Oh my: Kill the bill, says … Howard Dean
posted at 4:10 pm on December 15, 2009 by Allahpundit
The only thing that can save us from final passage now is the insane bitterness of “principled liberals” at seeing their dream of true socialized medicine smashed. Help us, Dean-o, you’re our only hope!
The gauntlet from Dean — whose voice on health care is well respsected among liberals — will energize those on the left who are mobilizing against the bill, and make it tougher for liberals to embrace the emerging proposal. In an excerpt Kinzel gave me, Dean says:
“This is essentially the collapse of health care reform in the United States Senate. Honestly the best thing to do right now is kill the Senate bill, go back to the House, start the reconciliation process, where you only need 51 votes and it would be a much simpler bill.”…
Dean had previously endorsed the Medicare buy-in compromise without a public option, saying that the key question should be whether the bill contains enough “real reform” to be worthy of progressives’ support. Dean has apparently concluded that the “real reform” has been removed at Lieberman’s behest — which won’t make it easier for liberals to swallow the emerging compromise.
That makes two leading nutroots lights to come out against the bill since the Medicare compromise was dropped. I’m skeptical that there are any Senate liberals willing to be the 41st vote against cloture — Burris made some noise this morning about demanding a public option, although even his language was qualified — but there’s a huge bloc of House progressives that will take this under careful advisement. Remember, Pelosi’s bill only passed by five votes; the more momentum there is on the left for the idea that Reid’s bill is a grand sellout, the more precarious this gets. No wonder Democratic pundits were rushing out pieces this morning urging liberals to take the deal.
As for Dean-o’s point about reconciliation, after all the damage this process has done to Democrats among independents, the left’s big vote-winning plan now is to have Reid … cram the public option down America’s throats using an arcane parliamentary procedure? With Lieberman, Nelson, Lincoln, Bayh, Pryor, and possibly one or two other Blue Dogs screaming “no way”? We may have actually reached the point where true-believin’ progressive ObamaCare supporters are so desperate to have their dream bill that they’re willing to trade the House majority for it. Which is well and good, but someone had better let Pelosi know pronto.
Update: It’s popcorn time, kids.
Democratic votes may stay home from the polls in retribution for Congress failing at health reform, a top liberal lawmaker said Tuesday.
Rep. Lynn Woolsey (D-Calif.), the co-chairwoman of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, said that members of the Democratic Party’s base “aren’t even going to go to the polls if they don’t have a public option.”…
“I don’t see what we’ve accomplished,” Woolsey said. “If we were going to have insurance reform, we could have done that very simply. If we don’t have a public option and at the very least we don’t have a Medicare buy in then we aren’t offering any competition to the insurance industry.”
She says she doesn’t know if she could vote for Reid’s bill.










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Kill Bill – part II
moc23 on December 15, 2009 at 5:08 PM
The voters will make that determination at the ballot boxes. As someone pointed out to me the other day, we have a republic, not a pure democracy for a reason. Elected representatives have to walk a fine line between their consciences and their re-election campaign but they are not under any obligation to submit to government by poll.
As I look inot this, however, this whole discussion is essentially moot. The bills would have to be re-written and go through the House and Senate Budget Committees and would be subject to the “Byrd Rule” wherein any clause not deemed relevant to the deficit could be challenged. This is why Bush could — what’s the phrase? — “undemocratically cram down” his tax cuts, but it probably won’t work for health care.
Bleeds Blue on December 15, 2009 at 5:13 PM
Translation: Instead of pulling the engine and tranny, we just could have tuned things up.
unclesmrgol on December 15, 2009 at 5:13 PM
Tax cuts are budgetary issues to the core. This is not.
I’m not saying the Senate can’t legally or morally follow this path with ObamaCare, just that is will make matters worse on them- which as even you must admit with Obama’s record drop in the polls- takes some real doing.
Chuck Schick on December 15, 2009 at 5:17 PM
The delicious irony of Roland Burris being a potential dagger in this is, well, almost too much for my palate.
SouthernGent on December 15, 2009 at 5:18 PM
Liberals and lefties are horrible liars. That includes you Lynn. yeah, like you lefties would stay home. Your insane, it’s not an option. oh, Democrats like myself WILL be coming out on droves in 2010…to boot the current Democratic encumbants out ASAP. Just to screw with you Dems in office, we didn’t switch party affiliation but you won’t be getting our vote. You can’t even imagine how many registered Dems will be voting Repub. in 2010.
You don’t have to wonder what happened to those millions of Palin/McCain voters. You know damn well they aren’t going to vote Democrat in the coming election, Just like they didn’t in the last election. You Lynn, and every Democrat in Washington should be very scared of passing this trainwreck
Niteowl45 on December 15, 2009 at 5:20 PM
What was that song by ABBA? Oh yes…Waterloo! Love it!
redwhiteblue on December 15, 2009 at 5:22 PM
Exactly as I predicted yesterday; The Congressional Marxist Caucus are ideologues, not pragmatists. They won’t support this Senate plan because they see it as a sell out and Obama is not popular enough (anymore) to use moral suasion on them.
elduende on December 15, 2009 at 5:25 PM
I may be missing something here, but what Howlin’ Howie seems to be advocating is for the Senate to go with the House bill, which is a slimy government takeover of our rights and a major budget-buster all on its own.
Why does anyone find this a good sign?
One thing you can depend on: the greedy totalitarians in congress will get this passed while the talking heads on our side are distracted by supposed “defections” from the libs.
All this nattering about how this might “kill” Osama Obama Care is so much — you should pardon the expression — hot air, and simply means that the righties who buy what they’re hearing/reading right now will be in for an even bigger shock when the traitorous scum in congress and the White House get their way.
MrScribbler on December 15, 2009 at 5:25 PM
I’m not saying they’re not. I’m just saying that if it’s democratic to dispense with the filibuster on tax legislation, it should be equally democratic to dispense with it on health care.
Frankly, I’m not sure it can get any worse. Passing a bill and speaking with a unified voice in support of a finished product is certainly going to be better on a political basis than having the sausage-making process make headlines every day.
Bleeds Blue on December 15, 2009 at 5:33 PM
I think it is quite telling that the Anointed One actually said in public that congress is “on the precipice” of passing the bill.
“On the precipice” is correct and rather a Freudian slip, I think!
Dhuka on December 15, 2009 at 5:39 PM
‘Zounds! The sheer idiocy of this statement is of epic proportions. Medicare to create “competition” for the private insurance industry? What does “competition” mean, anyway? Have words, at last, been emptied of all meaning that is not Orwellian?
smellthecoffee on December 15, 2009 at 5:40 PM
What the Senate is producing may be vaguely sausage-shaped, but if you actually catch a whiff of it you’ll have to admit that it’s definitely not sausage.
notropis on December 15, 2009 at 5:43 PM
Is it wrong for an atheist to pray for this?
Ann on December 15, 2009 at 5:50 PM
From your point of view I don’t know how this can get any worse. Everything this bill was supposed to do is gone:
- Obama horsetraded away any chance to bring down pharma costs with his backroom $80B deal which, as paltry as that is over 10 years, they still don’t have to stick to. And seriously- do you think anyone is going to have the stomach to revisit HCR anytime soon?
- Drug reimportation dropped as part of the plan to not break apart above deal
- The very insurance system you all complain about is 100% in place- with potentially 30 million new customers
- The minority of patients with pre-existing conditions have their premiums held down, which means the vast majority will have theirs raised to compensate for it
- Massive medicare cuts the seniors are going to lose their sh1t over
- Doctors costs left alone
- Deficits expand and accelerate once 100% of the costs kick in after 4 years
- No public option, no Medicare buy in
And if they add reconciliation, this will all be undoable withiout a filibuster as well.
And you know Obama will cave like he does with everything else. Obama has shown zero leadership on this issue and will sign anything he can at this point.
Chuck Schick on December 15, 2009 at 5:51 PM
Plus I forgot all the mandates and taxes on companies- especially small ones- that will suppress wages, bonuses, benefits, employment and coverage as well.
Chuck Schick on December 15, 2009 at 5:54 PM
Bringing the public option into play through reconciliation or conference is nothing more than aggressive posturing. I’ve yet to see anyone outside of the extreme left wing fringe take it seriously. Don’t take my word for it, but ask yourself why the democratic leadership is pushing to compromise with Lieberman.
But I’m sure that will be the new lefty troll meme. Blah blah blah we are going to pass this with reconciliation blah blah blah. It’s not happening.
jhffmn on December 15, 2009 at 5:56 PM
No backlash, this is no longer a health insurance reform bill, it’s going to be a bill to see who can get the biggest piece of Zero’s stash. It’s going to be nothing but a huge pork barrel spending bill with some health care mandates in it. Now to pile on the pork.
Brat4life on December 15, 2009 at 6:05 PM
“We got to have the public option, we’re going to California, then Ohio, then Florida, then Michigan… until we get the public option. ARRRHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!
Bring in the clowns.
Hummer53 on December 15, 2009 at 6:12 PM
Hold out Burris, baby, hold out! The cesspool city, Chitown, armpit of the midwest needs a bailout bad!
Hold out Burris you can get more than that two bit Ho from Louisiana, baby, hold out.
Get yours befo the rest of the scumbags figure out the scam and jump on the “I can’t Vote for this crap sandwich without a lot of money for my constituents” bandwagon.
Hold on, baby, your in the catbirds seat don’t settle for less than $500 BILLION, man!
You’ll be a Hero in Zero’s hometown!
Your name will be forever Rolland Burris, “the man who saved Chi-town the armpit of the midwest and brought tons of money home to the Daley machine”!
dhunter on December 15, 2009 at 6:31 PM
Give that man a gold star for his knowledge of and insight on matters of Congressional procedure.
JohnGalt23 on December 15, 2009 at 6:33 PM
That is where you are mistaken, sir.
There is no such thing as a bad soap opera on Telemundo!!
JohnGalt23 on December 15, 2009 at 6:36 PM
From Robert Tracinski’s TIA:
JDPerren on December 15, 2009 at 6:39 PM
Just for fun, take a look at the 89th Congress, which I think is the last time the Dems had majorities this large. Go ahead and look at the legislation they pulled off.
The ghost of Lyndon Johnson is laughing/cursing at the Harvard trained buffoon who is sitting in the same funny shaped room he used to sit in, preparing to destroy the party he once led to triumph.
Do you hear it Barack?… Do you hear the laughter?
JohnGalt23 on December 15, 2009 at 6:42 PM
Does anyone remember the GOP ever even contemplating using “reconciliation” to pass major legislation?
Seriously, how the fuck are they getting away with floating this notion?
Can you imagine the “OMG THEY’RE SHREDDING THE CONSTITUTION” that would have been raised if this had been tried under Bush?
I really worry they are floating it out there so later when they do it the idea won’t seem as batshit crazy as it actually is.
TallDave on December 15, 2009 at 6:58 PM
Not gonna happen. They would have to put all the provisions back in that just got scrapped out and then do the reconciliation. Too late for this tactic.
Rovin on December 15, 2009 at 8:11 PM
Bush passed his tax cuts under reconciliation.
Senate internal procedures are not in The Constitution.
Bleeds Blue on December 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM
Wait. I’ve heard that twice now. Is that actually TRUE? Did Barak Hussein Obama, The Most Articulate Human Being Ever, REALLY say that Congress is “on the precipice” of passing his socialized health care bill?
logis on December 15, 2009 at 8:27 PM
shove it HoDe you Obama selecting idiot
ginaswo on December 15, 2009 at 8:28 PM
I wonder if they will hold their noses and vote for it in the end..but if they do, can it be undone? I hope so. The whole thing is just absurd. Worse political class ever.
Terrye on December 15, 2009 at 8:35 PM
Oh yes, those horrid tax cuts. Tell me, are the Democrats planning to raise all those taxes again? And what about the millions of people Bush took off the rolls, are they going to have to start filing again?
BTW, reconciliation is meant for budgetary process..not the passage of major domestic policy.
Terrye on December 15, 2009 at 8:38 PM
Also, it will look similar…
Schadenfreude on December 15, 2009 at 11:26 PM
This is getting insane. I think these freaks are going to pass something/anything to give Obrother something to crow about at his State of the Union address
Nuremberg rally. Whatever they take out, they will doubtless put back in during reconciliation or attempt to, which I can’t understand why the leftist don’t see that. They want gold on a silver platter immediately.No matter what, we must run on a platform that proudly affirms conservative principles and promises to REPEAL as much of this communist garbage as possible.
Courage my comrades (I meant that last word in a friendly non-commie way)
J.J. Sefton on December 16, 2009 at 6:05 AM
Yeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggghhhh!!!!!
adamsmith on December 16, 2009 at 7:03 AM
And if they add reconciliation, this will all be undoable withiout a filibuster as well.
Chuck Schick on December 15, 2009 at 5:51 PM
Ya know, I had completely missed that. If they can pass it with 51 votes, they can un-pass it with 51 votes. My previous premise had always been that the republicans will never, ever have 60 or more votes to stop this, and certainly not between now and it’s implementation.
That being said, I can guarantee you that even in the unlikely event the republicans do get 51 votes in 2010, or the more unlikely event of 60 later on, they will never repeal this. They have not the balls. You know this as well as I do, republicans are simply not up to the task, and conservatives don’t have the demographic base in this country to get to the majorities they need.
runawayyyy on December 16, 2009 at 3:12 PM
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