This is not surprising. They really don’t have a need to learn English. Spanish is spoken at home by their parents. Their radios and TVs are playing Spanish stations. They call someone and just have to press 2 to get Spanish. It is often said that immigrants and their children will be compelled to learn English because it is the key to joining the middle class. This is BS. Someone living in SoCal can live a middle class existence without having to be fluent in English.

Mark1971 on October 30, 2009 at 3:05 PM

Mark1971: You may have had a point 30 years ago, but the microcomputer changed everything.

Because the computer is primarily the invention of English speakers, because picture languages aren’t suitable for keyboard entry, because of the pervasiveness of the Internet, and for many other reasons, you MUST know English to survive in the modern technically-oriented world.

Those who cannot understand, read, or write English will be disadvantaged for their entire lives. You may not like it, but by default, English is the world-wide Universal Language.

Wethal on October 30, 2009

I see it every week and it convinces me that I am right. The longer we make it easier for people to not become part of American society, the harder it will be for them to reap the benefits of the great opportunities that will again exist once we rid outselves of Obama and his fascist butt buddies.

I remember when Ebonics was trying to make inroads into the educational system. Talk about enslaving the population.

nor on October 30, 2009 at 2:59 PM

Shut yo mouf, Yo.

TXUS on October 30, 2009 at 3:05 PM

There’s a different sentence structure in Vernacular Black English. Verbs are used in their infinitive form and modified by both adjective and pronoun. There’s some phonological differences also, including the tendency to drop final consonants which TXUS so (c)rudely imitates. Ebonics, which is mildly defamatory term, never made inroads past VBE being analyzed for differences so students could be coached into Standard English speech patterns. I did some of that coaching/tutoring as a college student for fellow college students back in the day, helping them pass Speech 100. The professor in charge of the program was bluntly honest to the participants, telling them to succeed that had to be able to switch into “whitey” or they would never get through an interview process applying as a college graduate for a job.

Don’t mess with Texans!

So for the white proletariat they have to overload the system, meanwhile for the minorities, they can frustrate them in other ways, eventually getting their support for fundamental change, sometimes called “revolution”.

I suspect that the main reason that the Democrats of LA like “bilingual” schools comes from a long habit of thinking like an elitist Plantation owner of the Democrat persuasion (listen to Barbara Boxer being condescending to her inferiors). Californian Democrats deliberately limit the opportunities for Mexicans so that they of the intellectual elite can have a cheap labor force available to do jobs that the aristocratic older families of California find demeaning. In 1809 these same families, before emigrating to California, did not want their “cotton-pikin’” black slaves to have an education for the same reason.

Just within the past year I had to read a book explaining to my little brain, why bilingual education is far better.

http://www.amazon.com/Under-Attack-Against-Bilingual-Education/dp/0965280829/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1256959951&sr=8-1

But do you think he would he also say that all Americans should learn English?

StormsWillPass on October 30, 2009 at 7:21 PM

Um, how would that get him the votes he wants?

Bilingual education is one of those well-intentioned programs that have become sacred cows — and for that matter, cash cows for school districts. Schools get incentivized to keep students in the program, thanks to federal funding based on head counts, rather than pushing students to get fluent in English and mainstreamed to become more competitive.

You mean schools do whatever it takes to make an extra buck?!? I thought only “eeeeevil” corporations did that…

BIL = Bilingual Education, which is taught in two languages
ESL = English as a Second Language (so named because of the way the brain learns a second language as opposed to a first; the language may be the third or fourth learned language). ESL is taught in English only.
ELL = English language learner
LEP = limited English proficient
ESOL = English for Speakers of Other Languages

In TX, where I teach ESL, the program in elementary school can be BIL or ESL. But in secondary it must be ESL. ESL is supposed to be full immersion in English, taught with specific methods to encourage the transfer of language. However, as one poster noted, the problem with Spanish-speaking students is that they are immersed in Spanish outside of school and avoid English in school as much as possible. Other ESL students typically learn English faster because they NEED English to survive.

The remark in the article is correct in that it is easier to get into ESL than to get out. The oral test we use to exit requires the kids to know specific words such as “piggy bank,” “obelisk,” “Arc de Triomphe,” “sari,” “epaulet.” These are not words they would necessarily have come across if they, for example, arrived in the U.S. as high schoolers or if they don’t speak English at home. Many native speakers have trouble scoring ‘fluent’ on the test.

Like all regular ed students, ESL students in TX also have to pass the state TAKS test with no accommodations in order to graduate. Some graduate with exiting from ESL!

I see kids walking alone through the streets past 11:00 PM. I grew up just across from Detroit. The thought just keeps running through my mind when I see the kids, “If you were in Detroit, you would be so raped or killed.” But they are just getting home from the after school schools.

One of my students goes to school on Tuesday and Thursday. At 4:00 PM she comes to English classes for 3 hours. After that, she goes to piano classes for another 3 hours. She’s 13 years old. So on those days, she’s been in school from 9:00 AM until 10:00 PM. That’s kind of normal here. And her English is excellent. She’s encouraged to learn.

I’ve heard the phrase “acting white” used derogatively by black kids towards black kids getting good grades. I wonder if that same situation may apply to those learning English. Some cultures just value education more.

IOW we are undergoing reverse assimilation here in Los Angeles.

NoDonkey strikes gold again! Where are the yellow people? Oh wait…isn’t that the newest “minority” group in the USA, and behold….they got their shit together. No victims in ChinaTown. Just hard working, leave us alone kinda folks.

They knew when they got here the American Dream was something they had to work for…not demand as soon as the shoes dried.

I would add the folks from the middle east to that group, too. They seem to find a business market niche and go after it and use entrepreneurship to gain financial independence here.

I sort of feel left out, having been raised in the system here. We were told that we had to work hard in school, get an education, and we would have a good job for life. Man were we LIED to!!! I wish instead my parents had told me that I had to rely on my own wits to make a living because corporate America was NOT where job security was going to be for the later born baby boomers. I definitely hammered that home to my nephew and his generation “gets it”. They know they have to work hard and rely on themselves because corporate america isn’t the life long job anymore and the boomers are going to bankrupt the country in unfunded entitlements like social security and medicare.

Who are liberals three favorite victim groups?

- 1) Blacks
- 2) American Indians
- 3) Latinos

NoDonkey strikes gold again! Where are the yellow people? Oh wait…isn’t that the newest “minority” group in the USA, and behold….they got their shit together. No victims in ChinaTown. Just hard working, leave us alone kinda folks.

They knew when they got here the American Dream was something they had to work for…not demand as soon as the shoes dried.

instead of encouraging assimiliation.

NoDonkey on October 30, 2009 at 4:15 PM

And BTW trolls-assimilation does NOT mean you have to sacrifice your culture.
You can still have BOTH.

I remember when Ebonics was trying to make inroads into the educational system. Talk about enslaving the population.

nor on October 30, 2009 at 2:59 PM
Shut yo mouf, Yo.

TXUS on October 30, 2009 at 3:05 PM

Ha ha!
I went to HS in Tyler at John Tyler HS-Ebonics was alive & well there.
I recall being a minority in that school: me a little ol’ white girl.