Palin: I told you so!
posted at 8:48 am on December 23, 2009 by Ed Morrissey
It didn’t take long for Jim DeMint’s outrage over highly unusual language protecting a care-rationing board to generate a response from Sarah Palin. This came just days after Politifact called her statement about “death panels” the “lie of the year,” but the attempt to rule any Congressional motion that changes the rulings of the Independent Medical Advisory Board out of order in perpetuity has highlighted once again this rationing board and its potential impact in a government-run system. And that, Palin writes at her Facebook page, was her point all along:
No one is certain of what’s in the bill, but Senator Jim DeMint spotted one shocking revelation regarding the section in the bill describing the Independent Medicare Advisory Board (now called the Independent Payment Advisory Board), which is a panel of bureaucrats charged with cutting health care costs on the backs of patients – also known as rationing. Apparently Reid and friends have changed the rules of the Senate so that the section of the bill dealing with this board can’t be repealed or amended without a 2/3 supermajority vote. Senator DeMint said:
“This is a rule change. It’s a pretty big deal. We will be passing a new law and at the same time creating a senate rule that makes it out of order to amend or even repeal the law. I’m not even sure that it’s constitutional, but if it is, it most certainly is a senate rule. I don’t see why the majority party wouldn’t put this in every bill. If you like your law, you most certainly would want it to have force for future senates. I mean, we want to bind future congresses. This goes to the fundamental purpose of senate rules: to prevent a tyrannical majority from trampling the rights of the minority or of future congresses.”
In other words, Democrats are protecting this rationing “death panel” from future change with a procedural hurdle. You have to ask why they’re so concerned about protecting this particular provision. Could it be because bureaucratic rationing is one important way Democrats want to “bend the cost curve” and keep health care spending down?
The Congressional Budget Office seems to think that such rationing has something to do with cost. In a letter to Harry Reid last week, CBO Director Douglas Elmendorf noted (with a number of caveats) that the bill’s calculations call for a reduction in Medicare’s spending rate by about 2 percent in the next two decades, but then he writes the kicker:
“It is unclear whether such a reduction in the growth rate could be achieved, and if so, whether it would be accomplished through greater efficiencies in the delivery of health care or would reduce access to care or diminish the quality of care.”
Though Nancy Pelosi and friends have tried to call “death panels” the “lie of the year,” this type of rationing – what the CBO calls “reduc[ed] access to care” and “diminish[ed] quality of care” – is precisely what I meant when I used that metaphor.
All health care gets rationed in one manner or another, as does every commodity (except air, although with cap-and-trade, that would change). Insurers ration, and so do consumers in a fully free-market system such as the Lasik or cosmetic-surgery industries. The difference is that those systems involve free choice, especially the latter. With insurers as third-party payers, there is less free choice, but the solution to that is more competition and better ability to be completely portable — or better yet, the removal of third-party payers for normal health care services.
When government rations commodities, it does so with the force of law. Considering the power it would have had in a completely government-run system to make the kind of decisions now left to insurers in a competitive market, people are correct to be worried about how exactly IMAB would bend the cost curve. Their mission in the ObamaCare bill is to “reduce the per capita rate of growth in Medicare spending.” The way ObamaCare is structured, the only way to hold down costs would be to start denying more treatments, or to cut compensation to the point where long wait times take care of the rationing by discouraging access to a dwindling number of providers. Will that prevent more deaths and make Americans healthier?
With insurers, consumers have the option to find another insurer or self insure. Those options won’t exist in a government-run system, and are seriously limited in ObamaCare, even in the latest incarnation. Without those options, the IMAB’s decisions will be inescapable — and thanks to Harry Reid’s language, citizens won’t even have the opportunity to challenge IMAB actions in Congress. It’s an abomination.
Update: I just talked to a source on Capitol Hill who wants to make sure everyone understands the mechanics of the issue. The bill sets up a supermajority threshold of 67 votes to bring accountability to IMAB decisions, and the rule on being in or out of order can get waived at 60 votes. However, as this battle shows, even getting to 60 is almost an impossibility, let alone 67. Clearly Reid wants to put accountability out of reach with these radical propositions.









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Far be it for me to defend a troll, but our friend Vox here isn’t a liberal.
I have seen a couple of his posts on other threads. He just happens to hate Sarah Palin. His perceives phoniness, which is his opinion.
I can pretty much say that he hates Obozo, too. And for pretty much the same reasons as the rest of us.
Vox, I’m guessing you’re hardcore Libertarian. But how ’bout dialing it back a bit so the rest of us can have some fun?
Lanceman on December 23, 2009 at 4:00 PM
What are you talking about?
Do you even know?
Jenfidel on December 23, 2009 at 4:00 PM
Are you really that dense, or just pretending for the sake of argument?
Dark-Star on December 23, 2009 at 4:02 PM
Medicare? Explain how a government paid system makes private insurance policies so exspensive.
HMO Act? Be more precise. Which one? What aspect?
I am asking these questions seriously as I am not sure exactly how these things contribute to costs significantly higher than any other industrialized nation.
lexhamfox on December 23, 2009 at 4:03 PM
CNN is an organ, alright….
BPD on December 23, 2009 at 4:03 PM
I see the fellow traveler souffle is on special today.
Lanceman on December 23, 2009 at 4:04 PM
Thank you.
Juno77 on December 23, 2009 at 4:04 PM
Del Dolemonte on December 23, 2009 at 3:59 PM
I just had a glance and it was shown as Secular Right rather than CNN but it echoes the proportions of the other polls I found.
lexhamfox on December 23, 2009 at 4:04 PM
http://www.freedomkeys.com/medicare.htm
Abuses exist when there are “inefficiencies” that can be taken advantage of. In this case I’m thinking of medicare and insurance fraud, some at patient level, some at doctor level, some at agency level. But the more intricate the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the works.
Fighton03 on December 23, 2009 at 4:08 PM
Also Lex, the concept of “third party pays” eliminates the natural price/cost feedback loop that controls market based economies.
Fighton03 on December 23, 2009 at 4:09 PM
Blue doesn’t seem to get it. An insurance company is a giant risk pool, which means that they are essentially playing the odds. Out of a limited amount of patients, only a certain percentage is likely to get seriously ill. Chances are your insurance policy covers you up to $2 million over a lifetime. (At least in my circle that seems to be about average.) If you take care of yourself, chances are you will not use that 2 million. But for someone who catches cancer, they can use that extra money to help cover their costs. Fun or not-so-fun fact: the average cost in 1997 for ovarian cancer was $15,000/yr, which ranked as the most expensive. Even if we were to raise that cost to $35,000/yr (that more than covers inflation) for someone diagnosed at 45 who lived to be 100 years old and had their bills paid 100%, they would use $1,925,000 over their lifetime. The point is that insurance companies have it figured out. They can only cover so many people for so much. Rationing under a private insurance plan is very unlikely. Why? They know how many people they have on the rolls, the likelihood of them catching a serious illness and how much all of that is going to cost. That allows them to give most of their consumers a good insurance plan, which explains why 80% of the public was happy with their insurance company.
But under government run systems, where EVERYONE is dumped onto the rolls, rationing starts to go up. Because unlike an insurance company that deals solely with insurance, government deals with many other programs. So that money you pay in a premium via taxes is SUPPOSED to go healthcare, but will likely be spent bailing out states or companies or to build Jack Murtha another unused airport. Face it. Government is notoriously bad at managing money. This proposed healthcare system, like Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, the VA etc, will run out of money, and when that happens your lifetime limits will go from $2 mill, to $1mill to $0.5 mill and lower. This mean, government will have to make decisions about what to spend money on, like drug treatments, screenings, how much your health is worth this year, how many surgeries to perform in a year, etc. Under a private plan, people have more options and they also have more money to spend if they get sick. If you want to increase your lifetime limitations, under this system you can, but you have to pay extra for it.
Other fun or not-so-fun facts:
If we are to believe the Dems numbers on how many people lack insurance- 40 million out of 300+ million is pretty darn impressive. Only 13% of the public are uninsured. And of those people insured, again using Democratic talking points, about 67-70% of them have private insurance.
The system isn’t perfect, but no system is, and NO system will ever be. I think our system allows for the maximum amount of people to access high quality health care at a reasonable cost- without unreasonable limitations on how much people can spend on their health. From a general statistical standpoint, we have a good system.
xax on December 23, 2009 at 4:13 PM
“Two things…medicare and the HMO act.”
Also, we subsidize the development of new medicines for other countries who threaten to violate intellectual property laws and pirate/clone patented drugs for their own citizens, like Canada and India. That’s why prescription prices are so high for new drugs.
ebrown2 on December 23, 2009 at 4:14 PM
there are a host of things, however those are two point causes that track to changes in the rate of healthcare cost increases.
Fighton03 on December 23, 2009 at 4:18 PM
Again, I ask of the libs–any of them: Would you die for what you believe?
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:26 PM
No. That’s for chumps. Feel free to do it anyway though!
simplesimon on December 23, 2009 at 4:30 PM
Would any of you libs forfeit your life for what you think is the greater good?
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:31 PM
Who thinks this way? What a dope!
simplesimon on December 23, 2009 at 4:33 PM
That’s easy. I’ll concede that most insurance group plans do not pay the full amount for any visit. But government, pays even less than private insurers do. (I’ve heard some doctors complain that medicare/medicaid will only cover $18 of a 75$ visit. But that’s just one example.)
So, doctors offices are merely small businesses and operate as such. If your government patients are only paying 25% of the full cost, then the only way to try to increase revenue is to increase your prices, cut overhead or get rid of your government patients. Most places keep the patients, cutting overhead is darn near impossible when dealing with billing, so prices go up. So that $75 dollar visit becomes $100. And for the private patient that means their insurance company pays $50 instead of $37.5, while the government patient only pays $25 vs $18. If we were to compare the increase in prices: $7 vs $12.5, the private patient is paying 44% more. Multiply these increases out over millions of people, then you’re talking about serious money which causes premiums to increase.
This is not the only factor in increases, but it does have an effect.
xax on December 23, 2009 at 4:34 PM
Then you have no concept of conviction. Yes, it’s better to make the other guy die for his conviction, but there might come a time when a man lays his life on the line for things that might come after him.
You speak much but say so little. You seem the type who would require others to die in your stead, while you remain somehow safe from your own demands.
You have defined yourself, as to also speak for all other liberals.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:36 PM
and once again Mill is shown to be correct.
Fighton03 on December 23, 2009 at 4:37 PM
That’s a rhetorical question. Right? But simplesimon already answered. Others will make the sacrifices for them. Liberals don’t care if those in real need die or get worse care under this system, as long as they get their “free” stuff. Liberals are parasites, pessimists and cowards. Not to mention racists.
alliebobbitt on December 23, 2009 at 4:42 PM
Obviously not you. It would require you to well … think.
That one neuron you’re firing needs a new spark plug. Contact your local ObamaCare Neuron Replacement Center for Morons.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 4:43 PM
What you don’t get, simon, is that I and other here–those racefans–will do all we can so that you, too, can have all the liberty for yourself and those you love the same way we want for us and those we love.
I don’t know you. But if your liberty is in danger, I’ll want the same for you and your household as I wish for me and mine.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:43 PM
Can I have some dope?
Del Dolemonte on December 23, 2009 at 4:44 PM
simplesimon can only type two sentences per comment. I wouldn’t expect much of an answer.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 4:44 PM
That’s great. Glad that you’re on the case.
simplesimon on December 23, 2009 at 4:45 PM
simplesimon has the distinction of being the communist’s only useless useful idiot.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 4:48 PM
Here’s another thing you don’t quite grasp:
If I gotta stop a government invasion of your household, I’m going to make the move.
I want you an yours as fully free as I want for my own.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:48 PM
He doesn’t care … he’s a communist.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 4:49 PM
Why do you devalue me, when I wish the best for you and all that you love?
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:49 PM
Of course, they elect democrats to create death panels.
Chris_Balsz on December 23, 2009 at 4:50 PM
All to a point, Friend.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:50 PM
No true Marxist I’ve ever known has behaved this way.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 4:54 PM
They belittle and smear her at every turn – and there she is being right once again!
Sarah Palin is the freakin’ BIZZOMB!
Mr Purple on December 23, 2009 at 4:59 PM
not an organ, an oriface.
Onager on December 23, 2009 at 5:01 PM
Not only could they exist, but they’re actually in the bill — also protected by a super-majority provision! You don’t say. Good Lord, that makes Palin right from the git-go! Fancy that.
littleguy on December 23, 2009 at 5:17 PM
Then I suppose he could be a confused communist.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 5:28 PM
Actually, he’s just a hateful little person posing as a communist.
Every Marxist I ever met stands to convictions of their Manifesto, while simon just goes off full of spite and rhetoric.
simon isn’t a Marxist in the least. He’s simply someone full of hate. For now, we’re his targets. Later, he’ll set his crosshairs on someone else.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 5:46 PM
Well, there are real people, and then there are primates. A persual of this thread alone is enough to highlight the distinction.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 5:52 PM
This.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 5:53 PM
OK. I admit I’m fiesty today.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 5:56 PM
The problem is, simplesimon and his ilk think just the same way. You cherish freedom, and thus, would seek it for him.
However, as failed citizen and general detritus of the species, he craves slavery, and thus, seeks it for you.
Never forget: Misery loves company.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:02 PM
You do seem to be a highly trained primate though …
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 6:03 PM
Whoa! Fiesty? and you have a cute little dog?
voxtinkerbelli !!!
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 6:05 PM
Oh darwin. If only you had the cognative abilities to truly express that sentiment. Then it might mean something.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM
Oh yes, the obligatory homosexual innuendo. LOL. No Quitter Fan can rest without one. (And what does that tell us, hmmmm?) :D
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:08 PM
Vote for Ed Morrissey!!!
portlandon on December 23, 2009 at 6:09 PM
Look out everyone! The smartest poster on HA is getting spicy. You have never seen a social lib get crazier!
ClassicCon on December 23, 2009 at 6:10 PM
I think you meant to write “perusal.”
ramrocks on December 23, 2009 at 6:12 PM
Apparently it did mean something .. unless you have a habit of replying to nothing.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 6:20 PM
Cast line, set hook, pull …
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 6:21 PM
Pieces of shit float on water provided by braver souls all the time.
that’s how you explain simplesimon.
manofaiki on December 23, 2009 at 6:27 PM
Yes, that’s all too true.
But I’m more of a meld to end such misery, if I can. If I can’t, then those are stuck where they want to be.
I just can’t grasp the concept of mindless hate, tho I admit to hating liberals. That’s for personal experience. But, if I can have an authentic discussion with a lib, I’ll go for it. With one rule: no personal slanders during the chat.
I ask only a fair chance but can’t seem to get that most times from the libs who post here.
Liam on December 23, 2009 at 6:33 PM
I am going out on a limb here. But maybe it is a good idea to allow death panels, then when we can add Liberalism as a condition that would preclude treatment… Just saying there might be an upside.
Holger on December 23, 2009 at 6:41 PM
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 5:52 PM
cs89 on December 23, 2009 at 6:52 PM
Don’t take this the wrong way, but that seems a bit . . . “arrogant” is the word I’m looking for, I suppose. Arrogant because it seems to imply that you are free to fail with impunity. As if they have no power over you or your world.
I don’t view it that way. Liberals/collectivists know how to wield power and are demonstrating it on a daily basis. I see them as a dangerous and powerful enemy, to be treated with the respect one would confer upon a rabid dog.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:52 PM
And for whom do you seek slavery, voxy?
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 6:53 PM
d are demonstrating it on a daily basis. I see them as a dangerous and powerful enemy, to be treated with the respect one would confer upon a rabid dog.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:52 PM
Or Palin.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 6:53 PM
Let’s try that again. Dratted buttons…
Or Palin.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 6:55 PM
I SEE . . . your hundreds of homosexual innuendoes over the months were all just a clever plot, eh?
I can see you down at the truck stop now, explaining to all your friends, “Yeah, I wear drag to the gay bar every Thursday, but it’s not what you think guys! I’m just like a secret agent, infiltrating them undercover.”
Nice one, 007. LOL
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:56 PM
Oh, unclesmrgol. Did you take a pause from beating your wife?
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 6:57 PM
Or Palin.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 6:58 PM
Or Palin.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 6:58 PM
Better. I took a pause from beating you. But I’m back.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:01 PM
LOL Tard.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 7:01 PM
Yessss . . . well . . . what can I say to that. LOL
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 7:02 PM
Or Palin?
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:03 PM
And Palin.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:06 PM
Oh my. Resorting to lying now voxtinkerbelli? Feel free to find and post the hundreds of homosexual innuendoes I’ve apparently made.
Plus, why do have something against going to a gay bar in drag on Thursdays?
You’re too uptight. Relax, play with your cute little dog … I have one too by the way, well actually two, one’s a Sheltie pup. They both come with me on Thursday night.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 7:07 PM
LOL Tard.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 7:08 PM
Must be her high heels, come to think of it.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:11 PM
Or Palin?
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:13 PM
And that, class, is what is known as an infinite loop.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:13 PM
ROTFLOL UBER-Tard.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 7:14 PM
Or maybe Mr. Voxy has entered the Outer Limits — that black and white place where someone else controls both the vertical and the horizontal.
Especially the horizontal, from the types of conversations Voxy seems to like.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:16 PM
Throw in your LOL’s soon if you’re going to use any. voxtinkerbelli has a habit of using them all up.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 7:16 PM
Or Palin?
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:17 PM
Of course, once you’ve entered an infinite loop, it’s impossible to exit.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:18 PM
LOL … whew! didn’t know if that one was going to make it.
darwin on December 23, 2009 at 7:18 PM
LOL Uber-tard.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 7:20 PM
Or Palin?
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:21 PM
That VoxVision brought to you courtesy of Wierd Al Yankovic.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 7:31 PM
Whoa…ease down on the internet nerd speak there poindexter. Would hate to see such an enlightened, over 35-year old “adult” be confused for a giggling mall rat hunched over her Sidekick.
Here let me try this goofy AOL invented short-type:
LOL
…jesus I feel like a pussy.
ClassicCon on December 23, 2009 at 7:44 PM
Why do I suspect that’s not new for you?
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 8:01 PM
I think vox is one of the corrupt “republicans” who got their clock cleaned by Palin.Ya know,the last time she “quit”.Or maybe just related?It sure has an obsession,for a supposed”conservative”.Must be pro-corruption.
theTarCzar on December 23, 2009 at 8:29 PM
Vox is just upset that the object of her affection,–Treacher is moving…and won’t be here as much any more… Palin is an prop, something Vox uses to stimulate herself…She gets off on your responses to her bait…
I’m tired of her same old lines–specifically QUITTER ie simple’s NASCAR…same thing. Not fun to play with anymore when she does her same tricks…we already know the punchlines…
lovingmyUSA on December 23, 2009 at 8:32 PM
Amen.
voxpopuli on December 23, 2009 at 8:35 PM
Here’s the key to voxpopuli: “Social Conservatives are Bad!”
Just another in a long line of idiots who think we can build a stronger party if we throw out some of the most loyal voters in our base.
This notion that social conservatives are somehow “poisoning” the Republican party is persistent. It’s also the best way to keep the Republican party divided and weak.
Fortunately, for all the tiresome “quitter” comments he throws around, Palin will be a much bigger influence on the Republican party than all the voxpopuli of the world.
I think he’s still holding out hope for Mitt Romney.
There Goes The Neighborhood on December 23, 2009 at 8:44 PM
DON’T WORRY
ONCE WE HAVE MAJORITY BACK, WE WILL PASS A LAW THAT MAKES IT ILLEGAL TO RUN FOR ANYTHING AND IT CAN ONLY BE REVOKED WITH 2/3 MAJORITY
WE WILL ALSO MAKE IT RULE THAT ANYONE WHO WAS IN FAVOR FOR IT WILL ENJOY THIS BOARD AND CANNOT USE ANY OTHER GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE SYSTEM AS THOSE SCUMBAG ELITISTS HAVE FOR THEMSELVES
WE WILL MAKE A LAW THAT WHOEVER IS AFRAID FOR MAN-MADE GLOBAL WARMING IS NOT ALLOWED TO HAVE ANY CHILDREN AND CAN ONLY LIVE IN A HUT WITH NO ELECTRICITY AND NO DANGEROUS CO2 EMITTING WOOD BURNING
WE WILL MAKE IT A LAW THAT CANNOT BE REVOKED THAT ANYONE WHO PASSES OR HAS PASSED SOMETHING, WILL LIVE ACCORDINGLY, EVEN IF THAT LAW IS REVOKED FOR THOSE OPPOSING IT
mooseburger on December 23, 2009 at 8:47 PM
AND YES, A NEW LAW WILL BE THAT LIBERALISM WILL BE CONSIDERED DANGEROUS FOR THE WELL BEING AND HEALTH OF PEOPLE AND ALL LIBERALS WILL BE PUNISHED BY JAIL TIME AND BANNED TO A SMALL PLACE ON THE NORTHPOLE, THE ONLY PLACE THEY THINK IS STILL COLD
mooseburger on December 23, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Agitvoxprop.
unclesmrgol on December 23, 2009 at 8:54 PM
Ed, Ed, Ed …
Insurers do not ration anything, they insure against financial risk. The consumer determines the extent of rationing by decing which level of protection he prefers. Please stop falling into the Dem trap of moral equivalence–”we can ration with our bill because you get that now from you current insurance coverage.” Apples and oranges.
FalseProfit on December 23, 2009 at 8:56 PM
Where does Allahpoundit find these skanks to troll the Palin threads for him?
james23 on December 23, 2009 at 9:03 PM
Not me. Or a lot of people I know. We’ve decided that when the crap hits the fan, the Liberals get taken care of. In the process of reclaiming this country from the Marxists, a whole bunch of parasites are going to have to be eliminated. Like the Bleeds Blue and simplesimons of the world.
mrpeabody on December 23, 2009 at 9:04 PM
hey Vox,
Having trouble dealing with a strong woman are you?
Maybe you should see someone about that…
jerrytbg on December 23, 2009 at 9:07 PM
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