Pence: America, we can win this fight

posted at 2:45 pm on March 18, 2010 by Ed Morrissey

Is the ObamaCare debate over if the CBO score is favorable to Democrats? Rep. Mike Pence (R-IN) isn’t ready to give up quite yet. He gave another speech on the House floor early this morning, exhorting Democrats on the fence to vote no and start over from scratch. He also warned Democrats that while Republicans may be a minority in Congress, opposition to this bill is a majority in the country as a whole:

“This is a remarkable moment in the life of our nation. After years of runaway federal spending, deficits, debt, borrowing, bailouts and takeovers, against the opposition of a clear majority of the American people, the Democrats in Congress and in this administration are prepared to ram through a $1 trillion government takeover of health care.

“It’s just hard to believe. Ignoring the will of the American people, twisting the rules of the House and the Senate into a pretzel, we are headed for a showdown this weekend. But I got to tell you, I like our chances.

“The reason House Democrats don’t have the votes is because the American people know this is a government takeover of health care. Mandating that every American purchase health insurance whether they want it or need it or not, passing hundreds of billions of dollars in job-killing tax increases, providing public funding for abortions, and setting into motion government-run insurance that will cost millions to lose the insurance they have is a government takeover of health care.

“Let’s have the debate. A minority in Congress plus the American people equals a majority. America, we can win this fight.”

Pence has been on fire this week. He has continually reminded people that ObamaCare is nothing less than a government takeover of the health-care system, predicated on the fact that the federal government will have for the first time the power to force every resident to purchase a service as a requisite of residing in the US. It’s an amazing act of governmental arrogance, one that is most likely unconstitutional.

Can Americans win this fight? It’s not over yet, but we’re getting down to the make-or-break moment. And if Nancy Pelosi calls for a vote this weekend, I’d have to assume she thinks she has the votes.

Update: The Boss Emeritus notes that the GOP muscled a privileged question onto the House agenda this afternoon to force an up-or-down vote on Demon Pass.  The House endorsed it, 223-203.


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NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:28 PM

It does make it highly hypocritical. When the dems filed lawsuits against it, Americans weren’t outraged, or against the bills it was being used on. And they were a bipartisan effort.

Using it on this partisan bill, when a majority of Americans are against it, makes a valid point to scream out against the use of it. Apples, and oranges here.

capejasmine on March 18, 2010 at 4:33 PM

Thank you, I was hoping you would get to this fact. Yes you are quite correct, by the way how did that turn out?

Yep, it turned out in favor of the republicans, perfectly legal.

See we agree!

Not liking it does not make it illegal, sorry.

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:28 PM

Yup, knew you’d go there…

It was ruled legal because it was used to amend an already approved bill with already approved language.

This Senate Bill will have had NEITHER.

BY THE CONSTITUTION, a Bill must be approved by both houses before being sent to the President for signing into a law.

The Senate Bill will not be voted on by the house, ergo, not approved.

Y’see there’s this thing called… context

Skywise on March 18, 2010 at 4:33 PM

I just got through to the House of Representatives switchboard and to my Congressman – Steve Kagen’s office, urging him to vote no. I spoke to one of his staffers. She was pleasant and so was I.

I’m not holding my breath – he is such a weasel, and he has always been for it. I’ve done what I can, what little it is. At least I can sleep tonight. I was amazed that I got through. Keep burning the lines everybody! 877-762-8762

kscheuller on March 18, 2010 at 4:34 PM

I’m not saying the bill will pass, only that the use will stand up (if they choose that route)as legal. Again, back to my original point, be consistent.

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:31 PM

This rule never had opposition from the entire other party when used in the past.

darwin on March 18, 2010 at 4:35 PM

I am searching frantically for something in the texts of my religion that would allow me to opt out of Obamacare sort of like the Amish.

Nothing so far. Looks like I am going Unorthodox Amish.

Holger on March 18, 2010 at 4:35 PM

All the screaming, yelling and gnashing of teeth won’t change the fact. The rule is legal and that won’t change. Please continue to tilt at windmills if it gives a sense of accomplishment but in the end, it won’t change. I’m not saying the bill will pass, only that the use will stand up (if they choose that route)as legal. Again, back to my original point, be consistent.

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:31 PM

No, it isn’t legal. That’s a fact no matter how many times you keep wringing your hands and saying it is because it’s not a consistent use of the rule.

Skywise on March 18, 2010 at 4:35 PM

http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/the-self-executing-rule-danger.

The bigger problem is that Republicans plan to challenge the constitutionality of health care reform if it passes through this method. Michael McConnell, a law professor and retired former Republican judge, had an op-ed in yesterday’s Wall Street Journal calling legislation passed this way unconstitutional.

This is the title of his op-ed for WSJ

The House Health-Care Vote and the Constitution
No bill can become law unless the exact same text is approved by a majority of both houses of Congress.

Dr Evil on March 18, 2010 at 4:36 PM

I

don’t condone it’s use in any case. The reason the founding fathers set things up as they did, was to avoid this. It forced government to stay small. However it was used, but in bipartisan fashion.

But…to use it now, on something so large, and so controversial, is wrong in so many ways, and they know it. This isn’t about health care…this is about expanding government immensely, and we are against that. If this passes, it will be far worse than I think we can imagine. Especially when it’s apparent that most of the dems don’t know a thing about dollars, and cents, or sense for that matter.

They will render a good majority of the tax payers in this country to poverty status…and still force more taxes on us. We’re heading back to the days of Tyrants, and peasants with nothing in between.

capejasmine on March 18, 2010 at 4:30 PM

And I would not argue with your beliefs, I respect them. My only point was regarding the legality. I personally don’t like the rule, I don’t think anyone, democrat or republican should use the rule but that does not change its legality.

Democrats complained, even sued when republicans used it, now republicans who went to court to defend is’t use are calling it illegal. It’s like living in wonderland.

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:38 PM

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:31 PM

Who are you and why have you just shown up on this site? You are convincing no one. Average Americans post here. People who love their country, pay their taxes, and cherish their freedom. Yes, the Slaughter Solution has been used before on smaller bills of little consequence. It was not used before in the facilitation of the takeover of 1/6 of the U.S. Economy. This is unprecendented and reeks of the coup that it is.

kingsjester on March 18, 2010 at 4:38 PM

No, it isn’t legal. That’s a fact no matter how many times you keep wringing your hands and saying it is because it’s not a consistent use of the rule.

Skywise on March 18, 2010 at 4:35 PM

Thats the great thing about these kinds of conversations. One of us will be proven right and the other wrong. I’m guessing that the parliamentarian will side with me on the larger issue and perhaps you on some peripheral issues but the outcome will be the same. The larger bill will meet constitutional standards while some side issues will be kicked.

Time will tell..

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:42 PM

Who are you and why have you just shown up on this site? You are convincing no one. Average Americans post here. People who love their country, pay their taxes, and cherish their freedom. Yes, the Slaughter Solution has been used before on smaller bills of little consequence. It was not used before in the facilitation of the takeover of 1/6 of the U.S. Economy. This is unprecendented and reeks of the coup that it is.

kingsjester on March 18, 2010 at 4:38 PM

Just a citizen like you. I haven’t “just shown up” have been here and posted previously but never when emotions were so inflamed so my perspective didn’t get people so upset.

Now to the topic, I think your concern of if it should be used on a piece of legislation this large and important is a reasonable discussion point. If that’s the point, then make that the point. Not some false construct on how it’s illegal.

Im quite confident that the republicans will win some of the fights over the technical use but not the larger argument, as a matter of settled law, that’s all. That said, I do find it amusing that a party that went to court and won a case to supports its legality is now telling the public the opposite. Do you see where that might be an issue?

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:48 PM

Allah Pundit: But look. If you think this thing is headed for passage, which seems increasingly likely, your last best hope to kill it is through a court challenge. The filthier the process, the better the odds that SCOTUS will torpedo it down the line.

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/03/18/disgrace-house-approves-slaughter-strategy-222-203/

Dr Evil on March 18, 2010 at 4:49 PM

but that does not change its legality.

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:38 PM

I hope that pray your “reasoning” is not indicative of the next generation. I guess that relativism has infiltrated the mind of young Americans to the point where all assertions are just shades of grey: no right, no wrong, just ‘opinion’ and ‘feeling’.

Grace_is_sufficient on March 18, 2010 at 4:51 PM

It doesn’t matter if the rule is legal or not, what matters in politics is perception … and the perception is that the democrats can’t pass this bill through normal procedure, and are willing to deem it through because of that.

It’s a miscalculation because the bill was already extremely unpopular to begin with … this just taints it so much more along with the backroom deals.

darwin on March 18, 2010 at 4:51 PM

72 Hours to go?

More significance with the number 72:

Number of virgins for suicide bombers: 72
Bloody Sunday: 1972
Watergate: 1972

Very fitting

ConservativeTony on March 18, 2010 at 4:52 PM

What will be deemed ILLEGAL is the resultant (if signed) HC bill !! Because of the Slaughter Solution.
sigh.

pambi on March 18, 2010 at 4:52 PM

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:48 PM

Mark Levin addressed this yesterday or the day before.

The court ruled that it would not rule regarding procedure on a constitutional piece of legislature.

This is regarding the constitutionality of the process, not the bill.

Two different things. This bill will not have passed according to constitutional process.

Jvette on March 18, 2010 at 4:55 PM

^^ what Jvette said ^^ :-)

pambi on March 18, 2010 at 4:57 PM

For all intents and purposes, the democrats have destroyed the reputation they spent decades creating, false as it was.

This is what unchecked corruption looks like.

darwin on March 18, 2010 at 4:57 PM

NextGen on March 18, 2010 at 4:48 PM

No. The overwhelming issue is whether America will remain a Free Republic or devolve into a Democrat Socialist Marxist-lite nation, such as is seen in Europe. The only reason this is being done is that the Democratic Party is afraid to cast their votes in public and face the wrath of the people they actually work for. This nyah nyah nyah nyah nyah nyah you did it first argument holds no water. This is not passing a budget bill or amendment. Again, this is an attempt to radically change 1/6th of America’s Economy.

kingsjester on March 18, 2010 at 4:58 PM

I am searching frantically for something in the texts of my religion that would allow me to opt out of Obamacare sort of like the Amish.

Nothing so far. Looks like I am going Unorthodox Amish.

Holger on March 18, 2010 at 4:35 PM

You could deem yourself Amish.

BitterClinger on March 18, 2010 at 5:33 PM

PS
And deem your taxes paid while you’re deeming.

BitterClinger on March 18, 2010 at 5:34 PM

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