Breaking: Massacre at Fort Hood; Update: Feds tracked Hasan’s posts online for six months? Update: Surveillance video added
posted at 3:44 pm on November 5, 2009 by Allahpundit
No word yet on motive, but the fact that at least three gunmen are involved already has Shuster and Miklaszewski mentioning similarities to the Fort Dix Six plot on MSNBC. Seven dead, 12 wounded so far. Supposedly two of the gunmen are still at large and one has fired shots at the SWAT team on the scene.
Stand by for updates.
Update: New details from CNN: One gunman “neutralized,” one “cornered,” no word on the third. The shooting happened at the “sports dome,” a.k.a. the soldier readiness station.
Update: Whether there are two shooters or three seems to be in dispute at the moment, but there’s certainly more than one: The second shooting on the base evidently occurred at a theater.
Update: M-16s involved:
At least seven people have been killed and at least 12 more wounded in a mass shooting at Fort Hood Army Base near Killeen, Texas, that apparently began minutes before a graduation ceremony was to begin at a base sports complex, Pentagon officials said.
Details of the events were sketchy, but officials said the shooting involved two men with M-16 rifles and began about 1:30 p.m. Central time at Howze Theater on the base, then moved to the sports complex, where the graduation ceremony was scheduled to begin at 2 p.m. It was not immediately clear who the ceremony was honoring.
Update: Fox News says there are reports that the men were dressed in fatigues.
Update: Hearing reports on Twitter that there have been shootings in the parking lot of some store in Killeen, the town adjacent in Fort Hood. Grain of salt, though: I haven’t seen anything like that on the wires.
Update: One of the shooters is alive and in custody. We should have a motive soon.
Update: MSNBC TV says two shooters are in custody now.
Update: CNN now says the death toll is nine.
Update: MSNBC’s story has been updated to say that four SWAT members were wounded in the shootout with the gunmen.
Update: Am hearing via Twitter that Fort Hood’s public affairs office says the earlier reports of a third shooter were wrong and were based on a second eyewitness report of the second shooter. Which means everyone’s in custody now.
Update: Heavy suspicions of a fragging grow heavier still. From Chuck Todd’s Twitter account: “More from NBC’s Pete Williams: US official says early reports are the man in custody is in the military, late 30s, with officer rank.”
Update: Good lord — there’s a report from BNO News on Twitter that new shooting is being heard on the base. Nothing on the wires yet. Big grain of salt.
Update: Press conference being held now. 12 dead, 31 wounded. No idea of motive yet but it sounds like both shooters are military. Or rather, were: One of the shooters is dead.
Update: Okay, wait, I misunderstood: According to MSNBC, there were three shooters. One is dead, two more are in custody. Has there ever been a case of “battle stress” that involved a conspiracy by multiple people?
Update: From the local Fox affiliate, how it all went down. Evidently McClatchy’s report of M-16s was wrong:
According to officials, a soldier carrying two handguns opened fire at about 1:30 p.m. Thursday at the Soldier Readiness Center at the post in Killeen, Texas.
“It would be an environment that would be very susceptible to casualties or injuries,” Killeen City Manager Connie Green said.
Officials said the gunman was shot and killed after quick response from security officers.
At least two other soldiers were taken into custody.
Update: Hmmmm: “A senior administration official told NBC News analyst Roger Cressey that the suspect who was in custody was an Army major with an Arabic-sounding name. The official said the shootings could have been a criminal matter rather than a terrorism-related attack and that there was no intelligence to suggest a plot against Fort Hood.”
Update: The suspect’s name, via ABC: Major Malik Nadal Hasan.
The suspected gunman was identified as Major Malik Nadal Hasan. He was killed and two other suspects have been apprehended, Lt. Robert W. Cone said.
The gunman used two handguns, Cone said. He wasn’t sure if the shooter reloaded the weapons during the attack.
The general called the attack “a terrible tragedy, stunning.” He said the community was “absolutely devastated.”
According to Brian Ross at ABC, Hasan was a convert to Islam.
Update: In case you’re wondering whether the other two soldiers in custody were actual accomplices or just being questioned because they knew Hasan, Rick Perry just said at the presser he’s holding that all three were shooters.
Update: CBS reports that Hasan was a licensed psychiatrist in Maryland, of all things. Meanwhile, Kay Bailey Hutchison apparently has info that Hasan was upset about being deployed to Iraq. Which, without further specifics as to why, doesn’t tell us much given the possible motives in play.
Update: This story deserves its own post but an update here will have to do: Remember that census worker who was found hanged, allegedly with the word “Fed” scrawled on his chest, which was of course instantly the fault of bloodthirsty wingnuts everywhere? The AP reports today that investigators increasingly doubt he was murdered and are looking now at suicide. Just something to bear in mind when the tut-tutting over making assumptions about Hasan begins tomorrow.
Update: Per the last update, here’s another reminder of why it’s always a bad idea to speculate too much: Contra Brian Ross, the AP says it’s unclear what Hasan’s religion was or whether he was a convert.
Update: And yet another reminder: Hearing rumblings on Twitter right now that Perry was wrong and that the two other “suspects” have now been released. Was Hasan, in fact, a lone gunman? If so, how’d those four SWAT members end up wounded? Surely he didn’t surprise them all after they arrived on the scene.
Update: Something else worth flagging re: the tut-tutting about motives and speculation: The media had no problem today, even in its earliest reports on the shooting, noting how many soldiers have suffered from combat stress. In fact, apparently, it was one of the ways Charlie Gibson framed his report on tonight’s ABC News.
Update: If Hasan was a lone gunman, how could the general at his presser earlier say there were eyewitness accounts of more than one gunman? And if neither of the two suspects in custody are that other gunman, then where is he?
Update: Of the 11 killed (beside Hasan), 10 were soldiers and one was a cop.
Update: For what it’s worth, an eyewitness report of Arabic being shouted during the attack:
Hunt said his son told him he loaded up many of the wounded and drove them to the hospital. The wounded relayed what they saw inside when the shooting happened.
“They were telling him that one guy was shouting something in Arabic while he was shooting,” Tom Hunt said. “He couldn’t say much more than that.”
Update: No mention of shouting in this eyewitness report, though:
George Stratton’s son George Stratton III was five feet away from the shooter at the Soldier Readiness Center and suffered a gunshot wound to his left shoulder.
“He said he was there doing medical stuff and all of a sudden someone came through the door, walked behind the desk and just started shooting,” Stratton told FoxNews.com.
He said about 15 rounds went off and people started dropping to the floor.
“He peaked up over the desk and that’s when he was shot in the shoulder, and he just went down again. He said he saw one of his NCOs get badly shot,” Stratton told FoxNews.com after talking to his son in the hospital.
Update: Hasan’s performance evaluation while at Walter Reed was, perhaps not surprisingly, a poor one.
Update: Lots of buzz on Twitter about Shep Smith’s interview with a colleague of Hasan’s who claims he was known to say things about standing up to the American aggressors in the Middle East. I can’t find a clip or print account, though. If you see one, please e-mail it to our tips account; I don’t have time to follow the comments below.
Update: Local news is reporting that one of the wounded has died. 12 now besides Hasan.
Update: Apparently, one of Hasan’s cousins just told Shep that he’s always been Muslim, not a recent convert.
Update: So much for the “combat stress” theory: ABC News reports that his upcoming deployment to Iraq would have been Hasan’s first.
Update: Here’s the Shep interview with Ret. Col. Terry Lee alleging that Hasan thought Muslims should stand up and fight the “aggressor” and that he was “happy” about the shooting in Little Rock. Apparently Hasan was also increasingly agitated by the fact that Obama hasn’t pulled out of Afghanistan and Iraq.
Update: The two suspects detained earlier were released, but according to Rep. John Carter, another one was just hauled in.
Update: Here’s another Shep interview that people are buzzing about, this one with Hasan’s cousin. The cousin says Hasan decided after 9/11 that he didn’t want to deploy overseas, that he heard horrific stories from returning soldiers, and that he was harassed by other troops.
Update: The circumstantial evidence mounts. This certainly jibes with what Terry Lee told Shep:
Federal law enforcement officials say the suspected Fort Hood, Texas, shooter had come to their attention at least six months ago because of Internet postings that discussed suicide bombings and other threats.
The officials say the postings appeared to have been made by Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, who was killed during the shooting incident that left least 11 others dead and 31 wounded. The officials say they are still trying to confirm that he was the author. They say an official investigation was not opened…
One of the Web postings that authorities reviewed is a blog that equates suicide bombers with a soldier throwing himself on a grenade to save the lives of his comrades.
The $64,000 questions: What was he doing at Fort Hood among the population if he thought suicide bombers were heroes? And why are the feds tipping the AP about this if they haven’t even confirmed that he was the author yet?
Update: Another good question from Andy Levy: “If Hassan got poor performance evaluations, why was he promoted to Major in May?” Also, why didn’t they grant him a discharge if what his cousin said is true about him not wanting to deploy since 9/11? Why did they keep this guy around? Fox could track down Terry Lee in a few hours to have him talk about Hasan urging Muslims to stand up to America, but the Army couldn’t do it in a few years?
Update: Here’s what Hasan supposedly wrote about suicide bombers:
“To say that this soldier committed suicide is inappropriate. Its more appropriate to say he is a brave hero that sacrificed his life for a more noble cause,” said the Internet posting. “Scholars have paralled (sic) this to suicide bombers whose intention, by sacrificing their lives, is to help save Muslims by killing enemy soldiers.”
Update: So poor and fragmented have the early media reports about this been that only now, after 9 p.m. ET, do we learn that … Hasan’s still alive. He’s in stable condition. And, according to the general conducting the briefing going on right now, he appears to be a lone gunman.
Update: This appears to be Hasan’s original Internet posting about suicide bombers in full. Quote:
There was a grenade thrown amongs a group of American soldiers. One of the soldiers, feeling that it was to late for everyone to flee jumped on the grave with the intention of saving his comrades. Indeed he saved them. He inentionally took his life (suicide) for a noble cause i.e. saving the lives of his soldier. To say that this soldier committed suicide is inappropriate. Its more appropriate to say he is a brave hero that sacrificed his life for a more noble cause. Scholars have paralled this to suicide bombers whose intention, by sacrificing their lives, is to help save Muslims by killing enemy soldiers. If one suicide bomber can kill 100 enemy soldiers because they were caught off guard that would be considered a strategic victory. Their intention is not to die because of some despair. The same can be said for the Kamikazees in Japan. They died (via crashing their planes into ships) to kill the enemies for the homeland. You can call them crazy i you want but their act was not one of suicide that is despised by Islam. So the scholars main point is that “IT SEEMS AS THOUGH YOUR INTENTION IS THE MAIN ISSUE” and Allah (SWT) knows best.
Emphasis added.
Update: A military reader e-mails to answer Andy Levy’s question of why even a poor officer would be promoted:
I served in the Air Force as a psychologist. I believe the way the rank works within in the medical corp is similar in the Army. If you were a medical officer, you had to try very hard to not make rank. They are not even required to go through much of the Military Education in order to make rank (a luxury other officers did not have). I had a friend who was a psychiatrist who went through the same medical program this Army Major went through (based on the years I’ve heard reported, they may have overlapped one another to some extent). When you go through this program, you owe 10-13 years for medical school and residency (maybe more, depending on any additional training you go through). The military will get there commitment back. My friend did his medical school, residency, and a fellowship in child psychiatry and he owed something like 17 years. He made LtCol without any effort. In fact, he often laughed about it, like he got it for his MD and breathing. Another Air Force psychiatrist friend of mine hates being in the USAF and is not quiet about it (though certainly not in the same way as this Army Major): has had many disciplinary problems, including having suspended credentials in our hospital; and in the midst of this, made Major. Go figure.
Update: The media Narrative on this story is congealing as we speak. Assume you’re an eager beaver reporter who’s as anti-war as the next fellow in the newsroom. How do you frame a story about a murderous lunatic who’s never been deployed overseas to serve your agenda? Why, this way of course: “Fort Hood has felt strain of repeated deployments”.
Update: WaPo reports that Hasan is “very devout”:
Hasan attended the Muslim Community Center in Silver Spring and was “very devout,” according to Faizul Khan, a former imam at the center. Khan said Hasan attended prayers at least once a day, seven days a week, often in his Army fatigues.
Khan also said Hasan applied to an annual matrimonial seminar that matches Muslims looking for spouses. “I don’t think he ever had a match, because he had too many conditions,” Khan said.
“We never got into details of worldly affairs or politics,” the former imam said of his conversations with Hasan. “Mostly religious questions. But there was nothing extremist in his questions. He never showed any frustration. . . . He never showed any . . . wish for vengeance on anybody.”
Update: More devotion: “A former neighbor of Hasan’s in Silver Spring, Md. told Fox News he lived there for two years with his brother and had the word ‘Allah’ on the door.”
Update: So here’s where we are right now, near 11 p.m. ET. This guy raged about Muslims standing up to aggressors, praised suicide bombers, and the lead theory in the media is … PTSD? For a guy who’s … never been deployed? A friend just e-mailed me with a good question: Even if he was suffering from some type of trauma from listening to vets’ war stories, shouldn’t a shrink trained in dealing with trauma been able to diagnose himself and seek treatment?
Update: And now a little more about just how devout he was, this time from NPR:
A source tells NPR’s Joseph Shapiro that Hasan was put on probation early in his postgraduate work at the Uniformed Service University of the Health Sciences in Bethesda, Md. He was disciplined for proselytizing about his Muslim faith with patients and colleagues, according to the source, who worked with him at the time.
I’m hearing on Twitter that Fox interviewed one of his neighbors within the last half-hour or so and that the neighbor claims Hasan was handing out Korans just this morning. Does anyone have video? Or is this a bad lead? Smells fishy to me but multiple people have mentioned it.
Update: Ryan Lewis offers this transcript: “Brenda Price of KUSJ reported to Greta at 10:33: ‘also, the latest I am hearing, this morning, apparently according to his neighbors, he was walking around kind of giving out his possessions, giving away his furniture, handing out the Koran…’” Sounds like her information is secondhand. Grain of salt.
Update: Credit to WaPo for looking at Hasan’s religious background despite the flak they’ll take for it. New details:
He steered clear of female colleagues, co-workers said, and despite devout religious practices, listed himself in Army records as having no religious preference…
“He came to mosque one or two times to see if there were any suitable girls to marry,” Khan said. “I don’t think he ever had a match, because he had too many conditions. He wanted a girl who was very religious, prays five times a day.”…
A co-worker at Walter Reed said Hasan would not allow his photo to be taken with female co-workers, which became an issue during Christmas season when employees often took group photos. Co-workers would find a solo photo of Hasan and post it on the bulletin board without his permission.
Update: Ah, here’s a source for the Koran story told on Greta: “News Channel 25′s Henry Rosoff has learned the Hasan, was giving all of his furniture along with copies of the Qu’ ran to neighbors Thursday morning.”
Update: Evidently CNN is airing surveillance footage from a convenience store camera taken this just morning showing Hasan in a traditional Muslim cap and robe. Supposedly, according to an employee, he talked about his deployment and said he didn’t want to kill other Muslims. I’ll update with the clip once they post it.
Update: Here’s the clip. I think this is it for tonight.









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So let me get this straight. Every single Muslim in America is undeserving of the benfit of the doubt?
You’re no better than a terrorist yourself.
Grow Fins on November 5, 2009 at 8:42 PM
You are clearly a very angry man or woman. I feel sorry for you. But your anger is not justification for the bigotry and racism on this forum.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:42 PM
f**k you
jaime on November 5, 2009 at 8:42 PM
I somehow missed that Huffpo article. That is truly disgusting, but I think we should remind the author of it, about now.
notropis on November 5, 2009 at 8:43 PM
If that’s true, maybe you should try to learn from them.
malclave on November 5, 2009 at 8:43 PM
You need to work a little more on your race baiting.
the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 8:43 PM
Poor GrowFins. His weak little mind can’t bear the thought of muslims being viewed with rightful suspicion. He can’t admit that islam is an inherently violent ideology.
If it walks like a duck & quacks like a duck …
OhioCoastie on November 5, 2009 at 8:44 PM
No, nemecizer, it is not racist to assume that a mass murder committed by a muslim might have ideological underpinnings.
Vera on November 5, 2009 at 8:40 PM
But it is racism to assume that because the shooter had a Arabic name that he was a fanatical Muslim.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:41 PM
Not racism just a safe bet. And absolutely right as it turns out. That is what the weak do. Cry racism because they lack the intelligence to do anything else. islam is no race it is a satanic death cult.
Jerricho68 on November 5, 2009 at 8:44 PM
Malik Nadal Hasan was a self-professed Muslim. His mass murdering actions made him an extremist Islamo-fascist.
Race is an arbitrary label that has no legitimacy.
Islam, however, is not a race. Muslims are not a race. Islam is an ideology that should be open to critical examination.
America’s Greatest Generation were no less furious over the beheadings of American soldiers by Shinto-fascists.
Get a clue.
Terp Mole on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
LOL-That is their answer for everything they cannot debate intellectually.
That is why the charge of racism no-longer has any meaning.
Dave R. on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
I would point out that Fascism, Communism and Nazism are all far Left ideologies and that Fascism & Nazism have, for quite some time now, been mis-labeled as as “far-right” ideologies by those who use the word “Far-Right” and “Conservative” as synonyms for “evil.”
Aside from that (sorry, it’s a pet peeve), I agree 100%. In fact, Nazis, the KKK and Islamo-fascists are not only all anti-Semite, but also anti-Catholic and they hate homosexuals.
29Victor on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
no you idiot, it is his recent activity, you know, murdering 12 soldiers and wounding over 30 peopel – soldiers and civilians alike ,plus what we know about these savages who blow up children in the name of their god, is what gave us that conclusion. morons like you gave us 9/11.
runner on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
The spin is starting already. Just heard a report about Hasan being stressed because of the way he was treated by fellow soldiers..didn’t want to go to Iraq…misunderstood. blah..blah.
Itchee Dryback on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
Ok, for the 900th time you gibbering imbecile. When did ‘Muslim’ become a race???
YOU GOD DAMNED IDIOT!!!
BigWyo on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
The moral relativism is the trademark of liberals.
You got a clue of what terrorists do.
the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
No offense, but the logic here is kinda odd. Is there such a thing as a non-fanatical mass murderer?
Erich66 on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
How do you come to that conclusion?
fogw on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
I did it. Don’t care if you think I’m a racist. It’s a new day in America friend, one in which I for one don’t give a bucket of rancid squirrel squirts if you don’t like my bigoted ways. So suck on that, Mr PC police pillow biter.
Ahhhh…can you smell the post-racial freedom that comes from assuaging your “white guilt” by voting for a racist black man. How liberating. Thanks Obama!
The rest of you stuttering and falling over yourselves trying to persuade this pud you aren’t racist, grow some balls and man up.
Sugarbuzz on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
I am not saying that the bigots and racists here are wrong about the underlying motivation of the murderer. But if they are right in their assumptions it is because they are hateful bigots, not because of an objective analysis of the facts of the case.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
Maybe the “shooter” part led the “fanatical” claim.
Ronnie on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
Now you’re trying to look into that other’s posters mind. They posted that this might be another Hasan Ackbar situation – a Muslim member of the military killing other service members. That’s it. You’re only seeing racism there because that’s what you want to see.
Some of the comments here are out of line, but not that one, not even close. You jumped the shark a bit with your first comment on this thread and aren’t willing to walk back from it.
BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
I don’t recognize your nic, nyx. I do have a question for you, have any of your “friends” disavowed/sworn off/denied “The verse of the sword”?
Let me know if they ever do.
Blacksmith8 on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
So, Barry just sat there reading My Pet TOTUS, and Joe’s in hiding in a disclosed location. Doing it right, Dems?
Christien on November 5, 2009 at 8:45 PM
Actually, the assumption is/was that a murderous rampaging nut with a Muslim name was likely to be an extremist Muslim. Behavior and actions defined the ‘extremist’ word. It stood up to scrutiny. His name gave heavy odds that he was Muslim. What is wrong with this deduction?
anuts on November 5, 2009 at 8:46 PM
Do you have a link? I’ve been so preoccupied with reading comments I haven’t looked at anything else.
beachgirlusa on November 5, 2009 at 8:46 PM
Highly unlikely.
1) He was no “pu$$y”.
2) As a Medical Doctor he would likely have had it relatively safe and easy in Iraq.
MB4 on November 5, 2009 at 8:46 PM
It’s become painfully obvious that this guy was a Muslim terrorist. I abhor all posts which can be construed as a call to violence, but if you really stop to think about it, today is not the day to start a PC crusade.
ElectricPhase on November 5, 2009 at 8:46 PM
By the time we knew his name, we knew that he was a mass murderer. Sure he could be a non-muslim Arab who happened to snap because of PTSD, but because of the past 10 years, the simplist answer is that he acted out of ideology.
Occams razor…
Vera on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
I am an angry man. Angry that I have to risk my ass for a POS like you!
jwp1964 on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
The Koran was the prequel to Mein Kampf.
Jerricho68 on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
Waging jihad, by which is meant violent war against non-believers, is every Muslim’s religious duty.
It is a complete oxymoron to call only the ones who practice it “devout,” “radical” or “fanatical” Muslims.
The ones who kill for Allah are the truly “good” Muslims.
I would love to see Islam as a “religion” banned world wide but especially in this country–there’s nothing praiseworthy about it.
It is a religion of Evil and the Devil.
Jenfidel on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
You called referring to a person as Muslim as racist. I pointed out that is incorrect and that you are a moron for stating it. I shouldn’t have to read your previous comments to understand a point that you so succinctly made. And pointing out your stupidity is not despicable, it’s actually quite commendable. The fact that you assumed I was apologizing when I simply was correcting you makes you the very type of person you claim to despise.
Deanna on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
He will probably have a photo-op saluting the murdering muslims coffin.
farright on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
What Bulls**t!! The worst thing this muslim is— is still ALIVE!!!! SCREW all these apologist ever thinking liberal progressive assholes who have to think up excuses for these murdering cowardly muslim pieces of shit . This really pisses me off
flyoverboy on November 5, 2009 at 8:47 PM
At least Sugarbuzz is accepting of the fact that he is a racist.
Oh, and just because I find your attitude objectionable and despicable doesn’t mean that I voted for Obama. I didn’t. I think he is a terrible President. But bigots like you make it more difficult to convince rational people that our side is right about him. Your racism and bigotry empowers the left and gives them a weapon to use against us. And you don’t understand that or even care.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
Yeah, there’s always the possibility that the 11 people who were killed actually committed suicide.
Daggett on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
Damn that’s way too logical.
Erich66 on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
Answer:
Barack Hussein Obama…
Hmmmm Hmmmm Hmmmm!!!
Seven Percent Solution on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
Our resident hate-filled, name-calling “progressive” troll can’t seem to get enough of this place, can it.
Fish – we were hoping you were away making some “progress”:
progress from gibbering psychotic outbursts to catatonic coma.
Relapse!
jaime on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
The family member, Nader Hasan, said the murderer was a good American(Right up until the time he murdered American troops).
The family member, Nader Hasan, says he was dealing with harassment. (See, good psychiatry,, it’s not his fault. He was a victim).
The family member, Nader Hasan, says it was the military that was harassing him (See? More good psychiatry, those mean military people are just so mean!).
The family member, Nader Hasan, says the murderer was dealing with “things from the war”(Again, he was a victim of Bush’s war!).
The family member, Nader Hasan, says the murderer tried to get out of the army, he tried to be fair and reasonable, and even tried to pay back the government(See?? He really tried not to commit murder! He tried! Give him a break!).
The family member, Nader Hasan, said nobody should even try to suggest this murderous rampage had anything to do with the murderer being afraid to go to war(Now what does that mean?? Could it be about something else, then??)
The family member, Nader Hasan, says they were blown away by all of this (No, the victims were).
JellyToast on November 5, 2009 at 8:48 PM
…and who made you the ultimate arbitor in that decision? Your reasoning mirrors that of which you are accusing others.
thomasaur on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
You’re worried that some comments here will get good people like yourself labeled a racist by proxy.
I’m worried that comments like yours here reinforce the meme that conservatives are dumb.
BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
I never said that referring to someone Muslim was racist. I said that people who assumed that because the shooter had an Arabic name, he was therefore a Muslim jihadi was racist.
You can’t even follow a basic logical argument.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
…But Ronald Reagan said it’s beef, then it’s beef!
(just trying to add a little levity to a hot-tempered post)
And, yes, I’m waiting for the trolls to call me a bigot again.
Liam on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
Terrorists lump their enemies together as a single mass of ‘infidels.” Some here lump all Muslims together as a single mass of ‘Islamic radicals.’
Grow Fins on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
Indeed.
And guess what Mein Kampf translates as “My struggle.”
And “Jihad” translates as struggle.
Coincidence?
I just saw new film footage of Hitler, released last week, at Berchtesgarden showing him greeting the King of Saudi Arabia as a guest.
Jenfidel on November 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM
Those who call racism are the real racists. The followers of the child molester mohamed are the racists.
Jerricho68 on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
No its because they refuse to make themselves stupid. When the Washington sniper was shooting people daily the police told people to look for a white male and so the investigation was conducted on that basis. It eventually turned out to be a Muslim named John Muhammed. But if they had set out to look for a Muslim that would have been racism right? Deliberately making yourself stupid is fine but don’t get upset because everyone else won’t shut off their brains too.
aengus on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Maybe, because no one dropped a dime on the guy. And Hasan had a nice cushy job and he was getting his medical school and grad school tuition paid for and he had a fellowship. He was staying so long as he didn’t deploy.
Blake on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Memo from Bertha Lewis.
malclave on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
So, now we find out the feds were tracking this guy for 6 months? I knew something was fishy about this whole story. No wonder why the authorities at Ft. Hood have been so careful in rolling out this story. First, they drag their feet on releasing the guy’s name. Well, once they did that I knew right away the guy was a muslim. We’ve had a murderous rampage on a military base in the country and we are worried about our political correctness so as not to offed. Pathetic.
Someone has some serious explaing to do. Why wasn’t this guy discharged? Did they think he was willingly going to go to the middle east to fight muslims? Are they that dense?
KickandSwimMom on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Imagine the PC pressure they’re under.
the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Nidal Malik Hasan…hmm…must be one of those militant Presbyterians. It’s all Rush Limbaugh’s fault!
packsoldier on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
T
These are all great questions, and the almost certain answer makes me sick to my stomach and sick at heart. I’m betting that those soldiers died today because of political correctness.
ProfessorMiao on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
The Race Card is the most rapid-fire all purpose ad hominem and vapid weapon of smear, mass deception and diversion ever conceived by man. It is a weapon under which weak minds are servilely crouched and can be fired with the greatest of ease by even the most intellectually and sanity challenged, and in fact, was designed especially for use by them. It is void of justice. It is void of liberty. It needs no footing in rationality. It has no expiration date. It doesn’t even appear to have a half life. There are those who theorize that it may continue to exist indefinitely in some form even after time itself has come to an end.
MB4 on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
But it is racism to assume that because the shooter had a Arabic name that he was a fanatical Muslim.
[nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:41 PM]
No it isn’t, racism. It’s speculation, a surmise, conjecture, and if it’s based on something other than just guessing, which is in the realm of opinion, it’s reasonable.
Racism is thinking you are superior to another race just for being of another race. Note the word race; religion is excluded.
Dusty on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Well, it could be that nemecizer doesn’t think the shooter was an extremist because they see this as normal behavior for someone with an “Arabic Name.” In fact, that must be what they meant.
What a big fat racist nemecizer is. Thinking that non-extreme Arabs go around shooting innocent people. Shame on nemecizer the big fat racist, shaaaaaaaaammmeee.
29Victor on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
Here is question #4, why would a known Islamist psychiatrist have any access to a soldiers personal thoughts, and what kind of thoughts would he plant in soldiers minds?
fourdeucer on November 5, 2009 at 8:50 PM
New here?
I see the problem: because of this thread, because of your naiveté, you’ve just now come to the realization that there are simpletons and jerks in both camps.
Well, welcome to the real world, kid. In the future, I’d suggest that when you get riled up and want to express your outrage, you clearly pick a fight with just one and stay focused on them.
You’ve been huffing and puffing so much that I doubt you noticed that most are just ignoring you. Did you even notice the “un-offended” Muslim that’s calmly posting her take on things?
Take a deep breath. Live with the fact that people got issues and realize your indignant rant of calling everyone in the room names only makes matters worse.
Rod on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
you know what to do
put them out of business
boycott their stores
fire them if they employees
torture your congressmen to stop any form of educational aid etc
the fact that i see endless halal ( pig f&ckers ) stores says how much they are interested in blending in.
we can drive them from here if we try.
they have islamic banking systems here most likely funded by us
I like the idea of a crusade and mopping the floor with these animals and nonconformist to OUR values in OUR country.
we go to their country we observe their value system that what it is.
they come here, we have to bend over to the primates
fuck that. the only job they can have is bacon tester.
lets knock down all the mosques the way they knock down churches and temples.
Sonosam on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
Sorry for the spelling errors. Seems I can’t preview my comments before posting.
KickandSwimMom on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
Now they are saying 12 dead (I’m not counting the murderer) and that he used 2 shotguns. He also went to Virginia Tech!!!
Blake on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
nemecizer… Your ignorance concerning islam is clearly monumental or you would not make such uninformed and PC posts.
I donot hate muslims. I hate islam. There is a difference. It is possible to hate the sin, not the sinner.
I see muslims as the victims of islam that must be made free.
You’ve clearly not had many conversations with those mulslims that wish to leave islam. They cannot. They are under the scrutiny of those that they pray alongside 5 times a day. Many would love to see their wives free to drive to the store alone. They cannot express that view as the state is the religion is the law is the government.
Leaving islam is punishable by death.
Y
Army Brat on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
My hope is that by standing up to the vapid bigotry and racism on this forum people would think that conservatives are decent Americans who stick to our most cherished principles: innocent until proven guilty, equality for all, tolerance, and a disdain for the tyranny of mob rule.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
Oh course he will, he admitted he’s one of them. Look at his name.
Jeff from WI on November 5, 2009 at 8:51 PM
“Terrorist eat food = we’re all terrorist”
the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
As Dennis Miller would say, “I like the cut of your jib!”
Wonderful!
Jenfidel on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Aren’t you lumping all terrorists together?
Ronnie on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Given today’s events, is this really appropriate, in any context?
I go back to my earlier point about the richness of watching you lecture others on behavior.
BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Kudos to you for trying to maintain a basic level of humanity. Look, I’m guilty of a lot of BS round here, much of it intemperate provocative crap. Guilty as charged. But I’m done with that. It is hard to maintain composure in the face of vileness. You, sir, are an example to us all.
Grow Fins on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Why was this man so upset about being deployed? Wouldn’t he have worked in his capacity as a psychiatrist not a combat solider?
Cindy Munford on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Craig Winn does a line by line comparison of Mein Kampf and the Koran. They look as though they share a common author.
Jerricho68 on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Winston Churchill also thought so.
MB4 on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
It’s what’s called an “educated guess.” It’s Occam’s Razor. It’s “more than likely.” It’s a survival mechanism and it’s pretty darn smart.
29Victor on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
So the words we type expressing our opinion here, make us the equivalent of throat-slitting terrorists.
Okey-Dokey.
fogw on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
This thread has been hijacked.
Joe Caps on November 5, 2009 at 8:52 PM
Ok calm down. Please step away from the computer and go have a cup of tea or coffee. Or soda. Might want to watch some non news TV. When you start attacking folk like Lox it’s time to call it quits. Hope you’re ok. Take care.
Annietxgrl on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
I’m a tough sell when it comes to syllogisms, but that one’s pretty darn airtight.
notropis on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
there is some nut job expert on CNN going on about how repeated deployments are causing PTSD and outbreaks of violence by our soldiers. However, this shooter HAS NEVER BEEN DEPLOYED so how is that conversation relevant?
Willie on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
Nice.
I’ve noticed that President Obama tends to lump his critics together when he’s making one of his strawman arguments. Are you calling Obama a terrorist?
malclave on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
Fight the evil terrorist lumpers.
Ronnie on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
nemecizer… Your ignorance concerning islam is clearly monumental or you would not make such uninformed and PC posts.
I do not hate muslims. I hate islam. There is a difference. It is possible to hate the sin, not the sinner.
I see muslims as the victims of islam that must be made free.
You’ve clearly not had many conversations with those muslims that wish to leave islam. They cannot. They are under the scrutiny of those that they pray alongside 5 times a day. Many would love to see their wives free to drive to the store alone. They cannot express that view as the state is the religion is the law is the government.
Leaving islam is punishable by death.
Army Brat on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
Hatred of an entire religion practiced all over the world by 1.2 billion people is pretty radical. I feel sorry for you.
As for my knowledge of Islam, I lived all over the Middle East for years. Trust me, not every country is like Saudi Arabia. Yet you lump them all in and assume they are the same.
That’s some serious bigotry on your part.
nemecizer on November 5, 2009 at 8:53 PM
Datz Ok, yur spelin luks gud ta mee
Jeff from WI on November 5, 2009 at 8:54 PM
With all due respect, there has been nothing on this thread contributed by you that would afford yourself the priveledge of speaking for rational people.
anuts on November 5, 2009 at 8:54 PM
Innocent until proven guilty? Let me know when Hasan’s trial is, might be kinda tough though considering that he was shot dead by the police after he committed murder.
Erich66 on November 5, 2009 at 8:54 PM
So you’re the race baiting troll.
He wasnt innocent , he killed 12 people.
the_nile on November 5, 2009 at 8:54 PM
Allah quick we need a Sarah Palin thread to distract the trolls!!!
Joe Caps on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
nemecizer… Your ignorance concerning islam is clearly monumental or you would not make such uninformed and PC posts.
I do not hate muslims. I hate islam. There is a difference. It is possible to hate the sin, not the sinner.
I see muslims as the victims of islam that must be made free.
You’ve clearly not had many conversations with those muslims that wish to leave islam. They cannot. They are under the scrutiny of those that they pray alongside 5 times a day. Many would love to see their wives free to drive to the store alone. They cannot express that view as the state is the religion is the law is the government.
Leaving islam is punishable by death. You might want to give the koran a passing glance before you defend a religion that wants you converted, paying the jizya or dead.
Army Brat on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
Winston Churchill also thought so.
Churchill was a racist, so your example is asinine. This is the man who thought that “the provision of some kind of asphyxiating bombs” was good “for use in preliminary operations against turbulent tribes.”
Grow Fins on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
It is the stateside Psychiatrists who bear the heaviest burdens, not the combat soldiers on the front line.
Jerricho68 on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
Radical Muslim or not. I’m just glad the sumbitch is in hell right now.
TXUS on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
Ahhh, lovely and classy on such a horrible day.
Yes, yes, i’m a racist. I get people yelling at me and being prejudiced against in all sorts of countries because I’m a Jew. Being a Jew isn’t a race (nor is Muslim), but that’s beyond the point. But because of my religion, I’m treated like crap ran over twice. However, when I simply point out that the mass murdering b*st*rd was a Muslim, I’m a racist. Ahhhhhh, logicness.
mjk on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
I think so too at times (no offense to Lox) but its refreshing to find a quiet oasis amid the chaos caused by trolls.
beachgirlusa on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
You’re having quite the difficult time making one.
BadgerHawk on November 5, 2009 at 8:55 PM
LOL!
KickandSwimMom on November 5, 2009 at 8:56 PM
What do you want to bet that the Feds (FBI) knew about this guy but wouldn’t go in and bust him because of the kind of PC backlash (which would start with Ogabe on down) we’re dealing with right on this thread?
And now 12 fine American soldiers are dead and their family and friends are crying.
And 30+ others are clinging to life in the hospital.
Jenfidel on November 5, 2009 at 8:56 PM
In a word, Isalm. In all likelihood anyway.
Yes. He would have been a “REMF”. Three hots and a cot. If he had been in a psychiatric slot he would likely have had it relatively pretty safe and comfortable at a main base, maybe even in the Green Zone.
MB4 on November 5, 2009 at 8:56 PM
This is how you do a “Shout Out” (sans TOTUS).
Christien on November 5, 2009 at 8:56 PM
Is everyone who doesn’t agree precisely with you a racist?
And what have YOU done that even compares with Winston Churchill? Oh that’s right nothing.
mjk on November 5, 2009 at 8:57 PM
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