Chris Matthews: We may never know if religion was a factor at Fort Hood

posted at 8:34 pm on November 6, 2009 by Allahpundit

Well … yes, that’s true, if you think anything short of Hasan sitting up in his hospital bed and declaring “why, indeed, religion was a factor at Fort Hood” amounts to irresponsible speculation. But here’s what we’ve got so far, according to eyewitnesses, colleagues, and friends. He considered the war on terror a “war on Islam” and himself a Muslim first and an American second; he thought Muslims had the right to stand up to the “aggressor” in the Middle East and is suspected of posting things online about the selfless heroism of jihadist suicide bombers; he was placed on probation for proselytizing about Islam to patients and colleagues and was sufficiently devout that he refused to have his picture taken with women; he once used a lecture at a medical conference as an opportunity to discuss how the Koran orders decapitation for infidels; and, oh yes, he yelled “Allahu Akbar” before opening fire.

Now, per the media’s favored Narrative, could a guy with that background have somehow compartmentalized that in his mind and been driven to kill entirely by pre-traumatic stress disorder or PTSD by proxy or whatever? I guess. Anything’s possible. But would the same benefit of the doubt be given to a nut trending towards fanaticism of a different ideological hue? Like I said yesterday on Twitter: You’ll know it’s okay to start speculating about Hasan’s motives when cops find a Glenn Beck book on his bookshelf. In fact, if the same “PTSD by proxy” elements had been present in Hasan’s bio but it turned out he’d attended a tea party or two, we’d already be well into hour 30 of a full-on media speculation orgy. The nutroots needed less time than that to pronounce conservatism collectively guilty of murder in the case of that hanged census worker, even though, as it turns out, he probably wasn’t murdered. But then, we’ve been over this ground before. For now, let’s simply look forward to this Sunday’s New York Times op-ed page, as Krugman and Rich and the rest of the gang who see murderers in every angry conservative face warn us how vicious it is to assume the worst about people because of one bad apple.

In fairness to Matthews, this isn’t a terrible interview. He does press his guest — a little — on the “Allahu Akbar” detail. What he doesn’t press him on is whether he’s the best person to be chatting about this subject. Anyone recognize our expert here?

Update: Incidentally, if Hasan does end up confessing to a jihadist motive, should we start re-thinking 9/11 as motivated in part by post-traumatic stress disorder? Bin Laden fought in Afghanistan against the Soviets, after all. Surely there must be some other explanation besides the obvious one.


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Timothy James McVeigh (April 23, 1968 – June 11, 2001) was a United States Army veteran and security guard who was convicted of bombing the Alfred P. Murrah Building in Oklahoma City on April 19, 1995, the second anniversary of the Waco Siege, as revenge or to inspire a revolt against what he considered a tyrannical federal government. The bombing killed 168 people and was the deadliest act of terrorism within the United States prior to the September 11, 2001.

Do not forget a white christian repug boy.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 12:34 AM

I’m sorry…how is this even remotely relevant?

And why is McVeigh the ONLY counter example libtards can come up with when trying to explaing away islamo-facisism?

Fed45 on November 7, 2009 at 2:12 AM

I vote for death by Bacon!

elduende on November 6, 2009 at 8:43 PM

For a minute there I thought you meant forcing him to watch movies starring Kevin Bacon.

Fed45 on November 7, 2009 at 2:17 AM

I watched MSNBC the night of the elections… I was shocked at how they have aged. They are all starting to look like the king in Lord of the rings who is taken over by the bad guy… the worm-tongue guy tells him what to do.

I wish Gandalf could come and knock the devil out of them. I used to like Matthews before he sold his soul completely.

petunia on November 7, 2009 at 2:39 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 12:34 AM

You are as despicable as the Man-Child precedent you worship. Why didn’t you point out the fact that McVeigh was dressed up like a priest passing out Bibles the morning before the bombing? Or that he was trying to convert people to Christianity? You could also point out all those New Testament verses calling for the forced conversion or death of non-Christians. After all there’s no difference between the two religions right, skank.

cjk on November 7, 2009 at 2:43 AM

Tomorrow Chris will probably have someone from the Southern Poverty Law Center telling us how the real terrorism threat is most like that group of some 20 odd skinheads in Mississippi or the 34 militiamen in Idaho.
BTW, send $ so we can continue this important work.

thegreatbeast on November 7, 2009 at 2:48 AM

I’m sorry…how is this even remotely relevant?

And why is McVeigh the ONLY counter example libtards can come up with when trying to explaing away islamo-facisism?

Fed45 on November 7, 2009

Mass murderer McVeigh is the best irrefutable example of a white, christian repug “Country-First Patriot” we have so far.

I know rethugs hate the truth, but do not bite me!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 3:33 AM

Being a muslim and killing anyone makes you guilty of religious-incited violence automatically if you ask me. You can’t worship a god created in the fanatic mind of a mass murderer and ever claim to be a peaceful person.

TheBlueSite on November 6, 2009 at 11:49 PM

christians rethugs never killed anyone? The Crusades never happened?

The Holocaust was just a figment of the Jewish collective and the Nazis christians did nothing wrong?

shrub w. bush and christians did not try to steal Iraqi oil by murdering 100,000 innocent Iraqis in search for the all-important WMD?

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 3:51 AM

The truth bites.

McVeigh was neither a Christian , nor a Republican, nor a patriot at the time he committed mass murder in the Oklahoma City bombing. On the previous page, I posted quotes from the Wikipedia article which refute such lies.

Stop spreading lies, and the truth will not hurt when it bites.

Loxodonta on November 7, 2009 at 3:57 AM

The truth bites.

McVeigh was neither a Christian , nor a Republican, nor a patriot at the time he committed mass murder in the Oklahoma City bombing. On the previous page, I posted quotes from the Wikipedia article which refute such lies.

Stop spreading lies, and the truth will not hurt when it bites.

Loxodonta on November 7, 2009 at 3:57 AM

Anyone can edit the wiki pages and falsify entries regarding any subject.

It was obviously in the interest of the rethugs to claim that the terrorist McV was neither a christian nor a patriot when all available evidence makes that irrefutably clear. All the Patriot groups he lived with and learned from were well documented by the FBI. His Roman Catholic upbringing cannot be lied away, and no one knows how many times he was buttloved by his catholic priests as a youngster or the extent of the deleterious mass attendances affected his mind.

Do you think he did not receive his christian last rites upon death? And voting one way once does not erase all the repugs’ false, erroneous ideas and policies that had infected his mind beyond the point of no return.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:37 AM

Muslims murder people in the name of their alleged religion in the name of their pagan moon god.

They have done this thousands of times.

wildcat84 on November 7, 2009 at 1:02 AM

christians rape
enslave
steal Iraqi oil
murder millions from the times of the Crusades to the present in the name of their alleged religion in the name of their pagan Jesus/Christ/messiah.

They have done this thousands of times.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:49 AM

You are as despicable as the Man-Child precedent you worship. Why didn’t you point out the fact that McVeigh was dressed up like a priest passing out Bibles the morning before the bombing? Or that he was trying to convert people to Christianity? You could also point out all those New Testament verses calling for the forced conversion or death of non-Christians. After all there’s no difference between the two religions right, skank.

cjk on November 7, 2009 at 2:43 AM

Grasshopper, have you ever heard of the CRUSADES and do you know what the christian thugs did to non-believers?

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:55 AM

As a Catholic, I too strongly believe that my religion comes first, and I am an American after that. I am a vet that proudly fought for my country in Korea, though morally I’d have a difficult time doing so with this nation today. It is not the same God and Constitutionally based, moral nation that I fought for many years ago. Not only is the entire secularized culture corrupted, but official America, at the highest levels, is causually supporting the culture of death, having killed off far more humans in the name of feminist politics than all the dictators we’ve fought in the last couple centuries. We are flirting with euthanasia and orgasmically elected a president who aggressively advocate the destruction of innocent live humans outside the womb.
This is a nation of not so subtle anti-Christianity and it reeks so in both parties and our national media and is one of the few true hate crimes not listed. If that had been a staunchly pro-life Catholic shooting people, the media wouldn’t have hesitated to nail the cause, supported by the wrath of most of its viewers.
We are a nation that no longer believes in freedom, free speech, and public servitude, but desire and accept a ruling class. Private property earned at great personal risk to individuals, is considered the spoils of the politicians and their special interest groups to raid and distribute among the politically powerful. Having more than your neighbor is anethma. Elections have become a farce, sovereignity is given away under the guise of the largest hoax in man’s history -climate change. Our teacher’s unions support aborting their own future clients. Our politicians never fail to lie and we are foolish enough to re-elect them -and they count on that.We have destroyed the black community through the subtle slavery of the nanny state, and are near imprisoning the souls of all to the almighty state. We no longer support fighting our enemies, but treat our friends and allies as if they were the enemies and our enemies as if they were our friends.
True,things are beginning to happen. The reaction to the takeover of our final few freedoms is too little, too late, perhaps -time will tell. But as I write this, one sixth of our economy and a lot more of our freedom is casually being taken away (more properly “given away” with over 40 percent wanting a scam of a healthscare bill that no rational person can say is better than what we have now.

I pray for America and yes, my God comes first.

Don L on November 7, 2009 at 5:45 AM

Well, kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:55 AM

I am sure that the Muslims were the very models of civility in warfare in the middle ages. A notion that they continue to this very day. People still angry about the crusades? That was not all western evil….not even mostly.

I would use Latin, but you would probably not understand it. So I shall simply say that your comment is off the point. The Crusades are not relevent to this thread or the present conflict.

We don’t have Baptist suicide bombers using the Bible as some sort of cheap prop. (Credit to Ann Coulter on some TV show.)

If we were the monsters that the likes you you believe we are, the Iraqi oil area would be a parking lot. You think the Soviets or Chinese would save the Muslims? Against a cruel west? Put the pipe down. If I were President, we would dispense with the problem economically and efficiently and make Detroit develop like Dubai with the proceeds. Or get out and let the radicals go back to tossing acid at girls, lopping off body parts and urinating in the drinking water. The oil states would have to sell the oil to somebody, eventually.

We have many problems and suffering poor in our nation and around the world. We were attacked. Kuwait was invaded. And we responded by trying to set a stable situation in place of insane tyrants. With soft measures, half measures and even begging and bribes. We have men dying. We are going bankrupt as a nation.

The abstract in this conflict sounds Christian and kind to me. Broke and dying. Handwringing, emotive defeatists in our media and government who have no respect for our basic values, the suffering of our soldiers or even the load of debt and misery they are loading on us and even our children ask us to use minimum force and maximum effort to deal with a violent and lawless culture.

Now, how does Saddam Hussain, hiding Bin Laden, invading Kuwait, gouging on oil prices and an eternal war with Israel look to you by comparison? Civilized or savage?

IlikedAUH2O on November 7, 2009 at 6:07 AM

second hand PTSD

Dpet on November 7, 2009 at 6:25 AM

Ever notice the pattern all the trolls have? They accuse, going back to the Crusades if needed, to make a point. When something like that is refuted, they start the personal insult. Then they answer pointed questions with counter-questions. Following next, they try changing the point of the thread.

Trolls deny evidence, and even sources they themselves will use. Wikipedia is fine for a lib to use but ‘questionable’ as a source when a conservative uses and article.

The tactics are the same among them, and they mix up which they’ll use. The idea is to browbeat, tire their opponent, and go away feeling like they won. Their whole mission is to win, not to change people’s minds.

It’s not worthwhile even debating them.

Liam on November 7, 2009 at 6:32 AM

Since Matthews is an idiot, he may never know if religion is a factor. It seems clear to the rest of the world that Islam was a factor in this massacre.

BottomLine5 on November 7, 2009 at 6:54 AM

Mass murderer McVeigh is the best irrefutable example of a white, christian repug “Country-First Patriot” we have so far.

I know rethugs hate the truth, but do not bite me!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 3:33 AM

You can’t be serious. I have read a lot of pretty stupid comments but Yours just won the prize. You quite frankly don’t know what You are talking about.

old trooper2 on November 7, 2009 at 6:59 AM

Read a little about the Crusades. They were organized to fight Islam when it overan Christian nations in the Middle East. They were a defensive move! The evil eminated from Islamic facists. Of course if you dig you will find acts that are considered extreme and unciviliozed by todays standards. Keep in mind that they occured in another era and judged by the morality of the day not extreme.

chicken thief on November 7, 2009 at 7:11 AM

More Mathews Schtick to improve his ratings. Every now and then you can catch him laughing at himself.

shtick also schtick or shtik (shtk)
n. Slang
1. A characteristic attribute, talent, or trait that is helpful in securing recognition or attention.
2. An entertainment routine or gimmick.

diogenes on November 7, 2009 at 7:17 AM

I guess I’ll never really understand the totality of the liberal ideology. I wish someone would create a matrix chart of where it all fits together. For instance, where does this reluctance of the liberals to call this what it is. This guy screamed Allahu Akbar prior to murdering 13 people, yet the Lame Stream Media is ignoring it, and when confronted with it, rejects it. It’s beyond “plitical correctness”, but I’d like to know where it fits into the liberal ideological matrix. Guess I’ll never know.

marklmail on November 7, 2009 at 7:22 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 3:51 AM

Hello troll, welcome to Hot Air.

nyx on November 7, 2009 at 7:26 AM

Chrissy is not a liberal. Chrissy will do anything to sleep with the President including lie about the vermin who shot up 30 soldiers. Chrissy will get his punishment soon enough when the GOP takes over Congress in 2010 and Palin is sworn in as President in 2012. Right now, Chrissy in the outs with Mr. Well Creased Pants and he is desperate to be back in.Chrissy will do anything for Ogasm. Anything.

nyx on November 7, 2009 at 7:28 AM

Chris Matthews better beware just how twisted he gets bending over. He aims to please Muslims. Because this was jihad, however, for Matthews to deny Hasan his due “glory” is an insult to all who aim to perform jihad, denying what they consider the most holy of holy personal sacrifice by rescinding Allah from the act.

maverick muse on November 7, 2009 at 7:45 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:55 AM

Put down the Time Machine kookoo and catch-up with civilization. Pretty clear where your coming from. Got a big poster of Rev. Jerry Wrong on your wall I’m guessing. I’m sure it wouldn’t be hard to tie you and “your” people into some pretty outrageous crimes and misdemeanors.

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 7:54 AM

Chris Matthews: We may never know if religion was a factor at Fort Hood

Who is this “we” Mr. Matthews? Are you speaking for your >1 million viewers? Because the rest of us already know.

Osis on November 7, 2009 at 7:56 AM

The Crusades never happened?

The Crusades were push back to halt and reverse the Muslim conquest of Europe. They worked. Until now.

Islam does not allow freedom of conscience. Islam is, on that account alone, not a legitimate religion. It is a totalitarian form of government masquerading as a religion. Soon it will be illegal to write this. The Muslims are winning the so-called war on terror and will continue to do so until we study and then challenge the legitimacy of Islam.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 8:08 AM

This is why the other networks are dragging the bottom of the ratings game.

They simply don’t make sense to reasonable people.

AnninCA on November 7, 2009 at 8:11 AM

What he means is that “we” (the Left) may never want to know if “religion was involved”–i.e., if the Arab shooter was a jihadi terrorist. The disadvantage of such knowledge would be to admit that there is a war on terror–a war that during the Bush years was restricted to foreign soil, but which now under Obama has mutated into a domestic version (think of it as Palestinian Swine Flu).

The Left simply isn’t ready for these inconvenient truths and will have to deflect any discussion for a later date.

If you ever wonder why Liberals are such incompetents, this is a good example. They always play defense. Slowly but surely the Obama administration (much like the Clinton admin) is getting bogged down in silly wars with Fox, Alinsky-style attacks against perceived wrongs done against it by the insurance industry, trying to prop up dreadful candidates, trying to deflect attention away from the obvious insanity of Nancy Pelosi, and always trying to play catch-up in a world that doesn’t sit still.

No wonder Obama loves golf so much. More his speed.

EMD on November 7, 2009 at 8:18 AM

The Crusades were push back to halt and reverse the Muslim conquest of Europe. They worked. Until now.

Islam does not allow freedom of conscience. Islam is, on that account alone, not a legitimate religion. It is a totalitarian form of government masquerading as a religion. Soon it will be illegal to write this. The Muslims are winning the so-called war on terror and will continue to do so until we study and then challenge the legitimacy of Islam.
Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 8:08 AM

Islam is winning the war on terror, but only in Europe. And this is only because the Europeans (the ultimate in Liberals in Denial, the ultimate appeasers) are letting it happen. Europe will never have a 9/11 the way we did; it isn’t necessary. Rather than the Eiffel Tower being blown to bits, the more likely outcome is that in a few generations Notre Dame will be converted into a mosque, and no one will care. That’s Europe.

Islam will never win the war on terror against America, in spite of our spineless Liberal children.

EMD on November 7, 2009 at 8:25 AM

No wonder Obama loves golf so much. More his speed.

Wrong. The overriding ethic of golf is, don’t cheat.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 8:25 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 4:55 AM

Are you related to dave742, idiot?

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 8:26 AM

Ever notice the pattern all the trolls have? They accuse, going back to the Crusades if needed, to make a point. When something like that is refuted, they start the personal insult. Then they answer pointed questions with counter-questions. Following next, they try changing the point of the thread.

Trolls deny evidence, and even sources they themselves will use. Wikipedia is fine for a lib to use but ‘questionable’ as a source when a conservative uses and article.

The tactics are the same among them, and they mix up which they’ll use. The idea is to browbeat, tire their opponent, and go away feeling like they won. Their whole mission is to win, not to change people’s minds.

It’s not worthwhile even debating them.

Liam on November 7, 2009 at 6:32 AM

The kids are out of bed at last.

The Crusades are not to be mentioned precisely because its totality could not be effectively or conveniently argued against as the model for present day christian brutality and rampant arrogance.

Do not mention the Slave Trade as it was not our (present day white christians’) fault and do not mention the Holocaust as the white ass pure Aryan Nazis were not really christians and it was too long ago by about 60 years.

What is the point of the thread again?

That followers of the dead Jew are peaceful and never commit atrocities against non-believers?

When something like that is refuted, they start the personal insult

Ever notice the pattern all the trolls have?

Troll is what you were raised to call your mother?

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:30 AM

What he means is that “we” (the Left) may never want to know if “religion was involved”–i.e., if the Arab shooter was a jihadi terrorist. The disadvantage of such knowledge would be to admit that there is a war on terror–a war that during the Bush years was restricted to foreign soil, but which now under Obama has mutated into a domestic version (think of it as Palestinian Swine Flu).

I could not understand why both sides were getting furious with me over the characterization of the shooter. I personally think the guy is a mass murderer, very similar to other mass murderers. He fits the FBI profile perfectly, which always works best in hindsight, of course.

He falls into the category of mass murderers who focus on a cause or an institution. His obsession was the army and the war against Muslims as he framed it.

I was catching heat from both lefties and righties. I just finally figured out that this is, as the posters says, really all about politics. The left doesn’t want that label, because then they’ll lose bragging rights that Obama kept them safe, too. The right wants to annoint this as terrorism because that gives them bragging rights that Bush did the job better than Obama.

And doofus me thought we were actually talking about what happened.

We need to address what to do about mass murderers before they explode. There’s always a triggering event of some sort. This guy’s triggering event was his deployment, it appears.

We heard from the VA Tech students/teachers/friends almost the same as what we’re hearing from Ft. Hood’s shooter’s co-workers/peers/etc. They all knew he was off. They all saw the growing rage.

The issue for America isn’t about Bush or Obama. The issue is what steps should be taken when people see this. We need a kind of awareness that would allow us to simply recognize that this problem exists and here’s what averts catastrophe.

AnninCA on November 7, 2009 at 8:32 AM

We may never know if it was Richard Nixon dressed as Santa on the grassy knoll.. (or was it Santa dressed like Nixon?)

UncleOlaf on November 7, 2009 at 8:33 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:30 AM

Your true colors are shining through.

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 8:36 AM

Islam will never win the war on terror against America, in spite of our spineless Liberal children

Islam is winning. Hasan should have been booted out of the army when he praised suicide bombers and attacked the mission even in front of those to whom he was paid to administer. The army was too PC to deal with him.

Immediately after an Islamic attack the media spins it as something else. The vast majority of Americans are too PC to deal with the realities of Islam.

The juxtaposition of idiotic political correctness and the resolve of Islam portend the Islamicization of America.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 8:36 AM

For seekers interested in some genuine scholarship about the Crusades, try this one out. Readable and comprehensive in scope. An eye-opener. You can google for a synopsis and reviews.

Title: The First Crusade: A New History
Author: Thomas Asbridge
Publisher: Oxford University Press
ISBN: 0195178238

marybel on November 7, 2009 at 8:38 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:30 AM

You are a very bitter person to be pitied. And evidently, you didn’t hear. He is risen indeed!

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 8:42 AM

The Crusades were push back to halt and reverse the Muslim conquest of Europe. They worked. Until now.

Islam does not allow freedom of conscience. Islam is, on that account alone, not a legitimate religion. It is a totalitarian form of government masquerading as a religion. Soon it will be illegal to write this. The Muslims are winning the so-called war on terror and will continue to do so until we study and then challenge the legitimacy of Islam.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 8:08 AM

Clearly you never studied History as a subject. and you are too lazy to google it up.

If you did you would at least acknowledge the madness and incomparable brutality of the christian crusaders in the wars to conquer Jerusalem and overun Arab lands and loot and rape and enslave the citizens of these areas.

The Arabs will never forget and there are books and historical events cementing their eternal repugnance of the christian genocidal wars.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:45 AM

We’ll know. It’ll be FOX who tells us though, not the MSM.
gee we have a big ole Muslim with the button. Lets hope he doesn’t want to make a statement anytime soon.

johnnyU on November 7, 2009 at 8:47 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:30 AM

You are a very bitter person to be pitied. And evidently, you didn’t hear. He is risen indeed!

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 8:42 AM

Great!

Barack Hussein Obama is PROTUS.

Deal with it!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:49 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:49 AM

Buck Farack Obama!… you broken puppet monkey troll.

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 8:53 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:49 AM

Ooooh…I am overcome by your dazzling wit and brilliance. It’s POTUS, Not PROTUS. Now run along. Cartoons are on.

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 8:53 AM

Did they have Open Registration last night. Where did this kookoobin come from?

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 8:56 AM

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 8:56 AM

From under a bridge somewhere.

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 8:58 AM

The Holocaust was just a figment of the Jewish collective and the Nazis christians did nothing wrong?

Hey koko puffs, Nazism had nothing to do with Christianity.

Your stupidity is showing.

Maybe you should have been paying attention in school instead of writing “Rethugs r the SUXXORS LOL” all over your notebook.

tsj017 on November 7, 2009 at 9:01 AM

Funny how the Left doesn’t think we’ll know if religion was an issue if the suspect is a Muslim but they always know that racism is the issue when a white person doesn’t support Obama.

katiejane on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

Barack Hussein Obama is PROTUS.

Deal with it!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:49 AM

What’s a PROTUS? “Playing Rex Of The United States” ?

oldernwiser on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

Unstinkingbelievable…
the MSM has become so PC, it makes me sick…
they will deny religion until it hits one of their own

cmsinaz on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

Funny how the Left doesn’t think we’ll know if religion was an issue if the suspect is a Muslim but they always know that racism is the issue when a white person doesn’t support Obama.

katiejane on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

+1000

cmsinaz on November 7, 2009 at 9:03 AM

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

Classless, insignificant, little Troll. You’re not going to be around here very long.

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 9:04 AM

Your true colors are shining through.

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 8:36 AM

I hope so.

Rethugs do not bother me.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 9:07 AM

Barack Hussein Obama is PROTUS.

Deal with it!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:49 AM
What’s a PROTUS? “Playing Rex Of The United States” ?

oldernwiser on November 7, 2009 at 9:02 AM

Hmmm, let’s see . . . PR of the United States . . . what could that possibly mean? Oh, I’ve got it! Just add ICK!

tsj017 on November 7, 2009 at 9:08 AM

Methinks kokobin is the same person as nemecizer. Please people do not bother responding to this poster or the thread will devolve rapidly. This poster is nothing but a bomb-throwing baiter. He/she is not interested in logical open-minded discussion only a slugfest.

Now, relative to this thread, I don’t believe the argument should be whether this was motivated by religion (although I believe it most certainly was). My main concern is why this guy, a committed muslim, was kept in the military after problems surfaced. In my opinion this whole episode has exposed the danger of POLITICAL CORRECTNESS in our country. It is honorable to want to not offend people, but not at the expense of truth. We must come to grips with the truth of this matter or we will continue to put ourselves in unnecessary danger.

KickandSwimMom on November 7, 2009 at 9:09 AM

Rethugs do not bother me.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 9:07 AM

Which is why your loser ass just spent twelve hours here posting the same thing over and over and over and over and over… wait a sec. You can stop now; Mom’s got breakfast ready.

Doorgunner on November 7, 2009 at 9:10 AM

What makes Chris Matthews such a dumb jackass?
We may never know!

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:11 AM

Where did this kookoobin come from?

He’s a suicide-blogger for the Incompetent in Chief.

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:17 AM

Clearly you never studied History as a subject. and you are too lazy to google it up.

If you did you would at least acknowledge the madness and incomparable brutality of the christian crusaders in the wars to conquer Jerusalem and overun Arab lands and loot and rape and enslave the citizens of these areas.

The Arabs will never forget and there are books and historical events cementing their eternal repugnance of the christian genocidal wars.

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 8:45 AM

Why do you cirticize someone for not knowing their history when you could use some brushing up yourself?

The Crusades were a brutal and dark time for Christiandom, no querstion about it. The dirty little secret is that the West is still reaping the benefits of the Crusades the same way America is reaping the benefits of the land we acquired from the Red Man.

The Crusaders themsevles were a mixed bunch with a large number of them being devout Christians who truly thought they were doing God’s work. There were profiteers among them as well, especially in the later Crusades, but the first was certainly a “holy war” just as Muhammad’s call to Jihad which united the Arab people and put the Holy Land in Muslim hands from Christian hands.

I’m going to get into it in detail but let me just say that as brutal as the Crusades were (All war is) they: 1) prevented Islam from spreading further into Europe and pushed it back, 2) made Europe look more united and powerful than it was to the Mongol Hordes who were set to push further west before they witnessed the mighty Crusader armies, 3) snapped Europe out of the Dark Ages by introducing it to a new world of trade, science and culture.

The Crusades can not only be looked at as a war of response, but a war of defense. Listening to history teachers today you would think that the Crusades were somehow different than any other war out there and that the Crusaders were more evil than any other soldier out there. No mention is ever made of the original Jihad which wrestled the Holy Land out of Chrisitan hands in the first place or the benefits all these wealthy revisionists of today enjoy because of the Crusades of yesterday. As embarassing and horrifyingly Un-Christian the Crusades were, the fact remains that those who are unwilling to fight will always be subject to those who are.

Daemonocracy on November 7, 2009 at 9:19 AM

Daemonocracy on November 7, 2009 at 9:19 AM

Excellent synopsis. Well done.

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 9:21 AM

Kokobin, please don’t refer to my God as a “dead Jew”. He’s not dead, as he conquered death. I’m fine with you not believing, but please respect my beliefs. I know it makes you feel witty and that you have balls. Go to an Islamic site and say something equally as offensive about Allah or Mohammed if you have any balls. Hitting people that turn the other cheek isn’t like real brave.

adamsmith on November 7, 2009 at 9:21 AM

tsj017 on November 7, 2009 at 9:01 AM

KoKo puffs… too funny. This Troll is dumber than a thimble full of hamster vomit with the smart chunks taken out.

ronnyraygun on November 7, 2009 at 9:21 AM

“………….. In my opinion this whole episode has exposed the danger of POLITICAL CORRECTNESS in our country………”

KickandSwimMom on November 7, 2009 at 9:09 AM

When you are a Politically Correct Muslim, you have to kill innocent people in the name of your religion. Otherwise, you are an “Infidel”.

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:23 AM

He’s a suicide-blogger for the Incompetent in Chief.

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:17 AM

I must say, grasshopper

that was funny!

kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 9:25 AM

Hey kokobin!

How are you?

Let’s check out some of what you say.

The Crusades? Absolutely there were events that we, in our modern age, would consider barbaric. However, the Crusades were a response to Islamic aggression. That raping and pillaging and looting that you pointed out all so clearly, and yes, was participated in by Crusaders was initiated by Muslims. Oh, and it’s pretty much still going on today. Not the Christians mind you, but in the name of Islam.

The Slave Trade? Evil, plain and simple, however it was through the actions of “white Christians” that the Slave Trade was ultimately abolished. Check out information on William Wilberforce. Fascinating stuff.

The Nazis? Seriously? Christian? heh. Dude, you really need to check your history. There were some people who called themselves Christian who aligned themselves with Nazi ideology but it was, ultimately, godless.

As for McVeigh. Not Christian, not a Patriot. Just a paranoid sob who murdered.

Hope this helps.

sincerely,

MT

Mistahtibbs on November 7, 2009 at 9:28 AM

Daemonocracy?

Well said.

MT

Mistahtibbs on November 7, 2009 at 9:29 AM

Daemonocracy on November 7, 2009 at 9:19 AM

Excellent synopsis. Well done.

kingsjester on November 7, 2009 at 9:21 AM

Yes; I second the motion.
The Crusades wouldn’t have been successful if they had tried to conduct them like the United States is trying to run a “war” in Afghanistan today.
They had to counter violence with violence, otherwise die a miserable death. They eradicated a major disease that threatened their civilization. As we should do.

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:30 AM

Kokobin, please don’t refer to my God as a “dead Jew”. He’s not dead, as he conquered death. I’m fine with you not believing, but please respect my beliefs

He doesn’t have to respect your beliefs and you don’t have to respect his irrational beliefs. It is politically correct nonsense to suggest we have to respect each other’s beliefs no matter how odious. I do not respect a so-called religion that does not allow freedom of speech and conscience.

I do not respect Islam. This gives Muslims the right to say anything they want about me just as long as they don’t threaten me.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 9:44 AM

The press can insist all they like on one narrative, but the casual observor will likely come to a different conclusion. You can stretch credibility only so far before people begin to ignore you. The media is experiencing that now.

zoyclem on November 7, 2009 at 9:48 AM

The last time I checked he is not alive.
kokobin on November 7, 2009 at 9:42 AM

Listen up locointhekokobinladen.

On the third day He arose from the dead and ascended into heaven.

Heaven is eternal. No one dies in heaven. Wrap that around your Muslim mind.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 9:51 AM

As for Hasan, it was criminal that the Army did not act sooner. I heard on NPR (after making some ridiculous PC statement that you can’t determine if religion was part of this) then report that Hasan gave a speech at a medical convention (the type where you describe a new technique or medication to fellow physicians) and proceeded to rant on how non believers in Islam would be decapitated in hell and have hot oil poured down their throats. A Muslim doctor in the audience tried to interrupt him and say his interpretation was flawed and was shouted down. The doctors in attendence were horrified by the display. And then Hasan did a similar rant on another public occasion. Talk about a warning sign.

Here is a writen summation of the NPR audio.

We have a doctor treating soldiers who thinks the wars they are fighting are evil and that non believers in Islam are going to burn forever in hell? Heads need to roll (not actually as Hasan would support but figuratively) for sure, because someone seriously screwed up not getting this mad man out of the Army sooner.

And next time Andrew Sullivan or Charles Johnson or some other idiot disparges Christians over something trivial, someone please slap them in the face and tell them to shut up. I am sorry, but Christians and Jews are not doing these sorts of crimes. Muslims are. There is something very wrong with Islam right now. I recognize it is a minority extremist faction of the religion, I am not blaming all Muslims. But Islam and Muslims have to deal with and stop this madness.

Mr. Joe on November 7, 2009 at 9:53 AM

I think the problem here is the difference between motivation and justification.
Clearly, there currently is no link, and there probably never will be, between the motive for this act and Islam.
That said, when a guy is running around killing at random while yelling “Allahu Akbar“, it’s pretty clear in my mind that he is using Islam as a justification for his acts.

J_Crater on November 7, 2009 at 9:56 AM

I respect peoples’ right to believe in Islam. I don’t believe in it, and as long as it doesn’t affect me(unfortunately it does, their Jihad includes me)they can believe whatever they want to. Our government was founded with that concept in mind.

No, Kokobin doesn’t have to respect me or vice versa. It’s just easier that way. I’m also one of the most politically incorrect people I know. Respect is lacking in all of our modern socially engineered society (Johnson’s Great Society). People seem to get uglier by the day. A little “Do unto others” can go a long way.

adamsmith on November 7, 2009 at 9:58 AM

See this video featuring Obama’s apparently selective philosophy on jumping to conclusions: http://optoons.blogspot.com/2009/11/president-obama-on-jumping-to.html

Mervis Winter on November 7, 2009 at 10:01 AM

I couldn’t watch it when the terrorist from CAIR starts criticizing the coverage.

PattyJ on November 7, 2009 at 10:02 AM

Hasan is a muslim terrorist who planned a terrorist attack, just like the scum that attacked us on 9/11.

It was always all about his religion and he said so.

Ever notice the pattern all the trolls have? They accuse, going back to the Crusades if needed, to make a point. When something like that is refuted, they start the personal insult. Then they answer pointed questions with counter-questions. Following next, they try changing the point of the thread.
Liam on November 7, 2009 at 6:32 AM

That’s the tactic employed by all the trolls I’ve seen.

And going back to the crusades will not help them against anyone who actually knows their history. They do not, they will just throw out whatever shiite they can and hope it sticks.

Around here that tactic doesn’t work out to well. The HA crew is an extremely literate an thoughtful group.

dogsoldier on November 7, 2009 at 10:07 AM

Chris Matthews: We may never know if religion was a factor at Fort Hood

Chris Matthews may never know if religion was a factor in the hijackers flying planes into the Twin Towers on 9/11.

Uniblogger on November 7, 2009 at 10:08 AM

As for Hasan, it was criminal that the Army did not act sooner at all, despite the obvious threat.

There is something very wrong with Islam right now.

How about forever. Islam is always on the attack whenever there is any chance of victory.

I recognize it is a minority extremist faction of the religion, I am not blaming all Muslims

.

It’s irrelevant whether a small minority of Muslims are active extremists. Events are determined by a tiny fraction of the population. The religion itself is extremist. Islam is a totalitarian political movement intent on world domination. Muslims are trying to make it illegal to criticize Islam. A religion that does not tolerate freedom of speech and conscience is not legitimate.

But Islam and Muslims have to deal with and stop this madness

Why should they? Their enemy, the infidel, has no clue.

Basilsbest on November 7, 2009 at 10:10 AM

That said, when a guy is running around killing at random while yelling “Allahu Akbar“, it’s pretty clear in my mind that he is using Islam as a justification for his acts.

J_Crater on November 7, 2009 at 9:56 AM

Its more than that, though. Please examine all the reported statements the terrorist made and all the prep work he did leading up to his terrorist attack.

He extolled the virtues of other terrorists and following his religious beliefs acted in the same manner as his terrorist heroes.

dogsoldier on November 7, 2009 at 10:11 AM

Yes; I second the motion.
The Crusades wouldn’t have been successful if they had tried to conduct them like the United States is trying to run a “war” in Afghanistan today.
They had to counter violence with violence, otherwise die a miserable death. They eradicated a major disease that threatened their civilization. As we should do.

Cybergeezer on November 7, 2009 at 9:30 AM

without the crusades, and people like Charles Martel, the whole world would be muslim already.

thank God for the Crusades!!

and yes we don’t fight total war like we did in WWII…no total war = no total victory.

right4life on November 7, 2009 at 10:12 AM

Matthews is a douche but we already knew that.

RobCon on November 7, 2009 at 10:21 AM

The press can insist all they like on one narrative, but the casual observor will likely come to a different conclusion. You can stretch credibility only so far before people begin to ignore you. The media is experiencing that now.

zoyclem on November 7, 2009 at 9:48 AM

Absolutely. All the fringe pundits are going to see their ratings slide, I think.

The fad of the screaming shows is just about over, thank goodness.

AnninCA on November 7, 2009 at 10:23 AM

Good for you Mistahtibbs (re your post of November 7, 2009 at 9:28 AM), correcting kokobin on history, particularly with respect to Hitler’s German National Socialism and Christianity. Hitler’s German National Socialism was a form of socialism and was godless. To be in the SS, you had to disaffiliate with the Christian Church. A number of the top German National Socialists were stridently anti-Christian.

I recommend reading Brit historian Richard Overy’s Wolfsom Prize winning “The Dictators,” which is a heavy work of history comparing Hitler’s German National Socialism with Stalin’s Bolshevik Socialism and found them to be at bottom the same basic system, just a different conception of utopia. The chapter on religion reflects that both were godless.

I also recommend reading Laurent Murawiec’s “The Mind of Jihad,” a seminal work that shows radical Islam to be the 21st century successor to the 20th century totalitarian ideologies of German National Socialism and Bolshevik socialism. Among mnay things, Murawiec shows that radical Islam is an ideology of death that has been influenced by German National Socialism and Bolshevik socialism.

People like kokobin are really ignorant. Unfortunately, that ignorance spawns a political correctness that has and will get people killed. As Mark Steyn writes today, it would be a bad day for us and a good day for the Taliban and al Qaeda if 13 Americans were killed and 31 wounded in Afghanistan. That is what one radical Islamist inflicted here at a home base in America.

Phil Byler on November 7, 2009 at 10:36 AM

I got sidetracked by the thread. I originally meant to write how idiotic Chris Matthews is. He should be considered a pathetic lunatic, not a serious political commentator.

Phil Byler on November 7, 2009 at 10:38 AM

Maybe we could get some crackerjack reporter to do some investigative work on the guy. He is still alive, you know. Hey, wait…maybe the actual perp could tell us things, too. Maybe we could sit down and talk to him about his life and possibly glean some information to conclude motive. I dunno. It’s worth a shot.

Diane on November 6, 2009 at 8:55 PM

Get Jack Bauer to handle the interrogation.

1921 C DRUM on November 7, 2009 at 11:03 AM

Its crackheads like you and others that want to destroy the boy scouts and respect the bastards that are killing Americans. You will never understand, never ever. You are incapible of it.

bluegrass on November 7, 2009 at 11:13 AM

The suggestion he suffered from PTSD is prima facie absurdum, since he was not combat deployed. Faced with that fact, the media resort to extolling some theory of Second-hand Traumatic Stress Disorder.

Hey, if he can get cancer by sitting in a bar and inhaling other peoples’ cigarette smoke, then he can be driven to murderous rampage by sitting to listen to other soldiers’ traumatic experiences, right?

lacerta on November 7, 2009 at 11:14 AM

I’ll tell you whose responsible:
THE EVIL ZIONISTS

After all, according to many, aren’t the Zionists responsible for all the evil in the world.

I bet the Zionists made Hasan snap by zapping him with their mysterious ray guns which can penetrate walls, just like they did to torment that Honduras dude last month.

The “Evil Zionists” probably picked Hasan because they knew he was of Palestinian descent. And afterwards, they probably celebrated by drinking more blood of Palestinian children. (Ask anyone in the Arab street and they will confirm that the evil Zionists drink the blood of Palestinian children and steal their organs for transplantation as well.)

Yes, sir, this is a much more probable explanation than it was Islam that made him do it.

guest77 on November 7, 2009 at 11:23 AM

lacerta on November 7, 2009 at 11:14 AM

Hasan will somehow be portrayed as the “victim” over time.

Military=Bad
Guns=Bad
America=Bad

Radical Islamist on a Mission to Exact Justice for Allah=Victim with Pure Motives

/s

Otis B on November 7, 2009 at 11:25 AM

If a skinhead handed out copies of “Mein Kampf” in the morning to his neighbors, stood on a table, screamed “White power!” and shot up a room full of black people, then would Chris Mathews know what was a factor in that individual’s actions?

scrubjay on November 7, 2009 at 11:38 AM

The Scary Part
Suppose we had a mechanism that would have stopped this?

Better that we have a few dozen (score, thousand) people dead than make wacked out Muslims feel watched or uncomfortable. Theoretical chats among libs like our Affirmative Action Hero in the White House are very touchy feely about negative thoughts or even vibes cast at nonwhites so the whole putrid bunch will have to “just not think about it” for a while. Till there is something else in the news.

I would love to see the news if a right wing nationalist had started the same mess in the Harvard Faculty Lounge? Ok, I know there is no place with exactly that name but…

IlikedAUH2O on November 7, 2009 at 11:48 AM

Sorry that i missed scrubjay on November 7, 2009 at 11:38 AM

IlikedAUH2O on November 7, 2009 at 11:49 AM

I have a hunch that Hasan is going to play the victim card and say everyone was so, so mean to him that he just lost it. He’ll find alot of sympathy with the Liberals all the way from the Huffington Post to NBC and be legally represented by some MoveOn.org type lawyers who will proclaim what a terrible place America is because of the right wingers.

OxyCon on November 7, 2009 at 11:51 AM

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