espouse principles of democracy and human rights, [yet] … ally ourselves with oppressive regimes in many of these countries. … [U.S.] policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.
If he doesn’t think Muslims were responsible, why’s he so keen to build at Ground Zero? Add that query to the media fuss, please. Exit question: Every major politician in New York State, from Schumer and Gillibrand on down, objects to holding the KSM trial here because it’s a security risk. Any worries that a giant new mosque at Ground Zero might also, perhaps, pose a security risk given what a powerful symbolic draw it’ll be for triumphalist radicals?
Update: The media fuss cometh. One footnote: Apparently it’s not a mosque but rather a cultural center which includes prayer space, among other functions. Which changes nothing.
“I think that it is incredibly insensitive and audacious really for them to build a mosque, not only on that site, but to do it specifically so that they could be in proximity to where that atrocity happened,” said Burlingame, who is co-founder of 9/11 Families for a Safe and Strong America…
Rauf insists the effort is meant to help heal the wounds of 9/11, “We’ve approached the community because we want this to be an example of how we are cooperating with the members of the community, not only to provide services but also to build a new discourse on how Muslims and non-Muslims can cooperate together to push back against the voices of extremism.”
But Dr. Zuhdi Jasser, president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy, says there are more productive ways to fight Islamic extremism.
“Even when they have the resources, they are using it for a place of worship, a cultural center for organizations,” he said. They are not using it for a counterterrorism research center.
If this is all about “healing the wounds,” then presumably there’ll be no objection to moving the center if the public makes clear that it doesn’t want to be “healed” in this particular way, right?









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If you understood the war on terror, you’d know that GWOT (or whatever the hell we call it presently) is also a war of ideas and information. Propaganda victories such as this are great for Islamist recruitment. Ultimately the war will be won or lost on this front, and not on a distant battlefield.
Shock the Monkey on May 14, 2010 at 5:21 PM
This is exactly what I said to my husband.
speed911 on May 14, 2010 at 5:22 PM
A Proposed Constitutional Amendment.
Rebar on May 14, 2010 at 5:23 PM
YYZ on May 14, 2010 at 4:50 PM
OT: Are you from Toronto or a Rush fan (or both)?
cableguy615 on May 14, 2010 at 5:23 PM
Hey, let’s build a Catholic Church in Mecca.
What would the Saudis say to THAT, since 12 of the 19 9/11 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia?
Steve Z on May 14, 2010 at 5:23 PM
No words to describe this atrocity. Are the people of NY this clueless?
cmsinaz on May 14, 2010 at 5:25 PM
This is a slap in the face
Kini on May 14, 2010 at 5:25 PM
Don’t be so hard on AP. As an omega male, he has to be all sensitive and stuff….
Master Shake on May 14, 2010 at 5:26 PM
Have you ever lived in a Muslim country? I doubt it. Don’t spout off about things you know nothing about.
I doubt you have even traveled outside of the US.
Pathetic.
tetriskid on May 14, 2010 at 5:27 PM
TAQIYYA Anyone?
ontherocks on May 14, 2010 at 5:28 PM
This tard doesn’t even know that it was not just New Yorkers who died on those flights that hit WTC. or the Pentagon and Shanksville.
Each and everyone on those 4 flights died.
macncheez on May 14, 2010 at 5:28 PM
F#$K NO!!!!! My cousin was one of the first fire fighters to die there that day…..I don’t care WHO they think they are or what cr@p they espouse about memorializing…..THEY WILL NOT DISRESPECT HIS OR ANYONE ELSE’S MEMORY with this cr@p! I would love to say more…but I would be banned.
sicoit on May 14, 2010 at 5:30 PM
They keep electing Bloomberg , don’t they ?
macncheez on May 14, 2010 at 5:31 PM
Lets call it “The ernesto Center for Multicultural Bullshit”.
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 5:32 PM
AMEN TO THAT!! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR This just makes my blood boil, eyes bleeding, head about to explode…
sicoit on May 14, 2010 at 5:33 PM
The day people stop using perceived (aka imagined) slights for jingoism and paranoid xenophobia, I’ll gladly ignore anything and everything pertaining to the state of Arizona.
I’ve never commented on it.
Either way, you’re all still imagining this insult; the mosque isn’t even being built at Ground Zero. What you should all be saying, is no more mosques…because that’s what you’re really after. So go out, shout it from the rooftops…NO MORE MOSQUES!
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 5:34 PM
Weren’t several dozen Muslims among those who were killed by the terrorists?
dedalus on May 14, 2010 at 5:34 PM
See the UNs “Alliance of Civilizations” which Obama just signed the US to join.
Skywise on May 14, 2010 at 5:35 PM
Oh, goody. From now on you won’t be insulted by the Tea Partiers, since you’ve never been to one; by the Arizona immigration law, since you’re not from Arizona; or by the DADT policy, since you’re not in the military.
Right, Ernie?
Grace_is_sufficient on May 14, 2010 at 5:35 PM
The biggest tell on the real motive behind this is the expected opening date. Talk about adding insult to injury…
ProfessorMiao on May 14, 2010 at 5:36 PM
Macncheez: point taken
*sigh*
cmsinaz on May 14, 2010 at 5:36 PM
Do you even realize how stupid, how absolutely void of reason, this comment is?
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 5:36 PM
When those “cave dwellers” chop your empty head off, you won’t be able to worry about those “billion more important things”.
A commenter said, on column 1 that “darkness is when there is no light, in ernesto’s case when he’s asleep”…should have said “when his ‘brain’ is empty”.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:36 PM
Gadflies are indignant.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:38 PM
Several dozens ? really ?
hahahahahhaha
Its called collateral damage in persuit of the caliphate, its in the koran , read it
macncheez on May 14, 2010 at 5:38 PM
For the time being, I’d settle for NO MORE ERNESTO!
Master Shake on May 14, 2010 at 5:39 PM
YES!!!!! :-)
speed911 on May 14, 2010 at 5:39 PM
Ernesto, don’t you think you should be apologizing for calling all Muslims “cave-dwellers”?
Xenophobic bigot!
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 5:40 PM
He’s in a tunnel and the bullet train is after him.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:40 PM
No way, Scooter-Pie. You don’t live in Arizona, therefore, by your own standard, you have nothing to say about their laws. Live by your own sword, little man.
speed911 on May 14, 2010 at 5:42 PM
A commenter said, on column 1 that “darkness is when there is no light, in ernesto’s case when he’s asleep”…should have said “when his ‘brain’ is empty”.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:36 PM
???
I said “when his eyes are closed”…as in closing one’s eyes to the light…as in deliberate ignorance.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 5:42 PM
Just had to fix it. I think this whole mosque idea is a ploy to make a white domestic terrorist. You have to know that there are some Americans who would never tolerate this insult. Just remember back to the days after 9/11 when the skies were quiet and the interstates were full of trucks doing mercy missions to NYC.
I just don’t believe that all Americans have the same boiling point.
platypus on May 14, 2010 at 5:42 PM
I have yet to discern the difference between the political and terrorist wing of hamas, taliban, al-Qa’ida, Hezbollah ect., ect., ect.,………………………
Johan Klaus on May 14, 2010 at 5:43 PM
Knock it. Only Nazis would call them “cave dwellers”.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:43 PM
I wasn’t aware bombs were used in the 9/11 attacks in New York. Care to enlighten us?
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 5:43 PM
Del Dlemonte, first trade center attach? bomb?
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:45 PM
attach = attack
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 5:47 PM
Not surprised but this is really sad and horrible.
deidre on May 14, 2010 at 5:47 PM
The parts I’ve read have been a waste of time, and it’s not a relevant consideration in honoring the people who died.
The state of NY should get it’s act together and finish the ground zero development, including the permanent memorial.
dedalus on May 14, 2010 at 5:47 PM
Are you an illegal alien?
Johan Klaus on May 14, 2010 at 5:48 PM
I would say more likely, since this will be a draw for radical Muslims the world over. More radical fanatics in the city = more likelihood some of them will do mischief.
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 5:49 PM
Yes, including a woman and her unborn child on Flight 11. And several who worked at Cantor Fitzgerald.
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 5:51 PM
Elighten you, maybe.
Do you know what a bomb is? Do you know what a bomb does?
Of course you do. So, realize your mistake, and move on.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 5:51 PM
Please read my question again. I wasn’t referring to the 1993 attack.
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 5:53 PM
Let’s see, 10 years after 9/11 a mosque will be built with a grand opening. But the actual ground zero memorial, still working on it. Pathetic that those causing the delays can’t get their act together. Shameful that a mosque on that site was even given approval. When are the people of NYC going to come together to protest this?
texasconserv on May 14, 2010 at 5:55 PM
What mistake?
If anything, the planes that hit the WTC were missiles.
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 5:58 PM
Not fighting you. I understood you the first time. Just a reminder that there was a bomb; plus, the planes were the bombs. No worries, we’re on the same side.
Schadenfreude on May 14, 2010 at 6:01 PM
its easier to get the mosque built
with the huge reconstruction at the GZ site, there are leases to deal with
insurance issues
then frankly visionary issues. it aint right but thats what it is
bad economy doesn’t help either, i wonder what the tenant prospects are
blatantblue on May 14, 2010 at 6:01 PM
Actually if the entire site were declared a historic site I think the government(ie: We The People) could have a say in what was built there.
We need a movement to declare the most expensive land in downtown NYC a Historic National Park. Or State Park, like Central park is. You couldn’t build anything in Central Park. So there are places you can’t build a church.
Okay, I have a tinge of conscience with my attempt to subvert the Bill of Rights in this way. Religion can’t be interfered with… but this is not opposing a religion, it is preventing an insult, and frankly a propaganda tool for the violent radical members of that Faith.
Do they really want to call it Cordoba? Because that is the clue that this particular Mosque has a jprimary purpose other than religious. Calling it Cordoba is a political statement.
In truth, if the land weren’t so valuable it probably would have been made a protected Park of some kind.
petunia on May 14, 2010 at 6:03 PM
I beg to differ. This didn’t just hit New York. It affected an entire nation, even world. Would you tell all those who generously donated in the name of victims of 9/11 to buzz off, if they were compelled to donate again, if God forbid another attack came to NYC? Would you tell all those family members of victims from other nations to buzz off, if they felt the need to voice themselves either in favor, or opposed to this?
The world doesn’t revolve around New York, but when it counts, the rest of the world stood with New York. Now tell everyone again….to buzz off.
capejasmine on May 14, 2010 at 6:04 PM
I was born in the Bronx, to American born parents.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:05 PM
Sure, just as soon as we can build a “Sword of Joshua Independent Full Gospel Pentecostal Assembly” megachurch in Mecca. (Listeners to the John Boy and Billy show will know what I mean. ;)
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:05 PM
Several does not make several dozen!
Johan Klaus on May 14, 2010 at 6:06 PM
Maybe they could include a center for the study of jumbo shrimp too, each would require voluminous libraries, and ironically it’s the same kind of oxymoron as islamic culture.
And hey, maybe we could get some visiting mullahs from iran, and really get to the bottom of that whole earthquake/volcano/female dress conundrum.
ontherocks on May 14, 2010 at 6:06 PM
Even if the entire site were made a protected landmark (which would require board approval to so much as change a light fixture), it still wouldn’t prevent this, as this mosque isn’t being built at Ground Zero!
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:07 PM
A bomb is any explosive device, which the impact and fuel were. A missile is an object that is propelled through the air.
The plane was used as a guided missile to explode a bomb. This is plain and simple logic. I find it a little odd to be arguing about it.
Please, we all make innocent mistakes, just realize that you are wrong in this case.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 6:10 PM
First of all, that’s not a response to what I wrote.
Second of all, Toronto’s not a s—hole. It’s just not.
YYZ on May 14, 2010 at 6:11 PM
Yeah! What would the people of New York know about the impact of 9/11. Don’t they understand?!
YYZ on May 14, 2010 at 6:13 PM
Agreed. It’s more like a bowl of vanilla ice cream. ;)
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:13 PM
Ernesto, the Muslims whom you insulted are awaiting their apology.
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 6:16 PM
Sorry to break it to you Upper Canadian…it is.
Caper29 on May 14, 2010 at 6:17 PM
But I have been to one…
Anyway, I think its a fair deal. Y’all can stop using things that happen in NY that have nothing to do with you as a way to expound your obnoxious jingoism and paranoia, and I’ll do the same over Arizona, DADT, or anything else that has nothing to do with me (though as a tea party attendee I reserve the right to comment on it). Deal? Any takers?? Up for only using your own towns and cities for paranoid jingoism??
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:17 PM
Cordoba…ha!
r keller on May 14, 2010 at 6:18 PM
I said getting into propaganda wars with cave dwellers…you kno, Al Qaeda. I wouldn’t even accept the premise that we’re in a propaganda war with muslims…nice try though.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:18 PM
But wearing an American flag t-shirt on Cinco de Mayo is incendiary.
The Ugly American on May 14, 2010 at 6:20 PM
I’m not aware that New Yorkers have contributed anything directly to my own town. Not aware that they even give a shit about my own town, for that matter.
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:20 PM
Weak.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 6:20 PM
Do We Deserve a Mosque at Ground Zero?
We plug our ears, drowning out our better judgment with counsel from apologists for Islam, flimflam men who, like carnival hawkers, are adept at misdirecting attention away from the Islamic doctrinal motivations behind what is a global jihad, waged both openly (violently) and more subtly, to advance the influence of Sharia in the world. Indeed, we become apologists and flimflam men, too. Or maybe we just don’t care. “If it’s legal, the building owners have a right to do what they want,” said a spokesman for New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg.
If it’s “legal”? What if it mocks the dead?
Maybe we deserve such a mosque at Ground Zero. It will serve as the perfect monument to post-9/11 America, a shining reproach to a nation that long ago capitulated through loss, or worse, absence of will.
MB4 on May 14, 2010 at 6:21 PM
Well then when the evil muslims come build a mosque on your Ground Zero or torn down church or whatever the hell would make you indignant, then you can use it as a way to justify jingoistic nonsense.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:22 PM
OK, suddenly it’s a New York-only matter. I don’t recall that donations etc were accepted only from New Yorkers during that time.
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:23 PM
Has it still not dawned on any of you that this mosque isn’t being built on, at, or overlooking Ground Zero?
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:23 PM
This is utterly unconscionable.
Midas on May 14, 2010 at 6:24 PM
Propaganda is when you define the single most definable characteristic of Al Queda “cave” dwelling.
Interesting.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 6:25 PM
How would you describe the location, assuming you know where it is?
exception on May 14, 2010 at 6:25 PM
No, the plane was used as a guided missile. There were no “bombs” aboard the planes, just the fuel used to propel them. That fuel exploded on impact.
Curiously, I just checked wiki’s entry for the word “bomb”. The airplanes used in the 9/11 attacks are not mentioned at all.
Do a Google search on “9/11 bombs” and all you find are Truther theories. Ditto with a Google search for “9/11 bombing”
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 6:27 PM
Its 2 blocks north. Thats 2 full blocks of office towers separating Ground Zero from 45 Park Place, which is the lot they bought. There are literally multiple gigantic buildings standing between this lot and Ground Zero…you cannot see this place from Ground Zero, or even a block away from Ground Zero.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:29 PM
Oh, and then there are the 9/11 plane bomb theories.
I’ll leave the 9/11 bomb bit to Ron Paul.
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 6:30 PM
Where do you find 7 WTC?
exception on May 14, 2010 at 6:30 PM
If I see or hear the inanity “radicals”, as in “radical” Islam, one more time I am going to scream!!!
The “radicals” in Islam are the apostates – the good guys.
The terrorists, in fast motion, and in slow motion, are the followers of the murdering, torturing, raping, lying, terrorist pedophile Mohammad, Islam’s “Perfect Man”, so how can they be the “radicals”?
Good Lord!, why is this simple and clear fact so hard for some to grasp?
MB4 on May 14, 2010 at 6:30 PM
One think we know for sure – Allahpundit is not really Allen West.
MB4 on May 14, 2010 at 6:32 PM
Come to think of it, I may be mistaken, but I don’t think it was only New Yorkers who were called to action in Afghanistan in the aftermath.
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:33 PM
On the northern end of Ground Zero…still on Vesey St…still a full 2 blocks, with giant buildings in between from 45 Park Place.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:36 PM
Which would perfectly explain how the 13 story building where the mosque will be was damaged by airplane debris on 9/11? It never reopened due to all the damage.
Del Dolemonte on May 14, 2010 at 6:36 PM
You know what I would like to do?
Nuke Mecca and then after the radiation dies down build a Church, a Synagogue and a Hindu Temple at the site.
Reciprocity.
MB4 on May 14, 2010 at 6:37 PM
But only Meccans will have a right to complain, of course.
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:38 PM
When debris is falling from 80 or 90 stories up, it travels. When you’re standing at ground level, all you can see from 45 Park Place is the gigantic building in front of it, or down Park Place in either direction…which runs east to west, not north to south.
This mosque won’t be at Ground Zero.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:40 PM
I would have said, nuke it again for good measure, but that works too.
Inanemergencydial on May 14, 2010 at 6:40 PM
Nowhere in your insulting comment did you mention… you kno(sic)… Al Qaeda. Nice try at misdirection though.
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 6:40 PM
So, you understand that 45 Park Place is two blocks to the north of the south face of 7 WTC. Do you also understand that it is only one block away from the north face?
Now, how far is 45 Park Place from any building permanently ruined in the attacks?
exception on May 14, 2010 at 6:40 PM
Nowhere in your insulting comment did you mention… you kno(sic)… Al Qaeda. Nice try at misdirection though.
So, are you saying that Al Qaeda are the ones building the mosque? Or are you just trying to weasel out your obvious hypocrisy being exposed?
hillbillyjim on May 14, 2010 at 6:42 PM
OK, to hell with it. Build it. You’d get more worked up about a new NRA building.
ddrintn on May 14, 2010 at 6:44 PM
Fuel exploded by impact, or by any other means of ignition, intentional or not, is a bomb. The key here is “explosion”.
A missile is technically not a bomb, but is often referred to as one. A missile can be a rock, an arrow, or a plane, as long as it is propelled above the ground in some fashion.
The planes were bombs upon impact. They were also guided missiles in that they were propelled through the air and were steered.
Bomb
Guided Missile
As to your reference to “Truthers” in our discussion, I’ve made no reference to bombs other than the planes. Totally uncalled for.
Saltysam on May 14, 2010 at 6:45 PM
For the same reasons that 52% of the voters “thought” that the manchurian muslim was the “hope and change” we needed in ’08.
Some people just believe what they’re told, and others “think” things that make them feel good about themselves, like the always foolish ernesto.
But I know you already knew that MB4.
ontherocks on May 14, 2010 at 6:46 PM
New Yorkers acted stupidly.
faraway on May 14, 2010 at 6:46 PM
I’ll tell you right now, this will not stand (for long)…
Just let em try it.
golfmann on May 14, 2010 at 6:46 PM
What makes you say that? I love guns.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:47 PM
Well, two is multiple, and that is the correct number, except for 7WTC. How many buildings between 7 and 45? That’s a trick question. It’s one, if you count 30 West Broadway. But it is being deconstructed due to being ruined in the attacks.
Do you really not see why people in New York City are displeased by this?
exception on May 14, 2010 at 6:48 PM
This is of a piece with New York’s Moronocracy’s inability to build anything on Ground Zero, now going on ten years after the fact. With decisions like these, one of these days we’ll wake up and wonder whatever happened to New York City. It’s fate is like that of Detroit.
EMD on May 14, 2010 at 6:51 PM
I don’t see why people who aren’t from here are displeased. I can understand why people here are displeased, though there’s nothing they can do about it.
Its just that this whole thing is being used to compound this insane theory that some muslim conspiracy is working in NY real estate to win some glorious propaganda victory for islam. That’s just f*cking bonkers. People are turning this into fuel for obnoxious jingoism and paranoia…that’s what I’m taking issue with.
ernesto on May 14, 2010 at 6:52 PM
Has NYC turned into France? Is this surrender?
faraway on May 14, 2010 at 6:53 PM
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