GOP health-care reform cost: $61 billion, cut deficit $68 billion

posted at 10:55 am on November 5, 2009 by Ed Morrissey

CBO director Douglas Elmendorf scored the new proposal from House Republicans on health-care reform and gave them plenty of ammunition to use against expansive and expensive Democratic plans for government takeovers.  Their plan, which relies on interstate competition, HSAs, and tort reform, would only cost $61 billion in the first ten years of the plan — or slightly less than 6% of what Democrats plan to spend to overhaul the entire system:

This evening, CBO released a preliminary analysis of a substitute amendment to H.R. 3962, the Affordable Health Care for America Act, proposed by Representative John Boehner, the Republican Leader in the House of Representatives. CBO and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) estimate that the amendment would reduce federal deficits by $68 billion over the 2010-2019 period; it would also slightly reduce federal budget deficits in the following decade, relative to those projected under current law, with a total effect during that decade that is in a broad range between zero and one-quarter percent of gross domestic product.

Unlike the Democratic proposals, the bill would actually reduce premiums:

CBO anticipates that the combination of provisions in the amendment would reduce average private health insurance premiums per enrollee in the United States, relative to what they would be under current law-by 7 percent to 10 percent in the small group market, by 5 percent to 8 percent for individually purchased insurance, and by zero to 3 percent in the large group market.  Those are averages, however, and they are subject to a great deal of uncertainty; some individuals and families in each market would see different results.

Compare this to what Democratic Rep. John Yarmuth told Fox News earlier this week:

Premium costs will still go up under ObamaCare, and Yarmuth neglects to mention one thing about the costs.  Prices may drop — may — relative to what they would be without federal intervention, but the federal intervention costs a lot of money, too.  We’ll all be paying for that in taxes and fees assessed to insurers, providers, and innovaters in the pharmaceutical and medical-device industries.  We just won’t see those costs directly.  It’s a shell game that Yarmuth and the Democrats are playing.

Susan Ferecchio has more at the Washington Examiner:

The CBO put the price tag for the GOP plan at $61 billion, a fraction of the $1.05 trillion cost estimate it gave to the House bill that lawmakers are set to vote on this weekend. And the CBO found that the Republican provision to reform medical malpractice liability would result in $41 billion in savings and increase revenues by $13 billion by reducing the cost of private health insurance plans. …

According to CBO, the GOP bill would indeed lower costs, particularly for small businesses that have trouble finding affordable health care policies for their employees. The report found rates would drop by seven to 10 percent for this group, and by five to eight percent for the individual market, where it can also be difficult to find affordable policies.

The GOP plan would have the smallest economic impact on the large group market that serves people working for large businesses that have access to the cheapest coverage. Those premiums would decline by zero to 3 percent, the CBO said.

For the 87% of Americans who have insurance and who overwhelmingly like the system, this is a much better prescription for real cost savings, and without the heavy government intervention that threatens the liberty and economic stability of Americans.  The only people disadvantaged by this plan are those pursuing ObamaCare out of ideological animus towards the private market.

Update: Getting a lot of heat for my last sentence on Twitter.  The truth is, though, that there are only somewhere between 11 million and 14 million people without coverage due to poverty, and this would gain coverage for somewhere between 20%-25% of those.  It’s also not our responsibility to provide health insurance to the masses; that would be a choice, not a duty.  Over half of the uninsured are satisfied with their position and their care, which is different from insurance. And comprehensive insurance is the biggest problem with health-care costs in America, anyway.  Spending a trillion dollars to address a nearly nonexistent problem makes it clear that it’s a screen for another agenda completely.

Update II: Ezra Klein argues that this shows the superiority of the Democratic plan, which covers more people (about 30 million) and “saves $36 billion more than the Republican plan.”  However, that Democratic plan doesn’t include the costs of the “doctor fix”, which apply to the Democratic bill because they use Medicare and Medicaid to expand coverage — which is why the Democratic plan will not save any money at all.  But let’s say for a moment that we accept that number.  Why would we spend an additional $1 trillion to “save” another $36 billion?  That would be a waste of 97% of the expenditure.

The Democratic plan “saves” money by playing around with pricing (and ignoring their parallel compensation boost), not through actual savings, and even those savings expire in the second decade.

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ELECTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES…..

America elected MORONS and now those MORONS have the power!

SDarchitect on November 5, 2009 at 11:00 AM

I just hate when politicans use Common Sense.

Let see Rahm, Axlerod, Pelosi and Reid spin this.

SmallGovtGuy on November 5, 2009 at 11:00 AM

Why didn’t they formally release their plan months ago? The airwaves should have been inundated with commericials touting the GOP plan.

flyfisher on November 5, 2009 at 11:02 AM

How many people would it cover?

Look, I don’t want either of these things to pass. I think the system’s more or less fine. But lets not gloss over the bad news. 61 billion for 3 million ain’t worth it.

Trent1289 on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

Not nearly enough. Better than the Obamacrats’ takeover bill, but not enough for all of this to be worth it.

These clods spend $68 billion in an afternoon.

Good Lt on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

First plank of the 2010 Contract with America

Rogue on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

If you go to MSM the only thing you will find is that it doesn’t cover as many people as the Democrat bill.

Cindy Munford on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

The Party of No.

BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 11:04 AM

These clods spend $68 billion in an afternoon.

Good Lt on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

That’s how much it reduces the deficit over the next decade. And it will reduce premiums.

There’s not a whole lot of downside.

BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 11:06 AM

The Party of No(t enough people covered under the Republican plan) is one possible spin.

Mark Boabaca on November 5, 2009 at 11:07 AM

Sounds spectacular to me. I’m in the bracket where I probably wouldn’t see a huge decline, but over all, it’s not about me saving money. It’s about making health care affordable for all. It can be done, but not the Democrats way.

To throw the entire system into complete upheaval, and tax us til we break is rediculous, and only proves one thing. This is not about health care for Democrats. It’s about gobbing up power, and hoarding it, thereby making EVERYONE dependent on them for our scraps.

capejasmine on November 5, 2009 at 11:07 AM

I think the Democrats bill will actually drive up the number of uninsured. I a family is struggling to pay heir insurance, or share of it, now, what is going to happen when those premiums immediatedly increase 20-30% to cover all the Dems tax and mandates. They will drop the insurance and wait until someone gets sick.

The Republican plan would go al ong way to fix what is broken.

bopbottle on November 5, 2009 at 11:08 AM

But, but, this will…make children starve!

/

perroviejo on November 5, 2009 at 11:08 AM

1.2 trillion or 61 billion to make health care more affordable…hmmmm…hard decision!

deidre on November 5, 2009 at 11:08 AM

There’s not a whole lot of downside.

Perhaps.

Good Lt on November 5, 2009 at 11:09 AM

sounds OK. . . but they really need to look at allowing people to get catastrophic health insurance.

The problem comes when the government dictates that every special interest gets covered. If we had catastrophic catch-all plans for people, we could make insurance affordable. I have some basic plans with deductible and co insurance that cost less than 25 bucks a month for some people. Affordability only becomes an issue when they force insurance to cover things like sex changes and maternity for 60 year olds.

ThackerAgency on November 5, 2009 at 11:09 AM

Tort Reform?

AHHHHHHHHH!!! No!!!

/

perroviejo on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM

/agree

Still costs too much for the impact it’d have. 3 million additional covered? Is that correct?

$61 billion to cover 3 million people is over $20k per additional person covered.

Hey guys – it’d cost less to simply group these folks and go out and buy them coverage on the open market.

Midas on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM

Word is Rahm and some of his buddies were present during the CBO analysis and word on the street is they were packing heat.

katy on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM

Why didn’t they formally release their plan months ago? lyfisher on November 5, 2009 at 11:02 AM

Probably because the overwheming majority of the American electorate have the attention span of an 8 year old with ADD.

marybel on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM

Pass the GOP bill NOW, before a crisis turns into a catastrophe!

fogw on November 5, 2009 at 11:11 AM

but this plan doesn’t give the government control over everything?????? how could this possibly be a good solution???

/sarc

search4truth on November 5, 2009 at 11:11 AM

I do appreciate the attempt to fix a problem without throwing more of my money at the problem.

Every solution from the D’s is for them to spend more money. There have to be solutions that don’t involve them spending money. But that’s all our government does these days – spend money. If they weren’t spending money, they wouldn’t have anything to do. I wish they would quit spending money they don’t have. I wish they wouldn’t expect the people that they are taking money from to love them.

Obama’s campaign speeches in 2012 will go something like this. . . I SPENT ALL YOUR MONEY SO VOTE FOR ME!

ThackerAgency on November 5, 2009 at 11:11 AM

yeah, but how many pages is it?

joeindc44 on November 5, 2009 at 11:12 AM

Let see Rahm, Axlerod, Pelosi and Reid spin this.

SmallGovtGuy on November 5, 2009 at 11:00 AM

The GOP Health Care plan wants people to DIE!!!!!

The GOP Health Care plan is RACIST!!!!!!

The GOP Health Care plan does not help Michelle’s CHILDREN!!!!

The GOP Health Care plan will hurt the Trial Lawyer INDUSTRY!!!!!

Spectreman on November 5, 2009 at 11:12 AM

How many people would it cover?

Look, I don’t want either of these things to pass. I think the system’s more or less fine. But lets not gloss over the bad news. 61 billion for 3 million ain’t worth it.

Trent1289 on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

I would imagine everyone that’s willing to pay for their own health care. Some just don’t pay, thinking they don’t need it. All others, have medicare, medicaid, and SCHIP. No one is turned away.

The problem, in my opinon is….there are just some people who would rather spend money on lottery tickets, beer, and other assorted goodies, and have their health care handed to them via the tax payers.

capejasmine on November 5, 2009 at 11:12 AM

One item that the GOP bill doesn’t seem to address is insuring the currently insured. Do they address this issue at all with their proposals?

Dennis_Second_Thots on November 5, 2009 at 11:13 AM

Why didn’t they formally release their plan months ago?

flyfisher on November 5, 2009 at 11:02 AM

Perhaps they took the time to do it right, instead of rushing to patch together a 2000 page monstrosity by competing teams of staff members during one weekend?

What’s good about the GOP plan is that it basically relies on markets to do the heavy lifting. It clearly shows the public the different philosophies of government the two major parties have.

What’s bad about it, and I should put bad in quotes, is simply that it is politically unaccceptable to the liberal political class. It’s not going to fly under the Pelosi-Reid leadership. Won’t even get a perfunctory hearing.

jwolf on November 5, 2009 at 11:13 AM

Why didn’t they formally release their plan months ago? The airwaves should have been inundated with commericials touting the GOP plan.

flyfisher on November 5, 2009 at 11:02 AM

Because they tried to play by the rules. Practically everything in the GOP bill had been attempted to be debated, but the Dems blocked them.

NoNails on November 5, 2009 at 11:14 AM

ThackerAgency on November 5, 2009 at 11:09 AM
Affordability only becomes an issue when they force insurance to cover things like sex changes and maternity for 60 year olds.

Just another cold hearted conservative that does not care for other. ;-)

This is NOT rocket science Dems. Unleash the free market and live by the words of the funder of your party

I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it.

- Thomas Jefferson

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:14 AM

That’d be nice if it were the goal. But of course, it’s not.

lorien1973 on November 5, 2009 at 11:14 AM

yeah, but how many pages is it?

joeindc44 on November 5, 2009 at 11:12 AM

I believe it was just north of 200 pages. Meaning people have probably read the damn thing.

Doughboy on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

This isn’t what Alan Grayson told me. But then again, I did find it off-putting that he was rocking back and forth and eating paste during the conversation.

bighead4 on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Again, this is why I like Allah, because he doesn’t engage in “happy talk.” Allah would’ve mentioned that this plan only covers 3 million people by 2019. That barely covers population growth. Ed’s often just a shill for the Republican party, regardless of how bad their ideas are.

We don’t need healthcare reform at all. And we don’t need to spend 61 billion dollars on something that would do absolutely nothing.

I know this plan has no chance of passing and that it was only drawn up so counter the Democrat’s “party of no” attacks, but this plan is idiotic. They were better off making the freedom and liberty argument. And the Constitutionality one.

Trent1289 on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Unfortunately, the bill didn’t tackle the purging and pre-existing conditions issue.

Good start though. I did like the small group premium decrease estimate, although the CBO warned that projected figure is impossible to nail down.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

I think the Democrats bill will actually drive up the number of uninsured. I a family is struggling to pay heir insurance, or share of it, now, what is going to happen when those premiums immediatedly increase 20-30% to cover all the Dems tax and mandates. They will drop the insurance and wait until someone gets sick.

The Republican plan would go al ong way to fix what is broken.

bopbottle on November 5, 2009 at 11:08 AM

That’s the idea. Eventually they want to force everyone onto the government plan.

capejasmine on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Boehner has unlimited time during debate doesn’t he? He should read the entire 2000+ page bill and then read the GOP’s alternative.

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

gophergirl on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

It would be nice if people could start concentrating on the more important aspects, such as the Constitutionality and also something that has not been discussed in the public debate – the REVERSIBILITY of this idea from the GOP. The Dem plan is an un-Constitutional, all-in, functionally irreversible change to the system. Once we start having problems and seeing the awful effects of the Dem idea of national socialization of health care and the immense expansion of the federal government into areas it is not allowed to go, there will be no real way to stop it. The Dems are fully committing the US, when all of the state examples of such systems that we know are on target to bankrupt every state that has tried it.

One of the keys to this debate is the irreversibility of the traitorous dem notion. What sort of moron would not try a reversible and simple change, first, but instead jump to fully committing our nation to a system that has left nothing but a sea of overwhelming red ink and destruction of advancements within the system? Shrillary only got a minor bit passed in her moronic attempt to kill health care in 1993, and she killed the vaccine industry and led to vaccine shortages (which few talk about these days, even though we have been in the middle of swine flu vaccine shortage while the morons in Washington have declared the wine flu a national emergency).

The major points of the dem rape of health care:

- Un-Consitutional

- Irreversible

- Bankrupting and a killer of medical advancement (see Shrillary’s ‘vaccines for Children’ idiocy to get an inkling)

progressoverpeace on November 5, 2009 at 11:17 AM

Boehner has unlimited time during debate doesn’t he? He should read the entire 2000+ page bill and then read the GOP’s alternative.

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

gophergirl on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

and read all the laws that are “linked” to in ObamaCare. That might bring the bill to 10,000 pages.

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:17 AM

$61 billion to cover 3 million people is over $20k per additional person covered.

Midas on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM

That’s over ten years — so about $2000 per person per year. That’s ballpark for most insurance plans (mine’s about $800/month for 4 people, so about $2400 per person per year, and I’d guess that’s fairly typical.)

notropis on November 5, 2009 at 11:18 AM

and read all the laws that are “linked” to in ObamaCare. That might bring the bill to 10,000 pages.

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:17 AM

Exactly – just keep reading, go all night if you have to.

The MSM can’t ignore that and it would make an impact.

gophergirl on November 5, 2009 at 11:20 AM

I rather think its a bit of genius for the Republicans to bring this plan out now…AFTER the huge wins in VA and NJ…which has the blue dog Democrats running scared. So the Republicans make epic wins in those states…and then what do they do? Release a plan from THEIR side of the aisle that costs massively LESS than the Democrat plan, but ALSO LOWERS COSTS which the Democrats say is impossible to do. Makes the Dems look incompetent in my book, and shows the voters they did the right thing by turning back to the right. :-D Smart move, Congressional Republicans…smart move!

Highlar on November 5, 2009 at 11:22 AM

That’s over ten years — so about $2000 per person per year. That’s ballpark for most insurance plans (mine’s about $800/month for 4 people, so about $2400 per person per year, and I’d guess that’s fairly typical.)

notropis on November 5, 2009 at 11:18 AM

Wow! That seems high. Ours is about $350 a month, for 4 people. Just think how much yours, and maybe mine would go down , if they opened insurance companies up, and let you buy from different companies around the country!

capejasmine on November 5, 2009 at 11:22 AM

yeah, but how many pages is it?

joeindc44 on November 5, 2009 at 11:12 AM

Good question! Because as we all know, the thicker the bill the better the legislation. Otherwise known as politics by the pound. :-0

Seriously, it dawns on me the GOP could well be throwing a lifeline to Pelosi and company if they simply give up on the notion that they can seize 1/6th of the economy. They could moan about how unfair it all is but in the name of those urgently needing healthcare express a willingness to agree to the GOP plan.

Keep in mind the filthy lying coward in the White House needs to pass something called healthcare reform even if it is a program to provide a box of band-aids to every household in America. He and his corrupt party are far too committed to drop the issue and they need to get out from under their own very unpopular program. A good political strategy would be to take the GOP plan, tinker around the edges with some issue like closing the benefits gap, and call it a day.

highhopes on November 5, 2009 at 11:23 AM

“Asset test” the uninsured before you start stealing my money to pay for someone else.

NO BIG SCREEN TV FOR YOU. INSURANCE FIRST.

marklmail on November 5, 2009 at 11:24 AM

OT/

In-laws called. They just arrived at capital for protest. Large crowds, people still streaming in from all directions. Lots of chanting, people in good spirits.

joshlbetts on November 5, 2009 at 11:24 AM

I am thrilled that the GOP FINALLY came up with an actual bill instead of feeding into the image of “the party of NO” that the Democrats slapped on them. Now we can have some real debate on the issue.

As far as the actual contents of the bill, I have heard bits and pieces that I like (free market approach, interstate competition, tort/malpractice reform, Health Savings accounts) but I haven’t looked at the actual bill yet. I wonder how long it is and how comprehensive the language is? Pelosi’s is 2,000 pages of legal talk, it would be awesome if the Republican plan was a weekends worth of easy reading.

Daemonocracy on November 5, 2009 at 11:25 AM

Smart move, Congressional Republicans…smart move!

Highlar on November 5, 2009 at 11:22 AM

The blue dogs would be well advised to jump on to this plan or announce their rejection of the Dem plan quickly, unless they really want to be bribed into supporting Pelosi.

highhopes on November 5, 2009 at 11:25 AM

OT/

In-laws called. They just arrived at capital for protest. Large crowds, people still streaming in from all directions. Lots of chanting, people in good spirits.

joshlbetts on November 5, 2009 at 11:24 AM

All right Michele – you go girl! I hope this is successful.

gophergirl on November 5, 2009 at 11:25 AM

$61 billion to cover 3 million people is over $20k per additional person covered.

Midas on November 5, 2009 at 11:10 AM
That’s over ten years — so about $2000 per person per year. That’s ballpark for most insurance plans (mine’s about $800/month for 4 people, so about $2400 per person per year, and I’d guess that’s fairly typical.)

notropis on November 5, 2009 at 11:18 AM

I stand corrected, thanks. :)

Midas on November 5, 2009 at 11:26 AM

I just hate when politicans use Common Sense.

Let see Rahm, Axlerod, Pelosi and Reid spin this.

SmallGovtGuy on November 5, 2009 at 11:00 AM

It is Unconstitutional.

joeswampy on November 5, 2009 at 11:26 AM

All legislation has unintended consequences, but I’d rather the unintended consequences cost $61 billion instead of $1.2 trillion.

ZenDraken on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Why didn’t they formally release their plan months ago? The airwaves should have been inundated with commericials touting the GOP plan.

flyfisher on November 5, 2009 at 11:02 AM

Over 80% of the provisions in this plan were submitted as amendments to the Democrats bill, and REJECTED along party lines. This is your new government.

Rovin on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Doesn’t the GOP plan require providing insurance despite pre-existing conditions? Isn’t that enough to still destroy the private insurance industry and push us to govt. care eventually?

aikidoka on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Unfortunately, the bill didn’t tackle the purging and pre-existing conditions issue.

Good start though. I did like the small group premium decrease estimate, although the CBO warned that projected figure is impossible to nail down.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Pence was just on Fox saying that he would let the states deal with the pre existing conditions, like they are doing now. The money saved could go to help those that have pre existing conditions.

Brat4life on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

People who have insurance for $350 a month or even $800 a month, bear in mind, if you are in a small group, as you get older costs go waaaaaay up. Try $1400 a month of 2 people between 50-55 years old, and it is a high deductible plan. It gets worse each year. I am looking for anything that will reduce these costs.

bopbottle on November 5, 2009 at 11:28 AM

So this is the “game changer”.

the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 11:28 AM

“Asset test” the uninsured before you start stealing my money to pay for someone else.

NO BIG SCREEN TV FOR YOU. INSURANCE FIRST.

marklmail on November 5, 2009 at 11:24 AM

marklmail on November 5, 2009 at 11:28 AM

GOP needs to put out some companion summary tables/charts comparing the two plans, stating their intent/goals. It would help the public a lot.

NickelAndDime on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

What is beyond me is treating – expansion of coverage and decrease of cost as separate issues -if the cost of healthcare is decreased (really decreased, not dcotors and hospitals fleeced, or taxpayers picking up the difference between price and cost)-the coverage will expand automatically – just think about it – you get betetr product at lower price -you will sell more.

anikol on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

Spending a trillion dollars to address a nearly nonexistent problem makes it clear that it’s a screen for another agenda completely.

Awww. come on. Just come out and say it–they’re just trying to return that wealth to the people “who created it in the first place.”

///s///

ted c on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

All legislation has unintended consequences, but I’d rather the unintended consequences cost $61 billion instead of $1.2 trillion.

ZenDraken on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Actually if you look at the math this bill presents a net savings of $7 billion over 10 years.

Johnnyreb on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

GOP needs to put out some companion summary tables/charts comparing the two plans, stating their intent/goals. It would help the public a lot.

NickelAndDime on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

Ross Perot is getting busy on that. ;-)

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:30 AM

Unfortunately, the bill didn’t tackle the purging and pre-existing conditions issue.

Good start though. I did like the small group premium decrease estimate, although the CBO warned that projected figure is impossible to nail down.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM
Pence was just on Fox saying that he would let the states deal with the pre existing conditions, like they are doing now. The money saved could go to help those that have pre existing conditions.

Brat4life on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

–Unfortunately, the states are not going anything significant to help with the pre-existing conditions. In Texas, the high risk pool premiums are 200% of standard individual premiums, making them unaffordable to most people. If Pence was sincere (which I don’t think he is), he would have done more.

Jimbo3 on November 5, 2009 at 11:31 AM

Unfortunately, the bill didn’t tackle the purging and pre-existing conditions issue.

Good start though. I did like the small group premium decrease estimate, although the CBO warned that projected figure is impossible to nail down.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

Actually, I caught a bit about this on FNC last night…didn’t really know what they were talking about until too late to catch just a bit. But there IS something in the bill about pre-existing conditions. They have a way of working that over, too. And the bill is only somewhere around 218 pages long or so, which means any media (hyuck hyuck) should be able to read it and figure though it, unlike the monstrosity that the Democrats have put up.

Highlar on November 5, 2009 at 11:31 AM

aikidoka on November 5, 2009 at 11:27 AM

Any reform’s going to do that. There’s a significant electoral mandate for making pre-existing conditions a non-issue when it comes to paying for treatment. Denying that over a slippery slope scare isn’t exactly the best way to win hearts and minds out there.

ernesto on November 5, 2009 at 11:32 AM

I think there is a measure to address catestrophic coverage, which is different than pre-existing conditions. Pre-existing conditions can be anything and insurance companies use them as an excuse to deny coverage. If you have a bit of a catch in your get-a-long, that is a pre-existing condition that could prevent you from finding coverage. That kind of denial needs to stop.

bopbottle on November 5, 2009 at 11:32 AM

People who have insurance for $350 a month or even $800 a month, bear in mind, if you are in a small group, as you get older costs go waaaaaay up. Try $1400 a month of 2 people between 50-55 years old, and it is a high deductible plan. It gets worse each year. I am looking for anything that will reduce these costs.

bopbottle on November 5, 2009 at 11:28 AM

–The total amount of my employer coverage for a family of four is about $1400/month. We’re in the same age bracket. Unfortunately, the GOP plan is a feeble attempt at trying to do something for political cover.

Jimbo3 on November 5, 2009 at 11:33 AM

GOP needs to put out some companion summary tables/charts comparing the two plans, stating their intent/goals. It would help the public a lot.

NickelAndDime on November 5, 2009 at 11:29 AM

Pointing out that the GOP plan wouldn’t cover the uninsured sounds counterproductive.

ernesto on November 5, 2009 at 11:34 AM

Actually, I caught a bit about this on FNC last night…didn’t really know what they were talking about until too late to catch just a bit. But there IS something in the bill about pre-existing conditions. They have a way of working that over, too. And the bill is only somewhere around 218 pages long or so, which means any media (hyuck hyuck) should be able to read it and figure though it, unlike the monstrosity that the Democrats have put up.

Highlar on November 5, 2009 at 11:31 AM

Interesting. I’ll look for that.

I really think the mainstream GOP needs to buck the common knowledge that this bill has no chance and force the discussion.

That’s real leadership.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:35 AM

Liberals have lost track of what this debate has been about. It’s been about lowering costs, not expanding coverage. The latter comes from the former.

uknowmorethanme on November 5, 2009 at 11:36 AM

Jimbo3 on November 5, 2009 at 11:33 AM

But what in ObamaCare reduces the cost of healthcare? Subsides reduce to the cost of one set or people and raise it for another. Price controls do NOT have a record of success, so what else is there in Obamacare to reduce costs to society as a whole?

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:36 AM

You have to have a solution for the pre-existing problem.

Being an employer based insurance country we have to have alternatives for when people lose there jobs. I think it should be included in Life Insurance plans.

tomas on November 5, 2009 at 11:36 AM

–Unfortunately, the states are not going anything significant to help with the pre-existing conditions. In Texas, the high risk pool premiums are 200% of standard individual premiums, making them unaffordable to most people. If Pence was sincere (which I don’t think he is), he would have done more.

Jimbo3 on November 5, 2009 at 11:31 AM

I agree. The reality is that this isn’t about individuals as much as about survival for small businesses.

That’s the ticket to ANYONE’s power in the future.

Back small business, you’re going to win.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:37 AM

Their plan, which relies on interstate competition, HSAs, and tort reform,

Sounds like a good start. They should probably add in a provision that allows insurance companies to sell cheap catastrophic-care-only insurance, which could attract young, healthy people into the health-insurance market.

They should also enable the establishment of for-profit, private cooperatives whose only business is buying and selling health insurance, enabling uninsured individuals and small businesses to pool their resources and buy insurance at cheaper, large-group rates. If the co-ops are private, and several of them are in competition with one another, market forces will tend to drive prices down, while the only government intervention would be to guard against fraud, and prevent them from using premiums to make risky investments outside the health insurance industry. The establishment of such co-ops could be encouraged by favorable tax rates, less than the normal corporate tax rate.

Steve Z on November 5, 2009 at 11:37 AM

Unfortunately, the bill didn’t tackle the purging and pre-existing conditions issue.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:15 AM

How can you provide insurance for a pre-existing condition? It’s like trying to buy flood insurance when the water’s already up past your ankles.

PackerBronco on November 5, 2009 at 11:37 AM

Pointing out that the GOP plan wouldn’t cover the uninsured sounds counterproductive.

ernesto on November 5, 2009 at 11:34 AM

IT is not in the federal government’s power to muck around in health care, let alone to cover the uninsured. If you don’t think the Constitution has any say in the limits of the federal government, why don’t you just make all hospitals federal government hospitals and no one gets charged for anything. THey just walk in and get treated? WOuldn’t that be easy? You don’t even have to give your name. Just stroll through the front door and the feds pay for everything. Isn’t that what you really want and think is appropriate?

Sheesh.

progressoverpeace on November 5, 2009 at 11:38 AM

I need to understand understand something. Republicans had 6 years, after Bill Clinton’s attempt to national health care, to fix this issue themselves, why didn’t they do it? I’m not trying to take the piss but Republicans had the chance and they blew it. I’m not for ObamaCare, I know what’s it like to wait hours in line for the doctor, but the fact is, the republicans left the door open allowing the Infantile in Chief to make a mess.

Michelle Dubois on November 5, 2009 at 11:38 AM

Liberals have lost track of what this debate has been about. It’s been about lowering costs, not expanding coverage. The latter comes from the former.

uknowmorethanme on November 5, 2009 at 11:36 AM

I personally think that’s because they are being disingenuous. The Democratic Congress is out-dated. They backed Obama over Hillary PRECISELY because they were in a notalgiac phase of life, led by Kennedy. Back to the 60′s.

That was so obvious to me. Good gravy. War protests? Let me dig out my peace symbol.

So they are all about entitlement programs. Which we all know, regardless of our label, don’t work.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:39 AM

The term “pre-existing condition” forfeits your right to INSURANCE for that condition. You can’t INSURE something that’s already happened.

uknowmorethanme on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

Back small business, you’re going to win.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:37 AM

As a small business owner (100 employees), I would rather NOT have to provide for my employees health insruance, retirement, etc. I jsut want to give them a good work environment and good pay of the services they provide me so they can take care of their needs as they see fit.

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

I agree with those above that are saying when costs go down, coverage spreads automatically. Part of that pesky “free market” things those darn Republicans keep harping on. :-P Also, I believe others are correct, in that this bill is made up of the bills they TRIED to bring up (buying across state lines, etc.), but were shot down by Democrats every time…which, to me, is a GOOD thing. Because now they can point to the Democrats rocking their amendments each time…and show how the CBO scores them against Democrat rejection. ;-) Again, another smart move, I think.

Highlar on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

national=nationalize.

Michelle Dubois on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

Sounds like a good start. They should probably add in a provision that allows insurance companies to sell cheap catastrophic-care-only insurance, which could attract young, healthy people into the health-insurance market.

Steve, bingo. That’s what I thought made sense; but, then, I paid attention to the depression we’re in. *haha

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

progressoverpeace on November 5, 2009 at 11:38 AM

Im fully aware of the conservative argument. Selling it is something altogether different than rhetorically justifying it. Obama didn’t hurt himself when he ran on finding a way to cover everyone. Sure, you’ve hit him hard on the details since then, but the intents, the policy goals, are another matter. Going against the goal is much harder than hammering at the current details (rightly, i might add).

ernesto on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

Good Lt.

It is not merely $61B to cover 3 million more people. It is $61B to reduce actual insurance costs by as much as 10%.

The 3 million increase in insureds is a comes, I suspect, from the lower cost of insurance generally.

Troll Feeder on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

So they are all about entitlement programs. Which we all know, regardless of our label, don’t work.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:39 AM

Amen

uknowmorethanme on November 5, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Why not just give every legal citizen the same coverage Congress gets, use 300 million people as the pool to keep premiums down, open it up to all insurance companies to bid for your business, and limit malpractice law suits to $250,000.00 with a “looser pays” clause…?

See, it wasn’t THAT hard.

Seven Percent Solution on November 5, 2009 at 11:41 AM

Setting aside the Constitutionality of government being financially involved in health insurance at all, the GOP proposal addresses a good segment of the actual problem on the ground, not some pie in the sky “if we throw enough money at it we can solve it” Democrat “solution.”

The Dems have been saying since last summer that the GOP has offered no real proposals. Well, this is a proposal. Will the Dem-controlled Congress allow an open debate on the merits? Probably not.

coldwarrior on November 5, 2009 at 11:41 AM

As a small business owner (100 employees), I would rather NOT have to provide for my employees health insruance, retirement, etc. I jsut want to give them a good work environment and good pay of the services they provide me so they can take care of their needs as they see fit.

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:40 AM

I don’t blame you. I am on the board of a non-profit with only 2 employees.

Health insurance premiums are threatening the viability at this point.

AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:41 AM

This is a start. All of these issues, pre-existing conditions, catastrophic coverage, etc. can be addressed after the implementation of the cost-cutting/saving measures. Let’s see how these incremental changes work, then tackle the other issues. This is where Medicaid may have a place for some of the sicker individuals who have pre-existing conditions. Throwing the whole system out w/PelosiCare is just stupid. All of her revenue and savings are based on taxes and penalties. What happens when you no longer have the same amt. of $$ coming in from the penalties? Taxes go up! It is madness. It needs to be scrapped. NOW!

JAM on November 5, 2009 at 11:41 AM

why didn’t [the GOP]do it?
Michelle Dubois on November 5, 2009 at 11:38 AM

Cloture votes in the senate could never be overcome, so little to no effort was put into it.

Health care is not a big issue, see current polling.

Bush tried to focus on a more simple, but huge and more imminent, problem first, SocSec. You know how that went.

WashJeff on November 5, 2009 at 11:43 AM

The first rule of holes is: Stop Digging!

The US is in a huge financial hole. Obama is digging as fast as possible.

Would somebody please take his shovel away?

The Republican plan at least addresses some of the causes of the increased costs. The Pelosi plan protects the lawyers and allows them to keep digging.

The Rock on November 5, 2009 at 11:43 AM

In-laws called. They just arrived at capital for protest. Large crowds, people still streaming in from all directions. Lots of chanting, people in good spirits.

joshlbetts on November 5, 2009 at 11:24 AM

The big thing I’m waiting to see is what Pelosi does when they start storming Congressional Office buildings in an effort to see their representatives instead of being snubbed by the snotty twentysomething that answers the phone or e-mails.

It will be political suicide, IMO, for Pelosi or the Capitol Police to shut out these people. I also think that this is what Bachman expects to happen and wants the visual of thousands trying to get to see their elected representatives on the cusp of major legislation but unable to get there by the palace guard controlled by Pelosi in her role as Speaker.

In other words, I fully expect today’s rally to be politically akin to George Wallace standing in the way of desegregation while his troops used firehoses on the masses.

highhopes on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

I personally think that’s because they are being disingenuous. The Democratic Congress is out-dated. They backed Obama over Hillary PRECISELY because they were in a nostalgia phase of life, led by Kennedy. Back to the 60’s.
That was so obvious to me. Good gravy. War protests? Let me dig out my peace symbol.
So they are all about entitlement programs. Which we all know, regardless of our label, don’t work.
AnninCA on November 5, 2009 at 11:39 AM

It’s completely disingenuous for some to label themselves as ‘Progressive’ when they really want the country to go backwards.

Why do things that are proven to not work?

Juno77 on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Pointing out that the GOP plan wouldn’t cover the uninsured sounds counterproductive.

ernesto on November 5, 2009 at 11:34 AM

You’re missing the point completely. The point is that this does this have to be a one shot deal? Is Congress never meeting ever again? Are no more laws to be passed, ever? You have to start with the low hanging fruit and then deliberately restructure the system. That’s the smart way to accomplish reform.

A “hail mary” in the 1st quarter is just plain stupid.

NickelAndDime on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

I stand corrected. The text of the Boehner bill is now available. It requires states to set up high risk or reinsurance pools and to offer coverage, if they have a high risk pool, at 150% of standard insurance rates. It provides $15 billion of federal funds for the first several years, then adds an additional $10 billion annually for the period 2015-2109.

Here’s the link: http://www.gop.gov/solutions/healthcare. Click on the text.

Jimbo3 on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Affordability only becomes an issue when they force insurance to cover things like sex changes and maternity for 60 year olds.

ThackerAgency on November 5, 2009 at 11:09 AM

Bingo. My understanding is that USAA members can pick and choose from a menu of types of coverage. This is how things ought to work in 2009. One-size-fits-all is unnecessary and will bankrupt the country.

Missy on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

How many people would it cover?

Look, I don’t want either of these things to pass. I think the system’s more or less fine. But lets not gloss over the bad news. 61 billion for 3 million ain’t worth it.

Trent1289 on November 5, 2009 at 11:03 AM

Not having read the bill yet, just reading news reports about it, from what I gather its not going to cover anyone, what it will do is lower costs so individuals can cover themselves if they want. Which sounds much more resonable than some trillion dollar tax boondoggle which will cover everyone through force of punitive financial levys.

Koa on November 5, 2009 at 11:44 AM

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