Keep hope alive: Space, Matheson both voting no
posted at 8:46 pm on March 20, 2010 by Allahpundit
Matheson’s the guy whose brother was nominated to the federal bench on the very day he met with The One about health care. He was a no before … and he’s a no now. Space was yes before, but suddenly he’s a no too — and a hard no judging by his statement, i.e. not one liable to flip back tomorrow. All of which is perfectly dull and predictable if you assume that Pelosi has already made it to 216 and beyond and is simply looking to cut loose a few red-district Democrats to vote no at the eleventh hour.
We’re told that this wasn’t a surprise to Speaker Pelosi but that she didn’t release him to vote no either, as sometimes happens late in the game when the leadership knows it has enough votes and can spare some to protect vulnerable incumbents.
I don’t know how else to read that except as an admission that she doesn’t have the votes. I’m shocked to be saying it, but if TPM is right, this really isn’t over. Yet.
The Firedoglake whip count had it at 204-206 earlier this afternoon with 21 undecided, including Matheson and 10 members of Stupak’s bloc. Matheson’s no makes it 204-207 but some Stupakers have been peeling away, so assume they split evenly and you’re at 209-212 with 10 on the fence to decide it. Stupak himself claimed a few hours ago that Pelosi was still four votes short, but as I’m writing this, there are rumors that Glenn Nye and Kurt Schrader are both voting yes. Nye was expected to, but Schrader was a potential yes-to-no flip.
Dude, I’m nervous.
Update: Actually, it’s possible that Space made his intentions known to Pelosi ages ago and she wrote him off as not worth pursuing. That would allow for a scenario where she has the votes but never formally releases Space. But if that’s what happened here, why did Space wait to the last minute to announce his no? If it was set in stone last week, no reason to keep quiet.
Update: NRO says this “still isn’t nailed down,” but it sounds like the final stumbling block may be some sort of executive order about abortion to bring the Stupakers on board. And the pro-choicers are apparently okay with it. Gulp.
Update: Hold the phone — sounds like Nye isn’t a yes (yet) after all.
Blowback
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There’s nothing to be nervous about. If a guy came up to you holding a ballpoint pen and said … “Hey, see this pen? I’m gonna destroy your SOUL with this pen!”
Would you be nervous about that guy? No – you wouldn’t – you’d laugh at him.
And it’s the same with this. The Democrats are going to Nationalize Health Care? With who’s money? No one has any money anymore. No matter how much they want to do this – they can’t pay for it. No matter how much they wish otherwise – it COSTS money. No money – no nationalized health care. It’ll take a few years to get us there – but we’ll get there.
And all these pundits who are scared the economy will improve the Democratic Party’s chances …
Not happening … you can’t “waive” or “Pass and Deem” laws of physics. A nation going bankrupt doesn’t have a booming economy. This bill just makes us go bankrupt quicker.
Look … it’s like this … things get sorted out one way or another. If we can’t elect politicians to fix things and keep our government running in the black – then we go into the red and go bankrupt. When that happens – everyone gets fired and a new crowd takes control … just like Russia. A few people get shot and a new crowd takes over.
We’ve come to this point in America … or will be soon.
So be ready when it happens – because we don’t want a PUTIN in charge of us. It’ll be an opportunity to return to the roots of the American Revolution and put this train back on the baseline … as the founders intended it. We may have to fight for it – like they did. So what? Who said we were owed peaceful lives? Our founders didn’t have peaceful lives and they were better men and women than we are. Maybe the ordeal will make us all better men and women.
One thing I know – I will never live under a Socialist Health Care system for more than a few years before the bank goes bust.
This is reality. This is fact.
HondaV65 on March 20, 2010 at 10:33 PM
NumberTwo on March 20, 2010 at 10:33 PM
N.T., I ♥ U!
Mary in LA on March 20, 2010 at 10:34 PM
Well, I mean, it was one hell of an earthquake, ya know…?
Dopenstrange on March 20, 2010 at 10:34 PM
Thank goodness. I can rest easy tonight knowing the poor Hawaiian earthquake victims will be able to afford the finest huts FEMA can buy.
Lily on March 20, 2010 at 10:35 PM
Wow. We are neighbors. What a small world.
Nye does look shiny and new. He sent out that email a few days ago, but his staffers are stonewalling on how he’ll vote. I’m calling again tomorrow.
conservative pilgrim on March 20, 2010 at 10:36 PM
I am heading that way next month, I’ll let you know. Have you lived in Virginia before?
Cindy Munford on March 20, 2010 at 10:40 PM
Nye is a no?
http://twitter.com/MPOTheHill/status/10800913990
KeepOhioRed on March 20, 2010 at 10:43 PM
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 10:43 PM
tatersalad—
Interesting article. Not flattering at all to Obama. Seems like Politico is trying to prop up Pelosi while simultaneously pushing her off the edge of the cliff. I can’t imagine Rahm enjoyed her “Kiddie Care” jab. haha
We’ll know tomorrow if this is an obit for Nancy.
conservative pilgrim on March 20, 2010 at 10:43 PM
If I never see, hear or read the word CHANGE again, it will be too soon.
Mr_Magoo on March 20, 2010 at 10:46 PM
Cindy—
No, this is our first time living in the area. The closest we’ve lived to here has been Raleigh.
conservative pilgrim on March 20, 2010 at 10:46 PM
You remind me of Manlyrash during the 08 election. He was calm and confident mccain had it in the bag…he has never posted again on HA.
You make an excellent point though…and that has brought me some much needed solace.
joepub on March 20, 2010 at 10:48 PM
Cindy–I just looked up that area on mapquest. That is a stone’s throw from our house. Wow. Just out the back gate.
conservative pilgrim on March 20, 2010 at 10:48 PM
Nye is a no
Bobbertsan on March 20, 2010 at 10:49 PM
Per NRO… Nye is a NO
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 10:49 PM
WOW! The Nye No is BIG.
brewcrew67 on March 20, 2010 at 10:49 PM
What’s up with Slaughter’s eyeliner?
SouthernGent on March 20, 2010 at 10:54 PM
Thanks for the link! The TRICARE issue came out yesterday (I think). That’s huge for military families.
That’s good news. Goodnight all!
conservative pilgrim on March 20, 2010 at 10:54 PM
***
I seem to be missing something here. Why does it matter if there is a so-called reconciliation bill? It just looks like more Kabuki theater to me.
***
The Senate already passed the Obamacare bill on Christmas Eve–their “present” to the American Taxpayers. If the House changes one word in this bill then doesn’t it have to be sent to the house for a revote?
***
The previously passed Senate bill will just be voted on as it stands. Then Comrade Obama (PBUH) will sign it into law, declare a victory, and move on to the Shamnesty and C(r)ap and Trade bills. Why should He, SanFranNan, or Dirty Harry do anything else stupid–like try to modify the Senate bill? Or by trying “reconciliation”? Ninety five percent of what you really want is a solid A+ anywhere. No SCOTUS challanges could occur this way.
***
John Bibb
***
rocketman on March 20, 2010 at 10:59 PM
I think she had a ballgame scheduled for this afternoon.
Sue on March 20, 2010 at 11:00 PM
It’s old, she got it from her dead constituent’s sister.
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 11:02 PM
I miss that guy! He was witty and fun to have around. Maybe he’s posting under a different nic?
Mary in LA on March 20, 2010 at 11:03 PM
ROFL! :-D
What do you say to a Representative with two shiners?
Nothing — we already told her twice!
Mary in LA on March 20, 2010 at 11:04 PM
Good stuff. +10
Dopenstrange on March 20, 2010 at 11:05 PM
It matches her teeth!
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 11:07 PM
The Chicago Way?
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 11:08 PM
I didn’t know manlyrash – and I’m not saying the Dems won’t pass this bill – I’m leaning toward thinking they will do it.
What I’m saying is … they don’t have the money to implement this and their attempts to GET the money will result in economic destruction for this nation. We’re headed there now anyway with Medicare, Social Security, and Prescription Drugs. This new ObamaCare will simply accelerate the process of bankruptcy.
And another thing they haven’t calculated is they aren’t preserving any of our economic resources for an inevitable international calamity like … oh, says the bursting of the Chinese economic bubble … or perhaps Iran starting a nuclear war in the middle east … or AQ getting ahold of more jets and crashing them into buildings like 9-11.
They’re setting us up for a “perfect storm” … one that we won’t be able to respond to because we’re broke – everything costs money.
Why worry about it though? It’ll be hell for sure but I won’t have to listen to Obama telling me not to put salt on my food or telling me to go to this doctor or that one … that I can assure you.
HondaV65 on March 20, 2010 at 11:13 PM
If I recall, he lost a bet..something along the lines that if McCain lost he would stop posting
bluejacket on March 20, 2010 at 11:13 PM
Oh! Bummer. :-( Thanks for the explanation.
Mary in LA on March 20, 2010 at 11:15 PM
This vote will also identify any Democrat (Socialist) that still has cajones.
Mojave Mark on March 20, 2010 at 11:15 PM
I hope you like it, lots to do. I hope I can run into you while I am there. It would be fun to fill you in.
Cindy Munford on March 20, 2010 at 11:17 PM
I saw this on Drudge and followed the links. I hope this means something to Cao, Stupak and friends…
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/u.s._bishops_final_plea_to_congressmen_do_not_pass_pro-abortion_health_care_bill/
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/louisiana_bishops_denials_that_senate_health_care_bill_funds_abortion_are_mistaken/
Eren on March 20, 2010 at 11:19 PM
http://www.rollcall.com/news/44440-1.html
Saucy!
NY Times has her as a yes.
Proud Rino on March 20, 2010 at 11:29 PM
Add Nye to Matheson and Space and the math for them is nearly impossible.
But it is Loretta Sanchez who amuses me most. May be the smartest Dem on the Hill. She bolted Friday. She’s fundraising in Florida and wont return phone calls. she;s avoiding the Dem leadership.
She may not even come back for a vote.
swamp_yankee on March 20, 2010 at 11:31 PM
Per NRO – Kaptur doesn’t like the executive order idea…. Maybe they don’t have the votes?
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 11:34 PM
Also funny that she’s fundraising in Florida and she’s a rep in Cali. Not that that stuff doesn’t happen all the time, but, oof, not the best weekend to be doing it, Loretta.
That’s pretty much the stupidest thing she could do.
Proud Rino on March 20, 2010 at 11:35 PM
Space lives in a gerrymandered (sp?) district – basically every county went for McCain. He got elected because his predecessor got entangled in the Abramoff mess. I was surprised he voted “yes” the first go round.
bluejacket on March 20, 2010 at 11:38 PM
This is why I am drinking….
lovingmyUSA on March 20, 2010 at 11:38 PM
If you’re reading what I’m reading, she’s just speculating that she doesn’t think it will bring the whole Stupak group on board. But they don’t need the whole Stupak group.
Proud Rino on March 20, 2010 at 11:38 PM
We’re about 10 miles too far west to be in Nye’s district, for which we are grateful.
CJ on March 20, 2010 at 11:41 PM
Trying to keep hope alive!
kringeesmom on March 20, 2010 at 11:42 PM
Praying that this will be the metaphor of the day tomorrow!
bluejacket on March 20, 2010 at 11:50 PM
Indeed. The Limbaugh/Levin strategy may be setting in. “Lookit, you people are passing the Senate bill, and that’s gonna be that”
Might make some House Democrats think twice. Probably not, but it might.
forest on March 20, 2010 at 11:59 PM
They’re calling in Clinton!
http://gatewaypundit.firstthings.com/2010/03/pelosi-still-scrambling-for-votes-bill-clinton-making-calls/
They don’t have the votes.
KSgop on March 21, 2010 at 12:00 AM
That summarizes their goal as well as any…
The whole point of what the Obama/Dem’s are engaged in, right there ^^.
Lourdes on March 21, 2010 at 12:04 AM
I read somewhere that an Executive Order wouldn’t work on this snyway, but I can’t recall why.
Deanna on March 21, 2010 at 12:06 AM
Honda is right. And we need more voices of reason like him around here these days.
I was pretty sure McCain was going to lose, Manlyrash said some pretty ridiculous things right before the election.
But Honda is right. I’m 99% sure the vote will pass. But, it’s really just the beginning. We can’t afford it.
What Honda has been saying is what I’ve been saying to people I know that are worried. The money simply isn’t there.
Now, conservatives like Beck and Hannity want you to think the world is coming to an end and all that. But if this passes, we’ll be ok.
It simply cannot work and won’t stand, that’s why what the dems are doing is so stupid. they are giving up their careers for THIS?? it won’t even last.
That’s why it’s so crazy.
Anyway, it’s going to be a razor thing margin of victory for them but they’ll probably get it tomorrow.
Our republic ISN’T dead. Democracy ISN’T dying.
These people in charge know they’re goners. If our democracy was dead they wouldn’t have anything to worry about.
Buck up, people. We’re going to be ok.
B Man on March 21, 2010 at 12:09 AM
From TheHayride.com Obamacare Watch:
“Update 3-20, 7:30 PM: The Minority Leader’s office is distributing the following comments about an Executive Order “deal”:
US Conference of Catholic Bishops: “No regulation, policy letter from HRSA, or other executive action can withstand a statutory mandate, construed by federal courts applying a constitutional decision on abortion.”
National Right to Life Committee: “If the [Senate] bill is signed into law, these statutory requirements and defects are not subject to correction or nullification by the chief executive or his appointees, whether by Executive Order, regulation, or otherwise.””
sarahpalinfan99 on March 21, 2010 at 12:27 AM
From WaPo
The group is already split and she’s one of the holdouts. Kaptur’s playing word games – “entire group” = me.
I’m beginning to see why Space jumped so late. If it passes he looks principled for recognizing and abandoning a nightmare. If it fails, he gets to say “if not for me…”.
Kaptur might be doing the same thing. If she and Stupak hold out, they’re either need all seven – or are one short.
Now – who would like to be vote 216 at noon tomorrow?
budfox on March 21, 2010 at 12:32 AM
From another Hot Air post tonight:
Rep. Loretta Sanchez says she’ll vote no. Call and fax her office tomorrow: (202) 225-2965 • Fax: (202) 225-5859
SheetAnchor on March 21, 2010 at 1:00 AM
Texas and Rick Perry had talked about a rule of succession about 5 months ago.
If States balk and the the Feds say, “ok, no Federal money for your public school”.
Does this mean a States only options are to take it lying down or succession so they can provide their own schooling/school funding?
That’s a question.
Thanks in advance
father on March 21, 2010 at 1:05 AM
ObamaCare getting clobbered in online MSNBC poll. MS-fracking-NBC
http://health.newsvine.com/_question/2010/03/18/4035073-do-you-want-congress-to-pass-president-obamas-health-care-reform-plan
lovingmyUSA on March 21, 2010 at 1:29 AM
The states can then say, Fine, no income tax revenue from our withholdings.
fossten on March 21, 2010 at 1:49 AM
Is AP speculating that Pelosi might have the votes to pass the Senate bill tomorrow? I find that difficult to believe.
blink on March 21, 2010 at 2:25 AM
Heh. I find it terribly amusing that they have to keep dragging Clinton out of mothballs to bail Barry’s sorry ass out of the sling he keeps putting himself in. This guy is the most inept f*** up ever to sit in the White House. A trained seal could be more effective.
NoLeftTurn on March 21, 2010 at 2:25 AM
If you weren’t nervous now, you wouldn’t be worthy of citizenship. These are the times that try en’s souls. This has to end here. Even if we have to fight to repeal this abomination, we have to dedicate ourselves to getting it done, or never count ourselves as patriots again.
America’s freedom has been endangered again and again and it has to be kept by every generation. There will never be a final resolution, because there will always be people willing to throw it away for the sake of carnal security.
flataffect on March 21, 2010 at 4:02 AM
The word is secession and Perry was not advocating nor talking about secession. He was merely invoking the 10th Amendment.
anuts on March 21, 2010 at 5:28 AM
I wrote to all these people yesterday from Mark Levin’s list: (www.marklevinshow.com/Article.asp?id=1733252&spid=32364)list via their email forms (find the extra 4 zip code digits to enter most) and gave them anecdotal evidence (since they like the sob stories) of my personal experiences with the oh-so “morally superior” European socialized medicine. My own stories of month long waits for ultrasounds and surgery appointments, death of family member’s baby waiting for the ONE doctor to come since Denmark doesn’t do OBGYNs in the delivery room, only midwives) and the absurdity that being “free” will give the same quality of care Americans expect! In addition, to be more rational, I linked yesterday’s AP story about the CBO’s deficit growing/budget busting upcoming Medicare Fix they need to add which comes in separate legislation so if they’re hiding behind fiscal responsibility, they will know it’s a LIE and SHAM. Keep writing and calling, people! That fat lady has not yet begun to sing! (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Medicare-fix-would-push-apf-2700343586.html?x=0&.v=2)
Renwaa on March 21, 2010 at 6:09 AM
Good Sunday mornin’, HA. Here’s what I think…it’s admittedly Pollyanna:
A secret Dem coalition could bring this down. Either they won’t show their hand, or they’re out-and-out LYING about their yes vote.
Five principled Blue Dogs would do it. The public hates this bill, Nancy’s approval numbers are abysmal, and Congress as a whole not much better. Their gamble is no more frightful that it is for other Dems– and a darn sight more admirable.
Grace_is_sufficient on March 21, 2010 at 6:32 AM
Grace–I thought that same thing last night.
We went to both Space’s and Matheson’s office yesterday after the rally. I spoke with Matheson’s COS–Amy. Somewhat of a off-putting woman, but she got an earful. Many undecided congressmen’s staffers said “they’re still reading the bill” yada yada.
Either way, they really, really got an earful yesterday. We prayed in front of 13 offices–from the list of undecideds that mark levin put out. I even confronted Congressman Levin in the hallway and gave him a direct earful.
ted c on March 21, 2010 at 7:02 AM
I’m late to this
partyfuneral, but what about the final CBO report? I thought they had only issued a preliminary report.Buy Danish on March 21, 2010 at 7:07 AM
guys, hate to pour cold water on your hopes, but gird your loins, this will pass.
I have held out as much hope as anyone, but I just don’t see how Pelosi fails to get the votes. The wet noodle spine “pro-life” democrats and the so-called “blue dogs”, still have a (D) after their name. They will cave….
evie on March 21, 2010 at 7:08 AM
They released more info Friday night, it does not favor democrats at all. They added in the ‘doc fix’ which dems removed to get a favorable number. It puts the bill in the red….shocker, I know.
evie on March 21, 2010 at 7:09 AM
pass or not, it will be pyhrric
ted c on March 21, 2010 at 7:17 AM
Grace, I also agree. I think there are those who have said publicly “yes” just to get the thugs off their back. Can you imagine the threats, strong arm tactics, the false promises a lot of these representatives have had to put up with? So say yes and let the goons focus on someone else and when it’s time to vote, they will vote no. I have to believe that there are some Dem’s left with a conscience, that they’ve not all gone to the dark side. That out of fear for their own future careers at the least or with a modicum of intelligence that “this bill just isn’t the right bill” will have them vote no.
It’s my sliver of hope (how I hate that word anymore) in the humanity of politicians. (although that’s an oxymoron isn’t it?)
ladyhawke53 on March 21, 2010 at 7:17 AM
I hope, no I PRAY, that you guys are right.
evie on March 21, 2010 at 7:24 AM
I am just going to wait and see and not even speculate anymore. It just makes me nervous.
Terrye on March 21, 2010 at 7:30 AM
I sure hope there’s a camera zoomed in on Pelosi’s face if that happens.
RedWinged Blackbird on March 21, 2010 at 7:34 AM
I thought the same thing. It would be a thousand times better than the look on her face when Joe yelled out, “YOU LIE!”
Thank you for that from the bottom of my God-fearing heart, ted. Thank you for speaking out, too. I hate to admit this, but Levin is from my state. Ugh. Thank you especially for giving HIM an earful!
Grace_is_sufficient on March 21, 2010 at 7:47 AM
Not sure if someone already gave you guys this update in the comments – but Nye is staying a NO. He announced this at about 11pm yesterday. I live in Hampton Roads, so this was all over the news last night.
Govgirl on March 21, 2010 at 8:01 AM
I saw clips of the president’s speech from yesterday on the news this morning. I cannot believe that he used the rational that the Republicans are afraid that this bill will prove so great that the Democrats will be more popular. Paraphrasing obviously but it harkened back to my high school years.
Cindy Munford on March 21, 2010 at 8:36 AM
I have given him a lot of grief but I have to admit on Cap & Trade and the original bill he has voted correctly. That’s a pretty conservative area but we had a Democrat named Owen Pickett for years who did a good job.
Cindy Munford on March 21, 2010 at 8:39 AM
I like Mark Steyn’s name for idiots who voted for Obama that are now shocked by what he’s doing to their wallets and their future.
Hopendopes
miles on March 21, 2010 at 9:37 AM
I would be surprised if they didn’t have the votes.
We’re talking about drama queens here. They want to be on camera when the tally is announced so they can clutch hands, wave them in the air and cry with joy. If the number was given out before then it would be like everyone knowing who won award before the envelope was opened.
These people are true believer blind.
Itchee Dryback on March 21, 2010 at 10:31 AM
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